# Paul Murray Live | 18 June

An episode of [Paul Murray Live](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/376966263), 18 Jun 2026, 49 min.

Audio: https://p.podderapp.com/2544644999/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/2fb3740d-3436-44af-8cc0-a91900716aa5/be3abd48-25e5-45a6-aede-ac2a00524a12/0ec35e1a-c63b-4e17-b313-b46d00d36d57/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=95971714-8fe6-4855-b1fe-ac2a00524a12

The government announces a CGT carve-out, dissecting Pauline Hanson's National Press Club address. Plus, the quality of education is declining in Victoria. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:00] Speaker 1: From the sky New Centers is Paul Murray Live. Thank
[0:06] Speaker 1: you callen, great job this week.
[0:08] Speaker 2: The vibes are high because it's Thursday and we've got
[0:10] Speaker 2: an awful lot to do tonight here on Paul Murray Live.
[0:13] Speaker 1: Now, there's been a void at.
[0:16] Speaker 2: The heart of Australian sport for too long now. And
[0:19] Speaker 2: it doesn't matter whether it's the soccer us that are
[0:21] Speaker 2: currently playing in the World Cup in the United States,
[0:24] Speaker 2: a summer of cricket of course against the English an
[0:28] Speaker 2: AFL season that feels slightly empty compared to previous ones.
[0:32] Speaker 1: And why could that be? Why would that be? Oh,
[0:36] Speaker 1: that's right.
[0:36] Speaker 2: Because the Minister for Freebies, the Minister for Sport, future
[0:40] Speaker 2: Prime Minister, Anika Wells, has been missing because as you know,
[0:46] Speaker 2: she likes a little freebie. She loves a bit of
[0:49] Speaker 2: that paid for travel. She loved boasting about the fun
[0:54] Speaker 2: times she was having on the taxpayer dollar. Well because
[0:58] Speaker 2: she's learned her lesson and because there's a new standard
[1:03] Speaker 2: and remember this is three scandals ago for the government,
[1:07] Speaker 2: but she sort.
[1:08] Speaker 1: Of stayed away from things.
[1:10] Speaker 2: But I'm pleased to say all is normal with austraight
[1:12] Speaker 2: in sport again because last night. While millions of people
[1:15] Speaker 2: around the country were watching Queensland absolutely rip apart the Blues.
[1:20] Speaker 2: There was somebody who was at the ground, our old
[1:25] Speaker 2: Madanika Wells. There she was, the Minister for Sport, the
[1:27] Speaker 2: Minister for freebies, back doing what she does best, being
[1:32] Speaker 2: a guest of There she is with the Prime Minister. Now,
[1:35] Speaker 2: could Anaker have waited for the third and more consequential
[1:38] Speaker 2: game in her hometown. Yeah, of course, but you know
[1:40] Speaker 2: she's got to fly to Melbourne, right, it's important sportsmen,
[1:42] Speaker 2: there's sports ministry stuff to be done here. And remember
[1:47] Speaker 2: she did absolutely nothing wrong. It was all just a
[1:50] Speaker 2: giant beat up. Oh yeah, apart from when she had
[1:53] Speaker 2: to pay back ten thousand dollars because her husband was
[1:58] Speaker 2: riding around on the taxpayer doll And then there's still
[2:02] Speaker 2: a question which the government hopes you've forgotten about, but
[2:05] Speaker 2: we haven't, of a fairly questionable use of taxpayers money
[2:11] Speaker 2: when she went to South Australia and she claimed she
[2:14] Speaker 2: had a face to face meeting with a labor minister.
[2:19] Speaker 1: She says that she.
[2:20] Speaker 2: Stands by her account of a taxpayer funded trip to Adelaide,
[2:23] Speaker 2: not for a fortieth birthday party.
[2:25] Speaker 1: Come on that would be just offensive.
[2:26] Speaker 2: It said she had a side meeting with there South
[2:29] Speaker 2: Australian labor minister who confirmed that he met the Communications
[2:32] Speaker 2: Minister on the night of his wife's birthday party.
[2:37] Speaker 1: So exactly where did this take place?
[2:40] Speaker 2: Because you would have thought that if there was a
[2:42] Speaker 2: photo of their meetings, say in the minister's office, there'd
[2:45] Speaker 2: be a photo of that. If there was a meeting
[2:47] Speaker 2: that was happening in a conference center somewhere, there'd be
[2:49] Speaker 2: a photo of that.
[2:50] Speaker 1: But it just so.
[2:51] Speaker 2: Happens the taxpayer funding was completely okay because there was
[2:55] Speaker 2: this meeting. Just where did the meeting happen? Now, thankfully
[2:59] Speaker 2: there had been questions that had been asked publicly that
[3:01] Speaker 2: if it wasn't held at an office, and it wasn't
[3:03] Speaker 2: held at a hotel, and it wasn't held at a
[3:05] Speaker 2: conference center, is there a chance that maybe they rented
[3:08] Speaker 2: out one of the rooms at the place where the
[3:10] Speaker 2: fortieth birthday party was taking place. Again, still no answers,
[3:14] Speaker 2: but the question still stands in which room.
[3:18] Speaker 3: At the live music venue the jade did the minister
[3:22] Speaker 3: hold her quote sideline meeting while at the fortieth birthday
[3:26] Speaker 3: party of her close personal friend, the bar, the garden,
[3:31] Speaker 3: kiosk or the room with the pinball machine.
[3:34] Speaker 1: Good quest.
[3:36] Speaker 2: Now, all I know is that if you ask the
[3:38] Speaker 2: Minister for freebie, who now is back on it? And
[3:41] Speaker 2: thank goodness, Australian sport would be a total failure without
[3:44] Speaker 2: her sitting up in the box. Because remember, this future
[3:50] Speaker 2: prime Minister has done nothing wrong.
[3:54] Speaker 3: I'm about it by the rules the whole time I've
[3:55] Speaker 3: been follow the rules, follow the rules.
[3:59] Speaker 4: Fo I have followed the rules, followed the.
[4:01] Speaker 3: Guideline so far.
[4:03] Speaker 1: Sure you have now?
[4:05] Speaker 2: Of course the budget, Well, it's been a problem for
[4:07] Speaker 2: the government for multiple weeks, even though their whole bet
[4:10] Speaker 2: was everyone had be annoyed about it maybe Tuesday night
[4:12] Speaker 2: they'd worked out by Wednesday then it's all about attacking
[4:14] Speaker 2: the opposition on the Thursday. Problem is people could see
[4:17] Speaker 2: this for what it was. It jumped outside of the
[4:18] Speaker 2: normal political bubble and you know the problems were because
[4:23] Speaker 2: they lied. You remember the lies of these people before
[4:27] Speaker 2: the last election. Can you rule out any changes to
[4:31] Speaker 2: negative gearing and capital gains?
[4:33] Speaker 1: Taxt?
[4:34] Speaker 5: How hard is it for the fiftieth time?
[4:37] Speaker 1: I rull out?
[4:38] Speaker 5: Really, I have responded to that lots of time.
[4:43] Speaker 6: Gearing and property taxes this too on East.
[4:45] Speaker 5: Well, what we're doing is doing the legislation that we
[4:49] Speaker 5: had before the Senate, So I talk about what we're doing, not.
[4:53] Speaker 2: What we're not doing.
[4:54] Speaker 5: I told people we wouldn't make changes the proofs in
[4:57] Speaker 5: the putting.
[4:57] Speaker 1: Andrew negative gearing is off the Yeah.
[5:01] Speaker 4: It's off the table.
[5:03] Speaker 2: But then, of course it happened anyway, because you know
[5:05] Speaker 2: that pesky idea of telling people what you're going to
[5:08] Speaker 2: do before you go around and do it. Well, the
[5:10] Speaker 2: last time it didn't quite work out. But remember the
[5:12] Speaker 2: lie about the lie is that they never lied.
[5:16] Speaker 5: This is a change in our policy.
[5:18] Speaker 6: When you say you changed your position, is that a
[5:20] Speaker 6: concession that you lied?
[5:24] Speaker 5: A't a statement of fact that we have changed our position?
[5:29] Speaker 5: Changing our position?
[5:31] Speaker 1: I'm convinced.
[5:32] Speaker 2: Well, of course, then the people of Australia got their say,
[5:35] Speaker 2: and well, thankfully from the government's perspective, it wasn't at
[5:38] Speaker 2: an election because if it was an election, they would
[5:41] Speaker 2: have lost the worst budget in terms of popularity since
[5:44] Speaker 2: nineteen ninety three. But then the government, of course, well
[5:50] Speaker 2: they didn't quite accept the will of the people because
[5:52] Speaker 2: remember what the Prime Minister said about anyone who had
[5:55] Speaker 2: a problem with this budget.
[5:58] Speaker 5: I think there are a campaigns being run from the
[6:02] Speaker 5: right wing parties and their allies to distort some of
[6:08] Speaker 5: what's being offered.
[6:09] Speaker 2: And this attempt to gaslight anyone who had a problem
[6:13] Speaker 2: with the government suddenly taking a whole lot more of
[6:15] Speaker 2: their business or trying to.
[6:18] Speaker 7: Are you hoping for a happier response?
[6:20] Speaker 1: No, this was about what I expected.
[6:22] Speaker 8: When it comes to the voices of the status quo,
[6:27] Speaker 8: it's not it's Jim.
[6:28] Speaker 7: It's not just the voices of the status quo. It's
[6:31] Speaker 7: young people today suffering. It's investors saying this country is
[6:36] Speaker 7: no longer worth investing in. You know, there's no point
[6:39] Speaker 7: in going into a high risk, high return business because
[6:43] Speaker 7: there's no incentive.
[6:44] Speaker 8: You need to be careful where you get your news from.
[6:47] Speaker 2: You see, because if you actually talk to the people
[6:50] Speaker 2: who are complaining about it, somehow they've been affected by
[6:52] Speaker 2: the evil for the evil forces of the status quo.
[6:56] Speaker 2: And then remember they said that anyone who had a
[6:58] Speaker 2: problem with this, well, of course it was sexism. Right.
[7:01] Speaker 9: Does anyone else find it weird that a whole bunch
[7:04] Speaker 9: of internet finance bros Are suddenly concerned about renters. So
[7:08] Speaker 9: when you see a video from a finance bro defending these.
[7:10] Speaker 3: Tax concessions, it's worth thinking about what they stand to gain.
[7:15] Speaker 2: Despite the fact that many of the people who had
[7:16] Speaker 2: a problem with the budget not quite finance bros, certainly
[7:20] Speaker 2: not tech bros. And so how do I read this
[7:23] Speaker 2: fee male is that a tech broke female business founders
[7:27] Speaker 2: lash the capital gains changes in Labour's controversial budget the
[7:30] Speaker 2: least popular since nineteen ninety three. Well, today was the backflip.
[7:36] Speaker 2: Today was the backdown. Now they're still going to make
[7:39] Speaker 2: the changes to negative gearing. That means people like Anthony Albersi,
[7:42] Speaker 2: he's set up for life, but you won't be able
[7:44] Speaker 2: to do it if you haven't already done it. Your
[7:46] Speaker 2: kids definitely won't be able to do it because hey, hey, hey,
[7:49] Speaker 2: we need to balance out the market. It's only Anthony
[7:51] Speaker 2: Alpinisi who was allowed to turn his meager, meager salary
[7:57] Speaker 2: that he has earned every day of his life life
[8:00] Speaker 2: since becoming a politician in nineteen ninety six and working
[8:04] Speaker 2: for the federal government or the Labor Party since the
[8:07] Speaker 2: early eighties. Because we're leveling the playing field here. Of course,
[8:12] Speaker 2: the problem is people and their ability to be able
[8:15] Speaker 2: to save for the deposit to buy the house, let alone,
[8:18] Speaker 2: to then also have the money for the stamp duty,
[8:20] Speaker 2: which whatever we're leveling the planing for you. So today
[8:24] Speaker 2: there has been a change, but at the heart of
[8:27] Speaker 2: the change there is.
[8:28] Speaker 1: A little problem.
[8:29] Speaker 2: I'll let our reporter Reuben Spargo explain from Canberra, and
[8:33] Speaker 2: then I'll point out the bit that a few aren't
[8:37] Speaker 2: talking about.
[8:38] Speaker 4: The turnover threshold for small businesses will increase from two
[8:42] Speaker 4: million dollars to ten million dollars. Labor will remove what
[8:45] Speaker 4: opponents labeled a death tax by stealth. It's also consulting
[8:50] Speaker 4: on changes for startups.
[8:52] Speaker 2: Now I want to get back in the way back machine.
[8:54] Speaker 2: Let's go thirty years back in my mind, maybe a
[8:56] Speaker 2: little earlier, maybe a little later. When it's you, I'm
[8:59] Speaker 2: going to go back to you. Eight economics. There is
[9:02] Speaker 2: a difference between turnover i e. How much money comes
[9:06] Speaker 2: through the cash register and profit, how much is left
[9:10] Speaker 2: over after you have created what you are selling, put
[9:16] Speaker 2: the labor into what you are installing, paid for the
[9:20] Speaker 2: rent or the employees or the superannuation.
[9:23] Speaker 1: And profit is the.
[9:25] Speaker 2: Bit that you get hit on when it comes to
[9:27] Speaker 2: things like company tax. Turnover could be a scenario where okay,
[9:33] Speaker 2: you might have on one set of figures five million
[9:37] Speaker 2: bucks that the business comes in and out, in and out,
[9:40] Speaker 2: in and out, but once you paid all the bills
[9:43] Speaker 2: one hundred thousand bucks, maybe a little more, maybe a little.
[9:46] Speaker 1: Less, that's what's left.
[9:48] Speaker 2: The decision to frame all of this around turnover is dangerous.
[9:53] Speaker 2: It's a new version of left wing economics. It's something
[9:57] Speaker 2: that has been deployed by the Victorian government when they're
[10:00] Speaker 2: mental health Levy was charged on turnover not profit. Many
[10:06] Speaker 2: of the Greens policies are based off turnover not profit,
[10:11] Speaker 2: and there are many businesses who for a certain period
[10:13] Speaker 2: of time might have significant turnover, but they're losing money
[10:17] Speaker 2: because it costs well more than even they are taking
[10:21] Speaker 2: for all of the things that I have mentioned above,
[10:24] Speaker 2: but because they have made a change.
[10:27] Speaker 1: The Prime Minister.
[10:28] Speaker 2: Says, despite the fact that I called everyone who disagrees
[10:31] Speaker 2: with this some part of a right wing conspiracy, despite
[10:35] Speaker 2: the fact that the Treasurer questions those stories about where
[10:38] Speaker 2: they get their news from, and despite the fact that
[10:40] Speaker 2: the Housing Minister clueless, Clara O'Neil.
[10:43] Speaker 1: Said that it was all just wealthy tech bros. This
[10:47] Speaker 1: is a man who's listened.
[10:50] Speaker 5: We back Australian small businesses and the important role that
[10:54] Speaker 5: they play in Australia. They're the blood running through the
[10:57] Speaker 5: veins of our local communities and the vital for our economy.
[11:02] Speaker 5: We also back innovatives and startups and we want them
[11:06] Speaker 5: to thrive here.
[11:08] Speaker 2: This is exactly what I believe, because I am certainly
[11:11] Speaker 2: not reading that small business is the lifeblood of a
[11:15] Speaker 2: Remember his experience in small business was no nothing, early eighties.
[11:20] Speaker 2: Before he worked for the federal government, before he worked
[11:22] Speaker 2: for the Labour Party, before he became an MP, he
[11:24] Speaker 2: was a bank teller one year.
[11:26] Speaker 1: One year.
[11:28] Speaker 2: Remember, around the entire cabinet table there is two people
[11:31] Speaker 2: who claim to have small business experience. One Tony Burke,
[11:34] Speaker 2: I've never seen any proof of it, but he puts
[11:36] Speaker 2: it on his CV. The other Don Farrell, the Special
[11:39] Speaker 2: Minister of State, the Trade Minister. His small business was
[11:42] Speaker 2: when he launched a wine label in a couple of
[11:44] Speaker 2: years between his first run in the Senate and his second.
[11:46] Speaker 1: Run in the Senate. But they understand small business, they
[11:49] Speaker 1: really do. Now.
[11:51] Speaker 2: If there's supposed to be some sort of giant political
[11:54] Speaker 2: advantage here in the government being able to turn around
[11:57] Speaker 2: and say we've listened. Someone might want to tell.
[11:59] Speaker 1: The tree because the Treasurer.
[12:01] Speaker 2: Along with the Prime Minister who says even though we lied,
[12:04] Speaker 2: we didn't lie, who was telling people as late as
[12:09] Speaker 2: four days ago on sixty minutes, be careful where you
[12:12] Speaker 2: get your information from. When he's confronted today with well,
[12:15] Speaker 2: this is clearly a backdown because we saw you announce it,
[12:17] Speaker 2: we saw you debate it, we saw you argue it
[12:19] Speaker 2: even on sixty minutes last week. Well, he's now lying
[12:22] Speaker 2: about the lie and the backdown from the lie.
[12:25] Speaker 1: Here he is helping. This is this is quite a backflip,
[12:30] Speaker 1: isn't it? Not at all?
[12:31] Speaker 8: This is the outcome of the consultation that we flagged
[12:35] Speaker 8: in the budget papers themselves.
[12:38] Speaker 1: It's not a backflip.
[12:38] Speaker 2: We just announced something, gave everyone a pat on the back.
[12:41] Speaker 2: We argued, we abused, we belittled any and everyone who
[12:45] Speaker 2: disagreed with us. We even did it on sixty minutes
[12:48] Speaker 2: on Sunday of this week Sunday.
[12:51] Speaker 1: Can we bring back that grab right? This is not
[12:53] Speaker 1: from you know, we're deep in the archives. Hand I'll
[12:55] Speaker 1: go and find this one. From eight on August two
[12:58] Speaker 1: thousand and eight. This was Sunday night.
[13:02] Speaker 7: Are you hoping for a happier response?
[13:04] Speaker 8: No, this was about what I expected. When it comes
[13:07] Speaker 8: to the voices of the status quo, it's.
[13:11] Speaker 7: Not it's Jim. It's not just the voices of the
[13:14] Speaker 7: status quo. It's young people today suffering. It's investors saying
[13:19] Speaker 7: this country is no longer worth investing in. You know,
[13:22] Speaker 7: there's no point in going into a high risk, high
[13:25] Speaker 7: return business because there's no incentive.
[13:28] Speaker 8: You need to be careful where you get your news from.
[13:32] Speaker 1: Now.
[13:32] Speaker 2: Those who know way more about it than me, writing
[13:34] Speaker 2: as they usually do in the Financial Review, have said
[13:36] Speaker 2: there's still a problem at the heart of the thinking here,
[13:39] Speaker 2: even though we're moving from turnover not to profit as
[13:42] Speaker 2: a way of trying to work out just how much
[13:44] Speaker 2: of a tax state the government will take when you
[13:46] Speaker 2: sell your small business. Some rebalancing of the way wealth
[13:50] Speaker 2: and labor attacks may be warranted, but the government seems
[13:53] Speaker 2: to focus on redistributing the pie. It doesn't have any
[13:57] Speaker 2: ideas on how to grow it.
[13:59] Speaker 1: What a good idea.
[14:01] Speaker 2: We want businesses to grow, to employ more, to make
[14:04] Speaker 2: more money, Yes, to pay company tax but under the government.
[14:08] Speaker 2: Remember it's about the triangle of dependence, where they might
[14:13] Speaker 2: say that small business is the blood that runs through
[14:16] Speaker 2: the veins of the Australian economy. What they want is
[14:19] Speaker 2: a permanent majority for those who are wed to the state.
[14:25] Speaker 2: We've seen it in Victoria, they are doing it in Canberra,
[14:30] Speaker 2: where they want you to have a job that is
[14:34] Speaker 2: either to directly with the government, or they want you
[14:36] Speaker 2: to be more than half of the country that gets
[14:38] Speaker 2: more from government than they end up paying via tax.
[14:41] Speaker 2: Or of course, if you're in business, big or small,
[14:44] Speaker 2: your biggest client is the government. So as long as
[14:47] Speaker 2: we get that to fifty fifty five sixty sixty five
[14:49] Speaker 2: percent of Australia, labor never loses. Some in the Opposition
[14:55] Speaker 2: is desperate to point out and desperately hopes people want
[14:59] Speaker 2: to avoid that vortex of the triangle of dependence.
[15:04] Speaker 10: Migration in this country has been too high and the
[15:06] Speaker 10: standards have been too low, and that must change.
[15:10] Speaker 2: But who cares, Right, We're just living in elbows world
[15:12] Speaker 2: right where every decision, regardless of whether it's good or bad,
[15:16] Speaker 2: is awesome, regardless of whether it's truth or a lie,
[15:19] Speaker 2: is awesome. Whether you know by your own experience whether
[15:23] Speaker 2: he's done the right thing or the wrong thing. The
[15:25] Speaker 2: whole point is as long as Albo can say, look
[15:28] Speaker 2: what I did, then apparently it's great. What he did
[15:34] Speaker 2: was crash his own political fortunes to six out of
[15:36] Speaker 2: ten Australians not approving his job right now, a higher
[15:39] Speaker 2: number of females feeling that than men. The working class
[15:42] Speaker 2: feeling even worse than that. So, yes, there has been
[15:46] Speaker 2: a fiddle, But is it a fix. Probably not. As
[15:53] Speaker 2: for big Australia that is always getting bigger, always getting
[15:56] Speaker 2: too big.
[15:57] Speaker 1: And why do we.
[15:57] Speaker 2: Say that, Well, because, of course, so clearly problem with
[16:00] Speaker 2: the way people look and the way people dress and
[16:03] Speaker 2: what they believe rubbish. No, of course, my issue about
[16:07] Speaker 2: the size of our population is because of the difficulties,
[16:10] Speaker 2: the delays, the pressures which are put on everything from
[16:13] Speaker 2: public infrastructure like hospitals, you know, hospital waiting lists all
[16:16] Speaker 2: the way through to the need to tell people up
[16:21] Speaker 2: the yin yang because well that's the only way to
[16:23] Speaker 2: get to and from work with a car.
[16:25] Speaker 1: Right.
[16:28] Speaker 2: Well, today we've got some population numbers and I won't
[16:30] Speaker 2: bore you with the details, but just pay attention to
[16:33] Speaker 2: the colors here. This shows the growth or lack thereof
[16:37] Speaker 2: in states. Basically Tasmania no movement, nor the territory no movement,
[16:41] Speaker 2: the Act no movement, Western Australia, South Australia, Queensland, Victoria.
[16:46] Speaker 1: And New South Wales.
[16:47] Speaker 2: All of those orange bars that's overseas migration. The blue
[16:52] Speaker 2: bars are people either moving to or being born in
[16:55] Speaker 2: the state and New South Wales worst offender here. Twenty
[16:58] Speaker 2: five thousand people left Whiles in the past twelve months.
[17:01] Speaker 2: But the news is great, apparently, despite the fact that
[17:04] Speaker 2: our population has never been higher, hundreds of thousands of
[17:08] Speaker 2: people being added each and every year via net migration.
[17:12] Speaker 2: Apparently it's the best it's been since way back in
[17:16] Speaker 2: twoenty twenty two, a crazy four years ago, you know,
[17:20] Speaker 2: when the government changed and the government then kicked open
[17:25] Speaker 2: the doors. One of the reasons Australians of all types
[17:30] Speaker 2: and I mean all types are frustrated with the speed
[17:35] Speaker 2: and growth of Australia is because if you live in it,
[17:38] Speaker 2: you can see it. Let's measure it, say, thirty years
[17:42] Speaker 2: that way nine to ninety six, eighteen million people lived
[17:45] Speaker 2: in Australia. Today twenty eight million people, ten million people.
[17:50] Speaker 1: In thirty years.
[17:51] Speaker 2: Pretty big number, right, the expectation here and again it
[17:54] Speaker 2: could be a little lower, could be a little higher.
[17:56] Speaker 2: But one of the projections of the Australian Bureau Statistics
[17:58] Speaker 2: is that were on our way thirty years from now
[18:01] Speaker 2: to forty three million people.
[18:04] Speaker 1: Forty three million people.
[18:07] Speaker 2: Now, we know that every time they build a brand
[18:09] Speaker 2: new suburb or subdivide something and say oh, let's just
[18:12] Speaker 2: turn that green field into a bunch of houses, or
[18:14] Speaker 2: let's turn those bunches of houses, let's turn.
[18:16] Speaker 1: Them into units.
[18:17] Speaker 2: There's no new hospital that comes with that. You're lucky
[18:20] Speaker 2: maybe to get a school that comes with that. You
[18:24] Speaker 2: certainly don't get much improvement when it comes to public transport.
[18:27] Speaker 2: But of course governments love to give into this idea
[18:30] Speaker 2: that we need to get people away from their cars.
[18:32] Speaker 2: So there's a push on right now, particularly in places
[18:35] Speaker 2: like Melbourne and inner city Sydney, that when you build
[18:38] Speaker 2: brand new apartments you don't need to have a car
[18:39] Speaker 2: park downstairs, because you know there's a train of achually somewhere.
[18:44] Speaker 2: This sort of idea that we all sort of live
[18:46] Speaker 2: in central London as opposed to an island continent, and
[18:49] Speaker 2: God forbid, you actually have to visit your parents or
[18:51] Speaker 2: a friend because they might be half an hour away,
[18:54] Speaker 2: and even then half an hour away and maybe even
[18:57] Speaker 2: further away when it comes to public transport.
[18:59] Speaker 1: Who cares?
[19:02] Speaker 2: And the reality is is that migration and migration is
[19:06] Speaker 2: a problem. In these numbers, don't trust me. Trust this
[19:11] Speaker 2: numbers which have been put together by Macro Business leaf
[19:14] Speaker 2: our Nonsolin's outfit. And they, by the way, unlike the
[19:17] Speaker 2: numbers from the Bureau Statistics, which only go back to
[19:19] Speaker 2: twenty seventeen, you can see here that we were in
[19:22] Speaker 2: nine to eighty one living in one hundred and twenty
[19:24] Speaker 2: thousand people. In twenty twenty six it's about three hundred
[19:29] Speaker 2: thousand people. So geez, I wonder why our population keeps
[19:32] Speaker 2: getting bigger. It's because governments of all stripes, but this
[19:35] Speaker 2: one in particular, are addicted to the idea of more
[19:39] Speaker 2: people coming in. And you want more people to come
[19:41] Speaker 2: in because they come in at eighteen and over, they
[19:43] Speaker 2: immediately theoretically get or create a job and there start
[19:46] Speaker 2: paying taxes. The idea of you having a kid costs money, right,
[19:51] Speaker 2: The school system costs money, right, So they would prefer
[19:54] Speaker 2: a system where to pay for the excessive amount of
[19:57] Speaker 2: immigration from five years ago. You've kind of got to
[20:00] Speaker 2: go two for one with everyone for the next five years. Repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat.
[20:05] Speaker 2: Australia forty three million people something again, the Opposition was
[20:12] Speaker 2: noting today and deserves credit for.
[20:15] Speaker 10: Migration in this country has been too high and the
[20:18] Speaker 10: standards have been too low and that must change.
[20:21] Speaker 2: But you're not allowed to say that. You're not allowed
[20:23] Speaker 2: to say there's the standards and the government says, well
[20:27] Speaker 2: don't you can't do that. I mean, remember Peter malanowskis
[20:30] Speaker 2: South Australian Premier, who's going to wipe you a bum
[20:33] Speaker 2: in an age care facility if we do not keep
[20:35] Speaker 2: importing people into the country. Tony Burkers later Sunday of
[20:40] Speaker 2: this week was here talking with Andrew Clenell. Remember what
[20:43] Speaker 2: he was saying back then, Well, if we don't import
[20:46] Speaker 2: more people who are able to build houses, well, then
[20:48] Speaker 2: how are we going to get them more houses for
[20:50] Speaker 2: the people who are coming into the country. You know,
[20:53] Speaker 2: nothing to see here, nothing to see here. No, my
[20:56] Speaker 2: suggestion is why don't we get more kids to do trades,
[21:01] Speaker 2: to start apprenticeships, to learn how to swing a ham
[21:04] Speaker 2: rather than the endless mass migration that is required to
[21:08] Speaker 2: fill the Ponzi scheme, because that's right, they might end
[21:11] Speaker 2: up with an ABN and then the outside of the
[21:13] Speaker 2: triangle of dependence. Right, Albou did good again, Albou did this?
[21:21] Speaker 2: Albo done good?
[21:22] Speaker 1: Is so good, isn't he?
[21:25] Speaker 2: There's a lot more I want to get to. I'll
[21:27] Speaker 2: get to all of that in the moment or two
[21:28] Speaker 2: is time. But I want to talk about one of
[21:29] Speaker 2: the great charity moments which happen each and every year,
[21:32] Speaker 2: and that is the CEO Sleepout. There are too many
[21:34] Speaker 2: people that are homeless in Australia. It is an indictment
[21:37] Speaker 2: on us as a society either there are so many
[21:40] Speaker 2: people who end up slipping through the cracks. It is
[21:42] Speaker 2: an indictment on our governments that we need to have
[21:45] Speaker 2: eventslate the CEO Sleepout, where they raise millions and millions
[21:50] Speaker 2: of dollars each and every year in order to take
[21:54] Speaker 2: care of those that are the ones that are flowing
[21:56] Speaker 2: through the crack. But the CEO Sleepout is what I
[21:59] Speaker 2: particularly love. The Saint Vincent de Paul Vinnie's organization. Laura
[22:02] Speaker 2: Goldberg is here along with James Dorney, both representing the
[22:06] Speaker 2: companies of Laura's with Hurricanes Grill, James Is with the
[22:10] Speaker 2: Clean Away, and I know both their businesses very well
[22:12] Speaker 2: for two very different reasons, and I'm a frequent user
[22:15] Speaker 2: of all Now they of course are out and about
[22:18] Speaker 2: and they're going to make a pretty cold night tonight.
[22:20] Speaker 2: Let's start with you first, Laura, Why are you there tonight?
[22:22] Speaker 2: Why is it important that somebody of your prominence shows
[22:26] Speaker 2: commitment to the cause.
[22:31] Speaker 1: For me, it's.
[22:32] Speaker 11: Because it can happen to anyone, and I've seen it,
[22:35] Speaker 11: you know, in my wider circle that it can happen,
[22:39] Speaker 11: you know, just to anyone. And women over fifty are
[22:42] Speaker 11: one of the growest, largest growing cohort of people being homeless.
[22:48] Speaker 11: So that really hits home for me because I'm creeping
[22:51] Speaker 11: up to that age.
[22:52] Speaker 2: I wouldn't believe it twenty one in a day. That's
[22:54] Speaker 2: all I'll say. Now, James, for you, why are you there?
[23:00] Speaker 12: Very similar reasons. I'm also a repeat participant here and
[23:04] Speaker 12: very familiar with the wonderful work that Vinni's does across
[23:07] Speaker 12: New South Wales and across Australia. And the big difference
[23:10] Speaker 12: is that every Cadolla can make to people who are
[23:13] Speaker 12: doing it tough. We deal a lot with Vini's in
[23:15] Speaker 12: our role as network operator for Return and Earn in
[23:18] Speaker 12: New South Wales, so every single day across New South
[23:20] Speaker 12: Wales we see the great work they're doing helping people,
[23:23] Speaker 12: and it's fantastic to come out here and raise a
[23:25] Speaker 12: couple of dollars to assist in that regard.
[23:27] Speaker 1: Yeah, Bloody Earth.
[23:28] Speaker 2: By the way, here's the website CEO sleepout dot org
[23:31] Speaker 2: dot auceo sleepout dot org dot Are you find a
[23:33] Speaker 2: person or donate overall to the cause?
[23:36] Speaker 1: Do that support the people.
[23:37] Speaker 2: That are doing this right now?
[23:39] Speaker 1: Laura.
[23:39] Speaker 2: When I've had the privilege of being part of the
[23:41] Speaker 2: event in the past, we've done shows from there over
[23:44] Speaker 2: many years. A big part of this is what has
[23:47] Speaker 2: probably been happening over the past couple of hours, which
[23:49] Speaker 2: is that people who've had experience on the street, they
[23:52] Speaker 2: end up speaking to this room of incredibly powerful people.
[23:57] Speaker 2: Did you get that example of that again this year
[23:59] Speaker 2: where there were impactful stories from people whose lives there's
[24:02] Speaker 2: no difference than the lives that you and I lead,
[24:04] Speaker 2: the families, they come from, all the rest of it,
[24:07] Speaker 2: but they just stand up in a spiral that puts
[24:09] Speaker 2: them on the street.
[24:12] Speaker 11: Oh absolutely. We just heard from one gentleman who was
[24:17] Speaker 11: in the corporate world and then just found himself in
[24:20] Speaker 11: a spiral of drug abuse. And you know it's a
[24:24] Speaker 11: drug and alcohol abuse, which is you know, something that
[24:28] Speaker 11: you know, a couple of drinks after work can turn
[24:30] Speaker 11: out to, you know, be a thing that you do
[24:32] Speaker 11: every single day, so it can happen to everyone. The
[24:36] Speaker 11: one story that got me was with the pets, because
[24:38] Speaker 11: it's something that I didn't think about, like what do
[24:40] Speaker 11: you do when you leave, you know, a domestic violence
[24:43] Speaker 11: situation and you have a pet. And we heard from
[24:47] Speaker 11: a lady that Venice helped her keep her pet, and
[24:50] Speaker 11: that really, you know, it warmed the clockles of my
[24:54] Speaker 11: heart because I'm very attached to my dogs.
[24:57] Speaker 1: So you've got a big heart, Laura.
[24:59] Speaker 2: I love it you too, Jay, and that just because
[25:00] Speaker 2: you're seventeen foot tall. I want to know about what
[25:03] Speaker 2: you think about Vinis and the work that they do
[25:06] Speaker 2: and what you've learnt in the past, but certainly again tonight,
[25:10] Speaker 2: about what Vinnis do. What does Vinnie do, What does
[25:14] Speaker 2: Vinnis do, so that quickly that impresses you James.
[25:20] Speaker 12: Well, they help save people and turn people's lives around.
[25:23] Speaker 12: And part of what we do tonight here on the
[25:25] Speaker 12: CEO sleep out, apart from sleeping on a piece of
[25:28] Speaker 12: cardboard on the concrete, is you get the immersive experience.
[25:32] Speaker 12: You hear from people like Laura mentioned whose lives have
[25:34] Speaker 12: been turned around by Vinnis and we obviously have a
[25:37] Speaker 12: very close working relationship with them across New South Wales
[25:41] Speaker 12: through regional parts of the state, Griffith, Wogger, Dubbo Tamworth
[25:46] Speaker 12: generating jobs which is then generating further benefits for the
[25:50] Speaker 12: communities in which they operate. So, as Laura mentioned, you
[25:54] Speaker 12: hear the stories about impacts on individual lives and it's
[25:58] Speaker 12: just so widespread that it's not often right in our
[26:02] Speaker 12: line of sight. And the fact that part of the
[26:04] Speaker 12: stories we hear is that it really could happen to
[26:07] Speaker 12: anybody and Vinniz is providing that safety net to get
[26:10] Speaker 12: people back on their feed and the stories are quite
[26:12] Speaker 12: inspiring and it's just a pleasure to be here to
[26:15] Speaker 12: be able to support it in a very small, somewhat cold,
[26:19] Speaker 12: someone uncomfortable way.
[26:20] Speaker 1: All right, now, make the most of this experience.
[26:23] Speaker 2: It is absolutely life, affirming to realize how good we
[26:27] Speaker 2: have all got it, and for those who don't, there's
[26:29] Speaker 2: an opportunity to help, and we can all do that
[26:31] Speaker 2: via that website of CEO sleep dot org. Thank you guys,
[26:34] Speaker 2: have a lovely evening and again we'll talk to you
[26:36] Speaker 2: very soon. And again, whenever you go to a waste
[26:38] Speaker 2: transfer station or hurricanes mentioned my name, pay full price.
[26:41] Speaker 2: That's the way it works. Okay, quick breakback with more
[26:44] Speaker 2: here on Paul Murray Live. CEO sleep out dot org
[26:46] Speaker 2: dot au is the way to do it, the way
[26:48] Speaker 2: to give.
[26:49] Speaker 1: It's a shame we have to.
[26:51] Speaker 2: But alas we do, and please do CEO sleep out
[26:54] Speaker 2: dot org dot au. More in a moment here on
[26:56] Speaker 2: Paul Murray Live, including more reaction to the Paul enhancement speech.
[27:00] Speaker 2: I show you one of the people who was all
[27:01] Speaker 2: very high for Loton today about her. We are on
[27:10] Speaker 2: our way to the Northern Territory. Not this weekend, next weekend,
[27:13] Speaker 2: this weekend. In fact, it's going to be supercars and
[27:15] Speaker 2: announced by the Northern Territory government yesterday. Next year's race
[27:19] Speaker 2: will be underlights at twilight. How good is that going
[27:21] Speaker 2: to be? In the meantime, get ready for our town
[27:24] Speaker 2: in Barra, MA. If you'd like to join us, please
[27:26] Speaker 2: do so. Sunday twenty eighth of June. Only fifteen saints left,
[27:31] Speaker 2: so let's fill the join oka our town at sky
[27:33] Speaker 2: news dot com. Do you ourtown at sky news dot com.
[27:35] Speaker 2: Are you not this next Sunday in the Northern Territory?
[27:38] Speaker 2: Then you stick around for a couple of days. Bang bang, dang,
[27:40] Speaker 2: crack and night.
[27:40] Speaker 1: How good is that? Joining me in the man cave?
[27:42] Speaker 2: Brother from another mother, the Great Darren Bunnette and Ross Cadell,
[27:46] Speaker 2: fellow motor racing tragic He joins us now as well
[27:48] Speaker 2: from Canberra gents. Hello, So budget back down?
[27:52] Speaker 1: All right?
[27:53] Speaker 2: From the political perspective, the government's going to go, oh okay,
[27:55] Speaker 2: we've shaved the ugly bits off.
[27:57] Speaker 1: We're going to find a way through.
[27:59] Speaker 5: Well.
[27:59] Speaker 2: Of course, the reality is is that again by calculating
[28:03] Speaker 2: this on turnover non profit, there's going to be some
[28:06] Speaker 2: areas but they'll be able to say, well we listened.
[28:09] Speaker 2: But the point is, ross are the Australian people listening
[28:13] Speaker 2: to the back down that Charmer says. It's not a
[28:15] Speaker 2: back down from a lie that the Prime Minister says
[28:18] Speaker 2: wasn't a lie.
[28:21] Speaker 1: They aren't.
[28:21] Speaker 13: Look, they'll hear something that Jim charmers are. We're addressing
[28:24] Speaker 13: the problems. They'll think it's all fixed. Is it's not
[28:26] Speaker 13: fixes a massive backflip both. I've seen gymnast in the
[28:29] Speaker 13: Olympics get nine point nines for lesser results in this one.
[28:32] Speaker 13: But what it is, it's really, you know, proof that
[28:35] Speaker 13: you can't polish your term, but you can roll it
[28:36] Speaker 13: in sparkles. But one under the sparkles is still a
[28:39] Speaker 13: hell of a tax policy that's rubbish. And this is
[28:42] Speaker 13: what it gets to. This isn't about housing iff. It
[28:45] Speaker 13: is to me when someone can tell me how you
[28:47] Speaker 13: can tax young people on shares or ETFs or crypto
[28:52] Speaker 13: one hundred percent more than they're being taxed and get
[28:55] Speaker 13: a house easier, it doesn't make sense to me. So
[28:58] Speaker 13: I just don't get it. It's still rubbish. I'll oppose
[29:00] Speaker 13: it and it'll still pass Thanks the Greens.
[29:02] Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean this is the thing where where they're
[29:04] Speaker 2: in the politics of this is pretty well established. We
[29:07] Speaker 2: remember that this many weeks after that twenty fourteen budget.
[29:11] Speaker 2: And look, obviously Malcolm Turnbull stirring the pot from within
[29:14] Speaker 2: is part of why that continued to become what it became.
[29:17] Speaker 2: But to me not entirely sure. This is government managing
[29:21] Speaker 2: and managing on the edges. But I would imagine that
[29:23] Speaker 2: many people have already engaged with either the LIE as
[29:26] Speaker 2: the fundamental thing that has turned them off until next
[29:29] Speaker 2: time around, or they saw the changes for what they
[29:33] Speaker 2: were and the tweak back is not substantive enough to
[29:36] Speaker 2: say the worst of it is gone. But that's me
[29:40] Speaker 2: with the half empty. Where's the half full?
[29:41] Speaker 9: Well to go on, Ross's fine analogy. You can't polish
[29:45] Speaker 9: a tur but you can flush it, and so they
[29:48] Speaker 9: will get rid of the bits that are not palatable. Yes,
[29:52] Speaker 9: and that's what you can do when you're in government
[29:55] Speaker 9: and you're able to just get rid of those bits.
[29:58] Speaker 9: And if they shave off as you write point out,
[30:01] Speaker 9: been in two years time, if the sky doesn't fall in,
[30:05] Speaker 9: I don't know how much of this budget will be
[30:07] Speaker 9: front of mind. I think the prospect of the LIE
[30:10] Speaker 9: will be well job, But the detail of the budget,
[30:13] Speaker 9: I'm not sure whether that will be front of mine.
[30:15] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[30:15] Speaker 2: Well, the opposition's job, one nation's job, anyone, is to
[30:18] Speaker 2: maintain the message in and around the LIE, because I've
[30:21] Speaker 2: got a feeling there might be a few more between
[30:23] Speaker 2: now and when there is another election. Now, speaking of
[30:27] Speaker 2: let's get to the Pauline Hanson of it all. In
[30:29] Speaker 2: the speech today she was in Townsville. Good to see
[30:31] Speaker 2: there as part of the Bush Summit. I love the
[30:33] Speaker 2: Bush Summit. All those details up at sky On News
[30:35] Speaker 2: dot com dot IU. Of course, yesterday she was at
[30:38] Speaker 2: the National Press Club and there was this conversation about
[30:42] Speaker 2: multicultural versus monocultural. I'll get to that in a second. Understandably,
[30:46] Speaker 2: all of the lefties hair on fire. Oh goodness me,
[30:49] Speaker 2: how terrible all of this is. There was a Human
[30:51] Speaker 2: Rights commissioner that was out and about today. Referring to
[30:54] Speaker 2: a rule is just disgraceful. But I want to focus
[30:57] Speaker 2: in on one little bit, though, which is the special
[30:59] Speaker 2: envoy that the Prime Minister appointed at the same time
[31:01] Speaker 2: as he did about anti semitism, This one about Islamophobia.
[31:05] Speaker 2: Now he is not quoted in an article he wrote
[31:07] Speaker 2: one as a Muslim. It is encouraging to hear paul
[31:10] Speaker 2: In Hanson quote from a book. If there's one thing
[31:14] Speaker 2: we need, it's more reading. Oh this is mildly patronizing,
[31:17] Speaker 2: But let's all read it together. I must admit that
[31:20] Speaker 2: Senator Pauline Hanson surprised me this week, but not for
[31:23] Speaker 2: the reasons you think. After years of hearing the Senator
[31:25] Speaker 2: speak about Muslims, Islam, mosque in the immigration and National identity,
[31:30] Speaker 2: I never imagined I would see the day when she
[31:32] Speaker 2: would stand up and quote for a book, because you know,
[31:36] Speaker 2: she's dumb, right, see, like like smart people read books
[31:39] Speaker 2: and dumb people don't, and anyone who agrees with her
[31:40] Speaker 2: as a dumb person apparently. Yet in her latest remarks,
[31:44] Speaker 2: she drew on British writer and his memoir The Islamist
[31:47] Speaker 2: Signing the account of joining then leaving U was Butteria
[31:50] Speaker 2: in Britain. Now, this is what she said in the
[31:54] Speaker 2: quote of that book yesterday at the National Press Club.
[32:00] Speaker 14: From a loving family who taught him that Islam is
[32:03] Speaker 14: a religion, no different from being a Catholic or a Protestant.
[32:07] Speaker 14: But he soon was taught that Islam is not a
[32:09] Speaker 14: religion but a political movement, and he learnt that quote
[32:17] Speaker 14: Islamist groups pose a threat to this country that we
[32:21] Speaker 14: Muslims and non Muslims alike do not yet understand. Unquote,
[32:28] Speaker 14: he says, quote I illustrate the depth of the problem
[32:34] Speaker 14: that now grips Muslim hearts and minds, and I lay
[32:38] Speaker 14: bare what politicians and Muslim community leaders do not want
[32:43] Speaker 14: you to know.
[32:45] Speaker 1: Unquote.
[32:47] Speaker 2: Now we continue with the person who is surprised that
[32:50] Speaker 2: she read from a book. If Hanson has developed an
[32:54] Speaker 2: interest in books and learning, then I find myself in
[32:57] Speaker 2: the unusual position of wanting to encourage it is this, this, remember,
[33:01] Speaker 2: is the envoid of the Prime Minister about Islamophobia. Right,
[33:05] Speaker 2: I would be more than happy to recommend it reading
[33:07] Speaker 2: list on Islam, Muslim history, Muslim Australians. Indeed, I have
[33:10] Speaker 2: curated such a list on my website link provided, because
[33:14] Speaker 2: there is one thing the current debate desperately needs. It's
[33:16] Speaker 2: not more slogans, it's more reading.
[33:18] Speaker 1: Well.
[33:19] Speaker 2: I would also suggest to the person who wrote this thing,
[33:22] Speaker 2: representing the Islamic community in Australia, that one of the
[33:24] Speaker 2: things that could be read would be perhaps the transcript
[33:27] Speaker 2: of the speech, because this is what she said many
[33:30] Speaker 2: many times.
[33:32] Speaker 14: Radical Islam hate preachers, radical Islam. Radical Islam hate preachers,
[33:36] Speaker 14: radical Islam.
[33:38] Speaker 2: Because the truth is that just as there is a
[33:41] Speaker 2: difference between priests and pedophile priests. There is a difference
[33:45] Speaker 2: between Islam and radical Islam. Right, That is a distinction
[33:49] Speaker 2: that any good faith person of the Islamic or otherwise
[33:52] Speaker 2: faith clearly understands. The graying of all of that becomes
[33:57] Speaker 2: a problem now last bit here in terms such as
[34:01] Speaker 2: radical Islam, hate preachers, and threats to Western civilizations carry
[34:05] Speaker 2: rhetorical force but little analytical precision. Their effect is not
[34:10] Speaker 2: to inform, but to frame, to construct a narrative in
[34:12] Speaker 2: which Islam appears uniquely prone to extremism and Muslim Australians
[34:16] Speaker 2: become a permanent source of cultural anxiety.
[34:20] Speaker 1: Darren.
[34:21] Speaker 2: My frustration with this as the hottest of hot takes
[34:24] Speaker 2: coming from a person who has been empowered by the
[34:25] Speaker 2: government to speak about the commoncepts and problems of Islamophobia
[34:30] Speaker 2: is I think there is an absolute distinction between Islam
[34:33] Speaker 2: and radical Islam. If there are those who believe that
[34:35] Speaker 2: Islam is radical or that is a generalist position of
[34:38] Speaker 2: which I do not agree, right, I think that take
[34:42] Speaker 2: is about as patronizing and as unhelpful as you can get.
[34:45] Speaker 9: But your thoughts, I was certainly unhelpful and it was
[34:48] Speaker 9: certainly patronizing. Look, I don't know how many people are
[34:50] Speaker 9: going to read it either. There's no doubt that in
[34:54] Speaker 9: the Australian community, people are concerned about militant Islam, particularly
[34:58] Speaker 9: off the back of the Bondi attacks, and that needs
[35:02] Speaker 9: to be addressed. And how that's addressed will become what
[35:06] Speaker 9: people talk about in the lead up to the next election.
[35:08] Speaker 2: And anyone who's actually paid attention wouldn't know that. The
[35:10] Speaker 2: conversations we've had here for as long as I've been
[35:12] Speaker 2: here is that I will talk about all of the
[35:14] Speaker 2: forms of extremism. When there is examples of right extremism, yeah,
[35:18] Speaker 2: we'll call it out. Those lunatics running around, the Nazis
[35:20] Speaker 2: and people trying to you know, march for White Pride.
[35:23] Speaker 1: All of that, all of that gets called out.
[35:26] Speaker 2: But again, Ross and I understand here that you're sick
[35:29] Speaker 2: of talking about Paul and Hanson, One Nation, all the
[35:31] Speaker 2: rest of it. Right, But this is this fundamental misreading, right,
[35:36] Speaker 2: which is that everyone should be united against radical Islam
[35:39] Speaker 2: or any other forms of radicalization. But it's when well,
[35:43] Speaker 2: the term radical Islam that's really a backdoor way of
[35:45] Speaker 2: criticizing all Muslims. No, it's not because I know as
[35:49] Speaker 2: a person who uses that term. I am using it
[35:52] Speaker 2: to describe the absolute fringe, not the majority.
[35:58] Speaker 13: And that's the right you see now and easy creeping
[36:00] Speaker 13: into his story now that the right wing parties that
[36:03] Speaker 13: you know, liberals us in the Nationals and one day
[36:06] Speaker 13: you we're all right wing part compared to them, they're
[36:10] Speaker 13: far left and the Greens are even far left. How
[36:12] Speaker 13: that goes. I think we're quite mainstream. But this is
[36:15] Speaker 13: the problem with Australia is you know, I get this
[36:17] Speaker 13: thing on multiculturalism and monoculture, as in my feel is
[36:21] Speaker 13: that our problem is multi monocultures. Too many people want
[36:24] Speaker 13: to put a fence around how they define themselves by race,
[36:26] Speaker 13: by culture, by beliefs, by sex, by any things, and
[36:29] Speaker 13: say this is it. So look you get radical radical
[36:33] Speaker 13: right wingers sit there and say, you know, the white
[36:35] Speaker 13: supremist we are after this, get radical Islam saying the
[36:37] Speaker 13: same thing, this is the only way forward. When you
[36:39] Speaker 13: have these monocultures that only want to be by themselves,
[36:42] Speaker 13: and they are growing throughout the country, that is the problem.
[36:45] Speaker 13: A single society, whether it be multicultural or monoculture, comes together,
[36:48] Speaker 13: adds to the pot, has a great time, wants to
[36:51] Speaker 13: be here, and grow. That's what we want as a country.
[36:53] Speaker 13: But we spent years dividing this over ability, disability, sex, gender,
[36:59] Speaker 13: you name it. Politicians and the left have found a
[37:01] Speaker 13: way to divide us because it's useful to them, because
[37:04] Speaker 13: they want you to feel less in power, less, you know,
[37:08] Speaker 13: more vulnerable, so they can drive a weds through a society.
[37:11] Speaker 13: This comes down to what the left have done over
[37:13] Speaker 13: a long time. I'm talking about the center left, I'm
[37:15] Speaker 13: talking about the far left. They have won and we
[37:17] Speaker 13: now need to put astraya back together.
[37:19] Speaker 2: Well, I remember, you know, let's go way back when
[37:21] Speaker 2: to the old university. There is the conversations about well,
[37:25] Speaker 2: you know, categorization. That's all about capitalism being able to
[37:28] Speaker 2: define you as this, this and this so then they
[37:30] Speaker 2: can sell things to you.
[37:31] Speaker 1: Well, lefties want to divide.
[37:33] Speaker 2: You on all of these things in order to put
[37:35] Speaker 2: the fence around you to say why you have been
[37:38] Speaker 2: affected by the existing powers, and therefore you must try
[37:41] Speaker 2: to overthrow the existing powers. But this concept of monoculture
[37:45] Speaker 2: versus multiculturalism, I know what she was talking about.
[37:49] Speaker 1: I spoke warmly of the.
[37:51] Speaker 2: Idea that she was trying to make yesterday. The term
[37:54] Speaker 2: I've noticed today is one that some people have become
[37:57] Speaker 2: a little bit uncomfortable with. But what do you think
[38:00] Speaker 2: is going to last longer the word that was used
[38:03] Speaker 2: or the things she was talking about.
[38:06] Speaker 9: It's a really good question. Actually, I think both will remain.
[38:10] Speaker 9: I think people generally know where Pauline sits on major issues,
[38:14] Speaker 9: and nothing that happened in yesterday's speech changes that. But
[38:18] Speaker 9: I do think she picked a lot of battles. And
[38:21] Speaker 9: if we go back to that twenty fourteen budget, its
[38:23] Speaker 9: problem wasn't automatically content per se. It was that it
[38:27] Speaker 9: started a fight with everybody, with doctors, with nurses, with
[38:30] Speaker 9: age care, with education. Everybody got offended in some union.
[38:35] Speaker 1: But yet I get it.
[38:37] Speaker 9: I get it well, the whole cross bench, Clive Palmer show,
[38:40] Speaker 9: they all got on board and it became an impossible
[38:43] Speaker 9: parliament to manage. And if you're in Pauline's position and
[38:46] Speaker 9: you're ascended in the polls, pick your battles. Probably picked three,
[38:50] Speaker 9: don't pick eight, and so then, because what happens now
[38:54] Speaker 9: is that people start to peel off because they get
[38:57] Speaker 9: mildly upset, or you kind of if you're in her
[39:00] Speaker 9: position right now, you're not in government the government's not
[39:03] Speaker 9: as popular as it was. The formal opposition is deeply unpopular.
[39:08] Speaker 9: It'd sort of sit there and maintain rather than try
[39:11] Speaker 9: and divide.
[39:12] Speaker 2: Well, certainly more people know the term fire the lie
[39:14] Speaker 2: this week than any of the other terms that we've
[39:17] Speaker 2: just been mentioning. Whether that extends in the next week,
[39:19] Speaker 2: next month, we'll all find out. It's gone his pulse
[39:21] Speaker 2: every couple of weeks year. All right, last one here,
[39:23] Speaker 2: our old mates at get Up. You both know how
[39:26] Speaker 2: to run a campaign. You've won, you've lost all the
[39:27] Speaker 2: rest of it here, Darren, we'll effectively right. I mean,
[39:32] Speaker 2: they're going to say the win is that we keep
[39:33] Speaker 2: saying get up. The obvious reality is that there's only
[39:36] Speaker 2: a certain number of The.
[39:37] Speaker 9: Twist reality is what does get Up represented and who
[39:39] Speaker 9: doesn't represent It hasn't been close to labor for quite
[39:42] Speaker 9: a long time, as in a decade, but.
[39:45] Speaker 1: They sort of were subsumed into teal world for a while.
[39:48] Speaker 2: Well.
[39:48] Speaker 9: I think the teal movement replaced Get Up's kind of
[39:53] Speaker 9: donor base, where wealthy people in coalition seats they thought
[39:56] Speaker 9: donating to get Up was a way to protest replaced. Obviously,
[40:01] Speaker 9: there's a new figurehead get up and he's trying to
[40:04] Speaker 9: make a name for himself. But I'm not sure who
[40:07] Speaker 9: they represent. And just as problematically, I think Pauline can
[40:11] Speaker 9: turn around very credibly and say I'm not hanging out
[40:14] Speaker 9: with the Press Club. I'm not hanging out with the
[40:16] Speaker 9: Gallery Journeys like this fits her narrative, not anybody else's that.
[40:21] Speaker 9: I'm anti those guys, And look what happened last time
[40:24] Speaker 9: I was there. And if you were at Gallery Journo,
[40:26] Speaker 9: you would be furious that your platform has been kind
[40:30] Speaker 9: of debased by someone shorting in a ridiculous stunt.
[40:34] Speaker 2: But watch them, do the interviews, cover them and give them,
[40:36] Speaker 2: you know, exclusives.
[40:37] Speaker 1: The group in manhats.
[40:40] Speaker 9: I just don't thinkure in the end, Pauline wins out
[40:43] Speaker 9: of that stunt. I got any shadow of a doubt.
[40:45] Speaker 1: I agree. All right, Ross, you're going to lose the week.
[40:48] Speaker 1: Whom is it leading on this?
[40:51] Speaker 13: David Charaz back in the spotlight. But for all the
[40:54] Speaker 13: wrong reasons. They're just leaning into making the wrong thing.
[40:56] Speaker 13: Did he press the button? I guess we'll find out.
[40:58] Speaker 13: Stay excited for next week's.
[41:00] Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, Darren, for you.
[41:02] Speaker 9: I'm going to soccer. I reckon the two goalkeepers is
[41:04] Speaker 9: straling guy Patrick Beach and the forty year old They
[41:08] Speaker 9: saved nine and eight direct saves in and.
[41:13] Speaker 6: I love it.
[41:14] Speaker 9: I love soccer, and I love those midnow nations who
[41:18] Speaker 9: probably won't make it through the qualifiers, but they've had
[41:20] Speaker 9: their moment and that's great for everybody.
[41:22] Speaker 2: Correct, All right, enjoy the twenty four hour puble revue
[41:25] Speaker 2: watching things early on Saturday morning, and then it's all
[41:27] Speaker 2: again back in a weekend towards the end of the month.
[41:29] Speaker 2: All right, thank you, lads, have a wonderful weekend. Enjoy yourselves. Next,
[41:33] Speaker 2: we're going to talk about the beautiful skies of New
[41:35] Speaker 2: York City. No, it's not me talking about a documentary
[41:37] Speaker 2: in a few weeks time. But there's a story behind
[41:39] Speaker 2: all of this, and the great Colin Flynn ends our
[41:41] Speaker 2: week with a smile.
[41:42] Speaker 1: Next, New York, New York, the town that was so.
[41:50] Speaker 2: Nice they named it twice. And the man who was
[41:51] Speaker 2: there right now is our diffriend, Colin Flynn. Is a
[41:53] Speaker 2: way of ending our week with a giant smile. Now,
[41:55] Speaker 2: we just showed before that iconic photo of the workers
[41:58] Speaker 2: building those many beautiful scona scripe is that are behind you,
[42:02] Speaker 2: but there's a story behind it, and you're about to
[42:04] Speaker 2: till me.
[42:06] Speaker 1: Paul.
[42:07] Speaker 6: They should have named you twice because you're so nice.
[42:12] Speaker 6: Seven five am here in Manhattan. Good morning, Paul, and
[42:17] Speaker 6: you're right. That image you showed before the break this
[42:19] Speaker 6: has become one of the most iconic images of all time,
[42:22] Speaker 6: certainly of the twentieth century. It's a black and white
[42:25] Speaker 6: image of eleven steel workers construction workers sitting on a
[42:29] Speaker 6: steel beam dangling over Manhattan. You can see Central Park
[42:33] Speaker 6: there behind them. And the incredible thing about this you
[42:35] Speaker 6: can never get away with it today. No harnesses, no
[42:39] Speaker 6: safety railings, no hard hats, just eleven guys on the
[42:42] Speaker 6: lunch break. Look at the guy in the right there,
[42:44] Speaker 6: he's got a bottle of liquor in his hand. The
[42:46] Speaker 6: guys on the left of the screen are smoking a cigarette,
[42:49] Speaker 6: they're reading the newspaper. They're sitting there like they're sitting
[42:52] Speaker 6: on a park bench in Central Park. It's incredible. So
[42:55] Speaker 6: this image really became a symbol of strength and determination
[42:59] Speaker 6: during the Depression. This was taken in nineteen thirty two
[43:02] Speaker 6: at Rockefeller Center, just a few blocks from me. Here
[43:04] Speaker 6: a lot of people think, Paul, it was the Empire
[43:06] Speaker 6: State Building, But no, it was the building we know
[43:09] Speaker 6: today as thirty Rock, where NBC is located. And this
[43:12] Speaker 6: was a time when the Rockefellers were employing forty thousand
[43:16] Speaker 6: people to generate work and to get America working again
[43:19] Speaker 6: in the economy. But what this photograph really symbolized was
[43:23] Speaker 6: not just the American dream, but it was the determination
[43:25] Speaker 6: and the hard work of the migrants who had come
[43:28] Speaker 6: from all over the world. Now, I don't want to
[43:31] Speaker 6: burst anyone's bubble, but here's the truth about this photograph.
[43:34] Speaker 6: Some people believe it was just a spur of the moment, casual,
[43:38] Speaker 6: romantic shot that was captured. But in reality, Paul, it's
[43:41] Speaker 6: what we would call today a pr shot, publicity shot
[43:45] Speaker 6: because the Rockefellers, who were paying for everything, remember they
[43:48] Speaker 6: needed to lease the office space for the buildings that
[43:51] Speaker 6: were going to open, so to drum up excitement and
[43:53] Speaker 6: to drum up publicity, one day they sent up a
[43:56] Speaker 6: team of photographers.
[43:57] Speaker 1: So the photograph was staged.
[43:59] Speaker 6: But the men are real, the real construction worker, and
[44:02] Speaker 6: the conditions are real. That is how they set every day,
[44:05] Speaker 6: having their lunch in those dangerous conditions. These were brave men.
[44:09] Speaker 6: And here's the other thing. Who wore the men? We
[44:11] Speaker 6: know there are eleven there and over the year's Paul.
[44:14] Speaker 6: Many people have said that guy's my grandfather.
[44:16] Speaker 12: Oh.
[44:16] Speaker 6: I think in our family we always say the fourth
[44:19] Speaker 6: and the left of the third. It remained a mystery
[44:21] Speaker 6: for so long until recently a woman called Christine Roselle.
[44:25] Speaker 6: She is the main archivist of Rockefeller Center.
[44:28] Speaker 1: She's a bit of a.
[44:29] Speaker 6: Legend, a living legend. And when I met her, I said,
[44:31] Speaker 6: they call you a legend. She said yeah, because I've
[44:33] Speaker 6: been around for so long. And I also said to her, hey,
[44:37] Speaker 6: I heard you lived in Ireland for a while. She said, yeah,
[44:39] Speaker 6: like one hundred years ago. So she wrote a beam
[44:43] Speaker 6: called lunch on a beam. She would have got called
[44:45] Speaker 6: lunch and a beam. And I went yesterday to Rockefeller Center.
[44:48] Speaker 6: I had the privilege of meeting her, and I asked her, Christine,
[44:52] Speaker 6: who are these eleven men sitting having lunch on the beam?
[44:57] Speaker 15: The eleven men on the beam are a variety of men.
[45:00] Speaker 15: Some are Mohawk Indians, some are Germans, some are Irish, Yay,
[45:05] Speaker 15: some are from Nova Scotia.
[45:08] Speaker 6: So how many of these men were you able to identify?
[45:12] Speaker 1: I know that the third from the.
[45:14] Speaker 15: Left, the third from the left, is my favorite man
[45:19] Speaker 15: because he's everybody's grandfather. Out of the people I'd interviewed
[45:24] Speaker 15: for this book, eighteen people said he was their grandfather.
[45:29] Speaker 15: The third from the left, the third from the left.
[45:31] Speaker 1: He just has that look. He looks like everyone's grandfather.
[45:34] Speaker 15: Everyone's grandfather. Absolutely.
[45:36] Speaker 6: But out of the eleven, how many do we know?
[45:39] Speaker 15: Well, probably nine out of the eleven, there are two
[45:42] Speaker 15: that are I call either or, and there's not enough
[45:48] Speaker 15: proof to say for sure they are. There's not enough
[45:52] Speaker 15: proof to say they aren't. So they're my either or people.
[45:57] Speaker 6: Just sweet lady Christine Roussel, the man archives Rockefeller Center,
[46:01] Speaker 6: was so lovely meeting or she's been there for a
[46:02] Speaker 6: long time and everybody knows her. But the amazing thing is, Paul,
[46:05] Speaker 6: when you think about it today, you know, we're so
[46:07] Speaker 6: obsessed with taking photographs and Instagram and PR companies. Can
[46:11] Speaker 6: you imagine getting a photograph that we're still talking about
[46:13] Speaker 6: one hundred almost one hundred years later. It's incredible. Finally,
[46:17] Speaker 6: I asked Christine, look, you researched this, you know all
[46:20] Speaker 6: about it. The original photograph was there in her office.
[46:23] Speaker 6: I said, why do you think this image is so special?
[46:27] Speaker 15: Well, I think it captivates people because it shows unity,
[46:32] Speaker 15: It shows determination, It shows people fighting to stay alive
[46:37] Speaker 15: and help their families and to build America. Actually, this
[46:41] Speaker 15: is sort of a tale of people who immigrated to
[46:45] Speaker 15: a country and built the country. And I think that's
[46:48] Speaker 15: why people relate to it. They have somebody in their
[46:51] Speaker 15: family who could be a member of this sitting on
[46:55] Speaker 15: the beam.
[46:55] Speaker 6: But not necessarily you mean like chasing that dream, that
[46:59] Speaker 6: American dream, that.
[47:00] Speaker 15: Is chasing the American dream.
[47:02] Speaker 2: Absolutely, you realize this column. Of course, being in America,
[47:06] Speaker 2: it's like everyone's built for TV. Everyone's sort of the
[47:09] Speaker 2: perfect interview. They always know exactly what and how to say.
[47:12] Speaker 2: But also what I love is that in a city
[47:15] Speaker 2: like in New York, there are so many people who've
[47:17] Speaker 2: dedicated themselves to telling the story of a little fragment
[47:21] Speaker 2: in time, and that photo means so much. And for
[47:25] Speaker 2: her to have that knowledge about that photo again you
[47:28] Speaker 2: lay it on top of the other stories, the other stories.
[47:31] Speaker 2: It seems like a very magical person and in a
[47:33] Speaker 2: beautiful place that you were yesterday, And you.
[47:37] Speaker 6: Know what, it's so true, what you say, Paulam. Finally,
[47:40] Speaker 6: when I was asking her about the eleven man, she said,
[47:42] Speaker 6: we could identify nine of them. And I say to you,
[47:45] Speaker 6: upset that you haven't been able to identify the other three,
[47:47] Speaker 6: and she said no, because these eleven men were eleven
[47:50] Speaker 6: of tens of thousands, and in a way, the three
[47:53] Speaker 6: mysterious men. It's good that people can claim them and
[47:56] Speaker 6: they can represent all of the others completely.
[47:59] Speaker 2: Now, before we're done, by this time next week, I'm
[48:01] Speaker 2: going to give you some homework. I want you to
[48:03] Speaker 2: go ninth Avenue. I want you to go down to
[48:05] Speaker 2: one hundred and fourteenth Street. Why because Gotham pizza. All right,
[48:11] Speaker 2: you report back in a week's time. All right, have
[48:14] Speaker 2: a slice to me.
[48:15] Speaker 6: And by the way, actually before I forget, when I
[48:17] Speaker 6: was leaving there and I had the camera and she said,
[48:20] Speaker 6: now what is this for again? I said, this is
[48:22] Speaker 6: going to be on Paul Murray in Australia. He just
[48:24] Speaker 6: looked at me like this. I said, would you like
[48:27] Speaker 6: to go to Australia some day?
[48:28] Speaker 12: Me?
[48:28] Speaker 6: Paul?
[48:29] Speaker 2: She said, hell no, see you mate, enjoy your time,
[48:35] Speaker 2: enjoy some Gotham pizza.
[48:36] Speaker 1: Thank you bout quick. Break back with more on Port
[48:38] Speaker 1: Murray Live.
[48:38] Speaker 2: We're reminder we've got our doco about America coming up
[48:41] Speaker 2: first week of July, Wednesday night at eight o'clock.
[48:44] Speaker 1: I'm looking forward to it.
[48:45] Speaker 2: Trump's America two hundred fifty years in the making, Wednesday,
[48:47] Speaker 2: the first of July. So we're done for tonight. We're
[48:54] Speaker 2: done for the week. We'll see you again on Sunday night.
[48:56] Speaker 2: Make sure you get the podcast. It's gone news dot com.
[48:58] Speaker 2: Do you go, Tigers Go?
[48:59] Speaker 1: Yankees? Say you think

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