# Tom Haberstroh on Giannis-Bucks Drama continues, Spurs Push for NBA title, UNC hires Mike Malone | 04.08

An episode of [The Right Time with Bomani Jones](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/982639043), 8 Apr 2026, 55 min.

Audio: https://podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/pscrb.fm/rss/p/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/370fc844-36bd-4f61-8b8f-b4bb010de39a/0309ab13-3211-43bc-aadc-b4bb01148d48/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=919a7cbe-003c-4146-b592-b4bb010de3a5

Bomani Jones is joined by Tom Haberstroh to break down the chaos surrounding Giannis Antetokounmpo, Doc Rivers, and the Milwaukee Bucks. They dig into whether Giannis really wants out, why the Bucks’ situation feels so broken, and what a trade could mean for the rest of the league. Then they shift to the Western Conference, the rise of Victor Wembanyama and the Spurs, and whether the NBA is heading back toward an era defined by rivalries instead of parity. They close by breaking down UNC hiring Mike Malone and whether it is the start of a paradigm shift in college basketball. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:09] Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the right time.
[0:11] Speaker 2: A wave original. My name is Beaumont Jones. Thanks for
[0:14] Speaker 2: listening wherever you get your podcast. Thanks for watching us
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[0:20] Speaker 2: five stars. You only give us four stars. I'm inclined
[0:22] Speaker 2: to believe you are a hater.
[0:24] Speaker 1: It is that time of week where we have a
[0:26] Speaker 1: guest join us.
[0:28] Speaker 2: Check him out on Yahoo Sports and many other places,
[0:31] Speaker 2: including Tom the Finder, great newsletter to which I subscribe.
[0:34] Speaker 1: Tom Haberstroh, what's going on, man?
[0:36] Speaker 3: Not a whole lot, Beaumont. Glad to be here.
[0:39] Speaker 1: Hey, man.
[0:39] Speaker 2: Hey, man. I'll get to the Mike Maloney things perhaps
[0:43] Speaker 2: a little bit later as I realize you as a
[0:46] Speaker 2: Wake Forest guy may have some interest in that. But
[0:48] Speaker 2: we got to start with what is going on in
[0:51] Speaker 2: Milwaukee where Shams Sharania, and it should be noted, Shams
[0:55] Speaker 2: is the guy to get you information. Shams is not
[0:58] Speaker 2: the guy to write a 4,000-word rundown of what's been
[1:02] Speaker 2: going on with the team. I don't say that as
[1:04] Speaker 2: a judgment. That's just not really typically like what he does.
[1:09] Speaker 2: Maybe it's because people acted like he was lying when
[1:11] Speaker 2: he said that Giannis had said that he wanted to
[1:13] Speaker 2: go to the Knicks, but he sure was like, I
[1:15] Speaker 2: told y'all he wanted to go to the Knicks. But
[1:17] Speaker 2: it was a long rundown of a chaotic situation with
[1:21] Speaker 2: the Bucs that added a All right, so it's Giannis
[1:25] Speaker 2: who keeps telling us in public he doesn't want to
[1:27] Speaker 2: be traded, but we all know he wants to be traded.
[1:30] Speaker 2: And then you add that with a dollop of the
[1:33] Speaker 2: most passive-aggressive man in basketball, passive-aggressive Hall of Famer, Doc Rivers.
[1:38] Speaker 2: You put all that together, that sounds like a terrible
[1:41] Speaker 2: situation that is now boiling over in part because the
[1:45] Speaker 2: Bucs just.
[1:46] Speaker 1: Want to tank and Giannis just wants to play. But
[1:49] Speaker 1: he doesn't want to play for them, but they can't
[1:52] Speaker 1: find a trade. What you got? What you got?
[1:55] Speaker 3: Man, there's so many ways we can tackle this story,
[1:58] Speaker 3: but I want to start with Doc Rivers saying, Google
[2:00] Speaker 3: me in a meeting, in a team meeting. And Shams
[2:04] Speaker 3: Tarani in the story, and I'm glad you picked up
[2:05] Speaker 3: the fact that he wrote like a 4,000 word missive
[2:08] Speaker 3: about this because that's not typically what the newsbreakers do
[2:12] Speaker 3: in this day and age. So Shams essentially was like,
[2:15] Speaker 3: I got the CVS receipt right here. And all of
[2:18] Speaker 3: the stories, anecdotes that support the notion is, That Giannis
[2:22] Speaker 3: Antetokounmpo wants out of there, but won't be willing to
[2:25] Speaker 3: say it. He doesn't want to be the guy to say,
[2:28] Speaker 3: I want to trade them in. I want to trade requests.
[2:31] Speaker 3: And remember when Woj, Adrian Wojnarowski on draft night, he
[2:34] Speaker 3: would come up with like 18 different synonyms for they're
[2:37] Speaker 3: going to select this player. Remember that? Shams Charani, if
[2:41] Speaker 3: you read his story, it's similar, except there's no mention
[2:45] Speaker 3: of a trade, quote unquote, demand or trade request. And
[2:49] Speaker 3: it's very interesting how everybody in the room knows what's
[2:53] Speaker 3: going on, but they're not willing to say that word, demand, request.
[2:58] Speaker 3: And it's just, they're all dancing around this thing that
[3:01] Speaker 3: Giannis doesn't want to be the bad guy and Doc
[3:03] Speaker 3: Rivers doesn't want to be there. Day one, Doc Rivers said,
[3:08] Speaker 3: I don't know why they hired me. I told them
[3:10] Speaker 3: not to hire me. This makes no sense. But man,
[3:13] Speaker 3: $ 40 million is $ 40 million. And when that contract happened,
[3:18] Speaker 3: is on the table. I understand why Doc Rivers left
[3:21] Speaker 3: ESPN to go take that job. But when he says
[3:24] Speaker 3: Google me and Shams Tarania in the story isn't just
[3:27] Speaker 3: saying multiple sources told me. He said six sources told me.
[3:34] Speaker 3: I was like, I got six people in that room
[3:37] Speaker 3: telling me that this went down. So if you don't
[3:39] Speaker 3: believe that I have receipts on this story, check that.
[3:41] Speaker 2: I want to know exactly what the six people said, right?
[3:45] Speaker 2: Because the first person was probably like, hey, check this out.
[3:51] Speaker 1: You're never going to believe this, right?
[3:52] Speaker 2: And then he starts calling other people for confirmation.
[3:55] Speaker 1: There's at least one, yeah, he said that shit. Another, oh,
[3:59] Speaker 1: you know about bro or bro. That's how they say
[4:03] Speaker 1: it now.
[4:03] Speaker 3: Bro.
[4:04] Speaker 1: And the Google me was, what was it that he
[4:06] Speaker 1: was saying? He's like, you guys can look me up.
[4:09] Speaker 2: I've taken teams to the playoffs that weren't supposed to
[4:11] Speaker 2: go to the playoffs because he was trying to rally
[4:12] Speaker 2: them into the play-in game.
[4:14] Speaker 1: And the long and the short was, I do this,
[4:16] Speaker 1: but what about y'all?
[4:19] Speaker 3: Yeah and Doc Rivers man we could do a whole
[4:21] Speaker 3: 90 minutes about the Doc Rivers story but that Boston
[4:26] Speaker 3: team it wasn't like they came out of nowhere to
[4:28] Speaker 3: win the NBA title in 2008 I think they started
[4:31] Speaker 3: out like 24 and three seasons. So it wasn't like
[4:35] Speaker 3: nobody believed us. You can't play that card with the
[4:39] Speaker 3: championship year. And after that, it's a, it's a mixed bag.
[4:43] Speaker 3: You know, he's like exactly 500 in the post season
[4:47] Speaker 3: as a NBA head coach. And when you look at
[4:50] Speaker 3: all the 3-1 leads, which I have a contrarian take
[4:53] Speaker 3: on that, but Doc Rivers, if you go to Google me,
[4:56] Speaker 3: he has been such a punchline in the NBA that
[5:00] Speaker 3: Gemini or ChatGPT or any of these AI apps are
[5:05] Speaker 3: probably going to put stuff at the very top of
[5:07] Speaker 3: Doc Rivers' Google search that he doesn't want to be
[5:10] Speaker 3: in there.
[5:11] Speaker 1: Okay.
[5:12] Speaker 2: Doc's first year in Orlando, I recall as being a
[5:15] Speaker 2: magic trick.
[5:16] Speaker 1: Like he, ah, magic.
[5:18] Speaker 2: But he took a team to the playoffs that people
[5:22] Speaker 2: did not think was going to go to the playoffs.
[5:23] Speaker 2: You have to remember that that was the period of
[5:25] Speaker 2: time where they kept thinking Grant Hill might play this year,
[5:28] Speaker 2: and then Grant Hill would be hurt again, right? He
[5:31] Speaker 2: also had that year after the Clippers traded Chris Paul,
[5:35] Speaker 2: where they absolutely exceeded expectations.
[5:39] Speaker 1: I am also with you. I think the 3-1 thing
[5:43] Speaker 1: is a bit overstated.
[5:44] Speaker 3: Well, one of those is like the Orlando went up,
[5:48] Speaker 3: three one against, I think it was Detroit Detroit as
[5:51] Speaker 3: an eight seed against the number one seed. I'm sorry.
[5:55] Speaker 3: I don't count that as a blown lead when you're
[5:57] Speaker 3: the eight seat about to upset a number one seat.
[5:59] Speaker 3: I just say, man, that's crazy that he got to
[6:01] Speaker 3: a three one lead in that series. Yes, they lost it,
[6:04] Speaker 3: but it was a one eight. There's a couple of
[6:06] Speaker 3: those where you're just like, all right, I get it,
[6:08] Speaker 3: but go on. Yeah.
[6:09] Speaker 2: The there's also in that three, one, the weird one
[6:13] Speaker 2: against the rockets where they had the lead in game six.
[6:17] Speaker 1: And then we, I think it was.
[6:18] Speaker 2: Kevin McHale was coaching the team at the time and
[6:20] Speaker 2: somehow he's got the bright idea. Maybe we should take
[6:22] Speaker 2: James Harden out of the game and just see what happens.
[6:24] Speaker 2: And next thing you know, they didn't do it, but
[6:26] Speaker 2: those things were deep enough. Like the Clippers would wind
[6:28] Speaker 2: up just simply not having enough gas. Like I think
[6:32] Speaker 2: Doc Rivers is a good coach. I think Doc Rivers
[6:35] Speaker 2: in the hall of fame, which just happened is preposterous
[6:39] Speaker 2: because they don't really put coaches in the hall of fame.
[6:42] Speaker 2: Like that is a, Eric Spolstra, you're in now. Like,
[6:46] Speaker 2: I had been prepared to make a, like, there's a
[6:48] Speaker 2: could go either way.
[6:49] Speaker 1: Nope, nope, nope. You're going in.
[6:51] Speaker 2: And Doc Rivers has gotten in. But where Doc Rivers
[6:53] Speaker 2: is really in the Hall of Fame is making your
[6:56] Speaker 2: players not like you. Like your team not liking you
[7:00] Speaker 2: in part because nothing is ever your fault. And so
[7:05] Speaker 2: now you've got Giannis who doesn't want to be the
[7:08] Speaker 2: bad guy with Doc Rivers who never wants to be
[7:11] Speaker 2: the responsible guy. It sounds like it's no fun to
[7:14] Speaker 2: be anybody on that team through the course of this year.
[7:18] Speaker 1: Like none. And as I recall, do they not have
[7:20] Speaker 1: control of their pick this year?
[7:22] Speaker 3: So this is how it works. They have the lesser
[7:26] Speaker 3: of the New Orleans pick.
[7:28] Speaker 1: That's right, because one of them goes to Atlanta. Exactly.
[7:30] Speaker 3: So the number one, if it goes number one, they
[7:33] Speaker 3: don't get it. But if, let's say, New Orleans lands
[7:35] Speaker 3: the number one overall pick, they send it to Atlanta.
[7:38] Speaker 3: And then Milwaukee will basically get whatever they end up with,
[7:41] Speaker 3: like the Milwaukee team. So they have incentive to tank.
[7:43] Speaker 3: This is one of the biggest misnomers in the NBA
[7:46] Speaker 3: season that I've just, it's been a pet peeve of
[7:48] Speaker 3: mine where they're like, they don't even own their own pick.
[7:50] Speaker 3: They have no incentive to tank. And I'm like, yes,
[7:53] Speaker 3: they do. Because New Orleans is terrible. If New Orleans
[7:56] Speaker 3: is terrible, that means Milwaukee should also be terrible because
[8:00] Speaker 3: that pick is going to go to Atlanta and then
[8:02] Speaker 3: they're going to get whatever they are at. And so
[8:04] Speaker 3: this is the math. for the Milwaukee Bucks is as
[8:07] Speaker 3: long as New Orleans is terrible, they have every reason
[8:11] Speaker 3: to be as bad as possible. So New Orleans is
[8:14] Speaker 3: 26 and 54 right now, and Milwaukee's 31 and 48.
[8:18] Speaker 3: They should be way lower than that because as long
[8:22] Speaker 3: as that Pelicans team is in the basement, they have
[8:26] Speaker 3: all the tanking potential. And so Giannis, this whole thing,
[8:29] Speaker 3: I said from the beginning, this is the worst supporting
[8:33] Speaker 3: cast for an MVP candidate we have ever seen. You
[8:37] Speaker 3: can say all you want about Miles Turner, but that
[8:40] Speaker 3: roster with Kyle Kuzma being your third best player is awful.
[8:45] Speaker 3: And so for those people who are like, man, this
[8:47] Speaker 3: is a tough situation for Giannis. I'm like, he should
[8:50] Speaker 3: have been asking out immediately once Damian Lillard had his
[8:54] Speaker 3: torn Achilles and just said, look, the writing is on
[8:57] Speaker 3: the wall. We had a good run. We won a championship.
[9:00] Speaker 1: I'm out.
[9:01] Speaker 3: But instead, like you point out, he wanted to be
[9:03] Speaker 3: the whole Dwight Howard in this situation and not really
[9:07] Speaker 3: be transparent. And so it just seems like everyone in
[9:11] Speaker 3: this situation is not being honest about what's really happening here.
[9:15] Speaker 3: The front office is tanking, wants to tank. The Doc
[9:19] Speaker 3: Rivers wants his paycheck and Giannis Antetokounmpo wants out of there.
[9:23] Speaker 3: And I just wish everyone would stop this just two-faced
[9:28] Speaker 3: dealings with each other because it's just, it's nauseating. This
[9:31] Speaker 3: has been 10 months of this. And I'm so tired
[9:35] Speaker 3: of Giannis just trying to be the good guy. His
[9:38] Speaker 3: players are, his, his, his brothers are on the roster.
[9:40] Speaker 3: He wants to play with them. And so he doesn't
[9:43] Speaker 3: really have the leverage that he thinks he does because he,
[9:48] Speaker 3: the Bucks know Bomani, the Bucks know he doesn't want
[9:50] Speaker 3: to say it. And so they're calling his bluff and
[9:53] Speaker 3: they're saying Bomani we got 275 million dollars coming at
[9:57] Speaker 3: you this summer are you really going to walk away
[9:59] Speaker 3: with from that because this is the weird thing if
[10:02] Speaker 3: Giannis walks away and makes a trade demand he will
[10:05] Speaker 3: not get the maximum bag because it has to be
[10:08] Speaker 3: with a team that he's been with for over six
[10:11] Speaker 3: months And so when you're asking for a trade, you
[10:14] Speaker 3: cannot sign that super max extension with your new team,
[10:18] Speaker 3: if it's the Knicks or if it's the Miami Heat.
[10:20] Speaker 3: And so the Milwaukee Bucks are like, you don't want
[10:22] Speaker 3: to say that word trade demand or that phrase. And
[10:25] Speaker 3: you also got a big bag here that if you
[10:28] Speaker 3: re-sign here, that's the only place you can get it.
[10:30] Speaker 3: And we'll see how much that money and that trade
[10:33] Speaker 3: demand loyalty really matters to you.
[10:35] Speaker 2: What he needed to learn from Dwight, and I've been
[10:38] Speaker 2: making the Dwight comparison through all of this and You
[10:41] Speaker 2: never want to go the full Dwight, right? Like, like,
[10:44] Speaker 2: unless you're trying to block a shot, you.
[10:47] Speaker 1: Never want to go the full Dwight.
[10:49] Speaker 2: And people like good guys that try to be a
[10:54] Speaker 2: good guy. Nobody likes that guy or they like it
[10:58] Speaker 2: at first.
[10:59] Speaker 1: And then they realize, ugh, I'm not sure about this. Like,
[11:02] Speaker 1: this is not a guy beloved by his peers.
[11:04] Speaker 2: I don't know so much how his teammates feel about him,
[11:07] Speaker 2: but they, I am certain that Bobby Portis has not
[11:10] Speaker 2: enjoyed this shit at all. In fact, that story has
[11:12] Speaker 2: something in there about Bobby Portis getting sick of it.
[11:14] Speaker 2: And the person I don't want mad at me is
[11:17] Speaker 2: the guy that broke Mero Titch's face that one time
[11:21] Speaker 2: and witnesses said it didn't even look like he hit
[11:23] Speaker 2: him that hard. That is not, that's not the guy
[11:25] Speaker 2: I want to be in this situation with. My question
[11:27] Speaker 2: for you though is, If you do make a trade
[11:30] Speaker 2: and you get Giannis at this point, what exactly are you.
[11:33] Speaker 1: Getting, right?
[11:34] Speaker 2: Because this is Giannis after 13 years in the NBA.
[11:39] Speaker 2: He has still put up excellent numbers, but I'm not
[11:42] Speaker 2: sure any player has been more heliocentric offensively than he
[11:46] Speaker 2: has been. A guy that's putting up 35, 36, 37,
[11:47] Speaker 2: 38 usage year after year after year. You start building
[11:53] Speaker 2: around that. I don't know how exactly you drop that
[11:56] Speaker 2: off onto something else. Like if you drop him off
[11:58] Speaker 2: onto the Knicks, you think that squad is all of
[11:59] Speaker 2: a sudden going to give him 40%.
[12:00] Speaker 1: Of the shots?
[12:02] Speaker 3: Not with Jalen Brunson around. I don't think so. You
[12:05] Speaker 3: saw what happened to Carl Anthony Towns this year. And
[12:08] Speaker 3: when Mike Brown took over, he was saying, hey, I
[12:10] Speaker 3: don't know about this offense. Like right out the gate,
[12:13] Speaker 3: Carl Anthony Towns was saying, I don't know about this offense.
[12:16] Speaker 3: And the reason is because Mike Brown was like, we're
[12:18] Speaker 3: giving Jalen Brunson the ball. And we're going to make
[12:20] Speaker 3: sure that we're going to not have all of Carl
[12:23] Speaker 3: Anthony Towns histrionics and weird stuff on offensively. And they're
[12:27] Speaker 3: going to run through him and Mikkel Bridges, OGN and
[12:30] Speaker 3: OB and try to get the offense a little bit
[12:32] Speaker 3: more reoriented away from Carl Anthony Towns. So for Giannis, look,
[12:37] Speaker 3: Giannis entering the season had been top four in MVP
[12:41] Speaker 3: in each of the last seven seasons. Seven years in
[12:45] Speaker 3: a row he has been that durable, and I know
[12:47] Speaker 3: he's had his injuries. This year it's gotten way worse,
[12:50] Speaker 3: but seven years in a row he's been top four
[12:52] Speaker 3: in MVP. He's won MVP. He's also Defensive Player of
[12:57] Speaker 3: the Year, Finals MVP, and you're going to have a
[13:00] Speaker 3: guy who's turning 32 in December. What do you do
[13:02] Speaker 3: with that? What do you do with that? With the
[13:04] Speaker 3: calf injuries, the hyperextended knee, and also in the finals
[13:08] Speaker 3: when he hyperextended his knee and then magically it didn't
[13:11] Speaker 3: seem to matter. There's a lot of history here that
[13:13] Speaker 3: if you're at the acquiring team, I think you're going
[13:17] Speaker 3: to have to have a Jalen Brunson or someone else
[13:20] Speaker 3: to essentially tell Giannis, hey, it's okay. You don't have
[13:25] Speaker 3: to go out and get 30 for us tonight. Maybe
[13:27] Speaker 3: 25 is fine. But if we're going to win in
[13:31] Speaker 3: the postseason, We need Giannis to focus on the defense
[13:34] Speaker 3: and we need him to just be a fast break
[13:36] Speaker 3: phenom like he normally is where he can just create
[13:40] Speaker 3: dunks out of fast breaks like no one we've ever
[13:42] Speaker 3: seen in NBA history. So for Giannis, it's a guy
[13:46] Speaker 3: that If you're looking at this at the back nine
[13:50] Speaker 3: of his career with his athleticism, he hasn't had that
[13:54] Speaker 3: major injury yet. But with the way that the NBA
[13:58] Speaker 3: is trending, with the high-speed tempo, if you're going to
[14:02] Speaker 3: win an NBA title, you've got to be guaranteed that
[14:04] Speaker 3: you're going to be ready for 100 games. And he
[14:07] Speaker 3: simply hasn't done that. A deep playoff run. Giannis has
[14:10] Speaker 3: been a first-round out or not doing anything in the
[14:12] Speaker 3: postseason for four years now. So we haven't seen whether Giannis'
[14:16] Speaker 3: body is equipped at this age to make a deep
[14:20] Speaker 3: playoff run. You know the Miami Heat are going to
[14:21] Speaker 3: take a chance. You know the New York Knicks are
[14:23] Speaker 3: going to take a chance. But I can understand why
[14:26] Speaker 3: other teams might be a little nervous about acquiring Giannis
[14:29] Speaker 3: at this stage of his career.
[14:31] Speaker 2: He has one of the great postseason performances of all time.
[14:35] Speaker 1: Game 6, 2021, to bring it home.
[14:38] Speaker 2: He also has been one of the great postseason underperformers.
[14:44] Speaker 2: Of his time and in a way that is interesting.
[14:46] Speaker 2: So I think that we could say at various points.
[14:49] Speaker 2: So Kevin Garnett is an interesting guy for his career
[14:52] Speaker 2: because Kevin Garnett needed to get to a place where
[14:54] Speaker 2: he could be the leader, but not the guy that
[14:55] Speaker 2: had to take the last shot.
[14:57] Speaker 1: Right.
[14:57] Speaker 2: And yes, he's got game seven against Sacramento in 04
[15:00] Speaker 2: where he carried them on his back. But that's not
[15:02] Speaker 2: a guy who wanted that shot. We've seen it. You
[15:04] Speaker 2: could pull up clips of it. That wasn't him.
[15:07] Speaker 1: Right.
[15:07] Speaker 2: But the difference is. Kevin Garnett was not a 38
[15:11] Speaker 2: usage guy, right? Giannis had the free throw issue, though
[15:14] Speaker 2: I always gave him credit.
[15:15] Speaker 1: He'd go to the line and take them, right?
[15:17] Speaker 2: He was not afraid of being embarrassed and taking those shots,
[15:19] Speaker 2: but he'd go and he'd take them. However, I can't
[15:22] Speaker 2: think of a player that was ever as good as him.
[15:24] Speaker 2: that we just saw those teams come up short like
[15:26] Speaker 2: they did. He's been on the wrong side of an
[15:28] Speaker 2: 8-1 loss, right? When they took that loss in the
[15:31] Speaker 2: bubble that year, that was another one. The 2-0 lead
[15:33] Speaker 2: that they blew to Toronto in 2019, where most of
[15:36] Speaker 2: us thought that that was going to be a series
[15:38] Speaker 2: that they were going to walk to because that was
[15:40] Speaker 2: before we told ourselves Nick Nurse was a good coach
[15:42] Speaker 2: because it looked like him and Bootenholzer We're just trying
[15:44] Speaker 2: to try to lose to each other in the course
[15:47] Speaker 2: of that. But we've had all these years where he
[15:49] Speaker 2: hasn't been the guy to get this done. He's not
[15:51] Speaker 2: a take us to a championship guy at this point.
[15:54] Speaker 2: I don't think I think he can be a very
[15:56] Speaker 2: significant part of you going to a championship. But I
[15:59] Speaker 2: don't know what he thinks of himself in all of this.
[16:01] Speaker 2: I don't know what happens when you drop him off
[16:03] Speaker 2: after being on a franchise that is catered to him,
[16:05] Speaker 2: as you should cater to a guy that's made first
[16:07] Speaker 2: team all NBA seven times in a row.
[16:10] Speaker 1: What happens when he goes to this next place?
[16:12] Speaker 2: Miami, to me, seems like the obvious place for him
[16:15] Speaker 2: to go because he is a Pat Riley, Eric Spolstra
[16:18] Speaker 2: sort of dude. Because if nothing else, he is going
[16:20] Speaker 2: to go hard. He is going to be in shape.
[16:23] Speaker 2: If you put him out there with Bam, I don't
[16:25] Speaker 2: know how other teams are supposed to score any points. Like,
[16:29] Speaker 2: I think they still need to get a guy to
[16:30] Speaker 2: get the shot. But that, that to me has got
[16:33] Speaker 2: to be the place that I would want to wind
[16:35] Speaker 2: up if I were him.
[16:36] Speaker 1: Not anymore.
[16:38] Speaker 3: I feel the same way with the Miami Heat, with Giannis.
[16:41] Speaker 3: You know that the coach is ready. The organization is
[16:45] Speaker 3: ready for that guy. Look, they took Jimmy Butler to
[16:48] Speaker 3: the NBA Finals twice. They won the number one overall
[16:51] Speaker 3: seed with Jimmy.
[16:52] Speaker 1: Or Jimmy Butler took them to the NBA Finals twice.
[16:55] Speaker 1: It all depends on your perspective.
[16:56] Speaker 3: That's right. You know my point is that they can
[16:59] Speaker 3: take this older guy and morph him into a championship
[17:03] Speaker 3: contender like that. And so what we saw with Jimmy Butler,
[17:07] Speaker 3: where I was in this camp where he's too old
[17:10] Speaker 3: and way too many miles on those tires, those Tom
[17:12] Speaker 3: Thibodeau tires, for me to believe that they're going to
[17:14] Speaker 3: actually get to a finals with Jimmy Butler. And they
[17:17] Speaker 3: proved me wrong multiple times. And so I look, I
[17:22] Speaker 3: got my career started in Miami. I know that organization
[17:26] Speaker 3: very well. And that is exactly the type of dude
[17:29] Speaker 3: that they want in that organization. The guy was defensive minded.
[17:32] Speaker 3: who is a hooper, a grinder, a guy who lives
[17:34] Speaker 3: in the gym, will play for the Greek national team,
[17:37] Speaker 3: even though it's probably not the best idea for him
[17:40] Speaker 3: physically to have to endure another year of international play
[17:45] Speaker 3: on a team that, look, let's be honest, they're not
[17:49] Speaker 3: vying for a gold medal.
[17:51] Speaker 1: They're the Milwaukee Bucks of Europe.
[17:55] Speaker 3: And I'm Greek, so I feel a lot of national
[17:58] Speaker 3: pride when I watch him playing for the Greek team,
[18:01] Speaker 3: but I also know, hey, if Giannis Antetokounmpo wants to
[18:04] Speaker 3: win another title or maximize his career, I kind of
[18:07] Speaker 3: feel like he should probably take the summer off. Now,
[18:09] Speaker 3: the other thing is Miami Heat is one team. The
[18:12] Speaker 3: other team that I'm wondering about, San Antonio. San Antonio
[18:19] Speaker 3: with Victor Weminyaba.
[18:21] Speaker 1: Cancel Christmas.
[18:23] Speaker 3: And Stephon Castle and Aaron Fox. You can get Giannis,
[18:29] Speaker 3: I'm sure, for Dylan Harper. Dylan Harper is one of
[18:31] Speaker 3: the best young players in the league, and he's still, what,
[18:33] Speaker 3: 20 years old. So if you're looking for young superstar potential,
[18:40] Speaker 3: James Harden 2.0, Milwaukee Bucks can do a lot worse
[18:44] Speaker 3: than Dylan Harper as the centerpiece of a Giannis trade.
[18:46] Speaker 3: And if the Spurs get Giannis, and they got Wemby,
[18:50] Speaker 3: and Fox, and Stephon Castle, that's why the glut of
[18:54] Speaker 3: amazing young guards there in San Antonio is so terrifying.
[18:57] Speaker 3: It's not because, hey, they can have James Harden 2.0
[19:01] Speaker 3: and Shea Gildress Alexander and basically all in the same team.
[19:06] Speaker 3: It's that they can parlay one of those players into
[19:09] Speaker 3: a win now guy like Giannis. And imagine if they
[19:11] Speaker 3: do the San Antonio Twin Towers. You got David Robinson,
[19:16] Speaker 3: Tim Duncan 2.0 with Giannis and Wemby. That's why I'm like, hey,
[19:21] Speaker 3: if San Antonio wins this whole thing, I think maybe
[19:23] Speaker 3: the rest of the league is going to have a
[19:25] Speaker 3: breath of fresh air because they're not going to go
[19:26] Speaker 3: out and try to upgrade. But if they lose early
[19:30] Speaker 3: in this postseason and Wemby's like, yo, get me a guy,
[19:33] Speaker 3: the Giannis trade is fascinating.
[19:37] Speaker 1: Okay.
[19:37] Speaker 2: I had never considered this as a possibility. Throw something
[19:41] Speaker 2: out here at you. I had a buddy, he's from LA, right?
[19:46] Speaker 2: Kind of like LA private school world. And he always
[19:49] Speaker 2: talked about how he was friends with somebody who was
[19:53] Speaker 2: cool with the Collins twins, Jason and Jaron Collins. And
[19:58] Speaker 2: he said that they was so long that they slept
[20:03] Speaker 2: in a room. Each of them slept on two beds
[20:06] Speaker 2: that went the long way.
[20:08] Speaker 1: Right.
[20:09] Speaker 2: That's how that's how tall they were that you had
[20:11] Speaker 2: to put another bed at the foot of the bed.
[20:14] Speaker 2: for them dudes to be able to lay into bed.
[20:17] Speaker 2: And I thought about that. These two guys were on
[20:19] Speaker 2: the same high school team, right? Like this is like
[20:22] Speaker 2: Brooke and Robin Lopez. It's one thing to have like
[20:25] Speaker 2: supersized twins, but supersized twins who are like five-star recruits
[20:30] Speaker 2: and you have to play against them in high school.
[20:33] Speaker 2: And what you're telling me is that the Spurs could
[20:36] Speaker 2: potentially recreate this because my brother's 13 years older than me.
[20:42] Speaker 2: I know what it's like to never feel like you're old.
[20:45] Speaker 2: At every turn, you just feel like somebody might pitch
[20:49] Speaker 2: your shit into the stands.
[20:51] Speaker 1: They got two of those.
[20:52] Speaker 2: Giannis has an argument for being the best defensive player
[20:56] Speaker 2: of his generation.
[20:57] Speaker 1: He's up there with Kawhi Leonard. It's a different thing
[20:59] Speaker 1: because he's so much taller.
[21:00] Speaker 2: But absolutely, as an interior defender who could also step
[21:04] Speaker 2: out in all of those things. And then you're going
[21:06] Speaker 2: to put him with the best defensive player I've ever seen.
[21:10] Speaker 1: Yeah. Ouch.
[21:12] Speaker 3: It's possible, man. It's, it's possible that it's possible. We will,
[21:16] Speaker 3: we will see the first zero points in the paint
[21:19] Speaker 3: game in NBA history. If that happens, you know, like, like,
[21:23] Speaker 3: like no one's going in. There's no one going into
[21:25] Speaker 3: that house. There's no one going inside of the arc.
[21:28] Speaker 3: If you got Wemby and Giannis on the floor, cause Giannis,
[21:31] Speaker 3: he's not the greatest shot blocker, but he's also the
[21:33] Speaker 3: greatest threat. Like he's just him lurking. There is going
[21:38] Speaker 3: to terrify people from going into the paint. And you got,
[21:42] Speaker 3: you got Wemby too. So, They have picks. They got
[21:45] Speaker 3: Dylan Harper. They got Steph Castle. They've got De'Aaron Fox.
[21:49] Speaker 3: They've got a lot of interesting pieces here that Milwaukee
[21:52] Speaker 3: or any other team, Houston could have done this when
[21:56] Speaker 3: they had Fred Van Vliet and Steven Adams healthy that
[21:59] Speaker 3: they have some young players that they could put into
[22:01] Speaker 3: a trade. Now I'm not so sure they can do that.
[22:04] Speaker 3: But San Antonio, I think that's what the most interesting
[22:07] Speaker 3: dynamic is because Wemby wants it, right? Wemby wants it
[22:11] Speaker 3: and he wants it now. If there's one thing we
[22:13] Speaker 3: know about Wemby, it's he's all about this life. He
[22:16] Speaker 3: wants the All-Star Game MVP. He wants to win All-Star.
[22:21] Speaker 3: He wants the MVP. He wants to be the GOAT.
[22:24] Speaker 3: And he's willing to say it. So if he's willing
[22:26] Speaker 3: to say he's the MVP out to the public, to
[22:28] Speaker 3: the media, at the press conference, and if they lose
[22:31] Speaker 3: in the second round because De'Aaron Fox has a bad
[22:33] Speaker 3: series or Stephon Castle and Dylan Harper aren't ready yet,
[22:37] Speaker 3: You know he's going to make his voice heard. And
[22:40] Speaker 3: the San Antonio Spurs, with Victor Weminyama that good right now,
[22:43] Speaker 3: I can understand where they're like, you know what? Let's
[22:46] Speaker 3: end the NBA right now. Oklahoma City, your time is up.
[22:49] Speaker 3: We're going to go get Giannis, and we're going to
[22:51] Speaker 3: end this right now.
[22:52] Speaker 2: But you know Sam got everything he needed to make
[22:54] Speaker 2: a move, too, though. The arms race with two of
[23:02] Speaker 2: the four smallest markets in America, baby.
[23:05] Speaker 1: It's on. Well, not America, but you know.
[23:07] Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah. This is, Bomani, what the NBA needs because
[23:11] Speaker 3: as much as Adam Silver wants to say he loves
[23:13] Speaker 3: parody and he wants parody, I don't truly believe that.
[23:18] Speaker 3: I think he is in the David Stern school of
[23:20] Speaker 3: thought of what's better than Lakers-Knicks? Give me Lakers-Lakers.
[23:25] Speaker 4: Yes. Right?
[23:26] Speaker 3: We had J.A. Donde on the pod yesterday, Basketball Illuminati.
[23:30] Speaker 3: You should check it out. Every Wednesday, we drop that
[23:33] Speaker 3: podcast with Amino Haas and Anthony Mays and I. We
[23:35] Speaker 3: had J.A.
[23:35] Speaker 4: Donde.
[23:36] Speaker 3: We were talking about how different David Stern and Adam
[23:38] Speaker 3: Silverware and this League of Parody where seven different titles,
[23:43] Speaker 3: seven different teams have won titles over the last seven years.
[23:46] Speaker 3: And I'm sitting here like, Bomani, I kind of want
[23:50] Speaker 3: the rivalries back. I want teams going at it every
[23:53] Speaker 3: season and having that story build because as much as
[23:56] Speaker 3: we say we want parody, I think we want story.
[24:00] Speaker 3: I think we want David versus Goliath. I think we
[24:03] Speaker 3: want Godzilla versus King Kong where it's like, I want
[24:07] Speaker 3: these two juggernauts, OKC and San Antonio, to meet up
[24:10] Speaker 3: in the playoffs. And I want them to hate each other.
[24:13] Speaker 3: And we're already there except for the playoff thing. And
[24:16] Speaker 3: I want that to happen. I want this rivalry. I
[24:19] Speaker 3: want a Sam Presti and R.C. Buford, Giannis Antetokounmpo bidding
[24:24] Speaker 3: war because I feel like the NBA needs this. They
[24:28] Speaker 3: need these rivalries because as much as we want to
[24:30] Speaker 3: say parity is the North Star of the NBA. I
[24:33] Speaker 3: think that's a euphemism for another economic goal for the
[24:37] Speaker 3: NBA owners rather than true parity. I think the NBA
[24:41] Speaker 3: needs this in a way that I don't think people
[24:43] Speaker 3: appreciate is San Antonio and OKC. We need that rivalry
[24:47] Speaker 3: in the Western Conference.
[24:49] Speaker 2: All right, so coming up next, I want to talk
[24:50] Speaker 2: about this exact thing because I have long felt that way,
[24:54] Speaker 2: but I've wavered a little bit.
[24:55] Speaker 1: I'm explaining why coming up next.
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[26:18] Speaker 2: All right, we are back with Tom Haberstroh, and I
[26:21] Speaker 2: am just like you. I have felt that Dynasty Saga
[26:25] Speaker 2: is the best narrative form for the NBA, right? Like
[26:29] Speaker 2: with San Antonio, I think people have missed a point
[26:31] Speaker 2: where there's like, oh.
[26:32] Speaker 1: You're just saying they can't win because they just don't
[26:34] Speaker 1: have experience.
[26:35] Speaker 2: It's like, no, it's that playoff basketball is not the
[26:38] Speaker 2: same kind of basketball as the regular season. And we
[26:41] Speaker 2: have not seen what they will do in playoff basketball.
[26:43] Speaker 2: And literally every other team we've seen pretty much has
[26:48] Speaker 2: needed to figure out playoff basketball, including the Oklahoma City
[26:51] Speaker 2: juggernaut that exists now went in and lost in the
[26:54] Speaker 2: second round. that first year that they got there is
[26:57] Speaker 2: the number one seed because it's a matter of learning
[27:00] Speaker 2: what it is, right? And so there's something to that
[27:02] Speaker 2: where a team gets a little farther, gets a little farther,
[27:05] Speaker 2: typically having somebody that they have to run up against
[27:07] Speaker 2: a couple of times before they manage to get by.
[27:10] Speaker 1: That is how I prefer it.
[27:12] Speaker 2: However, I have to say, I am totally fascinated by
[27:15] Speaker 2: what the West is, right? Like, I love the idea
[27:17] Speaker 2: that this year, these games are going to matter all
[27:20] Speaker 2: the way until the end.
[27:22] Speaker 1: How those matchups go matter.
[27:24] Speaker 2: And it's sizing up such that I think Denver would
[27:27] Speaker 2: rather be in the four than be in the three.
[27:30] Speaker 2: But the Lakers having their injury situation basically locks Denver
[27:33] Speaker 2: into the three. But what that means is we're going
[27:35] Speaker 2: to get Jokic, and the Spurs in the second round.
[27:39] Speaker 2: And as we just saw on Saturday, that'll be a
[27:42] Speaker 2: slobber knocker, right? And as good as Victor is, the
[27:45] Speaker 2: best player in the NBA is still number 15. We're
[27:47] Speaker 2: going to have to see that. Oklahoma City getting matched
[27:51] Speaker 2: up with Houston. That one stinks because Oklahoma City is
[27:52] Speaker 2: going to walk over whoever they get in the second
[27:54] Speaker 2: round if it stays. lakers rockets um in that round
[27:58] Speaker 2: but i liked the idea that i didn't really have
[28:01] Speaker 2: a great handle on who was going to win the
[28:03] Speaker 2: west right like i look at the east that i
[28:05] Speaker 2: feel very similarly where there's no team that i think
[28:07] Speaker 2: you could look at just because we don't know what
[28:09] Speaker 2: jason tam is going to look.
[28:10] Speaker 1: Like with the pounding of playing in the postseason.
[28:14] Speaker 2: Right I think they've gotten more out of the parody
[28:18] Speaker 2: than I expected for them to get. Like, I think
[28:20] Speaker 2: this is going to be pretty broadly an interesting post season,
[28:24] Speaker 2: but you're right. It might be the last one because
[28:26] Speaker 2: those teams at the top are going to have to
[28:27] Speaker 2: ramp up. Yeah.
[28:29] Speaker 3: I think, I think, I think the Spurs can win
[28:31] Speaker 3: it this year. I think the Spurs can win it
[28:34] Speaker 3: this year and overcome that playoff inexperience. Because if there's
[28:38] Speaker 3: one thing we've seen over the last few years in
[28:40] Speaker 3: the league is that injuries are creating more parody injuries.
[28:45] Speaker 3: The Indiana Pacers getting all the way to the conference
[28:48] Speaker 3: finals two years ago and the NBA finals last year
[28:51] Speaker 3: is much of a story as it is of Tyrese
[28:53] Speaker 3: Halliburton and his amazing clutch play and Siakam and just
[28:58] Speaker 3: the balling out that Andrew Nembhard and Aaron Neesmith do.
[29:01] Speaker 3: It's certainly a story. But it's also that these injuries
[29:05] Speaker 3: in the Eastern Conference have paved way for the New
[29:07] Speaker 3: York Knicks and the Indiana Pacers to go deeper into
[29:10] Speaker 3: the postseason than we ever imagined. And I think... I
[29:14] Speaker 3: think that if there was going to be a year
[29:17] Speaker 3: in which the San Antonio Spurs or an era where
[29:20] Speaker 3: a team with no playoff experience, I'm not counting Harrison
[29:23] Speaker 3: Bards in this equation, right? The playoff inexperience, that variable,
[29:28] Speaker 3: I think in the 90s and early 2000s, it would
[29:32] Speaker 3: matter a whole great deal. But because the game is
[29:35] Speaker 3: so violent right now on the joints and because the
[29:39] Speaker 3: pace is so high, I'm wondering if we're not taking
[29:43] Speaker 3: that into account enough that there is just so much
[29:47] Speaker 3: variance in the post season now, because the game is
[29:52] Speaker 3: taking out so many star players that we, I mean, okay. See,
[29:56] Speaker 3: went to two game sevens last year, but money.
[29:58] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[29:59] Speaker 1: You know?
[29:59] Speaker 3: And so it's, if Aaron Gordon is healthy in that series,
[30:03] Speaker 3: you could say that Denver wins that series against OKC.
[30:08] Speaker 3: So part of me says, yeah, the Spurs have to
[30:11] Speaker 3: go by the tradition, the ritual of it is in
[30:14] Speaker 3: the NBA that you cannot just come out of the
[30:16] Speaker 3: gate without any post-season runs and win the whole damn thing.
[30:20] Speaker 3: We've never seen that happen. But I kind of feel
[30:23] Speaker 3: like We need to rewrite the history books with these
[30:25] Speaker 3: injuries that we're seeing among star players in the NBA,
[30:29] Speaker 3: where star players this year are playing only 60% of
[30:31] Speaker 3: their games. SGA, Chad Holmgren, Jalen Williams, J-Dub, they've only
[30:37] Speaker 3: played 26 games together this season. And so if they're
[30:41] Speaker 3: not healthy, yeah, I can see the San Antonio Spurs
[30:45] Speaker 3: upsetting them in the postseason. And after that, all bets
[30:48] Speaker 3: are off. I kind of feel like the San Antonio
[30:50] Speaker 3: Spurs can win a title this year and not and
[30:53] Speaker 3: not lay down to the history of all of those
[30:57] Speaker 3: teams that needed a playoff run before they won it all?
[31:01] Speaker 2: Well, the series that I think would be interesting for
[31:03] Speaker 2: the Spurs to kind of chart the course of what
[31:05] Speaker 2: happens is if the Clippers beat the Suns in that
[31:07] Speaker 2: 7-8 play-in game, assuming that's going to be the game.
[31:12] Speaker 2: I think the Clippers will win two of those because
[31:15] Speaker 2: the version of Kawhi Leonard that currently exists and has
[31:18] Speaker 2: been playing this year he'll get you one at least, right? Like,
[31:24] Speaker 2: that is an all-time great postseason performer, right? Like, he's
[31:28] Speaker 2: not young anymore. I want to say this is his
[31:30] Speaker 2: 15th year in the NBA. But I think they'll knock
[31:33] Speaker 2: the Spurs around a little bit. right they'll they'll they'll
[31:37] Speaker 2: give them because look we just saw uh victor catch
[31:39] Speaker 2: a rib contusion that felt like a very skinny man
[31:41] Speaker 2: injury right like we just we we just saw that
[31:44] Speaker 2: thing go down the attrition for the spurs like that
[31:47] Speaker 2: one will that will be entering interesting for us to
[31:49] Speaker 2: see how this ends up going but also let us
[31:52] Speaker 2: not forget it's entirely possible that uh the legend killer
[31:55] Speaker 2: anthony edwards could come out here and take denver out
[31:57] Speaker 2: in the first round himself.
[31:59] Speaker 3: Yeah, the West is going to be a bloodbath. And
[32:03] Speaker 3: Kawhi Leonard, by the way, he's number five on my
[32:05] Speaker 3: MVP ballot. Let's just count Luka in there for now.
[32:10] Speaker 3: But he's going to get first-team All-NBA. He deserves to
[32:13] Speaker 3: get first-team All-NBA. Aspiration scandal aside, imagine the other owners,
[32:19] Speaker 3: if Kawhi is winning a playoff series, a 1-8 series,
[32:23] Speaker 3: if the Clippers somehow pull that off in one of
[32:24] Speaker 3: the most all-time biggest upsets... Steve Ballmer is just going
[32:29] Speaker 3: to be laughing his way to that next round if
[32:31] Speaker 3: that happens.
[32:32] Speaker 1: But the GMs might care. The owners do not care
[32:38] Speaker 1: at all.
[32:39] Speaker 3: What, that Steve Ballmer is getting away with this?
[32:45] Speaker 2: I firmly believe that once this investigation is done and
[32:49] Speaker 2: whatever they come back with, because I'm not sure. I'm
[32:53] Speaker 2: not sold that he's getting away with anything. I have
[32:55] Speaker 2: not been convinced of that yet.
[32:57] Speaker 1: Okay.
[32:57] Speaker 2: I'm just telling you, don't nobody really care. A colleague
[33:03] Speaker 2: of mine made a very good point about this aspiration situation,
[33:07] Speaker 2: and this is the truth. The NBA's problem right now
[33:10] Speaker 2: is teams trying to lose. It is not teams trying
[33:12] Speaker 2: to win. Nobody really cares.
[33:16] Speaker 3: I can get on with the teams trying to lose thing.
[33:17] Speaker 3: Did you see the piece that I did last week
[33:19] Speaker 3: about the A League and the B League?
[33:22] Speaker 1: I did. It is.
[33:24] Speaker 3: It is unbelievable, Bomani, how this league just morphed into
[33:30] Speaker 3: two separate leagues. And I absolutely agree with you that
[33:34] Speaker 3: Adam Silver, on the list of things that he has
[33:36] Speaker 3: to care about, is the integrity of the game. And
[33:39] Speaker 3: that teams are throwing games strategically with coaching decisions where
[33:45] Speaker 3: I saw the coach of the Washington Wizards argue that
[33:49] Speaker 3: Alex Saar and Bilal Koulibaly and... Keyshawn George, I think
[33:54] Speaker 3: Trey Johnson, that they were on minutes restrictions due to
[33:58] Speaker 3: their medical situations. And that's why they had to sit
[34:02] Speaker 3: in the fourth quarter in these close games. Bub Carrington
[34:06] Speaker 3: had to sit in the fourth quarter of these games,
[34:09] Speaker 3: even though he played the first 12 minutes of the game, Bomani.
[34:13] Speaker 3: And he said, yeah, we got minutes restrictions on these guys.
[34:16] Speaker 1: It's a Tom Tuesday night.
[34:19] Speaker 2: The Golden State Warriors are trailing the Sacramento Kings by
[34:22] Speaker 2: a point. And the Kings intentionally filed to put the
[34:27] Speaker 2: Warriors on the line. They intentionally filed Steph Curry.
[34:32] Speaker 3: Come on.
[34:35] Speaker 1: What are we doing, right?
[34:37] Speaker 2: Like, I feel like the one maybe benefit of it.
[34:41] Speaker 2: it makes it feel like every team into the playoffs
[34:44] Speaker 2: is coming in on a run, right? Because they get
[34:46] Speaker 2: to play enough games against these bums. Like I'm looking
[34:48] Speaker 2: at the top half of the top six teams in
[34:51] Speaker 2: the East right now. The Pistons have won seven out
[34:53] Speaker 2: of 10. The Celtics have won eight out of 10.
[34:54] Speaker 2: The Knicks have won seven out of 10. The Cavs
[34:56] Speaker 2: have won eight out of 10. The Hawks have won
[34:57] Speaker 2: seven out of 10. Everybody feeling good. Go down to
[35:00] Speaker 2: the West. Thunder, nine out of 10. Spurs, nine out
[35:03] Speaker 2: of 10. Nuggets, nine out of 10. Keeping in mind
[35:05] Speaker 2: the one loss for the Spurs was to the Nuggets. Rockets,
[35:09] Speaker 2: eight out of 10.
[35:10] Speaker 1: Hey, man, all these bubs got everybody else feeling good.
[35:14] Speaker 3: Well, I wonder, Bomati, do you think Adam Silver cares
[35:18] Speaker 3: about this or does he care about the gambling aspect
[35:21] Speaker 3: of it of, A lot of people who are setting
[35:24] Speaker 3: the lines on this game don't know who's playing or
[35:26] Speaker 3: how much they're going to be playing and where to
[35:28] Speaker 3: set these lines at. Because we just saw the Oklahoma
[35:31] Speaker 3: City Thunder, I think they were favored by a record
[35:34] Speaker 3: 24 points in a game, and they won by 35.
[35:39] Speaker 3: And so these lines makers, they're not really sure where
[35:42] Speaker 3: to put them because they don't know how much these
[35:46] Speaker 3: teams are actually trying to win and play their best players.
[35:49] Speaker 3: And so I'm wondering if Adam Silver, the reason why
[35:52] Speaker 3: he's so publicly strident and saying we are going to
[35:57] Speaker 3: end this now, full stop, you're going to see the
[36:00] Speaker 3: end of tanking. Is that because the owners want this?
[36:04] Speaker 3: Or is that because his business partners want this at
[36:07] Speaker 3: the other gambling companies? Because it does seem like to
[36:10] Speaker 3: me he is out here saying a lot. about how
[36:14] Speaker 3: he is going to end tanking. And the proposals that
[36:16] Speaker 3: I'm seeing, Bomani, these seem like half measures. We talked
[36:22] Speaker 3: about it last time I was on the show. I
[36:24] Speaker 3: don't know how you quote-unquote solve tanking by maintaining the
[36:28] Speaker 3: draft lottery. I just don't see how that's possible. Because
[36:31] Speaker 3: he's saying one thing, and then what he's coming at
[36:34] Speaker 3: with us is a totally different thing, a much more
[36:36] Speaker 3: water-diluted version of we're going to abolish tanking. We're going
[36:40] Speaker 3: to get rid of it. And so I'm wondering.
[36:44] Speaker 1: If.
[36:44] Speaker 3: Adam Silver's just not up for this task of trying
[36:47] Speaker 3: to get rid of tanking, because I think we all
[36:48] Speaker 3: know what that would take, and it doesn't seem like
[36:52] Speaker 3: he's willing to get rid of the draft lottery, which
[36:54] Speaker 3: is incentivizing teams to be as bad as possible to
[36:57] Speaker 3: get the players that are as good as possible on
[36:59] Speaker 3: the best financial construct in the rookie scale contract.
[37:03] Speaker 2: Yeah, or, you know, and you and I have talked
[37:05] Speaker 2: about this, because by flattening the lottery odds, it's now
[37:09] Speaker 2: made it more advantageous for teams that don't have to
[37:12] Speaker 2: be terrible to lose more games, right? Because they then
[37:15] Speaker 2: have a greater chance in order to win. But I
[37:19] Speaker 2: think for silver, part of it is definitely what's going
[37:22] Speaker 2: on with the gambling companies, right? But I also think
[37:26] Speaker 2: the other part of it is, and probably the biggest
[37:28] Speaker 2: part is, it's become shameful to a point of disrespect, right?
[37:32] Speaker 2: they're playing so obviously in our faces as a collective
[37:36] Speaker 2: and directly in his face as a commissioner in a
[37:39] Speaker 2: way that they never would have done to David Stern, right?
[37:42] Speaker 2: Like it's just the measures that teams are taking and
[37:45] Speaker 2: the ways that they're going about it. You can't flatly
[37:48] Speaker 2: tell the paying customers we're trying to lose here. What
[37:52] Speaker 2: has made it terrible for him though is that the
[37:54] Speaker 2: paying customers have been so conditioned to think this shit
[37:57] Speaker 2: is cool that they're in many cases begging for losses, right? Like,
[38:03] Speaker 2: I don't know how exactly he fixes it, but you're right.
[38:06] Speaker 2: The presence of a lottery throws all this off. The
[38:09] Speaker 2: presence of a draft, honestly, you know, you and I
[38:11] Speaker 2: have talked about this. The presence of a draft throws
[38:13] Speaker 2: this thing off, but he does have to do something
[38:17] Speaker 2: about this. But at the same time, it has been
[38:20] Speaker 2: a very interesting close to the season, right? Which is
[38:23] Speaker 2: something that we haven't always been able to say. You
[38:26] Speaker 2: just can't have people play it in your face like that.
[38:28] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[38:29] Speaker 3: Yeah, it's something that I think has happened increasingly is
[38:32] Speaker 3: the separation with the play-in tournament, like that you have
[38:35] Speaker 3: 10 teams that are post-season eligible now, but it's created
[38:40] Speaker 3: this split in ways we have never seen that there's
[38:45] Speaker 3: 20 teams that are trying to win, 21 if you
[38:48] Speaker 3: count the Pelicans because they don't have the rights to
[38:50] Speaker 3: their first-round pick, and then everybody else is like, All right, well,
[38:53] Speaker 3: if we're not going to go for the play-in, and
[38:55] Speaker 3: by the way, the 10th seed in the play-in ain't
[38:58] Speaker 3: all it's cracked up to be. One team has made
[39:00] Speaker 3: it out of the play-in in 10 times that they've
[39:03] Speaker 3: had this. One team has made it out of the
[39:05] Speaker 3: play-in as the number 10 seed, and it was the
[39:08] Speaker 3: Miami Heat last year, and they got embarrassed. BTA in
[39:13] Speaker 3: that series against the Cleveland Cavaliers. And so if you're
[39:16] Speaker 3: a number 10 seed or a team that's on the
[39:17] Speaker 3: fringe of competing, I can understand why Chicago was like,
[39:21] Speaker 3: all right, finally, we're going to pull, the court, right?
[39:24] Speaker 3: I can understand why Memphis, Dallas, Milwaukee is like, as
[39:31] Speaker 3: long as we're just kind of like in that nine, 10,
[39:34] Speaker 3: 11 range, we just saw the Atlanta Hawks jump to
[39:37] Speaker 3: number one. We just saw the Dallas Mavericks get Cooper
[39:39] Speaker 3: flag at number 11. So it's created this separation between
[39:43] Speaker 3: the two leagues and the teams are being as brave
[39:49] Speaker 3: about this. and as bold and emboldened about this as
[39:53] Speaker 3: they've ever had, like tanking outright from the start of
[39:55] Speaker 3: the season. And you're right. It's, it's not really worth
[40:00] Speaker 3: it for those teams in that 11 range, like in
[40:03] Speaker 3: the 11th of the, of the, uh, playoff standings to
[40:06] Speaker 3: try to go for it and get that number 10 seed.
[40:09] Speaker 3: So I just think that the NBA has to figure
[40:11] Speaker 3: this out. Um, but ultimately, yeah, I'm excited for the
[40:15] Speaker 3: post season to get here so we can get rid
[40:16] Speaker 3: of that talk. We just can talk about how good
[40:18] Speaker 3: OKC and San Antonio and Denver are. It is going
[40:20] Speaker 3: to be an absolute bloodbath. And I wonder, Bomani, I
[40:24] Speaker 3: think the best story for the NBA would be San
[40:26] Speaker 3: Antonio winning it all. Victor Wembenyama as fully empowered and
[40:31] Speaker 3: winning a championship. But I also can't discount the idea
[40:36] Speaker 3: of Victor Wembenyama pissed as all hell and getting out
[40:40] Speaker 3: in like the second round and being like, we got
[40:42] Speaker 3: to ramp up.
[40:44] Speaker 1: Yeah, no, no, no.
[40:45] Speaker 2: A game seven loss, whether it be to Oklahoma City
[40:48] Speaker 2: or to Denver. I think is the best long run
[40:51] Speaker 2: NBA situation. Cause look, he took a leap this year.
[40:54] Speaker 2: The first two years were the potential years for him.
[40:57] Speaker 2: Now where he's taking guys to the elbow and in
[41:00] Speaker 2: operating in space and they are terrified of what might
[41:03] Speaker 2: happen next on top of everything that happens with defense.
[41:05] Speaker 2: Like now he's out here flexing in people's faces and
[41:08] Speaker 2: everything else like, Oh no, no, no, no, no, no. This,
[41:11] Speaker 2: but if it goes, look, I was talking to somebody
[41:13] Speaker 2: about this the other day and they were asking me,
[41:16] Speaker 2: are the French the favorites to win the gold medal
[41:18] Speaker 2: in 2028?
[41:19] Speaker 1: And I think the answer is unequivocally, yes.
[41:22] Speaker 2: He tasted his own blood at the crib in 2024.
[41:25] Speaker 2: Now he gets the chance to return the favor in
[41:27] Speaker 2: Los Angeles.
[41:28] Speaker 1: It's going to be terrifying.
[41:30] Speaker 2: Now, if you give yourself somehow an NBA analog to
[41:33] Speaker 2: that situation.
[41:37] Speaker 3: I can't wait. I can't wait. It's the guy. The
[41:41] Speaker 3: guy is. Offensively. he's developed in a way that was
[41:48] Speaker 3: way faster than many imagined, but he's 22 Bomani. Like
[41:53] Speaker 3: this is, this is the worst he's ever going to be.
[41:56] Speaker 4: Yeah.
[41:56] Speaker 3: The worst he's ever going to be. So if you
[41:59] Speaker 3: have a guy who's figured out, Oh wait, no one
[42:02] Speaker 3: can stop me. Once I, once I get downhill or
[42:04] Speaker 3: once I get the ball in the post and I'm
[42:06] Speaker 3: going to be watching your kitchen, how he's been able
[42:08] Speaker 3: to master that, that block and figure out how to
[42:12] Speaker 3: play chess, you know, and literally play, the guy's a
[42:15] Speaker 3: chess master or want an aspiring chess master, Victor Wemenyama.
[42:19] Speaker 3: There's just going to be a time in the not
[42:22] Speaker 3: so distant future where he's as good offensively as he
[42:24] Speaker 3: is defensively. And that's a scary thought.
[42:28] Speaker 2: I do want to ask you before we get out
[42:30] Speaker 2: of here, but if you had thoughts on this Mike
[42:33] Speaker 2: Malone hire, because I think NBA coaches going to college
[42:36] Speaker 2: may become more of a thing. Now that college is
[42:38] Speaker 2: becoming a bit more like the pros, like now that
[42:40] Speaker 2: you don't really have to go on the road and
[42:42] Speaker 2: go get these guys.
[42:45] Speaker 1: I think this will be interesting.
[42:46] Speaker 2: But I think the Malone thing, it sounds like they're
[42:49] Speaker 2: going to get him a legitimate staff and go get
[42:51] Speaker 2: some players. He seems to, and this I did not
[42:54] Speaker 2: give him enough credit for, he understands the assignment when
[42:57] Speaker 2: it comes to the soft stuff of being a college
[42:59] Speaker 2: basketball coach, right? Like he knows how to talk that
[43:02] Speaker 2: shit about how much he loves Carolina and all of
[43:05] Speaker 2: those things.
[43:07] Speaker 1: This could work.
[43:09] Speaker 3: I'm for it, man. I'm for it. Like when they
[43:12] Speaker 3: announced that Michael Malone got that job, I've always felt
[43:15] Speaker 3: Michael Malone is more of a college coach, his disposition,
[43:17] Speaker 3: his personality. He has gotten, he's been ejected from games
[43:22] Speaker 3: where he gets his Dan Hurley on and he gets
[43:24] Speaker 3: in front of an official, an NBA official, makes contact
[43:28] Speaker 3: and is so irate that he has to get ejected.
[43:31] Speaker 3: Like Jokic has multiple times had to step in front
[43:33] Speaker 3: of Michael Malone because he just, he loses his temper,
[43:38] Speaker 3: just absolutely loses it on guys. And you saw Nikola Jokic.
[43:43] Speaker 3: In the press conference the other day, when asked about this,
[43:46] Speaker 3: he's like, I think he's going to have a really
[43:50] Speaker 3: good opportunity here. I'm happy for him because he can
[43:52] Speaker 3: actually teach and get players to play the right way. AKA,
[43:57] Speaker 3: he's more of a college coach than he is an
[43:59] Speaker 3: NBA coach. And I do feel like Michael Malone... Just
[44:03] Speaker 3: the vibe I get from him is way more college
[44:07] Speaker 3: oriented than it is. And he's won an NBA championship,
[44:09] Speaker 3: which is crazy to say that I feel like Michael Malone,
[44:12] Speaker 3: the way he talks about the game, he's more old school.
[44:15] Speaker 3: I feel like he's better suited for the college ranks
[44:18] Speaker 3: than the NBA ranks. And look, man, I think it
[44:21] Speaker 3: was the AD. Someone at Chapel Hill said we wanted
[44:25] Speaker 3: to go out and get the best available coach, professional
[44:28] Speaker 3: or otherwise. And I said, wait, college sports is professional. Like,
[44:32] Speaker 3: let's not. Let's not mix it up, but this is
[44:36] Speaker 3: an era where you have to think that college sports
[44:39] Speaker 3: is professional. Getting Michael Malone, I think you're right. There's
[44:43] Speaker 3: going to be a lot of guys in the NBA
[44:46] Speaker 3: that feel like, oh, I can get just as much
[44:48] Speaker 3: money by doing the college game, and I don't have
[44:51] Speaker 3: to go out on the road and recruit. Didn't Dusty
[44:53] Speaker 3: May talk about this? He's like, I haven't stepped foot
[44:56] Speaker 3: in any of these houses. This is great. I love
[44:59] Speaker 3: this era.
[45:00] Speaker 1: Yeah, but there's also.
[45:04] Speaker 2: You're going to see, I was talking to an agent
[45:08] Speaker 2: who works with college players about this a couple weeks ago,
[45:10] Speaker 2: and I asked him, I was like, so how is
[45:14] Speaker 2: dealing with, I guess what we'll now call a front
[45:16] Speaker 2: office in college, different than dealing with the front office
[45:19] Speaker 2: in the pros? He's like, it's not going to be
[45:20] Speaker 2: that much different because it's going to be a bunch
[45:22] Speaker 2: of guys from the pros. Like, if you were somehow
[45:25] Speaker 2: a washout for whatever reason in the front office in
[45:29] Speaker 2: the NBA, you There's a world for you now down here.
[45:32] Speaker 1: Like, I think you're going to start seeing that in football.
[45:34] Speaker 2: But there's just another there's a class of guys who
[45:37] Speaker 2: maybe could not move themselves up to be in a
[45:39] Speaker 2: VP of player personnel or GM or anything like that. Well,
[45:43] Speaker 2: maybe you just go down like all those stories we
[45:45] Speaker 2: got of like, for example, Adrian Wojnarowski is the GM
[45:49] Speaker 2: at St. Bonaventure, for example. Master P was the GM
[45:52] Speaker 2: at the University of New Orleans, Shaq's the GM there.
[45:54] Speaker 2: somewhere that's about to be out the window like not
[45:57] Speaker 2: even so much talking about adrian because i think that
[45:59] Speaker 2: he's probably up to that task but the idea of
[46:02] Speaker 2: a ceremonial general manager No, no, no. I think that's
[46:06] Speaker 2: about to be gone. And you're about to see a
[46:07] Speaker 2: lot of guys who used to work in the pros,
[46:09] Speaker 2: just like you're going to see a lot of agents
[46:11] Speaker 2: who maybe weren't that great at it in the pro ranks.
[46:14] Speaker 2: They're going to start moving down into college. And those
[46:17] Speaker 2: are going to be the guys that then traffic in
[46:18] Speaker 2: that space, which I then think is going to mean
[46:21] Speaker 2: you're going to see a lot more NBA type coaches
[46:23] Speaker 2: come down there because what I think is about to
[46:25] Speaker 2: go extinct.
[46:26] Speaker 1: Here's what you think about this.
[46:28] Speaker 2: We all know college basketball, and it's a lot of
[46:31] Speaker 2: guys with a lot of success. And what they did
[46:34] Speaker 2: was they went and got really good players, and then
[46:36] Speaker 2: they rolled the ball out there, and that's all it
[46:38] Speaker 2: had to be. All of us have in our mind
[46:40] Speaker 2: that guy that's got all the wins, and all they
[46:42] Speaker 2: did was roll the ball out there.
[46:44] Speaker 1: Those guys are about to be.
[46:46] Speaker 2: because your ability to get players is not going to
[46:49] Speaker 2: be enough to sustain your job anymore because the ability
[46:51] Speaker 2: to get players is going to be about money and
[46:54] Speaker 2: the front office, which means I think the strategic element
[46:57] Speaker 2: of college basketball is then going to go up, which
[47:01] Speaker 2: is then going to increase demand for a guy like
[47:03] Speaker 2: Malone because when Carolina fans were like, I don't know
[47:05] Speaker 2: about this, let me tell you what you weren't going
[47:08] Speaker 2: to find, a better basketball coach. Now, it's possible you
[47:12] Speaker 2: might have found a better steward for your program And
[47:14] Speaker 2: maybe you thought that Tommy Lloyd, because of his time
[47:17] Speaker 2: at Gonzaga and with his success at Arizona, would have
[47:19] Speaker 2: been the guy for you. Tommy Lloyd is not a
[47:22] Speaker 2: better basketball coach than Mike Malone is. Mike Malone, I
[47:27] Speaker 2: don't think, I think we've actually undersold how good a
[47:30] Speaker 2: job he did while he was in Denver.
[47:33] Speaker 3: Well, yeah, and that wasn't his first stop, right? So
[47:36] Speaker 3: he has the respect, like LeBron loves Mike Malone.
[47:39] Speaker 1: Buggy!
[47:40] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[47:41] Speaker 3: Like this, this dude, um, I think he's, I think
[47:44] Speaker 3: it was a great hire. Uh, I thought Billy Donovan,
[47:47] Speaker 3: the interesting part about the Billy Donovan story is that, uh,
[47:52] Speaker 3: in a weird way, Chicago cleaning house with the front office,
[47:56] Speaker 3: the bulls and deciding to get rid of corner corner
[47:59] Speaker 3: show of us in Eversley. Um, in empowered Billy Donovan
[48:03] Speaker 3: in a weird way that they're now saying the GM,
[48:06] Speaker 3: the incoming front office exec has to essentially be okay
[48:10] Speaker 3: with Billy Donovan as the head coach and Billy Donovan.
[48:13] Speaker 3: I don't know if he's, if he played his cards
[48:16] Speaker 3: right here because he could have been the head coach
[48:18] Speaker 3: of the, of the university of North Carolina Tar Heels.
[48:22] Speaker 3: And now he's got the Chicago bulls with the same ownership.
[48:25] Speaker 3: You'll get paid nicely, but, But I feel like Billy
[48:28] Speaker 3: Donovan would have been a lot happier if he was
[48:30] Speaker 3: at Carolina than if he was at the Chicago Bulls
[48:32] Speaker 3: because I just have no faith in that ownership with Chicago.
[48:36] Speaker 3: Has any professional franchise fumbled the bag more than the
[48:41] Speaker 3: Chicago Bulls after the 90s Bulls?
[48:44] Speaker 2: Well, that's why I would love if somebody could really
[48:46] Speaker 2: get to the bottom of it with Billy and getting
[48:49] Speaker 2: an understanding of why he did this.
[48:51] Speaker 1: And I say that because.
[48:53] Speaker 2: My understanding is that he never talked to anybody beyond
[48:56] Speaker 2: the search.
[48:57] Speaker 1: Firm with Carolina.
[48:58] Speaker 2: Like he was never really in it. He never really
[49:02] Speaker 2: got to a point of truly pursuing this. And I
[49:06] Speaker 2: would imagine that he would be trying to get the
[49:07] Speaker 2: hell out of Dodge for what the Bulls have been. Like,
[49:10] Speaker 2: why would you want to continue doing this? He must
[49:13] Speaker 2: really just be like, I'm done with this college thing,
[49:16] Speaker 2: even though I would feel like at this point, all
[49:19] Speaker 2: the things he probably didn't like about coaching college basketball,
[49:22] Speaker 2: he doesn't have.
[49:23] Speaker 1: To deal with anymore.
[49:24] Speaker 2: That being said, after working with actual factual NBA players,
[49:31] Speaker 2: can't really imagine what it's like working with college basketball players.
[49:35] Speaker 2: Like this is like, you go, you've taken a lot of,
[49:38] Speaker 2: you've taken a pretty decent level of high level math.
[49:41] Speaker 1: You know how them cats don't remember how to add.
[49:43] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[49:43] Speaker 1: Like, are they getting there?
[49:44] Speaker 2: Like two plus three. But if you ask them to
[49:47] Speaker 2: take a fourth order derivative of something, they might be
[49:49] Speaker 2: able to do it off the top of their heads.
[49:51] Speaker 1: Maybe that's it.
[49:52] Speaker 2: Like Billy Donovan is not trying to show you motherfuckers
[49:54] Speaker 2: how to add. He's just not trying.
[49:55] Speaker 3: To do it. Well, I think, I think the analogy
[49:59] Speaker 3: of this is Bill Belichick 2.0 is way off. I
[50:02] Speaker 3: think Mike Malone is way more in tune with what
[50:05] Speaker 3: works in 2026 on the basketball floor and the economics
[50:09] Speaker 3: and just the basketball talent and all the pipelines and everything.
[50:14] Speaker 3: I feel like he's more in tune with this, and
[50:15] Speaker 3: I think it's lazy to say this is Belichick all
[50:19] Speaker 3: over again. Way different situation with Michael Malone, who's in
[50:22] Speaker 3: his prime as a coach, who just won a couple
[50:25] Speaker 3: years ago, who still everyone really, really likes. And that
[50:29] Speaker 3: Denver Nuggets organization has been in flux. And so I
[50:32] Speaker 3: wouldn't hold it against Michael Malone that he was run
[50:35] Speaker 3: out right before the playoffs last year. But this is...
[50:39] Speaker 3: I'm bummed because... Duke Harris, I feel like Wake's best
[50:45] Speaker 3: player last year is probably going to be in Chapel
[50:47] Speaker 3: Hill because Michael Malone is there now. And it feels
[50:49] Speaker 3: like this is not a great situation for me at
[50:52] Speaker 3: Wake Forest because I think Mike's going to do a
[50:54] Speaker 3: great job. I think he's got the right tools. It's
[50:59] Speaker 3: just very odd to me. We've talked about this before, Bomani,
[51:02] Speaker 3: how the NBA products, like the– UNC has not produced
[51:11] Speaker 3: an all-star since I think it's Jameson, I want to say.
[51:15] Speaker 1: Well, Jameson I think is the last all-star, yes.
[51:18] Speaker 3: Yes, yes.
[51:20] Speaker 1: What do you mean? He and Vince, that's the same class,
[51:23] Speaker 1: my bad.
[51:23] Speaker 3: It's been a long time. But the coaching tree too,
[51:27] Speaker 3: you would imagine that they'd have more people who would
[51:29] Speaker 3: be in the Chapel Hill fraternity, so to speak, and
[51:36] Speaker 3: Duke calls it a brotherhood. I'm surprised there aren't more
[51:39] Speaker 3: candidates here. So that's another reason why Michael Malone got hired,
[51:42] Speaker 3: because if you're out here looking at other candidates and
[51:44] Speaker 3: they weren't enthused with Sean May or anybody internally, I
[51:48] Speaker 3: can understand why Mike Malone got that job.
[51:50] Speaker 2: I mean, to be fair, Krzyzewski didn't really have a
[51:52] Speaker 2: lot of candidates to take over for him. Carolina, there
[51:55] Speaker 2: were some guys that got sent away from home to
[51:56] Speaker 2: see if it would work out, and it didn't. Wes
[51:58] Speaker 2: Miller was a guy that I think they thought may
[52:01] Speaker 2: turn out to be that guy, and then he went
[52:03] Speaker 2: to Cincinnati, and you saw that that did not work out,
[52:06] Speaker 2: for example. Like, Bottom line is, finding the guy to
[52:11] Speaker 2: be coach is real. really really hard and every now
[52:14] Speaker 2: and then you wind up with an example of there's
[52:16] Speaker 2: the guy that's out there in the market and then
[52:19] Speaker 2: you need to coach the exact same year and you
[52:21] Speaker 2: go get that guy right ohio state cutting bait on
[52:24] Speaker 2: jim trestle because they knew urban meyer was going to
[52:26] Speaker 2: be there in a year florida cutting bait on their
[52:28] Speaker 2: guy and urban meyer was out there that year you
[52:30] Speaker 2: know what i mean like if there's a guy and
[52:32] Speaker 2: you're the program that you could go jump in and
[52:34] Speaker 2: you can go get that guy and this was not
[52:37] Speaker 2: a year if it's two years ago you go get
[52:38] Speaker 2: dusty may right? Dusty May takes Florida Atlantic to the
[52:41] Speaker 2: final four, and then you go get him like Michigan
[52:44] Speaker 2: just did, and then now you're.
[52:45] Speaker 1: The one that's out here making this happen. But, whoo!
[52:49] Speaker 1: This is, it's going to be an interesting season.
[52:51] Speaker 3: What about Stack? What about Stack? Do you have thoughts
[52:56] Speaker 3: on him as a head coach? Because it didn't work
[52:58] Speaker 3: out at the college level, but now he's with the
[53:00] Speaker 3: Golden State Warriors, and I kind of hope that Stack
[53:02] Speaker 3: would have gotten that job.
[53:03] Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know exactly why it did not work
[53:06] Speaker 2: at Vanderbilt, right? Because Vanderbilt's not a place that everybody's
[53:08] Speaker 2: going to win. It's before they got the huge influx
[53:10] Speaker 2: of money. Because let me tell you, one way to
[53:11] Speaker 2: get money for your college basketball program or college football, whatever,
[53:14] Speaker 2: get that black dude in there, fire his black ass,
[53:17] Speaker 2: and watch the money pile up. That happens just about
[53:21] Speaker 2: every single time And that at Vanderbilt, I guarantee you
[53:24] Speaker 2: stack is out there like, well, what do you think
[53:26] Speaker 2: would have happened if you gave me that money? What
[53:28] Speaker 2: would concern me about stack at Carolina is everybody wants
[53:31] Speaker 2: to play a certain type of basketball and win a
[53:33] Speaker 2: certain type of way. And Jerry Stackhouse was a scorer,
[53:36] Speaker 2: but he wants to coach intense defensive basketball.
[53:40] Speaker 4: And.
[53:41] Speaker 2: I don't know if that way is the way that
[53:42] Speaker 2: Carolina wants to play. But I think this, if he
[53:46] Speaker 2: had not gotten that Vanderbilt job, I think he might've
[53:49] Speaker 2: had a better chance of getting this job. I think
[53:52] Speaker 2: it would have been on the board, but I also
[53:53] Speaker 2: don't think the people that were hiring cared about that.
[53:55] Speaker 2: And I think Roy got to make the Hubert hire
[53:57] Speaker 2: and Roy was not going to get to make another hire. That's,
[54:01] Speaker 2: that's what I think from here, but they got, they
[54:04] Speaker 2: got a really, really, really good coach, right?
[54:07] Speaker 1: Like, State's mad because they lost Will Wade.
[54:10] Speaker 2: And I feel very confident that Mike Malone is a
[54:12] Speaker 2: better basketball coach than Will.
[54:14] Speaker 1: Wade is, you know?
[54:15] Speaker 2: With that, Tom Haberstroh. Check out Tom the Finder. Great
[54:19] Speaker 2: newsletter for you to check out. Also check him out
[54:21] Speaker 2: at Yahoo Sports. Shout out to the folks in Portland.
[54:23] Speaker 2: Check him out talking about basketball there too. My brother,
[54:25] Speaker 2: I appreciate you.
[54:26] Speaker 3: Hey, anytime, Imani. Appreciate it.
[54:28] Speaker 1: All right, man.
[54:29] Speaker 2: And ladies and gentlemen, thanks so much for joining us
[54:30] Speaker 2: here on The Right Time. We do this four times
[54:32] Speaker 2: a week. Ryan Brumley handling everything behind the scenes.
[54:35] Speaker 1: Thank you, sir.
[54:36] Speaker 2: Hit the voicemail line 323-596-7767. Remember, follow The Right Time. Subscribe, like,
[54:42] Speaker 2: rate us, review us, give us five stars. You only
[54:44] Speaker 2: give us four stars. I'm inclined to believe you are
[54:46] Speaker 2: a hater. We'll talk to you guys in a couple
[54:48] Speaker 2: of days.
[54:49] Speaker 1: Take it easy.

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