# Pat Forde on Chauncey Billups Gambling Scandal, College Football Coaching Chaos | 10.24

An episode of [The Right Time with Bomani Jones](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/982639043), 24 Oct 2025, 50 min.

Audio: https://podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/pscrb.fm/rss/p/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/370fc844-36bd-4f61-8b8f-b4bb010de39a/2098ceb5-4b34-4688-8de2-b4bb011d6b8d/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=919a7cbe-003c-4146-b592-b4bb010de3a5

Pat Forde of Sports Illustrated joins Bomani Jones. First, they discuss the recent arrests of Chauncey Billups & Terry Rozier, and how there are likely more gambling scandals coming down the pipe. Later, they discuss the latest in the College Football coaching carousel. Will Lane Kiffin take the job at Florida or stay at Ole Miss? And will LSU, USC, or Florida State move on from their coaches sooner rather than later? 2:00 - NBA Gambling scandal 26:00 - Which Coach gets fired next? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:05] Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the right time, a wave original.
[0:09] Speaker 1: My name is Beaumont Jones. Thanks for listening wherever you
[0:12] Speaker 1: get your podcast. Thanks for watching us on YouTube. Subscribe, like,
[0:16] Speaker 1: rate us, review us, give us five stars. You only
[0:18] Speaker 1: give us four stars. I'm inclined to believe you are
[0:21] Speaker 1: a hater. It is 40 Friday, Pat40ofSI.
[0:24] Speaker 2: Com. My man, how are you? I'm doing great, Beaumont.
[0:30] Speaker 2: Good to see you again. Great to be on with you.
[0:32] Speaker 1: I got to tell you, I don't know. I just
[0:33] Speaker 1: realized I was like, I have no idea. The last
[0:35] Speaker 1: time I did something with Pat and I do this
[0:37] Speaker 1: to embarrass him because he doesn't like it when I
[0:39] Speaker 1: do it. But I always tell people I'm not here
[0:41] Speaker 1: without Pat Forty. Forty was the first like legitimate person
[0:44] Speaker 1: that I recall to really like put an arm around
[0:47] Speaker 1: me and help me out through this. encouraged me when
[0:49] Speaker 1: I lost jobs and all of those things. So I get,
[0:51] Speaker 1: I always say one of the, one of my most,
[0:53] Speaker 1: I feel the jet moments ever is at the 2007
[0:55] Speaker 1: ACC tournament, sit next to you, watch the selection Sunday,
[0:58] Speaker 1: filling out the bracket. Like that is an all time
[1:00] Speaker 1: highlight of me doing this. So it's like, I'm thrilled
[1:03] Speaker 1: to have you on with us on this one.
[1:06] Speaker 2: Well, I got to give some backstory there, Bo. We were,
[1:10] Speaker 2: I was working at ESPN and you freelanced, I believe
[1:14] Speaker 2: a piece for us. From North Carolina. It was at
[1:17] Speaker 2: a press conference, I think. And I was like, holy shit,
[1:20] Speaker 2: who is this guy? He's a great writer. We need
[1:22] Speaker 2: to use more from him. And, geez, things worked out
[1:26] Speaker 2: pretty well for you from there. But, yeah, I remember
[1:28] Speaker 2: also seeing you at that ACC tournament. And you looked
[1:31] Speaker 2: at me and you said, I think we're probably both
[1:34] Speaker 2: taller than we thought the other one was.
[1:36] Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what I saw. I saw you at the
[1:38] Speaker 1: D-Dome on that one. And I was like, yep, that
[1:40] Speaker 1: is exactly.
[1:41] Speaker 2: What checked out.
[1:42] Speaker 1: We were definitely in the front court in that room.
[1:44] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[1:46] Speaker 1: Like, but so I originally had wanted to have Pat
[1:50] Speaker 1: on to talk about like the changing basically personnel structure
[1:53] Speaker 1: in college football coaching where everybody seems to get fired
[1:56] Speaker 1: really fast. And then as we were getting ready to
[1:58] Speaker 1: do this and preparing to record. The world set on fire.
[2:02] Speaker 1: And we get this report that Damon Jones and Chauncey
[2:06] Speaker 1: Billups have been arrested. Also, Terry Rozier. And I think
[2:09] Speaker 1: Rozier actually for the sporting part of it is the
[2:11] Speaker 1: most interesting one, because Rozier has basically been accused of
[2:15] Speaker 1: shaving points, providing insider information to gamblers. And, you know, hey,
[2:20] Speaker 1: my foot hurts. Come out of the game. A whole
[2:22] Speaker 1: lot of people had bet the under. Damon Jones is
[2:24] Speaker 1: in a similar place because he has been accused of
[2:27] Speaker 1: trading on insider information to gamblers because he had a
[2:32] Speaker 1: gambling problem, but he was also participating in illegal poker games.
[2:37] Speaker 1: Where Chauncey Phillips is also participating in illegal poker games.
[2:40] Speaker 1: And that's how these two things are tied together. And
[2:43] Speaker 1: I need you to understand that the illegal poker games
[2:45] Speaker 1: are accused to have been rigged and run by the
[2:48] Speaker 1: five families. Like we're not talking about like a movie.
[2:51] Speaker 1: We mean the actual five mafia families that I will
[2:54] Speaker 1: be honest with you. I didn't know it still worked
[2:56] Speaker 1: like that. Like, I didn't know that they had all, like,
[2:59] Speaker 1: persisted and it remained just fine. Like, you know, it
[3:01] Speaker 1: used to be the Power Six, and now it's, like,
[3:03] Speaker 1: really the Power Four conferences, but it's really the Power Two.
[3:05] Speaker 1: I thought that by now there would have been some
[3:07] Speaker 1: sort of mergers.
[3:12] Speaker 2: That's the only place where we haven't had realignment, I guess,
[3:15] Speaker 2: is in the mafia in New York. It's a wild story. Incredible.
[3:21] Speaker 2: Been following it since March of 2024 when– All of
[3:27] Speaker 2: a sudden, we started getting word about suspicious bets on
[3:31] Speaker 2: a Temple UAB basketball game. And lo and behold, Temple
[3:36] Speaker 2: lost by 28 and was getting housed in the first half.
[3:39] Speaker 2: And there were all these bets against Temple on the
[3:42] Speaker 2: first half spread. And that was kind of this first
[3:46] Speaker 2: inclination of, hey, there's this gambling ring out there. And
[3:50] Speaker 2: it has rippled from there. And then we started finding
[3:53] Speaker 2: about the NBA game. impact on it. And obviously, Jonte Porter,
[3:59] Speaker 2: his situation, getting banned from the NBA and being charged.
[4:02] Speaker 2: And it's believed, Bomani, obviously, that the people involved in
[4:07] Speaker 2: the NBA game fixing are also the people involved in
[4:11] Speaker 2: some of the poker game rigging and in the college game. Now,
[4:15] Speaker 2: the college game charges have not come out yet. That's
[4:19] Speaker 2: being run by the Eastern District of Pennsylvania. The rest
[4:22] Speaker 2: of this is Eastern District of New York. So it's
[4:25] Speaker 2: going to be a little while before we know more
[4:28] Speaker 2: about that. But this is all interconnected. And it's an
[4:32] Speaker 2: incredible bombshell headache for pro basketball and college basketball.
[4:38] Speaker 1: I mean, this sounds like Jack Molina's 1960s sort of stuff. Like,
[4:42] Speaker 1: am I wrong or is that too simple?
[4:45] Speaker 2: Yeah. It's like throwback to the, yeah, like CCNY 1950s
[4:50] Speaker 2: mobsters running around New York fixing stuff. rigged poker games.
[4:55] Speaker 2: It's an incredible, vivid story, which is probably why we
[4:59] Speaker 2: had some of the characters grandstanding in Brooklyn that we
[5:03] Speaker 2: did today at this press conference.
[5:05] Speaker 1: That was a circle jerk of epic proportions. Like if
[5:07] Speaker 1: you did not see that press conference, I'm convinced the
[5:10] Speaker 1: director of the FBI, that's just, I got to be
[5:13] Speaker 1: there for it, right? Like there's going to be pictures.
[5:15] Speaker 1: There's going to be all of this. I've seen people
[5:17] Speaker 1: who have raised the questions about whether this is like
[5:19] Speaker 1: kind of targeted by the Trump administration, or this is
[5:22] Speaker 1: somehow cooked up by Kash Patel. And I suppose that's possible.
[5:26] Speaker 1: But I think as you just pointed out, people have
[5:28] Speaker 1: been in on this for a while, like the timing
[5:30] Speaker 1: of the announcement may be its own thing. But this
[5:33] Speaker 1: is something that predates this current regime.
[5:36] Speaker 2: Absolutely. Yeah, this goes back and I think they've said
[5:38] Speaker 2: maybe like four years that they've been looking into this
[5:41] Speaker 2: and the genesis of it, as I understand it, and
[5:45] Speaker 2: we don't have complete information at this point, but these
[5:48] Speaker 2: were guys that were attempting to rig games and making
[5:52] Speaker 2: bets offshore and the offshore places started shutting them down.
[5:56] Speaker 2: Then they go domestic here and get a little over aggressive.
[6:01] Speaker 2: And all of a sudden where the regulators and the
[6:03] Speaker 2: watchdogs can monitor your bets more easily. Oh, there's problems here.
[6:07] Speaker 2: What's going on? And things start getting examined more closely.
[6:12] Speaker 2: So this does go back. It does predate certainly the election.
[6:16] Speaker 2: It certainly predates, Kash Patel's work as the FBI director,
[6:20] Speaker 2: you know, he was standing there front and center and
[6:22] Speaker 2: he got the microphone and talk. I can't imagine he
[6:24] Speaker 2: had much to do with this. I think this was
[6:26] Speaker 2: largely run by boots on the ground in New York
[6:29] Speaker 2: and elsewhere that predated his entry into the bureau.
[6:33] Speaker 1: I mean, I watched that press conference and I guess
[6:36] Speaker 1: the first 12 minutes or so, maybe even get around
[6:39] Speaker 1: 15 were useful. And then as you said, after that,
[6:42] Speaker 1: it was just people making sure that they were on
[6:45] Speaker 1: the program. Like it was almost like the funeral of
[6:46] Speaker 1: a dignitary where everybody's got it. Like this is your
[6:49] Speaker 1: chance and the world is going to see you or
[6:51] Speaker 1: the preachers come from all the other churches and now
[6:53] Speaker 1: they're going to show out. And I wonder if you
[6:56] Speaker 1: enjoy this as much as I do. So I got
[6:58] Speaker 1: a buddy of mine that used to sell a bunch
[7:00] Speaker 1: of weed, right? And they got popped for something. I
[7:03] Speaker 1: can't remember what, but he decided to fight it. And
[7:05] Speaker 1: so he like he took some law classes and started,
[7:07] Speaker 1: you know, putting in the paperwork that you can get
[7:09] Speaker 1: to look at, you know, look at the documents that
[7:12] Speaker 1: they have for these different cases. And I remember a
[7:14] Speaker 1: point that he always made was. they really impressed themselves
[7:18] Speaker 1: with the names of these operations. Like somebody always sits
[7:22] Speaker 1: around and comes up with a cute name. And the
[7:24] Speaker 1: cute name in this case is Operation Royal Flush. They
[7:28] Speaker 1: had all these betting metaphors they were using and everything
[7:31] Speaker 1: that they were saying. Like people knew that this was
[7:33] Speaker 1: their opportunity to be on television.
[7:36] Speaker 2: Without question. Yes, it was Operation Royal Flush was the
[7:39] Speaker 2: rigged poker games and Operation Nothing But Bet. was the
[7:46] Speaker 2: Terry Rozier part of this thing. I mean, you know
[7:50] Speaker 2: they were very pleased with themselves. And did they sit
[7:52] Speaker 2: around workshopping these names? You know, what's the best pun
[7:55] Speaker 2: we can come up with? The best play on words?
[7:59] Speaker 2: And I would love to know, yes, who was the
[8:03] Speaker 2: speech writer and who was the copy editor that went
[8:05] Speaker 2: into this of like, yeah, let's see if we can
[8:07] Speaker 2: slip in a little sports analogy here, a little betting
[8:10] Speaker 2: analogy there, and Oh, they were very pleased with themselves
[8:13] Speaker 2: at the microphone today.
[8:15] Speaker 1: And there's somebody that walks around the office and is like, hey,
[8:17] Speaker 1: that was mine. Like, for example, and I'm not exaggerating,
[8:20] Speaker 1: I know the dude who in the meeting at the
[8:23] Speaker 1: office came up with the term Wi-Fi. Really? And he'll
[8:28] Speaker 1: let you know. Like, just so you know. Just imagine that. Like,
[8:33] Speaker 1: somebody says Wi-Fi every time you hear from a new person. Hey,
[8:35] Speaker 1: you know, that was me. I came up with that.
[8:40] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[8:41] Speaker 2: No, that's yeah. This guy who would go a woman, whoever,
[8:44] Speaker 2: whoever came up with these names, they they're, they're having
[8:47] Speaker 2: rounds bought for him tonight at some bar in Brooklyn
[8:50] Speaker 2: after this.
[8:51] Speaker 1: So as this goes, and I feel, you know, confident
[8:56] Speaker 1: saying that this is only the beginning and it's going
[9:00] Speaker 1: to have some very interesting offshoots that I kind of,
[9:04] Speaker 1: I'm doing my best to wait, you know, before talking
[9:06] Speaker 1: about some of the things, some of them seem fairly obvious,
[9:08] Speaker 1: but we have to be careful here, but, It's shocking
[9:12] Speaker 1: that this happens and the day before, the NCAA announces
[9:17] Speaker 1: that they will allow their players at all divisions to
[9:20] Speaker 1: gamble on professional sports. And look, I've been talking about
[9:23] Speaker 1: this for a while and I acknowledge that I work
[9:26] Speaker 1: for people and I put my voice to things that
[9:29] Speaker 1: advertise for these gambling companies. Like I have spoken to
[9:31] Speaker 1: the caution that needs to be had and I make
[9:34] Speaker 1: the point that it's got a warning label, right? Like
[9:36] Speaker 1: we need to be honest about what it is that
[9:38] Speaker 1: we're doing, but I also recognize that They're paying the
[9:41] Speaker 1: bills in our business. There's a measure of complicity. And
[9:43] Speaker 1: it'll be curious to see how people decide that they
[9:47] Speaker 1: want to handle this. But at the same time, how
[9:50] Speaker 1: badly have we lost the plot here?
[9:53] Speaker 2: Yeah, no, this is astounding timing. It really feels like
[9:59] Speaker 2: to me, Bo, that. that college and pro basketball have
[10:05] Speaker 2: been whistling past the graveyard on this for a year
[10:08] Speaker 2: and a half. And just like, yeah, well, you know,
[10:11] Speaker 2: there's something going on. It's not going to be that bad.
[10:13] Speaker 2: How bad could it really be? Well, yeah, we need
[10:15] Speaker 2: the money from these gambling outfits. Sure, we're just going
[10:17] Speaker 2: to keep going down that path. And this is not
[10:22] Speaker 2: to say directly that DraftKings created this scandal. This is
[10:27] Speaker 2: a mafia scandal. This is, you know, on a different
[10:32] Speaker 2: kind of level to a degree of how this thing
[10:35] Speaker 2: has operated. But there is no doubt that the permeation,
[10:42] Speaker 2: I guess, of gambling throughout sports is just basically a
[10:47] Speaker 2: partner thing. and a side effect is problematic. And yes,
[10:53] Speaker 2: for the NCAA to have just finally announced, and this
[10:56] Speaker 2: has been going on for a few months, but to
[10:58] Speaker 2: come out with it this week, that yeah, our athletes
[11:02] Speaker 2: can go ahead and bet on pro football, pro basketball. Sure,
[11:06] Speaker 2: you know, if you played... I'm just going to throw
[11:09] Speaker 2: out this example. This is not to implicate anybody, but
[11:12] Speaker 2: if you played with Jace Richardson last year at Michigan state,
[11:16] Speaker 2: and now he's in the league and you call him up,
[11:18] Speaker 2: Hey Jace, you know, who's got an ankle, you know,
[11:21] Speaker 2: who's got a bad knee there. You know, what's who's
[11:23] Speaker 2: going to play tonight. Not saying Jace Richardson would give
[11:26] Speaker 2: that information, but boy, there's pathways there. This is, I
[11:30] Speaker 2: think you are creating way more problems than you're solving
[11:33] Speaker 2: by trying to simply lower caseload. That's what they're trying
[11:36] Speaker 2: to do is like, look, We're tired of chasing around
[11:38] Speaker 2: guys that bet $ 50 on the NFL. I get that.
[11:42] Speaker 2: Just don't chase them. But allowing this, I think, just
[11:45] Speaker 2: opens up the doorway for so many more problems.
[11:48] Speaker 1: You know, I think you just made an interesting point
[11:50] Speaker 1: there because I was talking to someone, and I forget
[11:51] Speaker 1: which story. The NCAA brought the hammer down to somebody
[11:55] Speaker 1: on some real old school NCAA type stuff. I can't
[11:58] Speaker 1: remember exactly who it was, but it dawned on me.
[12:00] Speaker 1: They got a lot more free time on their hands
[12:02] Speaker 1: now in the investigative department over there because there's not
[12:06] Speaker 1: money to chase in the same way. But there would
[12:09] Speaker 1: be this. And this would actually, when you talk about
[12:12] Speaker 1: the caseload, that's very, very important. The prevalence of betting
[12:16] Speaker 1: on campuses is so strong and it's so easy to
[12:19] Speaker 1: find somebody that'll do whatever the thing is for you.
[12:22] Speaker 1: And then it goes and obviously it gets to these players.
[12:25] Speaker 1: And I hadn't quite thought about it the way you did.
[12:27] Speaker 1: The interconnectivity of these worlds all these guys have access
[12:31] Speaker 1: to staggering levels of inside information in professional sports. Like
[12:35] Speaker 1: nevermind the fact how easily it is for them to
[12:38] Speaker 1: get strung out on this, especially a lot of these
[12:40] Speaker 1: kids who got, they now got some money in their
[12:42] Speaker 1: pockets for the first time. In some cases, a lot
[12:45] Speaker 1: of money in their pockets, but then also, yeah, I
[12:49] Speaker 1: can call up and just be like, Hey, what's it
[12:51] Speaker 1: looking like down there? Tell me what it is. And
[12:53] Speaker 1: that becomes full on catastrophic.
[12:56] Speaker 2: Absolutely.
[12:56] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[12:56] Speaker 2: No, I mean, Look, I think we're probably all happy
[12:59] Speaker 2: the players are finally getting some money. But as most
[13:03] Speaker 2: college kids and myself included, how responsible will they be
[13:07] Speaker 2: in terms of saving it versus spending it? And then, yeah,
[13:11] Speaker 2: you start getting backwards. You start getting in trouble there.
[13:13] Speaker 2: And it's like, oh, my gosh, I better. Yeah, I
[13:15] Speaker 2: better see if I can get some insider information. Or,
[13:18] Speaker 2: you know, the other direction is you start getting into
[13:21] Speaker 2: debt and somebody comes in and says, hey. All you
[13:25] Speaker 2: got to do is play a crappy first half against
[13:27] Speaker 2: Toledo and we'll get you, you know, we'll take care
[13:31] Speaker 2: of you here. And the other thing I would like
[13:33] Speaker 2: to bring up with the college part of this thing,
[13:37] Speaker 2: the truly, in my mind, evil genius of it, allegedly,
[13:43] Speaker 2: is that they went to these gamblers, gambling ring, went
[13:47] Speaker 2: to players who were involved, who were playing at mid
[13:50] Speaker 2: to low level schools. They're not getting much NIL. They
[13:54] Speaker 2: don't have much in the pocket. They're like, hey, this
[13:58] Speaker 2: is how you can do it. And nobody's going to
[14:00] Speaker 2: notice because nobody pays attention to your games or the
[14:02] Speaker 2: line movement on your games. Just dump a half for us.
[14:06] Speaker 2: And I think that's where the majority of this, when
[14:08] Speaker 2: it comes out from an NCAA standpoint, is going to
[14:11] Speaker 2: be at those level schools.
[14:12] Speaker 1: But the irony of it to me, and you tell
[14:15] Speaker 1: me if I'm crazy, but... the reason that nobody, or
[14:20] Speaker 1: you would think that nobody would pay attention is also
[14:23] Speaker 1: the reason that you get caught, right? Like nothing happens
[14:26] Speaker 1: on these games and now suddenly something happens. Like I
[14:29] Speaker 1: think of Rozier, Rozier had some crazy under, and I
[14:32] Speaker 1: think somebody likes like hundreds of thousands of dollars. come
[14:35] Speaker 1: in on him with this under in the first half
[14:37] Speaker 1: and i'm like who's sitting around thinking about putting this
[14:38] Speaker 1: much money on an under for terry rosier like that
[14:42] Speaker 1: that seems crazy that in order for this to truly
[14:44] Speaker 1: be effective for somebody and maybe a lot more people
[14:47] Speaker 1: get away with it than we realize right but it
[14:49] Speaker 1: sounds to me that for a scheme like this to
[14:51] Speaker 1: be effective you have to give away that it's a scheme.
[14:54] Speaker 2: Yeah no i mean that's a great point is that
[14:56] Speaker 2: that yes it doesn't take much to move the needle
[14:59] Speaker 2: if you're going to bet on a southland conference game
[15:02] Speaker 2: right right so i think the key is hey, bet
[15:07] Speaker 2: 500 here, bet 500 there, bet 500 over here. Don't
[15:10] Speaker 2: bet 5,000 or try to bet 5,000 and have the
[15:14] Speaker 2: casino say, hell no. But then it does reach a
[15:17] Speaker 2: point where it trips a wire, and all of a
[15:19] Speaker 2: sudden everybody's like, wait a minute, there is way too
[15:21] Speaker 2: much action on a personal over-under for a player who
[15:24] Speaker 2: doesn't play that much, like a Jonte Porter or a
[15:27] Speaker 2: Rozier who doesn't play as much as he used to, or,
[15:30] Speaker 2: you know, an obscure college game. So, you know, they...
[15:35] Speaker 2: One of the good parts of having so much legalized
[15:38] Speaker 2: gambling is the ability to monitor. There is much greater
[15:44] Speaker 2: technology and access to technology that will monitor all the bets.
[15:49] Speaker 2: I mean, Big Brother knows who you're betting on and
[15:51] Speaker 2: knows how much. And if it gets fishy, they can
[15:55] Speaker 2: turn it in.
[15:56] Speaker 1: Now, on the college level, in your conversations with coaches,
[16:00] Speaker 1: what is their level of concern?
[16:04] Speaker 2: Not much because you know how college coaches are. You
[16:07] Speaker 2: know how they are. They all live in this box
[16:10] Speaker 2: that's as big as their eyeballs, and that's it. Does
[16:12] Speaker 2: it affect me?
[16:13] Speaker 3: No.
[16:13] Speaker 1: All right, cool.
[16:14] Speaker 2: We're done. Oh, this is a University of New Orleans problem?
[16:19] Speaker 2: This is Mississippi Valley? We don't care. Screw them. It's
[16:25] Speaker 2: uncanny to me the lack of curiosity, the lack of
[16:29] Speaker 2: concern from the coaching staff fraternity about this sort of
[16:34] Speaker 2: thing and it does just go to show you know
[16:36] Speaker 2: college sports are so every man for himself or every
[16:39] Speaker 2: conference for themselves that's like yeah that's a mid-major problem
[16:43] Speaker 2: I'm at a high major school let's just keep going.
[16:47] Speaker 1: Yeah and for the NBA Adam Silver will always have
[16:53] Speaker 1: that op-ed he wrote in the New York Times in
[16:56] Speaker 1: 2014 saying the sports gambling should be legalized and maybe
[17:02] Speaker 1: he was right that this improved monitoring and everything else,
[17:05] Speaker 1: but he's always going to have that one on his back.
[17:08] Speaker 1: Cause to me, the issue is, um, and I've been
[17:11] Speaker 1: doing a lot of doom and gloom reading about the
[17:12] Speaker 1: internet that informs us to a degree, but the truth is,
[17:15] Speaker 1: is having legalized gambling is one thing, allowing you to
[17:18] Speaker 1: gamble on a cell phone is another. And that is
[17:21] Speaker 1: a greatly complicating factor in all of this. It makes
[17:25] Speaker 1: it very easy for people to get behind gambling. in
[17:27] Speaker 1: all kinds of ways but the real issue is is
[17:30] Speaker 1: one thing if you have to go to the casino
[17:31] Speaker 1: or you have to go to the otb or you
[17:33] Speaker 1: got to go wherever it is to meet the bookie
[17:35] Speaker 1: when the casino follows you around the stakes of all
[17:39] Speaker 1: of this just have just changed completely.
[17:42] Speaker 2: Totally yeah when the casino's in your pocket and sending
[17:46] Speaker 2: you alerts hey you know i mean boy it's right
[17:49] Speaker 2: there no doubt about it and if you go to
[17:51] Speaker 2: games now somebody pointed this out to me last year
[17:53] Speaker 2: like And especially you look at student section, but otherwise too.
[17:57] Speaker 2: During the games, there's a lot of people that are
[17:59] Speaker 2: on their phones placing in-game bets. They're not looking at
[18:02] Speaker 2: the game as much as they're looking at what the
[18:03] Speaker 2: line movement is and where can I get down and
[18:06] Speaker 2: try to make some money. So the availability of it
[18:10] Speaker 2: all is a major amplifier in this.
[18:15] Speaker 1: Do you have any concern? Because basketball really had to
[18:20] Speaker 1: fight to save its reputation coming out of like the 40s, 50s,
[18:22] Speaker 1: and 60s. and people kind of almost believing like it
[18:25] Speaker 1: was wrestling, like it was a game that could not
[18:27] Speaker 1: be believed in. Is it dramatic to say that that's
[18:31] Speaker 1: a concern that we'll have in this game going forward
[18:36] Speaker 1: if we have more of these?
[18:40] Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think it's that dramatic. I really don't.
[18:42] Speaker 2: I think this is a major reputational hit, and it
[18:47] Speaker 2: gives some people the fodder they want to have for
[18:50] Speaker 2: how they feel about NBA players or even college players
[18:53] Speaker 2: to a degree, um, you know, irresponsible, uh, you know,
[18:59] Speaker 2: prone to problems, that sort of thing. And, and you
[19:03] Speaker 2: are feeding ammunition to people who generally speaking are wrong,
[19:09] Speaker 2: but you're giving them ammunition for preconceived notions that they
[19:13] Speaker 2: may have. And, uh, that's, that's out there and yeah,
[19:18] Speaker 2: we'll see where this goes. And if there's a bunch
[19:20] Speaker 2: of other players involved, but you know, whether how much
[19:24] Speaker 2: is acknowledged or not, I don't know, but the, you know,
[19:26] Speaker 2: there is a lot of gambling that goes on the
[19:29] Speaker 2: NBA amongst the players. Most of it's legal, I believe,
[19:33] Speaker 2: you know, but, but like big poker games for in
[19:36] Speaker 2: casinos in Vegas, uh, And some story, you know, like
[19:41] Speaker 2: people losing lots of money. And it's just, it's a concern.
[19:44] Speaker 2: I think if the, if you're the leagues, like, Hey,
[19:46] Speaker 2: you know what?
[19:47] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[19:47] Speaker 2: Rich people of all persuasions can go to Vegas and
[19:50] Speaker 2: do the same damn thing. But if everybody's out there saying, Oh,
[19:53] Speaker 2: the NBA is full of gambling addicts. That's bad. Right.
[19:56] Speaker 1: I'll tell you two things right fast before we go
[19:58] Speaker 1: to break one, I was in Vegas this summer and
[20:01] Speaker 1: an NBA player, I will not name was at the
[20:03] Speaker 1: same table as me, but he was kind of blending
[20:06] Speaker 1: in just playing blackjack. And he, I tried to acknowledge
[20:10] Speaker 1: him without blowing his cover and he was dedicated to
[20:15] Speaker 1: holding on to his cover. Right. And then the pit
[20:18] Speaker 1: boss comes over and says, nah, he's here a lot.
[20:22] Speaker 1: And I was like, Oh yeah, yeah. That's number one.
[20:25] Speaker 1: Number two, there's a video going around of get up
[20:28] Speaker 1: on Thursday on ESPN. Um, and while they're talking about
[20:33] Speaker 1: this story, the ESPN bet logo was in the bottom
[20:36] Speaker 1: right corner, and apparently somebody was like, hey, maybe we
[20:39] Speaker 1: should take that down. And then, ixnay, it was gone.
[20:43] Speaker 1: And on that note, not sure what commercials are going
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[25:57] Speaker 1: We are here with Pat Forty of SI.com. Ryan and
[26:01] Speaker 1: I were talking just before we got on the air,
[26:03] Speaker 1: and we were just saying it is so interesting. Firing
[26:06] Speaker 1: season now starts in September, and it literally did. Like
[26:09] Speaker 1: it used to have back in the day, Jack Crow
[26:11] Speaker 1: gets fired because he lost to the Citadel, and then
[26:13] Speaker 1: something crazy like that happens. Now we've got the James
[26:16] Speaker 1: Franklin firing, even if understandable, firing a guy like that
[26:20] Speaker 1: after 34 of his last 42 games were wins in
[26:23] Speaker 1: the middle of the season. is kind of crazy now
[26:27] Speaker 1: it feels like the predominant story and I guess this
[26:30] Speaker 1: is a side effect of the playoff that people didn't
[26:32] Speaker 1: think about I haven't given that much thought to who
[26:34] Speaker 1: the 16 teams are I just spent all my time
[26:36] Speaker 1: trying to figure out who's going to get fired.
[26:39] Speaker 2: You know what I'll tell you this much readership is
[26:42] Speaker 2: very high for coaching carousel stuff not as high for
[26:45] Speaker 2: the playoffs so that tells you you're not alone in
[26:48] Speaker 2: that uh it's it's wild it really is and it's
[26:52] Speaker 2: funny so Late 20-teens, we were trending this direction where
[26:58] Speaker 2: you were getting some guys. Willie Taggart got fired early
[27:00] Speaker 2: at Florida State and a few other guys. But then
[27:05] Speaker 2: that kind of cooled down. Maybe that was pandemic related.
[27:07] Speaker 2: And then it virtually stopped last year because everybody was
[27:11] Speaker 2: scared to death about what the house settlement was going
[27:13] Speaker 2: to do to their budgets. Like, no, we got to
[27:16] Speaker 2: save our acorns for the winter, you know. Now, oh no,
[27:19] Speaker 2: we're back. We're back. Every time you hear an AD
[27:22] Speaker 2: say we don't have enough money, they find enough money
[27:24] Speaker 2: to do something like this. So it is wild. This
[27:28] Speaker 2: year's really pretty shocking, but I guess we could to
[27:31] Speaker 2: a degree see it coming because there were so few
[27:33] Speaker 2: firings last year. And, you know, I think they're obviously, look,
[27:38] Speaker 2: it's a copycat industry. And it's like, oh, somebody else
[27:41] Speaker 2: is getting ahead. They're being proactive. You know, they're getting
[27:44] Speaker 2: into the market early. We better do it too. And
[27:47] Speaker 2: so you've seen Virginia Tech and you've seen Arkansas and
[27:49] Speaker 2: you've seen UCLA and now you've seen Florida State. I'm sorry,
[27:52] Speaker 2: Florida and Penn State. And those jobs are going to
[27:56] Speaker 2: there's going to be domino effects from there. And it
[27:59] Speaker 2: is just amazing how fast people want to give up
[28:03] Speaker 2: on the current season to get to the next season.
[28:06] Speaker 1: Now, I feel like the catalyzing agent was when they
[28:09] Speaker 1: got that bright idea about the early signing day, right?
[28:12] Speaker 1: Because now it became a matter of we got to
[28:14] Speaker 1: do this because once the recruiting class doesn't look like
[28:16] Speaker 1: it's going to be good and the guys have a
[28:18] Speaker 1: greater chance of being off the table, then we started writing.
[28:21] Speaker 1: What we've seen more of, and I think Florida did
[28:23] Speaker 1: this twice, right? No, Florida didn't. Florida State didn't. No, no. Okay.
[28:28] Speaker 1: It happened to Jimbo at Texas A & M. We
[28:30] Speaker 1: fire you after a win. You beat Mississippi State, and
[28:33] Speaker 1: we still decide to fire you because actually we had
[28:35] Speaker 1: decided to fire you already, but we just needed a
[28:38] Speaker 1: little time to pass the hat and actually make sure
[28:40] Speaker 1: that we got the money together. And then it goes
[28:43] Speaker 1: from there. And so I am interested in your thoughts
[28:47] Speaker 1: about kind of the jobs and what is available. So
[28:49] Speaker 1: the Florida job, which I think you and I would
[28:51] Speaker 1: have agreed 20 years ago that Florida is one of
[28:53] Speaker 1: the two or three best coaching jobs. that you could have,
[28:56] Speaker 1: it doesn't feel that way anymore. And it's interesting because 10,
[28:59] Speaker 1: 20 years before that, you also wouldn't have said that
[29:02] Speaker 1: about Florida. Where do you think this stands? Because I think, look, man,
[29:06] Speaker 1: Lane Kiffin seems to be the spiritual successor to Steve Spurrier.
[29:12] Speaker 1: But I don't know how great an idea that is
[29:14] Speaker 1: for either of them.
[29:16] Speaker 2: Yeah, real quick, I have to say, yes, beating Mississippi
[29:19] Speaker 2: State ain't what it used to be because it gets
[29:20] Speaker 2: you fired now.
[29:22] Speaker 1: They used to be a losing tool that got you fired.
[29:25] Speaker 2: Yeah, right. Sylvester Croom got a bunch of people fired
[29:28] Speaker 2: because he kept beating them. But now, yeah, it's gone
[29:31] Speaker 2: the other way. And now you get fired even if
[29:33] Speaker 2: you win. The Florida job is fascinating, Bomani, and you
[29:39] Speaker 2: bring it up. There's a debate, and I don't know
[29:42] Speaker 2: what's right, between it's a phenomenal job. They've won three
[29:46] Speaker 2: national championships with two different coaches versus, eh, it's not
[29:51] Speaker 2: that good a job, and it took two of the
[29:52] Speaker 2: greatest coaches ever to win there, and everybody else has
[29:55] Speaker 2: been kind of mid. So.
[29:57] Speaker 2: What's the right answer? I don't know. Look, if we
[29:59] Speaker 2: look at the theory of what makes a good job,
[30:03] Speaker 2: Florida checks every box, right? You back out of the
[30:07] Speaker 2: driveway and you go past a five-star. There's players all
[30:10] Speaker 2: over the state of Florida. You have a massive, rabid
[30:14] Speaker 2: fan base. You seat 90,000 in the stadium. You have
[30:18] Speaker 2: membership in one of the two richest conferences. So all
[30:22] Speaker 2: those things are there. It's just a question– Now, one
[30:27] Speaker 2: of the amazing things about the flattening of the sport,
[30:31] Speaker 2: is Indiana now a good job? I mean, maybe it
[30:35] Speaker 2: is because all you need is NIL money and a
[30:37] Speaker 2: great coach, and they've apparently got both. Vanderbilt, if you
[30:42] Speaker 2: get a great coach and NIL money, can it be
[30:43] Speaker 2: as good a job? Maybe not for the long term,
[30:45] Speaker 2: but if you're trying to win a national title in
[30:47] Speaker 2: three or four years, is Florida that much better than
[30:50] Speaker 2: somewhere else? I still think it probably is, but... You
[30:54] Speaker 2: could argue the other way, that now anything could be
[30:58] Speaker 2: a good job in the right circumstance.
[31:02] Speaker 1: I got a whiff in that you're still coming to
[31:05] Speaker 1: terms with the reality that Indiana is what it is
[31:08] Speaker 1: right now, huh? It hasn't really landed with me either.
[31:11] Speaker 2: Dude, I've been covering games there since 1990, and.
[31:16] Speaker 2: The apathy was incredible. The teams were terrible. They couldn't
[31:19] Speaker 2: get the students to come in the stadium. They would
[31:21] Speaker 2: go tailgate and then they'd go back to the dorms
[31:23] Speaker 2: or go to the bars. None of them would come
[31:25] Speaker 2: into the stadium. So for them to be this good,
[31:28] Speaker 2: like Kirk Cignetti may be the greatest single coach in
[31:30] Speaker 2: the history of the human race. I don't know. I
[31:33] Speaker 2: cannot figure it out.
[31:35] Speaker 1: Well, I mentioned Florida. I am shocked that Florida State
[31:37] Speaker 1: put out a statement that said that they would not evaluate.
[31:40] Speaker 1: They would evaluate Mike Norvell at the end of the season.
[31:43] Speaker 1: And look, that is clearly over.
[31:45] Speaker 2: Right.
[31:45] Speaker 1: Like the one thing I will say is it's the
[31:47] Speaker 1: Jeremy Foley quote from 2004. That which will be done
[31:50] Speaker 1: eventually should be done immediately. It is clear that Norvell
[31:53] Speaker 1: is not going to stick around. Do you understand why
[31:56] Speaker 1: Florida State would decide that they were going to wait?
[32:00] Speaker 2: I think the subtext to that is we ain't got
[32:02] Speaker 2: that much money right now. We're hoping we'll have that
[32:06] Speaker 2: much money by the end of the season, but this
[32:09] Speaker 2: one's going to take a while. We don't have the
[32:11] Speaker 2: Texas oil man booster. You know, this is going to
[32:13] Speaker 2: wave 50 million and tell him to go away or
[32:16] Speaker 2: something like that. So that's my sense. They have spent
[32:20] Speaker 2: a lot of money on facilities here recently, which I
[32:23] Speaker 2: think is a very bad decision because facilities don't win
[32:26] Speaker 2: you anything anymore. And everybody could see this day coming when, well,
[32:30] Speaker 2: you know, for the last couple of years, the house settlement,
[32:32] Speaker 2: eventually you were going to have to start paying players
[32:34] Speaker 2: a lot of money. They blew through all the warning signs, said, no,
[32:37] Speaker 2: we're going to keep building things and refurbishing and whatever.
[32:41] Speaker 2: But I do think that you're right. It's done, right?
[32:44] Speaker 2: There is no, you can't go back and massively reboot
[32:47] Speaker 2: again after you did that last off season, blow out
[32:50] Speaker 2: the coordinators, bring in new ones, bring a new transfer
[32:52] Speaker 2: portal class and say, here's a new Mike Norvell. You
[32:55] Speaker 2: can't do that twice. But I think that it is
[32:58] Speaker 2: a matter of, We need to find the money or
[33:01] Speaker 2: Mike needs to find another job and help us out.
[33:04] Speaker 1: I really think a very underrated part of college sports
[33:07] Speaker 1: that we don't talk about is the idea of we
[33:10] Speaker 1: have to find the money, right? Colorado, when they hired
[33:13] Speaker 1: Deion Sanders, that famously didn't have the money. They're just like, OK,
[33:17] Speaker 1: we'll work that part out later. We saw that in
[33:20] Speaker 1: the early, more unstructured NIL days. Like, do we have
[33:23] Speaker 1: the money? Yeah.
[33:25] Speaker 2: Kind of. Not really. Don't worry.
[33:28] Speaker 1: We'll work that out later. And I guess that's it
[33:30] Speaker 1: with the timing on some of these moves. Because I
[33:32] Speaker 1: think we've seen some other schools with the, yeah, we'll
[33:34] Speaker 1: just wait until the end of the year. And it's
[33:36] Speaker 1: just like, oh, you guys just don't have the money.
[33:40] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[33:41] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[33:41] Speaker 2: I think it's Arkansas. I'm sorry. Wisconsin right now. Yes.
[33:44] Speaker 2: Same thing. Like that's unsalvageable, I think, for Luke Fickle.
[33:47] Speaker 2: But and their numbers smaller. It's like 27 million. But Arkansas.
[33:52] Speaker 2: I keep saying Arkansas. Wisconsin is kind of a frugal state.
[33:55] Speaker 2: Athletic department. They've never been lavish spenders. And so for
[33:58] Speaker 2: them to come up with $ 27 million, I think it's
[34:01] Speaker 2: going to take a while to figure that out. But
[34:03] Speaker 2: I would be shocked if we see Mike Norvell or
[34:06] Speaker 2: Luke Fickle coaching at those schools again in 2026.
[34:11] Speaker 1: Do you think Lincoln Riley will be coaching at USC
[34:13] Speaker 1: in 2026? I do.
[34:17] Speaker 2: That's a buyout number that's crazy. And USC does have
[34:20] Speaker 2: rich people, but that's like $ 90 million. I mean, that's
[34:23] Speaker 2: plus Jimbo. Oh, wow. Yeah.
[34:25] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[34:25] Speaker 2: It's it's higher than Jimbo. And so it's almost impossible
[34:30] Speaker 2: to go there. You know, he's he hadn't delivered on
[34:34] Speaker 2: what they thought he was going to be. But he
[34:36] Speaker 2: also he has not been a complete train wreck. And so,
[34:40] Speaker 2: you know, where do you land in the middle of that,
[34:42] Speaker 2: especially when you owe that much? I think that they're
[34:45] Speaker 2: kind of they're stuck with each other for the time being.
[34:48] Speaker 1: Not what they want him to be, but not a
[34:51] Speaker 1: train wreck seems to be the description. of my buddy Ryan's,
[34:56] Speaker 1: LSU Tigers head coach, Brian Kelly, with the added component being,
[35:01] Speaker 1: and we talk about this all the time, people don't
[35:03] Speaker 1: like him. Like, I think LSU actually is a bit
[35:07] Speaker 1: underrated in the sense that that is not an impatient job.
[35:10] Speaker 1: They give people time to get themselves out of things,
[35:13] Speaker 1: and it's been okay with Kelly. It's honestly been around
[35:17] Speaker 1: the general level of LSU success outside of a couple
[35:20] Speaker 1: of outlier seasons, but nobody seems to be having a
[35:22] Speaker 1: good time.
[35:24] Speaker 2: No, they don't. And, you know, it is funny. Yeah,
[35:27] Speaker 2: they played in the SEC championship game. Jaden Daniels won
[35:30] Speaker 2: the Heisman Trophy. It's not like they're just, you know, horrible.
[35:34] Speaker 2: But they've kind of decided to a degree, yeah, we're
[35:37] Speaker 2: done with this guy. His likability is a factor as well.
[35:44] Speaker 2: It's interesting. You bring up him and Lincoln Riley. That
[35:47] Speaker 2: was the same time in the cycle. You know, these
[35:51] Speaker 2: bombshell moves. Lincoln Riley going from Oklahoma to USC, Brian
[35:54] Speaker 2: Kelly going from Notre Dame to LSU. And the belief was,
[35:59] Speaker 2: and I was probably in that camp, geez, these guys
[36:01] Speaker 2: are going to win huge. They're going to be winning titles.
[36:04] Speaker 2: They're going to be in the playoff every year. Guess
[36:06] Speaker 2: who was the best coach out of that cycle? Marcus Freeman,
[36:09] Speaker 2: the defensive coordinator who hadn't been a head coach who
[36:12] Speaker 2: moved up at Notre Dame. So you never fully know,
[36:15] Speaker 2: especially when you make a big swing and that big
[36:17] Speaker 2: an investment, but A huge game for Brian Kelly Saturday,
[36:21] Speaker 2: huge against Texas A & M at home. Can't lose
[36:24] Speaker 2: that one. And then you got to turn around and
[36:26] Speaker 2: play Alabama in Tuscaloosa after that. So he better win.
[36:30] Speaker 1: I would say if you are at the point where
[36:32] Speaker 1: you are at, you better win against the number four
[36:34] Speaker 1: team in the country. It is over.
[36:37] Speaker 2: Yeah, you can absolutely make that argument. Yes. And, and
[36:41] Speaker 2: I think the fans there have kind of hit that
[36:44] Speaker 2: saturation point. You know, I, I, I think that, uh,
[36:49] Speaker 2: They've certainly got very good talent. They absolutely do. I
[36:52] Speaker 2: thought Garrett Nussmeyer has always been a little bit overrated
[36:54] Speaker 2: as a quarterback and they just haven't quite fitted in
[36:58] Speaker 2: around him. Young offensive line this year and now an
[37:00] Speaker 2: injured offensive line. The defense gets better. The offense gets worse.
[37:04] Speaker 2: They just haven't done a complete program, you know, rebuild
[37:09] Speaker 2: with Kelly.
[37:12] Speaker 1: One of our running topics here on the show is
[37:16] Speaker 1: how fast the Alabama hot seat gets in that Saban
[37:19] Speaker 1: was so good that there's an entire generation that doesn't
[37:22] Speaker 1: understand how Alabama actually works. They started to get a
[37:26] Speaker 1: whiff of it after the Florida State loss, but Ty
[37:29] Speaker 1: Simpson apparently now looks like he's the number one pick
[37:31] Speaker 1: in the draft. They are rolling, but all it would
[37:34] Speaker 1: take is that LSU game, huh?
[37:36] Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, look, that's a great point. The underrated
[37:42] Speaker 2: insanity of Alabama fans. And here's a good story for
[37:45] Speaker 2: you on that front. So this is Saban's Third season
[37:50] Speaker 2: down there. First season, not that good. Second season, they
[37:53] Speaker 2: break through. They play in the SEC championship game, nearly
[37:55] Speaker 2: beat Florida. Third season, they're undefeated, and they're playing Tennessee,
[38:01] Speaker 2: the huge rivalry game. It's in Bryant-Denny Stadium. It's a
[38:05] Speaker 2: complete slog. It goes down to the end. Tennessee has
[38:09] Speaker 2: a field goal to tie on the last play. Terrence
[38:12] Speaker 2: Cody breaks through, blocks it, wins the game. 90% of
[38:18] Speaker 2: the stadium's in euphoria, but I'm walking down to the
[38:21] Speaker 2: field and some old guy grabs me and says, Saban
[38:25] Speaker 2: ain't going to cut it. You can't come that close
[38:27] Speaker 2: to losing to Tennessee. Bear wouldn't do that. Saban cut
[38:32] Speaker 2: it pretty good. But that's exactly who you're dealing with there.
[38:37] Speaker 1: And DeBoer, I mean, I think getting Ryan Grubb back mattered.
[38:40] Speaker 1: The offense, like those two guys running an offense together, right?
[38:43] Speaker 1: That is a thing that goes. And when I've watched them,
[38:46] Speaker 1: It's not like the old days, but they do still
[38:49] Speaker 1: have players.
[38:51] Speaker 2: Oh, they do. They've got really good talent on this team.
[38:54] Speaker 2: I mean, it's a very talented team, probably the most talented,
[38:57] Speaker 2: I think, in terms of experience and ability in the SEC.
[39:02] Speaker 2: And bringing in Grubb has been huge. Ty Simpson has
[39:05] Speaker 2: been tremendous. Defense has been very good. You know, I
[39:09] Speaker 2: think Kalen DeBoer can and will win a national championship,
[39:13] Speaker 2: you know, and it'll happen at Alabama. I don't know when,
[39:15] Speaker 2: possibly this year. But remember the woman that got interviewed
[39:21] Speaker 2: after the Florida State game that was going to try
[39:24] Speaker 2: to play the power ball. And she said, if she won,
[39:26] Speaker 2: she was going to use the money to buy out
[39:27] Speaker 2: to bore and then get on with the rest of
[39:30] Speaker 2: her life. I, I don't think she needs to do
[39:32] Speaker 2: that anymore.
[39:33] Speaker 1: So staying in that world, a point that I've made
[39:37] Speaker 1: many times. And if you only like kind of follow
[39:41] Speaker 1: college football, you don't realize this at Alabama college, you
[39:45] Speaker 1: got two outcomes, greatest coach of all time, or they're
[39:48] Speaker 1: going to run you out. Like there's, there's really kind
[39:50] Speaker 1: of no in between like Ohio state is a job.
[39:52] Speaker 1: You're going to get fired. Nobody really gets to, even
[39:55] Speaker 1: urban Meyer didn't really get to walk on his own terms.
[39:57] Speaker 1: Woody Hayes got fired, right? Every Jim Trestle got fired
[40:01] Speaker 1: one way or another. You're going to get fired at Auburn.
[40:04] Speaker 1: You are guaranteed to leave in one form of disgrace
[40:09] Speaker 1: or another. So which form is Hugh freeze going to
[40:12] Speaker 1: leave in? Because that one also appears to be old.
[40:16] Speaker 2: Yeah. Disgrace is inevitable. I should write that on the
[40:20] Speaker 2: top of your contract when you sign it. He's going
[40:25] Speaker 2: to go down this year for not winning. That's another one.
[40:28] Speaker 2: I think that's inevitable at this point. It's year three.
[40:31] Speaker 2: It hasn't happened. They're bad on offense, which is supposed
[40:35] Speaker 2: to be Hugh's thing. They made a bad decision to
[40:37] Speaker 2: make Jackson Arnold their centerpiece quarterback and they've got several
[40:42] Speaker 2: more losses to come. So I think Hugh Freeze gets
[40:45] Speaker 2: blown out at some point this year. Do they let
[40:48] Speaker 2: him go through the Alabama game at the end of
[40:50] Speaker 2: the Iron Bowl? We'll see. But I think that's another
[40:53] Speaker 2: one where the writing is on the wall.
[40:55] Speaker 1: That Jackson Arnold, that Oklahoma told Dylan Gabriel that he
[40:58] Speaker 1: needed to find a new place to play because Jackson
[41:00] Speaker 1: Arnold was coming, and then this is what happens if
[41:01] Speaker 1: Jackson Arnold gets to Auburn.
[41:04] Speaker 2: It's incredible. You know... It's not easy to look at
[41:09] Speaker 2: 18-year-olds and say, you're going to be really good or
[41:11] Speaker 2: really bad. But it's amazing how often they miss, considering
[41:15] Speaker 2: the money, the brainpower, and the effort put into finding
[41:18] Speaker 2: the ones that you think won't miss. But look at
[41:21] Speaker 2: who we're talking about right now. Ty Simpson was a
[41:23] Speaker 2: big time dude. Fernando Mendoza may be the second quarterback pick.
[41:27] Speaker 2: He was committed to Yale at one point and then
[41:30] Speaker 2: ended up at Cal. He was a three-star at best.
[41:32] Speaker 2: He was the number 134 quarterback. in the class of
[41:37] Speaker 2: 2022 so it's hard to do to figure out who
[41:40] Speaker 2: these guys are.
[41:40] Speaker 1: All right we got a couple more things for you
[41:43] Speaker 1: uh i have not gotten to uh my old stomping
[41:45] Speaker 1: grounds north carolina and what is going on with bill
[41:48] Speaker 1: belichick they got they just have to find the money
[41:50] Speaker 1: right like like this just has this just has to stop.
[41:55] Speaker 2: It's it's astounding it really is like the not just
[41:59] Speaker 2: the level of bad play but the chaos that seems
[42:03] Speaker 2: to be going on the sloppiness the The disorganization, the arrogance,
[42:08] Speaker 2: the hubris, the complete whiff on personnel decisions and player
[42:16] Speaker 2: grading and deciding who could play. It's unbelievable. But that's
[42:21] Speaker 2: another place. I don't know. Do they want to have
[42:23] Speaker 2: the money? I think there's some people that have enough
[42:26] Speaker 2: ego invested. They're like, we got to bring him back
[42:29] Speaker 2: for another year and see if he can get better.
[42:31] Speaker 2: But there's so much negativity and so much apathy. I mean,
[42:33] Speaker 2: I went to the first game. Fans were flying out
[42:36] Speaker 2: of there in the third quarter of the first game.
[42:38] Speaker 1: Oh, it takes nothing. It takes nothing. At the first
[42:42] Speaker 1: sign of trouble, somebody can hear a basketball bouncing somewhere. Like,
[42:45] Speaker 1: don't you worry about that. They're going to be upset,
[42:49] Speaker 1: but they're not necessarily going to stick around. The thing is,
[42:54] Speaker 1: one thing that I know is going to have to
[42:56] Speaker 1: take place at some point in the not distant future
[42:59] Speaker 1: around that athletic department is they're going to need to
[43:01] Speaker 1: figure out something for a new basketball building. And I
[43:04] Speaker 1: wonder how all that ties when you start talking about
[43:06] Speaker 1: we're going to need to pony up $ 30 million. Remembering
[43:09] Speaker 1: that that's a building that they built with private funds.
[43:11] Speaker 1: They did not build that with state funding. I don't
[43:14] Speaker 1: know how they're going to do it when it comes
[43:15] Speaker 1: down the line. But needing to come up with $ 30
[43:18] Speaker 1: million to get Belichick out of there, I wonder how
[43:21] Speaker 1: that's going to be. And I wonder how well Bill
[43:23] Speaker 1: Belichick can withstand pain of just being in an obviously
[43:27] Speaker 1: miserable situation.
[43:29] Speaker 2: Well, that's the other thing. Talk about a guy with
[43:32] Speaker 2: some ego. If he can pull the ripcord and save
[43:36] Speaker 2: some face out of this as opposed to coming back
[43:40] Speaker 2: next year as a punchline, I wouldn't be shocked at
[43:43] Speaker 2: all if he made the move as much as North
[43:46] Speaker 2: Carolina did. But we'll see.
[43:48] Speaker 1: I could not. I watched the first possession of that
[43:51] Speaker 1: game against TCU, and I was like, hey, man, these
[43:53] Speaker 1: guys look like they're executing. I think this is going
[43:54] Speaker 1: to be okay. I've never been wronger.
[44:00] Speaker 2: I was there in the stadium and I said the
[44:02] Speaker 2: exact same thing. Yeah, I was like, man, these.
[44:04] Speaker 1: Guys are rolling. They seem to be making something happen.
[44:08] Speaker 1: They did not. Before we let you go, we have
[44:10] Speaker 1: talked a lot on this show about the idea of
[44:13] Speaker 1: the Big Ten taking money from private equity. And my
[44:17] Speaker 1: line always is, show me the thing that private equity
[44:19] Speaker 1: has ever made better. But it is worth noting the
[44:21] Speaker 1: two schools in the Big Ten that have stopped this
[44:23] Speaker 1: from happening are the ones that have the most money.
[44:25] Speaker 1: Ohio State and Michigan. Do you think that this is inevitable,
[44:29] Speaker 1: that the day is just going to come where this
[44:30] Speaker 1: money gets taken? And what do you think happens if
[44:33] Speaker 1: it comes down to that?
[44:35] Speaker 2: Well, and USC, too, which also has more money than God,
[44:38] Speaker 2: is against this. I keep having people tell me private
[44:43] Speaker 2: equity is inevitable. It's smart. You need to do it.
[44:47] Speaker 2: There's so much unrealized potential, da-da-da-da-da-da. But I'm with you,
[44:51] Speaker 2: that the people that welcome in Private capital, does it
[44:54] Speaker 2: improve your actual product of what are your businesses? Almost never.
[44:58] Speaker 2: Sure as hell hasn't in the media world, and probably
[45:02] Speaker 2: a lot of other places as well. I just, you know,
[45:07] Speaker 2: it just bothers me, I guess, that we have the
[45:12] Speaker 2: Big Ten, which signed by far the richest media deal
[45:16] Speaker 2: in history three years ago, $ 7 billion, and continues to
[45:25] Speaker 2: rake that in and continues to fill stadiums while charging
[45:28] Speaker 2: more for tickets and more for parking and more for
[45:30] Speaker 2: popcorn is still like, oh, we need the money. Oh
[45:33] Speaker 2: my God, we need the money. It's insulting, I think.
[45:38] Speaker 2: It's indicative of completely irresponsible fiscal leadership, but they might
[45:43] Speaker 2: do it. Yeah, they'll probably do it, if I had
[45:45] Speaker 2: to guess. If you've got 16 out of 18 schools
[45:48] Speaker 2: or 15 out of 18 saying we need to do it,
[45:50] Speaker 2: you probably wear down the other ones and eventually- It happens.
[45:54] Speaker 1: And by the way, they have a media deal where
[45:55] Speaker 1: they are fleecing their network partners. Have you seen these
[45:59] Speaker 1: numbers that have shown that the highest rated games are
[46:02] Speaker 1: all SEC games, basically? Mostly games that are on ABC
[46:07] Speaker 1: and ESPN. The Big Ten partners are not, maybe they're
[46:12] Speaker 1: getting their money's worth, but they are not getting nearly
[46:14] Speaker 1: the steal of a deal that Disney is getting over
[46:17] Speaker 1: on the SEC.
[46:19] Speaker 2: It's true. I mean, the SEC, like you got to
[46:21] Speaker 2: be sitting there with one hand saying, gosh, we are
[46:23] Speaker 2: killing it. And the other hand saying, we're giving them
[46:25] Speaker 2: too good a bargain. We need to renegotiate here.
[46:29] Speaker 1: Yeah, no, this is a wild time. And, you know,
[46:31] Speaker 1: you and I have been talking about these things. You've covered,
[46:33] Speaker 1: you know, college football obviously longer than I have. But
[46:36] Speaker 1: it is amazing to watch now where we are, where
[46:39] Speaker 1: the stakes feel so high around your actual winning and losing,
[46:43] Speaker 1: but it generates a world where our conversation is barely
[46:46] Speaker 1: around the actual winning and losing.
[46:49] Speaker 2: It's true. You know, I mean, like, I can't believe
[46:52] Speaker 2: the amount of time I spend listening to people talk
[46:56] Speaker 2: or covering, you know, or researching things like private equity
[47:00] Speaker 2: and media deals and sponsorships and, you know, how much
[47:05] Speaker 2: you pay a GM now to run your front office
[47:09] Speaker 2: staff in a college situation. It's just, it is, you know, very,
[47:14] Speaker 2: very bottom line driven now. And I can You know,
[47:17] Speaker 2: I get it. I understand it. I also like writing
[47:20] Speaker 2: about like North Carolina versus Duke or Alabama versus LSU.
[47:24] Speaker 2: You know, I mean, that's fun. I like to cover
[47:28] Speaker 2: the games.
[47:29] Speaker 1: I'll also note, and this is something I wonder if
[47:31] Speaker 1: the powers that be over there kind of understand it.
[47:33] Speaker 1: And maybe maybe these things don't transfer over as neatly
[47:36] Speaker 1: as my brain says. But one of the chief criticisms
[47:39] Speaker 1: of the NBA in recent times, and it's fair, is
[47:42] Speaker 1: that it became a league where we covered the transactions
[47:44] Speaker 1: and the scuttlebutt more than we covered the actual action.
[47:48] Speaker 1: And here we are. And by the way, I don't
[47:49] Speaker 1: feel bad about having done this for this show. This
[47:51] Speaker 1: stuff is really interesting. But it can't be like that forever,
[47:56] Speaker 1: one would think.
[47:58] Speaker 2: I don't think. And I do know there are people
[48:01] Speaker 2: that still want to hear about the games. But boy,
[48:03] Speaker 2: oh boy, yes, we spend a lot of time. I
[48:06] Speaker 2: guess you would say the... The market on speculation is
[48:09] Speaker 2: through the roof, okay? Who's going to be the next coach?
[48:12] Speaker 2: Who are we hiring? Who are we firing? When's it
[48:15] Speaker 2: going to happen? Same as it was with recruiting. Are
[48:17] Speaker 2: we getting the five-star? And then is the five-star going
[48:20] Speaker 2: to be any good? And da-da-da-da-da. There's so much more
[48:24] Speaker 2: that's energy, and especially on the college level, that seems
[48:28] Speaker 2: to be put into projecting what's going to happen. Are
[48:33] Speaker 2: we going to be better with this new coach? Are
[48:35] Speaker 2: we going to be worse? I like to, again, like
[48:38] Speaker 2: sit there on Saturday and actually watch the games play
[48:40] Speaker 2: out and then say, oh, maybe Arch Manning isn't as
[48:43] Speaker 2: good as we thought. Or golly, Fernando Mendoza is unbelievable.
[48:47] Speaker 2: Where the hell did he come from? You know, that
[48:49] Speaker 2: sort of thing.
[48:50] Speaker 1: Well, but at least we're not where the NBA is
[48:52] Speaker 1: right now. Just wondering who might go to jail next.
[48:57] Speaker 1: Take the wins as you get them. That is my guy,
[48:59] Speaker 1: Pat Forty. Check him out at SI.com. My man, I
[49:02] Speaker 1: can't believe this is the first time that we have
[49:04] Speaker 1: had you as a Right Time guest. I apologize for
[49:07] Speaker 1: waiting so long, and I thank you for everything, my man.
[49:11] Speaker 2: My pleasure. Always happy to talk to you, Beaumont. Pleased
[49:14] Speaker 2: to be on with you. All right, man.
[49:16] Speaker 1: And ladies and gentlemen, thanks so much for joining us
[49:17] Speaker 1: here on The Right Time. We do this three times
[49:20] Speaker 1: a week. Ryan Brumley handles everything behind the scenes. Thank you, sir.
[49:23] Speaker 1: Hit the voicemail line, 323-596-7767. Whatever you want to talk about,
[49:29] Speaker 1: I'm up to hear about it.
[49:29] Speaker 2: 323-596-7767.
[49:30] Speaker 1: Remember, follow The Right Time. Subscribe, like, rate us, review us,
[49:36] Speaker 1: give us five stars. You only give us four stars.
[49:38] Speaker 1: I'm inclined to believe you are a hater. And we'll
[49:40] Speaker 1: talk to you guys in a couple of days. Take
[49:42] Speaker 1: it easy.

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