Podcasts · Theories of Everything with Curt Jaimungal

Rob Spekkens: Why the Quantum Wave Function Is Not Real

2 Feb 2026 · 2 h 48 min

Perimeter Institute's Robert Spekkens on quantum foundations. His 2004 classical toy theory makes maximum knowledge always incomplete, and out pops no-cloning, teleportation, and interference Feynman deemed impossible classically. He likens our situation to hieroglyphs before Champollion: a category mistake treating quantum states as describing reality when they describe knowledge of it.

Every episode days early, ad-free, plus my essays: https://curtjaimungal.substack.com/subscribe SUPPORT: - Crypto: https://nowpayments.io/donation/TOE - PayPal: https://tinyurl.com/paypalTOE - Substack: https://curtjaimungal.substack.com TIMESTAMPS: - 00:00:00 - Defining Quantum Innovation - 00:06:40 - Realism vs. Empiricism - 00:12:12 - Leibnizian Methodological Principle - 00:23:40 - Causal Explanations of Correlations - 00:30:24 - Epistemic Quantum States - 00:41:00 - Foil Theory Methodology - 00:54:00 - Causal Influence vs. Signaling - 01:07:27 - Thermodynamics and Ignorance - 01:15:00 - Conceptual Understanding in Physics - 01:21:00 - Philosophy of Physics Utility - 01:30:00 - Speckins' Toy Theory Origins - 01:40:13 - Perimeter Institute's Ambitious DNA - 01:52:00 - PBR Theorem Implications - 02:05:40 - Ontic Separability Assumptions - 02:17:40 - Hieroglyphs and Category Mistakes - 02:29:00 - Revolutionizing Modern Physics - 02:37:20 - Unscrambling Causation and Inference LINKS: https://www.rwspekkens.com https://pirsa.org/speaker/Robert-Spekkens https://arxiv.org/pdf/2507.01122 https://arxiv.org/pdf/quant-ph/0401052 https://arxiv.org/abs/0706.2661 https://arxiv.org/abs/quant-ph/0406166 https://arxiv.org/pdf/2207.11779 https://amazon.com/dp/1108066488?tag=toe08-20 https://www.jstor.org/stable/687269 https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/qm-copenhagen/ https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/identity-indiscernible/ https://www.fourmilab.ch/etexts/einstein/specrel/specrel.pdf https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/spacetime-holearg/ https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/mathematics/hidden-variable-theory https://www.nature.com/articles/299802a0 https://arxiv.org/pdf/2011.01286 https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF02058098 https://arxiv.org/abs/2005.07161 https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/engineering/maxwells-equation https://www.einstein-online.info/en/spotlight/equivalence_principle/ https://perimeterinstitute.ca/ https://amazon.com/dp/9810241054?tag=toe08-20 https://journals.aps.org/pr/pdf/10.1103/PhysRev.47.777 https://arxiv.org/abs/1111.3328 https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/rosetta-stone-hieroglyphs-champollion-decipherment-egypt-180980834/ https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0160932707000282 https://youtu.be/gEK4-XtMwro https://youtu.be/YWbjI-QsH2E https://youtu.be/fU1bs5o3nss https://youtu.be/NKOd8imBa2s https://youtu.be/6I2OhmVWLMs https://youtu.be/Tghl6aS5A3M https://youtu.be/HIoviZe14pY https://youtu.be/bprxrGaf0Os https://youtu.be/4MjNuJK5RzM https://youtu.be/gsSJPLX-BTA

Theories of Everything with Curt Jaimungal features long-form, technically detailed interviews with leading researchers in physics, mathematics, consciousness, and philosophy, exploring topics at the level of active research. For academics, graduate students, and anyone seeking depth beyond popular science.

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