# Paul Murray Live | 10 September

An episode of [Paul Murray Live](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/376966263), 10 Sep 2026, 49 min.

Audio: https://p.podderapp.com/2544644999/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/2fb3740d-3436-44af-8cc0-a91900716aa5/be3abd48-25e5-45a6-aede-ac2a00524a12/eb581455-7b94-4c40-be4e-b4c100cdf0da/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=95971714-8fe6-4855-b1fe-ac2a00524a12

One Nation leader refuses to apologise for Hastie cartoon, Labor proposes $100 million fine for directing users to harmful content. Plus, campaigns in full swing as election day approaches. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:02] Speaker 1: This is Paul Murray Live. Thank you, Steve. Hope you've
[0:08] Speaker 1: got a ticket. It's going to be mega, mega. All
[0:10] Speaker 1: eyes on Melbourne. And I don't just mean Australia, literally.
[0:13] Speaker 1: Tens of millions will be there. About 30 million apparently
[0:15] Speaker 1: watching in the US. A big part of the NFL
[0:18] Speaker 1: game that will be taking place in Melbourne is because
[0:21] Speaker 1: the Victorian government is paying for it. There will be
[0:23] Speaker 1: lots of examples of Victorian icons, tourism. So the theory
[0:28] Speaker 1: is watch the game. Come visit the country. We will
[0:31] Speaker 1: have three games in Australia for the NFL over the
[0:34] Speaker 1: next five years. Alright, tonight on the show we'll get
[0:37] Speaker 1: to winners and losers of the week. We're going to
[0:39] Speaker 1: have a chat to a politician who is absolutely taking
[0:42] Speaker 1: it to the government when it comes to these rorts
[0:45] Speaker 1: that are taking place. And Colin Flynn will join us
[0:48] Speaker 1: from the US. But obviously tomorrow is the 25th marking
[0:53] Speaker 1: of September 11. If you lived that history... You remember
[0:57] Speaker 1: exactly where you were and how we all felt at
[0:59] Speaker 1: the time. We knew that something had changed. We knew
[1:03] Speaker 1: that something had changed forever. Little did we know how
[1:06] Speaker 1: much was going to change. But it's important to remember
[1:12] Speaker 1: that while we lived that history, there are millions of Australians,
[1:16] Speaker 1: about seven million Australians, who were too young or not born.
[1:20] Speaker 1: So they don't remember what it was like to go
[1:24] Speaker 1: to the airport and not have... the levels of security
[1:28] Speaker 1: that exist when it comes to flying. The idea that
[1:32] Speaker 1: there was an Australia that was able to hold an
[1:36] Speaker 1: Olympic Games at the beginning of the 21st century in
[1:41] Speaker 1: a relatively low security environment only a couple of years
[1:47] Speaker 1: later to see everything change when you go into a
[1:51] Speaker 1: public place. Those people who didn't live it don't remember
[1:57] Speaker 1: One of the many things that was so frightening about
[2:00] Speaker 1: that particular night was it dawned on us that because
[2:04] Speaker 1: they used planes to hit a building, that anything could
[2:11] Speaker 1: be a weapon and everything could be a target. The
[2:17] Speaker 1: people who didn't live the experience of 25 years ago
[2:24] Speaker 1: don't remember the moral clarity of about wanting not just
[2:29] Speaker 1: to avenge the dead, but more importantly, to punish those
[2:34] Speaker 1: who were responsible. History, of course, is something that we
[2:42] Speaker 1: only get to live a small sliver of for obvious reasons. History,
[2:46] Speaker 1: of course, is thousands of years in that direction. The
[2:50] Speaker 1: physical history of the earth, millions of years before that.
[2:56] Speaker 1: And as the generations change, what we live through becomes
[3:01] Speaker 1: something that we tell our kids about that eventually becomes
[3:05] Speaker 1: something that kids read about. And in the same way
[3:09] Speaker 1: for Gen X, we read about World War I and Gallipoli,
[3:13] Speaker 1: but we didn't know anyone who had physically been through it.
[3:17] Speaker 1: So it had gone from being this nation that was
[3:21] Speaker 1: forged in the crucible of World War I to being
[3:27] Speaker 1: an item in a textbook. I never thought World War
[3:32] Speaker 1: II would become like that because it was my grandparents,
[3:35] Speaker 1: it was perhaps your parents, it might have even been you,
[3:38] Speaker 1: who was right in the middle of that lived experience,
[3:43] Speaker 1: who remembers the moral clarity for why they had to
[3:48] Speaker 1: stop the Nazis, why they had to repel the Japanese,
[3:53] Speaker 1: about what was on the line. Again, similarly, about the
[3:59] Speaker 1: Bali bombings, when Bali had gone from a place where
[4:04] Speaker 1: generations of Australians had gone on holidays until 88 Australians
[4:10] Speaker 1: were murdered in the worst possible way. And again, this
[4:15] Speaker 1: peaceful place that you didn't even think was going to
[4:18] Speaker 1: be a problem became something where you started to look
[4:22] Speaker 1: over your shoulders. Just recently, of course, we have all
[4:25] Speaker 1: lived the history of Bondi. The idea that a celebration
[4:31] Speaker 1: in summer of your faith would be anything other than
[4:35] Speaker 1: a lovely memory for a family. For that generation of
[4:42] Speaker 1: people who have grown up post 9-11, they don't remember
[4:47] Speaker 1: the moral clarity of the war or the need for
[4:50] Speaker 1: the war on terror or the the line in the
[4:53] Speaker 1: sand that was saying this is not going to happen,
[4:55] Speaker 1: we're not going to have the change in the world.
[4:57] Speaker 1: So they don't remember the clarity about why we had
[5:01] Speaker 1: to strike back, about why it was Afghanistan, about why
[5:07] Speaker 1: there was a singular focus on trying to make sure
[5:14] Speaker 1: that everything's a weapon, anything is a target, doesn't happen here. So,
[5:21] Speaker 1: of course, strengthen love to anyone with a personal connection
[5:25] Speaker 1: to any of this history, specifically the history that will
[5:29] Speaker 1: be marked in the next couple of days. But it
[5:33] Speaker 1: is behoven on all of us to not be able
[5:38] Speaker 1: to replicate what it was like to live through the history,
[5:40] Speaker 1: but to be able to pass on the clarity of
[5:44] Speaker 1: feeling that you had in the moment and the day after.
[5:49] Speaker 1: Because the further you get away from that, there's a
[5:51] Speaker 1: whole bunch of people who want to add context. The
[5:54] Speaker 1: black and white must be turned into grey again. But
[5:59] Speaker 1: just as we felt in Bondi, September 11, Bali, World
[6:03] Speaker 1: War II, and the list goes on forever. The world
[6:08] Speaker 1: changes and it changes forever. On an individual level, it
[6:12] Speaker 1: could be a horrific accident. It could be a terrible crime.
[6:18] Speaker 1: It could be an awful medical episode. And when you're young,
[6:23] Speaker 1: there's not a massive chance of any of that happening.
[6:25] Speaker 1: So somehow you think history happened to somebody else. Well,
[6:28] Speaker 1: the message to anyone who wasn't born for September 11 is,
[6:32] Speaker 1: guess what, history is going to happen to you. And
[6:35] Speaker 1: it does change you. And there's nothing wrong with seeing
[6:40] Speaker 1: things every now and then that are black and white,
[6:44] Speaker 1: right and wrong. because those traumas are what helped build
[6:49] Speaker 1: us into the people that we are today, to what
[6:52] Speaker 1: we demand of our governments, to how we interact with
[6:55] Speaker 1: each other as citizens, to the conversations that we have
[6:58] Speaker 1: each and every night. So Labor's red hot wrought. That's
[7:06] Speaker 1: the best I can get right now, but we'll get
[7:08] Speaker 1: further onto a final nickname for it. Keep sending the
[7:11] Speaker 1: emails here. This of course is the absolute disgrace That
[7:15] Speaker 1: was the government putting half a billion dollars aside and
[7:19] Speaker 1: then doling it out like they were rappers in a
[7:23] Speaker 1: strip club. It was raining cash. Unsurprisingly, it was raining
[7:29] Speaker 1: cash in mostly Labor seats. But remember, spending is nothing
[7:34] Speaker 1: new to the bloke who has tipped us past a
[7:36] Speaker 1: trillion dollars in debt. Remember, every single day, a billion here,
[7:41] Speaker 1: a million there.
[7:43] Speaker 2: A $ 7.
[7:43] Speaker 1: 2 billion announcement today $ 5 million $ 10 million $ 200 million.
[7:45] Speaker 3: $ 3 billion $ 350 million $ 2 billion $ 37 million $ 842 million $ 2.
[7:48] Speaker 1: 4 billion $ 8.
[7:48] Speaker 4: 5 billion $ 4.
[7:49] Speaker 1: 8 billion $ 1 billion $ 3. 4 billion $ 2. 8 billion $ 200 million
[7:51] Speaker 1: And it goes on and on on a little bit
[8:14] Speaker 1: like history there's deficits remember the intergenerational report says deficits
[8:18] Speaker 1: for the next well 40 years but who cares look
[8:21] Speaker 1: over there jackie lamb is yelling seriously the big stories
[8:26] Speaker 1: but of course beneath all of those major announcements were
[8:29] Speaker 1: these small announcements but they all add up to the
[8:31] Speaker 1: half a billion dollars that we've been talking about for
[8:33] Speaker 1: a couple of nights here a red hot wrought scheme One,
[8:38] Speaker 1: that even Channel 9, even Channel 9, who normally give
[8:41] Speaker 1: them a free pass, well, they saw how dodgy this is, remember?
[8:48] Speaker 3: Whereas the sports rort scandal involved a selection process that
[8:52] Speaker 3: was corrupted by politics, Labor's infrastructure grants program seemed to
[8:56] Speaker 3: have no process at all except to curry political favour.
[9:01] Speaker 5: Sports rots was pork barrelling by deception. This is pork
[9:05] Speaker 5: barrelling by design.
[9:08] Speaker 1: Unbelievable, right? Now, remember, all of this comes from a report.
[9:12] Speaker 1: The report was one that showed us very clearly here,
[9:16] Speaker 1: and this one, of course, again, came from that Centre
[9:20] Speaker 1: for Public Integrity, and it showed here $ 400 billion compared
[9:23] Speaker 1: to $ 128 million. It all ended up going where the
[9:26] Speaker 1: government wanted it to go. Now, the Prime Minister is cock-a-hoop.
[9:32] Speaker 1: There's nothing to see here. Don't worry about the Marrickville
[9:33] Speaker 1: golf course. I'm going to argue, you know, the wording
[9:37] Speaker 1: of your question. The point is it's dodgy. And when
[9:39] Speaker 1: apparently it was so dodgy that Liberal ministers had to
[9:41] Speaker 1: go and we had to change the government, what the
[9:43] Speaker 1: hell's going on here? You just saw it. But Helen Haynes,
[9:47] Speaker 1: hardcore lefty. We would disagree on many things. But tonight,
[9:51] Speaker 1: I'm going to get her on because I want to
[9:52] Speaker 1: talk about how do we change this system? How do
[9:54] Speaker 1: we fix this system? Because she has walked up and
[9:57] Speaker 1: put the black eye right on the Prime Minister's face
[9:59] Speaker 1: and he is trying to ignore it. So I'm not
[10:01] Speaker 1: going to ignore her, despite how much we probably won't
[10:04] Speaker 1: agree on much else. But we'll have a chat to
[10:06] Speaker 1: Helen Haynes in a couple of minutes' time. Now, I
[10:09] Speaker 1: have tried to avoid, for the obvious reasons, the back
[10:15] Speaker 1: and forth between Andrew Hastie and Pauline Hanson. You know
[10:18] Speaker 1: what it's about. You know why it is happening. You
[10:22] Speaker 1: know why it is political life and death. You will
[10:27] Speaker 1: have also noticed that the senator from Tasmania, who doesn't
[10:32] Speaker 1: like that Pauline Hanson has been able to create a
[10:35] Speaker 1: national movement, because remember the Jackie Lambie network was supposed
[10:37] Speaker 1: to be the national network, yet instead it only had
[10:42] Speaker 1: one extra MP. That MP, of course, left and became
[10:45] Speaker 1: a member of the Labor Party. The Jackie Lambie network
[10:49] Speaker 1: in Tasmania literally said at an election that they were
[10:53] Speaker 1: running with no policies. So the Jackie Lambie political model,
[10:58] Speaker 1: generally speaking, is to turn around, have somebody else come
[11:01] Speaker 1: up with an idea and then wait to see the
[11:03] Speaker 1: reaction and go, oh, I'm going to champion all the
[11:05] Speaker 1: people who hate. It's a brilliant, it'll keep her in
[11:08] Speaker 1: the parliament for a long time. But she's decided, well,
[11:12] Speaker 1: to kill two birds with one stone. One, which is
[11:16] Speaker 1: a stand-up for Andrew Hastie because of his military service,
[11:19] Speaker 1: something that I admire and something that if you really
[11:22] Speaker 1: remember the history of this program, I was very loud
[11:26] Speaker 1: in defending Andrew Hastie because remember the disgraceful allegations that
[11:30] Speaker 1: were being peddled around by the age from memory at
[11:34] Speaker 1: the time about actions on the battlefield? I knew them
[11:39] Speaker 1: to be BS and we defended staunchly. Andrew Hastie, as
[11:45] Speaker 1: the right person to go into the parliament, and now
[11:46] Speaker 1: he has gone into the parliament. But Jackie Lambie can
[11:50] Speaker 1: send some sort of blood in the water here, be
[11:52] Speaker 1: it what she thinks is Pauline Hanson's, because they won't
[11:55] Speaker 1: take down the cartoon, or maybe Angus Taylor's, because Hastie's
[12:00] Speaker 1: the next leader. Anybody that hides behind a cartoon and
[12:07] Speaker 1: goes after a veteran and calls them a traitor, a
[12:09] Speaker 1: paranoid traitor and.
[12:10] Speaker 6: A washed-up gutless maggot.
[12:12] Speaker 1: I have to say you're a bloody maggot yourself and
[12:14] Speaker 1: you're a coward.
[12:16] Speaker 6: And Hasty's right.
[12:17] Speaker 1: Call her out because she's a bloody coward. Okay. Now,
[12:21] Speaker 1: as I've said before, the one thing, above everything else
[12:25] Speaker 1: that I do admire about Jackie Lambie and her ability
[12:29] Speaker 1: to be appropriately outraged just at the crest of the wave.
[12:33] Speaker 1: She's never responsible for the idea, but she's the one
[12:35] Speaker 1: at the crest of the wave, just the most angry
[12:37] Speaker 1: on the day, right?
[12:41] Speaker 2: Is that.
[12:42] Speaker 1: She is always standing up for veterans, and I have
[12:44] Speaker 1: no problem with that whatsoever. And while she'll be throwing
[12:46] Speaker 1: something at the television, if she's watching anything now or
[12:48] Speaker 1: when she watches the video a little bit later, can
[12:51] Speaker 1: I just say to Jackie Lambie, I admired your rage
[12:55] Speaker 1: when it was about something a little more important. I
[13:00] Speaker 1: loved your rage about trying to get rid of the
[13:03] Speaker 1: cap on veterans' allied health. Remember the speeches in the parliament?
[13:08] Speaker 1: She's never going to stop. arrogantalbo.com.au. She's got the ability
[13:15] Speaker 1: to maintain the rage. I would love her to maintain
[13:17] Speaker 1: the rage about something that will help tens of thousands
[13:22] Speaker 1: of veterans, tens of thousands of veterans. We stand with
[13:27] Speaker 1: them in their fight with the government. And Senator Lambie,
[13:31] Speaker 1: you're on the inside. Fight for them as loudly as
[13:34] Speaker 1: you have in the past, as quietly as you may
[13:36] Speaker 1: behind the scenes, but you thunder each and every day Because, again,
[13:41] Speaker 1: the internal fights in and around Andrew Hastie, normal people
[13:45] Speaker 1: don't care. But a little warning about what I think
[13:52] Speaker 1: might also be going on here. So Andrew Hastie, very obviously,
[13:58] Speaker 1: is the most obvious next in line when it comes
[14:00] Speaker 1: to being the leader of the Liberal Party. Whether he
[14:03] Speaker 1: gets there before the election or not, we'll all wait
[14:05] Speaker 1: and see together, right? The polls are the polls. He's
[14:07] Speaker 1: got to convince his colleagues, fine, fair enough, right? That's
[14:09] Speaker 1: the way it goes. But there's a lot of people
[14:12] Speaker 1: in the media, and always beware the lefty media, who
[14:15] Speaker 1: start to champion one Liberal above all else, that this
[14:19] Speaker 1: is the obvious and absolute and you bet your leader,
[14:23] Speaker 1: and I'm talking about the type of media who always
[14:25] Speaker 1: hates the Liberal Party. You know, like nasty Nicky Savva,
[14:28] Speaker 1: the self-admitted liar. Feel free to Google it. It's all there. Well, she,
[14:32] Speaker 1: of course, is sort of pumping up the tyres. Like,
[14:34] Speaker 1: this is the next leader, the good idea, the next
[14:37] Speaker 1: good idea. You know, they always, the Canberra media, run
[14:40] Speaker 1: on this idea that there's some Liberal leader who's just,
[14:44] Speaker 1: you know, one step back from the current Liberal leader
[14:47] Speaker 1: who's like the perfect Liberal leader, the one Liberal leader
[14:50] Speaker 1: that will get them to not vote Green, not vote
[14:53] Speaker 1: Labor or not shiv the libs at every chance they get.
[14:56] Speaker 1: But guess what? Every time that person ascends to the leadership,
[15:01] Speaker 1: They disappoint the lefties. Because guess what? The Liberal Party
[15:08] Speaker 1: is not a left-wing political party. There might be a
[15:10] Speaker 1: lefty faction in it, but it is a centre-right political party.
[15:15] Speaker 1: And if they think that they've got Goldilocks and Andrew
[15:17] Speaker 1: Hastie as potentially the second coming of a leather jacket,
[15:21] Speaker 1: you know he says this about net zero, right, Nicky?
[15:25] Speaker 7: The truth is that Labor's net zero is a massive...
[15:28] Speaker 7: Giant green tax on the Australian people. It's a tax
[15:31] Speaker 7: on families. It's a tax on small businesses. And it's
[15:34] Speaker 7: a tax on heavy industry. And if we're ever going
[15:36] Speaker 7: to get advanced manufacturing going again in this country, we
[15:39] Speaker 7: need to axe Labor's net zero tax.
[15:43] Speaker 1: And this about immigration, Nicky.
[15:46] Speaker 7: And then, of course, we're going to cut immigration because
[15:49] Speaker 7: we think net overseas migration should be pegged to housing completions.
[15:53] Speaker 1: So I'm not getting into the fight. I'm not picking
[15:56] Speaker 1: a side. between Hastie and Hanson. I'm saying people like
[16:01] Speaker 1: Jackie Lambie who were taking, there's something else going on there.
[16:05] Speaker 1: But again, just a word of warning, when the media
[16:09] Speaker 1: is surrounding a Liberal and saying, you might be the
[16:11] Speaker 1: one to unpick the lock, guess what? It never unlocks.
[16:15] Speaker 1: It never unlocks. Instead, it turns around and always, always
[16:19] Speaker 1: bites you on the bum. Now, to Victoria, November cannot
[16:25] Speaker 1: come soon enough. There is a desperate need for the
[16:29] Speaker 1: state to change tack, desperately, right? And we know that
[16:34] Speaker 1: there is a million reasons for it, but for me,
[16:38] Speaker 1: the single biggest one is that the state has fallen
[16:40] Speaker 1: into a morass of grey corruption. That's not me making
[16:44] Speaker 1: it up. That, of course, was what the former ombudsman
[16:47] Speaker 1: had said, when essentially the difference between the public service
[16:50] Speaker 1: and the political party, it all sort of becomes nothing.
[16:54] Speaker 1: It all becomes the same thing. Everyone is in service
[16:56] Speaker 1: of the party and you don't end up as a
[17:00] Speaker 1: free place anymore. You end up as sort of some
[17:02] Speaker 1: mini CCP, which I'm sure Daniel Andrews is more than
[17:08] Speaker 1: happy to replicate. But there are a couple of organisations
[17:13] Speaker 1: like the Broadbase Corruption Commission, IBAC, or the ombudsman who
[17:18] Speaker 1: every now and then drop a report, like the one
[17:21] Speaker 1: that exposed that Ben Carroll, you know, the Premier who's
[17:24] Speaker 1: absolutely different than everyone he's ever worked for or ever
[17:28] Speaker 1: sucked up to or ever done the job for. I'm
[17:31] Speaker 1: definitely not Jacinda Ardern. I'm definitely not Daniel Andrews. Oh,
[17:35] Speaker 1: so the Auditor-General says you came up with a tax
[17:37] Speaker 1: that you didn't tell everyone about. Oh, I'm going to,
[17:39] Speaker 1: I'm going to, I'm going to, I'm going to.
[17:40] Speaker 2: We're getting rid of it.
[17:41] Speaker 1: Please vote for me. I'm different.
[17:42] Speaker 4: I'm different.
[17:45] Speaker 1: So there is pressure on the Victorian government with what
[17:47] Speaker 1: little time they either have in office or before the
[17:49] Speaker 1: election where they may well go round again. Anything's possible.
[17:52] Speaker 1: Nothing is inevitable. Nothing is inevitable. On this program, no-one
[17:55] Speaker 1: wakes up surprised, all right? Everything is possible, including a
[17:59] Speaker 1: return of a terrible government. It was new legislation to,
[18:03] Speaker 1: guess what, give more power, more focus to these agencies. Because,
[18:08] Speaker 1: as we've told you before, the state budget actually took
[18:11] Speaker 1: money off the integrity organisations. But guess what? None of
[18:19] Speaker 1: the changes are going to be retrospective, meaning Alan, Andrews,
[18:24] Speaker 1: all the ministers with the Sergeant Schultz, I know nothing, defence. Well,
[18:31] Speaker 1: it won't apply. It's only forward-facing. What a wonderful way
[18:35] Speaker 1: of pretending that the Jedi mind trick works. Well, of course,
[18:41] Speaker 1: they are in a position right now that if you're
[18:43] Speaker 1: going to draw up new laws, then guess what? Let's
[18:46] Speaker 1: increase the transparency and let's widen the scope to say,
[18:51] Speaker 1: guess what? They can look back in anger, and rightly so.
[18:54] Speaker 1: It's what Jess Wilson wants to happen. It's what she'll
[18:57] Speaker 1: vote for, even if it means she doesn't get to
[19:00] Speaker 1: take that clobbering stick to a state election. Here she is.
[19:05] Speaker 8: The legislation says here, in black and white, if IBAC
[19:08] Speaker 8: has received a referral in the past... about a matter
[19:12] Speaker 8: that it has dismissed, that it has referred on, or
[19:15] Speaker 8: that it has investigated, then that referral cannot be investigated
[19:19] Speaker 8: by IBAC. This is Ben Carroll's legislation. Ben Carroll approved
[19:24] Speaker 8: this to go to the floor of the Parliament.
[19:26] Speaker 9: We will amend it.
[19:27] Speaker 8: We will amend it to make it fully retrospective, and
[19:30] Speaker 8: I invite Ben Carroll to support our amendments to make
[19:32] Speaker 8: sure that IBAC has the power to investigate the largest
[19:36] Speaker 8: corruption scandal in this state's history.
[19:39] Speaker 9: Correct.
[19:40] Speaker 1: Fingers crossed she's the next Premier of Victoria. You want
[19:44] Speaker 1: somebody with that sort of energy and clarity and youth
[19:47] Speaker 1: and focus. A chance to reset. It is there, Victoria.
[19:52] Speaker 1: It's up to you. Fingers crossed it's taken. It happens
[19:55] Speaker 1: in November. But till then, can they do something about
[19:57] Speaker 1: the damn roads? How often do we talk about this?
[19:59] Speaker 1: I don't trust government to be able to fix our
[20:02] Speaker 1: education system or heal the sick or to pay down
[20:06] Speaker 1: the debt if they can't fix a freaking pothole. Because
[20:10] Speaker 1: it's the little things, right? If you can't do the
[20:12] Speaker 1: little things, then how the heck am I going to
[20:14] Speaker 1: trust you on the big things? Interesting stuff in the
[20:17] Speaker 1: age here. Almost half of all of Victoria's roads are
[20:20] Speaker 1: in poor condition. This comes from the Auditor-General's office. Again,
[20:24] Speaker 1: something not totally controlled by the government, hence why the
[20:26] Speaker 1: report could not be hidden. Almost half of the state
[20:29] Speaker 1: government's managed roads are in poor or very poor condition,
[20:32] Speaker 1: with decline outpacing repairs. 48% of state roads were considered
[20:37] Speaker 1: in poor or very poor condition. That's jumping by almost
[20:41] Speaker 1: a quarter from 2021. 2024 data reveals more than a
[20:46] Speaker 1: third of state roads have just got five years of
[20:49] Speaker 1: useful life left. To give you an idea, here's a
[20:52] Speaker 1: map of Victoria. The darker the colour, the more there
[20:54] Speaker 1: are potholes. Surprise, surprise. The darker they are, the further
[20:57] Speaker 1: you get away from Melbourne. Geez, wonder why those people
[21:00] Speaker 1: aren't going to be voting Labor. Well, they're probably going
[21:02] Speaker 1: to be voting One Nation. In terms of specific areas
[21:07] Speaker 1: that have got a world of problem, there are 445
[21:10] Speaker 1: potholes in Toowong. Mornington Peninsula, 382. Corangamite, 305. Wangaratta, 260.
[21:20] Speaker 1: And all the rest you can see on your screen
[21:22] Speaker 1: right now. And even then, don't just fix the potholes.
[21:26] Speaker 1: Here's an even bigger idea. Fix the freaking roads. The
[21:30] Speaker 1: Herald Sun made this excellent observation today.
[21:34] Speaker 10: Potholes are just a symptom. The real issue is what's
[21:37] Speaker 10: hidden underneath. Many moons ago, when it came to road maintenance,
[21:41] Speaker 10: Victoria prioritised road rehabilitation and road resurfacing, ripping up the
[21:47] Speaker 10: road and rebuilding it before potholes even have the chance
[21:51] Speaker 10: to appear. And then you add major flooding events in
[21:54] Speaker 10: 2022 and 2023, and things.
[21:57] Speaker 9: Took a turn for the worse.
[21:59] Speaker 10: The government poured heaps of funds into quickly patching up
[22:01] Speaker 10: the road. Long-term maintenance was slashed and roads were left
[22:05] Speaker 10: unexpected to handle heavier traffic for longer periods of time.
[22:09] Speaker 10: Roads are already slightly cracking and water has the chance
[22:13] Speaker 10: to seep down into the foundations, weakening the base of
[22:17] Speaker 10: the road.
[22:17] Speaker 9: So when heavy.
[22:18] Speaker 10: Cars and trucks now drive over, the road literally collapses
[22:22] Speaker 10: in on itself, causing what we.
[22:24] Speaker 6: Like to call a pothole.
[22:26] Speaker 1: I love when, there's not enough explainers on the internet.
[22:31] Speaker 1: I love that stuff. Well done to the Herald Sun. Now,
[22:34] Speaker 1: Donald Trump, as you know, every four years, presidential election,
[22:37] Speaker 1: every four years, the party puts on a giant convention.
[22:40] Speaker 1: It is a guaranteed way of being given at least
[22:44] Speaker 1: an hour of primetime TV for multiple days in a row.
[22:47] Speaker 1: Trump's been very successful with these, of course, in 2016,
[22:51] Speaker 1: obviously not 2020, and then again a couple of days
[22:54] Speaker 1: after he'd been shot at in 2024. So the midterms
[22:58] Speaker 1: are coming up. This is where the Republicans who are
[23:01] Speaker 1: in charge of the Senate that picks all of the
[23:03] Speaker 1: people and approves the ones to be in his cabinet,
[23:05] Speaker 1: or the judges, could go from being Republican-controlled to Democrat-controlled,
[23:10] Speaker 1: or the House, which impeaches presidents, doesn't get them pushed
[23:15] Speaker 1: out of office, that needs to happen at a trial
[23:17] Speaker 1: in the Senate, but essentially the main power.
[23:20] Speaker 1: Of the lower house of Congress is firstly, it can
[23:23] Speaker 1: stop anything passing through the system because if you lose
[23:26] Speaker 1: any one of those three, you're in a world of trouble.
[23:29] Speaker 1: So November is a high stakes game. So Donald Trump
[23:32] Speaker 1: has had a midterms convention. Nobody's ever done this before
[23:36] Speaker 1: in the hope that he would be able to get,
[23:37] Speaker 1: you know, guaranteed one hour of free airtime everywhere. He
[23:39] Speaker 1: didn't get it. He got cable news coverage and he
[23:42] Speaker 1: turned up with a very big and definitely not stimulatory promise.
[23:46] Speaker 1: Now we talk about pork barreling here. This could be
[23:50] Speaker 1: the whole farm.
[23:52] Speaker 11: If the Republicans win the House of Representatives and the
[23:56] Speaker 11: United States Senate, I will issue a dividend to every
[24:00] Speaker 11: adult citizen in the United States of America for $ 5, 000. $ 5, 000.
[24:06] Speaker 1: For each and every... Don't. Albo, we can see you.
[24:11] Speaker 2: $ 5, 000.
[24:13] Speaker 1: For each and every voter... Why is this happening? Because
[24:16] Speaker 1: this is the latest opinion polls, and again, polls can
[24:18] Speaker 1: always be wrong. Yes, they were in 2016. Yes, they
[24:21] Speaker 1: were a little bit in 2024. Republicans currently being beaten
[24:25] Speaker 1: by a pretty significant margin. Most likely, they're going to
[24:28] Speaker 1: lose the House. There's a good chance they'll lose the
[24:30] Speaker 1: Senate as well. Why? Because the President's disapproval ratings, it
[24:33] Speaker 1: is what it is. Again, will I take him over
[24:36] Speaker 1: Kamala Harris? All day, every day, every day, every day,
[24:39] Speaker 1: every day. But is there a chance that a giant
[24:41] Speaker 1: handbrake is going to be pulled on the presidency? You betcha.
[24:44] Speaker 1: It happens in and around November. Helen Haynes is the
[24:47] Speaker 1: independent member for Indi. She's been the one who has
[24:50] Speaker 1: been making the most noise about this rorting of the
[24:54] Speaker 1: pork-barrelling of the Labor Party in the lead-up to the
[24:56] Speaker 1: last election. Half a billion dollars, the majority of which,
[24:59] Speaker 1: more than $ 400 million of which. went to the Labor
[25:02] Speaker 1: Party and Labor Party seats. Their spin, of course, is
[25:05] Speaker 1: it's just their election promises. Hang on, it's taxpayer money.
[25:08] Speaker 1: You have to give that to 150 seats, not just
[25:12] Speaker 1: the red ones, right? Now, you would think that if
[25:15] Speaker 1: they have been shamed, as they have been this week,
[25:18] Speaker 1: that they might pull their head in a little bit. Instead,
[25:20] Speaker 1: they are utterly shameless. I spoke about this with Helen Haynes,
[25:24] Speaker 1: the independent member for Indi, just a bit earlier.
[25:28] Speaker 9: Oh, in fact, quite the opposite. They're proud of it, Paul.
[25:33] Speaker 5: This particular major and local community infrastructure grant program came
[25:38] Speaker 5: to my attention last year when a community group in
[25:44] Speaker 5: my community came to me and said, Helen, you've been
[25:48] Speaker 5: indicating to us we need to put our hand up
[25:50] Speaker 5: for a competitive grant for our golf club house. We've
[25:54] Speaker 5: been looking at all the grant programs and we've seen
[25:56] Speaker 5: this one and we're wondering how do we get an invitation? And,
[25:59] Speaker 5: of course, when I asked the minister responsible in question
[26:03] Speaker 5: time that precise question, how do you get an invitation,
[26:07] Speaker 5: quite clearly and proudly said, well, you know, this is
[26:10] Speaker 5: fulfilling our election commitments, which really, in my mind, Paul,
[26:15] Speaker 5: is a euphemism for this is about us rolling out
[26:18] Speaker 5: our pork barrel.
[26:20] Speaker 1: Well, and this is the thing, right? I mean, the
[26:21] Speaker 1: previous government got absolutely smashed for it, and rightly so,
[26:24] Speaker 1: because it is overtly political. And here it is with
[26:28] Speaker 1: the Labor Party, right? And the distribution of Labor to
[26:32] Speaker 1: non-Labor seats tells the obvious story. I do love that the...
[26:37] Speaker 1: prime minister's office is out and about trying to go
[26:39] Speaker 1: behind your back and say well you know helen might
[26:42] Speaker 1: be going on about this but she wanted money from
[26:44] Speaker 1: this she asked for lots and lots of programs yeah
[26:48] Speaker 1: but the difference here is you had to be invited
[26:51] Speaker 1: you had to be invited it's not about asking.
[26:54] Speaker 5: Well well to to your point i mean every mp
[26:58] Speaker 5: if they're doing their job right paul is out and
[27:00] Speaker 5: about in their community talking to community groups, working with
[27:04] Speaker 5: their local councils, really understanding where the glaring gaps and
[27:09] Speaker 5: challenges and needs are. And look, some things are wish
[27:11] Speaker 5: list things, but some things are deeply, deeply important, like
[27:15] Speaker 5: a bridge that doesn't flood when the water comes up
[27:18] Speaker 5: in a wet year or a community infrastructure program that
[27:23] Speaker 5: makes a particular area safer because of a better road.
[27:28] Speaker 5: tourism projects, you name it, arts projects, all sorts of
[27:31] Speaker 5: things local governments and community groups talk to their MPs about.
[27:35] Speaker 1: So.
[27:36] Speaker 5: You know, part of my job is to understand how
[27:38] Speaker 5: big the need is, where the need is.
[27:40] Speaker 9: And then I work really closely.
[27:43] Speaker 5: I've got nine councils that I work with, a host
[27:46] Speaker 5: of community organisations, not-for-profits and, in fact, you know, regional
[27:51] Speaker 5: development organisations. And together we put in a submission, every budget,
[27:56] Speaker 5: to the Treasurer to lay out where the need is.
[27:59] Speaker 5: And when I work with my community groups and indeed
[28:02] Speaker 5: some of the budget submission says, look, this could be
[28:05] Speaker 5: eligible under a particular grants program. This one hasn't got
[28:09] Speaker 5: a grants program that would match it. And the point
[28:12] Speaker 5: of that is to demonstrate to the government how big
[28:14] Speaker 5: the need is. And the big need is not just
[28:18] Speaker 5: in targeted Labor seats, I can tell you that.
[28:20] Speaker 1: Well, but also, right, 150 MPs should be asking for
[28:24] Speaker 1: a billion dollars for their seats because there may well
[28:26] Speaker 1: be those sorts of, as you say, infrastructure issues, right?
[28:30] Speaker 1: We know what the roads are like in Victoria. Yes,
[28:33] Speaker 1: don't we? Yeah, that story tells itself, particularly regional Victoria.
[28:36] Speaker 1: I mean, honestly, some of the goat tracks that people...
[28:38] Speaker 1: are having to use, it's a disgrace. But let's talk
[28:41] Speaker 1: about a fix here, because, again.
[28:43] Speaker 2: Yeah, let's talk about that.
[28:45] Speaker 1: Yeah, both sides of government are going to try to
[28:47] Speaker 1: turn around and say, well, look, this is kind of
[28:48] Speaker 1: a two-day story. Everyone moves on. Oh, look, Jackie Lambie's yelling. Quick,
[28:52] Speaker 1: that's the 6pm news. How do we get around this?
[28:56] Speaker 9: Well, that's the thing.
[28:57] Speaker 5: We can actually solve this, Paul, because fundamentally we have
[29:00] Speaker 5: to understand this money does not belong to the political classes.
[29:05] Speaker 5: It does not belong to a political party. This is
[29:09] Speaker 5: taxpayer money and governments are under obligation and public trust
[29:14] Speaker 5: to spend it wisely.
[29:16] Speaker 9: So how do we do that?
[29:17] Speaker 5: We make sure that our grants programs are administered in
[29:20] Speaker 5: such a way that that the default mechanism, and right
[29:24] Speaker 5: now the grants guidelines tell us this, that the best
[29:27] Speaker 5: practice is a competitive grant, great. Then we operate on
[29:32] Speaker 5: a guidelines and principles. But they're not enforceable, Paul. So
[29:36] Speaker 5: what I want to see is standards that are enforceable.
[29:40] Speaker 5: and this kind of closed invitation only whereby no one
[29:46] Speaker 5: knows how you get an invitation. Well, we all know actually,
[29:49] Speaker 5: but it's not written down, it's not justified and then
[29:53] Speaker 5: retrofitted guidelines that come after these people receive an invitation.
[29:59] Speaker 9: That's not okay.
[30:00] Speaker 5: We need to have standards that are enforceable and it
[30:03] Speaker 5: needs to be overseen by a parliamentary committee that has
[30:06] Speaker 5: members of the government of the day, of the crossbench
[30:10] Speaker 5: and of the opposition so we can all.
[30:12] Speaker 9: Have eyes on it.
[30:13] Speaker 2: And you know what, Paul?
[30:14] Speaker 9: We'd all be better off.
[30:15] Speaker 5: We could stop this stupid race to the bottom. As
[30:17] Speaker 5: you know, I gave the Morrison government curry over sports rewards.
[30:21] Speaker 5: I'm not afraid to give the Albanese government curry over
[30:25] Speaker 5: this one. We've got to get it right and we've
[30:27] Speaker 5: got to get it right because we're an environment... I mean,
[30:29] Speaker 5: we don't have a money tree. Every project can't get funded.
[30:32] Speaker 9: Of course it can't.
[30:33] Speaker 5: But it needs to be fair and it needs to
[30:36] Speaker 5: go to areas of need, public need, not political need.
[30:40] Speaker 1: My observation of this Prime Minister, like all, but he's
[30:43] Speaker 1: the one in charge right now, at times they can
[30:45] Speaker 1: be a bit petty, at times they can be a
[30:46] Speaker 1: bit thin-skinned, at times they can be a little bit vindictive.
[30:49] Speaker 1: Obviously not being a member of the government. Do you
[30:53] Speaker 1: expect any sort of retribution here, that future applications go
[30:56] Speaker 1: to the bottom of the barrel now because you've caused
[30:59] Speaker 1: trouble for the Prime Minister this week?
[31:01] Speaker 5: Well, that would be outrageous if that were to be
[31:05] Speaker 5: the case, and that would demonstrate a very egregious bias, Paul.
[31:10] Speaker 9: I mean, right now, when it comes.
[31:11] Speaker 5: To a pork barrel like this, I mean, it's clear
[31:15] Speaker 5: from the data that has been analysed so comprehensively by
[31:18] Speaker 5: the Centre for Public Integrity that that particular fund has
[31:22] Speaker 5: been targeted with bias to Labor held or needed to
[31:26] Speaker 5: win seats. But I have confidence in the competitive grants process.
[31:30] Speaker 5: I mean, that was the one that, of course, was...
[31:32] Speaker 5: I mean, it was a competitive grants process in sports rorts.
[31:36] Speaker 5: That's why the ANAO was so scathing about this. But
[31:41] Speaker 5: the competitive grants process has independent assessments. You know, anyone
[31:48] Speaker 5: can apply. If you meet the criteria, you get to
[31:50] Speaker 5: put your application in. And I'm confident that that is
[31:55] Speaker 5: assessed fair and square. But what we're talking about here
[31:58] Speaker 5: with this major community local infrastructure program is not that.
[32:02] Speaker 9: It's not a competitive process.
[32:04] Speaker 5: It's a closed shop, invitation only, to deliver on what
[32:09] Speaker 5: Labor boldly tell us is completely all right, and that
[32:12] Speaker 5: is to go out into little communities and make promises
[32:15] Speaker 5: using public funds.
[32:17] Speaker 1: Correct. They're not Oprah, they're the government. Thank you, Helen.
[32:19] Speaker 1: Nice to talk to you.
[32:21] Speaker 9: Lovely to talk to you too, Paul.
[32:23] Speaker 1: Helen Haynes has said we disagree on many things, but
[32:25] Speaker 1: on this one... Two broken clocks, same time, all right?
[32:28] Speaker 1: Quick break, back with more. We are going to talk
[32:30] Speaker 1: about the Liberal Party's decision to say..... to the changes
[32:33] Speaker 1: when it comes to social media, the political ups, downs
[32:37] Speaker 1: and whether it's the right thing to do next here
[32:39] Speaker 1: on Paul Murray Live, as well as who is the
[32:40] Speaker 1: winner and loser of the week. Thanks for watching. Well,
[32:48] Speaker 1: thank you so much for watching, wherever you're happy to be.
[32:50] Speaker 1: Let us get into the conversation where we will eventually
[32:52] Speaker 1: crown the winner and loser of the week, but there's
[32:54] Speaker 1: so much to do between now and then. Lisa Goddard,
[32:57] Speaker 1: of course, Queen of Adoni Media. She is in Brisbane tonight.
[33:00] Speaker 1: Lovely to see you. In Canberra, because that's where the
[33:02] Speaker 1: action is, is Sean Bell, of course, who is the
[33:06] Speaker 1: One Nation Senator for New South Wales. Lovely to see
[33:08] Speaker 1: you both. So I've noticed there's a little back and
[33:12] Speaker 1: forth between Andrew Hastie, Pauline Hanson. My position on this
[33:15] Speaker 1: is I'm not getting involved, right? because I think there's
[33:18] Speaker 1: bigger and better stuff to talk about, and I don't
[33:20] Speaker 1: care about Jackie Lambie getting involved in it, before we
[33:22] Speaker 1: get to Sean, who I'm pretty sure is going to
[33:24] Speaker 1: back in the position of his boss, party and cartoon. Lisa,
[33:28] Speaker 1: your thoughts on this? Wow.
[33:32] Speaker 12: What a week we've had in politics here in this
[33:34] Speaker 12: country for news junkies like us, Paul, who sit there
[33:36] Speaker 12: and watch it all. There's been numbers of press conferences
[33:38] Speaker 12: around this country this week and interviews where you've just
[33:41] Speaker 12: been on the edge of your seat, and certainly... One
[33:43] Speaker 12: Nation has been front and centre for all of them.
[33:45] Speaker 12: I'm going to beat Sean Bell to the punch here, Sean.
[33:47] Speaker 12: I think I have a crystal ball. I think there
[33:49] Speaker 12: is no chance in hell One Nation is going to
[33:51] Speaker 12: pull down that cartoon, no matter how much flack is
[33:54] Speaker 12: thrown in your direction. And, look, I think Pauline Hanson
[33:57] Speaker 12: is renowned for standing by what she says, so I
[33:59] Speaker 12: don't think her supporters at all will be surprised by that.
[34:02] Speaker 12: I think as far as Andrew Hastie goes, he's a... Look,
[34:05] Speaker 12: I think as a war veteran, we have to respect
[34:07] Speaker 12: our war veterans. However, he's talking about this.
[34:11] Speaker 6: Is going to divide the defence community.
[34:13] Speaker 12: If you have a look, tonight the RSL Australia put
[34:15] Speaker 12: up a post online saying that basically it was inappropriate.
[34:19] Speaker 12: I'm paraphrasing, but that's what they were saying. The number
[34:22] Speaker 12: of veterans that are on there, the number that have
[34:24] Speaker 12: called me tonight to say, we don't stand with this
[34:27] Speaker 12: fight against One Nation.
[34:28] Speaker 6: We think that it was satirical.
[34:30] Speaker 12: Andrew Hastie is already a divisive figure, I think, in
[34:33] Speaker 12: the defence community. So I don't think this is going
[34:36] Speaker 12: to divide veterans as much as what Andrew Hastie thinks
[34:39] Speaker 12: it's going to do. And for me, the timing of this,
[34:41] Speaker 12: that cartoon came out a month ago. I think it's
[34:44] Speaker 12: a political strategy now to jump on it because there's
[34:45] Speaker 12: no way, given the chatter around Parliament House, that he
[34:48] Speaker 12: didn't know that this was out a month ago and
[34:51] Speaker 12: he's decided to come out after that WA by-election.
[34:53] Speaker 1: Mate, I know when, and, you know, Sean, I'm sure
[34:56] Speaker 1: this is going to delight... the people who occasionally hate
[34:59] Speaker 1: watch the program, right? But there is always someone in
[35:02] Speaker 1: my life who decides to send me a link to
[35:05] Speaker 1: a story I had no plans on reading from a
[35:08] Speaker 1: website of which I barely know where it comes from,
[35:11] Speaker 1: and they go, look, look what they said about you,
[35:13] Speaker 1: as if he didn't know straightaway where the cartoon was. Again,
[35:18] Speaker 1: I'm not a big fan of that word being used, but, again,
[35:21] Speaker 1: that's a conversation... somewhere else. I think that all of this,
[35:26] Speaker 1: we all know what all this is about. It's about
[35:28] Speaker 1: saving his own backside in his own seat. It's also
[35:32] Speaker 1: about trying to sort of show that he's the one
[35:34] Speaker 1: to take on One Nation because Taylor can't. We get
[35:37] Speaker 1: all the messages here, right? But isn't the problem for
[35:40] Speaker 1: both sides of this is that when you're talking about this,
[35:42] Speaker 1: you're not talking about a superannuation policy, which was the
[35:46] Speaker 1: plan for the week, which was to talk about something
[35:48] Speaker 1: to help people who are on the bones of their backside.
[35:53] Speaker 13: Paul, I think it is a shame that this week,
[35:56] Speaker 13: much of it about helping veterans and defeating bad legislation
[36:01] Speaker 13: that the Albanese Labor government has brought in to cap
[36:04] Speaker 13: healthcare payments at $ 5, 000, some politicians have decided to go
[36:08] Speaker 13: out and make this about themselves. And I was very
[36:11] Speaker 13: proud today to work in Parliament with politicians from across
[36:14] Speaker 13: the spectrum. Michaelia Cash, when she moved an amendment to
[36:19] Speaker 13: a government bill, to fix that problem, to make sure
[36:22] Speaker 13: that the veterans got uncapped health care where they need it.
[36:27] Speaker 13: We voted for that. The whole parliament did. Now, that's
[36:30] Speaker 13: to go to the lower house. It's up to the
[36:31] Speaker 13: government to now deal with that problem. And that's what
[36:34] Speaker 13: this week should have been about. But instead, again, others
[36:37] Speaker 13: wanted to make it about themselves.
[36:39] Speaker 2: Yep.
[36:39] Speaker 13: And then things like the fact that One Nation brought
[36:41] Speaker 13: in legislation and voted on legislation to protect Australians against
[36:46] Speaker 13: dangerous returned terrorist supporters.
[36:48] Speaker 2: Labor government voted against that.
[36:50] Speaker 1: But.
[36:51] Speaker 13: People wanted to make it about themselves. We were trying
[36:53] Speaker 13: to make it about keeping Australians safe. We were talking
[36:55] Speaker 13: about our legislation, our policy, to allow people to access
[36:58] Speaker 13: a little bit of their super, if they need it,
[37:01] Speaker 13: to help them pay for their groceries, help them pay
[37:03] Speaker 13: rent and mortgages. That's what we were focused on. Sadly,
[37:07] Speaker 13: some other politicians were focused on themselves.
[37:09] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[37:10] Speaker 1: Now, I want to talk a little bit here about
[37:11] Speaker 1: the social media laws, right? Because, obviously, I'm completely with
[37:16] Speaker 1: everyone who's made the point, including my dear friend Peter Credlin,
[37:18] Speaker 1: who's made all the points about what really is the
[37:21] Speaker 1: point of the legislation. My issue with the Libs coming
[37:25] Speaker 1: out as hard as they have in the lower house
[37:28] Speaker 1: is that I think this is a battle that can
[37:29] Speaker 1: make it up to the Senate, potentially a whole bunch
[37:32] Speaker 1: of other ways to highlight the individual problems here, because, Lisa,
[37:37] Speaker 1: even though no government is going to be able to
[37:39] Speaker 1: get its hands around the evils of the internet, and again,
[37:41] Speaker 1: all of the justification for the algorithmic stuff is so
[37:44] Speaker 1: kids don't see it, but hang on, I thought we
[37:46] Speaker 1: banned that at the beginning a few months ago right
[37:50] Speaker 1: so hang on what what are we worried about the
[37:52] Speaker 1: kids for here my concern is as sarah henderson was
[37:57] Speaker 1: talking to peter a bit earlier tonight is the power
[37:59] Speaker 1: of the minister um i've got issues with that but
[38:05] Speaker 1: lisa the truth about this legislation and this is the
[38:07] Speaker 1: cold hard fact so the libs are going to start
[38:09] Speaker 1: kicking the telly as well here right um we're going
[38:13] Speaker 1: to fix big tech, we're going to take on big tech,
[38:15] Speaker 1: polls about as well as let's end homelessness, right? That
[38:18] Speaker 1: anyone sitting on the other end of that instantly gets
[38:21] Speaker 1: sent to the naughty corner. And I just think they
[38:23] Speaker 1: had to be kind of clever about how they fought this.
[38:27] Speaker 1: And maybe I think they fired the final shot a
[38:29] Speaker 1: bit early. Am I wrong?
[38:33] Speaker 6: Well, I just think it all sounds really simple.
[38:35] Speaker 12: They're just selling what The average person is going to
[38:37] Speaker 12: sound like a very simple argument. We're going to, like
[38:39] Speaker 12: you say, protect children, but they're not thinking about the
[38:42] Speaker 12: further ramifications.
[38:43] Speaker 6: Here's what I found really interesting today, Paul.
[38:45] Speaker 12: One of the Instagram bosses happened to be in Australia
[38:48] Speaker 12: and was caught by the media. Now, he was here
[38:51] Speaker 12: to market the tools that you can use to basically
[38:54] Speaker 12: control your own feed. So I didn't know this, and
[38:56] Speaker 12: I don't think many people do, that you can go
[38:58] Speaker 12: into your settings and you can edit your own algorithm.
[39:01] Speaker 12: So why on earth, if the Zuckerbergs of the world
[39:05] Speaker 12: are allowing us to do that, do we need an
[39:06] Speaker 12: Albanese in there then controlling what we can or cannot see?
[39:10] Speaker 6: I think that's where the danger is.
[39:12] Speaker 12: And the Liberals need to stand up against this because
[39:14] Speaker 12: ultimately it is free speech and access to the information.
[39:17] Speaker 12: It cannot be censored because it's a very dangerous and
[39:20] Speaker 12: slippery slope.
[39:21] Speaker 1: Now, also, Sean, if I can give you a little
[39:22] Speaker 1: homework here, or maybe you might be able to give
[39:24] Speaker 1: me the answer here, right, is I bet there's a
[39:26] Speaker 1: little carve-out for political parties that the switching off of
[39:30] Speaker 1: the algorithm doesn't apply to their ability to be able
[39:32] Speaker 1: to still get into your feed, because otherwise, why did
[39:35] Speaker 1: every politician get an extra member of staff to help
[39:38] Speaker 1: them make those crap social media videos?
[39:40] Speaker 2: Well, I mean, that's news to me that anyone got
[39:45] Speaker 2: extra staff. Not One Nation.
[39:46] Speaker 1: Not One Nation. Good point.
[39:50] Speaker 2: And I will go have a look into that, Paul.
[39:52] Speaker 13: But, look, frankly, I feel like if they turned off
[39:54] Speaker 13: the algorithm, it'll probably benefit One Nation. I think the
[39:57] Speaker 13: Labor Party needs to be worried here. Be careful what
[39:59] Speaker 13: you wish for. Because so much of the people I see,
[40:01] Speaker 13: the different activists or organisations supporting the Labor Party, they
[40:04] Speaker 13: seem propped up and astroturfed by the algorithm.
[40:07] Speaker 2: But that's a separate issue.
[40:08] Speaker 13: The reality is the only reason the Labor government is
[40:11] Speaker 13: out here talking about this stuff, using these persuasive terms
[40:15] Speaker 13: like digital duty of care, is because they're tired of
[40:18] Speaker 13: hearing people say... critical things of them on the internet,
[40:21] Speaker 13: and they are trying to shut it down. Whether it's
[40:23] Speaker 13: their legislation to ban children from social media or this
[40:28] Speaker 13: new digital duty of care, it's all a part of
[40:30] Speaker 13: their broader agenda to silence your speech. Silence the speech
[40:35] Speaker 13: of everyday Australians. They don't like being criticised and they
[40:39] Speaker 13: start losing elections to One Nation and they rush to
[40:42] Speaker 13: blame everybody but themselves.
[40:44] Speaker 1: Very good point. Oh, the bots from over east. Come on,
[40:46] Speaker 1: stop treating people like this. We're not mushrooms, we're human beings.
[40:50] Speaker 1: All right, Lisa, winner or loser of the week, who
[40:52] Speaker 1: stands out for you?
[40:55] Speaker 6: It's a bit controversial, Paul.
[40:56] Speaker 12: Winner, I think Warren Pickering, won because he stood up
[40:58] Speaker 12: and faced the music and also in that that he
[41:01] Speaker 12: actually suggested that every MP, every candidate and every incumbent
[41:05] Speaker 12: should be drug tested. I think that was a very
[41:07] Speaker 12: interesting one to throw out there and you can hear
[41:09] Speaker 12: the pollies running away.
[41:10] Speaker 1: From that immediately. Winner of the loser of the week...
[41:12] Speaker 1: Let's try the political journos. Keep going.
[41:16] Speaker 12: Loser of the week, Angus Taylor, because of all this
[41:19] Speaker 12: kerfuffle around the One Nation cartoon, so many more people
[41:23] Speaker 12: are going and searching it out and watching it, and
[41:25] Speaker 12: Angus Taylor's being exposed for losing his balls.
[41:28] Speaker 1: Yep. Now, well said. You've seen the video. If you've
[41:31] Speaker 1: seen the cartoon, that makes sense, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah,
[41:32] Speaker 1: you've seen the video. If you know, you know. All right, Sean,
[41:35] Speaker 1: who's your winner?
[41:38] Speaker 2: Look, I think the winner this week was veterans.
[41:40] Speaker 13: I think that, you know, the parliament worked together to
[41:42] Speaker 13: help correct mistakes that the Albanese Labor government had made.
[41:45] Speaker 13: The battle's not over, but we're going to keep going.
[41:47] Speaker 13: But I think seeing the vast majority... Unite. That's a
[41:51] Speaker 13: win for veterans. And now I think the loser is
[41:55] Speaker 13: Anthony Albanese. And frankly, he's often a loser every week.
[41:58] Speaker 13: But this stuff you've seen with the sports rorts, with
[42:00] Speaker 13: the golf club, I mean, I'll give you a tip.
[42:02] Speaker 13: You go onto his Twitter, you Google the words golf
[42:04] Speaker 13: club under his account and a whole bunch of posts
[42:06] Speaker 13: pop up with him standing with the president of the
[42:08] Speaker 13: golf club, past grants to this golf club, like his
[42:11] Speaker 13: attempt to try and distance his relationship from the golf club.
[42:14] Speaker 2: It just proves he's going to be a pretty loser.
[42:16] Speaker 1: I'm with you.
[42:16] Speaker 2: Thank you, guys.
[42:17] Speaker 1: Do appreciate it. Senator, future senator, lovely to see you.
[42:20] Speaker 1: All right, quick break. Back with more. Colin Flynn joins us.
[42:23] Speaker 1: 25 years since 9-11. He joins us from the US next.
[42:27] Speaker 1: Thanks for watching Thursday night. Thank you so much for
[42:33] Speaker 1: watching us here. Colin Flynn is the way that we
[42:35] Speaker 1: like to end our week each and every week. And,
[42:37] Speaker 1: of course, he is joining us from the United States where,
[42:40] Speaker 1: in the next couple of days, the marking of 9-11
[42:42] Speaker 1: and 25 years on. I started the show with this
[42:45] Speaker 1: whole thing of, obviously, history is a whole lot longer
[42:49] Speaker 1: than any of our lives, but if you've lived it,
[42:51] Speaker 1: you remember the sense of right and wrong, you remember...
[42:54] Speaker 1: the innocence that was broken in those particular moments. But
[42:58] Speaker 1: there's millions of people, millions, tens of millions of people
[43:00] Speaker 1: around the world who didn't live it. So that's why
[43:03] Speaker 1: I hope they pay attention to the stories in and
[43:06] Speaker 1: around the marking of the anniversary. And I hope that
[43:09] Speaker 1: they get the clarity that we all had 25 years ago.
[43:15] Speaker 4: Yeah, Paul, and it's tomorrow to the day, 25 years
[43:19] Speaker 4: since those incredibly dark and evil terrorist attacks. And Sometimes
[43:24] Speaker 4: I meet colleagues at work who are under the age
[43:26] Speaker 4: of 25 and they, you know, have no living memory
[43:30] Speaker 4: of the September 11th attacks, which is why you're right
[43:32] Speaker 4: in saying that it's so important. We make documentaries like this.
[43:35] Speaker 4: We report in these stories. And I brought you a
[43:37] Speaker 4: story last week from the fourth plane that crashed in Shanksville, Pennsylvania.
[43:42] Speaker 4: And today, Paul, I'm bringing you an inspiring story because
[43:45] Speaker 4: there were stories of hope and heroism and courage from
[43:48] Speaker 4: that day. So many of them from Americans. This is
[43:51] Speaker 4: from the North Tower of the World Trade Center. a
[43:54] Speaker 4: man called Paul Karras. He was working, Paul, on the
[43:57] Speaker 4: 71st floor of the North Tower. He was sitting at
[44:00] Speaker 4: his desk on September the 11th when the first plane hit.
[44:04] Speaker 4: And it hit just around 10 stories above him. Now,
[44:08] Speaker 4: I sat down and did a 40-minute interview with Paul,
[44:10] Speaker 4: who you can see on your screen now, and just
[44:12] Speaker 4: him retelling the events of that day was incredible.
[44:15] Speaker 1: But I want to play the first clip for you here.
[44:16] Speaker 4: This is him talking about the moment he was sitting
[44:19] Speaker 4: at his office desk on the 71st floor when the
[44:22] Speaker 4: first plane hit.
[44:23] Speaker 1: Hit just above him.
[44:24] Speaker 4: Here's what he said.
[44:30] Speaker 14: But the building tilted. And it tilted so far, for
[44:35] Speaker 14: a split second, you thought it was going to keep
[44:38] Speaker 14: going over. Really? And then it just started rocking back
[44:40] Speaker 14: and forth.
[44:41] Speaker 2: And did you feel that in your office, that rocking?
[44:43] Speaker 1: Oh yeah, oh yeah.
[44:44] Speaker 14: The lights didn't go out. Some books fell from the shelves.
[44:48] Speaker 14: But it was a significant tilt before it started rocking
[44:51] Speaker 14: back into place.
[44:52] Speaker 1: Your heart must have just.
[44:54] Speaker 14: Well, at that point, we started seeing the debris coming
[44:57] Speaker 14: down from above us. So there was a lot of
[44:59] Speaker 14: flames and debris just falling outside our window.
[45:05] Speaker 4: Here is where the moment of complete heroism came in
[45:08] Speaker 4: because Paul, like everyone else in the office, ran for
[45:10] Speaker 4: the stairwell. And he was just new in the job.
[45:13] Speaker 4: He didn't know many of his colleagues, but Paul, when
[45:14] Speaker 4: he went there, he stopped for a moment. And this
[45:16] Speaker 4: is where he had to make a split second on
[45:19] Speaker 4: what would be a life-changing decision because he saw a woman,
[45:22] Speaker 4: a colleague of his, again, didn't know her, and she
[45:24] Speaker 4: was extremely overweight, 300 pounds. She had health conditions. There
[45:28] Speaker 4: were people gathered around her. She was panicking because she
[45:31] Speaker 4: couldn't go down the stairs. And then he looked and
[45:34] Speaker 4: he said, Guys, go, I'll help her down. With her
[45:37] Speaker 4: clinging to his arm and another on the banister, they
[45:39] Speaker 4: made the slow journey down 71 stories, Paul. And inside
[45:45] Speaker 4: the stairwell, they didn't know what was going on outside.
[45:47] Speaker 4: They thought a small plane had hit. You and I
[45:49] Speaker 4: watching in Australia and Ireland on television, we had more information.
[45:53] Speaker 4: But when the second building, when it collapsed, then they
[45:57] Speaker 4: felt things getting much more urgent. Here's him talking about
[46:00] Speaker 4: that moment.
[46:06] Speaker 14: Partway down, she started praying out loud, Psalm 23, Lord
[46:10] Speaker 14: is my shepherd, I shall not want. And when she
[46:14] Speaker 14: started doing that, I said, hmm, maybe I better start
[46:16] Speaker 14: praying too. So I went praying to myself, but I was,
[46:23] Speaker 14: whatever I was saying to her, it was all focused
[46:25] Speaker 14: on keeping her calm. You know, the ceiling tiles were down,
[46:29] Speaker 14: the smell of jet fuel, which I didn't know what
[46:31] Speaker 14: it smelled like, it smells like kerosene, was really strong.
[46:35] Speaker 4: Strong.
[46:35] Speaker 1: Strong.
[46:37] Speaker 14: And we got to the next stairwell. Again, we're still
[46:40] Speaker 14: stopping twice the floor to let people past us. We
[46:44] Speaker 14: got to somewhere in the 20s. And it was just
[46:50] Speaker 14: almost felt like a hurricane force wind came blowing up
[46:54] Speaker 14: the stairs.
[46:55] Speaker 11: Oh, my God!
[46:56] Speaker 1: Oh, my.
[46:58] Speaker 5: God!
[47:00] Speaker 14: I just knew it was something bad and that we
[47:02] Speaker 14: needed to pick up the pace and get out of
[47:03] Speaker 14: there because they were getting less and less people. Another
[47:06] Speaker 14: thing most people don't understand is there was enough time
[47:10] Speaker 14: for most of the people below the impact to get
[47:12] Speaker 14: out of the building because we were one of the
[47:15] Speaker 14: last ones out. And I remember looking up and seeing
[47:19] Speaker 14: the top of the North Tower starting to come down.
[47:22] Speaker 14: How do we not get caught in that?
[47:26] Speaker 4: Such an incredible story, how they came minutes within death.
[47:30] Speaker 4: And the beautiful thing about this, Paul, to wrap up
[47:32] Speaker 4: this story is that he saved Judith's life, but he
[47:36] Speaker 4: would later go on to say that actually she saved
[47:38] Speaker 4: his life because it sent him on this journey. Oh,
[47:40] Speaker 4: there they are together. It started a long friendship, but
[47:44] Speaker 4: he was living a lifestyle that he wasn't proud of.
[47:46] Speaker 4: And she went on to describe him as an angel
[47:48] Speaker 4: and he thought, I'm no angel. So it sent him
[47:50] Speaker 4: on this journey where now he devotes his life to
[47:53] Speaker 4: helping others and to keeping the memory alive. of 9-11 alive.
[47:57] Speaker 1: Good man. Thank you, Colin. We'll see you again next week.
[48:00] Speaker 1: All the best to everyone who is marking it all.
[48:02] Speaker 1: About this time tomorrow night in the United States. Quick break.
[48:04] Speaker 1: Back with more here on Paul Murray Live. Before we
[48:11] Speaker 1: are gone, let us have a look at the social
[48:13] Speaker 1: media that has been happening while you were working. They,
[48:16] Speaker 1: of course, are not working hard. They're just making crap
[48:18] Speaker 1: videos like this one. This is a Labor MP called
[48:21] Speaker 1: Renee Coffey. Oh, and warning, it involves Raad.
[48:25] Speaker 12: I'm conscious it's been 18 months that our electorate office
[48:27] Speaker 12: has been.
[48:28] Speaker 8: Serving our community and we.
[48:29] Speaker 12: Haven't had an official opening, but that's because there was
[48:31] Speaker 12: just one person that I wanted to have do it.
[48:35] Speaker 14: Hi, folks.
[48:36] Speaker 1: I'm Kevin.
[48:37] Speaker 2: I'm still from Queensland and I'm here to help.
[48:42] Speaker 1: See you next week.

Shows are listed from Apple Podcasts' charts and directory, and Podcast Index where it is used. Every show and episode belongs to its publisher and plays from the publisher's own feed; this site hosts none of them.