# Paul Murray Live | 23 April

An episode of [Paul Murray Live](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/376966263), 23 Apr 2026, 49 min.

Audio: https://p.podderapp.com/2544644999/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/2fb3740d-3436-44af-8cc0-a91900716aa5/be3abd48-25e5-45a6-aede-ac2a00524a12/c017a96a-d78a-4011-a77f-b43500ceff56/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=95971714-8fe6-4855-b1fe-ac2a00524a12

Fuel reserves are up to 46 days and the government is calling that a win, the Greens say the fuel crisis means it's vital the government mandates a freeze on rent. Plus, the push to reject gender neutral bathrooms in New South Wales public buildings. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:00] Speaker 1: From the Sky News Center is Paul Murray Live. Thanks
[0:07] Speaker 1: for joining me.
[0:07] Speaker 2: I'm James Macpherson filling in for Paul Murray Live in
[0:10] Speaker 2: the man Cave. Here's what's coming up on tonight's program.
[0:13] Speaker 2: Fuel reserves are up to forty six days and the
[0:16] Speaker 2: government is calling that a win, which is a bit
[0:19] Speaker 2: like boasting you've got a full tank when the needle
[0:21] Speaker 2: is sitting at halfway and you've got no idea where
[0:24] Speaker 2: the next gas station is to Center Nampa. Jimber Price
[0:27] Speaker 2: will join me later to discuss that and more. The
[0:30] Speaker 2: Greens say the fuel crisis means it's vital. The government
[0:33] Speaker 2: mandates a freeze on rent. My panel will join me
[0:36] Speaker 2: to talk about silly ideas and unforeseen consequences, and later
[0:40] Speaker 2: on I'll chat to Michelle Pierce from the Australian Christian
[0:43] Speaker 2: Lobby about the push to reject gender neutral bathrooms in
[0:47] Speaker 2: public buildings. All of that coming up shortly, But first
[0:51] Speaker 2: let me show you two headlines from today's newspapers that
[0:54] Speaker 2: if you place some side by side, read less like
[0:57] Speaker 2: journalism and more like a civilization argue with itself.
[1:00] Speaker 1: While the smoke alarm is going off.
[1:02] Speaker 2: Here's the first one from Today's Australian Islamic State urges
[1:06] Speaker 2: followers to copy Bondai shooters in new propaganda. The terror
[1:11] Speaker 2: group's latest newsletter produced in Afghanistan, because if you're going
[1:15] Speaker 2: to publish instructions for global murder, you might as well
[1:17] Speaker 2: do it from a jurisdiction with limited interest in your
[1:20] Speaker 2: editorial standards. Well, this newsletter carries an article with the
[1:24] Speaker 2: cheerful little headline quote the Sydney attack revenge of the
[1:28] Speaker 2: oppressed Uma. He goes on to describe the two men
[1:32] Speaker 2: who allegedly committed the Bondi terror attack as quote brave lions,
[1:37] Speaker 2: and it says the Bondai shooting, in which fifteen Australians
[1:40] Speaker 2: were shot dead, most of them for being Jewish, was
[1:43] Speaker 2: not a sin, no, no, it was a template, a
[1:46] Speaker 2: handy how to guide for Muslims who are serious about
[1:49] Speaker 2: the interfada. The ISIS newsletter said that the Bondi attack
[1:53] Speaker 2: demonstrated to Muslims across the globe, and I quote that
[1:57] Speaker 2: the path to salvation and honor of Islam lies precisely
[2:01] Speaker 2: in the way adopted by the attackers. As for any
[2:05] Speaker 2: Muslims who might feel I don't know unease at the
[2:08] Speaker 2: concept of civilians being shot in the street. Well, ISIS
[2:11] Speaker 2: has a classification for them as well. They are apparently
[2:15] Speaker 2: shameful and just in case anyone thought there might be
[2:18] Speaker 2: moral ambiguity in the system, the article helpfully clarifies, quote,
[2:22] Speaker 2: there is no such thing as a noncombatant, Kaffir or
[2:26] Speaker 2: non believer. The ISIS article goes on like this for
[2:30] Speaker 2: page after page after page, seven pages. In all, I'm
[2:34] Speaker 2: just bringing you the highlights, it says, and I quote,
[2:37] Speaker 2: the Sydney attack was only a pebble from a mountain.
[2:41] Speaker 2: We will continue to kill by the permission of Allah
[2:44] Speaker 2: until you go weary of burying the dead. Now, if
[2:48] Speaker 2: I didn't know better, i'd say this stuff was written
[2:51] Speaker 2: by people who consumed too many energy drinks, not nearly
[2:54] Speaker 2: enough civilization. But as we know very well, these Islamic
[2:58] Speaker 2: extremists are deadly serious. They go on to say, for
[3:03] Speaker 2: the liberation of Jerusalem begin with the kaffir and apostates
[3:07] Speaker 2: closest to you, for they are the ones who prevent
[3:10] Speaker 2: you from killing the Jews and liberating Jerusalem. Support the
[3:15] Speaker 2: Islamic state in this great jihad cause. Now, if you
[3:19] Speaker 2: were tasked with compressing all of that into a modern slogan,
[3:24] Speaker 2: something punchy, shareable, suitable for signage or maybe chanting in
[3:28] Speaker 2: a march you'd struggle to beat. Oh, I don't know,
[3:31] Speaker 2: globalize the interfata. I mean, that's what ISIS is calling for.
[3:36] Speaker 2: If you want to liberate Jerusalem, which is a polite
[3:39] Speaker 2: way of saying, kill all the Jews, you've got to
[3:41] Speaker 2: begin where you are. They say this has always been
[3:45] Speaker 2: Islamic States call. Australian terror experts have said they believe
[3:49] Speaker 2: the men who allegedly committed the bond Bi terror attack
[3:52] Speaker 2: were inspired by twenty twenty four ISIS speech entitled and
[3:56] Speaker 2: kill them wherever you find them, which.
[3:59] Speaker 1: Does sound like a globalized uprising? Does it not? Now?
[4:04] Speaker 1: Hold that thought?
[4:05] Speaker 2: Because while Islamic State is urging Muslims to repeat the
[4:08] Speaker 2: Sydney massacre, here in Sydney we're debating whether using public
[4:13] Speaker 2: buildings to chant globalize the into farda is I don't know,
[4:16] Speaker 2: maybe little unwise, which brings us to the second of
[4:20] Speaker 2: today's headlines, this one from Sydney's Daily Telegraph. Politicians refuse
[4:26] Speaker 2: to intervene to stop globalize the Interfarta forum at City
[4:30] Speaker 2: of Sydney Venue. The City of Sydney is making available
[4:34] Speaker 2: a council owned building so pro Palestine supporters can gather
[4:38] Speaker 2: to demand the right to chant globalize the into Farda.
[4:42] Speaker 2: In fact, the event is called why It's right to
[4:45] Speaker 2: say globalize the inter Farda. Now, Sydney Lord Mayor Clovermore
[4:51] Speaker 2: is a lot smarter than me. I mean, I would
[4:53] Speaker 2: never have thought of turning half the CBD into bike
[4:55] Speaker 2: lanes in order to improve traffic flow, but she did so.
[4:58] Speaker 1: She's clearly no deal. But just for a moment, go
[5:02] Speaker 1: with me on this.
[5:03] Speaker 2: Does it not occur to clover More that when Islamic
[5:06] Speaker 2: State is openly calling for Muslims to kill Jews and
[5:09] Speaker 2: their supporters wherever you find them, and when we already
[5:13] Speaker 2: have an example of two extremists allegedly responding to that
[5:17] Speaker 2: call right here in Sydney just a few months ago,
[5:21] Speaker 2: is it not the height of stupidity to encourage anyone
[5:24] Speaker 2: to chant for more globalized uprising against Jews. Now, I
[5:29] Speaker 2: understand ninety nine point nine percent of people chanting globalizing too.
[5:35] Speaker 2: FATA would never commit a terrorist act, but as those
[5:38] Speaker 2: who lost mothers and fathers and children, and partners at
[5:41] Speaker 2: BONDI will testify through tears. It only takes one or two.
[5:47] Speaker 2: Maybe Local Government Minister Ron Honing could step in here.
[5:50] Speaker 2: I mean, surely local government buildings should not be used
[5:53] Speaker 2: for events like this. Well, a spokesperson for the local
[5:57] Speaker 2: government minister said it was all a matter of the
[6:00] Speaker 2: City of Sydney, which kind of begs the question, what's
[6:04] Speaker 2: the point of a local government minister if he has
[6:07] Speaker 2: nothing to say about local government platforming messages that could
[6:10] Speaker 2: be interpreted by some to sound, you know, a little
[6:14] Speaker 2: bit ici sy The Premier, Chris Minn, said he was
[6:17] Speaker 2: against the idea of this globalized the Interfata forum, but
[6:22] Speaker 2: insisted a phone call to clover More would be a
[6:24] Speaker 2: waste of time.
[6:26] Speaker 3: I prepared to be able to crime to clothe More
[6:28] Speaker 3: and expression of willis.
[6:29] Speaker 4: No, I'm not going to do that because the chances
[6:33] Speaker 4: of her listening to me are zero.
[6:35] Speaker 1: And that's the premier. Or what about the Prime Minister.
[6:38] Speaker 2: Does he not sense the danger, the stupidity, the recklessness
[6:42] Speaker 2: in all of this. Well, a spokesman for Anthony Albaneze
[6:45] Speaker 2: he told The Telegraph the government has made our position
[6:49] Speaker 2: clear on this by passing the toughest ever hate crime laws,
[6:52] Speaker 2: which translated means we've legislated extensively and hope the problem
[6:57] Speaker 2: resolves itself through paperwork. So here we are left, as ever,
[7:01] Speaker 2: with a familiar arrangement, one part of the world producing
[7:05] Speaker 2: explicit calls for violence, another part debating whether the words
[7:09] Speaker 2: describing those calls might be offensive, and a third part
[7:14] Speaker 2: assuring us everything is under control because a press release
[7:16] Speaker 2: exists somewhere in a filing cabinet, and somewhere between all
[7:20] Speaker 2: of that. Since you and I sleeping with one eye
[7:24] Speaker 2: open and wondering how the hell our country became so
[7:27] Speaker 2: incredibly stupid, Well, the Pharaoh by election is now just
[7:34] Speaker 2: sixteen days away, and there hasn't been much talk about
[7:37] Speaker 2: the Greens campaign. But looking at it today I was
[7:41] Speaker 2: struck by the fact that some of the campaign signs,
[7:44] Speaker 2: well they're not in English at all, They're in Punjabi. Now,
[7:47] Speaker 2: on the one hand, this could be dressed up as
[7:49] Speaker 2: civic minded inclusivity. If there are people of Indian descent
[7:53] Speaker 2: in Pharaoh who don't speak English, well we want them
[7:56] Speaker 2: to know what's going on. Fair enough, the Greens are
[7:59] Speaker 2: nothing if not unfailingly polite. Let's be honest. Politics is
[8:04] Speaker 2: really that innocent, is it. I suspect the Greens putting
[8:07] Speaker 2: signs around Farah in languages other than English is less
[8:11] Speaker 2: about helping out than it is about promoting an ideological
[8:15] Speaker 2: view held by progressives that you don't need to speak
[8:18] Speaker 2: English to live in Australia. Even if that's not the intent,
[8:23] Speaker 2: that's the message that's implicit in these signs. Don't trouble
[8:26] Speaker 2: yourself with the language of the country you've arrived in.
[8:29] Speaker 2: We'll simply rearrange the country around you. It's a comforting idea,
[8:34] Speaker 2: I suppose it's also a destabilizing one.
[8:37] Speaker 1: And if you think that's a stretch.
[8:39] Speaker 2: Immigration Minister Tony Burke did seem to underline the point
[8:42] Speaker 2: with these remarks yesterday.
[8:45] Speaker 5: I've never accepted the word assimilation. I don't want people
[8:48] Speaker 5: to lose who they are. We want people for who
[8:50] Speaker 5: they are. I've never subscribed to that sort of melting
[8:54] Speaker 5: pot concept that your whole identity is meant to be dissolved.
[8:58] Speaker 2: Seriously, that comment from toy Burke and those campaign core
[9:01] Speaker 2: flutes from the Greens candidate in Parah are wonderful advertisements
[9:05] Speaker 2: for Pauline Hanson's one nation. Encouraging people not to assimilate
[9:10] Speaker 2: only widens the gap between all the separate cultures now
[9:13] Speaker 2: being openly encouraged, transforming Australia from one country into a
[9:19] Speaker 2: transit lounge. Those campaign signs in Pharaoh might just be
[9:24] Speaker 2: a small local quirk, but they look like a billboard
[9:27] Speaker 2: for a much larger idea that Australia is no longer
[9:31] Speaker 2: a place you join. Rather, it's a place that endlessly
[9:34] Speaker 2: adjusts itself to whoever arrives, and we all pay for this.
[9:38] Speaker 2: Last week, it was revealed that taxpayers were being charged
[9:41] Speaker 2: millions of dollars to translate government documents so people who
[9:46] Speaker 2: don't speak English could understand them. The Department of Health,
[9:50] Speaker 2: Disability and Aging reportedly signed a four year, fifty two
[9:53] Speaker 2: million dollar translating contract and that's thirteen million dollars a
[9:58] Speaker 2: year to help people in Australia understand Australian government documents
[10:02] Speaker 2: in the language of their choice. There it is from
[10:07] Speaker 2: expecting newcomers to adapt to insisting the nation must. It's
[10:12] Speaker 2: a subtle difference, almost polite, but like most polite things
[10:17] Speaker 2: in politics, it carries consequences that are anything but polite,
[10:21] Speaker 2: and progressives are confused as to why so many people
[10:24] Speaker 2: are supporting one Nation. Now, remember that confidential one nation
[10:33] Speaker 2: policy document that somehow got shared via email with MPs
[10:37] Speaker 2: and staffers right across the Federal Parliament. Didn't just go
[10:41] Speaker 2: to a few inboxes, It went everywhere. It was the
[10:43] Speaker 2: kind of online distribution that would have made a computer
[10:46] Speaker 2: virus jealous. Pauline Hanson, as you would expect, was furious
[10:50] Speaker 2: and immediately issued a please explain. She demanded an investigation,
[10:56] Speaker 2: fearing the document had been deliberately leaked by her political enemies,
[10:59] Speaker 2: and honest, she has a few her political enemies. Well,
[11:03] Speaker 2: they speculated that perhaps it was a one Nation staff
[11:05] Speaker 2: wood accidentally shared the document, you know how clumsy they
[11:09] Speaker 2: can be. Well, as it turns out, it was neither.
[11:13] Speaker 2: Late this afternoon, the Department of Parliamentary Services released a
[11:17] Speaker 2: statement saying they'd investigated the leak and discovered it was
[11:21] Speaker 2: quote unquote human error. One nation policy ideas and everything
[11:26] Speaker 2: from health and immigration to energy and taxation had been
[11:29] Speaker 2: shared with absolutely everybody by mistake.
[11:33] Speaker 1: Oops.
[11:35] Speaker 2: In a letter to One Nation, the Department Secretary Jarla
[11:38] Speaker 2: Hinchcliffe said the department was quote deeply apologetic for the incident.
[11:43] Speaker 2: Department of Parliamentary Services assessment is that the access issue.
[11:48] Speaker 2: I love that access issue arose from human error and
[11:52] Speaker 2: is deeply apologetic that it occurred. The Department wishes to
[11:56] Speaker 2: note its sincere apologies and assure you that we have
[11:59] Speaker 2: and will continue to treat its involvement in this matter seriously.
[12:04] Speaker 2: I've also engaged an independent reviewer to provide me with
[12:07] Speaker 2: assurance that the Department has taken appropriate steps to mitigate
[12:10] Speaker 2: the risk of a similar issue reoccurring. Well, it's hardly reassuring.
[12:16] Speaker 2: Mitigate the risk doesn't fill you with confidence. Does it
[12:19] Speaker 2: ensure it never happens again? Would have been quite a
[12:22] Speaker 2: bit better. The Department failed to explain exactly what the
[12:26] Speaker 2: human error was. Just one of those things I suppose
[12:29] Speaker 2: that happens from time to time when left leaning bureaucracy,
[12:32] Speaker 2: as there in a party like one nation is gaining support.
[12:36] Speaker 2: Remember that time when human error resulted in confidential labor
[12:39] Speaker 2: documents being shared far and wide.
[12:42] Speaker 1: No me, neither, But there you go.
[12:45] Speaker 2: No conspiracy, no sabotage, no political intrigue worthy of a thriller,
[12:49] Speaker 2: Just confidential data carefully stored inside the digital architecture of government.
[12:54] Speaker 2: And then with all the precision of a drop tray
[12:57] Speaker 2: in a crowded cafe shared with everyone by mistake.
[13:01] Speaker 1: But hang on a second.
[13:02] Speaker 2: Doesn't the government routinely assure Australians that it's fit to
[13:06] Speaker 2: safeguard our most sensitive information tax records, health data, personal details,
[13:13] Speaker 2: and we're supposed to trust them. Tell you what, Nothing
[13:16] Speaker 2: inspires confidence quite like a track record of oops wrong attachment.
[13:25] Speaker 2: Energy Minister Chris Bowen announced today we have more fuel
[13:28] Speaker 2: now than we did at the start of the Iranian war.
[13:33] Speaker 6: Fact we now have forty six days worth of petrol
[13:36] Speaker 6: in our stocks, which is ten days more than when
[13:39] Speaker 6: the bombing of Iran commenced. Shows that while we are
[13:43] Speaker 6: facing international headwinds and risks and uncertainties into the medium term,
[13:47] Speaker 6: nevertheless nothing is being left on the field when it
[13:50] Speaker 6: comes to ensuring that Australia is very well placed.
[13:54] Speaker 2: Credit where credit's due. It's still only half the stocks
[13:57] Speaker 2: we're supposed to have in reserve. But improvement now. I
[14:01] Speaker 2: know what many of you are thinking. If we've got
[14:03] Speaker 2: thirty six days supply back then, but now have forty
[14:06] Speaker 2: six days supply, well, can I put the roof racks
[14:09] Speaker 2: back on my car. Who would have imagined at the
[14:11] Speaker 2: start of the year that national confidence would be measured
[14:14] Speaker 2: by how many people were gained to drive their suv
[14:17] Speaker 2: into the wind with an empty metal.
[14:19] Speaker 1: Cage attached to the roof. Maybe don't do.
[14:22] Speaker 7: It just yet, but importantly as well, Australians who are
[14:26] Speaker 7: doing their bit to as the advertising campaign says that
[14:31] Speaker 7: every little bit helps and people are changing their behavior
[14:36] Speaker 7: on a voluntary basis, which is one of the reasons
[14:39] Speaker 7: why we've seen the supply of petrol in particular go
[14:45] Speaker 7: up to forty six days.
[14:48] Speaker 2: In other words, keep the roof racks in the garage
[14:50] Speaker 2: for a little while longer, let them gather dust like
[14:52] Speaker 2: relics from a more optimistic age when fuel was abundant,
[14:56] Speaker 2: supply chains were stable, and energy resilience wasn't code for
[15:00] Speaker 2: do you really need the air conditioning on? Because in
[15:03] Speaker 2: today's Australia, national energy security isn't about having enough, it's
[15:07] Speaker 2: about needing less and calling that a win. Joining me
[15:10] Speaker 2: now is Shadow Minister for Small Business just into Nampa.
[15:13] Speaker 2: Jimper Price, Senator, thanks so much for coming on the program.
[15:16] Speaker 1: Great to speak with you. The PM says, we're.
[15:18] Speaker 2: At level two of the National Fuel Security Plan and
[15:21] Speaker 2: there's no imminent danger we'll be moving to fuel rationing.
[15:25] Speaker 2: Is satisfied with the government's response to this crisis and
[15:29] Speaker 2: what they're doing currently.
[15:31] Speaker 8: Well, the government, it doesn't truly have a plan. It
[15:35] Speaker 8: never did from the outset. I think what they don't
[15:38] Speaker 8: understand is energy is the economy, and with recent events
[15:42] Speaker 8: as to what's happened in another part of the world,
[15:45] Speaker 8: it's demonstrated just how vulnerable we are as a.
[15:49] Speaker 9: Country, what we've become.
[15:52] Speaker 8: And the worst thing about that is the fact that
[15:57] Speaker 8: it's not about resilience. There is no long term plan
[16:00] Speaker 8: in this government. That's what we were not hearing. We
[16:01] Speaker 8: keep hearing these updates, but we don't hear about.
[16:03] Speaker 9: The long term plan into the future. You know.
[16:06] Speaker 8: I spoke about it last year as the shadow of
[16:08] Speaker 8: Defense Industry Minister about the fact that and Jim Molan,
[16:13] Speaker 8: you know, has been talking about it a lot longer
[16:17] Speaker 8: than I had been, talking about the fact that we
[16:19] Speaker 8: need to invest in the infrastructure in our nation to
[16:22] Speaker 8: ensure that we have facilities for fuel supply around our country.
[16:28] Speaker 8: And this was in the event, you know, obviously, if
[16:30] Speaker 8: there was some sort of if anyone wanted to do
[16:34] Speaker 8: us harm other nations.
[16:36] Speaker 9: But here we are with this crisis in.
[16:39] Speaker 8: Another part of the world, and we are left vulnerable,
[16:41] Speaker 8: and we're still left vulnerable, and you just can't with
[16:44] Speaker 8: this particular government. You just don't know whether they're being
[16:49] Speaker 8: genuine or not, whether they're trying to, you know, cover their.
[16:52] Speaker 10: Backside in all of this.
[16:54] Speaker 8: And while they claim as rightly as you said, while
[16:57] Speaker 8: they claimed that, you know, we're ten days ahead in
[17:00] Speaker 8: terms of our fuel supply, we're still well behind the
[17:05] Speaker 8: ninety days that even the Prime Minister himself, in the
[17:09] Speaker 8: footage that emerged recently from years back, described as what
[17:13] Speaker 8: we should have to feel.
[17:15] Speaker 9: Like we're no longer sort of in a vulnerable position.
[17:19] Speaker 2: It's funny you mentioned that because I was watching the
[17:20] Speaker 2: press conference where a journalist bought that very quote up
[17:24] Speaker 2: back in twenty twenty Anthony Albanezi said we must have
[17:27] Speaker 2: ninety days worth of fuel in reserve, and the Prime
[17:31] Speaker 2: Minister's response was, well, we all know that was leaked
[17:34] Speaker 2: by the Liberal Party. In other words, it was the
[17:36] Speaker 2: Liberal Party's fault for telling everyone what he himself had said.
[17:41] Speaker 2: And so yeah, I sometimes wonder, am I just too
[17:44] Speaker 2: cynical and I think, well, it's responses like that one
[17:47] Speaker 2: from the Prime Minister that caused cynicism in the public precisely.
[17:53] Speaker 8: It's always batting off any sort of level of responsibility.
[17:57] Speaker 10: He and his ministers all.
[17:59] Speaker 8: Do it when the hard questions are placed upon them.
[18:03] Speaker 8: It's everybody else's fault by their own and you know,
[18:06] Speaker 8: I mean we get it all the time and question
[18:08] Speaker 8: time when we're asking them questions and they go back
[18:10] Speaker 8: to when the coalition was in government.
[18:14] Speaker 10: Well, you've been.
[18:15] Speaker 8: There now, you know, four years going on five years,
[18:18] Speaker 8: and you're demonstrating to the Australian people that get unreliable
[18:23] Speaker 8: that you can't be trusted either, and you don't take
[18:26] Speaker 8: any responsibility for the circumstances that this country are faced with.
[18:30] Speaker 10: And there's not just a.
[18:31] Speaker 8: Fuel crisis, but prior to the fuel crisis, you know,
[18:34] Speaker 8: we've we've got a debt crisis where we're hurtling toward
[18:37] Speaker 8: a trillion dollars, We've got an inflation crisis and we
[18:42] Speaker 8: continue to see interest rates rise under this government costs
[18:47] Speaker 8: of living crisis that they have created on their watch,
[18:50] Speaker 8: and we're going to be paying for all of.
[18:52] Speaker 10: This into the future.
[18:53] Speaker 8: And there's just no confidence or no stability right now,
[18:57] Speaker 8: or lack of taking any level of responsibility as well.
[19:01] Speaker 2: It's funny you mentioned all those crises because I've wondered
[19:03] Speaker 2: if the government's strategy is to hope for a future
[19:06] Speaker 2: crisis to distract us from the current crisis, and.
[19:09] Speaker 1: That's kind of the way they roll. I want to
[19:11] Speaker 1: ask you, I.
[19:12] Speaker 8: Think there's going to be a sorry, there's going to
[19:13] Speaker 8: be a budget crisis on our hands, and then they
[19:15] Speaker 8: will blame the events of the Middle East on the
[19:18] Speaker 8: next budget crisis.
[19:20] Speaker 10: That'll be the next thing.
[19:21] Speaker 1: There you go, there you go.
[19:22] Speaker 2: I want to ask you about your role as Shadow
[19:24] Speaker 2: Minister for Small Business. You've been out and about in
[19:26] Speaker 2: regional Australia, most recently into Woomba. How are small businesses
[19:30] Speaker 2: managing in these difficult times.
[19:33] Speaker 8: Yeah, Look, small businesses are doing it tough right around
[19:36] Speaker 8: the country.
[19:37] Speaker 10: Timber is a wonderful.
[19:39] Speaker 8: Community and you know, they're very very proud regional city
[19:44] Speaker 8: that work hard. They take care of one another in
[19:49] Speaker 8: their community. You know, businesses, while they're doing it tough,
[19:53] Speaker 8: they knuckle down and go harder in places like Timber.
[19:56] Speaker 10: But one of the things that.
[19:58] Speaker 8: Is killing a lot of small bitsusinesses around the country
[20:01] Speaker 8: is regulatory compliance. This burden is burdens them for all
[20:07] Speaker 8: businesses annually. It's annually it costs businesses one hundred and
[20:11] Speaker 8: eighty five billion, and small businesses themselves, which are ninety
[20:16] Speaker 8: seven percent of all businesses in our country, carry one
[20:19] Speaker 8: hundred and sixty billion of that annual burden.
[20:23] Speaker 10: And so they've got that to contend with.
[20:27] Speaker 8: Before the fuel crisis, of course, the cost of living
[20:30] Speaker 8: crisis and the cost of energy, which pushed the cost
[20:33] Speaker 8: of everything up, was another.
[20:36] Speaker 9: Thing impacting small businesses.
[20:38] Speaker 8: And I mean, it's so heartening to see those businesses
[20:43] Speaker 8: into Woomba getting down making sure that they're taking care
[20:47] Speaker 8: of their local community. I met a number of wonderful
[20:53] Speaker 8: apprentices that work really hard. I mean there was a
[20:57] Speaker 8: sixteen year old diesel mechanic apprentice, young girl that was
[21:02] Speaker 8: working at Harvey Black Toyota, and you know, it is
[21:06] Speaker 8: heartening to see that.
[21:08] Speaker 9: But they want to break.
[21:09] Speaker 10: They want to break, and.
[21:11] Speaker 9: They are met with so many different levels forms of tax.
[21:15] Speaker 10: They need a break so that they can.
[21:16] Speaker 8: Continue to employ people who are also paying their bills
[21:20] Speaker 8: and finding it hard. They need the government to stop
[21:23] Speaker 8: being their largest competitor. And in particularly when it comes
[21:27] Speaker 8: to things like the NDIS, they're experiencing a lot of
[21:31] Speaker 8: their workers leave to become.
[21:35] Speaker 9: Become part of the NDIS and.
[21:37] Speaker 2: That is really tough to I actually want to ask
[21:40] Speaker 2: you about the NDS. Obviously, the Minister Mark Butler has
[21:43] Speaker 2: unveiled proposed reforms. He wants to cut the number of
[21:46] Speaker 2: participants by one hundred and sixty thousand. He proposes to
[21:49] Speaker 2: do that by putting every person on the NDIS to
[21:51] Speaker 2: an assessment tool.
[21:52] Speaker 1: Just one catch.
[21:54] Speaker 2: The assessment tool hasn't been designed yet, to just bear
[21:56] Speaker 2: that in mind. And he said the assessment tool would
[21:59] Speaker 2: determine whether the partition it needs worth significant and permanent.
[22:03] Speaker 2: But the definitions of significant and permanent, well they've not
[22:05] Speaker 2: been determined yet either. So with all that in mind,
[22:08] Speaker 2: I can see you smirking. You think Mark Butler has
[22:11] Speaker 2: the ability to get this done.
[22:15] Speaker 8: I think he's got the ability to create more of
[22:17] Speaker 8: a dog's breakfast. You know, their labour's view is to
[22:22] Speaker 8: go hard on participants but soft on the perpetrators. You know,
[22:27] Speaker 8: we know that there are many who are taking advantage
[22:32] Speaker 8: of this system. We know that ninety four percent of
[22:35] Speaker 8: providers are in fact not even.
[22:37] Speaker 10: Registered with the NDIES. I mean that's where you.
[22:39] Speaker 8: Think you would start with as opposed to knowing that
[22:43] Speaker 8: Australians support the NDIES, particularly those who really genuinely need
[22:49] Speaker 8: the NDIES. But it's like with many things with this government,
[22:55] Speaker 8: is they tend to aim for in the wrong direction
[22:57] Speaker 8: when it comes to trying to fix any particular problems.
[23:01] Speaker 8: So I need to make sure that those individuals are
[23:03] Speaker 8: taken care of, but to go after those who are
[23:06] Speaker 8: doing the wrong thing.
[23:07] Speaker 2: All right, just before we go to a break, I
[23:09] Speaker 2: really want to play for you, and I showed it
[23:12] Speaker 2: early in the program, but I want to play for
[23:13] Speaker 2: you again. Comments by Immigration Minister Tony Burke where he
[23:17] Speaker 2: says he doesn't want migrants to assimilate into this country.
[23:21] Speaker 2: I just want to remind viewers and let you see
[23:23] Speaker 2: this grab and then get your response to it.
[23:25] Speaker 1: Here's what he said.
[23:26] Speaker 5: I've never accepted the word assimilation. I don't want people
[23:29] Speaker 5: to lose who they are. We want people for who
[23:32] Speaker 5: they are. I've never subscribed to that sort of melting
[23:35] Speaker 5: pot concept that your whole identity is meant to be dissolved.
[23:40] Speaker 8: Your reaction look, this bloke not only insults Australians but
[23:45] Speaker 8: those who who became citizens in this country.
[23:48] Speaker 9: I mean, you know, my husband is one of.
[23:50] Speaker 8: Those individuals and he left his differences at the door.
[23:53] Speaker 8: You know, the Scots don't like the English, but he
[23:56] Speaker 8: didn't bring that hatred with him. And this is what
[23:59] Speaker 8: we expect to bring any sort of level of hatred
[24:02] Speaker 8: from where they've come from into this country to become
[24:05] Speaker 8: part of this country. And let me tell you what
[24:07] Speaker 8: the meaning of assimilate actually means. So according to the
[24:11] Speaker 8: Oxford Dictionary, to assimilate means to fully understand and take
[24:14] Speaker 8: in information, ideas, or to integrate into a new community
[24:18] Speaker 8: or culture. I don't know what the hell is wrong
[24:22] Speaker 8: with that, but they need to stop stigmatizing this word assimilation.
[24:28] Speaker 8: And what this tells me is that mister Burke does
[24:30] Speaker 8: not want people to adopt our Australian values in orders
[24:36] Speaker 8: do I think he knows anything.
[24:38] Speaker 9: About what they are.
[24:39] Speaker 8: But Australians expect others to adopt those values, particularly new
[24:44] Speaker 8: Australians who have become citizens of this country. I mean
[24:48] Speaker 8: to me, does he actually believe in the pledge that
[24:51] Speaker 8: new citizens given this country? Because that is exactly what
[24:55] Speaker 8: it is about. And you know what, I don't think
[24:58] Speaker 8: he knows much about his own BA because the word
[25:01] Speaker 8: burke in the UK actually means idiot.
[25:06] Speaker 2: Senator Price, it's always nice speaking with you. Thanks for
[25:09] Speaker 2: joining me.
[25:10] Speaker 1: Thank you all right.
[25:12] Speaker 2: Coming up after the break, Donald Trump keeps accusing Australia
[25:15] Speaker 2: of refusing to help. The Prime Minister keeps insisting is
[25:18] Speaker 2: no idea what Trump's talking about.
[25:19] Speaker 1: So should Elbow pick.
[25:21] Speaker 2: Up the phone? And if you're thinking of switching to
[25:23] Speaker 2: an EV, well you might want to exercise caution. I'll
[25:26] Speaker 2: talk about all of that and more with my panel
[25:28] Speaker 2: after the break. Well, welcome back to the program. Lots
[25:36] Speaker 2: to get through with my panel tonight, so let me
[25:38] Speaker 2: introduce them. Joining me is National Senator Ross Caddell and
[25:41] Speaker 2: One Nation National Executive Manager Lee Hanson. Good evening to
[25:45] Speaker 2: you both. Let's start with the US alliance. It's long
[25:50] Speaker 2: been a cornerstone of our national security, but questions are
[25:53] Speaker 2: now being raised about just how solid the relationship really is.
[25:57] Speaker 2: Former Home Affairs Secretary Mike Pizzulo has warned the relationship
[26:00] Speaker 2: is drifting. He has sensibly, in my view, urged Prome
[26:04] Speaker 2: Minister Anthony Albanezy to pick up the phone and talk
[26:06] Speaker 2: to Donald Trump to reaffirm Australia's commitment to the alliance.
[26:10] Speaker 1: Have listened to what he had to say.
[26:12] Speaker 11: We would fight if we had to, we of course
[26:15] Speaker 11: prefer not to. And in Washington we need to give
[26:18] Speaker 11: the same message Laura. We cannot have a situation in
[26:21] Speaker 11: twenty seven or twenty eight, or whenever this mayor made
[26:23] Speaker 11: out arise where there's confusion about what President Trump and
[26:28] Speaker 11: his administration have asked us. We cannot have the debarcle
[26:32] Speaker 11: of him at press conferences, responding to Sky News journalists
[26:35] Speaker 11: saying well, I've asked them for help. They didn't help.
[26:37] Speaker 11: That lack of clarity and that confusion would be deadly lethal.
[26:43] Speaker 2: Ross he makes a pretty good point. But do you
[26:45] Speaker 2: think the PM will pick up the phone.
[26:49] Speaker 4: I think there's a very little chance of that. This
[26:51] Speaker 4: relationship has been rubbish from the start. We had elbow there,
[26:55] Speaker 4: we had that run over there after his tweet history
[26:58] Speaker 4: with Ken, We saw what happened in the Prescott for
[27:00] Speaker 4: when Clonel asked that question there. I think he does
[27:03] Speaker 4: want to do it for two reasons. I think if
[27:05] Speaker 4: he does get asked formally and remember every time he's
[27:07] Speaker 4: asked his question, he says, we haven't been asked formally.
[27:10] Speaker 4: It's like a little asterix on whether we've been asked
[27:13] Speaker 4: or not. I don't think he was to get asked
[27:15] Speaker 4: formally because I'm not sure given the state of Australian
[27:18] Speaker 4: defense status right now, whether we could send anything of
[27:20] Speaker 4: merit Isn't it ridiculous a country like Australia has trouble
[27:24] Speaker 4: putting a boat over there or things on the ground
[27:26] Speaker 4: to help. And Ukraine's talking about sending four mind sweepers
[27:29] Speaker 4: that they've got while they're at all with Russia. This
[27:32] Speaker 4: is a ridiculous state. It shows how ridiculous our defense
[27:36] Speaker 4: abilities have been and the relationship how bad it is.
[27:38] Speaker 4: I think the only good thing that this government has
[27:41] Speaker 4: done in the relationship with America is send Greg Moriarty
[27:44] Speaker 4: is the next ambassador who has a defense basis, who
[27:46] Speaker 4: was around when the aucust stuff was being formed, and
[27:49] Speaker 4: hopefully they will start to mend that relationship which is
[27:52] Speaker 4: horribly torn Lee.
[27:54] Speaker 2: I sometimes wonder if it's almost deliberate on the part
[27:58] Speaker 2: of the government. If I had a good friend who
[28:01] Speaker 2: was continually saying something that I had not said or
[28:04] Speaker 2: misunderstanding me. My response wouldn't be to shrug my shoulders
[28:08] Speaker 2: and say, oh, well, that's their problem. I'd get on
[28:11] Speaker 2: the phone, ring them and say, hey, what's going on.
[28:14] Speaker 2: Clearly there has been a misunderstanding. So the fact that
[28:17] Speaker 2: Anthony Albineze has continually asked this question and he repeatedly
[28:21] Speaker 2: says that's a matter for Donald Trump, it's almost like
[28:26] Speaker 2: the government is deliberately trying to put space between themselves
[28:30] Speaker 2: and this US administration. Maybe they believe that Trump is
[28:32] Speaker 2: unpopular and so it's a vote winner for them.
[28:34] Speaker 1: What's your take on all of this.
[28:38] Speaker 10: I agree with you, James.
[28:40] Speaker 3: The sensible thing would be to pick up the phone
[28:43] Speaker 3: and have a conversation. Our relationship with the USA is
[28:47] Speaker 3: absolutely essential.
[28:48] Speaker 10: It's essential for our country and for the future.
[28:52] Speaker 3: What I believe is happening is the labor government one
[28:56] Speaker 3: is demonstrating their incompetence too. They're trying to put distance
[28:59] Speaker 3: between them themselves and Trump. We know that the mainstream
[29:03] Speaker 3: media paint Trump in poor light here in Australia, so
[29:07] Speaker 3: he's appeasing to the polls to have no affiliation or
[29:12] Speaker 3: association or distance himself as far as he can but
[29:14] Speaker 3: instead it's showing his incompetence as a leader. And as
[29:18] Speaker 3: you say, any good business person, any good leader or
[29:22] Speaker 3: stakeholder manager, would pick up the phone and have a conversation.
[29:25] Speaker 10: I mean, if someone says I was ignoring them, what
[29:28] Speaker 10: would you do? The first thing? Give him a call?
[29:29] Speaker 10: What's going on?
[29:30] Speaker 3: You know that doesn't mean you're necessarily going to agree,
[29:33] Speaker 3: but you need to have the conversation because the Prime
[29:37] Speaker 3: Minister needs to look beyond the current and medium mediate term.
[29:42] Speaker 3: A good leader looks for long term vision. What's the
[29:45] Speaker 3: long term plan? And we need to maintain a strong
[29:49] Speaker 3: relationship with the America, with America, and he's not doing that.
[29:53] Speaker 2: It almost feels like the government's plan long term is
[29:56] Speaker 2: to wait until Trump's term ends and then hope for
[30:00] Speaker 2: a Democrat to replace him. But I'll tell you what
[30:02] Speaker 2: if they keep doing this with Trump and then Trump's
[30:04] Speaker 2: replaced by J. D. Vance As you point out, ross
[30:07] Speaker 2: our relationship with the USIB in all sorts of trouble,
[30:10] Speaker 2: with damage done over a long period of time. Let's
[30:13] Speaker 2: turn to those other geniuses, the Greens. They've come up
[30:17] Speaker 2: with what sounds I don't know less like economic policy
[30:20] Speaker 2: and more like student politics, they've decided. According to their
[30:25] Speaker 2: spokesman for Finance, Housing and Homelessness, this is Senator Barbara Pocock.
[30:29] Speaker 2: The rent freeze and a ban on evictions would give
[30:32] Speaker 2: people the security they need during the fuel and cost
[30:36] Speaker 2: of living crisis. She said, today people are already experiencing
[30:40] Speaker 2: financial stress, struggling to make ends meet. This sensible, immediate
[30:44] Speaker 2: cost of living rent relief will support people with the
[30:47] Speaker 2: least secure housing Lee. It looks like they don't think
[30:52] Speaker 2: of the knock on consequences, do they?
[30:54] Speaker 1: Because this is fraught.
[30:57] Speaker 3: This infuriated me when I aw this, James. The fact
[31:02] Speaker 3: is yes, there is going to be knock on consequences.
[31:04] Speaker 10: So hang on.
[31:05] Speaker 3: Everyone is suffering right now, the cost of living, the
[31:08] Speaker 3: fuel crisis situation that's occurring.
[31:10] Speaker 10: I get it.
[31:11] Speaker 3: Renters, landlords, homeowners are all struggling. So let's appease to
[31:16] Speaker 3: renters by punishing the landlords. Which majority of those who
[31:21] Speaker 3: own investment properties in Australia are those that have one
[31:25] Speaker 3: property for retirement plans or if they you know, the
[31:28] Speaker 3: superannuation fund basically, so let's punish those that are trying
[31:32] Speaker 3: to get ahead, who actually are investing in their own future.
[31:36] Speaker 3: But what really I rates me is the fact that
[31:41] Speaker 3: the Greens play a key role as to why we're
[31:45] Speaker 3: in a cost of living, why we have.
[31:47] Speaker 10: The housing pressures here?
[31:48] Speaker 3: So hang on, what are they look at the root
[31:50] Speaker 3: causes as to why is the cost of living is
[31:52] Speaker 3: so high and people are under rental strain or mortgage
[31:55] Speaker 3: strain right now, Greens have been involved in a lot
[32:00] Speaker 3: liable for this.
[32:01] Speaker 10: Stop the route so the root causes.
[32:03] Speaker 3: Stop the net zero agenda pushing up the unreliable and
[32:07] Speaker 3: high energy prices. Let's how about we stop the open
[32:12] Speaker 3: borders philosophy that they have and actually reduce immigration, which
[32:16] Speaker 3: will improve the suppli and demand issue as to why
[32:19] Speaker 3: housing is so short as well, there are numerous issues
[32:22] Speaker 3: which are contributing to this factor. Instead, they just want
[32:25] Speaker 3: to punish those that are actually trying to ensure a
[32:29] Speaker 3: solid security or future for themselves.
[32:31] Speaker 10: It makes me so irate in the way that they think.
[32:34] Speaker 1: I think a lot of people would feel the same way.
[32:36] Speaker 10: Ross.
[32:36] Speaker 2: Is it serious economic reform on the part of the
[32:39] Speaker 2: Greens or is this just a sure way to get
[32:41] Speaker 2: some votes at the next election.
[32:44] Speaker 4: Greens would never get within coui of serious economic reform
[32:48] Speaker 4: and this is not there too. I agree with Lee,
[32:50] Speaker 4: what a great business I'm jealous of the Greens have
[32:52] Speaker 4: this great business model. They cause the problem, then try
[32:55] Speaker 4: to get votes by complaining about the problem. So on
[32:58] Speaker 4: our little councils approve a development, Let's never approve a building.
[33:03] Speaker 4: Let's go out everywhere if someone wants to build a
[33:05] Speaker 4: block of lands or a housing development and say no,
[33:06] Speaker 4: we've got to save the gray fleck, blue frog or
[33:10] Speaker 4: whatever this is this week. And then we will let
[33:13] Speaker 4: all these people into the nation that needs houses because
[33:15] Speaker 4: we can't stop immigration. But then we complain that no
[33:18] Speaker 4: one can find out what a great thing, create the problem,
[33:21] Speaker 4: complain about the problem, get elected on the problem you created.
[33:24] Speaker 4: It's a great model. I'm jealous. I think you know
[33:27] Speaker 4: we should all do that. I might go out and
[33:28] Speaker 4: see what problems I can cause it. Then I can
[33:30] Speaker 4: pretend to fix it. It's not even close to a serious policy.
[33:35] Speaker 4: We're going to go out there and freeze the rents
[33:37] Speaker 4: of these people. Just remember, this government's about to do
[33:40] Speaker 4: something with capital gains tax for investors. They're about to
[33:43] Speaker 4: do something with negative gearings for mental investors. So we're
[33:46] Speaker 4: going to hurt the expense side of property investors, and
[33:50] Speaker 4: now the Greens want to hurt the income side. The
[33:52] Speaker 4: greatest sin in this country is having a few spare
[33:55] Speaker 4: bucks now, So if you've been able to save, you've
[33:57] Speaker 4: been able to do the right thing, let's just find
[33:59] Speaker 4: a way to take it off you.
[34:00] Speaker 10: And it's just ridiculous.
[34:02] Speaker 1: Ross.
[34:03] Speaker 2: I'm just wondering who you know that's got a few
[34:05] Speaker 2: spare bucks these days. I don't know anyone at the moment.
[34:09] Speaker 2: Have you have you noticed Chris? Have you noticed Chris Bowen?
[34:13] Speaker 2: Though he doesn't seem terribly concerned about the fuel crisis.
[34:17] Speaker 2: Maybe that's because he really does have the situation under control.
[34:21] Speaker 2: Maybe it's because he doesn't like fossil fuels and so
[34:23] Speaker 2: a shortage is hardly upsetting him. And besides, the fuel
[34:27] Speaker 2: shortage is driving more Australians toward his preferred form of transport,
[34:30] Speaker 2: which of course is EVS. But before you get excited,
[34:33] Speaker 2: you might want to pause for a moment, because there's.
[34:36] Speaker 1: Not always the case that they are what they see.
[34:39] Speaker 2: Is an interesting article from Today's Australian says the Australian
[34:43] Speaker 2: Automobiles Association's Commonwealth funded research shows The BYD Dolphin that's
[34:49] Speaker 2: a very popular EV, fell twenty four percent short of
[34:51] Speaker 2: its advertised driving range, with the EV traveling three hundred
[34:56] Speaker 2: and thirteen k's instead of the advertised four hundred and ten.
[35:00] Speaker 2: The BYD c Lion, a small suv, traveled four hundred
[35:03] Speaker 2: and sixty nine k's, which was seventeen percent under its
[35:07] Speaker 2: advertised range of five hundred and seventy six k's.
[35:10] Speaker 1: And that's not all.
[35:12] Speaker 2: The research found the hybrid was less fuel efficient than
[35:15] Speaker 2: some petrol or small diesel SUVs, and this was true
[35:19] Speaker 2: in numbers and numbers of these electric vehicles. So ross
[35:24] Speaker 2: for families looking for fuel relief, this could come as
[35:27] Speaker 2: a nasty surprise. They're being sold a dream that doesn't
[35:30] Speaker 2: really exist.
[35:33] Speaker 4: Yeah, and it's quite such a big margin like it.
[35:35] Speaker 4: I know car manufacturers have sometimes pushed the boundaries. Saw
[35:38] Speaker 4: the Volkswagen emissions thing a while ago and what they've done,
[35:41] Speaker 4: But these twenty percent, that's not even close to getting
[35:45] Speaker 4: it right. And I want to know what action is
[35:47] Speaker 4: going to be taken against these companies. We saw the
[35:49] Speaker 4: book thrown at Volkswagen, so what is going to be
[35:51] Speaker 4: happened to these people that are importing these cars that
[35:53] Speaker 4: don't deliver on these promises. You're getting your car. I'm
[35:56] Speaker 4: in the hunt of Valley. I'm a Newcastle right now.
[35:59] Speaker 4: I want to go to Sydney. In fact, that's basically
[36:01] Speaker 4: three hundred and three fifty three forty kilometers. I buy
[36:04] Speaker 4: a car that can do four hundred k's on the paper,
[36:06] Speaker 4: I'm stuck it down on the Central Coast for the
[36:09] Speaker 4: night because you know it hasn't done the detail. These
[36:11] Speaker 4: are real problems. This is fraud if this is what's
[36:13] Speaker 4: going on. But I guarantee you're not going to hear
[36:15] Speaker 4: anything because there is nothing wrong with the electrification of
[36:19] Speaker 4: Australia and decarbonizing according to this government. But they will
[36:22] Speaker 4: do nothing to fix this. Well, this is why they're
[36:25] Speaker 4: not doing anything on the fuel crisis of merit. They're
[36:27] Speaker 4: coping to get through it. They're not coping to fix
[36:30] Speaker 4: it with long term sustainability of liquid fuels because they
[36:33] Speaker 4: don't want to govern in the interests of Australia. They
[36:35] Speaker 4: want to govern in the interest of staying in government,
[36:37] Speaker 4: and so all they do is crisis management. They never
[36:40] Speaker 4: do long term building. That's why we see they tolerated
[36:43] Speaker 4: anti Semitism for so long till as a crisis. They've
[36:45] Speaker 4: let fuel security and resilience in this country go solong
[36:48] Speaker 4: till there's a crisis. They are not a government that
[36:51] Speaker 4: wants Australia to be strong. They are a government that
[36:53] Speaker 4: wants to keep themselves elected.
[36:55] Speaker 2: Lee, I've decided that I might get an IV, an
[36:58] Speaker 2: IV and EV when they can travel eight hundred k's
[37:02] Speaker 2: on one charge, When the battery can be fully charged
[37:05] Speaker 2: within a couple of minutes at a charging station, I
[37:07] Speaker 2: don't have to wait more than sixty seconds to access.
[37:10] Speaker 1: What do you reckon?
[37:13] Speaker 3: I think you might be waiting a little while there, James,
[37:15] Speaker 3: you know this pipe dream of you know, isn't it reliable?
[37:19] Speaker 3: Isn't it the future? Isn't it the way we all
[37:22] Speaker 3: need to turn to.
[37:23] Speaker 10: Basically, it means that.
[37:25] Speaker 3: Everybody will stay within their immediate city or locations, and
[37:28] Speaker 3: anyone traveling between rural and regional areas as if good
[37:32] Speaker 3: luck I mean where.
[37:33] Speaker 10: I live and EV wouldn't suit me.
[37:35] Speaker 3: I don't even think I can get, you know, from
[37:37] Speaker 3: one part of Tasmania to the next, or living on
[37:40] Speaker 3: a property good luck with an EV. I was speaking
[37:43] Speaker 3: to someone recently actually had a testla. It says they
[37:46] Speaker 3: wanted to get a boat and I said, I thought
[37:49] Speaker 3: it was a joke. I said, what do you mean,
[37:52] Speaker 3: how are you going to toe it? And I said,
[37:54] Speaker 3: how are you going to back an EV into the
[37:56] Speaker 3: water to.
[37:56] Speaker 10: Put a boat trailer in there?
[37:58] Speaker 3: I'm confused, but people are distinct when they obviously have evs.
[38:01] Speaker 10: It was hilarious, but look, you.
[38:04] Speaker 3: Know when it comes to when I saw the stats
[38:07] Speaker 3: on this was at three to thirty percent of margin
[38:11] Speaker 3: of error in regards to the mileage or the con
[38:16] Speaker 3: fuel consumption on these hybrids and evs. I'm not a lawyer,
[38:20] Speaker 3: but Australian consumer law. How is this being allowed to happen?
[38:25] Speaker 3: How is this you know, that is fraud, that's false advertising?
[38:28] Speaker 3: And why is it more being done about this or
[38:31] Speaker 3: is it purely being ignored because it's achieving or giving
[38:35] Speaker 3: this falsehood of this green energy and this net zero fantasy.
[38:40] Speaker 3: So yeah, i'd steer clear. I'm not interested, and I'd
[38:43] Speaker 3: say don't go there either too, James.
[38:45] Speaker 2: I'll hold off a little longer, but I'll promise I'll
[38:48] Speaker 2: call you Lee before I decide to get one, just
[38:51] Speaker 2: to make sure it's okay, just quickly, We're to go
[38:53] Speaker 2: in a second. But have look at this happy photo
[38:55] Speaker 2: posted on the Prime Minister's Twitter account today. There is
[38:58] Speaker 2: posing beside Microsoft chief executive Satya Nadella. Microsoft is looking
[39:03] Speaker 2: at investing twenty five billion dollars in Australia, with plans
[39:06] Speaker 2: for twenty nine data centers across the country.
[39:10] Speaker 1: Sounds kind of exciting. Just one problem.
[39:13] Speaker 2: AI data centers use huge amounts of power. This from
[39:17] Speaker 2: the report detailing Microsoft's plans. The government anticipates data centers
[39:21] Speaker 2: will consume around six percent of good supplied electricity by
[39:25] Speaker 2: twenty thirty, which is up from roughly two percent today.
[39:31] Speaker 2: So this kind of goes to what we've been talking
[39:33] Speaker 2: about tonight. That you know, it illustrates the fundamental problem.
[39:37] Speaker 2: If you want nice things, you need abundant energy. And
[39:41] Speaker 2: it really doesn't seem like the Labor government all their partners,
[39:45] Speaker 2: the Greens have much you know, sort of ambition of
[39:49] Speaker 2: creating that. Roscadell Lee Hanson appreciate you joining me tonight,
[39:53] Speaker 2: Thanks so much.
[39:54] Speaker 1: All right, Still to.
[39:55] Speaker 2: Come after the break, half of new public toilets could
[39:58] Speaker 2: become gender neutral under fresh plans, sparking heated debate I'll
[40:03] Speaker 2: discuss more with Australian Christian Lobby Chief executive Michelle Pierce
[40:07] Speaker 2: right after this. Well, in Australia we have a National
[40:15] Speaker 2: Building Code and for the most part it exists for
[40:17] Speaker 2: the rather quaint reason that people prefer buildings not to
[40:20] Speaker 2: fall down. It's a modest ambition really keep roofs above heads,
[40:24] Speaker 2: floors beneath feet, and water mostly where it belongs. That's
[40:27] Speaker 2: where the Australian Building Codes Board comes in.
[40:30] Speaker 1: It's their job to ensure fire.
[40:32] Speaker 2: Safety, structural integrity, waterproofing and to generally prevent building collapses.
[40:37] Speaker 1: But the eighteen member board.
[40:38] Speaker 2: Has decided that wants to do more than help engineer buildings.
[40:42] Speaker 2: It wants to engineer society. They seem to have expanded
[40:46] Speaker 2: their remit from how do we stop this balcony collapsing
[40:50] Speaker 2: to how do we redesign the bathrooms to rearrange society?
[40:53] Speaker 2: Because their latest update to the National Construction Code includes
[40:58] Speaker 2: a proposal that would see half the two will it's
[41:00] Speaker 2: in all public buildings designed as gender neutral. The Australian
[41:04] Speaker 2: Christian Lobby reckon the move will be deeply unpopular.
[41:07] Speaker 1: I cannot imagine why I.
[41:09] Speaker 2: Spoke to ACL Chief executive Michelle Pierce earlier today.
[41:13] Speaker 1: Well, thanks for joining me, Michelle.
[41:15] Speaker 2: If these proposed changes go through, what buildings will they affect?
[41:19] Speaker 12: Will they affect all public buildings, schools, shopping complexes, sporting complexes,
[41:25] Speaker 12: anywhere where you want to go to the lou out
[41:27] Speaker 12: in public These changes are going to affect every public building.
[41:31] Speaker 1: Libraries, yes, of course. Yeah.
[41:33] Speaker 12: And I mean it's really important to note that this
[41:35] Speaker 12: has even spaces where children are going to be and
[41:38] Speaker 12: I think schools is really a major concern for people.
[41:41] Speaker 12: But we're already seeing this being rolled out. There was
[41:43] Speaker 12: a school in Melbourne where they were going to change
[41:46] Speaker 12: a single sex toilet block into a unisex toilet block
[41:51] Speaker 12: for year two to four year olds.
[41:53] Speaker 10: I mean, parents were outrage.
[41:55] Speaker 12: It's completely out of step with what the community want.
[41:57] Speaker 2: So when I heard about this, my first question was
[42:00] Speaker 2: who's driving this, Like, I mean, who is asking for this?
[42:04] Speaker 4: Yeah?
[42:04] Speaker 12: And we did a bit of digging on that and
[42:06] Speaker 12: we found that it was a transactivist group called Parla
[42:09] Speaker 12: that were lobbying the Australian Building Codes Board to implement
[42:13] Speaker 12: these changes in the National Construction Code. And the really
[42:16] Speaker 12: concerning thing is that on their website, it actually says
[42:19] Speaker 12: that this is only the first step, and I mean
[42:23] Speaker 12: what that means we don't know. But doesn't mean that
[42:26] Speaker 12: it goes from voluntary to mandatory, or does it mean
[42:30] Speaker 12: that perhaps all gender toilets will replace all toilets. But
[42:33] Speaker 12: what we know this was a coordinated campaign by Parlor
[42:37] Speaker 12: to get this provision in the National Building Codes.
[42:40] Speaker 2: Okay, so there's lots of lobby groups in the country,
[42:43] Speaker 2: some of which we would agree with, some of which
[42:44] Speaker 2: we would disagree with.
[42:46] Speaker 1: That's fine. Why would the board agree.
[42:52] Speaker 2: With a trans lobby group that's making such a can
[42:55] Speaker 2: we call it unusual request or niche request instead of
[43:01] Speaker 2: using common sense, which would be to understand most Australians
[43:04] Speaker 2: probably wouldn't want this. Why would that organization have so
[43:07] Speaker 2: much sway, I suppose is what I'm asking with the board.
[43:10] Speaker 12: And that's a great question, and that's what we all
[43:12] Speaker 12: want to know because it's clearly out of step with
[43:15] Speaker 12: community expectations. But these translobby groups have so much influence
[43:20] Speaker 12: and now it's creeping into our bureaucracy, it's getting into
[43:22] Speaker 12: our red tape, and the agenda is social re engineering.
[43:27] Speaker 12: This is a very clever way to do it, because
[43:29] Speaker 12: we use public toilets wherever we go, and if gender
[43:32] Speaker 12: is removed from bathrooms, then what else have we got
[43:35] Speaker 12: left to differentiate single sex spaces out in the public.
[43:38] Speaker 2: I'm going to ask you in a moment why it's
[43:40] Speaker 2: a bad idea, But can you explain to me the
[43:42] Speaker 2: thinking of those who want this.
[43:44] Speaker 1: What's their argument in favor of it?
[43:46] Speaker 2: I mean, is it in the name of inclusion or
[43:49] Speaker 2: what's the argument?
[43:51] Speaker 12: Oh, the agenda is to remove gender from society. They
[43:56] Speaker 12: don't believe that sex is biological. They think sex is
[43:59] Speaker 12: a concept of Now we're not just talking about gender identity,
[44:03] Speaker 12: we're talking about completely redefining what sex actually is. We
[44:07] Speaker 12: know the Australian Human Rights Commission have already made that
[44:10] Speaker 12: call that they think sex is a legal status and
[44:14] Speaker 12: not a biological status. So this is a battle that's
[44:19] Speaker 12: happening in our law, it's happening through the Australian Human
[44:22] Speaker 12: Rights Commission in policy, and now we're seeing it come
[44:25] Speaker 12: down to the level where it's going to affect people
[44:28] Speaker 12: out in the public using the public toilets.
[44:31] Speaker 2: All right, So you've done some research with the Australian
[44:34] Speaker 2: Christian lobby And what's your research found in terms of
[44:37] Speaker 2: how people feel about this proposed change.
[44:39] Speaker 12: Yeah, we conducted a poll and everyday Australians were surveyed,
[44:43] Speaker 12: men and women, and we found that eighty seven percent
[44:46] Speaker 12: of the public would prefer single sex toilets than all
[44:50] Speaker 12: gender bathrooms. I mean, it's incredibly unsurprising, and that's why
[44:55] Speaker 12: it is surprising that this code in the National Construction
[45:00] Speaker 12: Code actually has even made it to the table.
[45:03] Speaker 10: And what's interesting is that.
[45:04] Speaker 12: Fewer than five percent actually support all gender bathrooms.
[45:08] Speaker 2: And so those who are posed, what are the arguments
[45:11] Speaker 2: against this? Aside from the fact that those who are opposed,
[45:16] Speaker 2: many of them would say gender is not a social construct,
[45:19] Speaker 2: it's a biological reality and bathrooms should reflect that. But
[45:23] Speaker 2: what are some of the more practical implications.
[45:25] Speaker 12: Ye, Well, the main concerns are also unsurprising. The first
[45:28] Speaker 12: concern is privacy. I want to keep their private spaces.
[45:31] Speaker 12: You can certainly understand that. The second one is safety,
[45:34] Speaker 12: and that safety of women who want to be separate
[45:38] Speaker 12: from men in their toilet spaces, but also parents concerned
[45:42] Speaker 12: about their children. You know, when I go to the
[45:44] Speaker 12: sharps end, if my ten year old wants to go
[45:46] Speaker 12: and use the lou and he's a boy, I'm a girl.
[45:49] Speaker 12: He'll go and use it by himself, and my teenage
[45:52] Speaker 12: daughter will go and use the toilet. I'm going to
[45:53] Speaker 12: be very concerned if it's an all gender toilet. Parents
[45:57] Speaker 12: are concerned, women are concerned. Completely out of step with
[46:01] Speaker 12: community expectations.
[46:03] Speaker 2: So the Australian Christian Lobby has launched a national campaign
[46:06] Speaker 2: urging state and territory governments to reject this proposal. How's
[46:11] Speaker 2: the campaign going and what response if any of you
[46:14] Speaker 2: had from state and territory governments.
[46:15] Speaker 12: Well, state and territory governments keep telling us that hey,
[46:18] Speaker 12: this is voluntary, but the fact is it's not voluntary
[46:22] Speaker 12: for the women and the children who will be using
[46:25] Speaker 12: these toilets, they'll be forced to either use the all
[46:27] Speaker 12: gender space if there's not enough women's toilets left. So
[46:30] Speaker 12: we haven't had a very good reception from state and
[46:32] Speaker 12: territory governments, but encouragingly, the Tasmanian government made a decision
[46:38] Speaker 12: to reject these changes. Now the clock is ticking because
[46:42] Speaker 12: state governments have only one more week to reject these changes.
[46:47] Speaker 12: The deadline is May first to accept or reject these
[46:50] Speaker 12: changes from the National Construction Code. Now now that the
[46:53] Speaker 12: state and territory, the premiers and the Chief Ministers are
[46:57] Speaker 12: aware of this poll should certainly make the decision to
[47:02] Speaker 12: not support these changes in the Construction Code.
[47:05] Speaker 2: I'm a little surprised that this has come to the
[47:07] Speaker 2: public attention so close to the deadline. Were it not
[47:11] Speaker 2: for your research and the promotion of that, this may
[47:14] Speaker 2: well have just slipped through with most people not even
[47:17] Speaker 2: realizing it was happening.
[47:18] Speaker 10: That's right.
[47:18] Speaker 12: And when this came across our desk, you know, we
[47:20] Speaker 12: just thought that this is something that is completely out
[47:23] Speaker 12: of step with Australians. They don't want this, So you know,
[47:28] Speaker 12: in terms of a campaign, it's one that I believe
[47:30] Speaker 12: is going to gain a lot of traction. But people
[47:33] Speaker 12: aren't aware. So that's what we're doing our best to
[47:34] Speaker 12: inform people. We have a bus that's circulating Sydney at
[47:38] Speaker 12: the moment and it says, hey, girls want to share
[47:41] Speaker 12: your public bathrooms with guys? No thanks, I mean that's
[47:45] Speaker 12: a statement that probably any woman would say. And then
[47:48] Speaker 12: we have our website toilets dot org dot au. We're
[47:51] Speaker 12: hoping people will go there, get informed and contact their
[47:54] Speaker 12: member of Parliament.
[47:56] Speaker 1: Very good, Michelle Piaus, appreciate you joining me tonight.
[47:58] Speaker 4: Thanks.
[48:00] Speaker 1: I think that's such.
[48:00] Speaker 2: A crazy story and I checked earlier today who's the
[48:04] Speaker 2: chairperson of the Australian Building Codes Board and I was
[48:09] Speaker 2: surprised to find the chairperson of the board that's recommended
[48:12] Speaker 2: these changes is a woman. So make of that what
[48:16] Speaker 2: you will. Well, that's it from me. Thanks so much
[48:19] Speaker 2: for joining me this week. It's been an absolute delight
[48:21] Speaker 2: to fill in for Paul Murray. But you'll be glad
[48:23] Speaker 2: to know Paul will be back on deck this Sunday
[48:27] Speaker 2: for our town. Coming from Kolak in Victoria. Make sure
[48:30] Speaker 2: you join in. Thanks for your company tonight. Stick Around
[48:33] Speaker 2: coming up in just a moment. It's late debate

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