# NFL Daily 32: Ranking Quarterbacks

An episode of [NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/680904259), 1 Jul 2026, 1 h 55 min.

Audio: https://pdrl.fm/91be81/podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/claritaspod.com/measure/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/9ce11dad-e86a-444f-ba83-ae27003475be/124ff225-4aec-446c-98ff-b4750130856a/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=deff018f-4b51-4501-937c-ae27003475d1

Gregg Rosenthal and Jon Ledyard rank the top 32 quarterbacks heading into the 2026 NFL season. Find out who the guys rank number one, where the likes of Joe Burrow, Patrick Mahomes, Josh Allen and Matthew Stafford are ranked, which teams don't have a quarterback in the top 32 and more! NFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcasts See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:04] Speaker 1: Welcome to NFL Daily, where the entire offseason has been leading.
[0:08] Speaker 2: To this very show. I'm Greg Rosenthal.
[0:11] Speaker 1: I am joined by our friend John Ledyard from across
[0:15] Speaker 1: the country, taking a break from his day job to
[0:19] Speaker 1: break down the best quarterbacks in the NFL.
[0:22] Speaker 2: Tongue in cheek a little.
[0:23] Speaker 1: Bit that the whole often season's been leading to this,
[0:26] Speaker 1: but this is our last show, John, before the fourth
[0:28] Speaker 1: of July break. We've been doing our NFL Daily thirty
[0:32] Speaker 1: two and we've led to quarterbacks the one I think
[0:36] Speaker 1: you know a lot of people we've been waiting for.
[0:39] Speaker 1: No one I would rather talk about the position than
[0:41] Speaker 1: with you.
[0:42] Speaker 3: I appreciate you, Greg, thank you for having me on.
[0:44] Speaker 3: I'm excited to talk about this position group. I feel
[0:48] Speaker 3: like this is the position group that you pulled me
[0:50] Speaker 3: away from. Any like hot takes I might have, I
[0:53] Speaker 3: have a lot of them in other positions. I will
[0:55] Speaker 3: be so curious. I think there are a couple quarterbacks
[0:58] Speaker 3: that it's like, where are we on these guys, Like,
[1:00] Speaker 3: are we like full fledged belief mode even though we
[1:03] Speaker 3: everyone most people would agree we haven't seen it to
[1:05] Speaker 3: that level yet, or we kind of like, let's hold
[1:08] Speaker 3: the line until we get more of a sample size
[1:10] Speaker 3: of excellence from a couple of guys. But other than that,
[1:13] Speaker 3: I think we're sort of in a like window where
[1:15] Speaker 3: it's not that controversial right now with this vision. But
[1:17] Speaker 3: maybe I'll be proven wrong today.
[1:19] Speaker 1: I think that's right in the sense that I think
[1:22] Speaker 1: there's more good to solid starting quarterbacks than any time
[1:27] Speaker 1: since I've been covering the league. It really hits me
[1:29] Speaker 1: doing this exercise that you can go twenty deep with
[1:33] Speaker 1: guys that are pretty good, and then you can have
[1:36] Speaker 1: a number of more promising players after that. It wasn't
[1:39] Speaker 1: always like that. There's this idea that there was some
[1:41] Speaker 1: golden age of quarterbacks. No, it used to fall off
[1:43] Speaker 1: pretty hard after you know, five or twelve or fifteen.
[1:46] Speaker 1: And so we'll get into who we think should be
[1:49] Speaker 1: a top our list, but just for parameters for everyone listening,
[1:52] Speaker 1: it's similar to the rest of the NFL Daily thirty
[1:54] Speaker 1: two series. We are drafting based on who we would
[1:58] Speaker 1: want for twenty twenty six alone, so it's not a
[2:01] Speaker 1: long term, you know, bet, And also we can have
[2:05] Speaker 1: multiple quarterbacks from the same team. Just guessing could be wrong.
[2:09] Speaker 1: There might not be a Cleveland Brown drafted today. So
[2:12] Speaker 1: there's some teams that maybe won't have any quarterbacks and
[2:15] Speaker 1: some teams that could have two. John, I've been giving
[2:18] Speaker 1: our guests the first pick, so I will give that
[2:22] Speaker 1: to you. And for people who aren't familiar, John's joined
[2:24] Speaker 1: the show before, but he is Ali Connolly's great co
[2:27] Speaker 1: host on their podcasts together, The Read Optional. He does
[2:32] Speaker 1: great work on Substack, so everyone check out John Ledyard
[2:36] Speaker 1: there and they combined for one of the best NFL
[2:39] Speaker 1: podcasts out there. And now a lot of pressure on you,
[2:42] Speaker 1: John with the first over.
[2:44] Speaker 3: Thanks for the kind words and the kind intro there.
[2:47] Speaker 3: Number one pick. This is a lot of pressure, and
[2:49] Speaker 3: I think what I'm gonna do is go a little bit.
[2:53] Speaker 3: Maybe this is oscrip. You tell me, and I don't
[2:55] Speaker 3: think I would say that. It's pretty like going away
[2:58] Speaker 3: from Patrick brohomes here two largely I think would be
[3:02] Speaker 3: a tough move. But I am going to go with
[3:03] Speaker 3: Josh Allen first. Overall, I think here, I think there's
[3:05] Speaker 3: a lot of guys in this tier though. That's how
[3:08] Speaker 3: I'd start My preface about this position is that Tier
[3:11] Speaker 3: one might be a little more crowded. There's more conversation
[3:14] Speaker 3: for other guys than there's been in a while where
[3:15] Speaker 3: I think for a couple of years we've seen it
[3:17] Speaker 3: mostly Lamar Jackson and Josh Allen and Patrick Mahomes and
[3:20] Speaker 3: then perhaps Joe Burrow if he's a healthy season, it's
[3:23] Speaker 3: usually Joe Burrow. If he's not outthy, everybody starts talking
[3:25] Speaker 3: about how he's not on that level. But those guys
[3:28] Speaker 3: have typically been like still at the top, and well,
[3:30] Speaker 3: I still think they're all in that conversation. I think
[3:32] Speaker 3: there's probably other names that we can throw in that
[3:34] Speaker 3: we're going to discuss. So it's a little more contentious
[3:36] Speaker 3: for this top spot. I think that it's been in
[3:37] Speaker 3: the past. The reason I go to Josh Allen, who
[3:40] Speaker 3: I know hasn't done it in the playoffs at the
[3:41] Speaker 3: level Mahomes has. But I think it's been a little
[3:43] Speaker 3: bit better the last couple of seasons is I think
[3:46] Speaker 3: the team built around him has actually been the least
[3:50] Speaker 3: helpful of the top guys, you know, the consensus top guys,
[3:52] Speaker 3: typical top guys. They've certainly had some good things. None
[3:55] Speaker 3: of these situations are just absolute disasters. So I don't
[3:57] Speaker 3: mean to paint it that way, but I would say
[3:59] Speaker 3: the situation around and whether you're looking at pass catcher
[4:01] Speaker 3: or even if you're looking at just overall offensive dominance,
[4:06] Speaker 3: like ability to dominate in lots of different situations. Their
[4:08] Speaker 3: offense has been in which when their team was at
[4:11] Speaker 3: their best, they had more of a building. That way,
[4:13] Speaker 3: they were able to be a team that beat different
[4:16] Speaker 3: types of defenses at a higher level. And certainly in
[4:18] Speaker 3: the regular season they've still had their share of success.
[4:20] Speaker 3: But I just think if you look at some of
[4:22] Speaker 3: their players, like there's some solid players in their offensive line, Obviously,
[4:25] Speaker 3: losing Aaron Kromer as an offensive line coach, I think
[4:27] Speaker 3: is going to affect them a lot too. So there
[4:29] Speaker 3: was like enough kind of bastions of the Bills of
[4:32] Speaker 3: a couple of years ago to survive year to year.
[4:34] Speaker 3: And they still have some good players, but he's not
[4:36] Speaker 3: surrounded by a lot of other all world types of
[4:39] Speaker 3: players on that offense. And so yet I think he's
[4:41] Speaker 3: been as good as any quarterback in the league. And
[4:43] Speaker 3: I know in the playoffs that matters too, And I
[4:45] Speaker 3: think he's rarely been the reason that they've just kind
[4:49] Speaker 3: of fallen off in those moments. They've frankly been pretty
[4:51] Speaker 3: unlucky in some moments in the playoffs, and also they've
[4:54] Speaker 3: hurt themselves some times too, But I think it he's
[4:57] Speaker 3: clearly in the conversation, and for me just think I
[4:59] Speaker 3: think he might still be closer to the peak of
[5:01] Speaker 3: his powers than maybe mahomes is, although watch to see
[5:04] Speaker 3: how he comes back from the injury.
[5:05] Speaker 1: So we'll have some trends with these rankings. And one
[5:09] Speaker 1: thing I got to thinking going through writing these names
[5:13] Speaker 1: down is the very top of the league, which I
[5:16] Speaker 1: think it's been pretty stable for a while, aren't coming
[5:19] Speaker 1: off their best seasons. To me, Josh Allen was an
[5:21] Speaker 1: easy number one.
[5:22] Speaker 2: I thought.
[5:23] Speaker 1: You know, I know, MVP votes aren't the most perfect
[5:26] Speaker 1: measure of a player, but the fact that he's third, fifth, first,
[5:30] Speaker 1: and third over the last four years, that just shows
[5:32] Speaker 1: the type of consistency you mentioned the playoffs, where his
[5:35] Speaker 1: play in general has only gone up. Then again, his
[5:39] Speaker 1: QBR last year, like was his lowest since twenty nineteen.
[5:43] Speaker 1: There were some ups and downs during the regular season.
[5:45] Speaker 1: He's very often had little dips in the regular season,
[5:48] Speaker 1: but the overall picture is great. You know, he's fifth
[5:51] Speaker 1: in yards percent. Some of the numbers were down, he
[5:54] Speaker 1: took more sacks. Certainly last year, I do think you
[5:56] Speaker 1: can fault the surroundings that he had, but over to me, actually,
[6:01] Speaker 1: he was a pretty easy number one, and I think
[6:04] Speaker 1: the playoffs are a good microcosm of what he can do.
[6:07] Speaker 1: The Jaguars game was just absolutely electric, almost a perfect game,
[6:10] Speaker 1: and then the Broncos game had a little bit of everything.
[6:12] Speaker 1: There are great scrambles and then there's a disaster scramble
[6:15] Speaker 1: from him doing too much that you know, helped to
[6:18] Speaker 1: lead to a turnover.
[6:19] Speaker 2: His short game is way better.
[6:21] Speaker 1: I think he's matured in terms of how he gets
[6:23] Speaker 1: rid of the ball, and he's so much more accurate.
[6:26] Speaker 2: We've obviously talked about that.
[6:27] Speaker 1: And he didn't have the weapons deep last year, so
[6:29] Speaker 1: he didn't use the weapons deep as the lowest air
[6:32] Speaker 1: yards for him, you know, per row for a season
[6:35] Speaker 1: by far. But in the end, he puts up all
[6:37] Speaker 1: those points on that Broncos defense that should have been
[6:41] Speaker 1: good enough to win that game. And it's one of
[6:44] Speaker 1: two Bills playoff trips where I really will look back
[6:47] Speaker 1: and think, man, they should have been in the super
[6:49] Speaker 1: Bowl that in two of those seasons, and this is
[6:51] Speaker 1: one of them.
[6:53] Speaker 3: Yeah, no doubt They've had a lot of opportunities to
[6:55] Speaker 3: look back on that way, and that's maybe the story
[6:58] Speaker 3: of the Buffalo franchise in some way. But I still
[7:01] Speaker 3: feel like with him, don't you feel like they've got
[7:03] Speaker 3: kind of as good a shot as anybody in terms
[7:05] Speaker 3: of you, because you're right, all these guys are not
[7:07] Speaker 3: coming off maybe their best season and even some of
[7:09] Speaker 3: their teams team building wise, there's more questions around the Ravens,
[7:13] Speaker 3: the Chiefs, the Bills like that. I mean, change is
[7:16] Speaker 3: a coach like changes? Could there be changes above them
[7:19] Speaker 3: at some point? Like there's more questions around the structure
[7:22] Speaker 3: of the franchise, and there's been really over the last
[7:24] Speaker 3: couple of years for all these guys. And yet I
[7:26] Speaker 3: think that if you're just saying, Okay, which quarterback would
[7:29] Speaker 3: I want to go into battle with? Out of all
[7:30] Speaker 3: these guys. There's certainly arguments for all of them. That's
[7:32] Speaker 3: why they're in the same tier. But I think Allen's
[7:34] Speaker 3: multi tool skill set would be the way that I
[7:36] Speaker 3: would go, Which, by the way, isn't it insane that
[7:38] Speaker 3: we're talking about Josh Allen best quarterback in the league.
[7:40] Speaker 3: I always been in that conversation for a while, but
[7:42] Speaker 3: like you're saying, easy number one of the league, he
[7:46] Speaker 3: wasn't even good in college. It's just like, yeah, the
[7:48] Speaker 3: craziest round. I'll never get over the rise of power.
[7:51] Speaker 2: It is absolutely true.
[7:52] Speaker 1: And I was slow to accept the new world order
[7:55] Speaker 1: we've been living in. And yet as someone who loves
[7:58] Speaker 1: Mahomes and I'm not taking them with them too because
[8:00] Speaker 1: he's coming off of this injury. You're making a face there,
[8:04] Speaker 1: but it is strange to feel that. I think, just
[8:07] Speaker 1: on balance, Alan has been the best guy. He's so
[8:11] Speaker 1: good that we didn't even mention that. Know, him running
[8:14] Speaker 1: the ball is essentially the most efficient play in football
[8:16] Speaker 1: for five straight seasons. So my number two pick, and
[8:19] Speaker 1: this was very difficult because again I'm with you that
[8:22] Speaker 1: this is a pretty big tier of five six guys,
[8:26] Speaker 1: and because of Mahomes' injury, I actually would take Lamar
[8:30] Speaker 1: Jackson as my second pick. If I was judging just
[8:34] Speaker 1: off last season, you know he would be much lower.
[8:37] Speaker 1: He was a different player in twenty twenty five. He
[8:39] Speaker 1: was not as elusive. He took a ton of sacks
[8:41] Speaker 1: when he was pressured. There weren't as many wow runs.
[8:44] Speaker 1: I'm going negative here to start to just build my case.
[8:49] Speaker 1: But the thing that really worried me was that there
[8:51] Speaker 1: weren't as many wow throws. Despite all that, he was
[8:56] Speaker 1: still a top ten quarterback in terms of QBR, is
[9:00] Speaker 1: still great against man coverage. It was a lot more
[9:02] Speaker 1: play action, which was weird but was fun to see. Ultimately,
[9:07] Speaker 1: he's like the all time NFL leader in adjusted yards
[9:10] Speaker 1: per attempt And I'm not a big QB rating guy,
[9:12] Speaker 1: but he is the all.
[9:13] Speaker 2: Time leader in that.
[9:15] Speaker 1: You know, he's been top two MVP three times the
[9:18] Speaker 1: other four seasons. It's worth noting like he didn't get
[9:20] Speaker 1: a vote and he eating missed four games in three
[9:23] Speaker 1: of the last five seasons. That's kind of the basic
[9:26] Speaker 1: argument the eyeball test to me is he still in
[9:30] Speaker 1: the middle of his prime. Last year was a really
[9:32] Speaker 1: down year. It's a contract situation, not that he wouldn't
[9:35] Speaker 1: be motivated every single season, but I like the direction
[9:39] Speaker 1: their offense is going to take, and I'm looking at
[9:42] Speaker 1: the total balance of his career and still considering him
[9:45] Speaker 1: smack in the middle of his prime, and the fact
[9:47] Speaker 1: that Mahomes is coming off this injury is enough for
[9:50] Speaker 1: me to look at the rest of the quarterbacks and
[9:53] Speaker 1: think no one's done enough for me to pass Lamar
[9:55] Speaker 1: Jackson on my overall list, And so I'm still going
[9:57] Speaker 1: to put Lamar number two.
[9:58] Speaker 2: What do you think?
[10:00] Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's totally valid. I mean, he's obviously
[10:03] Speaker 3: in that conversation he was three for me. But I
[10:05] Speaker 3: mean I also went back and forth between me and Mahomes.
[10:07] Speaker 3: You know, obviously Mahomes the injury, how do you dig
[10:09] Speaker 3: that into account. I'm a little bit worried about Lamar
[10:13] Speaker 3: and just how much his body's gonna hold up. But
[10:16] Speaker 3: I've also been here before in twenty twenty one, I
[10:18] Speaker 3: believe it was We're a little bit Ooh, what's that
[10:20] Speaker 3: going to look like? Moving forward with him? Like is
[10:22] Speaker 3: he going to be able to stay healthy? The way
[10:24] Speaker 3: that he plays and his adaptability is probably one of
[10:27] Speaker 3: the more underrated aspects of who he is as a player.
[10:30] Speaker 3: His ability to more from one system under Greg Roman
[10:33] Speaker 3: to a new system under Todd Munkin, and different things
[10:36] Speaker 3: that they asked him to do. He's always been a
[10:38] Speaker 3: more complete player than he's billed as. And I think
[10:41] Speaker 3: his ability to I mean, for a while, he was
[10:43] Speaker 3: like his rushing was as threatening as his passing and
[10:46] Speaker 3: then he just moved away from that, not being that
[10:48] Speaker 3: type of player anymore, and he's still like a great athlete,
[10:51] Speaker 3: but he just changed his style to protect himself more
[10:54] Speaker 3: after that season, and you get way less of those moments.
[10:57] Speaker 3: So I think that part of it for him, I mean,
[10:59] Speaker 3: is a big plus in his favor. I would say
[11:02] Speaker 3: he's you can make a case also though I think
[11:05] Speaker 3: the coaching situation has been better. Their talent's also fallen
[11:09] Speaker 3: off a little bit in Baltimore, and he's not necessarily
[11:11] Speaker 3: been surrounded by elite guys either, and last year the
[11:14] Speaker 3: offensive line play really knows dived, So I'm really curious
[11:17] Speaker 3: to see him in the new system. Could be an
[11:19] Speaker 3: MVP caliber season again for him, the way that he
[11:21] Speaker 3: just when you think maybe he's on his downside, the
[11:23] Speaker 3: way he bounces back, because he is such an adaptable player. Yeah, definitely,
[11:27] Speaker 3: clearly in this conversation, no doubt.
[11:30] Speaker 1: It's partly a hunch that he's got one more great
[11:33] Speaker 1: rushing season in him still, and that to me, he's
[11:36] Speaker 1: got another MVP caliber type of season in him still,
[11:40] Speaker 1: and I think this season would make a lot of
[11:42] Speaker 1: sense for that to happen with that new system. Maybe
[11:45] Speaker 1: I'm buying the offseason hype a little too much that
[11:47] Speaker 1: he's like into Decklan Doyle and everything.
[11:49] Speaker 2: All right, you're up with three. I think you telegraph
[11:51] Speaker 2: that you're going mind.
[11:52] Speaker 3: I did tip my hands to Momes. Yeah, and I'm
[11:55] Speaker 3: still gonna go with him. Maybe I'm a coward. I
[11:57] Speaker 3: don't know, but I am sort of with you in that, Like,
[12:00] Speaker 3: has anybody really done enough to like actually sway me
[12:03] Speaker 3: off the top three? Probably not. I mean, you could
[12:06] Speaker 3: certainly make an argument, but it's mostly belief based in
[12:09] Speaker 3: Drake May. And certainly we're saying, oh, for twenty twenty six,
[12:12] Speaker 3: we don't really even know healthy Mahomes is gonna be,
[12:14] Speaker 3: Like at the beginning, I tend to think he will be,
[12:16] Speaker 3: but you know, just based on the reporting that we
[12:18] Speaker 3: do have out there, but you know, if he isn't that,
[12:20] Speaker 3: I mean, I think that does open the conversation for
[12:22] Speaker 3: Drake May. I still feel like I think the situation
[12:26] Speaker 3: around Mahomes really has been devolving for some time, and
[12:31] Speaker 3: I think that caught up with them along with his
[12:33] Speaker 3: health obviously, but I think that really caught up with
[12:36] Speaker 3: them last season to where they had basically been like
[12:39] Speaker 3: Mahomes save us for a while, I think, in a
[12:41] Speaker 3: lot of different directions, and really their star players Kelsey,
[12:45] Speaker 3: Chris Jones, Patrick Mahomes. And when those players weren't stars anymore,
[12:48] Speaker 3: couldn't be, or were injured or fall it fell off
[12:51] Speaker 3: a little bit. There was just a lot of flaws
[12:53] Speaker 3: revealed that they hadn't actually done this unbelievable job team building,
[12:57] Speaker 3: but they just had best quarterback, may be, the best
[13:00] Speaker 3: tight end, one of the best defensive tackles, best head
[13:03] Speaker 3: coach or in the conversation, best defensive coordinator in the conversation,
[13:07] Speaker 3: like their cream of the crop was like as good
[13:10] Speaker 3: as it gets basically, and then after that the rest
[13:12] Speaker 3: of things really fell off. So as soon as there
[13:14] Speaker 3: was any type of decrease there, even in terms of
[13:16] Speaker 3: ingenuity and creativity for me and you read, whatever it
[13:18] Speaker 3: might be, I think they all felt the effect of that.
[13:21] Speaker 3: To me, Mahomes is the most likely of all those
[13:24] Speaker 3: factors to still be at the peak of his power.
[13:26] Speaker 3: So if they can get to the point, I still
[13:28] Speaker 3: think it's a huge question mark. By the way, if
[13:30] Speaker 3: they can get to the point where they have rebuilt
[13:32] Speaker 3: things around him a little bit I think he's still
[13:34] Speaker 3: going to be in all these Super Bowl conversations. I
[13:36] Speaker 3: don't think many people are thinking that he's really falling off.
[13:39] Speaker 3: So maybe I'm making a case that doesn't necessarily need
[13:42] Speaker 3: to be made, but he would still be my number
[13:44] Speaker 3: three guy. But I just think what's really happened in
[13:46] Speaker 3: this top tier is you've seen the gap close between
[13:50] Speaker 3: those guys and other people entering the conversation. And I
[13:53] Speaker 3: also think we're on the precipice of perhaps a big turnover.
[13:58] Speaker 3: Maybe we'll see if it's this season or it's next,
[14:00] Speaker 3: but I think we could be on the precipice of
[14:02] Speaker 3: major change. I thought maybe we were going to get
[14:04] Speaker 3: there last year. I don't know if we quite got
[14:06] Speaker 3: there other than Drake Mayo. I'm sure we'll talk about
[14:09] Speaker 3: here soon, but I think that we could be on
[14:11] Speaker 3: the precipice of that with some of these recent QB drafts.
[14:14] Speaker 1: So I struggled with Mahomes in this exercise because for
[14:18] Speaker 1: this season, I maybe it's just my like old thinking.
[14:23] Speaker 2: I know acls aren't what they used to be, but.
[14:26] Speaker 1: I saw enough last season before the injury that it
[14:31] Speaker 1: does worry me just a little bit that he was
[14:34] Speaker 1: playing his worst football of his career, or the offense
[14:37] Speaker 1: was as bad as it was. I think he actually
[14:39] Speaker 1: played really well the first nine to ten games of
[14:41] Speaker 1: the season. But if you look down the stretch, he
[14:43] Speaker 1: had a couple performances against it was the Texans, Bills,
[14:46] Speaker 1: and Broncos, whereas like ten points, thirteen points, thirteen points,
[14:49] Speaker 1: even the game that he got hurt against the Chargers,
[14:52] Speaker 1: they were lost in that game. So those are four
[14:54] Speaker 1: playoff teams he played down the stretch, and like he
[14:57] Speaker 1: was a little lost in those games like one, you know,
[15:00] Speaker 1: fifty two percent completion, one touchdown, six interceptions.
[15:03] Speaker 2: I know those aren't the end, I'll be all.
[15:05] Speaker 1: He looked better than that, and it was the offense
[15:07] Speaker 1: collapsing around him, but it did happen at what felt
[15:10] Speaker 1: like his lowest moment as a pro, even when he
[15:14] Speaker 1: was out there healthy. So when you're comparing him and
[15:17] Speaker 1: now it's been a couple of years where the numbers
[15:19] Speaker 1: have been a little down, I'm curious when you watch
[15:22] Speaker 1: on film, like, look, the last two healthy seasons, he
[15:27] Speaker 1: was very good, but he finishes like, you know, sixth
[15:29] Speaker 1: and seventh in MVP race. It's not quite the same
[15:32] Speaker 1: like firestarter that he opens his career. Is there anything
[15:35] Speaker 1: from him specifically, not his surroundings that you see as
[15:39] Speaker 1: different or concerning compared to the quarterback you saw when
[15:42] Speaker 1: he first got into the league.
[15:43] Speaker 3: I think there's still I think he's he dis evolves
[15:46] Speaker 3: to hero mode, I would say, and there is less
[15:49] Speaker 3: around him, so that's more frequent, and I think it's
[15:52] Speaker 3: just generally a hard way to survive. He I mean,
[15:54] Speaker 3: we talked about this with Russell Wilson when we talk
[15:56] Speaker 3: about his career, and obviously Mahomes I think is a
[15:58] Speaker 3: more talented player than Russell Wilson and playing within the structure,
[16:01] Speaker 3: but when the pieces devolved around you the way they
[16:03] Speaker 3: have homes and you have to go to hero mode
[16:05] Speaker 3: more often, the recklessness starts to come out. Some of
[16:08] Speaker 3: the shots that he's taken start to come out. So
[16:10] Speaker 3: whether it's taking sacks or just in general more pressure,
[16:13] Speaker 3: drop backs, those sorts of things. I think he creates
[16:16] Speaker 3: a lot of that stuff by trying to go into
[16:18] Speaker 3: hero mode to wake up for the fact that, yeah,
[16:20] Speaker 3: they can't play against every type of defense the way
[16:22] Speaker 3: that they used to. They don't have guys that separate
[16:24] Speaker 3: against top players and coverage the way that they used to,
[16:27] Speaker 3: So he doesn't have some of the go to things
[16:30] Speaker 3: that he's had in the past in the structure of
[16:32] Speaker 3: the offense, so they've had to adapt, So he's had
[16:35] Speaker 3: to adapt by playing more hero ball, and in general
[16:38] Speaker 3: their offense has lacked explosiveness in the past game. And
[16:41] Speaker 3: then the biggest thing is the run game also not
[16:44] Speaker 3: being so he's not able to do much off of
[16:46] Speaker 3: the run game, which now, especially as the league's evolved,
[16:49] Speaker 3: right the Chiefs were like at the peak of their
[16:50] Speaker 3: powers and all these RPOs and right running this offense
[16:53] Speaker 3: from the gun and like that was really efficient for them.
[16:55] Speaker 3: When they go under center, they just have not had
[16:57] Speaker 3: a great offense. And that's just a really hard way
[16:59] Speaker 3: to life because everybody right now the last couple of
[17:02] Speaker 3: years is building these really successful offenses for the most part,
[17:05] Speaker 3: has this big under center game, and the Chiefs haven't
[17:07] Speaker 3: been able to be consistently dominant in that capacity. So
[17:10] Speaker 3: some of that's affected him and just the overall ability
[17:13] Speaker 3: of him to play with instructure. When you think about
[17:15] Speaker 3: going under center and pure dropback football, you're thinking a
[17:18] Speaker 3: lot about structured passing attack, and that's just not been
[17:22] Speaker 3: where the chief The Chiefs just haven't had the talent
[17:24] Speaker 3: to be able to do it. I don't think they've
[17:25] Speaker 3: even had the coaching to be honest, to be able
[17:27] Speaker 3: to evolve. And I think that can be in there,
[17:29] Speaker 3: but it just hasn't been, and he suffered as a
[17:31] Speaker 3: result of that, and some of his worst tendencies have
[17:33] Speaker 3: come out.
[17:34] Speaker 1: He's such an interesting career arc right now, and the
[17:36] Speaker 1: longer it's gone on, I started to think, could he
[17:39] Speaker 1: have like a Dan Marino like career art? Because I've
[17:43] Speaker 1: said about Mahomes since the day he entered the league,
[17:45] Speaker 1: this is the best player I've ever seen enter the league.
[17:46] Speaker 1: It's the best quarterback I've ever seen enter the league
[17:48] Speaker 1: in terms of what he is producing on the field
[17:51] Speaker 1: from the minute he started playing. And then I started
[17:54] Speaker 1: to thinking, over the last twenty years, who's had an
[17:55] Speaker 1: arc like this where it's now a three year period
[17:58] Speaker 1: where it is it's still completely excellent, but it's down
[18:03] Speaker 1: a little bit like Manning and Brading breath like they
[18:05] Speaker 1: didn't really have like three year stretches like that. And
[18:09] Speaker 1: I started thinking, like, could he have a Marino like arc?
[18:12] Speaker 1: Where Marino is one of, if not the greatest quarterbacks
[18:15] Speaker 1: of all time in his first five seasons of his career,
[18:17] Speaker 1: and he was still an all time great the rest
[18:20] Speaker 1: of the way, but not at that level. I think
[18:23] Speaker 1: Mahomes will bounce back and get to his previous heights
[18:26] Speaker 1: in different ways. I don't think this is the year
[18:27] Speaker 1: to do it. So I had a handful of guys
[18:29] Speaker 1: ahead of him just because of the injury. I was
[18:31] Speaker 1: afraid that leaves us to four. You've been saying Drake
[18:34] Speaker 1: May Nate Tice, I saw took him third overall in
[18:38] Speaker 1: his in his QB draft, And maybe I'm just negging
[18:41] Speaker 1: myself because I'm a Patriots fan. I've always been a
[18:44] Speaker 1: Drake May guy. But I wrote down Joe Burrow ahead
[18:46] Speaker 1: of Drake May for this season alone, just because I
[18:49] Speaker 1: want to see May back it up do it again,
[18:53] Speaker 1: and because I'm really high on Burrow this season specifically.
[18:57] Speaker 1: I mean, we kind of know who Joe Burrow is
[18:59] Speaker 1: at this point. He will kill you if you keep
[19:03] Speaker 1: him clean, period, and he has maybe become, you know,
[19:08] Speaker 1: similar to to Stafford, like he's he's been better lately.
[19:13] Speaker 1: When you blitz him, he was holding the ball a
[19:16] Speaker 1: little longer. I mean he has a very specific style
[19:19] Speaker 1: of play. Although it's been very interesting. John, I just
[19:22] Speaker 1: I just listened to this this morning, hearing that they've
[19:25] Speaker 1: worked way more on under center plays this year. We'll
[19:27] Speaker 1: see if they actually do it, but in the off season.
[19:29] Speaker 3: That is western the off season if they're saying, yeah.
[19:33] Speaker 1: I know, Look, he was great, like capital G. Gray
[19:37] Speaker 1: in a couple of those games against the Bills and
[19:39] Speaker 1: the Ravens. He also had some stinkers. He killed the
[19:41] Speaker 1: bad teams late last year. I think he's going to
[19:43] Speaker 1: have a great season, and and maybe I think May's
[19:46] Speaker 1: ceiling is higher. But in terms of like feeling comfortable
[19:50] Speaker 1: that Joe Burrow is going to have a great season,
[19:52] Speaker 1: as long as he's out there, I'm gonna go Joe
[19:54] Speaker 1: Burrow forth.
[19:55] Speaker 3: I mean, it's totally fair. It's really just a question
[19:58] Speaker 3: to me, honestly, of health with Joe Burrow. I mean,
[20:01] Speaker 3: you just had these three seasons, you know, way lead
[20:03] Speaker 3: by injury to some extent and consistency aspects. But you know,
[20:07] Speaker 3: you're assuming going to next season it's all healthy. What's
[20:10] Speaker 3: it going to look like? You know, what's this his
[20:11] Speaker 3: age thirty season?
[20:12] Speaker 2: I think?
[20:13] Speaker 3: Is that right? Yeah? So you know how much of
[20:16] Speaker 3: that is there going to be a falloff after all
[20:18] Speaker 3: these injuries, But he was, you know, maybe the best
[20:20] Speaker 3: quarterback in the league. Certainly in that conversation in twenty
[20:22] Speaker 3: twenty four, I thought he played at that dominant of
[20:25] Speaker 3: a level statistically was obviously awesome. But then when you
[20:28] Speaker 3: take into consideration the tape aspect of this too, greg
[20:30] Speaker 3: that he's playing the game on the highest setting of difficulty.
[20:34] Speaker 3: Now he prefers to play it that way. There might
[20:36] Speaker 3: be way ways for his team to be more successful
[20:39] Speaker 3: if they play structure things a little bit differently, and
[20:41] Speaker 3: you referenced under center, more structured play from under center,
[20:44] Speaker 3: and that would hopefully allow them to lean somewhat on
[20:46] Speaker 3: some semblance of a run game and just having more
[20:49] Speaker 3: versatility in their offense, having more unpredictability. They just don't
[20:52] Speaker 3: run that much. There's not that big of a menu.
[20:54] Speaker 3: They are saved by their talent. That's how he prefers
[20:57] Speaker 3: to play. So it's not necessarily a shot at the
[20:59] Speaker 3: coaching staff. That's how Joe Burrow prefers to play. He's
[21:01] Speaker 3: excellent at it. Would he be as good at a
[21:04] Speaker 3: system that was less difficult in some ways? That's a
[21:06] Speaker 3: goodee question to ask, But that's sort of where you
[21:09] Speaker 3: get to with Burrow. But I think hopefully we learn that.
[21:12] Speaker 3: Imagine if he is, by the way, that would be fascinating,
[21:15] Speaker 3: because the whole offense, the whole team, it is really
[21:17] Speaker 3: just Burrow in the passing attack, and then everything else
[21:19] Speaker 3: is kind of like ho hum or, you know, not
[21:22] Speaker 3: good somewhere in there in that range. And I think
[21:25] Speaker 3: him individually, I've said for a long time, like, I
[21:27] Speaker 3: think you absolutely can make the case that in several
[21:31] Speaker 3: given years of his career he's been the best guy.
[21:33] Speaker 3: And he's been great in big moments too, which matter
[21:36] Speaker 3: a lot as well. So I'm totally good with this pick.
[21:39] Speaker 3: I've considered him underrated sort of, you know, although it
[21:42] Speaker 3: usually in this conversation for some time, it's really just
[21:45] Speaker 3: a matter of what you think about physically, where he's going,
[21:49] Speaker 3: where you think about the fact that this offense hasn't
[21:51] Speaker 3: had a lot of evolution to it. Does he want
[21:53] Speaker 3: to evolve? If he doesn't, does that mean that there's
[21:56] Speaker 3: just more going to go downhill from here? As we've
[21:58] Speaker 3: seen defensive all more and their success sort of tank.
[22:02] Speaker 3: Even when he's been good you mentioned him being up
[22:04] Speaker 3: on bad teams, Like, I think there's real questions about
[22:07] Speaker 3: that part of it in the league. What's the sustainability
[22:09] Speaker 3: of it as good as he is at it, So
[22:12] Speaker 3: that would be my big question for it. But in
[22:14] Speaker 3: terms of the individual player, I absolutely love Joe Burrow.
[22:18] Speaker 1: Yeah, it's partly a bed on twenty twenty six. And look,
[22:22] Speaker 1: if it really was my team, maybe I probably would
[22:24] Speaker 1: take Drake May. And yet, like, I think he'd be
[22:26] Speaker 1: a great MVP pick. I'm sure there's not that long
[22:29] Speaker 1: odds this year. I do feel that he is set
[22:33] Speaker 1: up and I do feel a little more comfortable that,
[22:35] Speaker 1: you know, he's at his age thirty season, as long
[22:38] Speaker 1: as he stays healthy, which is a big if I
[22:41] Speaker 1: trust him just a little bit more than Drake May
[22:44] Speaker 1: still see new things.
[22:46] Speaker 2: Is Drake May your pick at number five?
[22:48] Speaker 3: He is my pick? Yeah, And I think there's six
[22:51] Speaker 3: guys in this tier and we'll see if you pick
[22:53] Speaker 3: the sixth guy to having this tier. But I think
[22:56] Speaker 3: that Drake May, you could make arguments from kind of
[23:00] Speaker 3: all over this tier, I would say, to a degree,
[23:03] Speaker 3: but he's gonna be my pick here. I just felt
[23:05] Speaker 3: like poise for him, considering the fact that I don't
[23:08] Speaker 3: think he was like he had unbelievable production, and especially
[23:11] Speaker 3: because he got pummeled the second half his rookie season,
[23:14] Speaker 3: and then to go in and play the way he did,
[23:16] Speaker 3: to make the amount of throws under dress that he did,
[23:18] Speaker 3: and yes, he brings some of that on himself. I
[23:20] Speaker 3: think decision making and pocket presence or the areas the
[23:22] Speaker 3: big areas he needs to improve on. That's not that abnormal,
[23:25] Speaker 3: I would say for a quarterback in his place, and
[23:28] Speaker 3: he's already way better at those things than most guys
[23:30] Speaker 3: his HR. So I just think downfield accuracy, big play creation.
[23:35] Speaker 3: The fact that his legs are a legit asset doesn't
[23:37] Speaker 3: probably get talked about enough. There's a lot to talk about,
[23:39] Speaker 3: so I get it. Ability to throw in the middle
[23:41] Speaker 3: of the field is in there. He can play in
[23:43] Speaker 3: different types of offenses and game situations. That's all really
[23:46] Speaker 3: really appealing to me. I think he just has the
[23:48] Speaker 3: skill set of a guy that's going to be an
[23:50] Speaker 3: elite quarterback in the league. I think we've been able
[23:52] Speaker 3: to see that, frankly for a while now. Ball placement
[23:54] Speaker 3: in accuracy to high degree of difficulty, locations, on the
[23:57] Speaker 3: field is a real sp actual special trait, and I
[24:01] Speaker 3: think he has that. So one of the top things
[24:03] Speaker 3: I look for in a quarterback is a lot of
[24:04] Speaker 3: the stuff that he are. A bunch of the top
[24:05] Speaker 3: things I look for a bunch of the things that
[24:07] Speaker 3: he has. And so, yeah, it wasn't pretty in the playoffs,
[24:11] Speaker 3: and it got real ugly in the super Bowl, obviously,
[24:14] Speaker 3: and that's part of how it goes at this position,
[24:17] Speaker 3: especially when you're young. But to get there at all,
[24:19] Speaker 3: with the type of team they had, he had to
[24:20] Speaker 3: be an absolute special player all season. So it's just
[24:24] Speaker 3: not outside the possibility that we're looking at this is
[24:26] Speaker 3: like he's the number one guy going into coming out
[24:28] Speaker 3: of this next season. When we do this show again
[24:30] Speaker 3: next year, like that could be where the conversation starts.
[24:33] Speaker 3: So yeah, I just I don't want to go any
[24:34] Speaker 3: lower than this on him.
[24:36] Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm with you.
[24:37] Speaker 1: The part that I wouldn't say worries me, but so
[24:41] Speaker 1: many of the things he did felt like they were
[24:43] Speaker 1: almost impossible to do. Like he had the highest tight
[24:45] Speaker 1: window completion percentage in the league by far, it was
[24:49] Speaker 1: the third highest since twenty eighteen.
[24:50] Speaker 2: He was insane against the blitz.
[24:52] Speaker 1: He was insane against pressure until the offseason, where he
[24:57] Speaker 1: had I think almost more turnovers in the playoffs against
[25:01] Speaker 1: pressure then he did all of the regular season. But
[25:05] Speaker 1: you know, completing seventy percent seventy two percent of his
[25:08] Speaker 1: passes while being fourth an average depth of target like
[25:11] Speaker 1: and just hitting throws at a crazy high rate down
[25:14] Speaker 1: the field, Like, it is crazy to combine that all
[25:17] Speaker 1: you could you could look at that, and you could
[25:19] Speaker 1: think about him versus Patrick Mahomes' twenty nineteen season. I
[25:24] Speaker 1: would put Mahomes ahead of it, but it's like not
[25:26] Speaker 1: that ahead of it, and that's why we like, wouldn't
[25:28] Speaker 1: be that crazy to take May first.
[25:31] Speaker 2: Overall. The problem is the playoffs.
[25:32] Speaker 1: The problem is you suck sort of like his worst
[25:34] Speaker 1: stretch of the season right after that.
[25:37] Speaker 2: But I'm excited.
[25:38] Speaker 1: I'm excited to see this next step and his value
[25:42] Speaker 1: that he brings running the ball is massive. You said, Okay,
[25:45] Speaker 1: you think it's a six person tier, which means you're
[25:47] Speaker 1: either rude enough to say the reigning MVP doesn't even
[25:52] Speaker 1: belong in the first tier, or you just disagree with
[25:56] Speaker 1: my pick of Justin Herbert at six, because I'm taking
[25:58] Speaker 1: Herbert here. I don't care Matthew Stafford. He's getting up
[26:03] Speaker 1: there in years. Okay, it's to me, it's all one
[26:06] Speaker 1: big tier. The first seven I would have Stafford in it. Personally.
[26:11] Speaker 1: That playoff game was so bad out of Herbert, but man,
[26:14] Speaker 1: he was so good in the regular season.
[26:15] Speaker 2: I love the combination with Mike McDaniel.
[26:17] Speaker 1: I know we're trying to divorce the situation somewhat, but
[26:21] Speaker 1: he went deep more often, he held the ball more often.
[26:23] Speaker 1: He was pressured at the highest rate, and because he
[26:27] Speaker 1: was trying to make plays because that's what we've sort
[26:30] Speaker 1: of asked him to do, and I think he did
[26:31] Speaker 1: a pretty good job of that.
[26:32] Speaker 2: And the situation was brutal.
[26:34] Speaker 1: He faced the most quick pressures in the league, the
[26:36] Speaker 1: most unblocked pressures in the league. He was the first
[26:39] Speaker 1: quarterback since Deshaun Watson like eight years ago to face
[26:44] Speaker 1: the most amount of pressure and actually make the playoffs.
[26:46] Speaker 1: And so I give him a lot of credit for
[26:48] Speaker 1: that regular season. I think the arrow is just pointing up.
[26:51] Speaker 1: And a tiebreaker for these last three for me, between
[26:55] Speaker 1: you know, May and Herbert and Stafford was age was
[26:59] Speaker 1: a Dancy was like worrying about you know, possibly the
[27:05] Speaker 1: back injury for Stafford, but more importantly like mobility, and
[27:08] Speaker 1: so that that's enough where I think I'm just kind
[27:10] Speaker 1: of splitting hairs between those three.
[27:12] Speaker 2: I'm gonna take Herbert sixth overall.
[27:15] Speaker 3: He's tough for me, really tough. I've been a pretty
[27:18] Speaker 3: big Herbert sixth overall guy. But actually for me, he
[27:21] Speaker 3: went down to ninth, and I think you can make
[27:25] Speaker 3: a lot of arguments he kind of starts he's in
[27:27] Speaker 3: that beginning of the next tier for me. There's a
[27:30] Speaker 3: couple guys in the next year. He's in that next tier.
[27:32] Speaker 3: For me, I would say I have one more guy
[27:34] Speaker 3: in this in my top tier that you reference, Matt Stafford,
[27:38] Speaker 3: that we'll talk about here in a second when I
[27:40] Speaker 3: pick him. But yeah, just to talk about Herbert, I
[27:43] Speaker 3: am really I'm torn on him because you're right. He
[27:45] Speaker 3: was awesome in the regular season and awesome despite adverse
[27:48] Speaker 3: situations in the regular season, and that's been the story
[27:50] Speaker 3: of his career, right The offensive lines have been bad.
[27:52] Speaker 3: When they've been good, they've been hurt. Like it's just
[27:54] Speaker 3: over and over and over again. You're seeing kind of
[27:57] Speaker 3: some of the similar trends with him, and he yet
[27:59] Speaker 3: he served he's getting whooped on in the regular season.
[28:03] Speaker 3: I mean, it is brutal to watch, and statistically you're
[28:06] Speaker 3: not like necessarily always being wowed in terms of counting stats.
[28:09] Speaker 3: But if you watch the games, which I'm always saying,
[28:11] Speaker 3: watch the games, and you'll see how good Justin Herbert is.
[28:14] Speaker 3: And then the playoffs happen, and I just I'm at
[28:17] Speaker 3: the point Greg where I am like, not the person
[28:19] Speaker 3: at all. That's like, oh, let's go with the small
[28:21] Speaker 3: sample size. But the three playoff games he's played, yeah,
[28:23] Speaker 3: that's been really bad. And I'm just so I'm sort
[28:26] Speaker 3: of at that point where I don't want to move
[28:28] Speaker 3: away from him, which is why I'm still in this tier. Like,
[28:30] Speaker 3: I mean, he's still a top ten guy for me.
[28:31] Speaker 3: He's still one of the guys that I think is
[28:33] Speaker 3: the best in the league. Like obviously you have a
[28:35] Speaker 3: conversation with him. A lot of places in these rankings
[28:38] Speaker 3: depending on what you think of stafford in health if
[28:40] Speaker 3: you're thinking long term, like he would be a guy
[28:41] Speaker 3: that a lot of people would want to start the
[28:43] Speaker 3: franchise with. And I see all that. I think it's
[28:45] Speaker 3: in there. I just don't know why he doesn't play
[28:47] Speaker 3: that way in the playoffs. I mean, his this last
[28:49] Speaker 3: playoff game was just unbelievably bad, and the situation around
[28:53] Speaker 3: him is definitely tough, but it wasn't impossible to figure
[28:56] Speaker 3: out he genuinely looked like I mean, we're going to
[28:58] Speaker 3: talk about CJ. Stroud at some point too, and it
[29:00] Speaker 3: was like those guys just had meltdown performances. And with Herbert,
[29:03] Speaker 3: it's like, I'm like trying to figure out whether he
[29:06] Speaker 3: can ever get to the level of player that he
[29:08] Speaker 3: needs to be to carry a team that doesn't have
[29:11] Speaker 3: everything right. We were waiting every year for the Chargers
[29:14] Speaker 3: to get everything right around him, and at some point
[29:16] Speaker 3: I have to be like, well, can you have any
[29:19] Speaker 3: success in the postseason when that isn't the case, because yeah,
[29:22] Speaker 3: they haven't had perfect situations in the O line, neither
[29:25] Speaker 3: neither did Drake May and neither did the Pagers. Yet
[29:28] Speaker 3: you find ways and I think they're well coached. I
[29:30] Speaker 3: think all these other things are these other excuses that
[29:32] Speaker 3: it maybe exists in the past, aren't there right now.
[29:34] Speaker 3: So I'm just waiting for him to prove that he
[29:36] Speaker 3: belongs to in the tier with these other guys. I
[29:38] Speaker 3: think I think you can say he's top of the
[29:40] Speaker 3: next tier in my mind, and I'm like, yeah, totally
[29:42] Speaker 3: get it. I have two guys out of him that
[29:43] Speaker 3: I think there's an absolutely in that next tier that
[29:46] Speaker 3: I think there's an absolute argument for. I would just
[29:48] Speaker 3: say with him, I think that if he's going to
[29:51] Speaker 3: be in the top tier, I have to be able
[29:52] Speaker 3: to I can't point to the postseason and say, you
[29:55] Speaker 3: were one of the worst playoff quarterbacks I've seen. And
[29:58] Speaker 3: that's tough. Three times, that's tough.
[30:01] Speaker 2: Yeah, it's tough.
[30:03] Speaker 1: I NFL history players that have shown his level of
[30:08] Speaker 1: regular season play, The history of it is just like
[30:11] Speaker 1: it'll click at some point.
[30:12] Speaker 2: Maybe it was a little bit of a mental thing.
[30:14] Speaker 1: He was like over over correcting, trying not to make
[30:16] Speaker 1: a mistake, and then started to make more mistakes because
[30:19] Speaker 1: of that holding on to the ball. It wasn't great
[30:22] Speaker 1: and yet, but I would say, yes, I think he'll
[30:25] Speaker 1: be able to make things work and well, because I've
[30:28] Speaker 1: seen it. To me, it's a better sample size over
[30:31] Speaker 1: the sixteen games. Winning eleven games repeatedly with a lot
[30:34] Speaker 1: of the things that's been going on around him has
[30:36] Speaker 1: proven it to me.
[30:37] Speaker 2: And it's the mobility. I want a quarterback that can run.
[30:39] Speaker 1: And yet I do feel like we're going to get
[30:42] Speaker 1: some angry rams fans that Stafford here at number seven.
[30:46] Speaker 3: Stafford's my next guy. I actually had him at I
[30:49] Speaker 3: had him fifth. I mean I had Burrows sixth. But
[30:51] Speaker 3: they're all in the same tier, and I think you
[30:54] Speaker 3: can certainly make an argument for their anyway, and I
[30:56] Speaker 3: won't fight you. The reason for me was Stafford. I
[30:58] Speaker 3: didn't think it was unbelievable in the playoffs on the stretch,
[31:00] Speaker 3: like as much as he's been maybe in the past playoffs,
[31:03] Speaker 3: but I still think the.
[31:05] Speaker 1: Versus the Seahawks, I will not I will not mark
[31:08] Speaker 1: him down at allfer that Seahawcks gave the Ed more.
[31:10] Speaker 1: He had something like more deep yardage in that game
[31:13] Speaker 1: than any quarterback or one of the biggest ones of
[31:16] Speaker 1: the last like eight or nine years.
[31:18] Speaker 3: The beginning of that game, I was like, uh oh,
[31:21] Speaker 3: like we might be at the end, and then he
[31:22] Speaker 3: just rallied and made like six unreal throws and it
[31:26] Speaker 3: was maybe like the full best game. But the throws
[31:28] Speaker 3: he did make for and saying, and that's where you
[31:29] Speaker 3: get to with him, were just the accuracy to high
[31:31] Speaker 3: degree difficulty, parts of the field, and the mental stuff
[31:35] Speaker 3: you trust with him. So as long as that's still
[31:37] Speaker 3: the case, I worry less about unless he has an
[31:40] Speaker 3: injury that actually keeps him from playing. I worry less
[31:42] Speaker 3: about physical drop off and decline because I physical drop
[31:45] Speaker 3: off and decline doesn't usually affect the arm strength of
[31:48] Speaker 3: a quarterback unless there's an injury involved. You know, you
[31:51] Speaker 3: think of Peyton Manning, Drew Brees better outspurt. All these
[31:53] Speaker 3: guys had injuries that eventually led to some of that falloff.
[31:56] Speaker 3: It wasn't necessarily just like, oh they got old in
[31:58] Speaker 3: their arms, they still being able to throw the ad Like,
[32:01] Speaker 3: I don't think that's gonna happen with Matt Stafford. So
[32:03] Speaker 3: obviously you worry some about injuries with anybody court player
[32:07] Speaker 3: gets older. But he realized it missed that much time,
[32:09] Speaker 3: Like I mean, you know, he's I think still accuracy wise,
[32:12] Speaker 3: high degree difficulty throws down the field, the whole field
[32:16] Speaker 3: being open to him at any point, play action, pure
[32:18] Speaker 3: drop back. He can play within an offensive system that's
[32:21] Speaker 3: proven to be extremely successful in the league, and adapt
[32:24] Speaker 3: within the system as well. Mental aptitude, leadership. I think
[32:29] Speaker 3: all these things are in place, and he's not unbelievable athlete,
[32:32] Speaker 3: and I think but I think they've obviously he's been
[32:34] Speaker 3: one of the best situations in the league his whole
[32:36] Speaker 3: entire time he's been with the Rams, that's basically been
[32:38] Speaker 3: the case. So there's a lot going for him, but
[32:41] Speaker 3: also there's a lot asked of him too, Like this
[32:43] Speaker 3: isn't a cookie cutter offense that doesn't ask things of him.
[32:45] Speaker 3: They ask tough things of him, and he delivers tough things.
[32:48] Speaker 3: So to me, he's definitely in that Tier one conversation,
[32:51] Speaker 3: and I think in a given playoff run stretch of football,
[32:55] Speaker 3: you can really make it argument he's the best guy
[32:57] Speaker 3: in the league. I mean, obviously MVP speaks to that
[32:59] Speaker 3: as well, so I think because of that, he still
[33:03] Speaker 3: remains in this tier, although with him the downside perhaps
[33:07] Speaker 3: is more significant the other guys, even in a one
[33:09] Speaker 3: year because the injury component and just the always the
[33:14] Speaker 3: back and this and that, and the offseason this is happening,
[33:17] Speaker 3: and you know, retirement's looming, and you know this all
[33:19] Speaker 3: this kind of chatter that seems to follow him less
[33:21] Speaker 3: so this offseason, but you know, you would guess that
[33:24] Speaker 3: that is going to catch up at some point with him,
[33:26] Speaker 3: and so maybe it's a little bit of a risk
[33:28] Speaker 3: in that capacity, but if he's healthy, I have very
[33:31] Speaker 3: little question that he'll be one of the best quarterbacks
[33:33] Speaker 3: in the league.
[33:34] Speaker 1: Agree, And yet I did try to remember, like, what
[33:37] Speaker 1: would I have thought last year coming into this point?
[33:39] Speaker 1: Would I have thought in twenty twenty four coming into
[33:41] Speaker 1: this point? And I do think it's okay to understand
[33:44] Speaker 1: that there's been ups and downs with Stafford within seasons
[33:49] Speaker 1: and generally going into seasons. I've never viewed him as
[33:52] Speaker 1: like a top five guy. He's always right on that edge,
[33:55] Speaker 1: Like I feel like I have him here at sixth
[33:57] Speaker 1: or seventh around where I'd have him most of the
[33:59] Speaker 1: last last handful of years.
[34:01] Speaker 2: And I'm not going.
[34:02] Speaker 1: Crazy changing it because of the MVP season, because that
[34:04] Speaker 1: was the best I've ever seen him play. And so
[34:08] Speaker 1: at thirty eight years old, is he going to stay
[34:10] Speaker 1: at that very high level?
[34:11] Speaker 2: Maybe he will.
[34:11] Speaker 1: I mean, Rogers was winning back to back MVPs around
[34:14] Speaker 1: this age, and Brady's still had about five more elite
[34:17] Speaker 1: years left at this age, so it's totally possible. And
[34:21] Speaker 1: I'm probably selling him short. And he has replaced Burrow.
[34:24] Speaker 1: I think as the guy that you're just most afraid
[34:27] Speaker 1: to blitz, the numbers against the blitz last year are
[34:29] Speaker 1: just like outrageous. For Matthew Stafford, he has seen it all.
[34:35] Speaker 1: All right, it's time for the offseason ride along, presented
[34:38] Speaker 1: by Toyota. I'm going to go with Dak Prescott next.
[34:43] Speaker 1: I'm sure he was in your group.
[34:45] Speaker 3: He was actually next for me. I mean I had him.
[34:47] Speaker 3: He was one of the guys I had ahead of
[34:48] Speaker 3: Herbert that I think is just really open for conversation,
[34:52] Speaker 3: I think, and I can see the pushback and yeah,
[34:54] Speaker 3: so's he was next for me too. I'm glad we
[34:56] Speaker 3: kind of see this similarly.
[34:58] Speaker 1: Yeah, I you just know what you're gonna get, and
[35:03] Speaker 1: you know you're gonna get a guy who is not
[35:05] Speaker 1: afraid to throw every possible route that's on the field.
[35:10] Speaker 1: He attempted the most tight window throws in the NFL
[35:12] Speaker 1: that the Cowboys actually had the fewest amount of separation
[35:15] Speaker 1: on attempts, which is not surprising.
[35:18] Speaker 2: They use play action more.
[35:19] Speaker 1: I felt like he produced better in part because they
[35:22] Speaker 1: gave him a few more easy buttons, But it doesn't
[35:24] Speaker 1: change how next level he thinks of the game. He
[35:28] Speaker 1: is very much that old, you know, Peyton Manning style
[35:32] Speaker 1: of quarterback, which is great to still see in the league.
[35:34] Speaker 1: I mean, Matthew Stafford is very often that that type
[35:38] Speaker 1: of player too, And I just feel like I know
[35:41] Speaker 1: who Dak Prescott is. I can go win a super
[35:44] Speaker 1: Bowl with Dak Prescott, certainly if I have the right
[35:47] Speaker 1: support around him. If we can win one with Sam Darnold, John,
[35:50] Speaker 1: you know, we can win a couple with Dak.
[35:52] Speaker 2: He just needs the help.
[35:53] Speaker 1: And I feel very comfortable when he drops back to
[35:57] Speaker 1: pass the decisions that he's going to make.
[36:00] Speaker 3: I do too, And I know that it's not always perfect,
[36:03] Speaker 3: but I think his accuracy, his timing when he's locked
[36:08] Speaker 3: in mentally and in the flow. He's a little bit
[36:09] Speaker 3: of a rhythm guy, but my gosh, is it good
[36:12] Speaker 3: when he's in the rhythm. Like I've seen him takeover games.
[36:14] Speaker 3: I've seen him dominate. I've seen him make high degree
[36:17] Speaker 3: difficulty throws down the field. I've everyone's gonna say, well,
[36:21] Speaker 3: what about in the playoffs? Why hasn't he done in
[36:22] Speaker 3: the playoffs? And there's lots of reasons and answers, So
[36:24] Speaker 3: that's some At times, it has been his play. I
[36:26] Speaker 3: don't think he's been anywhere close to as bad as
[36:28] Speaker 3: some other guys in the playoffs. I also think that
[36:31] Speaker 3: that's the conversation we're in. We're outside of the top
[36:32] Speaker 3: tier now for me, and so the conversation we're in
[36:35] Speaker 3: is guys that like, yeah, they haven't necessarily been utterly
[36:38] Speaker 3: dominant in the playoffs. They haven't won super Bowls or
[36:40] Speaker 3: maybe been the key reason for their team winning a
[36:42] Speaker 3: super Bowl. We'll get to some guys that have won
[36:44] Speaker 3: super Bowls, but we you know, they haven't answered that question.
[36:47] Speaker 3: That question exists about their career. So for evaluating them
[36:50] Speaker 3: within the context of NFL history valid, but within the
[36:54] Speaker 3: context of this tier, Like, I just don't see it
[36:56] Speaker 3: as a compelling point. I think more about Okay, if
[36:58] Speaker 3: I can't have one of these in the elite tier,
[37:01] Speaker 3: then what am I getting? What kind of a player
[37:04] Speaker 3: do I want? I want someone who's cerebral. I want
[37:06] Speaker 3: someone who's accurate. I want someone who makes difficult throws
[37:08] Speaker 3: down the field. Now, you can raise questions about Dak
[37:11] Speaker 3: in other ways, like if you know when the protection
[37:13] Speaker 3: hasn't been great, has he relied on his legs enough,
[37:16] Speaker 3: has he played to his athleticism enough, when he's at
[37:19] Speaker 3: his best, he does he does do those things. So
[37:21] Speaker 3: I again I have seen those things with him. Is
[37:24] Speaker 3: there inconsistencies at times? Sometimes? Is there? You know, he
[37:27] Speaker 3: he gets a little bit I think risk taking in
[37:31] Speaker 3: some of the throws that he takes, and maybe he
[37:33] Speaker 3: doesn't make all these the best decisions in certain ruts.
[37:35] Speaker 3: Again when he gets into his play, that's possible. But
[37:38] Speaker 3: I think you don't have many consistently bad habits with
[37:43] Speaker 3: Dak that you're just gonna every single game. He's just
[37:45] Speaker 3: outside the structure of what you're doing, like some of
[37:48] Speaker 3: these other guys who have maybe better peaks than Dak,
[37:50] Speaker 3: but like the downside is just so much worse. Dak
[37:53] Speaker 3: is going to have you in that thing every year
[37:56] Speaker 3: if he's healthy and if the rest of your team
[37:58] Speaker 3: is competent, and there's just not a lot of that
[38:00] Speaker 3: you can say that about like he individually is that
[38:03] Speaker 3: good when you know he's had been banged up two
[38:04] Speaker 3: at times? So I still feel like as much as
[38:07] Speaker 3: we've moved around, I think he's been eight nine, seven,
[38:10] Speaker 3: somewhere in the seven to ten range for me basically
[38:13] Speaker 3: every year since he really got onto the map, So
[38:15] Speaker 3: I still feel pretty strongly about him being in this group.
[38:19] Speaker 1: Yeah, it's crazy to think how good he was immediately,
[38:22] Speaker 1: and he's obviously developed and matured.
[38:25] Speaker 2: As a player.
[38:26] Speaker 1: And look he was he was second in the MVP
[38:28] Speaker 1: just what three seasons ago and last season he has
[38:30] Speaker 1: one of the most productive offenses when he's out there,
[38:33] Speaker 1: and I'm excited because I do think he's getting more
[38:35] Speaker 1: help from the coaching staff. I like this marriage with
[38:38] Speaker 1: Brian Schottenheimer. And that was the off season ride along
[38:41] Speaker 1: presented by Toyota because when people are the destination, your
[38:45] Speaker 1: ride is important. Learn more at Toyota dot com and
[38:49] Speaker 1: find the vehicle that fits your people. So you said
[38:52] Speaker 1: you had like a little group of three, You had
[38:53] Speaker 1: a couple guys ahead of Herbert, and I want you
[38:56] Speaker 1: to disagree. Don't don't be happy that you see things
[38:58] Speaker 1: the same way with me as Dak tell me that
[39:01] Speaker 1: I'm an idiot, that I got Herbert way too high.
[39:03] Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I might have needed reassurance on that one
[39:05] Speaker 3: because I was like, I'm like this tier, it's hard
[39:08] Speaker 3: to sort out. But I just feel better about how
[39:10] Speaker 3: Dak's performed in big moments postseas. I think I trust
[39:12] Speaker 3: him a little more than I do Herbert. So I
[39:15] Speaker 3: know you have Herbert, I have I have Jordan love
[39:18] Speaker 3: between Dak and Herbert for me, so he would be
[39:21] Speaker 3: so he'd be eighth for me. And this is what
[39:23] Speaker 3: I'm torn onto. I mean, I didn't see it with
[39:25] Speaker 3: Dak as a prospect, this this quarterback ranking. Basically, by
[39:28] Speaker 3: the way, when you asked me to do this, it's
[39:29] Speaker 3: funny because it's just littered with all the players I
[39:32] Speaker 3: was too low. I'm pre drafted. Now they're only leading
[39:34] Speaker 3: players like Dak. I mean, obviously nobody saw that one
[39:36] Speaker 3: coming to Josh Allen, Dustin, Herbert, like none of these
[39:40] Speaker 3: guys I thought were like unbelievable in college. Jordan loves
[39:42] Speaker 3: another one of those guys. But I've just really been impressed.
[39:44] Speaker 3: I think the poise that he shows too. I think
[39:47] Speaker 3: the fact that he avoids negative plays to the degree
[39:49] Speaker 3: that he does is really compelling to me. Gives his
[39:51] Speaker 3: team a fighting chance. I think when they've if they
[39:54] Speaker 3: had been able to stay healthy this season, we might
[39:57] Speaker 3: be singing even a higher song than this one about
[40:00] Speaker 3: his ranking. I really think that because I don't think
[40:02] Speaker 3: he individually has been like usually the reason for why
[40:06] Speaker 3: they have struggled as a team. I think, honestly, they
[40:08] Speaker 3: got pretty banged up last year, pretty unlucky. They had
[40:10] Speaker 3: a window to really do something and it sort of
[40:13] Speaker 3: fell apart for them with some of the injuries to
[40:14] Speaker 3: Craft and Parsons and others. But I think with him,
[40:18] Speaker 3: the thing that impresses me the most is you can
[40:21] Speaker 3: design an offense. And this is big I'm going to
[40:22] Speaker 3: emphasize this. With a lot of these guys that are
[40:24] Speaker 3: in this next group. You can design an offense around them,
[40:27] Speaker 3: and they consistently play within the structure of the offense,
[40:30] Speaker 3: and they can make high degree difficulty plays and between
[40:33] Speaker 3: all those things. Are there issues at times? Are there
[40:35] Speaker 3: foibles at times? Do you have with them sometimes? Do
[40:38] Speaker 3: they make questionable decisions and risk taking things to the ball? Yes,
[40:41] Speaker 3: there's some of that with all these guys. But I
[40:43] Speaker 3: would rather have the combination of high end potential, even
[40:46] Speaker 3: for a run, that you get from guys who can
[40:49] Speaker 3: be creators and make high degree difficulty throws in plays
[40:52] Speaker 3: within an offense, and that consistently keep their offense on
[40:55] Speaker 3: schedule and play within the structure of the offense and
[40:57] Speaker 3: are constantly trying to go into hero mode, constantly trying
[41:00] Speaker 3: to get away from what their coach has told him
[41:01] Speaker 3: to do, constantly trying to create outside of what the
[41:04] Speaker 3: rest of the team, the other ten on the field
[41:06] Speaker 3: are doing, and just playing in their own world. There's
[41:09] Speaker 3: guys who are great talents, but they don't consistently play
[41:11] Speaker 3: that way. Jordan Love's ability to actually buy into a system,
[41:14] Speaker 3: master the system mentally work to the degree that he
[41:17] Speaker 3: does that has been the thing that's won me over
[41:20] Speaker 3: more so than the arm and the wild throws that
[41:22] Speaker 3: everybody talks about. He has those, certainly, but I knew
[41:24] Speaker 3: those were in there. It's the other stuff, the floor
[41:27] Speaker 3: just being way higher. I actually don't think he's that
[41:30] Speaker 3: risky of a quarterback compared to like what his reputation
[41:33] Speaker 3: sometimes is. I know he's had some bad ones and
[41:34] Speaker 3: eygh profile moments, but I don't think he's like throwing
[41:37] Speaker 3: the ball to the other team ten times a game
[41:39] Speaker 3: kind of reckless in his game. So I just think
[41:41] Speaker 3: he's brought the floor up and that hasn't been acknowledged,
[41:44] Speaker 3: and maybe the ceiling isn't, you know, elite tier guy
[41:46] Speaker 3: in the league but I think the floor is pretty high,
[41:48] Speaker 3: and I still think the ceiling's higher than a lot
[41:50] Speaker 3: of other guys.
[41:51] Speaker 1: I do have some knits to pick with that argument,
[41:53] Speaker 1: because to me, hey, the ceiling is that high. I mean,
[41:57] Speaker 1: I do think he could put it all together and
[42:00] Speaker 1: and have an MVP top five type of run because
[42:03] Speaker 1: I think last year he really started to reduce his mistakes.
[42:10] Speaker 1: That was where I'm totally on board with you that
[42:13] Speaker 1: he was not a risk taker last year.
[42:14] Speaker 2: I thought he was a different quarterback in that way.
[42:17] Speaker 1: It shows up in the turnover where he played percentage,
[42:20] Speaker 1: but it just it showed up in my watching of
[42:24] Speaker 1: his film that I just thought he did not really
[42:27] Speaker 1: lose much of his big playmaking while just making much
[42:31] Speaker 1: better decisions.
[42:32] Speaker 2: And anyone that went.
[42:33] Speaker 1: To kill him for the playoffs, I mean he threw
[42:35] Speaker 1: four touchdowns in the playoffs. Like it was like for
[42:38] Speaker 1: a bad relatively bad playoff game. It was like he
[42:41] Speaker 1: was not the reason that they lost. To me, he
[42:42] Speaker 1: was he was fine in that playoff game. He was
[42:46] Speaker 1: great on big plays last year. If he had the
[42:48] Speaker 1: best success rate and explosive play rate on third downs,
[42:51] Speaker 1: you know his EPA per play and success rate all
[42:54] Speaker 1: that QBR all that would you would put him right
[42:56] Speaker 1: there with Stafford and May as the best like numbers,
[43:00] Speaker 1: just pure numbers in the league, and I think context
[43:03] Speaker 1: it's okay to add to that. Probably the biggest context
[43:05] Speaker 1: I would add, and this is what he needs to do,
[43:07] Speaker 1: I think to get to that elite here, more than
[43:09] Speaker 1: anything is he was a lot worse under pressure last year,
[43:11] Speaker 1: Like you think Jared Goff is kind of the example
[43:14] Speaker 1: of the guy whose numbers get significantly worse under pressure.
[43:17] Speaker 1: Everyone's pressure numbers get worse, but it's even more dramatic
[43:20] Speaker 1: for golf. Love was probably the most dramatic guy in
[43:23] Speaker 1: the entire NFL last season. Not sure why that is exactly.
[43:27] Speaker 1: It's a lot of just holding onto the ball and
[43:30] Speaker 1: throwing it away and just hoping something happens. Maybe it's
[43:33] Speaker 1: just a tick slower processing than maybe some of the
[43:36] Speaker 1: top guys. He wasn't making catastrophic plays, but basically if
[43:41] Speaker 1: you got near him, he turned into a below average
[43:45] Speaker 1: quarterback last year.
[43:47] Speaker 3: Yeah. That The plus with him is that you don't
[43:50] Speaker 3: see him take a lot of sacks. The negative with
[43:53] Speaker 3: him is that I don't think he's a great creator
[43:56] Speaker 3: Outside of structure, and I think that's where a lot
[43:58] Speaker 3: of people thought the tools would be always his great
[44:00] Speaker 3: But he's not been a great or will or very
[44:02] Speaker 3: willing scrambler, and I have questions about that. And I
[44:05] Speaker 3: have questions about just when he does have to go
[44:07] Speaker 3: into a hero mode and sort of make those types
[44:09] Speaker 3: of big end plays outside the pocket, things like that.
[44:12] Speaker 3: Can he be that guy consistently? I think is a
[44:14] Speaker 3: valid question with him. So I agree with you. Now,
[44:16] Speaker 3: he's pretty good at staying. I mean, last year's offensive
[44:19] Speaker 3: line situation probably is under discussed in Green Bay, and
[44:21] Speaker 3: even this year moving into the season, I have major
[44:24] Speaker 3: questions about that group. There are some real questions in
[44:26] Speaker 3: Green Bay. It might not be talked about enough. But
[44:29] Speaker 3: I would say that just his ability, I mean, the
[44:31] Speaker 3: turnover wheth they play, number coming down this past season,
[44:33] Speaker 3: the percentage of him, just the fact that he's not,
[44:36] Speaker 3: throughout any season of his career been a guy who
[44:38] Speaker 3: takes a ton of sacks or puts his team behind
[44:40] Speaker 3: the sticks in a lot of ways. Gives his team
[44:42] Speaker 3: more of a chance to sustain drives, and I think
[44:44] Speaker 3: is a big reason why their offense is always elite.
[44:46] Speaker 3: The floor is a big part of that. Jordan loves
[44:48] Speaker 3: a big part of that. Their offense is always one
[44:50] Speaker 3: of the best in the league. Health has been a factor,
[44:52] Speaker 3: Lots of other things have been a factor for them,
[44:54] Speaker 3: but this range, I feel really comfortable taking Jordan Love here.
[44:57] Speaker 3: I never thought that would be the case when they
[44:59] Speaker 3: drafted him. So another success story we didn't see coming this.
[45:02] Speaker 3: The top ten is littered with these greg It's pretty awesome.
[45:05] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[45:05] Speaker 1: I liked the Love pick when they made it, and
[45:09] Speaker 1: I liked even the process of it, and even then,
[45:13] Speaker 1: after watching him in his first couple of preseasons, I'm
[45:16] Speaker 1: stunned because he was a different player early in his career,
[45:19] Speaker 1: and it does show you for some quarterbacks, man, this
[45:22] Speaker 1: sort of development path can still help you a lot.
[45:26] Speaker 1: I don't think his career would be the same if
[45:27] Speaker 1: he had to play early. He's doing the nineteen seventies
[45:31] Speaker 1: nineteen eighties mold, where I think it really helped him out.
[45:34] Speaker 1: This so, to me, I thought it was a very
[45:36] Speaker 1: clear top nine. At least for me, that was it.
[45:39] Speaker 1: We've taken those nine and I felt like it was
[45:43] Speaker 1: a pretty big drop off and that the draft almost
[45:45] Speaker 1: starts at ten, and I just have massive question marks
[45:49] Speaker 1: next to the guy I wrote down at number ten,
[45:51] Speaker 1: and I feel a little cheapish about it because I
[45:55] Speaker 1: have to just come to terms with the fact, John,
[45:59] Speaker 1: there's a big state for me that I've become a
[46:02] Speaker 1: brock pretty guy. I know you're not gonna like it.
[46:07] Speaker 1: I know plenty of people aren't gonna like it. I
[46:09] Speaker 1: don't care. I'm gonna go with I'm gonna go with
[46:10] Speaker 1: my what my heart is telling me right now. I
[46:13] Speaker 1: think he's dialed back his mistakes quite a bit. He
[46:17] Speaker 1: was holding the ball a lot longer while taking less sacks.
[46:21] Speaker 1: The numbers are obviously ridiculous, and I know that's very
[46:24] Speaker 1: scheme dependent. Like he's second in QBR, he's always first
[46:28] Speaker 1: or second, and EPA per play success rate last year was,
[46:32] Speaker 1: you know, incredible. I know Jimmy Garoppolo had all those
[46:36] Speaker 1: numbers too. My eyes tell me something different, that something
[46:39] Speaker 1: different is happening here, and that he's gotten significantly better
[46:43] Speaker 1: each season in terms of his processing, his ability to
[46:47] Speaker 1: give you a little extra by making plays and in
[46:52] Speaker 1: a different way than Dak Prescott. I feel pretty comfortable,
[46:57] Speaker 1: and ultimately that was the tiebreaker between him and then
[47:00] Speaker 1: four or five guys who I have all very close, Like,
[47:04] Speaker 1: I feel good about what he's going to give me
[47:05] Speaker 1: on a week to week basis. And I don't think
[47:07] Speaker 1: we give him the grace because he was a seventh
[47:11] Speaker 1: round pick that he's a young player. That's I think
[47:14] Speaker 1: consistently improved each and every season, and I'm projecting that
[47:18] Speaker 1: improvement into this a little bit like seventh round picks
[47:21] Speaker 1: can continue to get better and better and better and
[47:22] Speaker 1: better too. And to me, his floor is high, and
[47:25] Speaker 1: I think the ceilings a little higher than other people
[47:29] Speaker 1: want to admit, especially people like myself who I was
[47:32] Speaker 1: not buying it in that quote unquote MVP campaign season
[47:35] Speaker 1: against Lamar Jackson. I think he's a significantly better player
[47:38] Speaker 1: right now than he was even two years ago.
[47:41] Speaker 3: I like brock Party, He's not quite this high for me,
[47:44] Speaker 3: but I think you can make an argument that he
[47:46] Speaker 3: should be maybe a little bit higher than where I
[47:48] Speaker 3: have him. I have him fifteenth. Here here's what I'd say,
[47:54] Speaker 3: Why isn't it Jared Goff? What and Jared Goff to
[47:57] Speaker 3: me is in the tier that you talked about, the
[47:58] Speaker 3: tier ending at nine. Why isn't Jared Goff?
[48:01] Speaker 2: Yeah, he's next on my list.
[48:03] Speaker 3: Okay, so he's next, So he'd be next for me obviously,
[48:05] Speaker 3: And I don't want to jump ahead too much, but
[48:07] Speaker 3: I don't need to talk about golf. Could But I
[48:09] Speaker 3: just thinking about golf compared to Purty and thinking about
[48:13] Speaker 3: a couple of different factors to me. Like for me,
[48:16] Speaker 3: Jared Goff, I love the fact that he doesn't take
[48:18] Speaker 3: a ton of sacks, right Like I love the fact
[48:20] Speaker 3: that there's this quick release play within the structure of
[48:22] Speaker 3: the offense. Know your limitations, get out of there when
[48:24] Speaker 3: you need to. Yes, the physical tools are on anything amazing,
[48:27] Speaker 3: but the actoracy, the execution for years, the ability to
[48:30] Speaker 3: run high profile NFL offense that's proven to be successful
[48:35] Speaker 3: across the league, the ability to limit negative plays. I
[48:38] Speaker 3: think there's a couple of games, one or two games
[48:40] Speaker 3: every year where you see some of those pop up.
[48:42] Speaker 3: But for the most part, he's limited a lot of
[48:44] Speaker 3: the low end stuff and had a lot of the
[48:46] Speaker 3: high end stuff playing with the structure if they don't
[48:49] Speaker 3: have one of the unluckiest none of which was really
[48:51] Speaker 3: his fault playoff moments second albs that we've ever seen.
[48:55] Speaker 3: He's in the super Bowl for the second time, in
[48:57] Speaker 3: his career, Like he's proven it in the playoffs that
[48:59] Speaker 3: he can play like at that same level and like
[49:02] Speaker 3: at the moment isn't too big for him. So I
[49:04] Speaker 3: still have him in that tier with the other guys,
[49:06] Speaker 3: and I know that he's not sexy, and I know
[49:08] Speaker 3: that he's not a lot of people are looking for
[49:09] Speaker 3: Australia at this is the story you're scouting. But I
[49:12] Speaker 3: just think when you put on the tape, he gets it.
[49:14] Speaker 3: He freaking gets it done. And I really appreciate his
[49:17] Speaker 3: game way more than I thought I would a couple
[49:19] Speaker 3: of years ago when he finished with the Rams.
[49:21] Speaker 2: Look, he is exactly who everyone thinks he is.
[49:24] Speaker 1: He leads the league and in breaking routes there's a
[49:27] Speaker 1: ton of yak. The the numbers when he's clean are
[49:32] Speaker 1: just exceptional.
[49:33] Speaker 2: I mean, he is going to kill you. Let's talk
[49:36] Speaker 2: about them together.
[49:37] Speaker 1: You could throw eleven up for Gough because I think
[49:40] Speaker 1: it's an interesting conversation just comparing the two of them.
[49:43] Speaker 1: The answer would be that I think Purty still has
[49:47] Speaker 1: levels to go. Potentially, I'm betting the little on a
[49:50] Speaker 1: mystery box where I feel like I know who Goff
[49:53] Speaker 1: is and then it's it's the creation, you know, it's
[49:56] Speaker 1: it's the idea when things aren't going well, and things
[49:59] Speaker 1: were not going well for that forty nine Ers team
[50:01] Speaker 1: last year. I've really been impressed the last couple of
[50:04] Speaker 1: seasons when Perdy's been out there and healthy of his
[50:07] Speaker 1: ability to make those around him better. It is is
[50:11] Speaker 1: very close between those two, and goff is maybe a
[50:15] Speaker 1: little bit of a of a safer pick, but that
[50:17] Speaker 1: that's it, that he can. He's what Kyle Sanahan wanted,
[50:20] Speaker 1: which is, you know, a guy who can also create
[50:22] Speaker 1: some plays on his own.
[50:24] Speaker 3: And maybe you're maybe listeners are hearing the stylistic differences
[50:27] Speaker 3: maybe between a little bit of what we gravitated to,
[50:29] Speaker 3: because you're one hundred percent right, Brock Purty obviously way
[50:32] Speaker 3: better out of structure than Jared Goff is, and I
[50:34] Speaker 3: would say Jared Goff way better within the structure. I
[50:37] Speaker 3: think I gravitated first toward that guy because I trust
[50:40] Speaker 3: that guy to get it done within the structure without
[50:42] Speaker 3: needing to play in this creation mode. And I think
[50:45] Speaker 3: with Perty he definitely can play in the creation mode
[50:47] Speaker 3: more I worry that he stays there too often. Last
[50:50] Speaker 3: year's Time to Throw has me really scared just throughout
[50:52] Speaker 3: his career in some ways as he's played more and
[50:55] Speaker 3: some of that has been you know, I think it
[50:57] Speaker 3: was it was a mixed bag a little bit in
[50:58] Speaker 3: twenty twenty four last year he's banged up, and then
[51:00] Speaker 3: when he did play there's obviously really good things about
[51:03] Speaker 3: I played in the regular season. I worry about the
[51:05] Speaker 3: turner where he plays those can come in bunches for him.
[51:08] Speaker 3: The percentage of times where he gets all the other team.
[51:10] Speaker 3: I don't trust him to the degree that I trust
[51:12] Speaker 3: Jared Goff. And then he does a great job of
[51:15] Speaker 3: avoiding sacks, which I love about him. He really can't
[51:18] Speaker 3: create like he is a really fun player to watch
[51:22] Speaker 3: in a lot of ways, he's more exciting to watch,
[51:24] Speaker 3: and I think because he is this kind of I
[51:26] Speaker 3: don't want to say boring personalty, but just kind of
[51:28] Speaker 3: like he's not a like you don't put the mic
[51:30] Speaker 3: in front of him and I'm like, oh man, this guy,
[51:32] Speaker 3: let's go. Like, but the way he plays is really compelling,
[51:36] Speaker 3: I think from a viewership perspective. But then I mean
[51:39] Speaker 3: the three point twenty two second time to throw, like
[51:42] Speaker 3: it's just like that was where he lived last year.
[51:45] Speaker 2: And that's what happens with Jake Ton just as your
[51:47] Speaker 2: number one.
[51:48] Speaker 1: I mean, I hear you that he gets helped so
[51:51] Speaker 1: much by the scheme, but I also think, you know,
[51:54] Speaker 1: it should be recognized that like Pearce all is in
[51:57] Speaker 1: and out last year, Kit Kit Kittle, I guess it
[51:59] Speaker 1: was in it out. It wasn't until the end of
[52:01] Speaker 1: the year that he was out out. You know, you
[52:04] Speaker 1: have Juwan Jennings a little in and out last year.
[52:07] Speaker 1: I mean, for for a part of the season, it
[52:09] Speaker 1: was really Mac Jones making Kendrick Bourne happen. But I
[52:12] Speaker 1: think that was part of the reason why he's holding
[52:14] Speaker 1: on to the ball too long. And I think some
[52:15] Speaker 1: of the things you can knock him for, like we
[52:17] Speaker 1: could talk about with Caleb, who I'm sure is going
[52:19] Speaker 1: to come up fairly soon too, And uh yeah, I
[52:23] Speaker 1: think that's it. But the fact that for the most part,
[52:26] Speaker 1: I think he's gotten better at being a little safer,
[52:28] Speaker 1: but maybe you're right that he gets a little too
[52:30] Speaker 1: much dip on his chip every now and then.
[52:32] Speaker 3: And both are really good. I mean they're probably in
[52:35] Speaker 3: these conversation of quarterbacks that you're like, well, can they
[52:37] Speaker 3: ever can their good peaks, are they enough basically to
[52:40] Speaker 3: get you to the top. And that's been the question
[52:42] Speaker 3: with Perdy because when the Niners have been good, and
[52:44] Speaker 3: it'll probably continue to be the question with Jared Goff.
[52:46] Speaker 3: Obviously mcveighen thinks so moved to Matt Stafford. Certainly in
[52:49] Speaker 3: many ways he was right out of Stafford Hire. He's
[52:51] Speaker 3: a better player than Golf. But I think the idea
[52:53] Speaker 3: that Goff's still like still where he's gotten to in
[52:55] Speaker 3: his career has been pretty unbelievable to me, considering there
[52:58] Speaker 3: are these like very clear limitations with this game. They're like,
[53:01] Speaker 3: he can't play all the different ways, and so to me,
[53:04] Speaker 3: the accuracy, but then also the functional execution within the offense.
[53:08] Speaker 3: Now things can fall apart for Jared Goff two at times.
[53:11] Speaker 3: You know, it usually is one or two games a
[53:13] Speaker 3: season rather than just like these rash stretches of play.
[53:17] Speaker 3: But I I for like weeks and weeks and weeks
[53:20] Speaker 3: on end. But I would say that when he's at
[53:22] Speaker 3: his best, which I think most of the time, he's
[53:24] Speaker 3: able to play his game in most of formats in
[53:26] Speaker 3: the league, you know, he's again we're talking about a
[53:29] Speaker 3: tier of quarterbacks that probably aren't like carrying your team
[53:32] Speaker 3: in the playoffs, but they're guys that you trust that
[53:34] Speaker 3: operate the offense at a really high level. Obviously, when
[53:37] Speaker 3: it's been his best in Detroit, it's been a really
[53:39] Speaker 3: good offense, and he operated that at an extremely high
[53:42] Speaker 3: and efficient level for several years, and last year they
[53:45] Speaker 3: fall upon hard times just kind of in general, but
[53:48] Speaker 3: I give him a lot of credit for his operation
[53:49] Speaker 3: of that offense and his ability to maximize that system.
[53:52] Speaker 3: It was really such a great marriage with him and
[53:54] Speaker 3: Ben Johnson in so many different ways. And now there's questions,
[53:57] Speaker 3: and they'll be questions again. I think he's proven kind
[53:59] Speaker 3: of who he is as a quarterback, and it's up
[54:01] Speaker 3: to if this is your guy, and there's not many
[54:03] Speaker 3: guys better than them in the league. Even if you
[54:05] Speaker 3: want to say he's never going to be a top guy,
[54:06] Speaker 3: and I think that's fair, I don't he'll never be
[54:08] Speaker 3: somebody that we talk about in tier one, whereas some
[54:10] Speaker 3: of these other guys, even ahead of him and maybe
[54:12] Speaker 3: behind him, have a clear chance to be a number one,
[54:15] Speaker 3: be it, to be in that top tier at some
[54:16] Speaker 3: point in their careers if they keep progressing. And that's
[54:18] Speaker 3: probably off the table for Jared Goff, but who he
[54:21] Speaker 3: is is something a lot of teams would have benefited.
[54:23] Speaker 3: And there's a lot of teams that could have won
[54:25] Speaker 3: and been in Super Bowls if they had a quarterback
[54:27] Speaker 3: as clean as him that ended up being postseason disappointments
[54:30] Speaker 3: because their guy wasn't up to the up to the
[54:33] Speaker 3: up to par the way that he's been.
[54:34] Speaker 1: I think even in the playoffs, it's all totally fair.
[54:37] Speaker 1: It's still wild to have traded away Matthew Stafford and
[54:41] Speaker 1: have a case for did we win that trade? You know,
[54:44] Speaker 1: for everything that it's set up for the Detroit Lions
[54:46] Speaker 1: and getting golf as not a throw in, but as
[54:49] Speaker 1: something that they basically didn't have to give up any
[54:51] Speaker 1: value for because of his contract is incredible. I am
[54:54] Speaker 1: struggling here with my next pick. You know, you have
[54:58] Speaker 1: the class that twenty four guys and Caleb and Jayden
[55:01] Speaker 1: in the mix for this season and alone, I do
[55:07] Speaker 1: feel good about Trevor Lawrence. I've never been a Trevor
[55:09] Speaker 1: Lawrence guy in general. Seventeen, even last season where it
[55:15] Speaker 1: was kind of a breakout season, how it ended, he
[55:18] Speaker 1: was seventeenth in success rate, below average and in completion
[55:21] Speaker 1: percentage over expected. In QBR the stat profile wasn't like incredible,
[55:26] Speaker 1: but the closing stretch was excellent. He was under pressure
[55:30] Speaker 1: a lot, and he takes sacks. I want to see
[55:32] Speaker 1: it again, and yet I do have a feeling and
[55:36] Speaker 1: maybe I'm falling a little bit for the offseason. Oki
[55:38] Speaker 1: dooke that year two of Liam Cohen, it's gonna lock in.
[55:42] Speaker 1: He's never maybe had the quarterback instincts for lack of
[55:47] Speaker 1: a better word, that you want to see out of
[55:49] Speaker 1: your elite guy that he has to maybe be in
[55:52] Speaker 1: the right system. He is now in the right system,
[55:55] Speaker 1: and I think this is going to be a really
[55:56] Speaker 1: strong twenty twenty six for Trevor Lawrence.
[56:00] Speaker 3: Hmm, okay, a little bit of a difference here. I
[56:03] Speaker 3: have Trevor Lawrence seventeenth For me, I am a fan.
[56:07] Speaker 3: Last year the progress was exciting to me. I still
[56:11] Speaker 3: have some questions. I still think that he's less than
[56:14] Speaker 3: the sum of his parts, which has kind of been
[56:16] Speaker 3: the story of his career so far, as like this
[56:18] Speaker 3: guy is all the talent in the world but just
[56:20] Speaker 3: doesn't quite hasn't quite put it together consistently. What happened
[56:23] Speaker 3: for Jacksonville with adding Liam Cohen, adding Jacoby Myers, Brenton
[56:28] Speaker 3: Strange's breakout, even with Brian Thomas having this down year,
[56:31] Speaker 3: Travis Cunner getting heard and not really being a huge
[56:34] Speaker 3: offensive weapon right away, What's position is he going to play?
[56:37] Speaker 3: Even with that, I think that Trevor Lawrence the ability
[56:41] Speaker 3: that they had as an offense to open up the
[56:44] Speaker 3: middle of the field for him, and for the first
[56:46] Speaker 3: time in his career, he became a guy that would
[56:48] Speaker 3: confidently throw the ball between the numbers, between ash and
[56:50] Speaker 3: the middle of the field and make those throws with anticipation.
[56:54] Speaker 3: That is the most interesting thing to me with Trevor Lawrence.
[56:57] Speaker 3: I think a lot of the other foibles in his
[56:58] Speaker 3: game remained the same, and like you still has there's
[57:01] Speaker 3: still some recklessness to him at times. There's some panic
[57:04] Speaker 3: to him at times, I think, and there's some things
[57:06] Speaker 3: I don't necessarily like. But if he becomes a guy
[57:09] Speaker 3: who can off the play action, off the systems that
[57:11] Speaker 3: Liam Cohen creates, will now throw the ball to every
[57:14] Speaker 3: area of the field, my interest in him goes way
[57:18] Speaker 3: up as a quarterback because I think he's going to
[57:20] Speaker 3: lock himself into being a tier two guys how I
[57:22] Speaker 3: put it basically, and then who knows from there where
[57:24] Speaker 3: it'll go if he can iron out some of the
[57:26] Speaker 3: other things in his game. But for most of his
[57:28] Speaker 3: career he's just has never been consistent or confident thrown
[57:30] Speaker 3: in the middle of the field, throwing with anticipation, throwing
[57:33] Speaker 3: in there, throwing accurately, throwing on time, reading defenses there,
[57:36] Speaker 3: et cetera, et cetera. It just hasn't happened for him,
[57:39] Speaker 3: and that is I think the area of the field
[57:41] Speaker 3: that most quarterback if you're talking about how do you
[57:44] Speaker 3: go from being okay or good to great and moving
[57:46] Speaker 3: up tiers at quarterback play, Being able to throw in
[57:49] Speaker 3: that area of the field consistently at a high level
[57:52] Speaker 3: is a big differentiator, and that wasn't the case for
[57:55] Speaker 3: him until that trade. For Myers. You can see all
[57:57] Speaker 3: the numbers. You can see their success rate as a
[57:59] Speaker 3: passing attack. You can see their drop back, their EPA
[58:02] Speaker 3: per dropback in the ten to nineteen yard range. Between
[58:04] Speaker 3: the numbers, everything skyrockets and goes up. You can watch
[58:07] Speaker 3: the tape and watch him throw the ball there. He
[58:09] Speaker 3: finally had at players that he trusted there and that
[58:11] Speaker 3: was a big part of it, but also he bought in.
[58:13] Speaker 3: He bought it to the system, and I think there
[58:15] Speaker 3: were really good things with him now. Consistency is a
[58:17] Speaker 3: big factor. It just hasn't been there for him to
[58:20] Speaker 3: really all levels of the field before last year second
[58:22] Speaker 3: half of the season was the best we've ever seen him.
[58:24] Speaker 3: I'm a huge Liam going believer. Maybe they can get
[58:27] Speaker 3: everything else right around him to where this kind of
[58:29] Speaker 3: ends up looking bad for me because he's just going
[58:32] Speaker 3: to play way better within everything finally being right, and
[58:35] Speaker 3: he's frankly, it's been a disaster around him for a
[58:37] Speaker 3: lot of his career so far. But I think he's
[58:40] Speaker 3: got the best chance of anybody to like rise up
[58:43] Speaker 3: this or these ranks pretty much from this range where
[58:45] Speaker 3: I have him up higher than this because of the
[58:47] Speaker 3: factors around him.
[58:49] Speaker 1: Yeah, I had him fourteenth, So I don't know why
[58:51] Speaker 1: I'm reaching even on my own board, but when I
[58:53] Speaker 1: looked at him compared to some of the younger guys,
[58:57] Speaker 1: I am giving a little bit of an edge to
[59:00] Speaker 1: everything that he's seen in the NFL that they have
[59:04] Speaker 1: not that I think some of the younger quarterbacks are
[59:06] Speaker 1: going to go through some ups and downs and I
[59:08] Speaker 1: do think he's going to be in a little bit
[59:09] Speaker 1: of a sweet spot of having the right coach to
[59:12] Speaker 1: help to navigate everything that defenses are throwing at him
[59:17] Speaker 1: and em betting a little bit on it clicking. Like,
[59:19] Speaker 1: I have never seen him as some generational prospect because
[59:25] Speaker 1: of what you said, because of the inconsistent he just
[59:27] Speaker 1: doesn't hit throws as much as you.
[59:29] Speaker 2: Want him to hit it.
[59:30] Speaker 1: It's a little maddening even when he has the right
[59:32] Speaker 1: idea of when and where to go with it, Like
[59:36] Speaker 1: he's often been a tick late, and I really did
[59:39] Speaker 1: see that sort of improvement last year to the point
[59:41] Speaker 1: where I'm like, Okay, I think him next to Goff
[59:44] Speaker 1: is interesting because I do see them they're very different
[59:47] Speaker 1: players but in the same sort of idea that if
[59:51] Speaker 1: they are in the right scheme, and I think they
[59:54] Speaker 1: both are right now, that you can win a lot
[59:56] Speaker 1: of games with him.
[59:57] Speaker 2: All Right, I'm curious where you go thirteenth.
[59:59] Speaker 3: So for me, this guy was actually eleventh on my
[1:00:02] Speaker 3: board and thirteenth now in our draft. But I had
[1:00:04] Speaker 3: Jayden Daniels and I know last season he's a little
[1:00:08] Speaker 3: bit of a hard one to crack because it's like well,
[1:00:09] Speaker 3: last season. Everybody wanted to put him in five or
[1:00:11] Speaker 3: six after the season, and he had this unbelievable season
[1:00:14] Speaker 3: as a rookie, and it was it was a little
[1:00:16] Speaker 3: bit of pumped the brakes, like, let's see what it
[1:00:18] Speaker 3: looks like over larger sample size. We honestly didn't get
[1:00:21] Speaker 3: that big much bigger of a sample size because he
[1:00:23] Speaker 3: only had two hundred and forty four dropbacks last season,
[1:00:25] Speaker 3: and really was he healthy for many of those in
[1:00:28] Speaker 3: and out of the lineup. Played Week one and two, hurt,
[1:00:31] Speaker 3: played a couple of weeks that hurt, then back for
[1:00:33] Speaker 3: Week fourteen for reasons that no one understands, and you know,
[1:00:36] Speaker 3: it just he was never really healthy last season. And
[1:00:38] Speaker 3: so if that sustains, obviously this will look bad. But
[1:00:41] Speaker 3: I'm just gonna assume that because there wasn't a major
[1:00:43] Speaker 3: injury that took place here, that he's going to be
[1:00:44] Speaker 3: healthy again. Maybe he just continues to have nagging injuries
[1:00:47] Speaker 3: and that Durrell's his career, and you know, if that's
[1:00:49] Speaker 3: how it is, But I mean, this guy is utterly
[1:00:51] Speaker 3: brilliant as a rookie, like one of the best quarterbacks
[1:00:53] Speaker 3: in the league. Not just doing cookie cutter stuff, lots
[1:00:56] Speaker 3: of difficult throws, lots of difficult plays down the field,
[1:01:00] Speaker 3: evolved as a full field player, I thought accurate to
[1:01:02] Speaker 3: all levels of the field, great execute or great decision maker,
[1:01:05] Speaker 3: you know. I thought that was probably an undersold part
[1:01:07] Speaker 3: of it. Maybe is there like potential for him to
[1:01:09] Speaker 3: be a guy that takes too many sacks? Maybe, but
[1:01:12] Speaker 3: that's kind of true for these guys who are like
[1:01:14] Speaker 3: unbelievable athletes at their position, that maybe they do that
[1:01:17] Speaker 3: early in their career and then they kind of figure
[1:01:18] Speaker 3: it out as they go. So I have some questions
[1:01:21] Speaker 3: with him, But I also think the ceiling is way higher.
[1:01:24] Speaker 3: So I'm really interested in that guy who I thought
[1:01:27] Speaker 3: was clearly a top ten guy after his rookie season.
[1:01:29] Speaker 3: I mean, he played at a top ten level, I
[1:01:31] Speaker 3: should say that year, and you were like, oh, yeah,
[1:01:33] Speaker 3: he could easily be in this conversation, I just thought
[1:01:36] Speaker 3: last year he was hurt most of the time, and
[1:01:38] Speaker 3: when he in, the situation around him was worse. They
[1:01:39] Speaker 3: had other injuries as well, the Stuff and McLaurin in
[1:01:42] Speaker 3: the offseason, and just like never getting back to where
[1:01:44] Speaker 3: they were as a full offense. There was a lot
[1:01:47] Speaker 3: of stuff, and I still didn't think he was like
[1:01:50] Speaker 3: that bad, Like there were some things that were definitely concerned,
[1:01:52] Speaker 3: but he wasn't like a disaster as all that happened,
[1:01:54] Speaker 3: and then he was never healthy. So I just to me,
[1:01:57] Speaker 3: I'm feeling like I'm not that much lower on them
[1:02:00] Speaker 3: that I was coming out of his rookie season. I
[1:02:02] Speaker 3: just want to see him play. I think it was
[1:02:03] Speaker 3: one of the worst parts of last season that we
[1:02:05] Speaker 3: didn't get to see this absolutely brilliant, likable leading the
[1:02:09] Speaker 3: Commanders back after Snyder all this stuff, like it was
[1:02:12] Speaker 3: just so fun, and then we just didn't get to
[1:02:14] Speaker 3: see it last season really at all. And so they're
[1:02:16] Speaker 3: like top of my league pass rankings, Like I can't
[1:02:19] Speaker 3: wait to watch Washington. I think jayde Daniels is a star,
[1:02:22] Speaker 3: and I hope that he still plays at that level.
[1:02:24] Speaker 3: But he's the guy that I would want if I'm
[1:02:25] Speaker 3: getting outside that tier, and I'm just like, who gives
[1:02:28] Speaker 3: me the best chance to get into Tier two, tier one?
[1:02:30] Speaker 3: Maybe even after the season, I would still take him
[1:02:33] Speaker 3: over some of the other younger guys that we're probably
[1:02:34] Speaker 3: about to discuss.
[1:02:36] Speaker 1: Yeah, I had him thirteen, So he ends up landing
[1:02:38] Speaker 1: exactly where I had him in mind. My main issue
[1:02:42] Speaker 1: with him because you can see the vision look in
[1:02:45] Speaker 1: a perfect world, I mean, incredible accuracy and incredible decision
[1:02:48] Speaker 1: making is quite a combination you can see, like in
[1:02:53] Speaker 1: the highest of high outcomes for Jade Daniels, He's got
[1:02:56] Speaker 1: a lot of Joe Burrow plus running to him, which is,
[1:03:00] Speaker 1: you know, a league MVP type of player. My problem
[1:03:04] Speaker 1: is I just haven't seen him in a normal offense
[1:03:06] Speaker 1: yet in the NFL, so they're essentially like a no
[1:03:09] Speaker 1: huddle offense. I think he'll be able to adjust, but
[1:03:12] Speaker 1: he's trying to figure out when to run when not to.
[1:03:15] Speaker 1: And it's just the injuries. It's the fact that it's
[1:03:18] Speaker 1: not just his size, but that it was you know,
[1:03:20] Speaker 1: a handful of different ones, that it's a hamstring, it's
[1:03:23] Speaker 1: a knee, the elbow, I guess I'm less concerned about,
[1:03:26] Speaker 1: but an elbow on a quarterback is obviously concerning. So
[1:03:29] Speaker 1: that combination with his overall size is really the only
[1:03:34] Speaker 1: reason why. Yeah, for me, like he's at thirteen and
[1:03:37] Speaker 1: not in a higher tier. Just betting on that ceiling,
[1:03:39] Speaker 1: I'll pair him with Caleb Williams next at fourteen. I
[1:03:44] Speaker 1: think we probably I don't want to speak for you,
[1:03:46] Speaker 1: but you know, I almost don't know what to do
[1:03:48] Speaker 1: with Caleb Williams at this point of his career because like,
[1:03:53] Speaker 1: the reason he has to put on the Superman cape
[1:03:57] Speaker 1: is because he's done a ton of frustrating things before that,
[1:04:00] Speaker 1: and I think you can forget that, like among qualified passers,
[1:04:06] Speaker 1: he was dead last behind JJ McCarthy was second to last,
[1:04:09] Speaker 1: and completion percentage over expected like his you know, his accuracy,
[1:04:13] Speaker 1: it really comes and goes. And yet I don't want
[1:04:16] Speaker 1: to discount the playmaking because you know, the idea is
[1:04:20] Speaker 1: to win football games, and his ability to do that
[1:04:23] Speaker 1: in the biggest of moments in his combination. I think
[1:04:25] Speaker 1: PFF stats are helpful here that he's second in big
[1:04:29] Speaker 1: time throw rate, but you know, fifth in terms of
[1:04:33] Speaker 1: you know, his sack rate is an incredible combination of
[1:04:36] Speaker 1: big plays and avoiding negative plays. So even though his
[1:04:40] Speaker 1: best games like they were a little erratic and he's
[1:04:42] Speaker 1: holding onto the ball forever, the longest time to throw
[1:04:45] Speaker 1: in the league, and the rest of the stats are
[1:04:46] Speaker 1: more middle of the pack, like QBR all that stuff
[1:04:49] Speaker 1: is a lot of it is middle of the pack.
[1:04:51] Speaker 1: You are betting on a young, extremely talented player who
[1:04:56] Speaker 1: had some thing's click for mentally last year. Just continuing
[1:05:01] Speaker 1: that progression, and he certainly has a chance to make
[1:05:04] Speaker 1: both of us look dumb for even letting him go
[1:05:06] Speaker 1: this far in the draft.
[1:05:08] Speaker 3: He does, Yeah, I mean, he's one of the guys
[1:05:10] Speaker 3: that I think could be really you know, a big
[1:05:13] Speaker 3: riser that's not going to surprise anyone. You know, maybe
[1:05:15] Speaker 3: it'll be surprised some people why Daniel's higher, But I'm
[1:05:19] Speaker 3: definitely a fan. I thought the progression last year was
[1:05:21] Speaker 3: pretty wild. The I mean, what did he go from
[1:05:24] Speaker 3: a pressure to pressure to sack rate went from twenty
[1:05:28] Speaker 3: eight point two percent in twenty twenty four to nine
[1:05:32] Speaker 3: point six percent in twenty twenty five. That is insane.
[1:05:36] Speaker 3: And he held the ball point twenty seconds longer. So
[1:05:38] Speaker 3: he was just nothing about his like is this sustainable?
[1:05:43] Speaker 3: What you would say? Heck, though, there's no way he
[1:05:45] Speaker 3: could sustain this. He is and all He's made this
[1:05:48] Speaker 3: point and I think it's absolute spot on when you
[1:05:51] Speaker 3: watch him. He's the fastest guy to the edge of
[1:05:53] Speaker 3: any quarterback in the league, right, and that's crazy. I
[1:05:55] Speaker 3: don't think people just said, oh, pure speed he's just
[1:05:58] Speaker 3: so quick and so he out of the pocket so
[1:06:01] Speaker 3: fast and basically what he had to be, because I
[1:06:04] Speaker 3: don't think he's ever going to be just like you're
[1:06:06] Speaker 3: paint by numbers quarterback. Like I don't think he's ever
[1:06:08] Speaker 3: it's always going to be hard to compare him to
[1:06:10] Speaker 3: everybody else. What you hope with Kailee Williams, I think
[1:06:12] Speaker 3: is that he gets on this hot streak at the
[1:06:14] Speaker 3: right time because he can do that, he's so special
[1:06:17] Speaker 3: out of structure. He's one of the guys that might
[1:06:19] Speaker 3: be able to live there more often than others and
[1:06:21] Speaker 3: still be good. Now. I think he still has to
[1:06:23] Speaker 3: keep getting better within structure, and that was last year.
[1:06:25] Speaker 3: He did take steps in that way that was obvious.
[1:06:28] Speaker 3: But he is probably the top guy in the league
[1:06:31] Speaker 3: right now out of structure on a consistent base. Now
[1:06:33] Speaker 3: he spends more time there, So maybe it's an unfair comparison,
[1:06:35] Speaker 3: and maybe Mahomes and Allen and Jackson at the peak
[1:06:38] Speaker 3: of their powers can still play that way, but they've
[1:06:40] Speaker 3: learned to play other ways too, and Williams will need
[1:06:42] Speaker 3: to keep evolving there. But he's unbelievably special when it
[1:06:46] Speaker 3: comes to getting the edge of the defense, making throws plays.
[1:06:48] Speaker 3: We saw that in the playoffs, Like just all kinds
[1:06:50] Speaker 3: of unbelievable stuff from him. So the fact that his
[1:06:53] Speaker 3: style of play after a season where it looked like
[1:06:57] Speaker 3: none of it was going to translate to the NFL
[1:06:59] Speaker 3: because he kept trying to play the same way. It
[1:07:00] Speaker 3: was a complete disasters or rookie. His style play from
[1:07:03] Speaker 3: college going to the NFL and being able to work
[1:07:06] Speaker 3: on a really successful season for the team, not just
[1:07:08] Speaker 3: him individually, is unbelievably exciting stuff from a viewing perspective
[1:07:12] Speaker 3: because he is appointment viewing right. I mean, he is
[1:07:17] Speaker 3: all the things that fans on Twitter love to talk
[1:07:20] Speaker 3: about with quarterback play. He is those things. And so
[1:07:22] Speaker 3: because of that, the brand is going to be strong,
[1:07:24] Speaker 3: and that's really good for the league, really good for
[1:07:26] Speaker 3: the Bears, really good for people like you and I
[1:07:28] Speaker 3: who love watching players. This exciting play. I think in
[1:07:31] Speaker 3: between that there are still a lot of things that
[1:07:33] Speaker 3: need work, but this is a totally appropriate range for
[1:07:36] Speaker 3: him and a player that I think if those things,
[1:07:38] Speaker 3: you know, to the degree that they already improved last season,
[1:07:41] Speaker 3: if that keeps up, man like, we could really be
[1:07:44] Speaker 3: talking about something Greg. It would be really really fun
[1:07:46] Speaker 3: if he's able to be this unorthodox different than everybody
[1:07:49] Speaker 3: else in the league zig while everybody else zags type
[1:07:52] Speaker 3: of player. I would be really excited to kind of
[1:07:55] Speaker 3: be able to compare him year after year to some
[1:07:57] Speaker 3: other players and around the league because he's so different
[1:07:59] Speaker 3: at this position.
[1:08:00] Speaker 1: I mean, Bears fans are gonna be honking, this is
[1:08:02] Speaker 1: way too low. Why Why is Kale Williams at fourteen
[1:08:05] Speaker 1: if Drake may is at five? I think it points
[1:08:09] Speaker 1: to what I talked about to start the show, that
[1:08:12] Speaker 1: it's a really deep position right now. We still have
[1:08:14] Speaker 1: good players remaining to talk about. But there were early
[1:08:18] Speaker 1: moments in Stafford's career, in Carson Palmer's career, in different
[1:08:24] Speaker 1: like young ascending quarterbacks who are like going into a season,
[1:08:27] Speaker 1: it's like, well, you thought, okay, there's six, there's seventh,
[1:08:30] Speaker 1: you know, and that's kind of where Caleb Williams is now.
[1:08:32] Speaker 1: But there's just too many, you know, proven players ahead
[1:08:35] Speaker 1: of them. I have to admit I am regretting that
[1:08:37] Speaker 1: Trevor Lawrence pick, that the Lawrence pick in Herbert over Stafford,
[1:08:41] Speaker 1: Like I immediately thought twice about I feel pretty good
[1:08:46] Speaker 1: about who I would take fifteenth. I'm curious if it'll
[1:08:49] Speaker 1: be the same one for you.
[1:08:50] Speaker 2: Let's see c J.
[1:08:51] Speaker 3: Stroud is the guy.
[1:08:52] Speaker 1: Yes, that was mine too, he was like a solid fifteen.
[1:08:55] Speaker 1: I don't know why. Actually, so far we've gone off,
[1:08:58] Speaker 1: we've ticked off my top fifteen and larder.
[1:09:00] Speaker 3: Wow, there's one guy left in my top fifteen. We
[1:09:03] Speaker 3: haven't talked about Lawrence just outside of it. For me, Yeah,
[1:09:07] Speaker 3: I think CJ. Stroud, I who actually have twelve fear
[1:09:09] Speaker 3: by the way, just the way that it's falling for
[1:09:11] Speaker 3: me because I Jane daniels Hire too, I would say
[1:09:15] Speaker 3: with Stroud, I get into this. I see it both ways.
[1:09:19] Speaker 3: Right where the postseason has been a mess, I mean
[1:09:21] Speaker 3: this this past post season was I don't think all
[1:09:23] Speaker 3: of his postseason has been a mess, but this past
[1:09:25] Speaker 3: postseason a lot of the worst games I've ever seen
[1:09:27] Speaker 3: in my life by a quarterback. I'm not gonna lie
[1:09:29] Speaker 3: like any level of greg that was completely insane. Now,
[1:09:31] Speaker 3: I've always been a Stroud guy, So you know, this
[1:09:34] Speaker 3: feels like a good range for him. Maybe like there
[1:09:36] Speaker 3: could you know, there could be arguments for him. You know,
[1:09:38] Speaker 3: some would make arguments that he should be you know,
[1:09:40] Speaker 3: four or five spots lower maybe than this, but because
[1:09:42] Speaker 3: the reasons, he buys a strong right with him, and
[1:09:44] Speaker 3: it wasn't this unbelievable year overall with him. I'm really
[1:09:48] Speaker 3: curious if does he want to be Joe Burrow? And
[1:09:51] Speaker 3: is anybody gonna let him be Joe Burrow? And if
[1:09:52] Speaker 3: he can't be Joe Burrow, is he ever gonna be good?
[1:09:55] Speaker 3: If he can't be Joe Burrow and the offensive line
[1:09:57] Speaker 3: is terrible, Like will it ever get to a great point?
[1:10:00] Speaker 3: I think there's real questions that I have there just
[1:10:03] Speaker 3: about like what kind of offense works best for him
[1:10:05] Speaker 3: in the league. Not to the level I've always said
[1:10:07] Speaker 3: this about Kyler Murray. I'm like, I think it's extremely
[1:10:10] Speaker 3: difficult to build an offense that this guy can be
[1:10:12] Speaker 3: successful in the league with Stroud, I don't ask that question.
[1:10:15] Speaker 3: Maybe necessarily, I just don't know how many teams want
[1:10:17] Speaker 3: to play the way he might want to play. And
[1:10:19] Speaker 3: that's evidence by looking at Joe Burrow and the way
[1:10:21] Speaker 3: Burrow plays and the way Cincinnati's played, where you can say,
[1:10:24] Speaker 3: are they ever going to evolve, they ever going to change?
[1:10:26] Speaker 3: They ever going to do this or that? They're ever
[1:10:27] Speaker 3: going to modernize all this stuff. But the reality is
[1:10:30] Speaker 3: they're playing the way that they're playing because the quarterback
[1:10:32] Speaker 3: wants to play that way, and that hasn't really happened
[1:10:34] Speaker 3: in Houston, and so I wonder if that is going
[1:10:38] Speaker 3: to just negatively affect his career. And then I wonder
[1:10:41] Speaker 3: if he does get to play that way for a
[1:10:43] Speaker 3: sutent long period of time, is he consistent enough to
[1:10:47] Speaker 3: be able to do that? Because it is quarterback on difficult,
[1:10:49] Speaker 3: high difficulty mode. And I think he's brilliant and I
[1:10:51] Speaker 3: think he has a lot of similarities to Burrow in
[1:10:53] Speaker 3: some ways, but it's not that easy to pull off,
[1:10:55] Speaker 3: and we don't see a lot of guys pull it
[1:10:57] Speaker 3: off because it's not that easy. So I just have
[1:11:00] Speaker 3: questions if they have ever found like a symbiotic this
[1:11:03] Speaker 3: is what we want to be nature to Stroud and
[1:11:06] Speaker 3: an OC and play caller and system. And so I
[1:11:08] Speaker 3: think because of that, you're seeing like more cracks with
[1:11:12] Speaker 3: him as a player, Like he hasn't been unbelievable in
[1:11:15] Speaker 3: these other systems. And I think obviously this is one
[1:11:18] Speaker 3: of been one of the worst offensive lines in football
[1:11:21] Speaker 3: during most of his time there, especially the last couple
[1:11:24] Speaker 3: of years. So there's all these factors that sort of
[1:11:26] Speaker 3: collide to get like this maybe picture that isn't it's
[1:11:29] Speaker 3: just not quite as grandiose as we maybe thought it
[1:11:31] Speaker 3: was going to be after that rookie season. But I
[1:11:33] Speaker 3: still think he's pretty good, and I still think the
[1:11:35] Speaker 3: potential is there for him to be really good. The
[1:11:37] Speaker 3: stuff I've seen him do, the high derogreed difficulty stuff
[1:11:40] Speaker 3: i've seen him do, I'm really intrigued by and I'm
[1:11:43] Speaker 3: very high on. So I won't quit him for sure
[1:11:46] Speaker 3: yet after this next season. If it goes kind of
[1:11:49] Speaker 3: some of this last season, I probably will have to
[1:11:52] Speaker 3: slide him down because I understand people's doubt of whether
[1:11:55] Speaker 3: this is even the guy. There's been even the should
[1:11:57] Speaker 3: he get the next contract questions, which I would for
[1:12:00] Speaker 3: sure be given him an X contract, But I understand
[1:12:03] Speaker 3: I think there is maybe a little downside there, the
[1:12:05] Speaker 3: panicky nature to some things, and the mistake prone ball
[1:12:09] Speaker 3: when he plays that way, which wasn't the case for
[1:12:12] Speaker 3: early in his career and has become a little more
[1:12:14] Speaker 3: of the case. The sacks and all this kind of stuff.
[1:12:16] Speaker 3: It's it is somewhat concerning, so I would say for
[1:12:19] Speaker 3: the first time I'm concerned about CJ. Stroud, but not
[1:12:22] Speaker 3: enough to have him lower than.
[1:12:24] Speaker 2: This same I believe. I've always been a believer.
[1:12:29] Speaker 1: Last year was way better than people recognized, just even
[1:12:33] Speaker 1: just if you just look at the numbers. He was
[1:12:35] Speaker 1: eleventh in QBR for instance. That was higher than Lawrence
[1:12:38] Speaker 1: and Goff and Herbert and Caleb and Darneld eleventh in EPA.
[1:12:42] Speaker 1: So those are like two different advanced stats that kind
[1:12:44] Speaker 1: of have him in that area. That's ahead of Burrow
[1:12:46] Speaker 1: and Lawrence. He took less sacks, he avoided pressure last year,
[1:12:50] Speaker 1: and yet John, I'm at the same point as you
[1:12:53] Speaker 1: where I'm a little more worried right now than I've
[1:12:57] Speaker 1: ever been because I actually thought the tape at times
[1:13:00] Speaker 1: was worse because it previewed what happened in the playoffs,
[1:13:06] Speaker 1: which was whatever the opposite of oh, he has a
[1:13:11] Speaker 1: bad play and then he has amnesia and he forgets
[1:13:14] Speaker 1: about it and moves on whatever the opposite of that,
[1:13:16] Speaker 1: Like CJ. Stroud might might have been one of the
[1:13:18] Speaker 1: worst quarterbacks in the league when he got in a
[1:13:20] Speaker 1: hole last year, he would stay in a hole. And
[1:13:24] Speaker 1: there's three, four or five games where you can see
[1:13:27] Speaker 1: him getting frustrated, you can see it on his face,
[1:13:29] Speaker 1: and his play just doesn't give him a chance to
[1:13:32] Speaker 1: win for a couple quarters straight. And that to me
[1:13:35] Speaker 1: was new, and that was a streakiness, and I think
[1:13:39] Speaker 1: it came out in the worst possible way in the playoffs. Look,
[1:13:42] Speaker 1: I think he's come out and everything I hear from
[1:13:46] Speaker 1: this offseason sounds great. I'm optimistic that he'll get past
[1:13:49] Speaker 1: that because then the type of career I think he
[1:13:53] Speaker 1: can have is very similar to what Dak Prescott is having. Like,
[1:13:56] Speaker 1: I think he can be that level of quarterback and
[1:13:59] Speaker 1: play in a similar way, and I, if I had
[1:14:02] Speaker 1: to guess, I think he's going to get there. But
[1:14:04] Speaker 1: the streakiness and sort of the the holes that he
[1:14:07] Speaker 1: would get in mentally, that's not what you want out
[1:14:10] Speaker 1: of your quarterback. And so that that is concerning.
[1:14:13] Speaker 3: Yeah, no doubt. I mean, the downside stuff is clear.
[1:14:16] Speaker 3: People are not wrong about the aspects of play that
[1:14:19] Speaker 3: they've been concerning recently. But I do think there's a
[1:14:21] Speaker 3: path forward with him. It's better than the one that
[1:14:23] Speaker 3: they've just left behind. I'm just not sure they're going
[1:14:26] Speaker 3: to find it. And so because of that, I may
[1:14:27] Speaker 3: not look right about this, and you know, I'll obviously
[1:14:30] Speaker 3: make my excuses, but like at the end of the day,
[1:14:32] Speaker 3: trying to be right. So I understand why people wouldn't
[1:14:34] Speaker 3: want to have them asigh.
[1:14:36] Speaker 1: I had a pretty clear top fifteen and that was it.
[1:14:39] Speaker 1: It's a little bit of a drop off there. There's
[1:14:41] Speaker 1: actually not anyone that I'm excited to take next, struggling
[1:14:46] Speaker 1: I have.
[1:14:46] Speaker 3: I have a disagreement with that. There's one way I
[1:14:49] Speaker 3: left that I'm tell me, Okay, I'm a believer.
[1:14:54] Speaker 1: Give me bout bikes. Okay, I mean I'm next. So
[1:14:58] Speaker 1: I just I'm going to take that pick he was show.
[1:15:01] Speaker 1: I'll show you by board. I mean he is next.
[1:15:03] Speaker 1: But I'm not as excited to take. It's partly because
[1:15:06] Speaker 1: of the injury, which I shouldn't be that concerned about.
[1:15:08] Speaker 1: That he's coming off of surgery. He's gonna be ready
[1:15:10] Speaker 1: for training camp. I don't love that the injury happened
[1:15:14] Speaker 1: on one of those rollouts. And I do think that
[1:15:21] Speaker 1: he's a stable quarterback, and yet like so much of
[1:15:25] Speaker 1: his game is on the move, Like it feels too much.
[1:15:27] Speaker 1: Can you build the whole plane out of a quarterback
[1:15:30] Speaker 1: that just throws on the root move, whether it's designed,
[1:15:32] Speaker 1: whether it's scrambling, whether it's just you know, throwing.
[1:15:35] Speaker 2: He is great at it.
[1:15:36] Speaker 1: And yet you know you want to see him win
[1:15:38] Speaker 1: from the pocket a little bit. It's a lot of
[1:15:40] Speaker 1: hitch routes. He actually led the league in hitch routes,
[1:15:42] Speaker 1: not Jalen Hurts, which you would have thought. He's better
[1:15:46] Speaker 1: when he's trailing. But ultimately I had him here that
[1:15:49] Speaker 1: this was my sixteenth guy. Even though I had a
[1:15:51] Speaker 1: tier break. He backed up his rookie year. I think
[1:15:54] Speaker 1: he built on it. He had more big plays, he
[1:15:57] Speaker 1: had more mistakes, I think as well. But he does
[1:15:59] Speaker 1: have sachs And even if he's not making a lot
[1:16:03] Speaker 1: of big plays, specifically John when he gets pressured ANDGS
[1:16:07] Speaker 1: had him as the fewest air yards for completion when pressured,
[1:16:11] Speaker 1: he still had enough big plays in the arsenal. And
[1:16:15] Speaker 1: he was really good in late and close situations, third
[1:16:19] Speaker 1: down situations, third and long situations. Those are the situations
[1:16:22] Speaker 1: you want your quarterback to to be nails, and ultimately
[1:16:25] Speaker 1: he was. He played great in that game, and they
[1:16:27] Speaker 1: could have been going to the super Bowl if not
[1:16:29] Speaker 1: for that injury.
[1:16:32] Speaker 3: No doubt I think that, and I was not. Again,
[1:16:35] Speaker 3: another guy was not high on bot X coming out
[1:16:37] Speaker 3: as a prospect. Didn't get it, you know, I like
[1:16:40] Speaker 3: all these you know this offense at Oregon, they kind
[1:16:42] Speaker 3: of like basically made him fake play quarterback after he
[1:16:45] Speaker 3: was pretty bad. I thought. At Auburn, and I remember
[1:16:47] Speaker 3: watching him early in his college crowds like this guy's
[1:16:49] Speaker 3: a hype prospect, like hyped high school recruit, I guess
[1:16:53] Speaker 3: I should say, And I was like, man, I don't
[1:16:55] Speaker 3: see it. And the way he's just kept going like
[1:16:57] Speaker 3: he's smart. First of all, I think that's under sold
[1:17:00] Speaker 3: and that's a big reason why he took the leap
[1:17:02] Speaker 3: he did. Actually didn't think his rookie year was like
[1:17:04] Speaker 3: okay to me, but I wasn't. I was like a
[1:17:06] Speaker 3: little bit like, I think his rookieyears kind of overrated.
[1:17:08] Speaker 3: And maybe it was, or maybe I just didn't see
[1:17:10] Speaker 3: what was coming. But I think there was some rough
[1:17:13] Speaker 3: stuff early in the season with him, and after that
[1:17:16] Speaker 3: he was pretty much really good for the most part,
[1:17:20] Speaker 3: I think, And I think you're right about the all
[1:17:23] Speaker 3: structure play and just like obviously I've harp done that already,
[1:17:26] Speaker 3: but we're in a range again where I'm like just
[1:17:28] Speaker 3: looking at, like what's the potential for him? And he
[1:17:30] Speaker 3: got better in structure, got better thrown in the middle
[1:17:32] Speaker 3: of the field. Those were weaknesses of a rookie season.
[1:17:34] Speaker 3: He got better just making quick decisions and getting the
[1:17:37] Speaker 3: ball out a little bit faster to the point where
[1:17:39] Speaker 3: I think it's more palatable. And then he just continues
[1:17:41] Speaker 3: to avoid sacks. And after that early stretch in the season,
[1:17:44] Speaker 3: he's not been a high turnover guy either. And then
[1:17:46] Speaker 3: he's made really hydro good difficulty throws too, so you
[1:17:49] Speaker 3: get less of the valleys, more of the peaks, and
[1:17:52] Speaker 3: then a little bit better in structure play not good
[1:17:55] Speaker 3: enough yet still I think he's got to continue growing
[1:17:57] Speaker 3: in that regard. And then he's really good athlete, unbelievable,
[1:18:01] Speaker 3: Like in terms of functional athleticism, he's really really good.
[1:18:04] Speaker 3: He doesn't get hit very often. He is not going
[1:18:07] Speaker 3: to get sacked very often. That's been proven through two
[1:18:09] Speaker 3: years of his career, playing all these games, all these dropbacks,
[1:18:13] Speaker 3: he's just rarely, that's rarely happening to him. And he's
[1:18:15] Speaker 3: not like he's just like a quick release guy like
[1:18:17] Speaker 3: Jared Goff either, like he's holding the ball and making
[1:18:20] Speaker 3: plays and not having the downside plays in those situations. Now,
[1:18:24] Speaker 3: one year sample size, yeah, okay, I don't know, two
[1:18:27] Speaker 3: years sample size. Yeah, I'm starting to become a bowliever now'
[1:18:31] Speaker 3: that's long and short of it.
[1:18:33] Speaker 1: Yeah, we both had him at sixteen. And it's a
[1:18:36] Speaker 1: fair point because he I mean, he was pretty thrilling
[1:18:39] Speaker 1: in that playoff game in the second half in such
[1:18:42] Speaker 1: a high leverage moment, and his highs have been higher
[1:18:46] Speaker 1: than I would have expected. And you're right, it was
[1:18:50] Speaker 1: a big step forward. I do worry about like the
[1:18:52] Speaker 1: you know, surgeries after each of his seasons and some
[1:18:55] Speaker 1: lower body injuries and Sean Payton and him going at
[1:18:58] Speaker 1: it about the medical stuff. It's a little and certain.
[1:19:00] Speaker 1: All right, we're halfway through this, John. We got to
[1:19:02] Speaker 1: get you back to work. So what we're gonna do
[1:19:05] Speaker 1: is we're gonna pick up the pace for the second half.
[1:19:08] Speaker 1: We're gonna we're gonna We're not gonna go rapid fire.
[1:19:10] Speaker 1: We're gonna give these quarterbacks their love, but we will
[1:19:13] Speaker 1: we will go a little faster down the stretch.
[1:19:15] Speaker 2: But we're halfway through. You're up with number seventeen.
[1:19:18] Speaker 3: I actually had Sam Darnald ahead of Rock Party and
[1:19:21] Speaker 3: Trevor Lawrence, even though I think it's a conversation, those
[1:19:24] Speaker 3: guys are on the same tier. So he would be
[1:19:26] Speaker 3: he's fifteenth for me, what' seventeenth I think for us
[1:19:29] Speaker 3: in our draft, and that would be my top seventeen
[1:19:30] Speaker 3: basically then would be off the board. So we're we're
[1:19:33] Speaker 3: just a little bit different of an order basically there,
[1:19:35] Speaker 3: I think with Donald with me, I'm just.
[1:19:37] Speaker 2: Really very different.
[1:19:38] Speaker 1: If you've got Donald over Perdy Lawrence, yeah I can
[1:19:41] Speaker 1: see that, and yeah, I've got feel dumb about Lawrence.
[1:19:44] Speaker 3: Well I've got Donald one spot over Perty. And I've
[1:19:47] Speaker 3: gone back and forth on this, so I think there's
[1:19:48] Speaker 3: a lot of different ways to see it. Because Perdy,
[1:19:51] Speaker 3: I think has been better now for like consistently who
[1:19:53] Speaker 3: he is for longer, which is like a pretty good guy,
[1:19:55] Speaker 3: a guy in this rangel like or a little bit
[1:19:57] Speaker 3: higher maybe in the best moments of his career for
[1:20:00] Speaker 3: a couple of years now. And Donald there is still
[1:20:02] Speaker 3: like this unpredictability to like he's great for Minnesota, then
[1:20:06] Speaker 3: he like falls apart at the end of the season.
[1:20:07] Speaker 3: It's like, oh, like and you know, last year mostly
[1:20:10] Speaker 3: great for Seattle and they obviously win the Super Bowl.
[1:20:12] Speaker 3: For last season, he wasn't just good for Seattle. He
[1:20:14] Speaker 3: was like in the MVP conversation. I think people forget
[1:20:17] Speaker 3: about that, but for most of the season he was
[1:20:18] Speaker 3: in that conversation and playing at a really, really high
[1:20:21] Speaker 3: level for a team that was among the best in
[1:20:23] Speaker 3: the league that entire time. The operation of the offense,
[1:20:26] Speaker 3: being able to play pure drop back football, hiding your
[1:20:28] Speaker 3: difficulty throws down the field, like a lot of that
[1:20:30] Speaker 3: stuff's there now. I'll take a lot of sacks. He'll
[1:20:33] Speaker 3: get hit some like he makes some boneheaded throws. He
[1:20:35] Speaker 3: throws the other team sometimes and he you know, there's
[1:20:38] Speaker 3: there's real lows to him where we talked about with Bonix,
[1:20:41] Speaker 3: like there's not really the valley he's like as much
[1:20:43] Speaker 3: there's us with with tam Donald, Like I don't know
[1:20:46] Speaker 3: that that's ever gonna not that's ever going to completely
[1:20:48] Speaker 3: go away. But he has a lot of physical and
[1:20:50] Speaker 3: mental tools, ability to play different ways in different systems
[1:20:53] Speaker 3: that give you a real fighting chance. I think you
[1:20:56] Speaker 3: can design some different things. And he doesn't have a
[1:20:58] Speaker 3: skill set that's like, oh, there's lit on it. He
[1:21:00] Speaker 3: can't do all these different things, take everything off the menu.
[1:21:03] Speaker 3: There's obviously he operated this offense to specifically play acts
[1:21:07] Speaker 3: and stuff, but he could throw the middle of the field.
[1:21:09] Speaker 3: He throws the ball down the field aggressively. He's not
[1:21:12] Speaker 3: going to be scared, so you don't take a ton
[1:21:14] Speaker 3: off the menu with him, which is why I really
[1:21:16] Speaker 3: like him. And so this range, I think, I just
[1:21:20] Speaker 3: won a Super Bowl. Maybe he wasn't the number one
[1:21:22] Speaker 3: factor in that, but I also don't think he was
[1:21:24] Speaker 3: like a forgotten factor of that either. It wasn't like
[1:21:27] Speaker 3: this team was grind, ground and pound football and just
[1:21:30] Speaker 3: great defense, all throwback team. And obviously the defense was awesome,
[1:21:33] Speaker 3: but it wasn't like that was the style football that
[1:21:35] Speaker 3: they played. He had to be he had to make
[1:21:37] Speaker 3: plays in almost all these games, and he consistently made him.
[1:21:40] Speaker 3: And so I think he's more than just to you know,
[1:21:43] Speaker 3: plug anybody in there and they would have done this
[1:21:44] Speaker 3: last year. I don't think that at all. I think
[1:21:46] Speaker 3: he's a good player. So he probably this group I
[1:21:50] Speaker 3: think going up to maybe one more after Trevor Lawrence,
[1:21:52] Speaker 3: we'll talk about the next guy. Eighteenth on my list.
[1:21:55] Speaker 3: He's the most just a hard one. To figure out,
[1:21:57] Speaker 3: I think, but those that probably ends the guys that
[1:22:00] Speaker 3: I'm like excited about in the league is being a
[1:22:02] Speaker 3: starting quarterback for free. But I think about the point
[1:22:03] Speaker 3: where I feel pretty decent if Sam Donald was my
[1:22:06] Speaker 3: starting quarterback compared to what the downside could be with
[1:22:08] Speaker 3: about half the rest of the league.
[1:22:10] Speaker 1: But yeah, fourth and completion percentage over expected nineteenth in
[1:22:13] Speaker 1: QBR but ninth and pff, he's even his numbers are
[1:22:16] Speaker 1: all over the place. Yeah, he's His weaknesses are still
[1:22:19] Speaker 1: what they've always been. He led the NFL and interceptions
[1:22:22] Speaker 1: against the guy's coverages and turned it over a lot
[1:22:25] Speaker 1: when pressured in general.
[1:22:26] Speaker 2: But the highs the pluses.
[1:22:28] Speaker 1: You mentioned that down the field, throws really good and
[1:22:31] Speaker 1: his functional athleticism is really good.
[1:22:34] Speaker 2: I think too, in terms of what he can do
[1:22:36] Speaker 2: with the rollouts.
[1:22:37] Speaker 1: I have him in this tier of kind of for me,
[1:22:39] Speaker 1: it's like a sixteen, seventeen to twenty tier of guys
[1:22:43] Speaker 1: you're happy with, you can obviously win with, And yeah,
[1:22:46] Speaker 1: he's right smack in the middle of that tier for me.
[1:22:48] Speaker 2: I have Hurts next.
[1:22:49] Speaker 1: I don't know if that's who you were referring to
[1:22:51] Speaker 1: as Jalen Hurts, who's a tough one to deal with.
[1:22:54] Speaker 1: Now you have him much lower. Ultimately, I gotta give
[1:22:56] Speaker 1: him much, but yeah, okay, I gotta give him some
[1:22:59] Speaker 1: respective He's four years now removed from his coming in
[1:23:02] Speaker 1: second in MVP. The biggest concern I have with him
[1:23:06] Speaker 1: because his strengths and weaknesses have been talked to death. Look,
[1:23:11] Speaker 1: he's an outside the numbers thrower. He's a good deep
[1:23:13] Speaker 1: ball thrower, but he teams know what he's good at,
[1:23:16] Speaker 1: what he's not good at. I'm just worried that his
[1:23:19] Speaker 1: running ability is not coming back, and that that would
[1:23:23] Speaker 1: really make him a much more limited quarterback because his
[1:23:28] Speaker 1: short yardage running straight ahead. He's never been as good
[1:23:31] Speaker 1: side to side as people thought. But it really added
[1:23:33] Speaker 1: a lot of value and I think opened up things
[1:23:35] Speaker 1: that that it worries me. But I'm gonna I'm gonna
[1:23:39] Speaker 1: give him some credit for durability and not assume that
[1:23:42] Speaker 1: the athleticism is gone. And obviously you know you can
[1:23:47] Speaker 1: perform at a high level with him when things are clicking.
[1:23:50] Speaker 3: We're in that group of quarterbacks now for me, there's
[1:23:52] Speaker 3: three guys left where I think like their highs are
[1:23:54] Speaker 3: good enough to still be in the top twenty for me,
[1:23:58] Speaker 3: but we're in we've entered eighteen nineteen twenty range for
[1:24:01] Speaker 3: me of quarterbacks, which is kind of where I see
[1:24:04] Speaker 3: maybe a tear break right now. I'd say, where these
[1:24:06] Speaker 3: guys I don't trust every week to be good and
[1:24:09] Speaker 3: maybe they're just straight up and negative for my team.
[1:24:13] Speaker 3: And so Hurts is in that group. He's the second
[1:24:15] Speaker 3: one in this three person group that I have. But
[1:24:18] Speaker 3: the highs are also I mean, Jalen Hurts has played
[1:24:20] Speaker 3: two of the best games in a Super Bowl that
[1:24:22] Speaker 3: we've seen, and I struggle to rectify that with the
[1:24:25] Speaker 3: rest of what the player I watch weekly in the league.
[1:24:28] Speaker 3: And I'm just like, man, there's just so this offense
[1:24:30] Speaker 3: is so limited. He won't throw it to certain hears
[1:24:32] Speaker 3: of the field, he doesn't play with instructor, he doesn't
[1:24:33] Speaker 3: trust people. He only throws certain types of balls. You
[1:24:36] Speaker 3: have to have a great run game. The protection's amazing,
[1:24:39] Speaker 3: and yet still he holds it and holds it and
[1:24:41] Speaker 3: he's really not that unbelievable creator. And I just see
[1:24:44] Speaker 3: all these limitations show up when I'm watching him week
[1:24:46] Speaker 3: to week to week, and then he just lights it
[1:24:48] Speaker 3: on fire in two Super Bowls, and I'm like, look,
[1:24:50] Speaker 3: he played out of his mind, got one.
[1:24:52] Speaker 2: Of those years.
[1:24:53] Speaker 1: He was pretty great the whole season, and that's when
[1:24:55] Speaker 1: he had he had the running. I mean, one thing
[1:24:57] Speaker 1: he's not going to do is is throw it in
[1:25:00] Speaker 1: and turn the ball over. So that combination of just
[1:25:03] Speaker 1: some big plays with being very careful with the ball.
[1:25:06] Speaker 1: But yeah, he can be a frustrating guy to watch.
[1:25:09] Speaker 2: All right. Who else is in this tier for you
[1:25:10] Speaker 2: at nineteen?
[1:25:10] Speaker 3: So Baker Mayfield's one spot ahead of him. Yeah, me
[1:25:13] Speaker 3: and you could make any of those, you know, But
[1:25:15] Speaker 3: he's another one that again, I love that you don't
[1:25:17] Speaker 3: have to take stuff off the menu with him. He's
[1:25:19] Speaker 3: a physical arm strength, he has anough athleticism. You can
[1:25:21] Speaker 3: do kind of anything you want with your offense with
[1:25:23] Speaker 3: the Mipothetically, you just have to accept the fact that
[1:25:26] Speaker 3: everything you do is going to be inconsistent because he's
[1:25:28] Speaker 3: not a consistent player. He will get super hyped up
[1:25:31] Speaker 3: in the pocket to hold the ball. He won't throw
[1:25:33] Speaker 3: it open. People turn down plays and you just have
[1:25:36] Speaker 3: all these frustrations with them. So there's a ton on
[1:25:38] Speaker 3: the menu. He can make every throw on the field.
[1:25:41] Speaker 3: He's the moxie, the leadership, all that kind of stuff.
[1:25:44] Speaker 3: I think you have more questions there with Hurtz. Although
[1:25:47] Speaker 3: some people praise Hurts for it, there's obviously been some drama.
[1:25:50] Speaker 3: There's been enough smoke there where there has to be
[1:25:52] Speaker 3: some fire right over the years. With Baker, I think
[1:25:55] Speaker 3: there obviously there was early in his career in Tampa Bay.
[1:25:57] Speaker 3: It's been nothing but like praise for him and that
[1:25:59] Speaker 3: regard like they love the demeto the player, everybody in
[1:26:02] Speaker 3: the team loves like. All that stuff is positives right
[1:26:04] Speaker 3: at this point with him and the fact that you
[1:26:06] Speaker 3: can operate an offense with him. He's also an unbelievable
[1:26:08] Speaker 3: ball handler. Kind Of an underrated part about his game
[1:26:10] Speaker 3: is that the run game in Tampa got to be
[1:26:12] Speaker 3: so versatile that year under Cohen because he was such
[1:26:15] Speaker 3: a good ballhandled They could do all the pony stuff
[1:26:17] Speaker 3: in the fakes, and that was a real compelling part
[1:26:19] Speaker 3: of his game. But there's just some limitations. He's gonna
[1:26:21] Speaker 3: make a lot of mistakes. He's gonna miss throws, he's
[1:26:23] Speaker 3: gonna miss open guys. He's not gonna play within the
[1:26:26] Speaker 3: structure all the time as often as you want him too.
[1:26:28] Speaker 3: He's gonna invite his own pressure, and you just have
[1:26:30] Speaker 3: to live with this roller coaster a little bit with
[1:26:32] Speaker 3: him that you know, is clearly better than some of
[1:26:35] Speaker 3: the guys behind him in the last half league spots
[1:26:38] Speaker 3: in this list or whatever, twelve thirteen spots, but just
[1:26:40] Speaker 3: not as good as the peak guys.
[1:26:43] Speaker 1: I think he's like this tier especially, is again proving
[1:26:47] Speaker 1: the point that I'm talking about the fact that Baker Mayfield,
[1:26:50] Speaker 1: who's coming off one of his you know, worst seasons.
[1:26:52] Speaker 1: I would say, although he sat in up and down career,
[1:26:54] Speaker 1: but certainly in Tampa, but still like nineteen twenty at
[1:26:57] Speaker 1: an EPA and success rate and twelfth QBR, he scrambled
[1:27:01] Speaker 1: way too much last year, Like he's just taken off.
[1:27:04] Speaker 1: He was making it happen for a while, but the
[1:27:06] Speaker 1: percentage when he was pressured, you know, And that's the
[1:27:08] Speaker 1: thing you mentioned, the streakiness. But the fact that he's nineteenth,
[1:27:12] Speaker 1: I mean, I really do believe if you went and
[1:27:15] Speaker 1: looked at at some of the years, like there was
[1:27:18] Speaker 1: a really dire perier, like at the end of the
[1:27:19] Speaker 1: twenty tens, where like what Baker is right now would
[1:27:23] Speaker 1: be like the ninth best quarterback in the NFL. So
[1:27:26] Speaker 1: I don't blame the Bucks for thinking and really knowing
[1:27:29] Speaker 1: that they can win with Baker.
[1:27:30] Speaker 2: He's just streakier.
[1:27:31] Speaker 1: I have Kyler Murray next at twenty, and the numbers
[1:27:37] Speaker 1: have always been kind of middle of the pack, but
[1:27:39] Speaker 1: how he gets there is frustrating. He doesn't. He reminds
[1:27:44] Speaker 1: me a little bit of Trevor Lawrence, maybe a better
[1:27:46] Speaker 1: version of him for most of his career, but that.
[1:27:50] Speaker 2: There's a part.
[1:27:51] Speaker 1: Of reading the game and instincts, and by reading the game,
[1:27:55] Speaker 1: I mean when to push doing one thing, when to
[1:27:58] Speaker 1: know when to take a risk. It's almost like Tyler
[1:28:00] Speaker 1: has to be told like, Okay, start running more. Then
[1:28:03] Speaker 1: he starts running more for a little while, and then
[1:28:05] Speaker 1: he pulls back from running more. Throw to the middle
[1:28:07] Speaker 1: of the field more than he's instead of it all
[1:28:09] Speaker 1: just naturally flowing. And yet at his best he's incredible
[1:28:14] Speaker 1: and he's talented, and even with the ups and downs,
[1:28:18] Speaker 1: he's a solid starting quarterback with a real ceiling. There's
[1:28:22] Speaker 1: been streakiness to it, but I mean, man, he throws,
[1:28:24] Speaker 1: He throws a pretty ball and is a hell of
[1:28:27] Speaker 1: a runner. I think at this point of his career
[1:28:29] Speaker 1: it's going to be figuring out calibrate how to avoid
[1:28:31] Speaker 1: the hits, when to run, when not to and everything.
[1:28:33] Speaker 1: But I totally get why the Vikings made that bet,
[1:28:37] Speaker 1: and I would have made it even.
[1:28:38] Speaker 2: If you had to pay him much more money and
[1:28:40] Speaker 2: they didn't have to.
[1:28:42] Speaker 3: Yeah, one of the peak examples of this type of player,
[1:28:44] Speaker 3: right were just these crazy hot streaks that there's been
[1:28:47] Speaker 3: what four or five times in his career where after
[1:28:49] Speaker 3: a three week stretch, people like Gause, Kyler Murray and
[1:28:50] Speaker 3: the MVP conversation that you questioned if he's a starting
[1:28:53] Speaker 3: quarterback the next week like it. So just yeah, it
[1:28:56] Speaker 3: doesn't play consistly within the structure of an offense. I
[1:28:59] Speaker 3: really question the leader stuff with him. I questioned some
[1:29:01] Speaker 3: of that aspect of the game with him, like the
[1:29:04] Speaker 3: ability to consistently buy no team concepting to get other
[1:29:06] Speaker 3: people to buy, and I think that's important at this position.
[1:29:08] Speaker 3: I don't know that he's ever done that at a
[1:29:10] Speaker 3: high level. I don't know that he's ever bought in himself.
[1:29:12] Speaker 3: He will loves to play hero mode, not a structure,
[1:29:15] Speaker 3: and obviously he's great traits, but that's just not led
[1:29:17] Speaker 3: to a lot of consistency in his career, so a
[1:29:20] Speaker 3: guy I wouldn't necessarily be excited about my team taking
[1:29:22] Speaker 3: as a quarterback. But he is also twentieth for me,
[1:29:24] Speaker 3: so same top twenty different orders for us. My next
[1:29:28] Speaker 3: guy would be huge question mark. I really don't know
[1:29:31] Speaker 3: where to go from here. There's a bunch of cases,
[1:29:34] Speaker 3: the budget cases that can be made, and it's for
[1:29:36] Speaker 3: twenty twenty six, is what I keep telling myself. Who
[1:29:39] Speaker 3: all up for twenty twenty six? And I think, I
[1:29:43] Speaker 3: think that I don't know, but I think the answer
[1:29:46] Speaker 3: is the answer Daniel Jones. It feels so unfun to me,
[1:29:49] Speaker 3: but the answer might be Daniel Jones.
[1:29:52] Speaker 2: It's fine.
[1:29:52] Speaker 1: He's always been better than people thought when he was
[1:29:55] Speaker 1: the worst court, you know, and he was terrible, and
[1:29:57] Speaker 1: he's not as good as people thought.
[1:29:59] Speaker 2: Certainly in the first half of last year.
[1:30:01] Speaker 1: They if you're if you have healthy Danny Dimes, this
[1:30:04] Speaker 1: is you know, he deserves to be here. Or if
[1:30:07] Speaker 1: you had healthy Danny Dimes, you might even want them,
[1:30:09] Speaker 1: you know, Yeah, a couple of spots higher.
[1:30:11] Speaker 3: You might. And he played well last season, and you know,
[1:30:14] Speaker 3: I have to give some credit to that. I think
[1:30:16] Speaker 3: if he hadn't played well, last season. I don't think
[1:30:17] Speaker 3: even think I had him in this tier, but that
[1:30:19] Speaker 3: offense was a really good one, and like the system
[1:30:21] Speaker 3: around him, like he wasn't like in a mess like
[1:30:24] Speaker 3: he was with the Giants, And so I am a
[1:30:26] Speaker 3: little bit compelled if he hadn't gotten hurt, Like could
[1:30:28] Speaker 3: he be a guy who like would be maybe more
[1:30:30] Speaker 3: in the Baker tier, Like would he be in the
[1:30:32] Speaker 3: high teens or you know, he's twenty one from a year,
[1:30:35] Speaker 3: so it's not like he's much lower than that, but like,
[1:30:37] Speaker 3: you know, maybe there's something like that too, So maybe
[1:30:39] Speaker 3: he's the safest bet. There are guys with way more
[1:30:41] Speaker 3: upside than him though that I'm sure you will pick next.
[1:30:43] Speaker 1: So like that's compelling to heavy heavy play action last year,
[1:30:48] Speaker 1: it sounds positive the torn achilles that he'll be ready
[1:30:51] Speaker 1: for training camp was crazy good, unsustainably good, avoiding Saxon
[1:30:55] Speaker 1: and versus pressure early last season. I don't know, I
[1:30:58] Speaker 1: don't think I'm taking someone that you would take. Here,
[1:31:01] Speaker 1: I'll plant another flag that I'm happy to do, which
[1:31:04] Speaker 1: is after watching Tyler Shuck's tape last year talk about
[1:31:08] Speaker 1: being wrong about a player, I was solo on Schuck
[1:31:11] Speaker 1: coming into the draft. Just thought he wasn't going to
[1:31:13] Speaker 1: be able to handle pressure, and he did take a
[1:31:17] Speaker 1: lot of sacks. That is the number one concern that
[1:31:20] Speaker 1: I have for him. But man, he also hung in there,
[1:31:23] Speaker 1: like Ryan Tannehill style, just getting destroyed and making some
[1:31:27] Speaker 1: really good next level bros. The only quarterbacks that had
[1:31:32] Speaker 1: to higher pressure to sack ratio, by the way last
[1:31:34] Speaker 1: year was Gino Smith, who Chuck almost kind of reminds
[1:31:38] Speaker 1: me of sometimes with the way that he can throw
[1:31:40] Speaker 1: the ball into smaller windows and over the middle of
[1:31:42] Speaker 1: the field, and Brady Cook. But I loved how fast
[1:31:45] Speaker 1: he got through his reads, the arm was strong enough,
[1:31:47] Speaker 1: a lot of opposite field, and I just thought he
[1:31:50] Speaker 1: showed more as a rookie. So for twenty twenty six,
[1:31:52] Speaker 1: I'd rather have him than dart Or Ward. I think
[1:31:56] Speaker 1: he showed a lot. He's no Drake May, But in
[1:31:58] Speaker 1: the same way that I felt like I know what
[1:32:00] Speaker 1: I saw from Drake May's rookie year and made me
[1:32:02] Speaker 1: feel good, I feel like I know what I saw
[1:32:04] Speaker 1: from Tyler Shuck. I think he's an NFL quarterback that
[1:32:06] Speaker 1: the health is obviously a bit of a concern, you know,
[1:32:09] Speaker 1: based on college, but I like Tyler Suck this.
[1:32:11] Speaker 3: Year, well, since I was just being a coward until
[1:32:14] Speaker 3: you picked one of the second year quarterback O, because
[1:32:16] Speaker 3: I just have absolutely no idea what to think coming
[1:32:18] Speaker 3: off of those rookie years where Shuck did look like
[1:32:21] Speaker 3: the best guy down the stretch. He was situation was
[1:32:23] Speaker 3: just strength. Frankly, way better than the one cam Ward
[1:32:26] Speaker 3: was in. For sure, Jackson Dard looked good at times.
[1:32:29] Speaker 3: He also has hurt all the time. His play is
[1:32:32] Speaker 3: really reckless. I just I don't know that twenty twenty six,
[1:32:35] Speaker 3: even though you could say he was better than Ward
[1:32:37] Speaker 3: and you know, maybe as good as Shuk last year,
[1:32:39] Speaker 3: at some points at least, I don't know that I'd
[1:32:42] Speaker 3: he would be high my list twenty twenty six. I
[1:32:44] Speaker 3: just really questioned whether he's going to stay on the field.
[1:32:46] Speaker 3: I have other questions about cam Ward. I have questions
[1:32:48] Speaker 3: about Bryce Young. I'm going to go for Anando Mendoza.
[1:32:50] Speaker 3: We can do that, right, We can take rookie.
[1:32:52] Speaker 2: Ye, Yes, yeah, we should have. We should have talked
[1:32:54] Speaker 2: about it. Did I think I did?
[1:32:55] Speaker 1: I pointed out in Tech we can take multiple raiders
[1:32:57] Speaker 1: if you want. You know who knows chains gets taken
[1:33:01] Speaker 1: here he might.
[1:33:02] Speaker 3: I think I'm just like, I mean, what this is
[1:33:04] Speaker 3: twenty third for me? I think on my list twenty diffs,
[1:33:07] Speaker 3: So this range like, yeah, this is where I'm good
[1:33:10] Speaker 3: guy would like to go into twenty twenty six with
[1:33:12] Speaker 3: Fernanda Mendozo. If the other twenty two guys ahead of
[1:33:14] Speaker 3: him are off the list, I would just rather shoot
[1:33:17] Speaker 3: that shot and take that chance. I think there's a
[1:33:19] Speaker 3: real chance that he's the guy long term. I don't
[1:33:21] Speaker 3: think he's unbelievable. I don't think this is an unbelievable prospect,
[1:33:24] Speaker 3: but I think he's a pretty good one. I think
[1:33:25] Speaker 3: the floor might be higher than some other guys we've
[1:33:28] Speaker 3: seen at this position, even if you will wrestle with
[1:33:31] Speaker 3: what the ceiling is and how good the team around
[1:33:33] Speaker 3: him needs to be to reach that ceiling. I would
[1:33:37] Speaker 3: rather be in that conversation, I think, than some of
[1:33:39] Speaker 3: these more unpredictable what does it happen week to week,
[1:33:41] Speaker 3: you know conversations. So if he was not in year one,
[1:33:45] Speaker 3: I would probably have him above Kyler and maybe other guys.
[1:33:48] Speaker 3: But like, I need to see it in the league
[1:33:50] Speaker 3: first before that's too disrespectful, I guess. But I think
[1:33:53] Speaker 3: I I think, I mean, I believe in him, maybe
[1:33:55] Speaker 3: more than cam Ward after seeing cam Woard this year,
[1:33:58] Speaker 3: and I think cam Ward's ceiling. You know the potent
[1:34:00] Speaker 3: what he could be, just when you look at some
[1:34:01] Speaker 3: of the high degree difficulty throws with him, or like
[1:34:04] Speaker 3: draw on the floor stuff, I just have no idea
[1:34:06] Speaker 3: if he's ever going to be consistent within the structure
[1:34:08] Speaker 3: of an offense getting the ball out that kind of stuff.
[1:34:10] Speaker 3: With Mendoza, I just feel better that you'll be able
[1:34:13] Speaker 3: to create something functional about him. You think about Sam
[1:34:15] Speaker 3: Darnold winning a Super Bowl, right like, I think he
[1:34:18] Speaker 3: could be that kind of quarterback. And obviously a lot
[1:34:19] Speaker 3: of things were right for Seattle, but I think that's
[1:34:21] Speaker 3: in the cards for Windoze would be that kind of guy.
[1:34:23] Speaker 3: And now he plays with that oftense coordner as his
[1:34:26] Speaker 3: head coach. So I'm I think I'm just more intrigued
[1:34:28] Speaker 3: by him than the guys below him, even though there's
[1:34:30] Speaker 3: certainly arguments for other players.
[1:34:33] Speaker 2: I think it's a good value.
[1:34:34] Speaker 1: He's more athletic than the people gave him credit for
[1:34:37] Speaker 1: ideal size. If he can pick up the getting through
[1:34:41] Speaker 1: his reads quickly, and I think there's some good signs
[1:34:43] Speaker 1: that he'll be able to do that. It's just hard
[1:34:45] Speaker 1: as a rookie. So I didn't take him any earlier.
[1:34:47] Speaker 1: But that's that's absolutely the right spot to take him out. Man,
[1:34:51] Speaker 1: we're still talking about the second year guys and yet.
[1:34:55] Speaker 3: Oh man, you're gonna do it? Take it? What Young?
[1:35:00] Speaker 3: Are you going to take them?
[1:35:01] Speaker 2: Yeah? Well that's yeah. How did you know?
[1:35:03] Speaker 1: Well him or Dart I'm thinking about Milk Willis is
[1:35:06] Speaker 1: in there. I want to just give Bryce Young some
[1:35:08] Speaker 1: love that. I think he improved on a lot of
[1:35:11] Speaker 1: things a little and that's how you get better, you know,
[1:35:14] Speaker 1: as a pro. I think he got to his checkdown quicker,
[1:35:17] Speaker 1: he avoided sacks better. His quick game was really good
[1:35:21] Speaker 1: and they were able to use it. It was the push
[1:35:22] Speaker 1: and pull of figuring out Canals' offense. There was more
[1:35:25] Speaker 1: empty formations finally, which I think is going to help him.
[1:35:28] Speaker 1: There was a little more extending plays. He's a good
[1:35:31] Speaker 1: outside the numbers thrower. There are limitations, but I do
[1:35:34] Speaker 1: think you're seeing the benefit of the experience that he's
[1:35:37] Speaker 1: had at the NFL level. So entering year four here,
[1:35:40] Speaker 1: I do like him a little better than those year
[1:35:43] Speaker 1: two guys. Because at least I feel like he's kind
[1:35:46] Speaker 1: of built up to where I know what he is
[1:35:48] Speaker 1: and what he isn't. But I feel okay with him
[1:35:51] Speaker 1: at twenty four.
[1:35:53] Speaker 3: I do too. I still think there's a solid player
[1:35:55] Speaker 3: in here. You could really make an argument that he
[1:35:57] Speaker 3: should be as high as twenty maybe, and I think
[1:36:00] Speaker 3: this should This will be a telling year. Right, There's
[1:36:02] Speaker 3: been like marginal improvement I think each year with him.
[1:36:05] Speaker 3: But it's been marginal, right, it hasn't. He went from
[1:36:08] Speaker 3: can he play in the league? Questions like that's where
[1:36:10] Speaker 3: I was at when he got bench Frandy Doll in
[1:36:12] Speaker 3: the beginning of year two, it was will he even
[1:36:14] Speaker 3: make it in the league? Like will this guy just
[1:36:15] Speaker 3: be out of the league because he's not that functional
[1:36:17] Speaker 3: as a backup you have to design a whole offense
[1:36:19] Speaker 3: around a super unique skill set. So like he really
[1:36:22] Speaker 3: is like the ultimate boom bust guy, but he's just
[1:36:25] Speaker 3: inching closer to booming, but he's just not really there either,
[1:36:28] Speaker 3: So like it's it's funny the space that he's found
[1:36:30] Speaker 3: himself in where he's like one of the players that
[1:36:32] Speaker 3: I would feel most surely will not be where he
[1:36:35] Speaker 3: is not like he will either be off this list entirely,
[1:36:39] Speaker 3: out of the league, out of the question, like maybe
[1:36:40] Speaker 3: just because of the pedigree, people will keep taking chances
[1:36:43] Speaker 3: at him on a roster, or he's going to make
[1:36:45] Speaker 3: a jump this year without Dave Canal's calm plays. And
[1:36:48] Speaker 3: I don't think Dave canl is necessarily the problem, but
[1:36:51] Speaker 3: I'm really curious to see if another approach. The whole
[1:36:54] Speaker 3: thing with Bryce Young has been similar to the Kyler
[1:36:56] Speaker 3: Murray question. I think, but Kyler Murray, I think he
[1:36:58] Speaker 3: doesn't want to ever buying any offense because he wants
[1:37:01] Speaker 3: to be his own guy. That's just who he is.
[1:37:03] Speaker 3: I think Bryce Young would buy in. I just think
[1:37:05] Speaker 3: he can't play in that many different offenses, Like so
[1:37:08] Speaker 3: the fact that how do we design a run? Canals
[1:37:10] Speaker 3: wants to run the ball, He wants to do all
[1:37:11] Speaker 3: these things. He wants to build this way. Well, Bryce
[1:37:14] Speaker 3: Young wants to spread it around and throw the ball
[1:37:16] Speaker 3: around the yard, like being a point guard type of quarterback.
[1:37:20] Speaker 3: And that's just hard, Like it's hard to structure a
[1:37:23] Speaker 3: lot of other things offensively off a quarterback who wants
[1:37:26] Speaker 3: to play that way. And we've mentioned that a couple
[1:37:27] Speaker 3: of times now, but I think that's the quandary of
[1:37:29] Speaker 3: the Panthers find themselves in, and Canal is recognizing maybe
[1:37:32] Speaker 3: I'm not the right guy to tap into everything that
[1:37:34] Speaker 3: he is, but it's way easier to place me than
[1:37:36] Speaker 3: the quarterback or so I'm just gonna try that and
[1:37:39] Speaker 3: if it doesn't work, I'll probably get fired anyway, like
[1:37:41] Speaker 3: if he doesn't progress, So I think making that move.
[1:37:44] Speaker 3: I'm really curious to see what happens this year with
[1:37:46] Speaker 3: Bryce Young. I could see a conversation of a way
[1:37:48] Speaker 3: that he gets into the top fifteen. If it does
[1:37:51] Speaker 3: all just work and he's this super unique player, unique system,
[1:37:55] Speaker 3: they have enough pieces now around him. You could see
[1:37:57] Speaker 3: Jalen Coker and Tetra McMillan and some of these guys
[1:37:59] Speaker 3: like hitting their peak right like this season just taking off.
[1:38:03] Speaker 3: And but he's gonna need to be like really good
[1:38:05] Speaker 3: in that type of system. That is going to put
[1:38:07] Speaker 3: a lot on his shoulders in terms of decision making,
[1:38:09] Speaker 3: you know, knowing where he's going with the ball, pre snap,
[1:38:11] Speaker 3: all that kind of stuff. And there's advantages to it
[1:38:14] Speaker 3: for an offense, but it also probably means your run
[1:38:16] Speaker 3: game menu will be really limited, which puts more on
[1:38:18] Speaker 3: his shoulders again, so it's going to be compelling. He
[1:38:21] Speaker 3: is either that guy to the max or he's not
[1:38:24] Speaker 3: a guy at all.
[1:38:26] Speaker 1: Yeah, Alex Smith has always been my compa, although he's
[1:38:28] Speaker 1: five inches shorter. Not exactly as a style, but more
[1:38:32] Speaker 1: of the career that I think Bryce Young can have
[1:38:35] Speaker 1: if everything goes well in the type of type of
[1:38:37] Speaker 1: ways that he won. All Right, you're up with twenty
[1:38:40] Speaker 1: five again. We got we gotta got to get you
[1:38:43] Speaker 1: back to the day job. But also everyone, as I mentioned,
[1:38:46] Speaker 1: should be checking out John on substack with Ali when
[1:38:51] Speaker 1: they do their podcast The Readoptional. But John also does
[1:38:53] Speaker 1: some great writing. There's a lot of Steelers, there's a
[1:38:55] Speaker 1: lot of Bucks. He's got to be the foremost Steelers
[1:38:59] Speaker 1: slash Bucks experts in the in.
[1:39:02] Speaker 3: The NFL, there are dozens of us. There are dozens
[1:39:05] Speaker 3: of us. There's like two guys that are more that
[1:39:08] Speaker 3: are compelling still to talk about to me, maybe three
[1:39:11] Speaker 3: Walls is certainly interesting. I'll take cam Ward next, though.
[1:39:13] Speaker 3: Just believe that I'm another pre draft. Wasn't great last year,
[1:39:16] Speaker 3: Still believe he can be better than that. How good
[1:39:18] Speaker 3: can he be? How volatile is he? Still questions there
[1:39:22] Speaker 3: I think, but I mean, the situations around so bad.
[1:39:24] Speaker 3: I don't feel like I learned that much from his
[1:39:26] Speaker 3: rookie season, So just based on that, maybe I should
[1:39:28] Speaker 3: have him higher. The only reason I don't is because
[1:39:30] Speaker 3: it's for twenty twenty six and I'm just not sure
[1:39:31] Speaker 3: that that much better, and so that's why he's not
[1:39:34] Speaker 3: highed to me. I think long term career wise, he
[1:39:37] Speaker 3: would be over He would be in the high teens
[1:39:38] Speaker 3: for me probably, or maybe even mid teens for me.
[1:39:41] Speaker 3: Probably mid teens for me, because I still do believe
[1:39:44] Speaker 3: there's a really good player in there. For twenty twenty six,
[1:39:47] Speaker 3: I don't know if it's gonna look great yet. I
[1:39:49] Speaker 3: think he's in just a one of the worst franchise,
[1:39:51] Speaker 3: one of the worst situations in the league.
[1:39:55] Speaker 2: That that's tough.
[1:39:57] Speaker 1: Look, the weapons are better, the the coaching hopefully should
[1:40:02] Speaker 1: be better. One concerning to me is he had he
[1:40:04] Speaker 1: had the lowest market completion percentage when receivers were open
[1:40:08] Speaker 1: last year, which you know, you see it on tape
[1:40:12] Speaker 1: like you know NGS measures, like a guy has three
[1:40:14] Speaker 1: you know yards of separation. His completion percentage on those
[1:40:17] Speaker 1: throws were the lowest, and so you want to see him,
[1:40:20] Speaker 1: you know, scramble just like a little bit more, but
[1:40:24] Speaker 1: he's got a chance. I the wow plays were wow
[1:40:27] Speaker 1: again a note of how deep the quarterback position is
[1:40:31] Speaker 1: that he would go this lay. I'll go Malik Willis
[1:40:33] Speaker 1: my top free agent the off season report shouldn't bother
[1:40:36] Speaker 1: me about how slow it's going picking up this offense.
[1:40:40] Speaker 1: But also it does bother me a little and just
[1:40:43] Speaker 1: reminds me of like, oh my god, Malik Washington's like
[1:40:46] Speaker 1: their number one receiver. This is gonna be so hard.
[1:40:49] Speaker 1: And Bobby Slowek is his offensive coordinator. But he might
[1:40:52] Speaker 1: be the best running quarterback in the NFL right now.
[1:40:55] Speaker 2: I think he is.
[1:40:56] Speaker 1: If I had to choose, who gives you the most
[1:40:59] Speaker 1: on the ground, is a pure runner make you miss
[1:41:02] Speaker 1: it's Malik Willis. That gives you a nice floor. He
[1:41:05] Speaker 1: had a lot of deep throws last year. Limited sample size,
[1:41:08] Speaker 1: but the talent is intriguing. Malik Willis at twenty six.
[1:41:11] Speaker 3: Yeah, gotta be fun to watch at the very least,
[1:41:13] Speaker 3: like I'm excited for that that part of it. I
[1:41:15] Speaker 3: think I will go Jackson Dard here. He's nobody's taking him, right,
[1:41:20] Speaker 3: He's still that's right. That they're still sitting there. I'll
[1:41:23] Speaker 3: take him. Uh just what were we at twenty twenty seven? Yes,
[1:41:30] Speaker 3: I'm really torn on him. I thought he was okay
[1:41:32] Speaker 3: as a prospect, where I think he got a lot
[1:41:34] Speaker 3: of hate. I was kind of like, I think he solid.
[1:41:36] Speaker 3: I'd you know, i'd take him in the second round. Like,
[1:41:38] Speaker 3: you know, I think he'd be that kind of a guy.
[1:41:40] Speaker 3: And I don't know if I would have traded up
[1:41:41] Speaker 3: for him or not, but I mean take him in
[1:41:43] Speaker 3: the second round for a quarterback. He kind of had
[1:41:44] Speaker 3: like a solid starter type of grade for me in
[1:41:46] Speaker 3: the league, like where he'd be in this range, probably
[1:41:48] Speaker 3: like maybe in the higher twenty a little bit higher
[1:41:50] Speaker 3: in the twenties and late late teens type of ceiling.
[1:41:54] Speaker 3: I think that's basically he is. Like I'm curious to
[1:41:56] Speaker 3: see what it looks like if he's when he's out
[1:41:57] Speaker 3: able to sustain health. I think Giants fans are going
[1:41:59] Speaker 3: to be pretty upset that he's that he's just low.
[1:42:01] Speaker 3: But you know, and i'd probably have him ahead of
[1:42:04] Speaker 3: Willis maybe personally, but you know, I think you could
[1:42:07] Speaker 3: make that argument either way. Willison is compelling and exciting,
[1:42:09] Speaker 3: and you know, I think both of these guys have
[1:42:12] Speaker 3: some you know, leadership tendencies that are going to be
[1:42:15] Speaker 3: a really interesting to tap into, very different in a
[1:42:18] Speaker 3: lot of ways, and so I think that there's going
[1:42:20] Speaker 3: to be when they're given sort of like the show
[1:42:22] Speaker 3: to run, what's that going to look like over a
[1:42:25] Speaker 3: longer period of time. I just really question that Dart
[1:42:28] Speaker 3: is going to like he seems like he just kind
[1:42:30] Speaker 3: of plays dumb football. And I don't mean like in
[1:42:32] Speaker 3: terms of turnovers, just like he's just kind of reckless
[1:42:34] Speaker 3: and doesn't really think through things when he does them.
[1:42:36] Speaker 3: And I you know, obviously the injuries are a part
[1:42:38] Speaker 3: of that, but like even plays where he wasn't injured,
[1:42:40] Speaker 3: there was a lot of just like, yeah, I can
[1:42:43] Speaker 3: take it, I can get hammered, and I just am
[1:42:44] Speaker 3: not sure, Like, but but the upside plays aren't like that.
[1:42:47] Speaker 3: But like he was like, oh, but he's all the
[1:42:49] Speaker 3: payoff on the other side of this creation. It's just unbelievable.
[1:42:52] Speaker 3: I didn't really see that. So there's definitely more of
[1:42:55] Speaker 3: a ceiling here than some of the guys ahead of him.
[1:42:57] Speaker 3: But I still have questions, I think, as to whether
[1:42:59] Speaker 3: he's going to sustained as an NFL starting quarterback to me, yeah, even.
[1:43:02] Speaker 1: Just comparing him and Willis for instance, like the baseline
[1:43:07] Speaker 1: of Willis is running, and then the experience that Willis
[1:43:12] Speaker 1: had in the Mattlefleur system for multiple years was kind
[1:43:15] Speaker 1: of the edge for me, whereas I feel like Dart's
[1:43:17] Speaker 1: gonna still need more season. I do think the athleticism
[1:43:21] Speaker 1: and the highs were a little higher, better than even expected.
[1:43:26] Speaker 1: But he was a first read quarterback really, Like once
[1:43:29] Speaker 1: it was after the first read, he's scrambling around. Things
[1:43:32] Speaker 1: didn't go that well. That's Jackson Dart at twenty seven.
[1:43:37] Speaker 1: Now we're really getting into it. The fact that Jackson
[1:43:40] Speaker 1: Darts twenty seven again.
[1:43:42] Speaker 2: It's pretty good. Like it wouldn't surprise me at all if.
[1:43:44] Speaker 1: Jackson Dart's a top ten quarterback at some point in
[1:43:46] Speaker 1: his career and he's fallen here at twenty seventh. I
[1:43:50] Speaker 1: think I'll take our guy, Mac Jones. Okay, the NFL,
[1:43:55] Speaker 1: you know it's every quarterback's a system quarterback, right, what's
[1:43:59] Speaker 1: the most popular system out there in the NFL? John,
[1:44:02] Speaker 1: what system dominates this league? We know Mac Jones fits
[1:44:05] Speaker 1: in this system. Hell, you can throw him in a
[1:44:07] Speaker 1: Jaguars weird system a couple of years ago, and actually
[1:44:09] Speaker 1: he could spin it pretty well for them too, So
[1:44:12] Speaker 1: he is an ideal backup really if you're in a pin.
[1:44:16] Speaker 1: He's a bridge starter one B.
[1:44:19] Speaker 2: But I.
[1:44:21] Speaker 1: Liked that he kind of combines understanding what to do
[1:44:25] Speaker 1: with aggressiveness. Not all out of athleticism obviously, but that's
[1:44:28] Speaker 1: why he's a backup. And I feel like he would
[1:44:31] Speaker 1: fit on a lot of teams and just kind of
[1:44:33] Speaker 1: upgrade your team.
[1:44:34] Speaker 3: Yeah, just the ceiling with him because there's not much
[1:44:37] Speaker 3: movement ability and I think just limited tools overall. But yeah,
[1:44:40] Speaker 3: he's definitely a guy that you can get to like
[1:44:42] Speaker 3: learn the system, master the system, play within the system,
[1:44:45] Speaker 3: and be solid for you. I think there's absolutely number.
[1:44:49] Speaker 2: His numbers are crazy.
[1:44:50] Speaker 1: Last year, he's like top five completion over expected, top
[1:44:53] Speaker 1: five success.
[1:44:53] Speaker 2: He lit up the Rams a couple of times.
[1:44:55] Speaker 1: Lit Up is maybe a little strong, but he played
[1:44:57] Speaker 1: well against the Rams in two games.
[1:45:00] Speaker 3: In this spot for me too. The other guy that
[1:45:01] Speaker 3: I still I will I'll take next year. It was
[1:45:03] Speaker 3: the twenty ninth Gino Smith. I know that last year
[1:45:07] Speaker 3: was just an absolute disaster. I still think there's some
[1:45:09] Speaker 3: bounce back potential there is that can happen with the Jets.
[1:45:12] Speaker 3: Probably not, But I still think his years of Seattle
[1:45:15] Speaker 3: were legit good and I don't think you could talk
[1:45:17] Speaker 3: me off his years in Seattle being legit good like
[1:45:19] Speaker 3: that that happened, that was real, And I don't know,
[1:45:22] Speaker 3: like I just still think he's not just going to
[1:45:24] Speaker 3: totally fall part as a player. The way that it
[1:45:25] Speaker 3: looked last season less He's was a complete disaster in
[1:45:28] Speaker 3: every stretch of the imagine, every semblance of the thing
[1:45:31] Speaker 3: was just a mess with the Raiders, and so I
[1:45:34] Speaker 3: even with the Jets, which is just a terrible going
[1:45:38] Speaker 3: for the Raiders of the Jets is truly should be
[1:45:40] Speaker 3: something that never happens to a player in their career,
[1:45:42] Speaker 3: but it's happened to Gino Smith that. But even then,
[1:45:44] Speaker 3: I think there's some the more of a chance for competency,
[1:45:48] Speaker 3: and I still think he's talented. So I mean, we're
[1:45:50] Speaker 3: talking about twenty ninth, so it's not any great shakes,
[1:45:53] Speaker 3: a great praise, but at least to be a high
[1:45:55] Speaker 3: and back of if not like a solid starter type.
[1:45:57] Speaker 3: I think you could look at the end of this
[1:45:59] Speaker 3: year and be like, Okay, yeah, he's back in like
[1:46:00] Speaker 3: the twenty range of quarterbacks. I don't think that's out of.
[1:46:03] Speaker 2: The question exactly where I had him.
[1:46:05] Speaker 1: I had these two twenty eight and twenty nine Mac
[1:46:07] Speaker 1: and Gino Smith, And the biggest upset of this entire
[1:46:10] Speaker 1: draft is that I didn't take Gino or Drake make
[1:46:12] Speaker 1: Maybe I'm trying to over correct my own biases because
[1:46:15] Speaker 1: I'm the president of Geno Nation. Only thirty five years old,
[1:46:20] Speaker 1: you know, I mean that's young for quarterbacks these days.
[1:46:23] Speaker 1: The story, the stories that have come out about just
[1:46:25] Speaker 1: the coaching and the offense with the Raiders, if nothing else,
[1:46:29] Speaker 1: He's going to give his receivers a chance. They like
[1:46:31] Speaker 1: the Jets reporters almost sound sad that they're like, it's
[1:46:35] Speaker 1: shocking how much better the quarterback play is in offseason practices.
[1:46:39] Speaker 2: And I'm just like, wow, it was rough there last year.
[1:46:42] Speaker 2: Rip justin Field too, who might not get taken here.
[1:46:45] Speaker 2: I don't know. I'm gonna go Kirk.
[1:46:49] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[1:46:49] Speaker 2: I thought he played well at the end of last season.
[1:46:52] Speaker 3: Me too.
[1:46:52] Speaker 1: I think he's just a little bit better version of
[1:46:54] Speaker 1: where Rogers is right now, Like neither one of them
[1:46:56] Speaker 1: want to get hit.
[1:46:59] Speaker 3: But if you just mean yeah, Yeah, Kirk's just better
[1:47:02] Speaker 3: playing within the offense, I think than Rodgers at this point.
[1:47:05] Speaker 3: Neither one I want to get hit, neither one will
[1:47:07] Speaker 3: get hit much. I just think Kirk's better at actually
[1:47:10] Speaker 3: like consistently playing tall airs of the field within a
[1:47:13] Speaker 3: structure of an offense than Rogers is at this point.
[1:47:16] Speaker 3: I think He's a little more fearless and a little
[1:47:19] Speaker 3: more capable of going different places with the ball than
[1:47:21] Speaker 3: Rodgers's not.
[1:47:22] Speaker 1: But this might this might be bucks coated because he
[1:47:24] Speaker 1: because Kirk Cousins is Todd Bowles is worst nightmare. So
[1:47:27] Speaker 1: you as a as a as a Bucks enthusiast, you know,
[1:47:30] Speaker 1: you see the best of Kirk. Although he really was
[1:47:33] Speaker 1: moving better and playing better a year further removed from Achilles,
[1:47:37] Speaker 1: So I think that was big Yeah yeah for him
[1:47:38] Speaker 1: and Rodgers, but especially for for Cousins last year. I
[1:47:43] Speaker 1: think he's a great backup.
[1:47:44] Speaker 3: He's perfect for the role that he's I would if
[1:47:46] Speaker 3: I was if I was Bucks coating Kirk Cousins performances,
[1:47:48] Speaker 3: I would have taken him top five because his last
[1:47:52] Speaker 3: three games against Tampa Bay have been unbelievable ways in
[1:47:56] Speaker 3: my pick.
[1:47:56] Speaker 1: Next, yeah, yeah is the Steelers guy gotta fight is
[1:47:59] Speaker 1: Rogers finally going off the board.
[1:48:01] Speaker 3: Youn't believe you're making me do this. I can't believe.
[1:48:03] Speaker 3: I really he's next on mine as well. I really
[1:48:08] Speaker 3: flirted with taking the guy that I have thirty second
[1:48:10] Speaker 3: over him, just to say I didn't take Aaron Rodgers because.
[1:48:14] Speaker 1: If you don't want to take the other guy, take
[1:48:15] Speaker 1: the other guy, because it'll I.
[1:48:17] Speaker 3: Don't think I could justify it at that. Steelers fans
[1:48:20] Speaker 3: will maybe they'll forgive me to having him to this point,
[1:48:24] Speaker 3: but I don't think they'd forgive my thirty second guy,
[1:48:26] Speaker 3: although I think there's a chance that happens. But Aaron
[1:48:28] Speaker 3: Rodgers thirty first, Yeah, I mean it feels right. That's
[1:48:31] Speaker 3: about the range for him. You know obviously you know
[1:48:33] Speaker 3: we have what two backups three backups ahead of him,
[1:48:36] Speaker 3: so like there's some I just think if you're talking
[1:48:40] Speaker 3: about like you still have a couple of plays in
[1:48:42] Speaker 3: you Yeah, sure he has that in them, but like
[1:48:44] Speaker 3: consistently sustainably good quarterback play. No, And he's also making
[1:48:48] Speaker 3: more mistakes with the football. He had some terrible turnovers
[1:48:51] Speaker 3: last year, fumbles, the sacks that he does take. It's
[1:48:53] Speaker 3: just an absolute car crash in the back for like,
[1:48:55] Speaker 3: he doesn't offend him, he has no like, he just
[1:48:58] Speaker 3: is like it's like he doesn't want to be out there.
[1:49:00] Speaker 3: But then he gets hit and it's just like a
[1:49:01] Speaker 3: ton of bricks. He's flying all over the place the body.
[1:49:03] Speaker 3: Every time he gets hit, he looks like he's not
[1:49:05] Speaker 3: going to get back up and he doesn't want to
[1:49:07] Speaker 3: get it. He's always angry when he gets hit. I'm like,
[1:49:09] Speaker 3: that's kind of part of playing the position. Buddy, you
[1:49:11] Speaker 3: should retire if you don't want to do that, And
[1:49:13] Speaker 3: so it's just a hard needle to thread. He's mad
[1:49:16] Speaker 3: at young guys all the time, even when he makes mistakes.
[1:49:18] Speaker 3: But that's just part of his leadership. But I don't
[1:49:20] Speaker 3: I think in the locker room things are probably fine.
[1:49:22] Speaker 3: It's just if for a team that wants to evolve,
[1:49:25] Speaker 3: he doesn't really help you do that, and he doesn't
[1:49:27] Speaker 3: help you turn theit in the next chapter necessarily. So
[1:49:30] Speaker 3: his place in the league I think is a really
[1:49:32] Speaker 3: like might not exist if it wasn't for the Steelers,
[1:49:35] Speaker 3: and they're like kind of archaic way of thinking as
[1:49:37] Speaker 3: a franchise a little bit. But we're at thirty one
[1:49:40] Speaker 3: and you know he can still make a few throws
[1:49:42] Speaker 3: at times and look good for a quarter or two,
[1:49:44] Speaker 3: and you know, inspire some hope. Just that arm is
[1:49:47] Speaker 3: still pretty electric. So he's got that going for him.
[1:49:50] Speaker 2: Right like Bryce.
[1:49:51] Speaker 1: You have to run a very specific type of offense
[1:49:54] Speaker 1: now with Aaron Rodgers, but it's not an offense I
[1:49:55] Speaker 1: want to run. I always just just keep coming back
[1:49:57] Speaker 1: to the number that stands out to me is when
[1:50:00] Speaker 1: pressured last year, his success rate was worse than the
[1:50:04] Speaker 1: league by a huge margin, like lower than I think Slacko,
[1:50:07] Speaker 1: cam Ward and JJ where the JJ McCarthy were the
[1:50:10] Speaker 1: next ones he just plays over essentially, So that leaves
[1:50:13] Speaker 1: us at thirty two. I had Rodgers there at thirty one.
[1:50:17] Speaker 1: I'm curious who you had here. I'm gonna I'm gonna
[1:50:20] Speaker 1: show you at least how I wrote it down. I'm
[1:50:21] Speaker 1: not sure if I'm going to draft it this way,
[1:50:23] Speaker 1: but these are the next guys. Tua is there, Jakobe
[1:50:27] Speaker 1: Brissett's there, Michael Pennox is there, and I wrote down Mariota.
[1:50:31] Speaker 2: But now we're getting pretty pretty deep.
[1:50:33] Speaker 3: Mariota, that's the guy. That's why I had guy. Yeah,
[1:50:37] Speaker 3: I mean we're thirty two. So it is what it is.
[1:50:39] Speaker 3: But I think Washington's offense last year was actually, like
[1:50:43] Speaker 3: by a lot of metrics if they were like eighteenth
[1:50:46] Speaker 3: to twenties second.
[1:50:47] Speaker 2: Yeah, his numbers were great last year.
[1:50:49] Speaker 1: I think he's he's a good He's developed into one
[1:50:52] Speaker 1: of the best backups in the league. He was eighth
[1:50:54] Speaker 1: in completion percentage over expected, like led the league in
[1:50:57] Speaker 1: downfield attempts, Like he's willing to throw it into tight windows,
[1:51:00] Speaker 1: you know, in terms of our rate stat and pretty
[1:51:02] Speaker 1: average and success rate, Like there wasn't a big drop
[1:51:04] Speaker 1: off Jayden to him.
[1:51:06] Speaker 3: I think he's just, yeah, he doesn't. A lot of
[1:51:09] Speaker 3: things about his game have kind of smoothed out. He's
[1:51:11] Speaker 3: never going to be great, obviously, he's in those thirty
[1:51:13] Speaker 3: second Range's career back if he's thirty, will be his
[1:51:15] Speaker 3: age thirty three season. So like, obviously a lot of questions,
[1:51:18] Speaker 3: But if you're just saying, like, does he give you
[1:51:20] Speaker 3: a better chance to win? Would you rather have him
[1:51:22] Speaker 3: than all the guys you mentioned, which are also the
[1:51:24] Speaker 3: other guys that I've written out here, Yeah, I think
[1:51:26] Speaker 3: he does. And I don't know I really saw it.
[1:51:28] Speaker 1: I do think like with Stefanski, Sorry to. I do
[1:51:33] Speaker 1: you think with Stefanski too could look a little more
[1:51:36] Speaker 1: like to Again, he does have some skill set that
[1:51:40] Speaker 1: I'm not totally giving up on. He is an NFL quarterback.
[1:51:43] Speaker 1: To me, uh, that was a difficult situation. I think
[1:51:46] Speaker 1: mentally everything, he was really just going through it. And
[1:51:49] Speaker 1: yet my my producer, Eric Roberts knows me well, I mean,
[1:51:54] Speaker 1: Jacoby's my guy. I'm just saying, you know, I've always
[1:51:57] Speaker 1: been a team Jacoby. It's just a guy, and I
[1:52:01] Speaker 1: can take him here at thirty two. What the hell,
[1:52:03] Speaker 1: let's take let's take toa Kobe Brissette. There you go,
[1:52:05] Speaker 1: Let's have some fun, just like I like Jacoby too.
[1:52:08] Speaker 3: That's just it. I mean, he's next for me here
[1:52:10] Speaker 3: here Panics were probably next for me.
[1:52:12] Speaker 2: Yeah, it would be interesting.
[1:52:15] Speaker 1: He just keeps having to learn a new offense every
[1:52:17] Speaker 1: single season, Jacoby Brissett, and he's gonna have to sign
[1:52:20] Speaker 1: that contract and get in and actually learn this offense.
[1:52:22] Speaker 1: I think the I think the least is going to
[1:52:24] Speaker 1: be very short for him. But for the most part,
[1:52:27] Speaker 1: Patriots era accepted. Uh, you know, the two point zero
[1:52:33] Speaker 1: with two I think for me, he's got to give
[1:52:35] Speaker 1: you credible play, like you kind of know what you're
[1:52:36] Speaker 1: getting with Jacoby, So I'm gonna take it.
[1:52:38] Speaker 3: With two of for me just quickly to address him,
[1:52:40] Speaker 3: I don't know when i'd pick him because the odds
[1:52:44] Speaker 3: if I'm just picking them for twenty twenty six, because
[1:52:45] Speaker 3: the odds he'd get hurt are high, I think, and
[1:52:50] Speaker 3: then i'd have to be with a backup, and then
[1:52:51] Speaker 3: the upside if he doesn't get hurt is not great
[1:52:54] Speaker 3: enough for me to inherit the risk. So I that's
[1:52:57] Speaker 3: where I kind of see his career at this point.
[1:52:58] Speaker 3: So like maybe I'm over thinking it by by looking
[1:53:01] Speaker 3: at it so practically, but I think that's probably why
[1:53:04] Speaker 3: I wouldn't take him, maybe for another couple of spots
[1:53:07] Speaker 3: even but it is possible that there's still a season
[1:53:09] Speaker 3: in there for him, and like that he ends up
[1:53:11] Speaker 3: being in this twenties range.
[1:53:12] Speaker 1: He was the next one I wrote down because I
[1:53:14] Speaker 1: actually think with with the fans GI, he might have
[1:53:17] Speaker 1: the highest ceiling of these guys. Actually that I and
[1:53:20] Speaker 1: it's it's not crazy, but we've seen his his ceiling
[1:53:23] Speaker 1: where you're just like, okay, you know in rhythm he
[1:53:26] Speaker 1: does what he does well in the right in the
[1:53:28] Speaker 1: right offense like he can. He can get some buckets
[1:53:31] Speaker 1: for you, but I don't trust him in the end,
[1:53:32] Speaker 1: so I'm taking Jacoby.
[1:53:34] Speaker 2: We did it done.
[1:53:36] Speaker 1: We've we've been going a little longer with all these
[1:53:38] Speaker 1: NFL Daily thirty twos as we've gone, and but you
[1:53:41] Speaker 1: have we have set the record together.
[1:53:43] Speaker 2: But it makes sense.
[1:53:43] Speaker 3: It's the quarterbacks, that's right. It's a lot to talk about,
[1:53:47] Speaker 3: it really is for this position, for sure, it's a lot.
[1:53:50] Speaker 2: You're the best, John. I appreciate.
[1:53:52] Speaker 1: Like I said, everyone check out his work audibles and
[1:53:54] Speaker 1: analytics and then the podcast the read Optional and yeah,
[1:53:57] Speaker 1: we wanted to give you a big chunky up. So
[1:54:00] Speaker 1: because this is gonna be our last one of this week,
[1:54:03] Speaker 1: it's gonna sit over the long holiday weekend as the
[1:54:06] Speaker 1: NFL Daily crew hit that music.
[1:54:09] Speaker 2: You know, it takes a nice little break, not much
[1:54:12] Speaker 2: of one.
[1:54:12] Speaker 1: We'll be back next week. Jordan Rodriguez covered there, and man,
[1:54:17] Speaker 1: it was fun. I don't think we're done with NFL
[1:54:19] Speaker 1: Daily thirty two, but we did. The receivers. We've got
[1:54:22] Speaker 1: the skill positions now taken care of, and the quarterbacks
[1:54:24] Speaker 1: are in the books. We will see you next week,
[1:54:27] Speaker 1: enjoy the fourth of July.

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