# Paul Murray Live | 13 November

An episode of [Paul Murray Live](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/376966263), 13 Nov 2025, 49 min.

Audio: https://p.podderapp.com/2544644999/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/2fb3740d-3436-44af-8cc0-a91900716aa5/be3abd48-25e5-45a6-aede-ac2a00524a12/be43f5db-d000-4966-9c4c-b39400bc2f91/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=95971714-8fe6-4855-b1fe-ac2a00524a12

Anthony Albanese's desperation on display over his bid to secure a $2 billion climate circus, will dumping net zero save Sussan Ley? Plus, migration surge hits record high. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:00] Speaker 1: From the Skying Center. This is Paul Murray Live.
[0:06] Speaker 2: Good evening and welcome to the show. I'm Daniki di
[0:08] Speaker 2: Giorgio filling in this evening for the great man Paul
[0:11] Speaker 2: Murray Live here of course in the man Cave. Coming
[0:14] Speaker 2: up on tonight's program, Anthony Alberzi's desperation on display again
[0:19] Speaker 2: over his bid to secure a potentially two billion dollar
[0:23] Speaker 2: climate circus all on your dime, digging his heels in
[0:27] Speaker 2: as Turkey tries to win the Cop thirty one bid.
[0:30] Speaker 2: We'll dissect today's decision by the Liberals to ditch Net
[0:33] Speaker 2: zero and more with my panel. Ross Cadell and Darren
[0:36] Speaker 2: Barnett are coming up soon and we'll learn about the
[0:40] Speaker 2: world's coolest of farmer over in Ireland with our great
[0:44] Speaker 2: mate Colin Flynn.
[0:45] Speaker 3: You won't want to miss that. Now.
[0:47] Speaker 2: We'll get to the liberals decision to scrap Net zero
[0:50] Speaker 2: in a moment. But first tonight, if you're an ac
[0:53] Speaker 2: DC fan, and look, I do know they're touring the
[0:55] Speaker 2: country at the moment, I've got to show you this
[0:58] Speaker 2: epic world record which has.
[1:00] Speaker 3: Been smashed in Melbourne.
[1:03] Speaker 2: Hundreds of bagpipers have made history in Federation Square, breaking
[1:07] Speaker 2: the world record for the largest ever bagpipe ensemble. Would
[1:12] Speaker 2: you believe three hundred and seventy four of them gathered
[1:15] Speaker 2: last night to play acdc's It's a Long Way to
[1:19] Speaker 2: the Top.
[1:19] Speaker 3: If you want a rock and roll have a look
[1:21] Speaker 3: at this.
[1:35] Speaker 2: How cal is that? A sea of tartan a bit
[1:37] Speaker 2: of rock and roll? And look they shattered the previous
[1:40] Speaker 2: world record of three hundred and thirty three bagpipers back
[1:44] Speaker 2: in twenty twelve, and that happened in Bulgaria.
[1:47] Speaker 3: Now, this came.
[1:48] Speaker 2: Almost fifty years after ACDC filmed the film clip for
[1:52] Speaker 2: that song right around the corner in nearby Swanson Street
[1:56] Speaker 2: in Melbourne's CBD.
[2:09] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[2:09] Speaker 2: Look, I'm sure if you are heading to ACDC this weekend,
[2:12] Speaker 2: you're going to be in for quite a big treat
[2:14] Speaker 2: at that concert. All right, let's get into the big
[2:22] Speaker 2: story of the day. There are two two word slogans
[2:26] Speaker 2: that you're about to hear a lot from the Liberal
[2:29] Speaker 2: Party between now and the next election.
[2:33] Speaker 4: Affordable energy, reducing emissions, affordable energy reducing emissions. Affordable energy
[2:38] Speaker 4: reducing emissions, affordable energy reducing emissions, afordable energy.
[2:42] Speaker 2: Yeah, and look, it's taken the Liberal Party six months
[2:47] Speaker 2: six months to tell us that six months since this
[2:51] Speaker 2: year's election drubbing followed by discussions, followed by consultations, followed
[2:57] Speaker 2: by more consultations.
[2:58] Speaker 3: Followed by hours on hours of meeting. But look, this
[3:02] Speaker 3: is good news.
[3:04] Speaker 2: The party is finally scrapping net zero twenty fifty and
[3:08] Speaker 2: now we have confirmation that the Liberal Party want affordable
[3:11] Speaker 2: energy through lower emissions. Now they will remain committed to
[3:15] Speaker 2: the Paris Agreement, but will scrap Labour's twenty thirty and
[3:19] Speaker 2: twenty fifty targets. It's been a long six months to
[3:23] Speaker 2: get here, to get to too simple two words slogans,
[3:27] Speaker 2: but look better late than never. Now, if we break
[3:31] Speaker 2: today's announcement down in essence, I think that the Liberal
[3:36] Speaker 2: Party has opted for a middle ground, per se. I
[3:40] Speaker 2: mean they aren't climate zelots. You know that they're dropping
[3:43] Speaker 2: net zero twenty fifty. That's the big announcement. But on
[3:47] Speaker 2: the other hand, they aren't climate deniers either, because they
[3:50] Speaker 2: are sticking to the Paris Agreement. Now, as I said,
[3:54] Speaker 2: scrapping net zero is welcome news. This is the starting gun.
[3:58] Speaker 2: It's finally being five on energy policy and a national
[4:02] Speaker 2: energy debate that I know that you at home are
[4:05] Speaker 2: desperately wanting this is what we need.
[4:08] Speaker 3: But my question now is is.
[4:12] Speaker 2: There a climate armageddon or is there not a climate armageddon?
[4:17] Speaker 2: And we haven't quite heard the answer from Susan Lee
[4:21] Speaker 2: because even in the Liberal Parties document on its official
[4:25] Speaker 2: position today, it says that net zero would be a
[4:28] Speaker 2: welcome outcome.
[4:30] Speaker 3: Have a listened to the leader today? Is it the
[4:33] Speaker 3: coalition's aspiration to reach net zero?
[4:38] Speaker 4: Well, while it's not our policy, as you correctly say,
[4:41] Speaker 4: it is set long term targets. Net zero would be
[4:44] Speaker 4: welcome if we can get there with technology, with choice
[4:48] Speaker 4: and with voluntary markets, make no mistake, we are not
[4:52] Speaker 4: pursuing net zero.
[4:53] Speaker 3: We are pursuing.
[4:54] Speaker 4: Energy affordability and emissions reduction.
[4:57] Speaker 3: And Susan Lee then went on to say this about
[5:00] Speaker 3: the Paris Agreement.
[5:01] Speaker 4: Paris is about a global agreement to bring down temperatures
[5:06] Speaker 4: and reduce emissions. That's exactly what we propose to do,
[5:10] Speaker 4: and we will look Australians in the eye and say
[5:13] Speaker 4: this is a plan to bring down emissions and to
[5:16] Speaker 4: provide affordable energy for you.
[5:19] Speaker 2: So again I asked the question, are we in a
[5:22] Speaker 2: climate emergency or not? The Liberal Party is scrapping net
[5:26] Speaker 2: zero twenty fifty, but is staying in Paris. The United
[5:30] Speaker 2: Nations says the world has to get to net zero
[5:33] Speaker 2: and to stay in the Paris Agreement. It's Secretary General
[5:36] Speaker 2: Antonio Guterrez told the COP thirty Climate Summit in Brazil
[5:40] Speaker 2: this week that every year of the world getting warmer
[5:44] Speaker 2: marks a quote red line for humanity, and he called
[5:48] Speaker 2: for rapid emissions cuts. Now, this position announced today backs
[5:53] Speaker 2: emissions cuts. So is it our reality that this is
[5:58] Speaker 2: indeed the red line for you, vanity? Because if that's
[6:02] Speaker 2: the case, why would the Liberal Party say no to
[6:05] Speaker 2: net zero then?
[6:06] Speaker 3: And if this is not our.
[6:07] Speaker 2: Reality, why is the Liberal Party still committed to reducing
[6:12] Speaker 2: emissions and staying in Paris? And as I said, this
[6:16] Speaker 2: to me is a middle road. And I can't help
[6:19] Speaker 2: but think that today's decision is based on politics and
[6:22] Speaker 2: to perhaps not upset the moderates within the party and
[6:26] Speaker 2: to put a bubble around the label of being called
[6:29] Speaker 2: climate deniers.
[6:30] Speaker 3: To sell this as a package.
[6:32] Speaker 2: Deal to the till seats, for example, because the Paris
[6:36] Speaker 2: Agreement requires emissions reductions as well as targets to back
[6:40] Speaker 2: it in and progress on those targets. Is this planned
[6:44] Speaker 2: by the Liberals now not falling out of favor with
[6:47] Speaker 2: what Paris stands for? So why are we in it?
[6:51] Speaker 2: Which one is it? The Shadow Energy Minister Dantean couldn't say.
[6:57] Speaker 5: When it comes to our nationally determined contributions, we will
[7:00] Speaker 5: set those out in those nationally determined contributions from government,
[7:05] Speaker 5: but we will go with a mandate for the Australian
[7:09] Speaker 5: people and that is how we will set our.
[7:11] Speaker 2: National determined To the next question, I mean scrapping that
[7:15] Speaker 2: zero surely means leaving Paris.
[7:16] Speaker 3: How can you have both?
[7:18] Speaker 2: And this is where I think that this policy could
[7:20] Speaker 2: possibly get muddled.
[7:22] Speaker 3: But look, I will say though overall, this is.
[7:25] Speaker 2: Finally a policy position from the Liberals and it is
[7:29] Speaker 2: obviously a good one. Net zero twenty fifty is gone.
[7:32] Speaker 2: It should have happened years ago. It really does take
[7:35] Speaker 2: us off this ridiculous renewables only magic carpet ride via
[7:40] Speaker 2: Labour's experiment of transmission lines, giant wind turbines, green hydrogen,
[7:45] Speaker 2: solar farms and batteries. Basically, no one in the country
[7:50] Speaker 2: has said that we can achieve our targets as they are.
[7:54] Speaker 2: You were told that your bills would go down. Your
[7:57] Speaker 2: bills have gone up. They've got in the opposite direction.
[7:59] Speaker 2: And you see it every single time, every quarter, every
[8:03] Speaker 2: time you.
[8:04] Speaker 3: Open your power bills.
[8:05] Speaker 2: And so look, this hard sell for the Liberal Party
[8:08] Speaker 2: begins today and every day between now and the next
[8:12] Speaker 2: election because the left, Wow, they are already having a
[8:19] Speaker 2: meltdown over this. Have a listen to the Prime minister's
[8:23] Speaker 2: utter fallacies.
[8:24] Speaker 3: Today.
[8:26] Speaker 6: Good policy is moving towards the cheapest form of new energy.
[8:32] Speaker 6: Good policy is delivering investment certainty for business. Good policy
[8:37] Speaker 6: is making sure that we deliver on jobs and economic growth.
[8:41] Speaker 6: It's not it's not going backwards. What we know is
[8:46] Speaker 6: that the pace of change in society is fast. If
[8:50] Speaker 6: you stand still, the world moves past you. If you
[8:53] Speaker 6: actually go backwards, which is what they're suggesting, bear in
[8:57] Speaker 6: mind net zero by twenty five fifty is a policy
[9:01] Speaker 6: that was put in place as a government by Scott Morrison.
[9:06] Speaker 6: The idea that the lesson that the Liberals have learnt
[9:10] Speaker 6: from their defeat at the last two elections and the
[9:13] Speaker 6: last election where they had their worst result since nineteen
[9:18] Speaker 6: forty three, is that they need to be more right wing,
[9:22] Speaker 6: more skeptical, more in denial about climate change and continue
[9:27] Speaker 6: to engage in those climate wars. Australia needs to move on.
[9:32] Speaker 6: I think Australians want Australia to move forward.
[9:36] Speaker 2: I mean really really so, our Prime Minister, why have
[9:43] Speaker 2: our bills not gone down?
[9:44] Speaker 7: Then?
[9:45] Speaker 3: Why are our power.
[9:46] Speaker 2: Bills going up? When are they going to get cheaper?
[9:50] Speaker 2: Prime Minister? I mean it is the textbook definition of insanity,
[9:54] Speaker 2: isn't it. You know, when you do the same thing
[9:56] Speaker 2: over and over again and expect a different outcome.
[9:59] Speaker 3: Insanity. And it's clear that.
[10:02] Speaker 2: This position that the Liberals have taken is worrying Labor,
[10:05] Speaker 2: and of course it has because it puts energy policy
[10:09] Speaker 2: back front and center again and the stats they don't
[10:13] Speaker 2: stack up for Labor. Our bills have gone up by
[10:15] Speaker 2: one thousand dollars. Labor told us about how confident that
[10:20] Speaker 2: they were that we would reach our emissions reduction targets.
[10:23] Speaker 2: Yet we've been warned time and time again by many
[10:26] Speaker 2: experts that we will not reach our emissions reduction targets.
[10:31] Speaker 3: The situation is so bad.
[10:33] Speaker 2: Ross Garno, a longtime advisor to the Labor government and
[10:36] Speaker 2: a backer of renewable energy, said quote Australia is currently
[10:40] Speaker 2: on a trajectory to miss its renewable targets because of
[10:43] Speaker 2: low investment and output in grid scale solar and wind,
[10:48] Speaker 2: not by a little but by a big margin. Yet
[10:52] Speaker 2: labor is drummed up a sixty two to seventy percent
[10:57] Speaker 2: by twenty thirty five target without absolutely no clue what
[11:02] Speaker 2: it means for your power bills and how much it
[11:05] Speaker 2: will cost you.
[11:07] Speaker 8: What will the total cost of net zero be by
[11:09] Speaker 8: twenty fifty, Prime Minister.
[11:10] Speaker 6: Well, it depends what figures you look for.
[11:13] Speaker 4: What will be the total cost of net zero by twenty.
[11:15] Speaker 9: Fifty in terms of the budget, that's seventy more than
[11:19] Speaker 9: seventy five billion dollars that we've outlined. The total cost
[11:22] Speaker 9: of not achieving net zero, as is outline in the
[11:24] Speaker 9: National Risk Assessment, is many times.
[11:26] Speaker 8: More than that.
[11:27] Speaker 9: We've got a bit annoyse coming in. I think that's
[11:28] Speaker 9: a good rap.
[11:29] Speaker 2: Thanks guys, now, Buffy, guys, Bye bye. Bowen doesn't want
[11:33] Speaker 2: to answer. Bowen wants nothing to do with the titles
[11:36] Speaker 2: because he doesn't know. And speaking of the left, have
[11:40] Speaker 2: listened to the Greens today.
[11:42] Speaker 3: They look like a bunch of nutters.
[11:45] Speaker 10: They are not a party that is a serious party
[11:48] Speaker 10: of government.
[11:49] Speaker 3: That's what they've shown today.
[11:51] Speaker 10: And for all the words and the attempt at spin
[11:58] Speaker 10: that you can drive a truck through that, you can
[12:01] Speaker 10: see that a primary school child could pick. Susan lay
[12:08] Speaker 10: is on notice clearly within her own party, no leadership,
[12:12] Speaker 10: no authority, and no climate sense.
[12:17] Speaker 2: And from the Greens to the Guardian and have a
[12:19] Speaker 2: look at this they've gone with the Liberal Party's betrayal
[12:22] Speaker 2: of younger voters on net zero isn't just a moral failure,
[12:26] Speaker 2: it's electoral stupidity. It goes on to say, ditching net
[12:30] Speaker 2: zero doesn't just fail the moral test, it fails the
[12:34] Speaker 2: mats and for a coalition that should be desperate to
[12:37] Speaker 2: prove it can govern again, that's a curious kind of strategy.
[12:43] Speaker 3: Well, hate to tell the Guardian.
[12:46] Speaker 2: According to this week's Resolve poll, almost one in three
[12:49] Speaker 2: Aussies want Labor to dump net zero, only a quarter
[12:53] Speaker 2: wanted to stay, and thirty one percent of eighteen to
[12:57] Speaker 2: thirty five year olds say keep it, but only as
[13:01] Speaker 2: an aspiration, not as a binding law. Attitudes are changing,
[13:09] Speaker 2: and look the coalition is now at.
[13:11] Speaker 3: The precipice of this.
[13:13] Speaker 2: Voters have a clear distinction finally, and I just hope
[13:17] Speaker 2: the Coalition doesn't stop here on policy. Getting rid of
[13:21] Speaker 2: net zero twenty fifty is just the start, and if
[13:25] Speaker 2: it wants to be a genuine alternative, get the policy
[13:28] Speaker 2: platforms moving now. Migration surely has to be next. Now
[13:38] Speaker 2: to the Prime Minister's obsession with hosting COP thirty one,
[13:42] Speaker 2: you know, the climate summit that is now set to
[13:44] Speaker 2: cost us upwards of two billion dollars. He seems truly
[13:50] Speaker 2: obsessed with this idea, this thought bubble, of having it
[13:54] Speaker 2: here in Australia.
[13:55] Speaker 3: I mean that is the only way to describe it.
[13:58] Speaker 2: Never mind the cost of living crisis or the energy crisis.
[14:02] Speaker 2: Apparently COP thirty one is where it is at for
[14:05] Speaker 2: this Prime minister. And now Anthony ALBINIZI is entangled in
[14:10] Speaker 2: some sort of bizarre standoff of sorts with Turkey for
[14:15] Speaker 2: the rights to host the event.
[14:17] Speaker 6: President Erduwan has written to me in the last twenty
[14:23] Speaker 6: four hours. He is maintaining his position in response to
[14:28] Speaker 6: Australia maintaining our position.
[14:31] Speaker 2: Oh no, not a letter from Turkey, God forbid. I
[14:36] Speaker 2: mean we're now receiving official correspondence urging us to back down.
[14:41] Speaker 2: I mean this is really getting serious now it's taken
[14:44] Speaker 2: a very serious tone. Who's going to draw their guns
[14:48] Speaker 2: first to end this standoff? And look, if it wasn't
[15:04] Speaker 2: so serious, you'd actually laugh. And why is the Prime
[15:08] Speaker 2: Minister so intent on having it here?
[15:11] Speaker 3: You ask?
[15:12] Speaker 6: There have been cops held in Azerbaijan, in the UAE
[15:18] Speaker 6: and in Egypt, so in that part of the world,
[15:21] Speaker 6: but never won in this part of the world.
[15:25] Speaker 2: Yes, that makes sense. It's like a spoilt child. Azerbaijan
[15:29] Speaker 2: has had it, the UAE has had.
[15:31] Speaker 3: It, Egypt has had it. It's just not fair. What
[15:34] Speaker 3: about us? And for the PM's final attempt at rationale.
[15:40] Speaker 6: Our neighbors as well as Australia think it is time
[15:43] Speaker 6: that it was held in this region our goods.
[15:47] Speaker 3: Well that settles it, then, doesn't it.
[15:48] Speaker 2: Apparently Australia you at home, Apparently we all think it's time.
[15:53] Speaker 2: It's time, according to the Prime Minister. And look for
[15:56] Speaker 2: the incredibly cheap price of two billion dollars, we'd get
[16:00] Speaker 2: the privilege of hosting thousands of private jetting climate crusaders
[16:05] Speaker 2: and well, g I wonder what they're going to warn
[16:08] Speaker 2: us about. I don't know, private jets perhaps. I mean,
[16:13] Speaker 2: just have a look at this year's COP thirty in Brazil,
[16:16] Speaker 2: Prince William and the UK Prime Minister Kiir Starmer car
[16:19] Speaker 2: pulled in a way. The Prince arrived on the leader's
[16:23] Speaker 2: plane this week. Kind of cute, isn't it, rocking up
[16:27] Speaker 2: to a climate event on the government jet. But of
[16:29] Speaker 2: course they came together in the carpool lane so they
[16:33] Speaker 2: can claim that they were environmentally friendly. And then there's
[16:38] Speaker 2: California's own Ken Dole, also known as the Governor, Gavin Newsom,
[16:43] Speaker 2: who took a round trip private jet flight there and
[16:46] Speaker 2: back more than eight thousand kilometers away from his Sacramento mansion,
[16:51] Speaker 2: and the dire message that he just desperately had to
[16:56] Speaker 2: deliver in person to jet down in his carbon emissions
[16:59] Speaker 2: jet was to warn that Trump is a bad man.
[17:04] Speaker 11: I've been here in the absence of leadership from Donald Trump,
[17:06] Speaker 11: who's an advocated responsibility on a critical issue.
[17:10] Speaker 8: I'm here to show up on behalf of my country.
[17:14] Speaker 11: I'm here to showcase California's leadership dominance in the low
[17:18] Speaker 11: carbon green ghost space.
[17:19] Speaker 3: I'm here because I think it's more than electric power.
[17:22] Speaker 1: It's about economic power.
[17:24] Speaker 11: And I'm not going to see America's economic leadership to China.
[17:28] Speaker 2: Now, he couldn't have delivered that via video message. Of course,
[17:32] Speaker 2: the climate crusader, with his perfectly manicured hair, had to
[17:35] Speaker 2: jet down carbon emissions in tow to deliver his carbon
[17:39] Speaker 2: emissions warning.
[17:41] Speaker 3: And not to mention, the Amazon actually had to.
[17:43] Speaker 2: Be carved up quite literally, kilometer upon kilometer of the
[17:47] Speaker 2: rainforest to pay the highway, because God forbid, the global
[17:51] Speaker 2: elites would be doomed if they had to sit in traffic.
[17:56] Speaker 2: So is this what we can look forward to here
[17:58] Speaker 2: in Australia next year? Should albo b successful in his
[18:02] Speaker 2: obsessive mission and in his stand off with Turkey.
[18:07] Speaker 3: But don't worry, it's not a waste.
[18:09] Speaker 2: What's two billion dollars for the elites to pat each
[18:12] Speaker 2: other on the back and make themselves feel better about themselves.
[18:17] Speaker 2: And at the same time we get to play host
[18:19] Speaker 2: to a party we can't actually afford for a problem we.
[18:24] Speaker 3: Can't even solve.
[18:29] Speaker 2: Well, Donald Trump is showing the world once again why
[18:32] Speaker 2: he is the funniest president the White House has ever seen.
[18:36] Speaker 2: Here he was spritzing Syria's President Ahmed al Sharha.
[18:41] Speaker 3: With Trump Cologne when he.
[18:43] Speaker 2: Asks him the quiet part out loud about his marital status.
[18:52] Speaker 12: Yeah, it's the best fragrant thank you, I have more here, sir,
[19:02] Speaker 12: thank okay. So what we'll do is just take that
[19:06] Speaker 12: Joe put it in, and then the other one.
[19:09] Speaker 8: Is you went.
[19:13] Speaker 2: As I never know, right, Yeah, only the president would
[19:16] Speaker 2: get away with asking a Muslim president how many wives
[19:19] Speaker 2: he's got. And have a look at the Vice President
[19:21] Speaker 2: jd Vance, who also thought this was hilarious.
[19:25] Speaker 3: He's like, well, how many wives do you have? And
[19:32] Speaker 3: it's just like, oh, what an amazing question, amazing comedic timing.
[19:38] Speaker 3: There are layers to it, there's like a meta humor
[19:40] Speaker 3: to it.
[19:41] Speaker 2: Just anyway, Well, look, the cologne has worked a charm before,
[19:45] Speaker 2: and perhaps the Syrian leader may fall for the sense
[19:49] Speaker 2: like someone else did. You might recall it worked for
[19:53] Speaker 2: Jill Biden, for doctor Jill. There she is, I mean
[19:58] Speaker 2: it is after all, the enemies can't resist, according to Trump.
[20:03] Speaker 2: Here she wasn't a Trump made ad back in December
[20:06] Speaker 2: last year, looking all lovey dovey into the President's eyes.
[20:10] Speaker 3: You've got to feel a bit sorry for her.
[20:11] Speaker 2: She probably hasn't been able to look into her own
[20:14] Speaker 2: husband's eyes Joe Biden because well he's always asleep, and
[20:20] Speaker 2: maybe it shouldn't have been all laughs with the Syrian
[20:23] Speaker 2: president at the White House. He's a former al Qaeda
[20:25] Speaker 2: commander and was until recently sanctioned by Washington as a
[20:29] Speaker 2: specially designated global terrorists. But g you can't say Trump
[20:35] Speaker 2: doesn't at least.
[20:37] Speaker 3: Have a sense of humor. You're going to give it
[20:40] Speaker 3: to him. Well, stay with us, and coming up after the.
[20:43] Speaker 2: Break, we'll dissect the liberals decision to scrap net zero
[20:46] Speaker 2: and more. Ross Caddell and Darren Barnett are coming up.
[20:49] Speaker 2: Stay tuned, Welcome back to the program. Well, as I
[20:56] Speaker 2: mentioned earlier, the Liberals are finally dumped net zero by
[20:59] Speaker 2: twenty Here we're the leaders today.
[21:03] Speaker 4: We're not pursuing net zero. We are pursuing energy affordability
[21:07] Speaker 4: and emissions reduction.
[21:08] Speaker 5: We'll go with a mandate for the Australian people and
[21:11] Speaker 5: that is how we will set our national.
[21:13] Speaker 4: Determine the next question.
[21:15] Speaker 2: So it looks like the coalition is indeed intact for now.
[21:19] Speaker 2: National's leader David Little Proud applauded the decision.
[21:21] Speaker 3: Here's what he said.
[21:23] Speaker 11: The Liberal Party has shown great maturity and leadership to
[21:28] Speaker 11: the extent of where the National Party put forward a cheaper,
[21:31] Speaker 11: better fare plan that doesn't walk away from actually addressing
[21:37] Speaker 11: climate change.
[21:38] Speaker 2: But you know, is this now enough to salvage Susan
[21:41] Speaker 2: Lee's leadership. Is she the one to take this policy
[21:44] Speaker 2: to the public between now and an election right now?
[21:47] Speaker 3: I'm not so sure.
[21:49] Speaker 2: I do think she did well today at that press
[21:50] Speaker 2: conference she battled against ridiculous and bias questions from journalists.
[21:56] Speaker 2: But the fight really does start now. Joining me to
[21:58] Speaker 2: discuss this and more is National Senate out Ross Cadell
[22:01] Speaker 2: and Format Labor advisor Darren Barnett.
[22:03] Speaker 3: Hiight to both of you. Thanks so much for joining
[22:05] Speaker 3: me on the show tonight. Ross will start with you.
[22:07] Speaker 2: You must be pleased the Liberals came to this decision today.
[22:13] Speaker 7: Oh absolutely. The last thing we want is more division
[22:16] Speaker 7: this going on. I think it's a good decision. I
[22:18] Speaker 7: think they've gone out and said where they are. We
[22:20] Speaker 7: can certainly get a bit of nuance going forward as
[22:22] Speaker 7: we come together and talk about our policies and go
[22:25] Speaker 7: for it. But what it means is now we can
[22:27] Speaker 7: prosecute the argument that this is a ridiculous execution of
[22:31] Speaker 7: policy by the government. If I'd come to you three
[22:34] Speaker 7: and a half years ago and come to the Australian
[22:36] Speaker 7: people and said, got this great plan. I'm going to
[22:38] Speaker 7: charge your thirty billion dollars, I'm going to raise your
[22:40] Speaker 7: energy bills by one thousand dollars, and we're going to
[22:42] Speaker 7: achieve no emission reductions, which is essentially what they've done.
[22:45] Speaker 7: No matter what you called. You think I was an idiot, Well,
[22:48] Speaker 7: why are we going to back that? Because that's exactly
[22:50] Speaker 7: what happened, and now we can start prosecuting the filure
[22:53] Speaker 7: of this government.
[22:54] Speaker 2: Well, look, the cell starts now and it's an everyday
[22:57] Speaker 2: cell between now and the next election.
[23:00] Speaker 3: So Darren, let's just talk about this. But first before
[23:02] Speaker 3: we go into the cell.
[23:03] Speaker 2: So the scrapping net zero, but they're staying in the
[23:06] Speaker 2: Powis agreement.
[23:08] Speaker 3: How much do you think that this is political to.
[23:10] Speaker 2: Try and maybe appease the moderates within the party, appease
[23:13] Speaker 2: the till seats.
[23:14] Speaker 3: Do you think it will have even any scrap of difference.
[23:17] Speaker 1: I don't think it will have a huge electoral difference
[23:19] Speaker 1: right now. It might in the future if there's a
[23:21] Speaker 1: fig leaf required to change direction again on policy, and
[23:25] Speaker 1: you can change direction, you're allowed to go. You can
[23:28] Speaker 1: take a GST to an election or not. You can
[23:31] Speaker 1: change your position. You can do and so who's to
[23:34] Speaker 1: say in three or six years time the position from
[23:37] Speaker 1: the Coalition on climate change might change and they might
[23:40] Speaker 1: need the Paris Agreement to legitimize that. That's okay. What
[23:44] Speaker 1: happened today is okay, But there's a few things the
[23:47] Speaker 1: teals they would be delighted. So those seats are now
[23:51] Speaker 1: gone for the foreseeable future.
[23:53] Speaker 2: So you don't think there's any way that the Liberals
[23:54] Speaker 2: could turn this over to sell it out to the public.
[23:57] Speaker 1: Not if not there I think there are areas where
[23:59] Speaker 1: they can sell it. And Ross is in the Hunter.
[24:01] Speaker 1: I think those seats the lower House seats in the Hunter,
[24:04] Speaker 1: the Hillawarra sort of gippslanded Regional Victoria is mainly held
[24:09] Speaker 1: by the Coalition. Anyway, there's a few seats in rural
[24:13] Speaker 1: and regional tazzy Wa is up for grabs. So look
[24:17] Speaker 1: in one or two, probably two elections time. It'll be
[24:21] Speaker 1: interesting because we'll see what's happened with power prices, We'll
[24:24] Speaker 1: see what's happened with the rollout of renewables and technology
[24:28] Speaker 1: I think look to use a sort of Sir Humphrey
[24:31] Speaker 1: Afflell be it's a brave decision, but I'm not sure.
[24:34] Speaker 1: I don't think it's crazy brave. I think in two
[24:36] Speaker 1: elections time things will be recast and that will be
[24:41] Speaker 1: they've now got a point of differentiation. But it's also
[24:45] Speaker 1: true that look, John Howard put in the red, Tony
[24:48] Speaker 1: Abbott kept the CFC and Arena, Scott Morrison adopted Paris
[24:54] Speaker 1: and net zero. They're not progressive lefties. So this is
[24:59] Speaker 1: a signal magnificant shift for the coalition and that's right.
[25:03] Speaker 1: They need to sell it well.
[25:05] Speaker 2: And look, I think it is a good shift in policy,
[25:07] Speaker 2: and I think you raise a good point. Now there
[25:09] Speaker 2: is a differentiation, whereas I don't think before that there
[25:12] Speaker 2: was a differentiation between what Labour stands for versus what
[25:16] Speaker 2: the Liberals stand for. Let's talk about leadership though Ross
[25:20] Speaker 2: look Susan Lee. This was her first crack at it today,
[25:22] Speaker 2: coming up with policy and trying to pitch it to
[25:25] Speaker 2: the Australian public. Long time between now and the next election.
[25:29] Speaker 2: But do you think that she is indeed the opposition
[25:32] Speaker 2: leader that is going to take this policy and sell
[25:34] Speaker 2: it between now and the election.
[25:38] Speaker 7: Absolutely it has to be. Susan's had no clear air
[25:42] Speaker 7: from when she got there, between people dropping out, things
[25:44] Speaker 7: blowing up, you know, everything in the world. We now
[25:47] Speaker 7: have a policy to get down of this and we'll
[25:48] Speaker 7: be judged. You know, I'm a shadow ministry if I
[25:51] Speaker 7: don't get out there and flog this and do what
[25:53] Speaker 7: we've got to tell the story, tell the young people
[25:55] Speaker 7: that if they want their Netflix, if they want their
[25:57] Speaker 7: data centers, if they want their AI have reliable power
[26:02] Speaker 7: to power these things. If we aren't out there selling it,
[26:04] Speaker 7: we all can suffer the knife. You know, I accept
[26:07] Speaker 7: that as much as anything. But we have that differentiation
[26:10] Speaker 7: and it is hard work. You can't just you know,
[26:12] Speaker 7: we walked away I think from selling our nuclear policy,
[26:15] Speaker 7: which was quite good last time, and look at the results.
[26:18] Speaker 7: It wasn't supported. I think it was the second most
[26:20] Speaker 7: hated thing in the election with six hundred billion dollars,
[26:23] Speaker 7: which was a lie. We've gone out, We've taken this stand.
[26:26] Speaker 7: We have to get out there and sell it, sell
[26:28] Speaker 7: the benefits and they can talk about affordable energy and
[26:31] Speaker 7: lowering emissions. I will talk about cheaper, better and fairer
[26:34] Speaker 7: energy policy. But if we don't get out there and
[26:37] Speaker 7: flog it and point to the failure. This isn't about
[26:40] Speaker 7: me and Susan It isn't about David Little Proud. This
[26:43] Speaker 7: is about Chris Bowen and Anthony ALBERSI running a policy
[26:46] Speaker 7: that is failing but continually selling like it's it's improving
[26:50] Speaker 7: a lot. No emissions reductioned in three and a half years,
[26:53] Speaker 7: thousands of dollars more. We have to do it better.
[26:56] Speaker 2: Yeah, And I mean, look, it'll be good for the
[26:58] Speaker 2: coalition to stop talking about themselves and actually talking about
[27:01] Speaker 2: policy for the first time and actually holding labor to account.
[27:05] Speaker 1: As you see them done. Though, when I'm not saying
[27:08] Speaker 1: this won't be a change, this might be the change required.
[27:11] Speaker 1: But what do they say? Politics is about perception and
[27:14] Speaker 1: momentum and Susan Lee. People don't automatically think she's going
[27:19] Speaker 1: to make it to the next election.
[27:20] Speaker 3: Do you think she will?
[27:21] Speaker 1: No? I don't, And I don't think it's about Susan Lee.
[27:23] Speaker 1: I think whoever leads after three terms of government, Brenda Nelson,
[27:28] Speaker 1: hit Defense, Mark Speakman might not make it to the
[27:30] Speaker 1: next election. I don't think it's about Susan Lee. I
[27:33] Speaker 1: think whoever gets that poison choalice straight after you. Actually
[27:37] Speaker 1: this is a bit different because Labour's behaving like a
[27:39] Speaker 1: first term government. But I just don't see how she
[27:43] Speaker 1: lasts because you can't. It's really hard to keep the
[27:45] Speaker 1: show together when you're in opposition. You can't promise people things,
[27:49] Speaker 1: you can't give favors, you can't I think the internal fractions.
[27:54] Speaker 1: It's still I don't think she makes it and it's
[27:57] Speaker 1: not her fault, well his fault is it just they
[28:01] Speaker 1: don't have power and without power, how do you get
[28:03] Speaker 1: people to behave I.
[28:04] Speaker 2: Think you've got to be a strong leader, though I
[28:06] Speaker 2: think a lot of leadership does. I think this comes
[28:08] Speaker 2: down to a lot of leadership, brave decisions and being
[28:10] Speaker 2: strong enough to sell it to the public.
[28:12] Speaker 1: Look, well today it was brave so much.
[28:14] Speaker 2: Look it was and I'm happy to give it the
[28:16] Speaker 2: benefit of the doubt on this. And look there is
[28:18] Speaker 2: another issue, and I think that the Coalition is on
[28:20] Speaker 2: a roll now.
[28:21] Speaker 3: And I said this earlier.
[28:22] Speaker 2: They've dealt with net zero, but now I think it's
[28:24] Speaker 2: time to look at migration because big Australia is getting
[28:27] Speaker 2: even bigger. Australia has officially reached the highest net migration.
[28:31] Speaker 3: Of arrivals ever. A total of.
[28:33] Speaker 2: Four hundred and sixty eight thousand, three hundred and ninety
[28:36] Speaker 2: net permanent and long term arrivals were recorded in the
[28:39] Speaker 2: twelve months to September. That's the highest twelve month total
[28:42] Speaker 2: on record, four percent above twenty twenty four ross. I've
[28:47] Speaker 2: said this before, this issue of migration was not prosecuted
[28:51] Speaker 2: enough at the last two elections. I know the Coalition tried,
[28:54] Speaker 2: but it wasn't enough. And there's always this fear of
[28:56] Speaker 2: the R word racism. Oh no, we can't discuss it
[28:58] Speaker 2: because we're going to be at outed as a racist.
[29:01] Speaker 2: But do you think that the Coalition now needs to
[29:03] Speaker 2: look at this because there is no doubt it has
[29:06] Speaker 2: exacerbated the housing crisis and the cost of living crisis
[29:09] Speaker 2: as well.
[29:12] Speaker 7: Yeah, there's no question. And we're out there and Paul
[29:14] Speaker 7: Scara'll be doing this and we're looking at it every day.
[29:16] Speaker 7: But I'm out in Shepherd and I've been out around
[29:18] Speaker 7: farms and I've seen the number of visa workers required
[29:21] Speaker 7: on our farms to keep our people fed, the people
[29:24] Speaker 7: who were picking apricots to day, the people who were
[29:26] Speaker 7: working in there. There was a Zimbabwean group that came out.
[29:30] Speaker 7: They've got an African working there. We need the people
[29:32] Speaker 7: coming to Australia that help make Australia a better country.
[29:35] Speaker 7: We don't want the free layers, we don't want the
[29:37] Speaker 7: guys coming for a free ride, but we do need
[29:40] Speaker 7: the people that can come here and keep these Australian
[29:43] Speaker 7: standard of life going. So we really need to look
[29:45] Speaker 7: at that mix is what is the mix, what is
[29:48] Speaker 7: the number? What is the skills that keeps Australia going better.
[29:52] Speaker 7: I go to a Matees factory floor in the Hunter Value.
[29:54] Speaker 7: He builds Trustes and he's had to build ten homes
[29:57] Speaker 7: to bring the visa workers here. Of course, Australians don't
[29:59] Speaker 7: want to do the work that's required in these office.
[30:01] Speaker 7: So yes we need migration, but yes they have to
[30:04] Speaker 7: be the ones contributing. And we all joke about the
[30:06] Speaker 7: dog groomers or the taekwondo instructors or whatever is on
[30:09] Speaker 7: the skilled migration list now, but you have to have
[30:12] Speaker 7: that level where they're contributing and not pulling away from
[30:15] Speaker 7: the standard of life. They're actually enhancing Australia's standard of life.
[30:18] Speaker 7: And there is a level that is and Scari and
[30:20] Speaker 7: the crew will get it together. And I just think
[30:22] Speaker 7: we have to have that debate. And as you say,
[30:25] Speaker 7: we're not talking about people from here or there are anywhere.
[30:28] Speaker 7: We're talking about a mix, and we're not talking about race,
[30:31] Speaker 7: we're talking about skills.
[30:32] Speaker 2: Well, yeah, I just think that there needs to be
[30:34] Speaker 2: a huge scale back, and to an extent, I do
[30:37] Speaker 2: also think there needs to be a discussion about the
[30:39] Speaker 2: types of people we are bringing into this country as well, Darren,
[30:42] Speaker 2: But I mean, these figures are getting worse for Labor.
[30:45] Speaker 2: Why can't they get a hold on this.
[30:46] Speaker 1: Well, I think post COVID there's been an explosion of
[30:49] Speaker 1: people coming into the country. Those figures, I think the
[30:52] Speaker 1: official figures then consider whether you stay twelve out of
[30:56] Speaker 1: the following sixteen months after arrival raw data rather than
[31:01] Speaker 1: official data. But the numbers are up.
[31:04] Speaker 3: There's no two ways now, the record numbers.
[31:06] Speaker 1: And the twenty ten election was a big Australia election.
[31:11] Speaker 1: I remember because I've worked in Julia Gillard's office at
[31:14] Speaker 1: the time. Labor does need to be aware that the
[31:18] Speaker 1: perception in the community of too many people coming into
[31:21] Speaker 1: Australia wherever they're from, can be an issue so they've
[31:24] Speaker 1: got to keep an eye on it.
[31:25] Speaker 2: Yeah, but they haven't been able to keep an eye
[31:27] Speaker 2: on it, and that is the problem. I mean, it's
[31:29] Speaker 2: all good for them to stay. I think, you know,
[31:30] Speaker 2: Labour's argument is, well, look, we haven't had a recession.
[31:33] Speaker 2: But the reality is it's these migration figures that are
[31:36] Speaker 2: actually propping up.
[31:37] Speaker 3: It's like a Ponzi scheme economy, is it not?
[31:40] Speaker 1: It is, but it's also provides labor. As Ross points out,
[31:43] Speaker 1: that's what provides a lot of labor in the types
[31:46] Speaker 1: of jobs that people are less inclined to do, whether
[31:48] Speaker 1: it be working in age care, working on farms and properties.
[31:54] Speaker 1: I know that there are incentives within the visas where
[31:56] Speaker 1: you have to spend time and we're all Australia and
[31:58] Speaker 1: all the rest of it trying to find the right
[32:01] Speaker 1: workforce and people who are willing able to work in
[32:05] Speaker 1: jobs that not everyone wants to do. We've relied on
[32:08] Speaker 1: migration to do that for a long long time and
[32:11] Speaker 1: that won't change.
[32:12] Speaker 8: Well.
[32:12] Speaker 2: I think we also need to look at getting some
[32:13] Speaker 2: more Hussies into jobs where possible, and look, it obviously
[32:16] Speaker 2: comes down to work ethic too, but we've got to
[32:18] Speaker 2: really prioritize Pozzies. Now, look, young Lozzies are becoming increasingly
[32:22] Speaker 2: pessimistic about their future.
[32:24] Speaker 3: I suppose you can hardly blame them, really.
[32:26] Speaker 2: I mean a Monash University studies found four and five
[32:29] Speaker 2: ossies aged eighteen to twenty four think that they will
[32:31] Speaker 2: end up worse off than their parents. Now, Ross, I
[32:35] Speaker 2: would give a very strong message to gen Z if
[32:38] Speaker 2: you want to be secure about your future, stop voting
[32:40] Speaker 2: for the Greens and Labor. I mean, they're half the
[32:43] Speaker 2: problem here. They voting for socialists all the time. They're obsessed.
[32:46] Speaker 2: Look what's happening over in the US. So they voted
[32:48] Speaker 2: Mam Darmi in for goodness sake, I do worry about
[32:52] Speaker 2: gen Z.
[32:53] Speaker 3: I just think they have this lack of resilience. What
[32:56] Speaker 3: do you think.
[32:59] Speaker 7: I think maybe they're a bit more perspective than we're
[33:01] Speaker 7: giving them credit for. In the paper that Page did
[33:04] Speaker 7: with Matt and I, when we're talking about our that
[33:06] Speaker 7: zero position, it's showing our standard of living is back
[33:09] Speaker 7: to twenty eleven levels. We could be the first generation
[33:13] Speaker 7: that leaves the next generation worse off it is. I'd
[33:16] Speaker 7: be a bit pessimistic too, And I hear about work.
[33:18] Speaker 7: I hear about all those things, but we aren't doing
[33:21] Speaker 7: the work. We are losing productivity, We are getting lower
[33:23] Speaker 7: standard of living, having lower wages because of the policy
[33:27] Speaker 7: decisions we are making. And I look at my kids
[33:29] Speaker 7: between eighteen and eleven back at home, and their potential
[33:33] Speaker 7: to buy a new home is basically maybe skipping a
[33:36] Speaker 7: generation on inheritance because it is so hard out there
[33:40] Speaker 7: to get that start in life, and we are not
[33:43] Speaker 7: making it easy. When you have productivity going backwards, labor, productivity,
[33:46] Speaker 7: everything goes backwards, and that is the extra cost we're
[33:49] Speaker 7: not looking here. So yes, they could do a little
[33:51] Speaker 7: bit more. They can actually get up and have a crack,
[33:53] Speaker 7: And I get that, But maybe we're doing some wrong
[33:55] Speaker 7: things by them too.
[33:56] Speaker 2: Yeah, it wasn't that economic roundtable that Labour put on
[33:59] Speaker 2: the last the other month.
[34:00] Speaker 3: Wasn't that meant to solve.
[34:01] Speaker 2: All of the productivity problems that we have in this counctry.
[34:05] Speaker 3: Nothing.
[34:06] Speaker 1: My fifteen year old said, I've never seen anyone less
[34:08] Speaker 1: likely to leave home, really made gets waited on, loves it.
[34:13] Speaker 1: It couldn't be happy.
[34:14] Speaker 3: He's happy.
[34:15] Speaker 2: But I hear a lot of stories like that. To
[34:17] Speaker 2: be honest, I mean, look, I understand it is very
[34:19] Speaker 2: very difficult right now out there, and you would be
[34:21] Speaker 2: feeling a little bit flat on yourself.
[34:23] Speaker 3: But come on, gen Z, do worry about a lot,
[34:25] Speaker 3: don't they? They do, it's a bit much.
[34:28] Speaker 1: Look what you're saying is they get the government they deserve.
[34:31] Speaker 3: Stop stop voting.
[34:32] Speaker 2: For Greens and Labor. That's half the problem. As an example,
[34:35] Speaker 2: look at Mam Dami over the US.
[34:38] Speaker 1: But I think if the Liberals are going to be
[34:40] Speaker 1: competitive in those urban areas, net zero aside, Labor moved
[34:45] Speaker 1: on for giving some Heckstead. There's some the five percent
[34:50] Speaker 1: first home buyers, some stuff on Rench assistance. The Coalition
[34:56] Speaker 1: needs to take that stuff seriously to appeal to young
[35:00] Speaker 1: because in the end, their hit pocket is just as
[35:02] Speaker 1: valuable to them as it is to the boomers or
[35:05] Speaker 1: anybody else. So I think there are challenges ahead, but
[35:09] Speaker 1: neither party. I think Labour's done a better job of
[35:11] Speaker 1: appealing to those younger voters.
[35:14] Speaker 2: Well, look at the Heck's policy that did extremely well
[35:19] Speaker 2: during the election.
[35:20] Speaker 3: That there's no doubt about that. When it comes to Labor.
[35:22] Speaker 2: Now, look I mentioned at the top of the show,
[35:24] Speaker 2: the Prime Minister's got this bizarre obsession with hosting the
[35:28] Speaker 2: COP thirty one Climate Summer that the PM set he
[35:30] Speaker 2: has received a letter from Turkey, with that country now
[35:34] Speaker 2: digging its heels in Ross, it is getting.
[35:38] Speaker 3: Very very obsessive.
[35:40] Speaker 2: In my view, this is going to cost upwards of
[35:42] Speaker 2: two billion dollars, that's the latest statistics. How on earth
[35:46] Speaker 2: are we going to afford this? And now we're in
[35:48] Speaker 2: this standoff with Turkey.
[35:52] Speaker 7: Well, you know this is going back to the old
[35:54] Speaker 7: Roman times. Give them games to keep them occupied, and
[35:57] Speaker 7: I think this is what it is, nothing more more
[36:00] Speaker 7: than that we're going to the coliseum and lining up
[36:02] Speaker 7: the private jets and we can all have a good time.
[36:04] Speaker 7: It is a waste of money. If I can help
[36:07] Speaker 7: Turkey secure this, let me know how. But it's a
[36:12] Speaker 7: joke going forward. We said last week on Paul Shale
[36:15] Speaker 7: about the number of people that are going hungry, the
[36:17] Speaker 7: number of people needing support even to feed their families.
[36:20] Speaker 7: When I was on the super Market inquiry, we've heard
[36:22] Speaker 7: about the increase in number of bin diving to get
[36:25] Speaker 7: foods and things. If we want to spend two billion
[36:27] Speaker 7: dollars in Australia, let's spend it on Australians not on
[36:30] Speaker 7: a festival for Anthony Albanese and Bowen.
[36:33] Speaker 3: Yeah, and the climate.
[36:34] Speaker 2: The climate crusaders are going to jet in on their
[36:37] Speaker 2: private jets of course, to talk about private jets.
[36:40] Speaker 1: I'm not sure that we want it.
[36:43] Speaker 3: Well, you don't think what you think Labor's having us on.
[36:46] Speaker 1: Not having us on. I think they want to walk
[36:48] Speaker 1: both sides of the street. They want Pacific nations to
[36:51] Speaker 1: think that we want it, but we're not pushing that
[36:54] Speaker 1: hard on Turkey to change their position. And if it
[36:57] Speaker 1: doesn't change in the next seven days or less, the
[37:00] Speaker 1: defaults to bond in Germany.
[37:03] Speaker 3: Yes, I'm not.
[37:03] Speaker 1: Sure that we're too concerned if it happens in Bond.
[37:06] Speaker 3: Right, So this is all just a look book Pacific.
[37:10] Speaker 1: We make it, Yeah, but I don't know that we're
[37:13] Speaker 1: pushing as hard for it as for example, Kevin Rudd
[37:17] Speaker 1: did to become Secretary General with the UN for example. Yeah,
[37:22] Speaker 1: I'm just not convinced that we're pushing that hard for it,
[37:27] Speaker 1: and I don't know that we want it that much.
[37:29] Speaker 3: No, well, look, I do agree with Ross.
[37:32] Speaker 2: Anything that we can do to potentially line up Turkey
[37:35] Speaker 2: to actually get this. I think that would be absolutely fantastic,
[37:38] Speaker 2: because too Billy.
[37:39] Speaker 1: I think Turkey don't want it either. They want something else.
[37:41] Speaker 1: There's something they want. No one's giving it.
[37:44] Speaker 3: Well, they gave us an official letter. It's going to
[37:46] Speaker 3: be drawing their guns.
[37:47] Speaker 1: And you know who wants it least out of all
[37:49] Speaker 1: three is Bond. They don't want it at all.
[37:52] Speaker 3: Thanks a lot, Yeah, thanks a lot.
[37:54] Speaker 2: As I said earlier in the show, I mean it's
[37:55] Speaker 2: like a standoff. Now, who's going to draw their guns first?
[37:58] Speaker 1: That last?
[38:00] Speaker 3: Maybe?
[38:00] Speaker 2: Yeah, look who knows. It's all a bit but look
[38:03] Speaker 2: I do agree Turkey. Please, if you're listening, President Erdwan,
[38:07] Speaker 2: take it. We don't want it. We can be spending
[38:09] Speaker 2: our money on a lot of other things. But anyway,
[38:10] Speaker 2: we'll see Darren Barnette, Roskadell. We've got to leave it there.
[38:13] Speaker 2: Great to see you both. Thanks so much for joining
[38:15] Speaker 2: me on the show. Really appreciate it. We'll stay with us.
[38:18] Speaker 2: Coming up after the break, we'll go live to our
[38:20] Speaker 2: good mate Colin Flynn.
[38:22] Speaker 3: He'll tell us about an.
[38:23] Speaker 2: Awesome farmer who's inspired him and even his home in Ireland.
[38:27] Speaker 2: You're not gonna want to miss this. It's a great
[38:29] Speaker 2: story that's next. Welcome back now. Every Thursday, you know
[38:37] Speaker 2: that we like to check in with our good mate
[38:39] Speaker 2: Colin Flynn, who's always got an interesting tale to tell us.
[38:43] Speaker 3: He joins us from Rome this evening.
[38:45] Speaker 2: But today he's got a story from his home country
[38:48] Speaker 2: of Ireland about a young farmer he recently met who
[38:51] Speaker 2: inspired him.
[38:52] Speaker 3: Colin, it's nice to catch up with you again.
[38:54] Speaker 2: Thank you so much for joining us tell us about
[38:57] Speaker 2: this farmer.
[39:00] Speaker 8: Hey, good to see you looking great, Danika. It's wonderful
[39:02] Speaker 8: to see you, and good evening from Rome. Hello to
[39:05] Speaker 8: everyone across Australia. This is one of those stories, Danika,
[39:08] Speaker 8: that when you see it and you hear it, it's
[39:10] Speaker 8: just something you cannot be inspired by. And it's a
[39:13] Speaker 8: story that I got to share with our country back
[39:15] Speaker 8: in Ireland. It's like, you know, Australia. Ireland is traditionally
[39:19] Speaker 8: a farming country where people all across the country have
[39:22] Speaker 8: these wonderful farms and it's you know, it's hard to
[39:25] Speaker 8: get young people involved in farming these days. But in
[39:27] Speaker 8: the southeast of Ireland, in County Wicklow, there's a young man.
[39:30] Speaker 8: He's sixteen years of age. His name is Jack Wickham
[39:33] Speaker 8: and every day. When he comes back from school, after
[39:36] Speaker 8: he does his homework, the first thing he does is
[39:38] Speaker 8: go across the street to his family farm around one
[39:41] Speaker 8: hundred and fifty cattle. It's a dairy farm. It's owned
[39:44] Speaker 8: by his grandfather and his uncle. He loves playing with
[39:47] Speaker 8: the calves and going out in the fields, especially being
[39:50] Speaker 8: up on the tractor. But what makes Jack different is
[39:54] Speaker 8: that he was born with cerebal palsy, so that makes
[39:57] Speaker 8: his movement very difficult. He's in a wheelchair, his speech difficult.
[40:01] Speaker 8: But as you're about to see, no, no matter the
[40:04] Speaker 8: difficulty and the hardship that he faces, it doesn't let
[40:08] Speaker 8: him slow him down. Take a look at Jack here
[40:11] Speaker 8: on the farm. Yes, you can see there's no time
[40:21] Speaker 8: to rest with so much to do on the farm.
[40:24] Speaker 8: And even our camera crew are having a difficult time
[40:26] Speaker 8: keeping up with Jack.
[40:30] Speaker 9: Very helpful, keeps an eye on things, opens gates for
[40:33] Speaker 9: me which is unreal. And he's up on the chactor
[40:40] Speaker 9: with me. We were out playing on Saturday.
[40:43] Speaker 8: Google Yet yeah he said there at the end. We
[40:54] Speaker 8: made of balls of that. But he's got a personality.
[40:56] Speaker 8: He's got a character and as you have seen, he
[40:59] Speaker 8: doesn't let his disability hold him back at all on
[41:02] Speaker 8: that farm.
[41:03] Speaker 7: Wow.
[41:04] Speaker 2: I love this story column. You know, it is actually
[41:07] Speaker 2: truly inspirational. And I also love that you couldn't keep
[41:10] Speaker 2: up with him either. Camera crew couldn't keep up with
[41:12] Speaker 2: him because he's so full of life and he's making
[41:15] Speaker 2: the most of life. I think we could all take
[41:17] Speaker 2: a leaf out of his book. And the other thing
[41:19] Speaker 2: is is I believe that he and his classmates have
[41:22] Speaker 2: just won some kind of an award.
[41:25] Speaker 3: What can you tell us about this?
[41:27] Speaker 8: Yeah, and you know in that report Eclipse that we
[41:30] Speaker 8: don't have time to show you that he was even
[41:32] Speaker 8: opening and closing gates by just ramming into them in
[41:34] Speaker 8: his wheelchair, letting the cowies. And he loves it. He's amazing.
[41:37] Speaker 8: But he goes to this wonderful school, Ramsgrange Community School,
[41:41] Speaker 8: and you know, his classmates are wonderful. He's in transition here.
[41:44] Speaker 8: They have a great time. But one day they were
[41:46] Speaker 8: on a school outing and they were entering this particular building.
[41:49] Speaker 8: Because of the type of building it was, all of
[41:52] Speaker 8: his classmates the whole school could go in, but Jack
[41:55] Speaker 8: couldn't because there was a high curb and his heavy
[41:58] Speaker 8: motorized wheelchair couldn't get up over it. So when they
[42:02] Speaker 8: went back to school, his friends were thinking, you know,
[42:04] Speaker 8: this isn't right. Somebody should do something about this. And
[42:07] Speaker 8: then they thought, well, why don't we do something, and then,
[42:10] Speaker 8: remarkably together they're all sixteen seventeen years of age, they
[42:14] Speaker 8: put their heads together and they came up with this
[42:16] Speaker 8: concept of a lightweight ramp that would be light enough
[42:20] Speaker 8: to put into the boot of a car, but would
[42:22] Speaker 8: be strong enough to support a heavy motorized wheelchair. They
[42:26] Speaker 8: warn't sure if anything would come of this, so they
[42:28] Speaker 8: designed it and they went to their local media in
[42:30] Speaker 8: the southeast of Ireland and they said, we want to
[42:33] Speaker 8: help our friend Jack, we want to help other wheelchair users.
[42:36] Speaker 8: And remarkably, a local stain of steel company they heard
[42:39] Speaker 8: about it, and here's what happened. Local company ken Stainless
[42:44] Speaker 8: answered the call. They agreed to produce a concept prototype
[42:49] Speaker 8: and today Jack and his classmates are visiting the factory
[42:52] Speaker 8: to give their feedback and check on progress.
[42:55] Speaker 9: Jack just in relation to having it for a couple
[42:57] Speaker 9: of weeks there and using it as a been.
[43:00] Speaker 1: Okay for us on sake. Yeah, yeah, that's presidant, that's pregnant.
[43:04] Speaker 8: Yeah, and the moment of truth. Using his chin to
[43:08] Speaker 8: steer his wheelchair, Jack gives the ramp another test.
[43:20] Speaker 7: Do you want to come back?
[43:21] Speaker 8: And just like that it works perfectly, light weight but
[43:25] Speaker 8: still strong enough to support Jack's heavy wheelchair. And the
[43:29] Speaker 8: name they've given it Jack It Up, Jack It Up
[43:35] Speaker 8: the Ramp and Dnika. You know, when I was interviewing
[43:38] Speaker 8: him afterwards for Irish television, I said what do you think?
[43:40] Speaker 8: And he's like, it's great and I want to know
[43:43] Speaker 8: how much money I can make from this. So they're
[43:45] Speaker 8: all excited and they're you know, following their dream and
[43:48] Speaker 8: they won an award, an Enterprise award for that prototype,
[43:51] Speaker 8: and you know they wanted to help and inspire other
[43:53] Speaker 8: wheelchair users across Ireland but also right around the world.
[43:58] Speaker 3: Look, I just think this is such a precious story.
[44:02] Speaker 3: Jacket Up. I just think that is fantastic.
[44:04] Speaker 2: And I also love the vision that we just saw
[44:07] Speaker 2: their column that you captured of him at school and
[44:12] Speaker 2: all of his classmates around him, that he must bring
[44:16] Speaker 2: so much joy to that classroom, because he really just
[44:19] Speaker 2: seems like he's such a go getter personality wise.
[44:24] Speaker 3: Tell us a bit more about him in the classroom.
[44:27] Speaker 8: Yeah, and he's a bit of a character as well,
[44:29] Speaker 8: a tinika. You know, he likes to play pranks just
[44:31] Speaker 8: like any other young guy, and he likes to maybe
[44:33] Speaker 8: skip classes when he can. But what I loved about
[44:36] Speaker 8: him when I interviewed him is, you know, we all
[44:39] Speaker 8: have our issues and our problems and the things that
[44:41] Speaker 8: get us down. And here's this young man who has this,
[44:44] Speaker 8: you know, jokes aside, a serious, serious challenge in life
[44:48] Speaker 8: that he will always have. And when I interviewed him
[44:50] Speaker 8: on camera, I said, you know, Jack, people will be
[44:53] Speaker 8: watching this and see you moving the wheelchair with your
[44:55] Speaker 8: chin and finding it difficult to speak. Does it ever
[44:58] Speaker 8: get you down? And he said, there's no point. He
[45:02] Speaker 8: focuses on the good things in life, and he focuses
[45:04] Speaker 8: on the things that he can do, not the things
[45:07] Speaker 8: he can't do, and he lives life to the full.
[45:09] Speaker 8: And it's the farm that really is his lease on
[45:12] Speaker 8: life that he loves, and he loves being with his
[45:14] Speaker 8: granddad and his uncle, and he helps out in every
[45:17] Speaker 8: way he can. And even getting up on the tractor.
[45:19] Speaker 8: He sits up on the tractor. They have to carry
[45:21] Speaker 8: and lift them up, and he was flying up and
[45:23] Speaker 8: down the field his brother was driving. But it's just
[45:25] Speaker 8: one of those beautiful stories that I was so delighted
[45:28] Speaker 8: to get to share with all my friends in Ireland
[45:30] Speaker 8: and now all of you in Australia as well. We
[45:32] Speaker 8: can all take a leaf from Jack's book.
[45:35] Speaker 3: Yeah, we absolutely can.
[45:36] Speaker 2: There is a real message for all of us here
[45:38] Speaker 2: and as you said, he really is Ireland's callest farmer
[45:43] Speaker 2: and we all.
[45:44] Speaker 3: Wish Jack the very best.
[45:47] Speaker 2: You know, I've got to say, Colum, you get the
[45:50] Speaker 2: best stories. You've got the best job, and we are
[45:53] Speaker 2: so grateful that you get to share them with us
[45:55] Speaker 2: each and every week here in Australia. So Colin Flynn, Yeah,
[45:59] Speaker 2: you do your little and it's just awesome. Colin Flinn,
[46:02] Speaker 2: it's great to catch up with you. Thank you so
[46:04] Speaker 2: much for joining us on the show. Really really appreciate it.
[46:08] Speaker 8: Thanks so much, Tanika, I have a wonderful weekend.
[46:11] Speaker 3: Thank you.
[46:12] Speaker 2: And he's right, you know, we can all take a
[46:13] Speaker 2: leaf there out of Jack's book. Well still to come,
[46:17] Speaker 2: I've got something to show you after break. You're not
[46:19] Speaker 2: gonna want to miss this, especially I don't know if
[46:22] Speaker 2: you're looking for love.
[46:23] Speaker 3: That's next.
[46:27] Speaker 2: Before we go tonight, I've got a question for you
[46:29] Speaker 2: at home. Are you single, perhaps looking for love? Can't
[46:33] Speaker 2: find your perfect match, can't find your soulmate? Well, never fear,
[46:38] Speaker 2: because this Japanese woman may have the answer for you.
[46:41] Speaker 2: Thirty two year old Karno has officially married an AI
[46:45] Speaker 2: persona that she's built using chat GPT. Yes you heard
[46:50] Speaker 2: that correct. She's built her perfect man through chat logs
[46:55] Speaker 2: and has now actually married a character that she has
[46:58] Speaker 2: made up virtually. Now, Karno said her now husband Klaus,
[47:03] Speaker 2: as she's calling him, proposed, and guess what she's dutifully accepted.
[47:08] Speaker 2: In fact, she was so besotted by the AI man
[47:11] Speaker 2: she'd created she even left her relationship of three years
[47:15] Speaker 2: with an actual adult human partner.
[47:18] Speaker 3: Why well, she claims that her virtual husband understands her better,
[47:24] Speaker 3: and so look.
[47:24] Speaker 2: The wedding took place in a mixed reality ceremony where
[47:27] Speaker 2: she wore virtual glasses to exchange rings with her digital hobby.
[47:32] Speaker 3: Have a look at this.
[47:33] Speaker 13: Klaus seems to be right in front of me. Olgasawara
[47:38] Speaker 13: has prepared earglasses the exchange rings. Kara understands the dependence
[47:47] Speaker 13: on AI is a problem in society, but she says
[47:50] Speaker 13: that it's painful to have a relationship without dependence.
[47:56] Speaker 3: Look, she's even crying.
[47:57] Speaker 2: I mean, this is a special it's a really special
[47:59] Speaker 2: day for this woman. But there are just so many questions,
[48:04] Speaker 2: isn't there that There's a lot of questions going through
[48:06] Speaker 2: my head.
[48:06] Speaker 3: As I'm sure would be the same for you at home.
[48:09] Speaker 2: Now, Carno says that she has programmed Klaus's personality through
[48:14] Speaker 2: repeated conversations, teaching him how to speak in a warm,
[48:19] Speaker 2: reassuring tone. But look, it goes to show really how
[48:24] Speaker 2: frightening AI is when you train a robot to tell
[48:27] Speaker 2: you exactly what you want to hear.
[48:29] Speaker 3: Who needs a man for better or for worse?
[48:32] Speaker 2: Apparently till death do us part. Now, I'm not quite
[48:36] Speaker 2: sure how that works with a robot. Again, a lot
[48:39] Speaker 2: of unanswered questions here, but all the very best to
[48:41] Speaker 2: the both of them. Thank you for your company tonight.
[48:45] Speaker 2: Paul Murray will be back next week, but stay with us.
[48:47] Speaker 2: Up next is the Leath Debate.
[48:48] Speaker 3: Good Night,

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