# AFC South Preview with Trevor Sikkema

An episode of [NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/680904259), 5 Aug 2026, 1 h 05 min.

Audio: https://pdrl.fm/91be81/podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/claritaspod.com/measure/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/9ce11dad-e86a-444f-ba83-ae27003475be/fa106099-4b85-4cee-be53-b49c016a03d4/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=deff018f-4b51-4501-937c-ae27003475d1

Gregg Rosenthal and Trevor Sikkema go around the AFC South for a team-by-team preview of the Texans, Titans, Jaguars and Colts. Gregg and Trevor tell you which non-quarterback player on each team is the most important, what the biggest concern is for each team, discuss the ceiling and floor for each team and more! NFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcasts See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:04] Speaker 1: Welcome to NFL Daily, where the AFC South is sick
[0:07] Speaker 1: of your Thursday night football jokes. They've graduated. I'm Greg Rosenthal.
[0:11] Speaker 1: I'm here in the Chris Wesley podcast studio and really
[0:15] Speaker 1: excited to welcome in a first time guest two NFL Daily,
[0:21] Speaker 1: a man that lives in the American South. It's Trevor Sikkhima,
[0:26] Speaker 1: co host of the NFL Stock Exchange Show. You know
[0:29] Speaker 1: him from PFF. Excited to see what he's doing next
[0:33] Speaker 1: in his career, but had to have you on. Trevor,
[0:36] Speaker 1: I am ready and I'm sick of like the the
[0:39] Speaker 1: you know, Texans Jags. This should be Thursday Night in
[0:41] Speaker 1: week three jokes like this is a good division now,
[0:44] Speaker 1: the AFC South.
[0:45] Speaker 2: I agree, I definitely agree with you one. It's great
[0:47] Speaker 2: to be with you, man. I appreciate you having me
[0:49] Speaker 2: on the show big fan for a long time, so
[0:50] Speaker 2: this is really cool getting to be on the program
[0:52] Speaker 2: with you here.
[0:52] Speaker 3: But I agree with you.
[0:54] Speaker 2: I think we need to put the bad Thursday night
[0:57] Speaker 2: football you know theme for the for the AFC southast side. However,
[1:01] Speaker 2: let us never forget the mustard Thursday Night football Jaguars
[1:07] Speaker 2: Titans game that happened. I don't like a decade ago
[1:10] Speaker 2: or whatever. Let us never forget that, but the rest
[1:12] Speaker 2: of it we can move on from.
[1:13] Speaker 1: It was it was always the Titans in one of
[1:15] Speaker 1: those games, and it was always in the World Series
[1:18] Speaker 1: window where they would like do the lesser games because
[1:22] Speaker 1: they would know it was going up against games right
[1:25] Speaker 1: six alcs. It's like, I saw what you were doing,
[1:27] Speaker 1: schedule makers. But you know, look Thursday Night Football AFC South,
[1:31] Speaker 1: that's when we got that huge ninety nine yard Derek
[1:34] Speaker 1: Henry run. We've got I think some Super Bowl Championship
[1:37] Speaker 1: contending teams in this division. I think this could be
[1:41] Speaker 1: a three playoff team division if you're just joining us.
[1:45] Speaker 1: In terms of these division previews, we put twelve minutes
[1:48] Speaker 1: on the clock for every team. We got different categories,
[1:52] Speaker 1: and we're gonna start with the Houston Texans. I haven't
[1:55] Speaker 1: told Trevor the order or anything like that, but I
[1:58] Speaker 1: did give you the category. So I'm gonna let you
[2:00] Speaker 1: get us going and start with what's bringing you joy
[2:03] Speaker 1: when it comes to the Houston Texans.
[2:05] Speaker 2: I mean, how can I not simply say everything that
[2:08] Speaker 2: goes on with the defensive side of the football. I
[2:10] Speaker 2: mean what de Migo Ryans has been to that team.
[2:12] Speaker 2: Just the identity, the excitement, the passion, and also the production.
[2:16] Speaker 2: When you look at this team in twenty twenty five,
[2:18] Speaker 2: this is via ngs second in points allowed, fifth in
[2:22] Speaker 2: yards per play, fourth in rush yards per game, eighth
[2:25] Speaker 2: in total explosives allowed, second in total EPA, first in
[2:29] Speaker 2: EPA per play, seventh in total sacks. I mean, just
[2:33] Speaker 2: no matter where you look a lot of times because
[2:36] Speaker 2: in the salary cap era, a lot of times like, hey,
[2:38] Speaker 2: you can't have just studs, wave after wave of players
[2:43] Speaker 2: on all three levels of the defense.
[2:44] Speaker 3: But it just feels as though the Texans do.
[2:47] Speaker 2: And it feels like whether it's been their free agent editions,
[2:50] Speaker 2: whether it's been their high draft picks, whether it's been
[2:51] Speaker 2: their low draft picks, and maybe some of the guys
[2:53] Speaker 2: who were afterthoughts in free agency, they've got a really
[2:56] Speaker 2: great continuity right now between the front office and the
[2:59] Speaker 2: coachings have to get the most out of all of
[3:01] Speaker 2: these guys. So what brings me joy is that this
[3:04] Speaker 2: is one of the most talented defens in the NFL
[3:06] Speaker 2: and can absolutely be the best defense in the NFL
[3:08] Speaker 2: in twenty twenty six.
[3:08] Speaker 1: Yeah, I totally agree, and I'm parking my car in
[3:11] Speaker 1: a similar garage. And it's more just about the secondary
[3:15] Speaker 1: if you think about you know, Kamari Lassiter, Kaylen Bullock,
[3:20] Speaker 1: Derek Stingley, and Jalen Petrie that I'm just going to
[3:23] Speaker 1: give you the ages of the of the four twenty three,
[3:27] Speaker 1: twenty three, twenty five, and twenty seven. It just doesn't happen.
[3:31] Speaker 1: I mean, those are all all Pro caliber players. Stingley's there,
[3:36] Speaker 1: Lassiter when we did our All Pro team, our friend
[3:39] Speaker 1: Olli Connolly had him on his I think second team,
[3:41] Speaker 1: maybe first team, like Petrie one of the best nickels
[3:44] Speaker 1: in the league, and Bullock gets kind of overlooked. And
[3:47] Speaker 1: to have them all together at the same time, we
[3:51] Speaker 1: honestly haven't seen anything like that since the Legion of Boom,
[3:55] Speaker 1: So it's really rare. It's really special. And you know,
[3:58] Speaker 1: just to throw some numbers on it. When they get pressure,
[4:01] Speaker 1: and this is the team that gets pressure more than
[4:04] Speaker 1: anyone give up one point six yards per play. That
[4:07] Speaker 1: is just totally ridiculous, and the NGS numbers support you.
[4:10] Speaker 1: It's they'd have the highest tight coverage rate when they
[4:12] Speaker 1: do get pressure. So it's everything. It's the combination. It's football. Obviously,
[4:16] Speaker 1: it's always not one thing, but those four guys specifically,
[4:20] Speaker 1: and you're adding reading blanket ship to that mix, who
[4:22] Speaker 1: I think will help them out. Just being that young,
[4:25] Speaker 1: it just doesn't happen. This is the dream for team building.
[4:27] Speaker 1: You're super into team building at the NFL Stock Exchange
[4:30] Speaker 1: and like, this is the dream and you got to
[4:32] Speaker 1: give Demico Ryans and Nick Casario some love, dude.
[4:35] Speaker 3: Here's a perfect example.
[4:36] Speaker 2: Kylen Bullock is a player who I watched him with
[4:39] Speaker 2: scouting him when he was coming out of USC. Phenomenal
[4:42] Speaker 2: single high cover one, cover three type of safety where
[4:45] Speaker 2: they just let him play that center fielder role and
[4:47] Speaker 2: let him be a ballhok.
[4:49] Speaker 3: But there were.
[4:49] Speaker 2: Negatives to his scouting report as well. Right didn't love
[4:51] Speaker 2: to tackle when he was coming down to fill the run.
[4:53] Speaker 2: He just really wasn't a presence. He really wasn't reliable,
[4:56] Speaker 2: And in the scouting report it reads he's got to
[4:59] Speaker 2: go to the right, He's got to go to a
[5:01] Speaker 2: spot where the coach understands exactly what he does well
[5:04] Speaker 2: and has a scheme and a spot where you can
[5:07] Speaker 2: mitigate some of those weaknesses Texas is the Texans are
[5:11] Speaker 2: the perfect spot for him.
[5:13] Speaker 3: They truly are.
[5:13] Speaker 2: So that's again going back to what I was saying
[5:15] Speaker 2: with Casario in the front office, being just step for
[5:18] Speaker 2: step with the coaching staff of exactly the type of
[5:21] Speaker 2: players they want to bring in. And I'm glad that
[5:23] Speaker 2: you shouted out the secondary anyways, because I almost just
[5:26] Speaker 2: picked Jalen Petrie as the thing that I was the
[5:29] Speaker 2: most excited about that gave me joy here is just
[5:32] Speaker 2: Jalen Petrie because I just love washing him play.
[5:34] Speaker 1: Well. We do have to move on, but quickly. Like
[5:35] Speaker 1: what makes you love Petrie the most.
[5:38] Speaker 2: Dude, It's the freedom and the confidence in which he plays.
[5:41] Speaker 2: I mean when you play defense at the NFL level,
[5:43] Speaker 2: specifically the nickel position, which I'm always fascinated with as
[5:47] Speaker 2: somebody who scouts from college to the NFL. What makes
[5:51] Speaker 2: an elite modern day nickel Because a lot of times,
[5:53] Speaker 2: if you get that position right, it's like getting tight
[5:56] Speaker 2: end really right on offense. It just unlocks so much
[5:59] Speaker 2: fun were you and everything that you could do. And
[6:01] Speaker 2: I feel like the confidence which Peatree plays with it,
[6:04] Speaker 2: it does that, it unlocks so much for you.
[6:05] Speaker 1: Yeah, he's incredible and we did a very quick all
[6:09] Speaker 1: underpaid team on our last show, and he was my pick.
[6:11] Speaker 1: And in terms of the defensive back, like, they compliment
[6:14] Speaker 1: each other so well. And I guess I'll go to
[6:16] Speaker 1: our next category, which is you know something schematic scheme
[6:19] Speaker 1: dream and it is related to the defense. We'll hit
[6:22] Speaker 1: the offense soon enough. But the thing I like about
[6:25] Speaker 1: this is that in this age of specialization, they blitz
[6:30] Speaker 1: less than anyone else. They are ultimately kind of simple.
[6:36] Speaker 1: They literally didn't have a snap Trevor this according to
[6:39] Speaker 1: FtM Fantasy, that they had six defensive backs on the field.
[6:42] Speaker 1: They're just gonna put their five out there. They have
[6:44] Speaker 1: virtually no defensive back sacks because they don't blitz. They
[6:48] Speaker 1: don't sim pressure at all. One percent is the lowest
[6:51] Speaker 1: in the entire league. Thirty first in blitz is like
[6:55] Speaker 1: and yet it all works and it does take you
[6:58] Speaker 1: back and it reminds you like execution, playing fast. There's
[7:02] Speaker 1: not just one way to do things. They are anti
[7:05] Speaker 1: trend in the NFL, and yet they're the best defense
[7:10] Speaker 1: in the NFL and something like that. I love, you
[7:13] Speaker 1: know about that, It's like like we're losing recipes. You
[7:16] Speaker 1: could play a different style of football, and Dimiico Ryans
[7:20] Speaker 1: is showing it. So that's kind of my schematic. Look
[7:22] Speaker 1: that I really love about this team is that you
[7:23] Speaker 1: don't need to get into that other world as great
[7:26] Speaker 1: as these players are.
[7:27] Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'll get to the offensive side with my
[7:29] Speaker 2: scheme trend, but just to touch on a little bit
[7:31] Speaker 2: of what you were saying there, a lot of times
[7:33] Speaker 2: the trends that we follow in the NFL, they're out
[7:36] Speaker 2: of necessity. Right again, we play in the salary cap
[7:39] Speaker 2: erow where it's so seldom that you're really able to
[7:44] Speaker 2: just out talent somebody at the pro level. And for
[7:47] Speaker 2: this Texans defense, they are I mean, they win with four.
[7:52] Speaker 2: They don't have to blitz their secondary, they don't have
[7:54] Speaker 2: to go to dime looks all the time because they
[7:57] Speaker 2: feel good about the chemistry and the communication and the
[8:00] Speaker 2: talent of everybody around them. So it really is just
[8:04] Speaker 2: it's so fascinating to see the Texans play because they
[8:06] Speaker 2: really are we're gonna line up against you and we're
[8:10] Speaker 2: gonna be better than you.
[8:11] Speaker 3: And it's just sometimes as simple as that.
[8:14] Speaker 1: With the Houston texts and and some and one thing,
[8:16] Speaker 1: Seth Painwood point out who covers the team, and I
[8:18] Speaker 1: think this is something doesn't mean they're not incredible coaches,
[8:21] Speaker 1: because they are great at the detail and the development
[8:24] Speaker 1: of these players. So it's just like a different way
[8:26] Speaker 1: to do things without being as you know, show me
[8:29] Speaker 1: as some defensive coordinators are all right, give me your
[8:31] Speaker 1: scheme dream.
[8:32] Speaker 2: So the scheme dream for me with this team, and
[8:35] Speaker 2: I think it goes into another category that we're going
[8:37] Speaker 2: to talk about here in a second time. We only
[8:39] Speaker 2: got twelve minutes, it's all good, okay, okay, So this
[8:42] Speaker 2: this sort of goes into you know, what happens if
[8:45] Speaker 2: things go wrong for this team, and it has to
[8:47] Speaker 2: do with the power run game. You know, those man
[8:49] Speaker 2: and gap scheme between the tackles rush concepts, which it
[8:53] Speaker 2: felt like this team wanted to be a little bit
[8:55] Speaker 2: more of a zone blocking or a zone rushing type
[8:57] Speaker 2: of a team at the beginning of the season. But
[8:59] Speaker 2: then when we're Marx was kind of coming in and
[9:01] Speaker 2: he was really becoming that most dynamic and feature back
[9:04] Speaker 2: that they wanted to be. Felt like they were having
[9:07] Speaker 2: a little bit more success with the man and gap
[9:09] Speaker 2: scheme run blocking concepts, and I think their offseason leans
[9:13] Speaker 2: into that. Wyatt Teller, Keelan Rutledge, ed Ingram, Braden Smith
[9:17] Speaker 2: and even Arianta Ersirie who could do a lot of
[9:19] Speaker 2: his own blocking stuff for you.
[9:20] Speaker 3: But those are mallers, baby.
[9:23] Speaker 2: Those are guys who are going to get off the
[9:24] Speaker 2: ball and try to push the lion scrimmage at least
[9:26] Speaker 2: one in two yards before the running back even approaches
[9:29] Speaker 2: and gets to where he is even with them. When
[9:31] Speaker 2: you look at an mgstat that I saw from this group,
[9:34] Speaker 2: Marx had eleven explosive runs on those outside the tackle
[9:41] Speaker 2: run concepts last year. Now, that's designed to get you
[9:45] Speaker 2: into space, so okay, like that kind of makes sense,
[9:47] Speaker 2: but only four when he was rushing in between the tackles.
[9:51] Speaker 2: This team has to be better between the tackles. The
[9:55] Speaker 2: rushing yards over expectation was much lower for this team
[9:59] Speaker 2: overall last year. Ye when they were trying to just
[10:02] Speaker 2: run it down the middle, run it between the tackles,
[10:04] Speaker 2: and if they cannot run the ball effectively in the
[10:07] Speaker 2: power run game between the tackles, that's a major weakness
[10:10] Speaker 2: that I have for this team. They were fourteenth in
[10:12] Speaker 2: total rush attempts lash year, but they were bottom five
[10:16] Speaker 2: in yards per carry. A big reason why is because
[10:19] Speaker 2: those rushing yards over expectation was so much lower. It
[10:22] Speaker 2: was not a dynamic run game when it came to
[10:25] Speaker 2: running between the tackles.
[10:26] Speaker 3: So it's got to be more fishing.
[10:27] Speaker 2: It's got to be more dynamic, and I need this
[10:29] Speaker 2: scheme to really be able to run down the middle
[10:33] Speaker 2: of the field and in between the tackles if this
[10:34] Speaker 2: offense is going to fire on all cylins.
[10:36] Speaker 1: Yeah, they didn't change offensive coordinators, so it's a little
[10:38] Speaker 1: bit more of continuity. You mentioned some of the new
[10:41] Speaker 1: offensive linemen there. They do have depth relatively. Trent Brown
[10:45] Speaker 1: is battling for Braden Smith. With Braden Smith at right tackle,
[10:48] Speaker 1: you have your former starter at center, Jake Andrews is
[10:51] Speaker 1: now more of a backup. You have your former starter
[10:52] Speaker 1: at one of the tackles, Blake Fisher more of a backup.
[10:55] Speaker 1: So they are set up better early. You know, signs
[10:59] Speaker 1: in camp have been positive. That can be misleading, but yeah,
[11:04] Speaker 1: they need to help out CJ. Stroud. That's where I'll
[11:07] Speaker 1: hit you know, the their offensive line not coming together
[11:09] Speaker 1: all the new pieces, it's just being more the same
[11:12] Speaker 1: as also, what things could go wrong if you know
[11:14] Speaker 1: if they just don't come together. But in terms of
[11:16] Speaker 1: the scheme, Look, they put a lot on CJ. Stroud's
[11:20] Speaker 1: play last year. Jordan Rodrieg talked about a few weeks
[11:23] Speaker 1: ago on the show, and I think it really helped
[11:26] Speaker 1: him setting protections. He avoided sacks. They want to do
[11:30] Speaker 1: a little more two tight ends this year with the
[11:32] Speaker 1: draft pick of Marlin Klein and everything.
[11:34] Speaker 2: Who doesn't we can exact for literally everything right.
[11:38] Speaker 3: Sem at this point, but the get heavier.
[11:40] Speaker 1: Right to me, it's kind of that balance of maybe
[11:44] Speaker 1: asking him to do a little less in the second
[11:46] Speaker 1: year in that system, whether that helps him out because
[11:49] Speaker 1: that Patriots like system and the kind of combo systems
[11:53] Speaker 1: that they did, it's asking a lot of their quroducts.
[11:55] Speaker 1: We got to move to our most important non quarterback.
[11:58] Speaker 1: I threw Daniel Hunter in there. Look, they gave him
[12:01] Speaker 1: a one year, forty million dollar contract. He is the man.
[12:04] Speaker 1: He is breaking the usual age charts when it comes
[12:07] Speaker 1: to the edge. Signing to Devian Clowney helps give them
[12:11] Speaker 1: more depth at the position, but they sort of count
[12:16] Speaker 1: on him being elite, elite and man. He just has
[12:18] Speaker 1: stayed there a year after year and so it's just
[12:20] Speaker 1: him staying there, so he stuck out to me, Ursuri
[12:23] Speaker 1: would be another option on the offensive line. Who do
[12:26] Speaker 1: you have as the most important non quarterback?
[12:29] Speaker 2: So you know, if I were to go with like
[12:31] Speaker 2: one player, I think that Jayden Higgins is one that
[12:34] Speaker 2: I would point out just because it elevates a lot
[12:36] Speaker 2: of times when we talk about like, hey, who's the
[12:38] Speaker 2: most important? We talk about like, hey, if this guy
[12:40] Speaker 2: doesn't show up, then a lot of things fail.
[12:42] Speaker 3: To me.
[12:42] Speaker 2: If you want to hit the ceiling of this offense,
[12:44] Speaker 2: Jayden Higgins is going to be the way that you
[12:46] Speaker 2: do it because you're hoping that David Montgomery can be
[12:48] Speaker 2: a little bit better in the power run game for
[12:49] Speaker 2: you now that he is there. Obviously, Nico Collins is
[12:52] Speaker 2: one of the most talented wide receivers in the league.
[12:54] Speaker 3: You touched on it.
[12:55] Speaker 2: If the offensive line doesn't work, none of this works anyways.
[12:58] Speaker 2: But the true ceiling of this offense, in my opinion,
[13:00] Speaker 2: runs through Jayden Higgins and that second year bump that
[13:03] Speaker 2: he could have. And it seems as though he could
[13:05] Speaker 2: absolutely do that because Nico Collins was talking him up
[13:08] Speaker 2: pretty good earlier this week.
[13:09] Speaker 1: Yeah, so far in camp his development has been a
[13:13] Speaker 1: big story. He is probably their wide receiver too. You
[13:18] Speaker 1: know Noel is injured right now. I'm excited for Tankedll
[13:21] Speaker 1: to play football again. I think if Tank Dell is
[13:23] Speaker 1: your sure three or four, like you're you're happy. We
[13:26] Speaker 1: had Dalton Saltz on the show and he's a reliable guy.
[13:30] Speaker 1: He was absolutely crushed and you know about how last
[13:34] Speaker 1: season ended, but he's not going to be going crazy.
[13:36] Speaker 1: I think, Higgins, you're right in terms of getting to
[13:38] Speaker 1: the ceiling and I kind of like we stayed away
[13:40] Speaker 1: from the Stroud talk because we've hit him a lot
[13:42] Speaker 1: on this show. I believe in him and if everyone's
[13:45] Speaker 1: better around him, I think he is going to be better.
[13:47] Speaker 1: And that kind of gets to the ceiling floor of
[13:50] Speaker 1: this team as we wrap the Texans and yeah, the
[13:54] Speaker 1: ceilings is winning the Super Bowl. I think they are
[13:57] Speaker 1: absolutely one of the real deal contender in the AFC.
[14:01] Speaker 1: And the thing I really love about where they're at
[14:04] Speaker 1: right now, and like these horns, they're suggestions. Trevor, you're
[14:10] Speaker 1: new to this, Okay, we're just gonna blow right by.
[14:12] Speaker 1: You did a good job just ignoring the one minute
[14:14] Speaker 1: warning and everything and just keep talking you're a TV pro.
[14:19] Speaker 1: They I think people forget, like, what a crazy rebuild
[14:24] Speaker 1: this was. They won ten games combined in three seasons.
[14:30] Speaker 1: They were one of the worst teams in the history
[14:33] Speaker 1: of the NFL over a three year period, and they
[14:36] Speaker 1: were so good in CJ. Stroud's rookie year that the
[14:39] Speaker 1: expectations got so high so quickly. And they've gone division round,
[14:43] Speaker 1: division round, division round. They've gone ten, ten, twelve with wins.
[14:46] Speaker 1: But to me, I think they really were their best
[14:49] Speaker 1: version of the team because of the defense last year.
[14:52] Speaker 1: It feels like they've been stuck, but I don't think so.
[14:54] Speaker 1: I think it's all been building to this moment, and
[14:58] Speaker 1: I think it's rare in today's NFL that a plan
[15:00] Speaker 1: comes together like this. And I do think this year
[15:03] Speaker 1: is a little different with the secondary, with where CJ's at,
[15:06] Speaker 1: with some of the depth on the offensive line, and
[15:09] Speaker 1: the talent that like now's the time, Like I love
[15:12] Speaker 1: seeing it all coming together like this, And I don't
[15:16] Speaker 1: feel like this is a team that's stagnated. I think
[15:18] Speaker 1: it's a team that's been slowly building to this moment.
[15:21] Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think the schedule sets up pretty well
[15:23] Speaker 2: for them as well like the ceiling that I have, Like, hey,
[15:25] Speaker 2: a thirteen and four type of a team, a Super
[15:27] Speaker 2: Bowl champion type of a team for me. And the
[15:29] Speaker 2: reason why is because I think you look at their
[15:32] Speaker 2: road schedule. The road schedule is decently easy this year.
[15:34] Speaker 2: Sure you have the divisional games, but then it's like, okay,
[15:37] Speaker 2: yeah at Los Angeles with the Chargers, that's going to
[15:39] Speaker 2: be somewhat difficult. But then you really don't have to
[15:41] Speaker 2: play tough road games until a Week sixteen is at Philadelphia.
[15:45] Speaker 2: Week seventeen is week Green Bay. But the rest of
[15:47] Speaker 2: it's pretty easy. You get a bye week in the
[15:48] Speaker 2: middle of Week eighteen. So I feel pretty good about
[15:52] Speaker 2: about this team. I'd say that thirteen and four is
[15:54] Speaker 2: kind of the ceiling. Floor I think is nine and eight,
[15:56] Speaker 2: still right around five hundred, a little bit above five hundred.
[15:58] Speaker 2: I just think the team and the defense are that good.
[16:00] Speaker 2: So that's the floor and the ceiling for me.
[16:02] Speaker 1: With this team, things would have to go really wrong
[16:04] Speaker 1: for them to not make the playoffs. In my mind
[16:06] Speaker 1: this could be a segment later, but I have a
[16:09] Speaker 1: short list of teams where I would be truly surprised
[16:12] Speaker 1: if they didn't make the playoffs. It's probably only four
[16:15] Speaker 1: to six teams and they would be on it for me.
[16:17] Speaker 1: So let's move to a team that I would be
[16:20] Speaker 1: surprised if they do make the playoffs. It's the team
[16:22] Speaker 1: that's in the middle of that rebuild I talked to
[16:25] Speaker 1: that the Texans went through. It's the Tennessee Titans. I
[16:29] Speaker 1: will get us going. It's just cam Ward what's bringing
[16:32] Speaker 1: me joy. I don't know. Did you watch Quarterback the
[16:34] Speaker 1: show on Netflix at all? I didn't yet. It wasn't
[16:37] Speaker 1: a homework assignment. I didn't really watch it. I didn't
[16:39] Speaker 1: think it was great the first two seasons. This season
[16:41] Speaker 1: was better to me, in large part because of cam
[16:43] Speaker 1: Ward Man. That's a guy you would want like running
[16:46] Speaker 1: your team, a guy you just if you're in the
[16:48] Speaker 1: NFL you're rooting for. Like he's so serious about his
[16:52] Speaker 1: craft and wants to be great, but also is so generous.
[16:57] Speaker 1: The way that he handled losing, in terms of his
[17:00] Speaker 1: motivation and everything around him, it was pretty remarkable. I
[17:04] Speaker 1: usually don't get bowled over by these reality shows because
[17:07] Speaker 1: they show you what they want to show. But whatever
[17:10] Speaker 1: intangibles you're looking for from a quarterback, like he's He's
[17:14] Speaker 1: just got it. You can't fake that. It's all there.
[17:18] Speaker 1: And then when you think about him as a player,
[17:20] Speaker 1: he plays with joy. It's just such a loose game
[17:25] Speaker 1: where he's so comfortable back there in the pocket. He's
[17:28] Speaker 1: too comfortable. I don't know how you viewed him as
[17:30] Speaker 1: a prospect, but you know, like his clock needs to
[17:34] Speaker 1: speed up, speed up, And I love an accurate quarterback.
[17:37] Speaker 1: He just wasn't accurate enough last year. But he showed
[17:40] Speaker 1: you a lot of really high level things. The variance
[17:43] Speaker 1: is through the roof kind of like we thought for
[17:45] Speaker 1: him as a prospect. But man, I don't want to
[17:48] Speaker 1: go out Tim Tebow on you, but like the intangibles
[17:51] Speaker 1: are so good. I think that if he can continue
[17:55] Speaker 1: to get better at the basics of it all, that
[17:58] Speaker 1: really raises his ceiling. And as like a transformational guy,
[18:01] Speaker 1: he's bringing me joy. I am a cam Ward fan.
[18:04] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[18:04] Speaker 2: I mean, like a big part of talent acquisition, especially
[18:07] Speaker 2: in the draft, is making a bet. Like you're betting
[18:09] Speaker 2: on guys, right, I mean they haven't played in the
[18:11] Speaker 2: NFL yet. Sure they play in college, but what are
[18:13] Speaker 2: they in the NFL? And you've got to be able
[18:15] Speaker 2: to bet on these players their talent, but also who
[18:17] Speaker 2: they are as people. And when you look at cam Ward,
[18:20] Speaker 2: everything that I heard about him in the pre draft process,
[18:22] Speaker 2: and then the people I know who are in the
[18:24] Speaker 2: building in Tennessee as well as covering the team, I mean,
[18:26] Speaker 2: everyone thinks that this guy is the guy that you
[18:29] Speaker 2: take a bet on, that you invest in. I ended
[18:31] Speaker 2: up giving him a second round grade overall as a prospect,
[18:34] Speaker 2: but that's so much more because of the turnover issues
[18:39] Speaker 2: that I had with him, whether it was the interceptions
[18:40] Speaker 2: or specifically the fumbles, which he really continued to struggle.
[18:43] Speaker 3: With last year.
[18:45] Speaker 2: But all that to say, given where the Titans were
[18:47] Speaker 2: and given what the draft class was, I still would
[18:50] Speaker 2: have taken cam number one overall, like I still would
[18:52] Speaker 2: have had him as that option, because you got to
[18:54] Speaker 2: pay one a little bit of a quarterback tax, right.
[18:56] Speaker 2: Just because the quarterback has the second round grade does
[18:58] Speaker 2: not mean he's going to be a second round player,
[19:00] Speaker 2: and a lot of times that's not the case. You're
[19:02] Speaker 2: looking at what these guys could be, So it makes
[19:04] Speaker 2: sense to invest in a player who approaches the game,
[19:08] Speaker 2: the work what you need to do to be better.
[19:11] Speaker 2: All of that, the talent is there for Cam Wood
[19:12] Speaker 2: and I am.
[19:13] Speaker 1: I'm with you.
[19:13] Speaker 2: I'm very, very excited to see what he could do
[19:16] Speaker 2: this year, specifically because of something else that we're gonna
[19:18] Speaker 2: mention heat another segment.
[19:20] Speaker 1: I know I want to I want to get to
[19:21] Speaker 1: your joy, but while we're talking Cam, I want to
[19:24] Speaker 1: just kind of close the loop there, Like, schematically, how
[19:28] Speaker 1: do you think he fits with Brian Dabel? They gave
[19:31] Speaker 1: him a lot of weapons. They signed Wandel Robinson to
[19:34] Speaker 1: a contract I think was totally fair for like a
[19:36] Speaker 1: two slash three, which is going to be Calvin Ridley
[19:39] Speaker 1: is still around in practicing with the first team. You
[19:41] Speaker 1: have a little bit of depth there with Elecio Manner,
[19:43] Speaker 1: who's I think can be a solid NFL player as
[19:45] Speaker 1: your three. You have Carnel Tatus as your one. Like
[19:48] Speaker 1: how do you think he fits with what Dabel wants
[19:51] Speaker 1: to do, because that's that's the one where Dabel's a
[19:53] Speaker 1: bit of a shape shifter. But I don't know. I'm
[19:57] Speaker 1: a little worried. Personality and schematically how that all works together.
[20:01] Speaker 2: So personality, like who knows right? I mean, like these
[20:05] Speaker 2: are two guys who could like get in the same
[20:07] Speaker 2: room together, and these guys are fiery competitors in both
[20:10] Speaker 2: of these people and Brian Dable and cam Ward, and
[20:13] Speaker 2: it can go one of two ways. Right, if it's
[20:14] Speaker 2: going well, I think they're gonna be the best fans
[20:16] Speaker 2: in the world, and they're gonna be a bad boys.
[20:17] Speaker 2: They're gonna be right in their motorcycles and their sunglasses
[20:20] Speaker 2: into the facility together every morning. But if it doesn't
[20:23] Speaker 2: go well, you know, obviously we'll start to hear about
[20:25] Speaker 2: it and all that kinds of stuff. But I don't
[20:28] Speaker 2: know if I'm messing up with the graphics people. Hopefully
[20:29] Speaker 2: I'm not, because this goes straight into like my scheme
[20:32] Speaker 2: dream and the most important non QB for me. The
[20:35] Speaker 2: most important on QB is Carnell Tape to me, and
[20:38] Speaker 2: it's because it's the vertical offense, Like we have to
[20:41] Speaker 2: get more of a vertical offense in here for cam Ward.
[20:43] Speaker 2: Brian Dable has done that in multiple stops throughout his
[20:47] Speaker 2: coaching career, whether it has been in college or in
[20:50] Speaker 2: the NFL, So it is something that he has done before,
[20:52] Speaker 2: being more of an offense that pushes the ball deep
[20:55] Speaker 2: down the field. Because when you look at it from
[20:56] Speaker 2: last year, he's from mgs again. Cam Ward thirteenth in
[21:01] Speaker 2: deep passes okay, which are passes of more than twenty
[21:04] Speaker 2: yards last season, seventeenth in deep completions okay, but just
[21:09] Speaker 2: thirty fifth in deep pass percentages total. That to me
[21:15] Speaker 2: tells me that one the Titans were down on the scoreboard,
[21:18] Speaker 2: so you know, when it comes to the second half, hey,
[21:20] Speaker 2: they're chucking it deep because they got to do so
[21:22] Speaker 2: to try to come back in these games. But more so,
[21:25] Speaker 2: just that vertical passing was not really a staple in
[21:30] Speaker 2: what they wanted to do in the offense. And yet
[21:33] Speaker 2: the numbers would still tell you it's what cam Board
[21:37] Speaker 2: is good at. It's what he was good at when
[21:38] Speaker 2: he was at Washington State, it's what he was good
[21:40] Speaker 2: at when he was at Miami, and it's what he
[21:42] Speaker 2: could be good at in the NFL. I think Brian
[21:44] Speaker 2: Dable and I think the rest of the coaching staff
[21:46] Speaker 2: has got to see that as well, because it's just
[21:48] Speaker 2: what he has done so well. So to me, that
[21:51] Speaker 2: is the scheme dream is let's get more vertical and
[21:54] Speaker 2: let's use the guy that we picked in the top ten,
[21:56] Speaker 2: who was the best vertical wide receiver in college football
[21:59] Speaker 2: last year. Who was in the draft in Carnell Tait.
[22:01] Speaker 2: All that mixes together and kind of what I'm excited
[22:04] Speaker 2: for the scheme to be there in Tennessee.
[22:06] Speaker 1: Look, they're throwing Carnel Tait into the deep end. He
[22:09] Speaker 1: is gonna have to be their lead guy. I know
[22:12] Speaker 1: you were obviously high on him coming into the draft,
[22:15] Speaker 1: as most people were. Any such a unique talent in
[22:18] Speaker 1: that like he's not a burner, but he gets opened
[22:20] Speaker 1: deep and You're right, cam whether the guys were open
[22:23] Speaker 1: or not, whether it was in rhythm and like what
[22:25] Speaker 1: the play called for or not. He's throwing it down there,
[22:29] Speaker 1: and that's part of the reason why I'm so excited
[22:31] Speaker 1: to watch him. I've put you, I've thrown you into
[22:34] Speaker 1: the deep end, kind of like Carnel Tait with this
[22:35] Speaker 1: format where it's just like it's different sections. We got
[22:38] Speaker 1: a hit a timer, but I do want to know
[22:41] Speaker 1: what's bringing you joy, like first and foremost for this team.
[22:44] Speaker 3: So obviously you hit cam Ward.
[22:46] Speaker 2: I think he's the obvious, but to me, it's what
[22:48] Speaker 2: Robert Sala has done to create these waves of pass
[22:51] Speaker 2: rushers in Tennessee, which was so so so needed. When
[22:53] Speaker 2: you look at what they were last year. Obviously, Jeffery
[22:56] Speaker 2: Simmons is a stud in and of himself. But you know,
[22:58] Speaker 2: you signed John Franklin Meyer, you signed Jacob Martin, You
[23:01] Speaker 2: signed Jordan Elliott, You drafted Keldrick Faulk, you traded for
[23:03] Speaker 2: Jermaine Johnson, you traded for Solomon Thomas. Right we're talking,
[23:07] Speaker 2: You've got Famiola dejo in there as well, to see
[23:09] Speaker 2: what he can develop into with this coaching staff. Vo
[23:12] Speaker 2: we're talking about waves of pass rushers, waves of defensive
[23:16] Speaker 2: linemen that you could stay fresh and do a lot
[23:18] Speaker 2: of different things with. So to me, I think that
[23:21] Speaker 2: this will allow Sala, who is one of those defensive.
[23:24] Speaker 3: Coordinators and head coaches.
[23:25] Speaker 2: I guess I should just say defensive minds that likes
[23:27] Speaker 2: to win with four kind of the way that we
[23:29] Speaker 2: talked about with the Texans, and he hasn't always had
[23:33] Speaker 2: the defensive line to not blitz as much as he
[23:35] Speaker 2: doesn't want to blitz.
[23:36] Speaker 3: But I think for Tennessee, it's a nice.
[23:38] Speaker 2: Year one group for him to stay true to the
[23:40] Speaker 2: scheme that he wants to be able to run. Because
[23:43] Speaker 2: I think that that's pretty big for first year head
[23:45] Speaker 2: coaches coming in when the roster doesn't really fit exactly
[23:47] Speaker 2: what they want to do schematically. Yet sometimes you see
[23:50] Speaker 2: like a lot of headbutting in terms of like what
[23:52] Speaker 2: guys are good at versus what they're being asked to do.
[23:54] Speaker 2: I think it's going to be a little bit more
[23:56] Speaker 2: streamlined than it normally is for a first year head
[23:59] Speaker 2: coach because of what Saula has been able to do
[24:02] Speaker 2: acquiring those defensive line talent.
[24:03] Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a good group. It's a deep group. They've
[24:08] Speaker 1: added a lot. It was clearly a priority. I still
[24:11] Speaker 1: do wonder if there's enough one on one juice, Like
[24:16] Speaker 1: is Keldrick fault that guy as a rookie, Jermaine Johnson
[24:20] Speaker 1: a good player, does he have that juice? You have
[24:23] Speaker 1: Jeffrey Simmons who is going to be a force multiplier
[24:25] Speaker 1: and help everyone else out. But it does feel like
[24:28] Speaker 1: a lot of good depth and a lot of like
[24:31] Speaker 1: bees versus a lot of like blue chip talent. I'm
[24:35] Speaker 1: gonna flip to my most non important non quarterback on
[24:40] Speaker 1: the team and mention j C. Latham, who oh yeah, Like, look,
[24:45] Speaker 1: they drafted him as a top ten pick and now
[24:47] Speaker 1: they're just hoping he can be a decent starter it's
[24:51] Speaker 1: not even a lock. I don't think that he is
[24:53] Speaker 1: going to keep that starting job. But they don't really
[24:54] Speaker 1: have great options. There was some buzz of like he
[24:58] Speaker 1: might have been available in a trade, and this is
[25:01] Speaker 1: I think the weakness of the team. You know, when
[25:03] Speaker 1: you give that much money to Dan Moore at left
[25:06] Speaker 1: tackle and you have a high pick at right tackle
[25:08] Speaker 1: and you're one of the more lackluster tackle duos last year,
[25:13] Speaker 1: that really needs to change or it's it's not going
[25:16] Speaker 1: to matter, you know. And even the interior other than
[25:19] Speaker 1: Peter Skoronsky, on paper doesn't look like an amazing group,
[25:24] Speaker 1: and so you're hoping the coaching helps here, but they
[25:26] Speaker 1: could really use J. C. Latham to develop into a
[25:30] Speaker 1: into a plus starter.
[25:32] Speaker 3: No, I'm with you.
[25:32] Speaker 2: That's that's my things go wrong if with this team
[25:36] Speaker 2: is they have to figure out the offensive line. And
[25:39] Speaker 2: as a draft guy, I was so shocked that we
[25:41] Speaker 2: weren't talking about o line for the Tennessee Titans more
[25:45] Speaker 2: at number four.
[25:46] Speaker 3: Overall, I think cam.
[25:47] Speaker 2: I think Cornel Tage is going to be great for
[25:49] Speaker 2: them for what they want to do again getting more
[25:50] Speaker 2: vertical in their offense. But Peter Skronsky is the only
[25:53] Speaker 2: offensive lineman that I could tell you with full confidence
[25:56] Speaker 2: is going to be there two years from now, right,
[25:58] Speaker 2: I think that all four other starters you have no idea,
[26:01] Speaker 2: and that's JC Latham included. And anytime that's the case, man,
[26:04] Speaker 2: I just have a hard time really passing over offensive
[26:07] Speaker 2: lineman in the draft, especially when you got a high pick.
[26:09] Speaker 3: So I'm with you.
[26:10] Speaker 2: That goes into my things definitely go wrong for this
[26:13] Speaker 2: team if this offensive line can't be a lot better
[26:16] Speaker 2: than what they were last year.
[26:17] Speaker 1: And their fans will point out they're excited about Carmen Brisilla,
[26:21] Speaker 1: who's with Dable, who did a pretty good job I
[26:23] Speaker 1: thought with the Giants last year, and he's replacing Bill Callahan,
[26:26] Speaker 1: who in one of the Goats as an offensive line
[26:28] Speaker 1: coach but didn't really make it. Capa didn't work in
[26:31] Speaker 1: Tennessee for whatever reason. My things go wrong if the
[26:35] Speaker 1: big ticket items in the secondary, which we haven't mentioned,
[26:38] Speaker 1: don't work, and you just see this happen over the years,
[26:42] Speaker 1: more bad money I think is spent in the secondary
[26:45] Speaker 1: and free agency than anywhere else. Good players pop up
[26:49] Speaker 1: for one good year, two good years, and then they
[26:51] Speaker 1: get signed for big money and then they're not difference makers.
[26:54] Speaker 1: So they give Alante Taylor a huge contract to be
[26:57] Speaker 1: one of the highest paid slots essentially in the league.
[27:00] Speaker 1: And then Cordell Flytt, who had a good year you
[27:02] Speaker 1: know in New York last year. The front can make
[27:06] Speaker 1: up for it, but like I said, I'm not sure
[27:08] Speaker 1: about like whether there's enough juice. And then you look
[27:11] Speaker 1: at the safety position. If those cornerbacks don't get you know,
[27:15] Speaker 1: pan out as well as they played last year as
[27:17] Speaker 1: well as the Titans hope, then they could get picked
[27:20] Speaker 1: on a little bit in the back end.
[27:22] Speaker 3: I'm a big I'm a big Kevin Winston junior believer.
[27:26] Speaker 1: Okay, with him young safety, him second year player, so
[27:30] Speaker 1: when he with him being healthy, man, I hope we
[27:33] Speaker 1: see the best of him because his stuff was special at.
[27:35] Speaker 3: Penn State when he was coming up as it underclassman.
[27:37] Speaker 1: And here's a thing. Salah can coach defense. Nobody doubts that,
[27:42] Speaker 1: Like what he did with the forty nine ers last
[27:43] Speaker 1: year was great, but everything he did with the forty
[27:45] Speaker 1: nine ers before, more importantly, what he did with the
[27:47] Speaker 1: Titan with the Jets when he took over for the Jets,
[27:50] Speaker 1: that was one of the best defenses in the league,
[27:52] Speaker 1: and I think this is a good enough group, maybe
[27:54] Speaker 1: not a great group, but it can be a better
[27:57] Speaker 1: than average top ten to twelve defense if everything goes right.
[28:01] Speaker 1: And that kind of leads us to the ceiling floor
[28:04] Speaker 1: of the team. To me, if the defense hits like
[28:09] Speaker 1: this can be a competitive team. Cam Ward taking a
[28:12] Speaker 1: like a next step. The talent is there for them
[28:15] Speaker 1: to win seven eight games, like I think that is
[28:17] Speaker 1: probably the ceiling of the team. The floor is obvious,
[28:20] Speaker 1: it's more of the same. I think they'd be a
[28:22] Speaker 1: little better than they were a year ago, but they
[28:23] Speaker 1: could still be one of the worst teams in the
[28:25] Speaker 1: NFL if things don't go well. But I think they
[28:27] Speaker 1: could hang around five hundred make some noise potentially. I
[28:32] Speaker 1: don't see them as a potential playoff team. Yeah, we
[28:35] Speaker 1: have the same thinking.
[28:36] Speaker 2: Right. They're three and fourteen last year. I think the
[28:38] Speaker 2: ceiling is eight and nine, still missing the playoffs. And
[28:40] Speaker 2: I don't mind how their schedule starts. You know, it's
[28:43] Speaker 2: not too bad. And I think that having a week
[28:45] Speaker 2: nine by is nice because it gives you a little
[28:47] Speaker 2: bit of a reset moment right in the middle of
[28:49] Speaker 2: the season. Decently easy schedule, if there is such a
[28:53] Speaker 2: thing in the NFL. But floor, yeah, I think it's
[28:55] Speaker 2: a little better than that, you know, three and fourteen mark,
[28:58] Speaker 2: but five and twelve is where I had four.
[29:01] Speaker 3: So five and twelve for the floor for this team
[29:03] Speaker 3: and then eight and nine for the ceiling.
[29:05] Speaker 1: That week one game and they start with two home games.
[29:07] Speaker 1: They're always trying to help out the teams that struggled
[29:10] Speaker 1: the year before, and the Jets and Titans. These Week
[29:15] Speaker 1: one games to me, like that's one of the most
[29:17] Speaker 1: important games of the season for these two teams, Like
[29:20] Speaker 1: I will be watching because there's so much unknown about
[29:23] Speaker 1: those two teams, and like both teams are looking at
[29:26] Speaker 1: that matchup and thinking like, oh, we can get one
[29:29] Speaker 1: in week one. We can start out one to know,
[29:31] Speaker 1: and then they're at the Giants week three, like that's
[29:33] Speaker 1: a winnable road game. Like there're saying there's a path
[29:36] Speaker 1: here for two and one, and you're feeling yourself. You know,
[29:39] Speaker 1: I'm feeling myself today talking about this division. Let's take
[29:43] Speaker 1: a quick break. Trevor Sikoma is with us for the
[29:45] Speaker 1: first time on NFL Daily. Won't be the last, that's
[29:48] Speaker 1: my bold prediction. But we'll be back in just a
[29:51] Speaker 1: minute to hit the rest of the division. Back on
[30:02] Speaker 1: NFL Daily. Liam Cohen not happy with the lack of
[30:08] Speaker 1: attention on the Jaguars, so we gave him a lot
[30:11] Speaker 1: of pop earlier this week. It just happens to be
[30:13] Speaker 1: AFC South week. We'll give them their fair share of
[30:17] Speaker 1: pop here, Trevor Sikama, give me what's bringing you joy
[30:20] Speaker 1: about this program?
[30:23] Speaker 2: We didn't talk about this before we came back from
[30:25] Speaker 2: the break. It's literally Liam Cohen like that, like that,
[30:28] Speaker 2: that's actually what gets me excited and what brings me
[30:31] Speaker 2: joy with this team. I grew up a Bucks fan
[30:35] Speaker 2: and so followed the Tampa Bay Buccaneers very closely, even
[30:38] Speaker 2: still to this day.
[30:38] Speaker 1: I got the mic all stot jersey in the background
[30:41] Speaker 1: for everyone watching it on YouTube, Like, if you like
[30:45] Speaker 1: Trevor and this show, like and subscribe. But yeah, I
[30:47] Speaker 1: love the Allstar jersey back there.
[30:49] Speaker 3: That's good.
[30:49] Speaker 2: That's a good plug to get people to come over
[30:51] Speaker 2: to the YouTube channel.
[30:51] Speaker 3: That's good. It's good. I see what you're doing there.
[30:53] Speaker 3: That's why you're pro.
[30:54] Speaker 2: But Cohen, I mean I enjoyed what he did when
[30:57] Speaker 2: he was in college. I enjoy what he did when
[31:00] Speaker 2: he was the Buccaneers offensive coordinator. The Bucks were kind
[31:02] Speaker 2: of running through a couple of different offensive coordinators, some
[31:04] Speaker 2: one year guys here here here, and then when Liam
[31:06] Speaker 2: Cohen came along, it just felt as though like he
[31:10] Speaker 2: just had this confidence about what he was going to
[31:12] Speaker 2: set up and the acclamation period for him was okay,
[31:16] Speaker 2: training camp and then the first four or five weeks
[31:18] Speaker 2: of the season, but other than that, like you got
[31:20] Speaker 2: to establish your identity. And I think that's sometimes an
[31:23] Speaker 2: issue with offensive coordinators is they go, well, we don't
[31:26] Speaker 2: know exactly what these guys are good at yet, and
[31:28] Speaker 2: then you get into week twelve, week thirteen, and you
[31:31] Speaker 2: still don't feel like you have an identity of the team.
[31:34] Speaker 2: Cohen was able to recognize that so quickly with the Buccaneers,
[31:38] Speaker 2: where the second half of the season there was so
[31:41] Speaker 2: much confidence with every single player because they knew exactly
[31:43] Speaker 2: what they were going to do, because they were put
[31:45] Speaker 2: in the positions to succeed. You obviously saw that again
[31:48] Speaker 2: last year with him with the Jags winning thirteen games,
[31:51] Speaker 2: and so I just the way that he thinks about
[31:55] Speaker 2: the game of football, the personality that he is to
[31:58] Speaker 2: instill confidence in his players, you know, whether it's them
[32:01] Speaker 2: being doubted or whether it's you know, him just telling them, hey, yeah,
[32:04] Speaker 2: if we do this, it will work. And I think
[32:07] Speaker 2: that we saw that so early on last year. I
[32:09] Speaker 2: think that's something that's going to continue. And he's one
[32:11] Speaker 2: of the best coaches in the NFL. And so he
[32:13] Speaker 2: is somebody who gives me joy because I'm so excited
[32:15] Speaker 2: to always see what he is cooking up now with
[32:17] Speaker 2: this Jags team.
[32:18] Speaker 1: Obviously, so you're a Tampa guy, Ray, I don't call
[32:21] Speaker 1: you that now. I'm a map and and so is
[32:25] Speaker 1: Liam Cohen. Spiritually, he went, he went through, he went
[32:29] Speaker 1: to UMass. He grew up in Rhode Island, which is
[32:32] Speaker 1: essentially the same idea. Sorry Rhode, it is, I mean,
[32:36] Speaker 1: the same types of personality. And I think it really
[32:40] Speaker 1: comes out in those soundbites that people latch onto because
[32:45] Speaker 1: he's just like kind of always looking for a fight.
[32:47] Speaker 1: But that's his love language. That's mine too, like that
[32:49] Speaker 1: I can't get it out of me. That's just who
[32:52] Speaker 1: he is. And I had I had the same idea
[32:55] Speaker 1: of just he's he's gonna be great at the podium,
[32:59] Speaker 1: but more importantly, he is going to be great on
[33:02] Speaker 1: the field. And I think that one year he had
[33:04] Speaker 1: with the Rams where he was the offensive coordinator and
[33:07] Speaker 1: it was their nightmare season, he just got caught And
[33:11] Speaker 1: I fell victim to this from a public image standpoint
[33:14] Speaker 1: of getting blamed a little for that when that wasn't
[33:16] Speaker 1: about him, He wasn't even calling the plays. It was
[33:18] Speaker 1: just a nightmare season for them. And yet when he
[33:21] Speaker 1: got back into the NFL and the Buck season and
[33:23] Speaker 1: now with the Jags, like he's the one, Like he's
[33:26] Speaker 1: that guy, he is the guy everyone is searching for.
[33:29] Speaker 1: The Bucks should have kept him. I know that's a
[33:30] Speaker 1: sore spot there in Tampa. Like he is right there
[33:35] Speaker 1: with with Sean McVay and Ben Johnson at the very
[33:37] Speaker 1: forefront of play calling and what it takes an offense.
[33:42] Speaker 1: And I don't know if that leads you if you
[33:44] Speaker 1: go offense or defense with your scheme dream, which which
[33:47] Speaker 1: way do you want to go?
[33:48] Speaker 2: So the scheme dream for me is it is on
[33:51] Speaker 2: the offensive side of the ball. And when I was
[33:53] Speaker 2: kind of like looking up some numbers of say, what
[33:55] Speaker 2: could this team do to be a little bit different
[33:57] Speaker 2: this year? I think that this goes into a little
[33:59] Speaker 2: bit of them wanting to lean more into heavier personnel.
[34:02] Speaker 2: We'll talk about Nick bor Kercher here in a second,
[34:04] Speaker 2: but when it comes to the scheme dream specifically getting
[34:07] Speaker 2: heavier personnel when they go under center. So this team
[34:11] Speaker 2: is not afraid to go under center. Liam Cohen was
[34:13] Speaker 2: not afraid to go under center. Trevor Lawrence not afraid
[34:15] Speaker 2: to go under center. This team had the ninth highest
[34:18] Speaker 2: percentage of snaps under center last year, but just twenty
[34:22] Speaker 2: fourth in the NFL in overall two tight end or
[34:27] Speaker 2: three tight end sets, so heavier personnel sets. When you
[34:29] Speaker 2: think about being able to get under center, the things
[34:32] Speaker 2: that you can do when it comes to formations and
[34:35] Speaker 2: play action and just everything, it gets so advantageous when
[34:39] Speaker 2: you have multiple tight ends that you could put on
[34:41] Speaker 2: the field. Because if you have a quarterback and an
[34:43] Speaker 2: offense that's very comfortable getting under center, whether it's to
[34:46] Speaker 2: hand the ball off and to actually execute your run
[34:49] Speaker 2: game or to execute play action, and you do so
[34:53] Speaker 2: with multiple tight ends on the field.
[34:55] Speaker 3: The defense has to respect where those tight ends are.
[34:58] Speaker 3: They have to respect where they think the strong side
[35:01] Speaker 3: of the line of scrimmage is going to be. And
[35:04] Speaker 3: I think that the Jags.
[35:05] Speaker 2: When you look at how often they wanted to get
[35:07] Speaker 2: under center last year, and they did get under center
[35:09] Speaker 2: last year, and then some of the offseason emphasis to
[35:13] Speaker 2: get more tight ends and prioritize that tight end position.
[35:16] Speaker 2: I think we're going to see heavier personnel for them
[35:19] Speaker 2: when they're going under center, and I just think it's
[35:21] Speaker 2: going to unlock another level of what Liam Cohn wants
[35:25] Speaker 2: to do to say to stay mysterious with what the
[35:29] Speaker 2: play call is going to be, where the ball is
[35:31] Speaker 2: going to go.
[35:32] Speaker 3: And I think that's going to unlock that.
[35:33] Speaker 1: Wait, so are you going Nate barkercher as your most
[35:37] Speaker 1: important non quarterback?
[35:39] Speaker 3: I am, And I'm a little reluctant to do.
[35:41] Speaker 1: Second round rookie. Where did he go to school? He
[35:45] Speaker 1: went to Texas A and m one of the most
[35:47] Speaker 1: surprising picks of the draft. He was and he is
[35:51] Speaker 1: your most important non quarterback.
[35:54] Speaker 3: He is.
[35:54] Speaker 2: And I'm almost a little reluctant to do this because
[35:57] Speaker 2: my face was all over social media with my reaction
[36:01] Speaker 2: for when this pick came in.
[36:02] Speaker 3: I was floored. My jaw hit the floor.
[36:05] Speaker 2: I could not believe that he And it's not because
[36:08] Speaker 2: I've said this multiple times it's not because I don't
[36:10] Speaker 2: like the player. It's not because I don't think he's
[36:12] Speaker 2: going to be a difference maker. I just couldn't believe
[36:14] Speaker 2: he got picked a number. Was it fifty four?
[36:16] Speaker 3: Overall?
[36:17] Speaker 1: He started at the run, started at the run, but.
[36:19] Speaker 2: It did indeed start the run. And James Gladstone when
[36:22] Speaker 2: they revealed the the behind the scenes footage, He's like, Hey,
[36:25] Speaker 2: let's go shock the world here with this pick, and
[36:27] Speaker 2: they absolutely did. But the reason why I think he's
[36:29] Speaker 2: the most important one it ties into sort of what
[36:31] Speaker 2: I said about how I think that their scheme can
[36:33] Speaker 2: change a little bit there. They didn't draft him in
[36:36] Speaker 2: the second round to be a bystander, and I don't
[36:37] Speaker 2: mean to put too much on a rookie's plate. However,
[36:41] Speaker 2: I do think they want to get heavier in their personnel,
[36:43] Speaker 2: whether it's under center or not. And when you look
[36:46] Speaker 2: at Brenton Strange, Brent Strange was a key part of
[36:49] Speaker 2: this offense last year. They wanted to run a lot
[36:52] Speaker 2: of what they did, whether it was the run game
[36:53] Speaker 2: or the pass game through Brent Strange. He missed a
[36:56] Speaker 2: little bit of time due to injury, only played in
[36:57] Speaker 2: seventy five percent of the snaps the offensive snap slash
[37:00] Speaker 2: here didn't play a full season, and it was different
[37:03] Speaker 2: when he was hurt and when he was not out there.
[37:05] Speaker 2: So not only to expand how often and how confident
[37:09] Speaker 2: they can be putting two tight ends on the field,
[37:12] Speaker 2: also a little bit of insurance of hey, if Brent
[37:15] Speaker 2: Strange gets hurt again, we still want to be able
[37:18] Speaker 2: to run an offense that has tight ends heavily involved.
[37:22] Speaker 2: And I think the answer to both of those questions
[37:25] Speaker 2: is Nate bor Kercher Ark Kurscher. Again, I don't want
[37:28] Speaker 2: to put too much on a rookie's plate because as
[37:31] Speaker 2: Ian Beckle's the former offensive line for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers,
[37:34] Speaker 2: used to tell me, Hey, Trevor, rookies suck.
[37:36] Speaker 3: It's just the way it is.
[37:37] Speaker 2: And he would always hear me get excited about these
[37:39] Speaker 2: young guys, and so he's always trying to put a
[37:40] Speaker 2: little bit.
[37:41] Speaker 3: Of cold water on it.
[37:42] Speaker 2: But I think that however quickly bor Kircher can adapt
[37:47] Speaker 2: to what they want to put on his plate, that
[37:50] Speaker 2: could hold the key for how perhaps unstoppable even this
[37:55] Speaker 2: offense can be this season. I think you mentioned Liam
[37:57] Speaker 2: Cohen's time with the Rams. He came in with the
[37:59] Speaker 2: Rams for the first time in twenty eighteen. That was when,
[38:01] Speaker 2: you know, those condensed sets were sort of in vogue,
[38:04] Speaker 2: and I think that we could, especially with Parker Washington,
[38:06] Speaker 2: who gives his all as a blocker Jacoby Myers, who
[38:09] Speaker 2: gives us all as a blocker, I think you're going
[38:11] Speaker 2: to start to see more of these condensed heavy sets
[38:14] Speaker 2: from this team, and I think that it's really just
[38:17] Speaker 2: going to change how Liam Cohen's is going to be
[38:19] Speaker 2: able to really put a lot of stress on defense
[38:21] Speaker 2: coordinators with everything.
[38:22] Speaker 1: That he could do. Yeah, you mentioned two of the
[38:23] Speaker 1: really versatile wide receiving weapons that they have who can
[38:27] Speaker 1: both block, and I noticed, you know, you didn't mention
[38:29] Speaker 1: Brian Thomas Junior, who maybe his fit in the system
[38:32] Speaker 1: was a little awkward at first, but now they've kind
[38:34] Speaker 1: of figured out what he can do and so for
[38:36] Speaker 1: him he's not a role player, because I still think
[38:38] Speaker 1: he might lead the team in receiving yards. I think
[38:41] Speaker 1: Parker Washington would be more likely receptions, but either way,
[38:44] Speaker 1: they've kind of figured out what he can do, what
[38:46] Speaker 1: he can't do, and it's a crazy deep group of
[38:50] Speaker 1: weapons with Travis Hunter also in the mix. And I'll
[38:55] Speaker 1: never say that running backs don't matter, but on this team,
[38:59] Speaker 1: I think with Lee Cohen's playing calling, the questions about
[39:02] Speaker 1: the running backs and the offensive line relatively is lesson.
[39:05] Speaker 1: Not that they aren't important, but they're lessened by the
[39:08] Speaker 1: play calling and the amount of weapons. We haven't talked defense,
[39:12] Speaker 1: so I'll go there with my scheme dream and Anthony
[39:15] Speaker 1: Campaneely is the defensive coordinator. Second year, they lose Devin
[39:20] Speaker 1: Lloyd in the offseason, lost some depth. They just forced
[39:25] Speaker 1: a lot of turnovers last year. I think there are
[39:28] Speaker 1: absolutely questions in the secondary. They are very reliant on
[39:32] Speaker 1: Travon Walker and josh heinz Allen, who wouldn't be, but
[39:35] Speaker 1: like there's not a lot of great depth behind him.
[39:38] Speaker 1: I don't think the defensive tackle spot is great, even
[39:40] Speaker 1: the cornerback spot behind Hunter, Like they probably feel a
[39:44] Speaker 1: little more confident in it than I do. Which is
[39:46] Speaker 1: why Travis Hunter is my most non important, you know,
[39:49] Speaker 1: my most important on quarterback because sure, sure he's been
[39:53] Speaker 1: out there hooping this week and I think he will
[39:56] Speaker 1: add you mentioned the rookies suck. I mean Travis Hunter
[39:59] Speaker 1: didn't suck, but he wasn't the Travis Huenter I was
[40:01] Speaker 1: expecting his rookie season. His head was swimming a little.
[40:04] Speaker 1: He is a young player. I think he's going to
[40:05] Speaker 1: take a step on both sides of the ball, add
[40:08] Speaker 1: on both sides of the ball. But the important part
[40:10] Speaker 1: here to me is that he's a difference making cornerback
[40:14] Speaker 1: and I absolutely expect him to be and that will
[40:19] Speaker 1: maybe make up for, you know, some of the turnover
[40:21] Speaker 1: luck that they had, and some of it was luck,
[40:23] Speaker 1: like they had one of the highest percentage of recovering
[40:26] Speaker 1: fumbles in the last like ten to fifteen years, and
[40:28] Speaker 1: that's just you know, you can't count on that happening
[40:31] Speaker 1: year after year. But I think Travis Hunter gives them
[40:34] Speaker 1: another blue chip talent, especially on the defense that they
[40:37] Speaker 1: need to kind of maintain where they were at because
[40:39] Speaker 1: it was a surprisingly good defense a year ago. Yeah,
[40:43] Speaker 1: and that sort of goes into my you know, things
[40:45] Speaker 1: go wrong if there's a couple of areas that you
[40:47] Speaker 1: kind of mentioned that you could potentially point to here.
[40:50] Speaker 1: But I'm going to talk about the safety play, Like
[40:52] Speaker 1: if the safeties can't hold up, I get a little
[40:54] Speaker 1: bit worried about this defense. They gave up the ninth
[40:57] Speaker 1: most completions of twenty or more yards last year and
[41:00] Speaker 1: had the fourth most deep passes against them as a team,
[41:04] Speaker 1: still have Eric Murray, still have Antonio Johnson, who's coming
[41:07] Speaker 1: off of a good year. But I think that you've
[41:09] Speaker 1: got a lot of young guys around him. The secondary's
[41:12] Speaker 1: got to limit those explosives in those big plays, because
[41:15] Speaker 1: if there's an area where you can really attack down
[41:17] Speaker 1: the field, hey Josh Heinz Allen, Trayvon Walker. And even
[41:20] Speaker 1: if the defensive line plays really well, if you don't
[41:22] Speaker 1: have safeties in a secondary that could really defend deep,
[41:25] Speaker 1: I think you're still going to struggle. So they got
[41:26] Speaker 1: to be better than they were last year in that area. Yeah,
[41:28] Speaker 1: Jordan Lewis was good for them at Nickel and he's
[41:30] Speaker 1: going to play corner for them. Caleb Rants if we
[41:33] Speaker 1: had all the time in the world, the two lane legend.
[41:36] Speaker 1: We'll see if he can come back from an injury.
[41:38] Speaker 1: It was a third round pick for them last year
[41:40] Speaker 1: and make an impact before we get to the ceiling floor.
[41:43] Speaker 1: Things go wrong. If Lawrence Fritz is out, If Lawrence
[41:47] Speaker 1: is more like the guy we've seen for most of
[41:49] Speaker 1: his career, and I found it interesting in Mike Sandos
[41:52] Speaker 1: QB tiars that, like the coaches, GMS kind of aren't
[41:56] Speaker 1: totally buying in on Lawrence finally getting late last season.
[42:01] Speaker 1: To me, it's partly that he got Liam Cohen, and
[42:04] Speaker 1: that's why I think it can be steady. But I've
[42:07] Speaker 1: never really been a Lawrence guy versus consensus because once
[42:12] Speaker 1: he gets past his first read sometimes I just don't
[42:15] Speaker 1: understand the decision making process and he's not always been
[42:18] Speaker 1: crazy accurate, So like the athleticism, everything else hasn't been
[42:22] Speaker 1: enough to make up for it. But if he's that
[42:25] Speaker 1: guy in the second half of the season where it
[42:26] Speaker 1: was you kind of knew who you were getting week
[42:28] Speaker 1: after week, including the playoff game. I thought he played
[42:30] Speaker 1: well in the playoff game. They're just a different team,
[42:33] Speaker 1: So that's the things go wrong if for me, it's
[42:35] Speaker 1: just that if he fritzes out a little bit mentally
[42:38] Speaker 1: and he's not the guy. I don't know if you've
[42:39] Speaker 1: ever been a Lawrence guy overall.
[42:42] Speaker 2: No, obviously, like obviously, like when he was coming out
[42:45] Speaker 2: of Clemson, I thought he was incredible. But but Lawrence
[42:47] Speaker 2: was actually a really good case study for me when
[42:49] Speaker 2: it came to going back and seeing maybe how you
[42:52] Speaker 2: could scout things a little bit better and a little
[42:53] Speaker 2: bit more accurately. I just didn't take into account how
[42:56] Speaker 2: much of his success at Clemson was a lot of
[42:59] Speaker 2: the first stuff, and how talented Clemson was, and how
[43:02] Speaker 2: much more talented they were than a lot of other
[43:04] Speaker 2: teams when teams really started to rotate their coverages or
[43:07] Speaker 2: have different looks in the secondary, like he would struggle
[43:10] Speaker 2: there back in college, and I just didn't really give
[43:13] Speaker 2: I don't think enough weight to that when talking about
[43:16] Speaker 2: him to the NFL, which kind of goes into sort
[43:17] Speaker 2: of where he is right This is year six for
[43:19] Speaker 2: Trevor Lawrence. The first year was an absolutely I mean
[43:21] Speaker 2: you like that on fire was the Urban Meyer year
[43:24] Speaker 2: with him.
[43:24] Speaker 3: So it's like, okay, well is he sort of where
[43:29] Speaker 3: he should be?
[43:29] Speaker 2: I would have liked for him to take a little
[43:31] Speaker 2: bit more of a definitive step a little bit earlier.
[43:33] Speaker 2: But there's reason to believe the best version of Trevor Lawrence,
[43:37] Speaker 2: and the most consistent, I think is probably the better
[43:39] Speaker 2: way to say it, version of Trevor Lawrence does actually
[43:42] Speaker 2: show up this year in year two of Liam Cohen.
[43:45] Speaker 2: So I think that I've probably been right around sort
[43:49] Speaker 2: of like the middle of like what people think with Lawrence,
[43:52] Speaker 2: But I really do think that this could be a
[43:54] Speaker 2: really strong year with him with Liam Gohin.
[43:56] Speaker 1: And you hate to pick on a guy for like
[43:58] Speaker 1: how he's reading the game and coverage and we're kind
[44:01] Speaker 1: of talking around it when it's talking about getting past
[44:03] Speaker 1: your first read, but there are there is a certain
[44:06] Speaker 1: type of player, and I think of Ben Roethlisberger, even
[44:10] Speaker 1: though he's very different than Lawrence. I think of like
[44:12] Speaker 1: Peek Russell Wilson in a little way that sometimes like
[44:17] Speaker 1: the me, you know, the mental peak of your career
[44:19] Speaker 1: is going to be more like year six, seven, eight nine.
[44:22] Speaker 1: Obviously keeps getting better, but it takes some quarterbacks longer
[44:26] Speaker 1: to develop that part of the game than others. And
[44:28] Speaker 1: then when that starts hitting, the athleticism that everyone's so
[44:31] Speaker 1: excited about really comes out ceiling floor of this team,
[44:35] Speaker 1: I think they are one of the teams that can
[44:36] Speaker 1: win the Super Bowl. I'm a championship big a mist
[44:40] Speaker 1: on this show. I probably have a list of like
[44:41] Speaker 1: eleven twelve teams, Like I don't think it's that short,
[44:44] Speaker 1: but I think the Jaguars are one of them. I
[44:47] Speaker 1: do think they have more of a variance though than
[44:49] Speaker 1: the Texans, for instance, or than some of the other
[44:52] Speaker 1: AFC teams between the offensive line, some of the things
[44:55] Speaker 1: I talked about, the overall talent and the secondary between
[44:58] Speaker 1: you know, Trevor Lawrence, I love Liam Cohen and even
[45:01] Speaker 1: he like if something went wrong, is it like they're
[45:04] Speaker 1: gonna get stuck in a run? I don't know yet,
[45:07] Speaker 1: and so to me, they have more of a floor
[45:09] Speaker 1: where things could go really wrong and it could be
[45:12] Speaker 1: more of a seven win team. But ultimately I think
[45:15] Speaker 1: they're more you know, leaning towards that playoff championship contender,
[45:18] Speaker 1: and it's gonna be really important to win this division
[45:20] Speaker 1: because it's just so hard to win the Super Bowl
[45:24] Speaker 1: as a wildcard team, and so them versus the Texans,
[45:26] Speaker 1: and we'll see, maybe the Colts is just a big deal.
[45:29] Speaker 1: You know.
[45:29] Speaker 2: If we're talking about teams that like have the ability
[45:33] Speaker 2: to potentially win a Super Bowl, I suppose that Jaguars
[45:35] Speaker 2: should be on that list. The ceiling that I had
[45:37] Speaker 2: for them though is twelve and five, so not quite
[45:40] Speaker 2: as good as last year, but I think there's around
[45:43] Speaker 2: that mark. But I think like Conference championship feels like
[45:46] Speaker 2: a ceiling for this team where I like him and
[45:49] Speaker 2: I like what the ceiling could be. I'm just not
[45:51] Speaker 2: sure it's the whole team yet for them to make
[45:55] Speaker 2: that super Bowl jump. So that's where I have them
[45:57] Speaker 2: as more of a conference championship type of a team
[45:59] Speaker 2: with that ceiling, and then the floor is like, hey, yeah,
[46:02] Speaker 2: if Lawrence doesn't progress, if the defense takes a couple
[46:05] Speaker 2: of steps back, if the offensive line ends up being
[46:07] Speaker 2: a little bit more of an issue than we thought. Uh,
[46:10] Speaker 2: eight and nine feels like the floor for this team
[46:13] Speaker 2: missing the playoffs, but I think it's much more likely
[46:15] Speaker 2: you get closer to that nine to eleven win range
[46:18] Speaker 2: for them is something that's more realist.
[46:20] Speaker 1: Yeah, good and bad for Jags fans out there. The
[46:22] Speaker 1: good like we blew over that that twelve minute buzzer,
[46:25] Speaker 1: thanks to Eric for not, you know, unforce it. So
[46:28] Speaker 1: I think the Jags got more time on this show
[46:29] Speaker 1: than any team.
[46:30] Speaker 3: I'm gonna get yelled at. We're blowing past the time.
[46:34] Speaker 1: Ever, it doesn't matter. It's just it's just a way.
[46:36] Speaker 2: I'm gonna get fine. I'm gonna get I'm gonna get fine.
[46:39] Speaker 2: It's a podcast.
[46:40] Speaker 1: You guys are doing like two and a half hour
[46:42] Speaker 1: redrafts on the NFL stocking stage, and that's great content.
[46:45] Speaker 1: I love that stuff. But we're daily, so we try
[46:47] Speaker 1: to keep it moving. Sometimes the bad though, that's the
[46:51] Speaker 1: good for the deck. The bad is that Trevor kind
[46:53] Speaker 1: of convinced me that. In my heart, I think Conference
[46:56] Speaker 1: championship as the ceiling feels more right this year sometimes
[46:59] Speaker 1: in or two with a good new coach, like even
[47:02] Speaker 1: if the record's not as good, you are taking a
[47:04] Speaker 1: step forward and you just see it a lot, So
[47:06] Speaker 1: that actually makes more sense. I'm not lowering my ceiling. Sorry.
[47:09] Speaker 1: Let's talk about the Colts, a team that I believe
[47:13] Speaker 1: has a has quite a high variance too. When we
[47:15] Speaker 1: get to the ceiling floor, I think the ceiling is
[47:18] Speaker 1: sneaky high and the floor is, you know, is the
[47:22] Speaker 1: basement to kind of parapher It's Michael Jordan, what is
[47:26] Speaker 1: bringing you to joy? When it comes to the Colts.
[47:29] Speaker 1: The floor is, the floor is the basement. The floor
[47:31] Speaker 1: is like a top five pick, and who has their pick?
[47:34] Speaker 1: Don't the Jets have their pick this year? So the
[47:36] Speaker 1: Jets are just like driving it on everybody's pick.
[47:39] Speaker 2: Yes, if you have a question of who has their pick,
[47:41] Speaker 2: you've got a good chance if you just say that
[47:43] Speaker 2: it's the New York Chats. What brings me joy for
[47:46] Speaker 2: this team the potential jumps. I think whether it's your
[47:50] Speaker 2: two year, three, year two in the system, there's a
[47:53] Speaker 2: lot of guys that you can get excited about on
[47:55] Speaker 2: this team. Tyler Warren is one of them. Tanner Bordolini
[47:58] Speaker 2: who had a really great year last year stepping into
[48:00] Speaker 2: that starting role. Jalen Travis getting it could get in
[48:03] Speaker 2: a crack at being in a starting offensive tackle for them.
[48:06] Speaker 2: Layout to Latsu, Okay, what can the potential jump that
[48:09] Speaker 2: he could.
[48:09] Speaker 1: Have this year?
[48:10] Speaker 2: I think Sauce Gardner if with this team now hopefully healthy,
[48:14] Speaker 2: you know, his second year jump here for them. Like,
[48:16] Speaker 2: there's just a lot of I couldn't say like second
[48:19] Speaker 2: year jump because sometimes it's guys who are in year two,
[48:21] Speaker 2: year three, and even maybe a little bit longer than that.
[48:23] Speaker 2: But it's these potential jumps for a lot of players
[48:28] Speaker 2: at some really important positions on this roster that give
[48:32] Speaker 2: me a lot of joy because, for as much as
[48:34] Speaker 2: it has not come together for this Colt team, the
[48:37] Speaker 2: way that that obviously like the front office and the
[48:41] Speaker 2: coaching staff would have liked. Chris Ballard is a draft
[48:44] Speaker 2: guy at heart, and and so I love sort of
[48:47] Speaker 2: always watching his process and how how serious they take
[48:50] Speaker 2: the draft and player development and getting guys who are
[48:53] Speaker 2: good fits for them and everything.
[48:54] Speaker 3: And I think there's just a handful of players that
[48:57] Speaker 3: you look.
[48:57] Speaker 2: At and you can go, man, I could realistically see
[49:00] Speaker 2: a world where you're really taking a next step up,
[49:03] Speaker 2: You're really improving your consistency, the efficiency and how you play,
[49:07] Speaker 2: the impact of how you play, whatever that is. And
[49:09] Speaker 2: I just feel as though we're sort of littered around
[49:12] Speaker 2: this roster of guys who could potentially do that. And
[49:15] Speaker 2: so it's a roster that does get me excited going
[49:17] Speaker 2: a little bit towards your point of sor the variance
[49:20] Speaker 2: and the potential high ceiling. Some people might hear a
[49:22] Speaker 2: high ceiling with the Colts and roll their eyes, But
[49:25] Speaker 2: I look at this roster and I look at a
[49:26] Speaker 2: lot of guys that have the potential to take that jump,
[49:28] Speaker 2: and if they do, yeah, we're talking about hitting maybe
[49:31] Speaker 2: a ceiling that's a little bit higher than people would
[49:32] Speaker 2: expect for this team.
[49:34] Speaker 1: I'll never forget it because I was in New Orleans
[49:37] Speaker 1: for a wedding of a friend and at that moment
[49:40] Speaker 1: in time. Last season, the Indianapolis Colts were the number
[49:44] Speaker 1: one team in the AFC, They were the number one
[49:46] Speaker 1: offense in the NFL. They were eight and two, and
[49:49] Speaker 1: they were like setting records. I mean, that's the ceiling.
[49:52] Speaker 1: And you're right when you talk about the development. I
[49:54] Speaker 1: think it's something that people should know about this roster.
[49:57] Speaker 1: We talked about them that they were a sneaky win
[49:59] Speaker 1: now team last year despite you know, the uncertainty of
[50:01] Speaker 1: quarterback going into the year, because they have so many
[50:04] Speaker 1: guys that have been there for a while and could
[50:06] Speaker 1: be taking that step up. So I'm gonna jump all
[50:08] Speaker 1: the way ahead to most important non quarterback before I
[50:11] Speaker 1: get to my joy because you mentioned Leatu lots and
[50:14] Speaker 1: I do think that is emblematic of the team in general.
[50:18] Speaker 1: I think he took a really good step as a
[50:20] Speaker 1: difference making pass rusher. Was my favorite pass rusher in
[50:23] Speaker 1: that draft, was clearly their favorite pass rusher. He was
[50:25] Speaker 1: the first defensive player at taken and he's so important
[50:29] Speaker 1: because I do think they need a little bit of
[50:31] Speaker 1: that development and juice. But the ceiling for me, is
[50:35] Speaker 1: him as a top ten edge, you know, is him
[50:37] Speaker 1: making you know, getting into the all pro mix. And
[50:41] Speaker 1: he's had such a deep bag of moves that sometimes
[50:44] Speaker 1: it takes you a little while to figure it all out.
[50:46] Speaker 1: But I think he took an important step forward and
[50:48] Speaker 1: if he can take another big step forward, that's why
[50:50] Speaker 1: I put him as my most important non quarterback.
[50:53] Speaker 2: No, I feel you that goes right into sort of
[50:55] Speaker 2: my like things go wrong. If the things go wrong,
[50:58] Speaker 2: if to me is if they don't have a finisher
[51:00] Speaker 2: on defense. That's the statement there. Because I looked up
[51:03] Speaker 2: some of the numbers from NNGS here without blitzing. Okay,
[51:06] Speaker 2: the Colts were fourth in total pressures with one hundred
[51:09] Speaker 2: and sixty last year, and they were seventh in pressure percentage,
[51:11] Speaker 2: which just over thirty three. It's prett dan good if
[51:13] Speaker 2: you're top ten in both those marks. When it comes
[51:15] Speaker 2: to pressures, however, they were just twentieth in sacks with
[51:20] Speaker 2: twenty four and they were twenty fifth in sack percentage
[51:24] Speaker 2: at just five percent. You're getting a lot of guys
[51:26] Speaker 2: that are collapse in the pocket. Hey, they're making a difference,
[51:29] Speaker 2: They're beating their guy you're just not doing it soon
[51:31] Speaker 2: enough and you're not enough of a finisher. And when
[51:33] Speaker 2: you look at this team, greg almost a fourth of
[51:35] Speaker 2: their salary cap is tied up in their secondary. Yeah,
[51:38] Speaker 2: and if you don't and if you don't have a
[51:40] Speaker 2: defensive line that can compliment the money and the talent
[51:43] Speaker 2: that you spent in the secondary, that's not going to
[51:46] Speaker 2: be good because a lot of your chips are on
[51:48] Speaker 2: the table on that defensive side of the football, especially
[51:52] Speaker 2: in the secondary there.
[51:53] Speaker 3: So you've got to have a finisher.
[51:55] Speaker 2: You have to have somebody that puts fear in the
[51:58] Speaker 2: heart of a quarterback to get rid of the ball
[52:01] Speaker 2: just a fraction of a second maybe before they want to.
[52:03] Speaker 2: And that's where that expensive and talented secondary has to
[52:06] Speaker 2: be able to capitalize with creating some turnovers. So to me,
[52:09] Speaker 2: lat Too is by far the top candidate to be
[52:13] Speaker 2: that finisher on defense and they absolutely need one this year.
[52:16] Speaker 1: Well, you know who agrees with you, Chris Ballard, And
[52:19] Speaker 1: he agreed with you so much he was ready to
[52:21] Speaker 1: sign Trey Hendrickson to a big deal. I always think
[52:25] Speaker 1: about the sliding doors moments of the offseason, and the
[52:30] Speaker 1: reports were that they had the best offer in on
[52:33] Speaker 1: Trey Hendrickson before everything fell apart with the Max Crosby trade,
[52:38] Speaker 1: which caused the Ravens, who might have been a more
[52:41] Speaker 1: attractive destination for him, to raise their offer get to
[52:44] Speaker 1: the spot, and then they kind of settle for arden Key,
[52:47] Speaker 1: and yeah, it's just not as exciting. They do have
[52:50] Speaker 1: the Forrest Buckner back. You mentioned the defensive line. He
[52:53] Speaker 1: had a neck injury that we weren't sure, a back
[52:55] Speaker 1: injury that if he was going to come back, go over.
[52:57] Speaker 1: Stewart's been there forever. But yeah, you're right to think
[53:01] Speaker 1: about that juice. That leads me into my schematic talk,
[53:05] Speaker 1: which is what's lou An Arumo gonna do? The average
[53:10] Speaker 1: fan probably forgets lou Anarumo, who is with Cincinnati, got
[53:13] Speaker 1: a lot of credit for how creative his defense was.
[53:16] Speaker 1: Good coach, kind of changing what he wants to do
[53:18] Speaker 1: week after week, and I think he struggled to do
[53:21] Speaker 1: that last year with the Colts because they were just
[53:23] Speaker 1: so banged up, especially in the secondary. You thought Charvarius
[53:26] Speaker 1: Ward was going to be a difference maker. He was
[53:29] Speaker 1: never on the field. He is back for this team
[53:32] Speaker 1: next year. You trade for Sauce Gardner and you think, okay,
[53:36] Speaker 1: maybe that can unlock us being a little more creative
[53:38] Speaker 1: week after week. He gets hurt immediately and so with
[53:42] Speaker 1: a little more health upfront, you didn't have Buckner really
[53:46] Speaker 1: either last year. You have a young player in CJ.
[53:50] Speaker 1: Allen as your middle linebacker. Can these guys learn what
[53:55] Speaker 1: lou wants to do enough for him to change the
[53:58] Speaker 1: plan week after week, because I think that's the best
[54:00] Speaker 1: version of the Colts defense. Maybe it's not the first
[54:03] Speaker 1: section of the season, but he does not want to
[54:05] Speaker 1: be like Damiko Ryanson just rushing for He wants to
[54:09] Speaker 1: change what he's going to do on a week to
[54:10] Speaker 1: week basis.
[54:12] Speaker 2: Yeah, and it is tough with leaning on a lot
[54:14] Speaker 2: of younger guys to be able to do that. Albeit
[54:16] Speaker 2: I like the younger guys, right, I like CJ. All
[54:18] Speaker 2: and I like AJ Halsey. These are guys who are
[54:20] Speaker 2: going to be a part of the mix for them.
[54:22] Speaker 2: But you're right there, should it go on to my scheme,
[54:25] Speaker 2: dream is on the offensive side of the ball going
[54:28] Speaker 2: to go to that next pace? Okay, so this kind
[54:30] Speaker 2: of ties into my most important non QB for this
[54:33] Speaker 2: team as well, And that's just the emphasis that Tyler
[54:36] Speaker 2: Warren could be for this offense. Tyler Warren was everything
[54:39] Speaker 2: for them. It felt like last year he led the
[54:41] Speaker 2: team in open target percentage. Last year he also had
[54:45] Speaker 2: the highest snap count of anybody on offense that didn't
[54:47] Speaker 2: play quarterback or offensive line. So they had this guy
[54:51] Speaker 2: on the field all the time. If Alec Peerce is
[54:54] Speaker 2: limited at all, whatsoever. Okay, we're looking at a receiving
[54:58] Speaker 2: group that is Josh Down, Ashton, Dulan, Lakwan Treadwell, Anthony Gould,
[55:05] Speaker 2: and then you get the tight ends into the mix,
[55:07] Speaker 2: and I think Warren's just gonna be the biggest part
[55:09] Speaker 2: of that, right. Not only would Warren like take that
[55:12] Speaker 2: next step there anyways, now you don't have Michael Pittman Jr.
[55:17] Speaker 2: So a lot of I think those like red zone
[55:20] Speaker 2: X type of like plays like you could put him
[55:23] Speaker 2: on the line of Scrimmage's exactly.
[55:24] Speaker 1: What he was.
[55:24] Speaker 3: And the scheme dream for me with Warren is go watch.
[55:30] Speaker 2: The Penn State tape and just do a lot of
[55:32] Speaker 2: that stuff because that stuff was so much fun Warren
[55:35] Speaker 2: was at Penn State. Warren was an inline tight end.
[55:39] Speaker 2: He was a wingback tight end. He played in the slot.
[55:41] Speaker 2: They play him as an X, they play him as
[55:43] Speaker 2: part of the top of the triangle. Whenever there was
[55:45] Speaker 2: a bunch formation, they'd put him in at full back.
[55:47] Speaker 2: He played wildcat quarterback for them at the goal line
[55:50] Speaker 2: and on short yarded situations. He played fifty nine snaps
[55:53] Speaker 2: in the backfield last season. He played three snaps at
[55:55] Speaker 2: quarterback last season as well. I just hope that there
[55:58] Speaker 2: is a world where they look at Tyler Warren and
[56:00] Speaker 2: just say, hey, Swiss army knife, we can do so
[56:02] Speaker 2: many different things with this player. He's built like it,
[56:05] Speaker 2: He's got the athleticism for it. He could take the hits,
[56:07] Speaker 2: he could dish out hits like he could just truly
[56:09] Speaker 2: do it all. I love Tyler Warren when he was
[56:11] Speaker 2: coming out. I love this spot for him in Shane
[56:13] Speaker 2: Stikeen's offense, and I just hope that they continue to
[56:16] Speaker 2: lean into that creativity of all of the different ways
[56:19] Speaker 2: that you could utilize a player who has his skill set.
[56:22] Speaker 2: I'm a big Tyler Warren guy, and so Claire, I
[56:24] Speaker 2: really hope sous I love to see more from him
[56:26] Speaker 2: this year.
[56:27] Speaker 1: He landed in the right spot. I'm so confident that
[56:29] Speaker 1: that can happen, because I think we saw it last
[56:31] Speaker 1: the first five or six weeks of last season. At
[56:34] Speaker 1: some point, you know, whether it was physically he took
[56:37] Speaker 1: on a little water, there was injuries around him. Then
[56:39] Speaker 1: the Daniel Jones injury happens. The creativity kind of started
[56:43] Speaker 1: dimming as the season went along, but we saw a
[56:45] Speaker 1: lot of that Penn State type of usage early. I
[56:48] Speaker 1: think he landed in the perfect spot. And I do
[56:51] Speaker 1: wonder without you know, Alec Pierce practicing at training camp
[56:57] Speaker 1: and you mentioned the lack of depth at wide receiver
[57:00] Speaker 1: in general, so you have Josh Downs playing outside at
[57:03] Speaker 1: training camp a little bit more than you want, Like
[57:05] Speaker 1: they're probably working on a lot of Tyler Warren stuff,
[57:07] Speaker 1: which which is what was bringing me joy, and it's
[57:09] Speaker 1: all connected to me. This is a team where the
[57:12] Speaker 1: things go wrong if and bringing me joy is connected,
[57:14] Speaker 1: because what's bringing me joy is just the pure speed
[57:19] Speaker 1: and explosiveness from the skill guys. If it all goes right, Pierce,
[57:24] Speaker 1: Josh Downs, who I love, Tyler Warren and Jonathan Taylor
[57:27] Speaker 1: with a really good offensive line and a really creative
[57:30] Speaker 1: play caller. I mean that that's cooking with gas. That
[57:34] Speaker 1: is enough. I know you lost Pittman, Butman not really
[57:37] Speaker 1: an explosive player that that is going to keep defensive
[57:40] Speaker 1: coordinators up at night. But it connects to my things
[57:44] Speaker 1: go wrong if like the injuries and just the variance
[57:48] Speaker 1: of this team is off the charts. Downs is a
[57:50] Speaker 1: is a variance player. Daniel Jones, who's looked very good
[57:54] Speaker 1: in training camp based on what the expectations would be
[57:57] Speaker 1: for his achilles, is an extreme variance player even if
[58:01] Speaker 1: he's healthy and he's coming off inn Achilles. Pierce is
[58:04] Speaker 1: now coming off a serious injury. I don't think he's
[58:07] Speaker 1: a variance player, but he is like not a every
[58:09] Speaker 1: down I'm gonna just like catch an eight yard slant
[58:12] Speaker 1: type of player. And then Buckner with the injury ward
[58:14] Speaker 1: coming off an injury on the defense, CJ. Allen, who
[58:17] Speaker 1: I loved, is a little bit of an up and
[58:19] Speaker 1: down player. It's just like, Man, I can see how
[58:23] Speaker 1: you and Chris Ballard could see the best case scenario
[58:26] Speaker 1: of this team, and yet like there's a lot of
[58:29] Speaker 1: downside for a lot of their key players too. So
[58:31] Speaker 1: I almost don't know what to think about the team,
[58:33] Speaker 1: But it makes them exciting to watch.
[58:35] Speaker 3: That makes me curious is good.
[58:36] Speaker 2: I'm wondering what your ceiling is for them when you
[58:38] Speaker 2: talked about like the variance and everything, like, what's the
[58:41] Speaker 2: ceiling that you see for the.
[58:42] Speaker 1: Gold It's tough in this division, but we saw it
[58:46] Speaker 1: last year. I think it's last year them taking that
[58:49] Speaker 1: step forward. It's like them winning the division. It's them
[58:52] Speaker 1: having a home playoff game or two. I don't see
[58:54] Speaker 1: them in the Super Bowl, like eventually they get picked
[58:56] Speaker 1: off by a better team. But I do think they're
[58:58] Speaker 1: a conference championship game type of ceiling because we kind
[59:01] Speaker 1: of saw it. Hey, I think we saw it last year,
[59:03] Speaker 1: and yet the floor to me is like you're one
[59:06] Speaker 1: of the worst six or eight teams in the league.
[59:07] Speaker 1: I think they might be the highest variance team in
[59:09] Speaker 1: the entire NFL.
[59:11] Speaker 2: So I have the floor for this team is five
[59:14] Speaker 2: and twelve, and I feel like you get like a
[59:17] Speaker 2: whole regime change type of thing going on here with
[59:19] Speaker 2: them at five and twelve. The ceiling, I think because
[59:22] Speaker 2: they were eight and nine last year. I think the
[59:24] Speaker 2: ceiling for this team I have ten and seven and
[59:26] Speaker 2: a wild card, and I don't totally disagree with with
[59:30] Speaker 2: if they make it to the postseason, winning a game
[59:34] Speaker 2: or two there, Like, I could potentially see that if
[59:36] Speaker 2: because obviously, if they make it to the postseason, if
[59:37] Speaker 2: they're winning double digit games, things are panning out for them.
[59:40] Speaker 2: The tough thing for them is I hate their schedule.
[59:45] Speaker 2: Their schedule starts out Baltimore at Kansas City, Houston Texans
[59:52] Speaker 2: International game against Washington, and then at Pittsburgh.
[59:57] Speaker 3: Like, those are the first five.
[59:58] Speaker 2: Games they came I think is I think that that's
[1:00:02] Speaker 2: not okay. I think that's pretty not ideal for them.
[1:00:05] Speaker 2: And then they also don't have a bye week until
[1:00:07] Speaker 2: week thirteen. Okay, so that's and then and then wait, wait,
[1:00:11] Speaker 2: I forgot this part of it. So you go Baltimore
[1:00:14] Speaker 2: at Kansas City home versus Texas International, so you got
[1:00:18] Speaker 2: an international game against Washington, and then you go on.
[1:00:22] Speaker 3: The road against Pittsburgh. Yeah, hosting the Tennessee Titans. Yeah,
[1:00:25] Speaker 3: on the road a Minnesota on the road to Jacksonville.
[1:00:28] Speaker 1: Okay.
[1:00:28] Speaker 3: That is a brutal first eight weeks of the season.
[1:00:31] Speaker 1: Right for argument's sake, that is about as hard a
[1:00:36] Speaker 1: three team parlay you can play against. In the first
[1:00:39] Speaker 1: three games of the season, including Sunday Night Football in
[1:00:42] Speaker 1: Week two is interesting that the cults are there. Yeah,
[1:00:45] Speaker 1: that's tough. Ravens, Chiefs, Texans. The bright side, Yeah, two
[1:00:49] Speaker 1: of three of those are at home, so if you're
[1:00:50] Speaker 1: ever going to beat one of you know, let's even
[1:00:53] Speaker 1: put them at one and two. There. Look the Commander's game, Yeah,
[1:00:56] Speaker 1: it's it's overseas, but that's a road game, so you
[1:00:58] Speaker 1: kind of like playing you know, that's a new game
[1:01:00] Speaker 1: that is sneaky a road game, So that that actually
[1:01:03] Speaker 1: you could look at as a positive where one of
[1:01:05] Speaker 1: your road games is overseas when it's really like a neutral.
[1:01:09] Speaker 1: And then you know at Pittsburgh, Tennessee, those that's three
[1:01:12] Speaker 1: winnable games Commanders, Steelers, Titans in a row, and at
[1:01:15] Speaker 1: Minnesota that yeah, they're all in the same tier. Like it.
[1:01:18] Speaker 1: It's fine, it's fine. But to our overall point to
[1:01:22] Speaker 1: circle back around, the AFC South is a much tougher
[1:01:28] Speaker 1: in division schedule. I even think the Titans will be
[1:01:31] Speaker 1: better this year. And then the out of yeah, the
[1:01:35] Speaker 1: out of division schedule I would say is average. You know,
[1:01:39] Speaker 1: you face the NFC East, which I actually think is
[1:01:42] Speaker 1: is a decent division play. You face the AFC North,
[1:01:45] Speaker 1: which is a relatively tough division to play, It's somewhere
[1:01:48] Speaker 1: in the middle. So the schedule, which usually the AFC
[1:01:51] Speaker 1: South could kind of dine on easy schedules, but now
[1:01:54] Speaker 1: that it's better as a division and out of the
[1:01:56] Speaker 1: division overall, I think it's like an average schedule overall
[1:01:59] Speaker 1: and maybe particularly hard. To your point for the Indianapolis Colts,
[1:02:03] Speaker 1: I think I you're not buying it.
[1:02:04] Speaker 3: I think I think.
[1:02:05] Speaker 2: I think I believe in Jayden Daniels and uh Kyler
[1:02:09] Speaker 2: Murray a little bit more in those first eight games
[1:02:12] Speaker 2: than you. Okay, I'm scared. I'm scared, Greg, I'm scared
[1:02:14] Speaker 2: of the first eight games.
[1:02:15] Speaker 1: That's fair.
[1:02:16] Speaker 3: They're scaring me.
[1:02:18] Speaker 1: I do get scared about a situation where people could
[1:02:20] Speaker 1: get fired and it's just bad vibes. We've kind of been,
[1:02:24] Speaker 1: you know, with the position with Jordan Rodrigue, you know,
[1:02:26] Speaker 1: being a big influence on this. Take that. Yeah, maybe
[1:02:29] Speaker 1: Stichen would be a little safer long term is like
[1:02:33] Speaker 1: I would certainly hope then Chris Ballard. But you know,
[1:02:37] Speaker 1: you start out one and six, everything's on the on
[1:02:39] Speaker 1: the board. Look, I'm not I'm not gonna say that
[1:02:43] Speaker 1: it was like an undefeated start for us, but I
[1:02:45] Speaker 1: think we put out like a five and two if
[1:02:47] Speaker 1: that was our first you know, seven schedule. We went
[1:02:50] Speaker 1: five and two.
[1:02:51] Speaker 3: Okay, I'm cool with that. I'm cool with five and two.
[1:02:54] Speaker 1: What a first time guest. As I said Trevor Sikkima,
[1:02:58] Speaker 1: you can check them out to tell them, like, are
[1:03:00] Speaker 1: you back now with like with the shows with the
[1:03:03] Speaker 1: stock Exchange you're doing.
[1:03:04] Speaker 2: Yes, yes, So had a little bit of a vacation
[1:03:08] Speaker 2: hiatus there for myself, my coast Connor Rodgers, him and
[1:03:11] Speaker 2: his wife had their first baby.
[1:03:14] Speaker 3: They had a son, So there's.
[1:03:15] Speaker 2: You know, you know, it happens a little a little
[1:03:18] Speaker 2: less time for podcasting, as any parent out there would
[1:03:21] Speaker 2: would understand. So, but yes, we're finishing up previewing all
[1:03:26] Speaker 2: of the positions for the twenty twenty six college football season,
[1:03:30] Speaker 2: mainly for the twenty twenty seven NFL Draft. And look,
[1:03:34] Speaker 2: I know a lot of people say the grass sagreener, right,
[1:03:36] Speaker 2: Everybody's like, I'll just wait till next year. I'll just
[1:03:38] Speaker 2: wait till next year's class twenty twenty seven rules. I mean,
[1:03:41] Speaker 2: there's so many quarterbacks and skill position players and like
[1:03:43] Speaker 2: there's just so many good players in that twenty twenty
[1:03:46] Speaker 2: seven class. So it so far with my summer scouting
[1:03:50] Speaker 2: study of it, it is as advertised, So yes, come
[1:03:52] Speaker 2: hang out with us on the NFL Stock Exchange channel
[1:03:55] Speaker 2: on YouTube.
[1:03:55] Speaker 1: I should have mentioned, yeah, I'm not a draft nick,
[1:03:58] Speaker 1: but I do your program one of the best out
[1:04:02] Speaker 1: there of just going to school early, kind of putting
[1:04:04] Speaker 1: in that early work before the NFL season starts to
[1:04:07] Speaker 1: like know about this college class. So that's what they're
[1:04:10] Speaker 1: doing over there here. And yeah, I don't think I'm
[1:04:13] Speaker 1: speaking out of school to say this will not be
[1:04:15] Speaker 1: the last appearance on NFL Daily knocked it out of
[1:04:17] Speaker 1: the park. Thank you to Trevor big Week on the show.
[1:04:23] Speaker 1: We are going to be coming to you from RAMS
[1:04:26] Speaker 1: Training Camp. We have some big time guests at Sean McVay.
[1:04:31] Speaker 1: You cannot back out now. At this point, I'm saying
[1:04:33] Speaker 1: Sean McVay has agreed to come on the show. So
[1:04:35] Speaker 1: that'll be our next show. You'll hear from us at
[1:04:37] Speaker 1: RAMS Training Camp with Sean McVay. See you that

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