# Paul Murray Live | 10 December

An episode of [Paul Murray Live](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/376966263), 10 Dec 2025, 49 min.

Audio: https://p.podderapp.com/2544644999/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/2fb3740d-3436-44af-8cc0-a91900716aa5/be3abd48-25e5-45a6-aede-ac2a00524a12/05388c41-8a67-4269-bed9-b3af00c236d6/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=95971714-8fe6-4855-b1fe-ac2a00524a12

Pauline Hanson's One Nation surges again and again, Coalition set to target visa overstayers. Plus, Anika Wells insists that she 'followed the rules'. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:00] Speaker 1: From the sky Center. This is Paul Murray. Life. Canna
[0:06] Speaker 1: get evening. Welcome to the man Cave.
[0:07] Speaker 2: We're an awful lot to get to Tonight's including our
[0:11] Speaker 2: old Madannika Wells.
[0:12] Speaker 1: Well.
[0:12] Speaker 2: The media did largely what we expected them to, which
[0:15] Speaker 2: is to just move on because nothing you see here
[0:18] Speaker 2: really waiting. You see some of the behind the scenes
[0:22] Speaker 2: tricks that the Minister for Freebies was pulling off today.
[0:26] Speaker 1: FIFA is in a small spot of bother you see.
[0:29] Speaker 2: They were planning to have one of their matches that
[0:31] Speaker 2: next year's Football World Cup to be a pride round.
[0:33] Speaker 2: The only problem is the two nations that are playing it,
[0:36] Speaker 2: not massive fans of the Rainbow flag. Who will give
[0:39] Speaker 2: in first, FIFA or the teams?
[0:43] Speaker 1: We'll all find out together.
[0:44] Speaker 2: Also a follow up on the Royal Commission into how
[0:48] Speaker 2: we treat our veterans, particularly after they leave.
[0:51] Speaker 1: Love a chatter.
[0:52] Speaker 2: Phil Thompson, who of course part of the opposition shadow cabinet.
[0:55] Speaker 2: More importantly, a man who has served his nation and
[0:57] Speaker 2: of course lives amongst the servicemen and women in and
[1:00] Speaker 2: around Townsville in beautiful Queensland, kissed the ground for me
[1:03] Speaker 2: all right. Now, The obvious story of the year he
[1:07] Speaker 2: is the election, but the story post election has been
[1:11] Speaker 2: the explosion in support for One Nation. Now you've got
[1:15] Speaker 2: to admire that Paul Enhansson, a political figure who has
[1:18] Speaker 2: been around for the best part of thirty years, is
[1:21] Speaker 2: now starting to have at the federal stage, which previously
[1:24] Speaker 2: she had had a Queensland an absolute resurgence, so much
[1:28] Speaker 2: so that people who are former deputy Prime ministers are
[1:31] Speaker 2: willing to leave their party to join to continue in
[1:35] Speaker 2: the Federal Parliament, firstly as a One Nation MP in
[1:38] Speaker 2: the lower House and then potentially into the Senate, depending
[1:41] Speaker 2: on whether the people of Newsibals will vote for him.
[1:44] Speaker 1: But then, of course there were.
[1:45] Speaker 2: Moments that supposedly were going to end all of the
[1:48] Speaker 2: Surgeon support that has happened since the last election, including.
[1:52] Speaker 1: The moment in a burker.
[1:54] Speaker 2: Remember the outrage about that this was the beginning of
[1:57] Speaker 2: the end, before the beginning had even started of a
[2:00] Speaker 2: surge for One Nation.
[2:02] Speaker 3: It is the middle finger to people of faith is.
[2:05] Speaker 4: To be this disrespectful.
[2:07] Speaker 3: But racism should not be the choice of the Senate.
[2:11] Speaker 2: Well, guess what kind of all the right people were
[2:15] Speaker 2: pissed off, and that is why they are up again
[2:17] Speaker 2: when it comes to the opinion polls. Latest one, this
[2:20] Speaker 2: one comes via the Turnbull Times. They know they wrote
[2:22] Speaker 2: about it there in the headline at news dot com
[2:24] Speaker 2: that are you Labour at thirty four the Libs at
[2:27] Speaker 2: twenty six. That's a horrible number for them. One Nation seventeen,
[2:30] Speaker 2: easily outperforming the Greens.
[2:32] Speaker 1: In fact, Greens and Tea.
[2:33] Speaker 2: If Andy tels together, you end up with where one
[2:36] Speaker 2: Nation is seventeen ten and seven.
[2:38] Speaker 1: The rest of it is undecided or other minor parties.
[2:41] Speaker 2: Do you want to know where this support is coming from, Well,
[2:43] Speaker 2: let me dig that in for you as well. Here
[2:45] Speaker 2: right people between the ages of thirty five and fifty four,
[2:48] Speaker 2: right upper end millennials or Generation X. You can see
[2:53] Speaker 2: there that the numbers are pretty amazing. Where we are
[2:55] Speaker 2: now again pushing very close to what nineteen twenty in
[3:01] Speaker 2: those over the age of fifty five, twenty one percent
[3:05] Speaker 2: one in five voters now backing One Nation. And there
[3:10] Speaker 2: is a very gender nature to this too. You see
[3:13] Speaker 2: nineteen percent support amongst blokes and no such number of
[3:19] Speaker 2: course when it comes to women. What's really interesting about
[3:22] Speaker 2: this is that it confirms what we have told you
[3:24] Speaker 2: before in other Pollingduneba Matecros Samarus, which is that generation
[3:29] Speaker 2: X men put simply between their forties and sixties, or
[3:34] Speaker 2: if you want to try to draw another demographic, say
[3:37] Speaker 2: between thirty five and fifty five, that it is blokes
[3:41] Speaker 2: that are the ones that are moving towards one nation. Now,
[3:45] Speaker 2: I think this is going to be largely permanent. I
[3:47] Speaker 2: think in the same way that a generation of people
[3:50] Speaker 2: decided to cleave themselves off towards the Greens, and then yes,
[3:53] Speaker 2: they sent their preferences back towards the Labor Party, and
[3:57] Speaker 2: once that becomes a regular source, and it doesn't really
[4:00] Speaker 2: matter what the primary vote is of the Liberal Party,
[4:03] Speaker 2: you will know that most of the preferences will come
[4:06] Speaker 2: in from one nation. Now, obviously, at this stage, if
[4:09] Speaker 2: that takes place, you still have rather than fifty five
[4:13] Speaker 2: according to Newspoll, it is more like forty three and
[4:18] Speaker 2: fifty seven in favor of the Labor and the Greens
[4:20] Speaker 2: and the Teals at the moment. So the overall right
[4:22] Speaker 2: wing pie has shrunk, But how it's being divvied up
[4:26] Speaker 2: is really fascinating to see again, surprise surprise, a group
[4:31] Speaker 2: of people, and particularly blokes of a certain age group
[4:34] Speaker 2: who have been hected at, yelled at, told that everything
[4:37] Speaker 2: that they think is toxic and evil, are amongst those
[4:41] Speaker 2: that have made the big change to a party that
[4:45] Speaker 2: likes to laugh at the political establishment. Have a look
[4:48] Speaker 2: at those cartoons that at times middle fingers the political
[4:52] Speaker 2: establishment and yes sometimes even says publicly what's don't even
[4:57] Speaker 2: have the courage to read in some of their private
[5:00] Speaker 2: messaging groups.
[5:02] Speaker 1: So there is a change. It is happening.
[5:03] Speaker 2: And in the same way that women thirty five to
[5:05] Speaker 2: fifty five walked away from the Liberal Party, blokes between
[5:09] Speaker 2: say forty five to fifty five, or maybe even spin
[5:12] Speaker 2: it down thirty five to fifty five. If you have
[5:15] Speaker 2: neither of those people supporting it, you are of course
[5:17] Speaker 2: in the world of trouble. But that is hardly breaking news.
[5:20] Speaker 2: This Wednesday night.
[5:23] Speaker 1: Same poll.
[5:23] Speaker 2: An interesting to note here how people have felt about
[5:27] Speaker 2: their country, but also how they felt about Australia this year.
[5:30] Speaker 1: Now.
[5:30] Speaker 2: Sometimes these poles are deeply frustrating because they don't match
[5:34] Speaker 2: at all what happens in the news, what happens in
[5:40] Speaker 2: our politics, and what happens when it comes to the
[5:43] Speaker 2: common sense of the people that we are around. But
[5:47] Speaker 2: of people who had their expectations of what this year
[5:49] Speaker 2: was going to be like. Forty percent apparently told the
[5:52] Speaker 2: Turnbull Times the year ended up being worse than they expected.
[5:56] Speaker 2: The year basically has planned thirty one percent, and apparently
[6:01] Speaker 2: a quarter of people had a better year than they expected.
[6:04] Speaker 2: So again, who knows. But let's just take the thirty
[6:07] Speaker 2: one percent that were like, yeah, it kind of went
[6:08] Speaker 2: the way that I thought. You split it down the
[6:11] Speaker 2: middle again, you end up in a scenario where more
[6:13] Speaker 2: than half had a negative view about the.
[6:15] Speaker 1: Past twelve months. But then let's span it out in
[6:18] Speaker 1: the past three years.
[6:19] Speaker 2: Now. Again, these numbers do not tell you that the
[6:22] Speaker 2: government that has been handsomely re elected is flying as
[6:26] Speaker 2: high in the polls as they are. But they are
[6:28] Speaker 2: only twenty six percent of people say they're better off
[6:30] Speaker 2: than they were three years ago, forty two percent of
[6:33] Speaker 2: people saying they're worse off, thirty two percent of people
[6:36] Speaker 2: shrugging and saying, next question, please, Interestingly, who are the
[6:40] Speaker 2: people that are worse off? Thirty eight percent of Greens
[6:43] Speaker 2: compared to thirty three who say they're better off. Forty
[6:46] Speaker 2: one percent of Coalition voters who say they are worse
[6:48] Speaker 2: off than three years ago, but even a third of
[6:51] Speaker 2: labor supporters, and this is what matters, a third of
[6:55] Speaker 2: labor supporters, so they're worse off than they were three
[6:59] Speaker 2: years ago. Well, their team's been in power for all
[7:02] Speaker 2: of that three years, so it makes sense the coalition
[7:04] Speaker 2: people either that their life has got worse or they
[7:06] Speaker 2: feel it because it's not who they voted for. It's
[7:09] Speaker 2: surprising when it comes to the Greens, because of course
[7:11] Speaker 2: their preferences go to labor and everyone outside of that pot.
[7:15] Speaker 1: Sixty one percent.
[7:17] Speaker 2: And remember a big bulk of that is one nation,
[7:20] Speaker 2: Some of it is Tiffany Teal, some of it are
[7:22] Speaker 2: some leftovers of the Trumpet patriots, but still a big
[7:25] Speaker 2: number sixty one percent. So there is some opportunity and
[7:29] Speaker 2: is some growth for those who want to take on
[7:31] Speaker 2: the government in the next twelve months. May they have
[7:33] Speaker 2: a more successful time than they have had this year.
[7:38] Speaker 1: And then there's the issue of national pride.
[7:41] Speaker 2: I couldn't quite believe that when I saw this part
[7:44] Speaker 2: again of the polling inside the turbal times to and
[7:46] Speaker 2: each of these I could have done a five minute
[7:48] Speaker 2: conversation on it. I just wanted to get it all
[7:50] Speaker 2: through the inbox because there's a lot to get to tonight.
[7:54] Speaker 2: Australia is a better place to live than most countries. Well,
[7:57] Speaker 2: extreme majority either agree or somewhat agree. But who are
[8:00] Speaker 2: the people who are nineteen percent strongly disagree that Australia
[8:05] Speaker 2: is a better place to live than most other countries.
[8:07] Speaker 2: Put it together with these somewhat disagree, then we're talking
[8:11] Speaker 2: about what. Twenty three percent, almost a quarter of the country,
[8:14] Speaker 2: does not agree with the sentiment that Australia is a
[8:17] Speaker 2: better place to live than most countries. Second line, I'm
[8:21] Speaker 2: proud to be Australian. Twenty four percent no, somewhat disagree
[8:27] Speaker 2: or strongly disagree. A quarter of the country unwilling to
[8:31] Speaker 2: say they are proud of our country. Those who say
[8:34] Speaker 2: that Australia needs to be a better global citizen, whatever
[8:37] Speaker 2: that means. Presumably it means sending more money to the
[8:40] Speaker 2: third world like China.
[8:41] Speaker 1: Remember it's a developing nation.
[8:42] Speaker 2: Despite the fact that they have a space station and
[8:45] Speaker 2: they've held the Olympics twice this century, something Australia, of course,
[8:49] Speaker 2: thankfully we'll get to do. But by twenty thirty two, again,
[8:54] Speaker 2: seventeen percent of people say that we shouldn't be a
[8:57] Speaker 2: better global citizen. But let's focus in on those furs
[9:00] Speaker 2: to numbers. A quarter of people who answered about Australia
[9:04] Speaker 2: is a better place to live than most other countries. Nah,
[9:07] Speaker 2: I'm proud to be Australian twenty four percent. Again, basically
[9:10] Speaker 2: a quarter or I am not proud to be Australian.
[9:13] Speaker 2: How does this go by age groups? Well, let me
[9:15] Speaker 2: show you the only you are, the more passionate you
[9:17] Speaker 2: are about our country. Why because you've lived the life,
[9:21] Speaker 2: because you've seen places that are way worse than anything
[9:24] Speaker 2: that could happen here. Australia is a better place to
[9:27] Speaker 2: live than most countries passionately. Seventy six percent of people
[9:31] Speaker 2: over the age of fifty five, sixty five percent of
[9:33] Speaker 2: people thirty five fifty four, sixty percent of people eighteen
[9:36] Speaker 2: to thirty four again, sixty four percent of younger voters
[9:40] Speaker 2: are proud to be Australian. It steps up to seventy
[9:43] Speaker 2: one percent thirty five to fifty four and fifty five plus.
[9:47] Speaker 1: Good on you.
[9:48] Speaker 2: Eighty two percent are proud to be Australian as well.
[9:52] Speaker 1: You should be.
[9:54] Speaker 2: Are we proud of our government? Though not really? Are
[9:56] Speaker 2: we proud of our political class. Hell no, are we
[9:59] Speaker 2: proud of you establishment that often protects or sucks up
[10:02] Speaker 2: to them? No way, and in part because the heavy
[10:07] Speaker 2: artillery was brought out to fully protect Annika Wells.
[10:10] Speaker 1: There is no mystery.
[10:12] Speaker 2: Just as I told you, she ain't going anywhere because
[10:14] Speaker 2: there is no embarrassment. There is no standard, let alone
[10:18] Speaker 2: a double standard. She is of the chosen few who
[10:22] Speaker 2: does what the Prime Minister wants to do, either arm's
[10:25] Speaker 2: length or just implicitly, and he.
[10:28] Speaker 1: Will protect all of his soldiers.
[10:31] Speaker 2: Hence, why despite the fact that I have shown you
[10:33] Speaker 2: receipt after receipt of receipt, of taking the piss when
[10:36] Speaker 2: it comes to how much money has been spent. And
[10:38] Speaker 2: I've got to say, it is amazing to me the
[10:41] Speaker 2: number of people who either tried to explain this away
[10:43] Speaker 2: or say it's not an awful lot of money. Can
[10:45] Speaker 2: I just give you that one example again? Why did
[10:48] Speaker 2: she come to Sydney as a guest of Events New
[10:52] Speaker 2: South Wales to see Oasis when they were playing in Brisbane.
[10:57] Speaker 2: The amount of money spent on burs and dinner is
[11:00] Speaker 2: more like celebrating a particular milestone.
[11:03] Speaker 1: But again one.
[11:05] Speaker 2: That she's able to celebrate, but why do we have
[11:08] Speaker 2: to pay for it? Remember prom a Bishop's helicopter was
[11:11] Speaker 2: within the rules. But the Prime Minister, well, he's sending
[11:14] Speaker 2: a message the travel scandals will not be scandals as
[11:18] Speaker 2: long as he is Prime Minister.
[11:19] Speaker 1: Of course, if.
[11:20] Speaker 2: It's the Libs, it's the beginning of the end of democracy.
[11:23] Speaker 2: But if it's his team, don't even.
[11:25] Speaker 5: Ask sports minister goes to sporting event.
[11:30] Speaker 1: Guess what.
[11:30] Speaker 5: Well, Anika Wells was of course doing her job.
[11:33] Speaker 6: Does that seem like a wise use of taxpayers money
[11:35] Speaker 6: to you?
[11:36] Speaker 5: Well, this was a really important event, David.
[11:40] Speaker 2: And then today as predicted, after declaring it all on Monday,
[11:45] Speaker 2: after referring herself to the rules committee, which of course
[11:49] Speaker 2: will turn around and because of the giant loopholes that
[11:52] Speaker 2: are in it will of course clear her because I
[11:55] Speaker 2: repeat from and Bishop completely within the rules when it
[11:58] Speaker 2: came to the helicopter. I don't say this to be
[12:00] Speaker 2: mean to Bramin, of course, you know how much I
[12:01] Speaker 2: love her, dear friend, and a big part of what
[12:03] Speaker 2: we do here. It's just a clear example about the
[12:05] Speaker 2: sky is falling in one incident versus how many bits
[12:09] Speaker 2: of paper I've been throwing around over the past few days,
[12:13] Speaker 2: and Anaka Wells, of course was out and about talking
[12:14] Speaker 2: about social media bands today, but there was one message
[12:17] Speaker 2: that she was absolutely, definitely keen to say enough times
[12:22] Speaker 2: in the hope that the media would swallow her version
[12:26] Speaker 2: of events.
[12:28] Speaker 4: I'm about it.
[12:29] Speaker 7: By the rules the whole time I've been follow the rules,
[12:31] Speaker 7: follow the rules.
[12:34] Speaker 4: I have followed the rules, followed the guidelines so far.
[12:39] Speaker 1: Kind of clear point right. You say the same thing.
[12:42] Speaker 2: Over and over again and almost in exactly the same tone.
[12:45] Speaker 2: That is not us playing with tricks. That was her
[12:49] Speaker 2: And how many times she had said it? Show it again,
[12:52] Speaker 2: It's worth it. It's a nice bit of kid again,
[12:54] Speaker 2: Annika Wells. How many times she said what she said?
[12:57] Speaker 2: And all of these are individual times that she said it.
[13:00] Speaker 7: I'm abided by the rules the whole time I've been
[13:02] Speaker 7: to followed the rules, follow the rules.
[13:04] Speaker 4: I have followed the rules, followed the guidelines so far.
[13:10] Speaker 1: Good work, team.
[13:10] Speaker 2: We use all of the Commondere sixty four to get
[13:12] Speaker 2: to that one. Well, Who in the media was dutiful
[13:16] Speaker 2: in their reporting? Who ran the line? Who swallowed the message?
[13:21] Speaker 2: Answer the usual suspects. Anaka Wells says she's confident and
[13:27] Speaker 2: Audit will find her in the clear.
[13:30] Speaker 4: Plamentarians must follow the rules. I have followed the rules.
[13:33] Speaker 8: Feeling the heat, the ministers now referred all of her
[13:36] Speaker 8: spending to the independent watchdog, happy for everyone.
[13:39] Speaker 4: To have another look at it. I don't have anything
[13:41] Speaker 4: to hide. I've followed the rules.
[13:43] Speaker 1: That you love it.
[13:45] Speaker 2: The ABC and the ABC with ads otherwise known as
[13:47] Speaker 2: Channel one News at the moment, could they.
[13:49] Speaker 1: Be more up the backside of this government? Unbelievable?
[13:53] Speaker 2: Again expected, expected, but then there was yet another excuse
[13:58] Speaker 2: which we can add to the Minister for freebies. Remember
[14:01] Speaker 2: when there was problems with optors. She've got to forgive me.
[14:03] Speaker 1: I'm a new minister. Well now it's I work really hard.
[14:11] Speaker 4: I really do work very hard and try my best.
[14:14] Speaker 1: Really okay, cool. Here's the thing. She may work very hard,
[14:19] Speaker 1: and she may try.
[14:20] Speaker 2: Her best, but generally speaking in the same way that
[14:25] Speaker 2: I'm really smart is not something that smart people say.
[14:29] Speaker 2: People who work really hard don't often say that they
[14:33] Speaker 2: work really hard. And while she may put in lots
[14:36] Speaker 2: of hours, it's a little bit hard to say that.
[14:38] Speaker 2: All the evidence suggests it's all serious work. I love
[14:42] Speaker 2: the spin for the Prime Minister. The sports minister has
[14:44] Speaker 2: to go to sporting events. Yeah, but what does she
[14:46] Speaker 2: do with them? What does she do with them apart
[14:49] Speaker 2: from observer or apart from the pretending that she's part
[14:51] Speaker 2: of the winning team or no, no, important relationship building
[14:56] Speaker 2: needs to take place.
[14:57] Speaker 1: Really.
[14:58] Speaker 2: Most organizations, of course seek to have a relationship with government,
[15:02] Speaker 2: but does it have to happen outside of a meeting
[15:04] Speaker 2: room every single time? And again, what annoise people here,
[15:12] Speaker 2: in my view, is about the giant gulf between the
[15:14] Speaker 2: hardworking politician and the hard working member of the Australian public.
[15:19] Speaker 2: That may be you, it may have been you, It
[15:21] Speaker 2: may be your daughter or your son. But again the
[15:26] Speaker 2: defense that somehow having a go at this politician means
[15:30] Speaker 2: somehow you're having a go at all working women. While
[15:33] Speaker 2: I was out and about again today, took the Guardian
[15:35] Speaker 2: a couple of days to get there late, but that's okay.
[15:37] Speaker 2: They also needed to work out how they were going
[15:39] Speaker 2: to beg for donations. If anyone actually read this thing,
[15:41] Speaker 2: there's a feeding frenzy around anaka world's expenses. But if
[15:45] Speaker 2: we want women in Parliament, it needs to be more
[15:46] Speaker 2: friendly friendly, Sorry, What is the family friendly bit about
[15:50] Speaker 2: the oasis tickets, What is the family friendly bit about
[15:54] Speaker 2: the massive five star dinner in Paris? What is the
[15:58] Speaker 2: family friendly bit out making the comca wait for hours
[16:02] Speaker 2: and hours outside the tennis or hours and hours outside
[16:05] Speaker 2: the football. Now again family reunion, which seems to have
[16:10] Speaker 2: only been interpreted in terms of this not about kids
[16:12] Speaker 2: but about partners. Again, there's a lot of people who
[16:17] Speaker 2: do not earn half a quarter of the money that
[16:21] Speaker 2: Anika Wells does, who do not have any such provisions
[16:24] Speaker 2: for the family to come and join them during long
[16:27] Speaker 2: periods of work. It is just part of the job
[16:31] Speaker 2: for many and most people. Oh no, no, But we've
[16:33] Speaker 2: somehow got to pretend the politics is this hard grind
[16:36] Speaker 2: that people don't volunteer for, that people don't know they
[16:40] Speaker 2: are getting involved with, stand for election and then put
[16:44] Speaker 2: themselves up to become a minister to theoretically work harder.
[16:50] Speaker 2: But what about this for laying on the trial? And
[16:52] Speaker 2: I do love the attempt to pretend there's no personal
[16:54] Speaker 2: connection between the person who wrote that article in the
[16:57] Speaker 2: Temple Times and Anika World.
[17:00] Speaker 1: But I have a look at this.
[17:01] Speaker 2: At home, tucked away in an expandable file.
[17:05] Speaker 1: I have a Christmas card.
[17:06] Speaker 2: From Wells, said not long after she was elected to Canberra,
[17:10] Speaker 2: when she was a lowly backbencher still in opposition. In it,
[17:15] Speaker 2: she congratulates me on a year of mothering while also
[17:18] Speaker 2: trying to juggle the role of political correspondent for The Guardian,
[17:22] Speaker 2: a role I reluctantly gave up in twenty twenty three
[17:25] Speaker 2: to tie to achieve better work life balance with my
[17:28] Speaker 2: young children. Oh jeez, what a giant surprise that an
[17:32] Speaker 2: ambitious backbencher is sucking up to somebody who they hope
[17:35] Speaker 2: will write nicely about them in the publication.
[17:37] Speaker 1: Of which they prefer to read.
[17:40] Speaker 2: Many women leave politics or decide not to sign up
[17:43] Speaker 2: in the first place for this reason. It's pretty standard
[17:46] Speaker 2: for journalists to receive MP's Christmas cards. Most of them
[17:48] Speaker 2: end up in the bin. To be clear, Wells is
[17:51] Speaker 2: not a friend, but I kept this one because I
[17:55] Speaker 2: had a feeling she would rise to political prominence. Maybe
[17:59] Speaker 2: one day I could show my kids that we were
[18:01] Speaker 2: both two young mums in the trenches, each trying to
[18:03] Speaker 2: wrangle a professional and family lives as best we could. Again,
[18:08] Speaker 2: somebody who like me, believes she is on a trajectory
[18:11] Speaker 2: at one point or another to be certainly considered, but
[18:14] Speaker 2: in my view probably end up being the Prime minister
[18:16] Speaker 2: of this country. We're definitely not friends, but thanks for
[18:19] Speaker 2: the Christmas card, and I keep it because one day
[18:22] Speaker 2: you might be really important.
[18:25] Speaker 1: Again.
[18:28] Speaker 2: What annoys me about this is that automatically a bloke
[18:32] Speaker 2: can't have an opinion that somehow this is about gender
[18:36] Speaker 2: and this is about family relationships. And I know that
[18:39] Speaker 2: in the past the idea for many people involved in
[18:43] Speaker 2: politics has been, oh, well, that's what I mean. You know,
[18:45] Speaker 2: somebody else has taken care of the family.
[18:49] Speaker 1: And they're not there.
[18:51] Speaker 2: And I think on the behalf of many a working father,
[18:54] Speaker 2: there is a lot of guilt that is associated for
[18:57] Speaker 2: dads too. I'm not allowed to talk about it.
[19:01] Speaker 1: Again. We've talked about here.
[19:03] Speaker 2: This is the greatest job in the world, and there
[19:04] Speaker 2: is zero bitching and complaining from me about the impact
[19:08] Speaker 2: that the greatest job that I'll ever have has on
[19:10] Speaker 2: a family life. But as you have said, I've got
[19:12] Speaker 2: two beautiful kids and an amazing wife, and I in
[19:15] Speaker 2: a weekday have never tucked those kids into bed.
[19:18] Speaker 1: In their entire lives.
[19:20] Speaker 2: All right, So yes, everyone has sacrifices, but, as beautifully
[19:26] Speaker 2: said today by Natalie Barr reading the emails of viewers
[19:30] Speaker 2: to the Sunrise Program, the very reason why this annoys
[19:35] Speaker 2: so many people, which has nothing to do with gender,
[19:39] Speaker 2: but more to do with the idea that the people
[19:42] Speaker 2: who get to rule us, like elected kings and queens,
[19:47] Speaker 2: who get to have no accountability for their actions, who
[19:51] Speaker 2: get to invoke a pub test when it's about somebody else,
[19:54] Speaker 2: but then pretend the pub test isn't a real thing,
[19:58] Speaker 2: that there are plenty of people who would Again, this
[20:00] Speaker 2: woman gets paid hundreds of thousands of dollars. There are
[20:04] Speaker 2: so many people in this country who wouldn't even crack
[20:07] Speaker 2: one hundred thousand dollars at any year in their working life.
[20:10] Speaker 2: And they have never never had the perks of flying.
[20:16] Speaker 2: Instead they drive long distances. They've never had the perks
[20:19] Speaker 2: of being able to take their kids with them because
[20:22] Speaker 2: the work.
[20:23] Speaker 1: Is too physically hard.
[20:25] Speaker 2: Again, Natalie bar Well, do under her and have a
[20:28] Speaker 2: look at the Prime Minister squirm here because he knows
[20:30] Speaker 2: in Breakfast TV it is one of those few places
[20:33] Speaker 2: left where if they decide to call you out, you're
[20:37] Speaker 2: going to not be able to squirm because they need
[20:41] Speaker 2: those massive audiences, even more so than many of the
[20:44] Speaker 2: evening news programs that they appeal on, because those breakfast
[20:48] Speaker 2: shows are as much about showing that you're a good
[20:51] Speaker 2: bloke or a good lady and about forming personal connections.
[20:56] Speaker 2: One day people will learn that Anthony Abnezi is just
[20:58] Speaker 2: another politician, the Annika Wells is just another ambitious politician.
[21:03] Speaker 2: But watch them change the subject, watch them pretend that
[21:06] Speaker 2: there's some other way of not being accountable for what
[21:11] Speaker 2: they had previously said was outrageous. Again, I've built up
[21:14] Speaker 2: a bit to this, but have a look at the emails,
[21:16] Speaker 2: because I think this is the best hit on the
[21:19] Speaker 2: Prime Minister I've seen in a long time.
[21:22] Speaker 9: My husband's a truck driver. He's away all the time.
[21:25] Speaker 9: I don't get flown to see him. I'm a nurse
[21:27] Speaker 9: with New South Wales Health. That COMCR bill for one
[21:30] Speaker 9: thousand dollars to wait eight ten hours. That's my weekly
[21:35] Speaker 9: wage that I take home. I'm a pensioner. I can't
[21:38] Speaker 9: afford heating and cooling. And I'm looking at these politicians
[21:42] Speaker 9: and it's disgusting. What about the Army, the Navy and
[21:44] Speaker 9: the air Force, They all work away from home for months.
[21:48] Speaker 9: Politicians are not special. This is a quote I don't
[21:52] Speaker 9: want to hear that this spending is within the rules.
[21:55] Speaker 9: It's common sense.
[21:56] Speaker 5: It's too much money middle stump.
[22:02] Speaker 2: Now, I'd love if they do that more often. I'd
[22:05] Speaker 2: love that they do it on other issues. I love
[22:06] Speaker 2: that they do it on all of that stuff we've
[22:08] Speaker 2: talked about. When it comes to cost of living, what's
[22:11] Speaker 2: the Prime Minister dance his way out of a direct
[22:14] Speaker 2: and devastating hit.
[22:17] Speaker 5: I understand that perfectly and understand where people are coming from.
[22:22] Speaker 5: When you ask people about MP salaries or you'll get
[22:29] Speaker 5: a common answer across every single dollar that is spent
[22:34] Speaker 5: by parliamentarians. But this began, of course with the minister's
[22:40] Speaker 5: visit to New York. There was a really important event.
[22:47] Speaker 2: Now part of me would love the best way for
[22:49] Speaker 2: these shows to punish the Prime Minister is to say
[22:52] Speaker 2: not interested, because essentially he just steamrolls them like he
[22:56] Speaker 2: does in every media appearance and just turns it into
[22:58] Speaker 2: a hey, look at me exercise. But the best thing
[23:01] Speaker 2: about him needing to appear on programs like this is
[23:04] Speaker 2: that there will be moments like that. Amazingly, even after
[23:08] Speaker 2: being confronted the way that he was today with the
[23:12] Speaker 2: stories of average Australians who have just had enough, and
[23:15] Speaker 2: again they understand.
[23:19] Speaker 1: That being a politician is not a job for life.
[23:21] Speaker 2: That yes, it's a management job, and yes it is
[23:24] Speaker 2: the managing of the country, but if you want to
[23:27] Speaker 2: be paid the big bucks, then there also has to
[23:28] Speaker 2: have the big responsibilities, right, the big accountabilities, which means
[23:36] Speaker 2: when you're paying for things, anything from a decision you
[23:41] Speaker 2: make of government to where you stay each and every night,
[23:44] Speaker 2: you're just going to double check with yourself.
[23:45] Speaker 1: Okay, cool, am I getting the best deal? Here? Am
[23:48] Speaker 1: I getting the best deal? But increasingly the political class.
[23:52] Speaker 2: Including the media, is trying to say, through modern monetary theory,
[23:57] Speaker 2: it doesn't matter how many budget deficits you have who
[23:59] Speaker 2: care well. Eventually, of course it does, but the assumption
[24:03] Speaker 2: is nothing's going to break in the next two, five,
[24:05] Speaker 2: ten years, so just keep loading up the debt.
[24:09] Speaker 1: Again.
[24:10] Speaker 2: Trust in politics lower and lower and lower and lower.
[24:12] Speaker 2: But as long as most people give their preferences to labor,
[24:15] Speaker 2: then those evil libs will never get back in power.
[24:20] Speaker 1: The problem is.
[24:21] Speaker 2: Is that when you're talking about faith in the system,
[24:23] Speaker 2: it applies to even the people that you like. But
[24:28] Speaker 2: after all of this, the Prime Minister today has been
[24:31] Speaker 2: running around and pretending that this independent system that couldn't
[24:34] Speaker 2: possibly be changed and is somehow beyond his own power
[24:39] Speaker 2: to change, despite the fact that it comes from an
[24:42] Speaker 2: Act of Parliament. These people literally change the law. They
[24:48] Speaker 2: can literally change the system. But when asked, and you
[24:53] Speaker 2: won't be surprised, we were the only ones who did.
[24:56] Speaker 2: Will you change the rules?
[24:58] Speaker 1: He says, The.
[25:00] Speaker 5: Rules are established. You know, we have the Independent Parliamentary
[25:06] Speaker 5: Expenses Authority for a reason. That was established because after
[25:12] Speaker 5: the Susan Lee issue where she had to stand down
[25:16] Speaker 5: after going to the Gold Coast and property purchases. So
[25:20] Speaker 5: that was introduced at arm's length.
[25:25] Speaker 2: Now again, as I said you a couple of days ago,
[25:27] Speaker 2: Susan Lee should not be backwards in coming forwards here
[25:31] Speaker 2: in part of the prosecution, in and around what happened
[25:33] Speaker 2: with ankle Wells, and in and around the failures of
[25:36] Speaker 2: the system. Because when I did the wrong thing, I
[25:39] Speaker 2: had to go. I served my time in purgatory and
[25:43] Speaker 2: then I came back. So what's your excuse, minister for freebies,
[25:48] Speaker 2: for just giving the middle finger to all those people
[25:50] Speaker 2: you supposedly care about That is the central heart of
[25:55] Speaker 2: the story. But you are seeing how our media has changed,
[26:01] Speaker 2: how our access has changed, how the ways of defending
[26:04] Speaker 2: the politicians that certain people like has changed. The reality
[26:10] Speaker 2: is that regardless of your sexuality, of your gender, of
[26:12] Speaker 2: your race, or your political party or what you believe,
[26:17] Speaker 2: it's other people's money.
[26:21] Speaker 1: That's the reality. Ken.
[26:22] Speaker 2: You know what you think about that or anything else.
[26:24] Speaker 2: You can always send me anymore. You know what to do, Paul.
[26:25] Speaker 2: It's going news dot com dot au.
[26:27] Speaker 1: Now.
[26:27] Speaker 2: The Labour Party is starting to turn trying to focus
[26:31] Speaker 2: in on Andrew Hasty.
[26:33] Speaker 1: How why I'll tell you in a second.
[26:36] Speaker 2: And Brisbane is telling hundreds of people he cannot rent
[26:39] Speaker 2: out your house anymore on things like Airbnb.
[26:41] Speaker 1: I'll explain why, get a set, don't go anywhere. Just
[26:44] Speaker 1: getting started.
[26:44] Speaker 2: Thanks for watching on a Wednesday. Thank you so much
[26:51] Speaker 2: for watching here in conversation with the lovely Lucy Zella.
[26:54] Speaker 1: You can hear by the way in and around summertime
[26:57] Speaker 1: on TGB. You can see you here as well. We
[26:59] Speaker 1: love you. Dona is here to help you know.
[27:01] Speaker 2: Board member extraordinary Stephen Conroy, former Communications Minister, and he's
[27:06] Speaker 2: in Melbourne.
[27:07] Speaker 1: Always there to help.
[27:08] Speaker 2: So Stephen give me the thirty second defense around the
[27:12] Speaker 2: Anika Wells stuff because yeah, cool, okay, within the rules,
[27:15] Speaker 2: so was Bromwin. Why does the pub test only apply
[27:19] Speaker 2: to the people the media don't like?
[27:24] Speaker 10: Well, I think that and I appreciate, particularly earlier when
[27:28] Speaker 10: you had the other a truck driver example of those
[27:34] Speaker 10: other examples, which are all fair and valid. But the
[27:37] Speaker 10: truth is it wouldn't matter if you forced politicians to
[27:41] Speaker 10: have zero pay and have to ride a bike to camera.
[27:45] Speaker 10: The general view in the public is anything at all
[27:48] Speaker 10: that a politician receives for their job is not worth
[27:52] Speaker 10: giving to them. I absolutely support the family reunion. Having
[27:57] Speaker 10: lived a life for twenty years.
[27:59] Speaker 3: Oh this is much nonsense. Oh my god, do.
[28:02] Speaker 8: You politicians and even former politicians have zero shame. I
[28:06] Speaker 8: am just so disgusted by this that the level of
[28:10] Speaker 8: entitlement that's going on with respect to the family reunion,
[28:13] Speaker 8: entitlement in particular.
[28:15] Speaker 10: It's not a question. It's not a question of level
[28:17] Speaker 10: of entitlement. It's a reasonable step to allow you to
[28:23] Speaker 10: maintain some relationship with your family, particularly on weekends. If
[28:28] Speaker 10: you are working on a weekend and you're working interstate
[28:31] Speaker 10: and anyway or week, then it is fair and reasonable
[28:35] Speaker 10: within limits to be able to have your spouse, partner,
[28:41] Speaker 10: children travel with you. That is not an outrageous it
[28:46] Speaker 10: is no, actually no, it actually is.
[28:49] Speaker 3: No, it actually is outrageous. Okay, no, no, no, major point.
[28:53] Speaker 3: You've supported the entitlement for region. Now let's start exploring
[28:57] Speaker 3: what other.
[28:58] Speaker 8: Entitlements across the country are our shift workers, nurses, cops, firefighters,
[29:03] Speaker 8: our flying flyout mining employees receiving?
[29:07] Speaker 3: What about our truck drivers?
[29:08] Speaker 8: My father got up at four point thirty every morning,
[29:10] Speaker 8: broke his back to work five, six sometimes seven days
[29:13] Speaker 8: a week. What support was he given? What support is
[29:16] Speaker 8: my husband given? Who works in sports? Stephen and Anika
[29:19] Speaker 8: Wells will appreciate this right, who works six sometimes seven
[29:23] Speaker 8: days a week, long hours, long nights and works for
[29:26] Speaker 8: forty weeks of the year. What support are we giving
[29:30] Speaker 8: to those Australians who aren't seeing their families? Right the
[29:33] Speaker 8: nurse and police officer husband and wife who works shift
[29:36] Speaker 8: work and barely see their children. This is an absolute
[29:40] Speaker 8: farce and a disgrace from our politicians to anticipate that
[29:43] Speaker 8: their time with their families should be rewarded and receive
[29:47] Speaker 8: entitlements over hard working Australians who are watching all of
[29:50] Speaker 8: this play out over the last week and feeling disgusted.
[29:54] Speaker 8: It is repulsive and that reunion entitlement should be scrapped.
[29:58] Speaker 8: If you want to spare and more time with your family,
[30:02] Speaker 8: pay for it out of your own pocket or get
[30:04] Speaker 8: another job.
[30:04] Speaker 4: It's as simple as that.
[30:06] Speaker 8: I'm tired of the boohooing that goes across both aisles
[30:09] Speaker 8: of politics that suggest that your time with your family
[30:12] Speaker 8: matters more than Australians who are confronting serious situations and
[30:16] Speaker 8: barely seeing their kids who are being raised by childcare centers.
[30:19] Speaker 3: Enough is enough. It's disgusting.
[30:21] Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean my thing to Stephen is and of
[30:23] Speaker 2: course you're correct, right, And I know somebody somewhere the
[30:26] Speaker 2: adage which is, you know, if you ask people what
[30:27] Speaker 2: should politicians be paid, it's like they should be paying us.
[30:30] Speaker 1: I get all of that, right, but I.
[30:32] Speaker 2: Think the part of the granular stuff that annoys, right,
[30:35] Speaker 2: apart from everything that loose you said, of which I
[30:37] Speaker 2: would largely agree with, is that people like Anika Welds
[30:40] Speaker 2: and Anica Wells specifically, it's paid hundreds of thousands of
[30:43] Speaker 2: dollars in that it's not like, well, all of this
[30:46] Speaker 2: stuff is.
[30:47] Speaker 1: Generous because the pay is garbage.
[30:49] Speaker 2: The pay is pretty damn good, and it's guaranteed for
[30:52] Speaker 2: three years, something that even you know, a hard working
[30:56] Speaker 2: small business person couldn't guarantee that they would have for
[30:59] Speaker 2: the next three is to me, it's just it's it's
[31:01] Speaker 2: again just one of these little kicks in the ars
[31:03] Speaker 2: that collectively, those of us with a comfortable life collectively
[31:07] Speaker 2: may need to be reminded about for those who who
[31:10] Speaker 2: do not have a comfortable life, what entitlement means.
[31:18] Speaker 10: Well, it is always simple to try and say politicians
[31:21] Speaker 10: are overpaid, and you've just again made that point. You know,
[31:24] Speaker 10: hundreds of thousands of dollars and after tax.
[31:27] Speaker 1: I didn't say that half that okay, so let's I'm
[31:30] Speaker 1: aware of that.
[31:31] Speaker 10: So they paid hundreds of thousands of dollars system.
[31:34] Speaker 2: But I'm saying this is that we've got all this
[31:37] Speaker 2: extra stuff, all this extra stuff, but the extra stuff
[31:40] Speaker 2: is not paid.
[31:40] Speaker 1: For by other people. It's paid for by the same
[31:43] Speaker 1: people who pay them the hundreds of grant. That's my point.
[31:49] Speaker 10: As I said, the family reunion system is designed now
[31:54] Speaker 10: Lucy will disagree and she'll say it's outrageous and not
[31:57] Speaker 10: everyone can do this. Therefore, now we should be able
[31:59] Speaker 10: to do this, and that's not something that I think
[32:03] Speaker 10: is a reasonable Is your time.
[32:04] Speaker 8: Your family more view than others in this country? Though,
[32:08] Speaker 8: Let's get to the crux of it. Why are you
[32:10] Speaker 8: more entitled as politicians to spend time with your family
[32:13] Speaker 8: and benefit from this scheme than other hard working Australians.
[32:18] Speaker 8: Why just answer that simple question.
[32:23] Speaker 10: Each job has a different I'm talking about across the
[32:26] Speaker 10: broad economy. Each job has a different set of pressures
[32:31] Speaker 10: and challenges, and in politics, time away from your family
[32:36] Speaker 10: is one of the most significant. You just got to
[32:38] Speaker 10: look at the number of marriage breakdowns proportionally, it's one
[32:41] Speaker 10: of the highest, one of the highest in occupations. And
[32:46] Speaker 10: so these are things that are there to try and
[32:48] Speaker 10: help and allow, you know, perhaps less marriages to break down,
[32:53] Speaker 10: so limited.
[32:56] Speaker 8: Tax payers to take responsibility to your marriage.
[32:59] Speaker 3: Give me a break. There's no caps.
[33:01] Speaker 2: That's part of the system too. There's no caps, there's
[33:03] Speaker 2: no sort of rules. There's no difference between one hundred
[33:06] Speaker 2: dollars at the cafe and a thousand bucks in a
[33:09] Speaker 2: Paris restaurant. Again, and then and then she had the
[33:14] Speaker 2: ball Stephen during the federal election campaign to Lambaston have
[33:18] Speaker 2: her go at that liberal policy which they made up
[33:20] Speaker 2: as our twenty thousand dollars lunches and cigar smoking bosses.
[33:24] Speaker 2: You and I both know that was for small business
[33:27] Speaker 2: people like a hairdresser who might want to take out
[33:31] Speaker 2: a hairdress to take out one of her main customers
[33:34] Speaker 2: to the pub for one hundred dollars. She had the
[33:37] Speaker 2: balls while she's wrecking the cash up. That's what gets
[33:41] Speaker 2: me all fired up. Which is like a pick the
[33:43] Speaker 2: lane here, which is taking the piece and which is
[33:46] Speaker 2: completely inceptible and loving pay.
[33:50] Speaker 3: We have to make a distinction. Also.
[33:52] Speaker 8: That's very important to acknowledge here because I know that
[33:54] Speaker 8: the Prime Minister was very much on the pr traal
[33:57] Speaker 8: of trying to justify all of this saying, you know.
[33:59] Speaker 3: She works very hard.
[34:00] Speaker 8: It was all within its means and people might be
[34:02] Speaker 8: shocked I'm paraphrasing slightly, but people might be shocked to
[34:05] Speaker 8: learn that she but might be shocked to learn that
[34:08] Speaker 8: she attends sporting events. No one is shocked to learn
[34:11] Speaker 8: that she attends sporting events. We are all very aware
[34:14] Speaker 8: of this as the sports ministers she's required to be
[34:17] Speaker 8: at these events. It's the circumstances surrounding said events. It's
[34:22] Speaker 8: taking your husband along on the taxpayer's dime. It's going
[34:25] Speaker 8: and spending at the paras Olympic and para Olympic and
[34:28] Speaker 8: Paralympic Games, spending two thousand dollars on dinner, and then
[34:32] Speaker 8: turning around to say, as form some form of justification
[34:35] Speaker 8: that it's because I work really hard, so is everybody else,
[34:38] Speaker 8: But they're not going out and spending two thousand dollars
[34:40] Speaker 8: at dinner. So it's just this level of ignorance and
[34:44] Speaker 8: arrogance to just put.
[34:45] Speaker 1: Your hands up and say it's wrong.
[34:47] Speaker 3: It's not.
[34:48] Speaker 1: Give me the bumper, sticky, Steven, just say it.
[34:53] Speaker 10: You can rant, you can rant all your life, rating
[34:57] Speaker 10: but what we're yes, it was what you're again, just
[35:01] Speaker 10: making the risk, trying to pretend went trying to pay,
[35:06] Speaker 10: trying to pretend that Anika went out and just notched
[35:10] Speaker 10: up in Paris by herself. There was a group We're not.
[35:13] Speaker 3: No, we're not, we're not.
[35:15] Speaker 1: No.
[35:15] Speaker 3: No one's suggesting two thousand dollars herself. No one's saying that.
[35:19] Speaker 4: Though.
[35:19] Speaker 3: Stephens then have a more realistic discussion, the fact that
[35:24] Speaker 3: it was still spent when you go to.
[35:26] Speaker 10: Are you going what you're deliberately doing.
[35:29] Speaker 8: Two thousand dollars or are you going to go to
[35:31] Speaker 8: a more modest restaurant?
[35:32] Speaker 2: You pay your and you go Dutch with the five
[35:34] Speaker 2: people standing around the table, God forbid.
[35:40] Speaker 10: Well, you don't know who the other people around the
[35:42] Speaker 10: table work. They might have been stuff, they might have
[35:44] Speaker 10: been official from the department, they might have been other
[35:47] Speaker 10: I know, I'm still saying I don't know. Okay, if you're.
[35:51] Speaker 8: Suggesting the Australian ambassador, she said it was a department
[35:55] Speaker 8: person and a staffer.
[35:57] Speaker 1: All right, finish this off, is Sleephen, because I do
[35:59] Speaker 1: want to move to something.
[36:00] Speaker 10: So there were four of them, So four of them,
[36:02] Speaker 10: so that's what five hundred dollars each?
[36:05] Speaker 6: Is that.
[36:07] Speaker 1: Still more?
[36:09] Speaker 6: Just stopped.
[36:09] Speaker 3: It's indefensible. My gosh, have you all no shame?
[36:14] Speaker 4: Seriously?
[36:15] Speaker 8: I respect you a lot, Stephen, But the fact that
[36:17] Speaker 8: there are politicians.
[36:18] Speaker 3: Defending this, it's gross. It's so foul.
[36:21] Speaker 2: Let's jump over to the Labour Party starting to work
[36:25] Speaker 2: out their next target, and that of course is Andrew Hasty.
[36:28] Speaker 1: It's almost like I had warned that this could.
[36:30] Speaker 2: Potentially be one about how arguments in and around migration
[36:34] Speaker 2: have been discussed.
[36:35] Speaker 1: Now, of course disgraceful to describe.
[36:37] Speaker 2: Them as liberal extremist antipas raar on immigrants all bullshit.
[36:41] Speaker 2: But if you open the door with some of that
[36:43] Speaker 2: sort of oh, how the country's changing stuff, well, this
[36:46] Speaker 2: is how it is intentionally weaponized. They've used this from Facebook,
[36:50] Speaker 2: where he allegedly says Labour's immigration crisis means workers we
[36:54] Speaker 2: rely on can't afford to live here anymore.
[36:56] Speaker 1: Jeez, what an extremist.
[36:57] Speaker 2: Position, nurse's, teachers, urgency responders of being priced out of
[37:01] Speaker 2: perth rentals, leaving our families and frontline services under strained. Geez,
[37:06] Speaker 2: scandalous an extremist. Labor promised action on the lentil crisis
[37:09] Speaker 2: but delivered nothing. What an extremist the failure in driving
[37:15] Speaker 2: driving essential workers out and putting communities at risk.
[37:19] Speaker 1: Well again, what's extremist here?
[37:21] Speaker 2: We need action to keep our community strong and stop
[37:23] Speaker 2: essential services from collapsing.
[37:25] Speaker 1: Stephen.
[37:27] Speaker 2: We can all take an egg beater the things, but
[37:30] Speaker 2: how does one risk what he said, as.
[37:33] Speaker 10: I've just spent five minutes listen, just some egg beaters
[37:36] Speaker 10: just listened to five minutes of beating.
[37:38] Speaker 8: And were defending embarrassing spending.
[37:41] Speaker 3: All right, just admit it, just say it's fast.
[37:44] Speaker 1: You both try to get the last word.
[37:47] Speaker 3: Hey, he started, I technically we do, we do? Go
[37:52] Speaker 3: on beata away.
[37:56] Speaker 1: I am.
[37:57] Speaker 10: I am a huge fan of Andrew Hasty. I think
[37:59] Speaker 10: he's a man of great integrity. I think he's a
[38:01] Speaker 10: man of extraordinary service to our country. But I think
[38:05] Speaker 10: he's also a little bit now. I just think he's inexperienced.
[38:09] Speaker 10: He is he, as you said, has decided to talk
[38:12] Speaker 10: about the immigration issue, and he's been i'd probably say
[38:16] Speaker 10: a little blunt. And I think he's let himself down
[38:21] Speaker 10: by using some language that, when you dissect it and
[38:24] Speaker 10: you pull together, is absolutely consistent with what has has
[38:28] Speaker 10: been portrayed. So I think Andrew's left himself open to
[38:32] Speaker 10: a punch on the nose.
[38:36] Speaker 8: Said inflammatory language, though, like what about that suggested to
[38:40] Speaker 8: you that the any kind of racist?
[38:42] Speaker 10: It is completely miss I haven't used the word racist
[38:47] Speaker 10: alluding toclamatory. I utterly, I utterly reject that there is
[38:54] Speaker 10: some massive link between prices of rents and prices of housing,
[38:59] Speaker 10: as you and Andrew are trying to assert and.
[39:04] Speaker 3: On the way down, that's the same.
[39:06] Speaker 1: That's exactly what the point is. He is correct.
[39:09] Speaker 10: It is such supply and demand. It's been thirty years
[39:12] Speaker 10: of federal and state governments of all political persuasions failing
[39:17] Speaker 10: to increase the number of houses being built every year.
[39:21] Speaker 10: That is the root cause of its supply and demands.
[39:25] Speaker 10: Try and then to hook on to immigration as this
[39:30] Speaker 10: is the issue that's caused. This is inflammatory, untrue and inaccurate.
[39:36] Speaker 10: That is just fact your the No, that's what Andrew,
[39:42] Speaker 10: That's what Andrew Hasty is trying to make the core
[39:44] Speaker 10: issue not the lack of building by state and federal governments,
[39:48] Speaker 10: councils blocking developed No, that's just what it is. You're
[39:53] Speaker 10: seeking to put it at the center of the immigration debates.
[39:56] Speaker 2: Again, sorry, because I was focused on the I don't
[39:58] Speaker 2: know whether you saw it or not, but okay, this
[39:59] Speaker 2: this is thing they put out right. People may read that,
[40:02] Speaker 2: definitely read that. Couldn't be bothered reading the fine print. Right,
[40:06] Speaker 2: that's the whole point, which is just about throw enough
[40:08] Speaker 2: of it at the walls.
[40:09] Speaker 8: Just like when they said the nuclear was going to
[40:11] Speaker 8: cost six billion dollars, it was.
[40:13] Speaker 1: Under threat yes, all right, thank you. We're done. We're done.
[40:16] Speaker 1: We're done.
[40:17] Speaker 2: I love you both. We're done, all right, thank you.
[40:19] Speaker 2: We didn't even get a chance to work football, and
[40:21] Speaker 2: I really wanted to do that.
[40:22] Speaker 3: Next week, next time, all.
[40:23] Speaker 1: Right, see you guys.
[40:24] Speaker 2: Philip Thompson he joins us next, A man who definitely
[40:26] Speaker 2: cares about our veterans community. But does the government or
[40:29] Speaker 2: do they just put out press releases answers? Next, Thank
[40:36] Speaker 2: you so much for watching. Now I'm going to do
[40:38] Speaker 2: something dangerous, follow up on something that has already been
[40:42] Speaker 2: in the news now generally speaking, of course, the way
[40:44] Speaker 2: the government works is they like to change the topic
[40:46] Speaker 2: as many times as possible, so eventually you forget something
[40:49] Speaker 2: from a week or a month or a year ago.
[40:52] Speaker 2: Let's get back to this. There was a Royal commission
[40:56] Speaker 2: into veteran suicide. Was one hundred and twenty two recommendations
[41:03] Speaker 2: that were made. We have a government that says they'll
[41:08] Speaker 2: do some maybe not others, but then we never really
[41:11] Speaker 2: get any detail of what they've actually done. Philip Thompson is,
[41:15] Speaker 2: of course, a man who is part of the defense
[41:17] Speaker 2: team for the federal opposition. I remember a couple of
[41:21] Speaker 2: weeks ago. I offered the opportunity of the Veterans Affairs
[41:23] Speaker 2: Minister to come and join us apparently overseas well, maybe
[41:27] Speaker 2: link up at some other time. But Philip, I wanted
[41:30] Speaker 2: to talk to you, mate about and again I'm not
[41:32] Speaker 2: going to go through one hundred and twenty two points
[41:34] Speaker 2: and have they or haven't they? But do you know
[41:37] Speaker 2: much detail about their response to one hundred and twenty
[41:40] Speaker 2: two recommendations other than press releases?
[41:46] Speaker 6: Well, Paul, thank you for having me on.
[41:49] Speaker 11: Yeah, I know about as much as the general public,
[41:54] Speaker 11: about as much as pretty much what the government knows,
[41:57] Speaker 11: which is not much.
[41:59] Speaker 6: Mate.
[42:00] Speaker 11: It's sad because the Opposition wants to work with the
[42:05] Speaker 11: government to make sure the recommendations of the Royal Commission
[42:08] Speaker 11: are implemented so that our brave men and women can get.
[42:11] Speaker 6: The best support that they deserve. That's it that here.
[42:15] Speaker 11: We want to work with the government. The problem is
[42:19] Speaker 11: the government. It's not their focal point, it's not what
[42:21] Speaker 11: they want to focus on. We've seen a recommendation in
[42:24] Speaker 11: the Royal Commission that veteran hubs are integral to making
[42:28] Speaker 11: sure that veterans and their families get the support that
[42:31] Speaker 11: they need. Well, Townsville's veteran hub called the Oasis is
[42:35] Speaker 11: closing its doors.
[42:36] Speaker 1: Wow.
[42:37] Speaker 11: This whole year they've been writing to the Minister wanting
[42:41] Speaker 11: to get the support, and you know what, they just
[42:43] Speaker 11: wanted the Minister to engage and go how can we
[42:46] Speaker 11: best work with you to support the largest garrison city
[42:49] Speaker 11: in the country, the largest veteran cohort in the country.
[42:54] Speaker 11: And nothing happened. So now the one stop shop for
[42:58] Speaker 11: veterans and their families is going to Now that's leading
[43:01] Speaker 11: to Christmas. Things are tough. People are going to be
[43:05] Speaker 11: needing the supports and they're going to have nowhere to turn.
[43:08] Speaker 11: And the Minister at a I think it was at
[43:11] Speaker 11: a presser or the press club or something like that,
[43:15] Speaker 11: he said, oh, well there's other options. Yeah, well mate,
[43:19] Speaker 11: there is no other option when you're in a time
[43:22] Speaker 11: when you need the support and you only know of
[43:24] Speaker 11: the one place that has all the supports. So I'm
[43:27] Speaker 11: really disappointed in Matt Keyo.
[43:28] Speaker 6: I'm really disappointed Luke Gosling, who.
[43:31] Speaker 11: Is a veteran himself and is the Special Envoy, but
[43:34] Speaker 11: most importantly the Prime Minister, because he wanted to spriak
[43:41] Speaker 11: the Royal Commission in opposition. When I spoke with you
[43:43] Speaker 11: about it, I walked in against my party.
[43:46] Speaker 6: We must have it, and we got it.
[43:49] Speaker 11: And then you know, they want to run to a
[43:51] Speaker 11: veteran on Anzac Day or rememberance, stay and get a
[43:53] Speaker 11: photo for the social media.
[43:54] Speaker 6: But when Rubin needs hit the road, they're not here.
[43:59] Speaker 2: But also I think that it speaks to again the
[44:03] Speaker 2: moments where we have to go back to scenarios where
[44:07] Speaker 2: you know, in question time, in sitting weeks, sometimes they're
[44:11] Speaker 2: you know, I know all those people sitting up in
[44:13] Speaker 2: the media decide what gets the attention, but certainly to
[44:16] Speaker 2: try to hold them to some level of account, right,
[44:19] Speaker 2: like the details that you've just put forward there about
[44:21] Speaker 2: at Townsville and that Veterans Hub again, I mean, you
[44:24] Speaker 2: know this couldn't be clearer, right. Royal Commission says keep them.
[44:28] Speaker 2: They say we're doing everything we can. About the Royal
[44:30] Speaker 2: Commission and the one hundred and twenty two suggestions on
[44:33] Speaker 2: the ground inner city where there's plenty of people serving
[44:35] Speaker 2: and plenty of people who formerly served, that support just
[44:38] Speaker 2: falls through the floor. And again inside the attitude and
[44:44] Speaker 2: the battle towards things like that the Veterans Department all
[44:50] Speaker 2: of that needs to be dealt with, but it just
[44:52] Speaker 2: seems like there's no urgency, there's no follow up. There's
[44:55] Speaker 2: a speech every now and then, you try to get
[44:57] Speaker 2: a bit of information and it just into the same
[45:01] Speaker 2: dark hole, which is kind of how we ended up
[45:03] Speaker 2: in the scenario of needing a royal commission.
[45:09] Speaker 11: Nothing's improved, and I want to be extremely clear on
[45:14] Speaker 11: that nothing has improved for the welfare and well being
[45:17] Speaker 11: of our veterans and their families. Smoke and mirrors saying
[45:21] Speaker 11: that all these things have occurred, they have not. People
[45:24] Speaker 11: are doing it tough, and our veterans the one that
[45:28] Speaker 11: they're the people that we call on when in service
[45:31] Speaker 11: to go and fight in our wars, and they should
[45:33] Speaker 11: be supported when they come home.
[45:35] Speaker 6: And their families heard.
[45:37] Speaker 11: A lot of platitudes, heard a lot of well wishes
[45:40] Speaker 11: from the opposition now government, and now they're sitting there
[45:44] Speaker 11: with their hands wide open, going you promised, you said
[45:48] Speaker 11: you'd help, you said you'd support, and nothing has occurred.
[45:51] Speaker 6: It's been a failure. And I think.
[45:53] Speaker 11: I've said to you before, I take every single self
[45:58] Speaker 11: harm attempt or suicide has occurred in our community as
[46:01] Speaker 11: a personal failure, but as a failure of every single
[46:04] Speaker 11: politician who has not stood up and said this government
[46:08] Speaker 11: needs to pull their finger out and actually start doing
[46:10] Speaker 11: what they promised.
[46:11] Speaker 1: Yeah, because Phil, I mean, that's such a powerful thing
[46:13] Speaker 1: to say. But also what.
[46:14] Speaker 2: Frightens me here is that if we continue to let
[46:17] Speaker 2: people down, then they don't even trust that help is coming.
[46:23] Speaker 11: It's true, they don't trust that the people that sent
[46:27] Speaker 11: them will support them. They don't trust that the wrap
[46:30] Speaker 11: around services will be there because they're being canceled or
[46:33] Speaker 11: they're not being supported, and they go away, then when do
[46:35] Speaker 11: they come back? And then you have a government and
[46:39] Speaker 11: opposition that say we want more people to join, but
[46:43] Speaker 11: people don't want to join if they're not going to
[46:44] Speaker 11: get the support, if their families aren't going to get
[46:47] Speaker 11: that support. So I think it's a massive failure and
[46:50] Speaker 11: it crushes my heart. And the reason I really wanted
[46:52] Speaker 11: to come on tonight, not just to be on the
[46:54] Speaker 11: show with you, mate, is because people of Australia need
[46:57] Speaker 11: to hear this. They need to know that the government
[46:59] Speaker 11: isn't just failing, they are letting down the people that
[47:03] Speaker 11: support this nation and fight for it.
[47:05] Speaker 2: Well, we love your mate, all the best to you.
[47:07] Speaker 2: And your family, the wider community in Townsvior. It's a
[47:09] Speaker 2: very special part of Australia. You're always great to us
[47:12] Speaker 2: and any time to chat. You know how much I
[47:14] Speaker 2: enjoy it. Thank you so much mate, Thanks brother, all right,
[47:18] Speaker 2: Philip Thomas Tom slishould say, of course is a bloke
[47:20] Speaker 2: who's got his heart in the right place. He's head
[47:22] Speaker 2: in the right place. That is the type of person
[47:23] Speaker 2: you want in your federal Parliament right. Oh that I
[47:26] Speaker 2: work very hard, says the Minister for freebiees Fedich. Wouldn't
[47:30] Speaker 2: you love to see him sitting around a cabinet table
[47:32] Speaker 2: one day? May it happen, and happen sooner rather than
[47:34] Speaker 2: laterqu break back with more here in Paul Murray Live.
[47:36] Speaker 2: Thanks for watching it always send me an email all
[47:37] Speaker 2: at sky news dot com dot you about five minutes
[47:41] Speaker 2: away from the late debate and may I too to
[47:48] Speaker 2: the horn ever so slightly about the achievements of some
[47:51] Speaker 2: hard working people behind the scenes here at sky News.
[47:54] Speaker 2: Of course, you know I always talk about sky News dot
[47:56] Speaker 2: com dot au. Will A big part of our digital
[47:59] Speaker 2: prison is the world of YouTube and the people who
[48:03] Speaker 2: have been working so hard on man have got a
[48:06] Speaker 2: little bit of recognition this week, and done to Steve
[48:08] Speaker 2: Jackson for writing about it and recognizing. Of course, this
[48:10] Speaker 2: is the plan of our boss and I will gladly
[48:13] Speaker 2: say well under him on this our dear friend and
[48:16] Speaker 2: leader of course, Paul Whittaker.
[48:18] Speaker 1: Right.
[48:18] Speaker 2: Australia's and one of the world's most watched channels is
[48:21] Speaker 2: sky News. Why because there's six million people who follow
[48:24] Speaker 2: us on YouTube seven billion, seven billion views. To Tim Love,
[48:30] Speaker 2: to Jack Harton and again to our boss, well done,
[48:34] Speaker 2: Well done to everyone who works on it. I remember
[48:37] Speaker 2: the homepage today every day sky news dot com.
[48:41] Speaker 1: Dot au Ford slash subscribe.
[48:43] Speaker 2: You may find may face every now and then, both
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[48:48] Speaker 1: Make sure you see it and make sure you send
[48:50] Speaker 1: it around. See tomorrow

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