# A Tiny Whispering Voice - Bishop Barron's Daily Sermon

An episode of [Daily Sermons With Bishop Robert Barron](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/6783446284), 17 Aug 2026, 14 min.

Audio: https://dts.podtrac.com/redirect.mp3/api.spreaker.com/download/episode/73911048/a_tiny_whispering_voice_bishop_barron_s_sunday_sermon.mp3



## Transcript

[0:00] Speaker 1: Peace be with you friends. For this nineteen Sunday ordinary time,
[0:03] Speaker 1: I want to do a little apologetics with you. I promise, though,
[0:06] Speaker 1: I will get to the readings. But you know, I
[0:09] Speaker 1: do a lot of work online with people who are
[0:11] Speaker 1: often skeptical of religion, and you hear their questions. When
[0:14] Speaker 1: I'm coming up against someone, let's say, from the left wing,
[0:16] Speaker 1: who's you know, just dismissive of religion, as they're all
[0:20] Speaker 1: tired superstition and it's irrational, et cetera, et cetera, I
[0:24] Speaker 1: usually ask a couple of questions. The first one is,
[0:27] Speaker 1: well do you believe in science? And you know, without
[0:30] Speaker 1: exception they say, well, yeah, of course, you know, follow
[0:33] Speaker 1: the science. And look, I'm again superstition. I like modern science.
[0:38] Speaker 1: I say, okay, good, I like science too, I say,
[0:41] Speaker 1: you know, the condition for the possibility of any science
[0:46] Speaker 1: is the keen sense that the world, in every nook
[0:50] Speaker 1: and cranny, is intelligible. It can be understood, It has
[0:55] Speaker 1: something like a rational pattern to it. Otherwise science would
[1:00] Speaker 1: it off the ground if things were just utter chaos,
[1:02] Speaker 1: there was no intelligibility. I couldn't launch a science. I
[1:06] Speaker 1: can launch biology, psychology, physiology because there's lawgoss in all
[1:13] Speaker 1: three Right, I'm looking for the lawgoss in bios. What's
[1:17] Speaker 1: the lawgosts in life? Psychology? I'm looking for the lawgoss
[1:21] Speaker 1: in the psuque? What's the intelligibility of the mind? Right?
[1:25] Speaker 1: Or like astronomi, Well it doesn't not lagos, but it's noamos,
[1:28] Speaker 1: which means law. I'm looking for the law of the stars.
[1:33] Speaker 1: All of science, I remind them, depends upon the mystical
[1:38] Speaker 1: intuition that reality is marked by intelligibility. I think I've
[1:43] Speaker 1: told you before about the great physicist Eugene Vigner, who
[1:46] Speaker 1: writes this article in nineteen sixty called the unreasonable effectiveness
[1:51] Speaker 1: of mathematics in the physical sciences. What struck Vigner, who
[1:55] Speaker 1: was a secular Jew by the way, not a religious man,
[1:58] Speaker 1: what struck on was how weird that we need the
[2:01] Speaker 1: most abstract, complex mathematics to describe the qualities of physical reality.
[2:07] Speaker 1: Why should that be true that there's such a rich
[2:11] Speaker 1: intelligibility patterning within physical things? How about Einstein? And my
[2:17] Speaker 1: favorite quote of his, the most incomprehensible thing about the
[2:22] Speaker 1: universe is that it's comprehensible. Let that sink in. I
[2:26] Speaker 1: often say, to these critics of religion, the weirdest thing,
[2:30] Speaker 1: the hardest thing to understand about the world is that
[2:34] Speaker 1: it's understandable. So here's my question to my you know,
[2:38] Speaker 1: liberal critics of religion. How do you explain that? Why
[2:43] Speaker 1: is that true? Where does this universal intelligibility, describable with
[2:50] Speaker 1: the most complex mathematics come from? You know the answer
[2:55] Speaker 1: I get typically, I don't know. It's just that's the
[2:57] Speaker 1: way it is. Good answer. I don't know any other
[3:02] Speaker 1: read of life where you're think an answer like that's
[3:03] Speaker 1: a good answer. Hey, why is that the case? I
[3:06] Speaker 1: don't know, that's just the way it's Dumbly there, I
[3:10] Speaker 1: got a better answer. Why is the world marked by
[3:15] Speaker 1: mathematically precise and complex intelligibility because it was made by
[3:21] Speaker 1: a mathematician? In the beginning was the Word, and the
[3:26] Speaker 1: word was with God, and the Word was God, and
[3:28] Speaker 1: all things that came to be came to be through
[3:30] Speaker 1: that word. I don't know about you, mister rationality, I'll
[3:35] Speaker 1: often say, but that strikes me as a much more
[3:39] Speaker 1: rational answer to the question of universal intelligibility. Okay, then
[3:43] Speaker 1: I say, while you're thinking about that, let me ask
[3:45] Speaker 1: you a follow up question. How is it that we
[3:49] Speaker 1: are capable of understanding the intelligibility of the world. He said, well, no,
[3:56] Speaker 1: it's from your mind ors from your brain. And okay,
[4:00] Speaker 1: but you're a complete materialist, right, You don't think there's
[4:04] Speaker 1: any purpose or direction of the universe. It's under no
[4:07] Speaker 1: intelligent direction. Things just happened by dumb chance, by the
[4:13] Speaker 1: accidents of evolution, and that's how the brain was produced,
[4:17] Speaker 1: according to you. Yeah, well, here I echo the great
[4:21] Speaker 1: John Lennox, you know, the Oxford mathematician who's an apologist too.
[4:25] Speaker 1: He said, well, why in the world would you trust it?
[4:30] Speaker 1: This brain is just thrown together by haphazard chance and
[4:33] Speaker 1: evolutionary accidents. Why would you trust it? If your computer
[4:38] Speaker 1: was just sort of was thrown together by haphazard accident,
[4:43] Speaker 1: would you trust its calculations? See, the intelligibility of the
[4:48] Speaker 1: world is met by an even more puzzling If you
[4:51] Speaker 1: want capacity to understand the world, the rational mind meets
[4:57] Speaker 1: intelligible reality. We call that philosophy or indeed science. How
[5:04] Speaker 1: do you explain that, I don't know, dumb chance just
[5:09] Speaker 1: the way it goes. Come on, it's a stupid answer,
[5:13] Speaker 1: I say to them. You call me irrational. I'm the
[5:16] Speaker 1: avatar of superstition. That's a pretty stupid answer. I think
[5:21] Speaker 1: much better answer. Both world and mind come ultimately from
[5:27] Speaker 1: a great, creative and personal mind whom we call God. Okay.
[5:33] Speaker 1: Tho was the first set of questions I asked my
[5:35] Speaker 1: skeptical interlocutors. Here's a second one. People that say religion
[5:41] Speaker 1: is crazy, there's no God, it's just a lot of
[5:42] Speaker 1: old superstition. I'll say, do you think slavery is wrong?
[5:48] Speaker 1: And I said, yeah, of course I do. Well what
[5:53] Speaker 1: if I just said, no, that's you know, it's just
[5:55] Speaker 1: the consensus of the culture. You know, most people agree
[5:58] Speaker 1: to it. So we say, okay, slavery is wrong. But
[6:00] Speaker 1: you know, heck, two hundred years ago in our country,
[6:03] Speaker 1: the consensus was that slavery was okay. There were opponents
[6:07] Speaker 1: of it, sure, but I'd say that general consensus two
[6:10] Speaker 1: hundred years ago was it slavery was okay. Go way
[6:13] Speaker 1: back to someone like Aristotle, brilliant philosopher. He thought slavery
[6:17] Speaker 1: was natural, that some people were suited for slavery. So
[6:21] Speaker 1: what if I said, hey, you know, someday the consensus
[6:24] Speaker 1: might change again, and we'd say slavery is okay. No, no, no,
[6:28] Speaker 1: My interlockator always says, no, no, no, no, no, slavery is
[6:31] Speaker 1: just wrong. Yeah, I agree with you, it is. It's
[6:35] Speaker 1: just it's not a matter of just consensus. It's really wrong.
[6:38] Speaker 1: Then I say, how about racism. Is racism wrong? Well, yeah,
[6:44] Speaker 1: of course it is. I mean it's like this the
[6:46] Speaker 1: basic moral principle of anyone on the left wing today. Racism.
[6:50] Speaker 1: Of course it's wrong. And I say, yeah, I agree
[6:53] Speaker 1: with you, it's wrong. But I said, you know, look,
[6:56] Speaker 1: even one hundred and fifty years ago, a lot of
[6:58] Speaker 1: people in our country would have said, no, there's a
[7:00] Speaker 1: difference between the races, and some are higher than others,
[7:04] Speaker 1: they're superior and inferior races, and so, you know, treating
[7:07] Speaker 1: people accordingly and segregating them and organizing society according to
[7:12] Speaker 1: hierarchies of race is okay. Very bright people and good
[7:17] Speaker 1: people said that one hundred and fifty years ago. Yeah, yeah,
[7:21] Speaker 1: but they were wrong. Yeah, I agree with you. I
[7:23] Speaker 1: agree they were wrong. But what if in one hundred
[7:26] Speaker 1: and fifty years from now things shift around and there's
[7:29] Speaker 1: a different consensus and people say, I think slavery's okay. No, no, no, no,
[7:34] Speaker 1: My interlocker says no, no, no, Slavery is just and racism
[7:37] Speaker 1: is just wrong. Okay. In other words, I say, you
[7:43] Speaker 1: believe in objective moral value. You think there are some
[7:48] Speaker 1: things that are objectively right or wrong. Where's that come from?
[7:57] Speaker 1: Where do these values come from that are not a
[8:01] Speaker 1: matter of just vote or consensus or the opinion of
[8:03] Speaker 1: the crowd, that are in themselves good and evil? Where
[8:08] Speaker 1: does that come from? I don't know, just the way
[8:11] Speaker 1: it is, really, that's your answer. While you're thinking about that,
[8:17] Speaker 1: I'll say, let me ask you another one. How do
[8:21] Speaker 1: we come to recognize these moral values and disvalues? How
[8:26] Speaker 1: do we come to say, yeah, that's right or you
[8:31] Speaker 1: know that's wrong. Where's that come from? Oh? I don't know.
[8:37] Speaker 1: Just it's some kind of you know, instinct that we have.
[8:41] Speaker 1: Let me go back now to the scripture. I think
[8:44] Speaker 1: a great breakthrough in Western consciousness is reflected in this
[8:49] Speaker 1: reading from the First Book of Kings. Remember the famous
[8:52] Speaker 1: story of Elijah. He's on the run and he comes
[8:54] Speaker 1: to horror of the mountain of God, and he's into
[8:56] Speaker 1: great distress, and the Lord says, I'm going to be
[8:59] Speaker 1: passing by right. A strong and heavy wind was rending
[9:04] Speaker 1: the mountains crushing the rocks, But the Lord was not
[9:07] Speaker 1: in the wind. After the wind an earthquake, the Lord
[9:11] Speaker 1: was not in the earthquake. After the earthquake was a fire,
[9:14] Speaker 1: but the Lord was not in the fire. Now, those
[9:16] Speaker 1: are all classic kind of signs of rather bombastic signs
[9:20] Speaker 1: of God's presence. Right then, listen, after the fire, there
[9:26] Speaker 1: was a tiny whispering sound. When he heard this, Elijah
[9:32] Speaker 1: hid his face in the cloak and went and stood
[9:34] Speaker 1: at the entrance of the cave. Whelready sensed the presence
[9:39] Speaker 1: of God in this tiny whispering voice. What is that?
[9:49] Speaker 1: How do we recognize objective moral value? Just as our
[9:53] Speaker 1: rational mind recognizes objective intelligibility. How do we recognize objective
[10:01] Speaker 1: moral values? What John Henry Newman called the aboriginal vicar
[10:09] Speaker 1: of Christ and the soul, the conscience that we rightly
[10:15] Speaker 1: call mind, you the voice of our conscience, a voice
[10:24] Speaker 1: that tells us yes, that is right, that's a value,
[10:30] Speaker 1: or that's wrong, that's a disvalue. Seek and do this
[10:36] Speaker 1: avoid that. What is this voice but the presence of
[10:44] Speaker 1: God within us our capacity to discern moral value and disvalue.
[10:52] Speaker 1: You know, there's a kind of Freudian reading of conscience
[10:55] Speaker 1: that says something like this, No, no, No. Conscience is just
[10:58] Speaker 1: the internalized voice of your father. You know, your father,
[11:02] Speaker 1: when your kid told you to do this and don't
[11:03] Speaker 1: do that, and you internalize that, and then you kind
[11:06] Speaker 1: of extrapolate from that as you grow up. It becomes
[11:09] Speaker 1: the sort of unconscious memory of what your father told
[11:11] Speaker 1: you to do and not to do. Come on, let
[11:15] Speaker 1: me tell you my argument against that. And I'm reluctant
[11:18] Speaker 1: because my father was the best guy ever. I loved
[11:20] Speaker 1: my father. He was a great man. But I remembered
[11:23] Speaker 1: the moment I don't know how old I was, but
[11:25] Speaker 1: when I realized, hey, you know what my father just
[11:29] Speaker 1: said there, that that wasn't the nicest thing, or you
[11:32] Speaker 1: know that that wasn't the best thing for him to do.
[11:36] Speaker 1: If the conscience is nothing but the internalized voice of
[11:39] Speaker 1: my father, I'd never be able to judge father or president,
[11:44] Speaker 1: or mother or elder. See I'm saying, yes, that plays
[11:47] Speaker 1: a role in the formation of conscience. Yes, indeed, the
[11:50] Speaker 1: rules given by your parents. None. No, But conscience is
[11:54] Speaker 1: much more mysterious. It's rather the presence in you listen, no,
[12:01] Speaker 1: of an intelligent person who knows you intimately and rewards
[12:09] Speaker 1: you for the good choices you make, and punishes you
[12:13] Speaker 1: for the bad choices you make. And the interesting everybody
[12:16] Speaker 1: that when we do something morally wrong, we feel that
[12:21] Speaker 1: we've offended someone and we feel accordingly ashamed. Let's say
[12:29] Speaker 1: you know, I'm a builder and I did something wrong.
[12:32] Speaker 1: You know, it was bad architecture or bad masonry or whatever,
[12:36] Speaker 1: and it didn't work out. Well. Well, I might feel like, Okay,
[12:38] Speaker 1: I'm stupid and that was a mistake. But I don't
[12:41] Speaker 1: feel like I'm ashamed in the presence of someone, I
[12:45] Speaker 1: might feel stupid. But when you do something morally wrong,
[12:52] Speaker 1: what do you feel as if you've hurt someone? When
[12:59] Speaker 1: you do something morally right, you feel that you've pleased someone.
[13:07] Speaker 1: There's a tiny whispering voice that enables us to know
[13:13] Speaker 1: objective moral right and moral wrong. Just as God place
[13:21] Speaker 1: these values in the world, so it's God who enables
[13:25] Speaker 1: us to intuit them and understand them. So next time
[13:30] Speaker 1: you're up again someone who's just completely dismissive of religion,
[13:34] Speaker 1: ask those two questions, how stand you with science? How
[13:39] Speaker 1: stand you with objective morality? I think you follow both
[13:44] Speaker 1: of those convictions all the way. You come to God.
[13:49] Speaker 1: You come to the author of intelligibility, the author of
[13:53] Speaker 1: moral value, and the one that enables us to understand
[13:57] Speaker 1: intelligibility and discern moral value. And God bless you.

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