# Wounded Veterans Climb Kilimanjaro; Sleep Walking With A Pistol; Looking For Trouble

An episode of [Gun Talk](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/190516844), 3 May 2026, 44 min.

Audio: https://dts.podtrac.com/redirect.mp3/api.spreaker.com/download/episode/71840950/050326guntalkc.mp3

-- Pete Brownells takes a team of former special forces warriors to the summit of Mount Kilimanjaro. -- He went sleep walking with his pistol a year ago and thought he had thrown it away. He found it in the file cabinet drawer where he keeps his tax records! -- Looking for trouble is a good idea, if you make it part of your "see and avoid" practice. Gun Talk 05.03.26 Hour 3 Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gun-talk--6185159/support.

## Transcript

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[0:32] Speaker 3: All right, I'm back Palm Gresham here. Be sure to
[0:34] Speaker 3: follow me over on X. I am at gun Talk
[0:37] Speaker 3: there at the NRAA Annual meetings in Houston a couple
[0:40] Speaker 3: of weeks ago, I had a chance to talk with
[0:42] Speaker 3: about friend Pete brown Now, and one of the things
[0:45] Speaker 3: we talked about was his efforts where he took some
[0:49] Speaker 3: former Special Forces warriors whoden had a need and he
[0:55] Speaker 3: took them to the summit of Mount Kelimanjaro. I think
[1:00] Speaker 3: you're going to enjoy this interview. Always good to get
[1:02] Speaker 3: together with some of your old friends here and then
[1:04] Speaker 3: you get to meet people and see people who are
[1:06] Speaker 3: really the giants of industry. Pete brown Els, the CEO
[1:09] Speaker 3: of Brown Els. Of course, everybody knows brown owls. I
[1:11] Speaker 3: mean we used to get the big catalog. Now we
[1:13] Speaker 3: go to the online site.
[1:14] Speaker 4: Yeah.
[1:14] Speaker 3: Yeah, So if you need gunsmithing tools, which is where
[1:18] Speaker 3: it started, right, well, you are third generation. Yeah, third
[1:21] Speaker 3: gen of course, Ryan's third generation. All right, here's the
[1:25] Speaker 3: thought I was thinking about this this morning, thinking we're
[1:27] Speaker 3: going to talk about third generation. Why are all these
[1:29] Speaker 3: companies Nozzler, Hornity, why are we all third generation? It's
[1:35] Speaker 3: because our grandparents started right after World War Two.
[1:39] Speaker 4: That's right, right, that's exactly right.
[1:41] Speaker 5: I mean you mean the hodge of all of us,
[1:43] Speaker 5: whether everyone knows, is like we got back, They got
[1:46] Speaker 5: back from service. Most everybody got back and from the service.
[1:49] Speaker 5: And there was a big need for repairing, big need
[1:52] Speaker 5: for men frankly and yeah.
[1:54] Speaker 3: Repairing guns, buying guns, relearning, getting into that. It was
[1:58] Speaker 3: all randwed and you had this mass of people coming
[2:01] Speaker 3: out of World War Two that they had time, right
[2:05] Speaker 3: and with the GiB all they had money. Yeah, and
[2:07] Speaker 3: we were the country was at a good place.
[2:10] Speaker 4: Yeah.
[2:10] Speaker 5: Well that was a time when innovation absolutely took off
[2:13] Speaker 5: as well. Because the United States was now adopted as
[2:16] Speaker 5: a world power of rebuilding. We could we were dependable
[2:21] Speaker 5: because we kind of saved saved the world on that front,
[2:25] Speaker 5: and then everybody came back with a lot more skills
[2:27] Speaker 5: and a lot more like I would say, resilience, and
[2:31] Speaker 5: that's when innovation really took off. And I think one
[2:33] Speaker 5: of the things deal right now we're seeing is good
[2:35] Speaker 5: innovation as well, coming back where.
[2:37] Speaker 3: I would agree. I mean, we had, you know, Fred
[2:38] Speaker 3: Huntington said we're going to do relearning products and bullets,
[2:41] Speaker 3: and yet your dad say, we know people are doing
[2:43] Speaker 3: home gunsmith and they need the tools, they need all
[2:45] Speaker 3: the stuff you had, you know, uh, Joyce Hornity, people
[2:50] Speaker 3: are gonna need bullets, and then you had you know,
[2:52] Speaker 3: Hodgsten say well they're gonna need powder, and it's like boom.
[2:56] Speaker 3: And now we have these big companies. But we are
[2:58] Speaker 3: to your point where third generation even for its generation
[3:01] Speaker 3: in some cases, and we are walking around Inerrat Show
[3:05] Speaker 3: and before we got on here, I'll say, look, it's
[3:08] Speaker 3: been eight years since we had the revolution of the
[3:11] Speaker 3: P three sixty five pistol, which kind of introduced a
[3:14] Speaker 3: new category, and I am feeling we're on the verge
[3:17] Speaker 3: of another thing happening.
[3:20] Speaker 5: Yep, we do see that being in the distribution world first,
[3:25] Speaker 5: and then we hear a lot of what's going on.
[3:27] Speaker 5: A lot of the people that are out there innovating.
[3:29] Speaker 5: This is where I think this pandemic post pandemic. A
[3:33] Speaker 5: lot of people were sitting around dreaming, and a lot
[3:36] Speaker 5: of that has turned itself into product.
[3:37] Speaker 3: Now.
[3:37] Speaker 5: It's not just the big companies with their own engineering
[3:40] Speaker 5: departments saying this is our this is our one year
[3:42] Speaker 5: dev plan on product. It's a lot of these lot
[3:45] Speaker 5: of these entrepreneurs. This is a great, great industry to
[3:48] Speaker 5: be in if you have an idea.
[3:50] Speaker 3: Garage based is right for people who are just saying,
[3:52] Speaker 3: what if I did this thing? Yeah?
[3:55] Speaker 5: Oh yeah, and then all of a sudden, bang you're
[3:57] Speaker 5: You're Fitzpatrick and all of a sudden you get MAGPULD.
[4:00] Speaker 5: What wasn't that quick? But you know it was.
[4:02] Speaker 3: But speaking of Magpole, one of the things I think
[4:05] Speaker 3: we're seeing is different companies getting together and saying, Okay,
[4:09] Speaker 3: we got smart people. You got smart people. Yeah, what
[4:11] Speaker 3: can we do if we put all our smart people together? Right? Right?
[4:14] Speaker 5: So yeah, that was a great one with with Ruger
[4:16] Speaker 5: and Magpole. This cooperative approach to providing kind of best
[4:20] Speaker 5: of product and best of companies right, And that's what
[4:24] Speaker 5: we're seeing a lot of it's it's and they're working together.
[4:27] Speaker 5: It's not just hey, it's not these silos anymore of
[4:30] Speaker 5: it's got to be me or nobody. It's we need
[4:32] Speaker 5: to be coming together. And they're bringing some young brands
[4:34] Speaker 5: up as well. And that's when you start to get
[4:37] Speaker 5: a good trigger company, you get a good magpool, you
[4:39] Speaker 5: get a major lead brand too, lead brands in that example.
[4:42] Speaker 5: And that's the innovation sparked that we're seeing right now.
[4:45] Speaker 5: And it's coming to market a little bit now, but
[4:47] Speaker 5: there's a lot.
[4:48] Speaker 3: Say we're seeing some of it on the floor now. Yeah,
[4:51] Speaker 3: but you do the same thing. We all have NDAs
[4:53] Speaker 3: with all these companies. You know things we're hearing but
[4:56] Speaker 3: we can't talk about. But basically, what do you think
[4:59] Speaker 3: next show January of next year, we're going to say
[5:02] Speaker 3: some things blowing up?
[5:03] Speaker 4: Oh yeah, oh yeah.
[5:04] Speaker 5: And so there's two things I think the industry has
[5:06] Speaker 5: learned is work together, not against each other. And when
[5:10] Speaker 5: you get a product, don't start telling me about it
[5:13] Speaker 5: unless I can go buy it right now.
[5:15] Speaker 4: So they're doing a lot better planning.
[5:16] Speaker 5: We're a lot better that I mean they've really really
[5:19] Speaker 5: again it's working together with not just their company, but
[5:22] Speaker 5: the distribution, the retail and the more whole marketing and
[5:25] Speaker 5: create content creators. Now all are coming together. So when
[5:28] Speaker 5: we hear about something or it's ready to go, it's
[5:31] Speaker 5: in the shop, ready to be picked up and used
[5:33] Speaker 5: in the field.
[5:33] Speaker 3: Okay, a lot of fun stuff. Obviously, Brown Els is
[5:36] Speaker 3: not just a supplier of New Dads but also a distributor.
[5:40] Speaker 3: You now sell mo o, you sell guns, you sell
[5:43] Speaker 3: all of it at Brownhills dot com. But I want
[5:46] Speaker 3: to talk about Kilimanjarro, what you went to Killiman Jarrow
[5:50] Speaker 3: and climb that bad boy.
[5:51] Speaker 5: Yeah, that was the last actually last time we were
[5:53] Speaker 5: on the air together. It was with a group of
[5:57] Speaker 5: nonprofits that focus on the special ops are military soldiers.
[6:01] Speaker 5: About five of us have got together and it was
[6:04] Speaker 5: a sponsor one of the foundations.
[6:06] Speaker 4: It was Sole Special Operations.
[6:08] Speaker 5: Wounded Warrior was the one I was representing, and we
[6:09] Speaker 5: brought somebody that's gone through programs. It was a special
[6:12] Speaker 5: operator wounded. A lot of I don't say PTSD, but
[6:16] Speaker 5: it's a lot of operators. Center which is head issues,
[6:19] Speaker 5: body issues, spiritual issues, alcoholism. I mean just to and
[6:23] Speaker 5: these are individuals that you get twenty two operators or
[6:27] Speaker 5: people in the military a day committing suicide, and that's
[6:31] Speaker 5: just a number that they contract. So it's more than that.
[6:34] Speaker 5: And our job as a group of people were to
[6:37] Speaker 5: inspire both the industry or America or we had someone
[6:42] Speaker 5: from Watchtower out in England. We've got a we've got
[6:47] Speaker 5: a job to do as well to make sure that
[6:48] Speaker 5: these soldiers come back. And it's yeah, that's a good point.
[6:52] Speaker 5: That's a good way to put it. And also to
[6:54] Speaker 5: inspire some of these guys that these are These are
[6:56] Speaker 5: rock hard men that are strong and and they go
[6:59] Speaker 5: from being top of their the pyramid to uh not
[7:04] Speaker 5: off the teams because of some damage. And and these
[7:08] Speaker 5: are examples of people who have been through.
[7:09] Speaker 4: That journey their model.
[7:10] Speaker 3: You took them all this, Yeah, how many did you
[7:13] Speaker 3: get up the mountain?
[7:14] Speaker 4: All of them? And they hold our tales up there really?
[7:17] Speaker 5: Oh yeah, yeah, these are strong guys and and this
[7:20] Speaker 5: is and they have gone through these journeys. One of
[7:22] Speaker 5: them was actually in jail for being a bad actor,
[7:24] Speaker 5: but he's got a path back to success and he
[7:27] Speaker 5: wants to be and all of them are inspirational to
[7:29] Speaker 5: say hey, this is this is how you can do it.
[7:32] Speaker 5: And these are well known guys inside their communities, and
[7:35] Speaker 5: to open up and say I've had problems and if
[7:37] Speaker 5: you do, you need to step into one of the trows.
[7:39] Speaker 3: They can go out and carry that message because these
[7:41] Speaker 3: people are used to facing really hard challenges in their
[7:45] Speaker 3: professional lives. That's what they did. Yeah, and now you said, okay,
[7:48] Speaker 3: let's go climb a really freaking hard mountain.
[7:51] Speaker 5: To gay that was That was it, and their way
[7:54] Speaker 5: of dealing with it is we're going to muscle through this.
[7:57] Speaker 5: This uh tough part. It's physically they can get through it.
[8:01] Speaker 5: They're mentally very tough on that side. But when you're
[8:04] Speaker 5: dealing with some of the stuff inside, you can't muscle
[8:07] Speaker 5: through it. You try to cover it up, and that's
[8:10] Speaker 5: when you start to have this this this circle of
[8:13] Speaker 5: depression that kind of hits us or grabs people. And
[8:16] Speaker 5: these are the guys that say that, yeah, I get it,
[8:18] Speaker 5: come with us, I understand what you're going through.
[8:21] Speaker 4: I'll tell you what their story was. We had a
[8:23] Speaker 4: documentary about this.
[8:24] Speaker 3: Oh nice.
[8:25] Speaker 5: Yeah, so it's out right now and it's it's being
[8:28] Speaker 5: used to make sure, we're bringing people to the to
[8:30] Speaker 5: the table and say yeah, I need help. They're not
[8:33] Speaker 5: going to tell their their wives or families or anybody else.
[8:35] Speaker 5: They can only tell the people who have been through it.
[8:37] Speaker 3: Yeah, because those people don't understand. We may think we do, yeah,
[8:41] Speaker 3: we hadn't been there. No, so they need to talk
[8:43] Speaker 3: to each other, all right.
[8:44] Speaker 4: So so killnjar was I mean, it was awesome.
[8:48] Speaker 3: You don't have to do this. Why do you do this?
[8:51] Speaker 5: You know, you take a look at the gifts that
[8:54] Speaker 5: you're given or the opportunities that you have in front
[8:56] Speaker 5: of you. I'm an adventure at heart, and I want
[8:59] Speaker 5: to climber.
[9:00] Speaker 3: Let people know me. You climb like the tallest mountains ko.
[9:03] Speaker 5: We get some good mountains behind this and then add
[9:05] Speaker 5: some might fee on some some pretty good peaks. As
[9:08] Speaker 5: you bring people on the journey, they discover a lot
[9:10] Speaker 5: about themselves. Uh, how to how to work together, especially
[9:14] Speaker 5: if you're doing mountaineering in a case like this, or
[9:15] Speaker 5: you're paddling the canyons. You have to work together as
[9:18] Speaker 5: a team. And that's the thing that I think fills
[9:20] Speaker 5: my bucket more than anything else. It's how do you
[9:22] Speaker 5: take somebody who has never had an experience. I grew
[9:26] Speaker 5: up in small town, Iowa, so you don't become a
[9:28] Speaker 5: mountaineer living in the flat plant of Iowa. As you
[9:31] Speaker 5: go on those adventures, you learn a lot about yourself.
[9:33] Speaker 5: You learn a lot about how where you're strong and
[9:35] Speaker 5: where you're not strong, and how to create a team
[9:38] Speaker 5: around you, which has helped me in the business world
[9:40] Speaker 5: more anything else. How do you create a team where
[9:42] Speaker 5: each person's strengths adds to a greater outcome? And and
[9:46] Speaker 5: and that philosophy that that's what fills my bucket.
[9:48] Speaker 4: So helping people out that.
[9:49] Speaker 3: You're not just building a team, you're building the team members. Yeah,
[9:53] Speaker 3: same time.
[9:53] Speaker 5: Yeah, and they're building me. So I mean, it's these
[9:56] Speaker 5: are these these are things that I'm real. We got
[10:00] Speaker 5: some guys that used to work for us. I'm really
[10:02] Speaker 5: proud of where they've gone. We were part of their
[10:05] Speaker 5: life for a bit. A couple a lot of are magpull.
[10:08] Speaker 5: It's a great feeding ground for Magpul and I love
[10:11] Speaker 5: it because they're great people.
[10:13] Speaker 4: We've got a lot of people around this industry.
[10:14] Speaker 3: So talks about that for a second. I've said this before,
[10:18] Speaker 3: and I think if you're in another world, another industry.
[10:21] Speaker 3: You don't really understand. It's like the people here at
[10:25] Speaker 3: the various gun companies, they'll beat each other up all
[10:28] Speaker 3: day long for marketing. Yeah, and then go out to
[10:30] Speaker 3: dinner and drinks together. Because this is a different industry.
[10:34] Speaker 3: It's a community, it's a family. It's based on culture
[10:37] Speaker 3: and beliefs and a strong passion for the Second Amendment.
[10:41] Speaker 4: Yeah.
[10:41] Speaker 5: Yeah, so it's you never well, nobody ever wants to
[10:45] Speaker 5: burn a bridge, but here you want to continue to
[10:47] Speaker 5: build those bridges and build those relationships and welcome this
[10:50] Speaker 5: next generation. We're the old guys in the industry right now,
[10:53] Speaker 5: so bring this next generation in and make sure that
[10:58] Speaker 5: we have a perpetuation of this industry friendship because you're
[11:01] Speaker 5: helping each other out and we're seeing it right now
[11:03] Speaker 5: with the new products they're coming out. These these friends
[11:05] Speaker 5: are working together. They may have been a different company
[11:07] Speaker 5: or the same company. Now they're on their own product
[11:10] Speaker 5: or their own company. Now they're working together. It's great.
[11:13] Speaker 3: It is setting over a drink over the cocktail on
[11:15] Speaker 3: laphan and say, well, what if we did this thing right? Yeah, okay,
[11:18] Speaker 3: so the last thing I would say would tag onto that.
[11:22] Speaker 3: And you are an industry leader here is if somebody's
[11:25] Speaker 3: out there thinking that sounds cool, there are companies everywhere
[11:29] Speaker 3: in this industry that are hiring right now.
[11:31] Speaker 4: Oh yeah, they're looking for your Absolutely, yeah we are.
[11:34] Speaker 5: So this industry is coming out of right after Like
[11:38] Speaker 5: every peak, there's a trough and that's when you kind
[11:40] Speaker 5: of consolidate and make sure your systems are really lean
[11:43] Speaker 5: and a lot of good companies have leaned up and
[11:45] Speaker 5: gotten their stuff right. And just like the innovations coming
[11:48] Speaker 5: at Shoto next year, which is January, people need to
[11:51] Speaker 5: be ramping up right now and there's a lot of
[11:54] Speaker 5: tailwind that we're starting to feel behind it. So they're
[11:57] Speaker 5: gonna have to be how do you get in this industry?
[12:00] Speaker 5: I'll start looking at take a look at the air
[12:02] Speaker 5: fifteen dot com. There's some Reddit stuff that's out there
[12:05] Speaker 5: in our space. Call these companies up. See if there's
[12:07] Speaker 5: engineering operations, there's a lot communications. There's a lot of
[12:10] Speaker 5: good stuff coming to this industry and we're gonna see
[12:13] Speaker 5: I think a breakout coming.
[12:14] Speaker 3: And we are in a better place politically. I just
[12:17] Speaker 3: we're going to be in a better political landscape, which
[12:19] Speaker 3: is going to help everybody in this industry and everybody
[12:22] Speaker 3: who's a two a person and it's a great time
[12:25] Speaker 3: to get into this. So if you are interested in this,
[12:28] Speaker 3: find a company, start checking out because everybody's looking for everybody.
[12:32] Speaker 3: Talk to here sus. We're hiring. Yeah, we just need
[12:34] Speaker 3: people to come on in.
[12:35] Speaker 5: Right, that's good, that's a good position to be in
[12:37] Speaker 5: his industry. Thank god, as was, we're coming out of this.
[12:40] Speaker 5: We've seen it over eating.
[12:41] Speaker 3: We've seen the slumps and you know the trough say,
[12:43] Speaker 3: and now we're headed back up. Pete Brown outro Browneils
[12:46] Speaker 3: dot com. Happy to call your friend and then you
[12:49] Speaker 3: guys do good stuff. You personally do good Tom, Thank
[12:52] Speaker 3: you so much, Pete. All right, now it's a good
[12:54] Speaker 3: time for you to call in with your range reports
[12:57] Speaker 3: that Tom Talk.
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[15:42] Speaker 3: Here. We're all over the place today. You can be
[15:44] Speaker 3: a part of that too. Used to give me a
[15:46] Speaker 3: called an eight to sixty six talk gun or tom
[15:48] Speaker 3: talk gun. Rifles, pistol shotguns, doesn't matter, different kinds of AMMO.
[15:52] Speaker 3: I was just figuring out there's loaded up the forty
[15:54] Speaker 3: five stuff going down to gunsight forty five ACP. You know,
[16:01] Speaker 3: I have had knowledgeable people tell me people I really
[16:04] Speaker 3: respect that with a forty five you might as well
[16:08] Speaker 3: just shoot FMJ for your defensive loads. I know that
[16:12] Speaker 3: goes against everything we're told about what's good AMMO for
[16:16] Speaker 3: defensive stuff. Expanding AMO or like the black Hell's mo
[16:20] Speaker 3: their honey badger stuff. I don't know starts off with
[16:24] Speaker 3: a great, big old bullet though, forty five caliber. What
[16:28] Speaker 3: do you think for forty five FMJ I'm and maybe
[16:32] Speaker 3: not for nine oh man, I don't know where I
[16:34] Speaker 3: follow on that one. I don't know enough about it.
[16:37] Speaker 3: I would have to do some shooting into gel and
[16:40] Speaker 3: see what it all looks like. There you go. Let's
[16:43] Speaker 3: go talk to Let's say John is in Dallas on four. John,
[16:46] Speaker 3: thank you for your Patience's glad we got you back
[16:48] Speaker 3: in here. How can we help?
[16:50] Speaker 10: Hey, good afternoon, Tom, Hey, thanks for having Jack carhonally.
[16:54] Speaker 10: I really like that interview, so we appreciate that.
[16:57] Speaker 3: Oh he's the heck of a author. If you haven't
[16:59] Speaker 3: read books, you really ought to.
[17:02] Speaker 10: Oh, I will, I will, I will.
[17:04] Speaker 3: Hey.
[17:04] Speaker 10: I was gonna say, if you're talking about forty five,
[17:06] Speaker 10: you like that big two hundred and thirty bullet forty five,
[17:10] Speaker 10: you should try a four hundred and forty grain bullet
[17:13] Speaker 10: out of a five hundred smith and wasn't magnum. That'll
[17:16] Speaker 10: that'll get your blood going.
[17:19] Speaker 3: Yes, it will that they hold on and see what happens.
[17:23] Speaker 3: Kind of a rig, isn't.
[17:24] Speaker 10: It, Yes, sir, yes, sir. So to the question, I
[17:28] Speaker 10: have a five hundred Smith and Wiston Magnum ten and
[17:31] Speaker 10: a half inch barrel the Performance Center, and I learned
[17:33] Speaker 10: a lesson, so when you mount the scope, you have
[17:36] Speaker 10: to have good I relief. So the four text I
[17:39] Speaker 10: put on there is a one to eight. It has
[17:41] Speaker 10: terrible IE relief. And there's no way you want to
[17:43] Speaker 10: put your face close to the end of that gun
[17:46] Speaker 10: if it doesn't have good I relief. So if anybody
[17:49] Speaker 10: listening out there, make sure you get good I relief.
[17:51] Speaker 10: You put a ship on that bone.
[17:53] Speaker 3: Well, let me jump in. Was this an extended I
[17:56] Speaker 3: relief handgun scope or was it a rifle scope?
[18:01] Speaker 10: That's what I learned. I didn't know there's a difference.
[18:03] Speaker 10: I bought a Vortex rifle scope and I figured that yeah, no, no.
[18:09] Speaker 3: No, no, no no no, because yeah, you're looking at
[18:11] Speaker 3: like a three inch I relief on that one three
[18:14] Speaker 3: to four inches, and what you really need is something like,
[18:16] Speaker 3: you know, twenty inch I relief, right.
[18:20] Speaker 10: Right, And I learned that the hard way. But here's
[18:22] Speaker 10: here's the big question. Though, if you look at any
[18:25] Speaker 10: manufacturer's scope, whether schmidten Bender, Vortex or night Force. They
[18:32] Speaker 10: don't say that there's a limit to what type of
[18:35] Speaker 10: round you're shooting, whether it's you know, twenty two or
[18:39] Speaker 10: a five hundred magnum. So is there a particular scope
[18:42] Speaker 10: that you like to put on your big bore revolvers.
[18:48] Speaker 3: I don't. I'm trying to remember the only think what
[18:52] Speaker 3: I have a scope on. I don't have any scope
[18:54] Speaker 3: on any I don't have a scope on any of
[18:56] Speaker 3: my big boar revolvers now that to think about it. Uh,
[18:59] Speaker 3: there's ay for a magnum I got from Dad, and
[19:02] Speaker 3: I don't even remember. It's probably like a loophole two
[19:05] Speaker 3: x two and a half X. I don't think I've
[19:06] Speaker 3: ever shot it. I'm an iron sight guy, so it's
[19:10] Speaker 3: kind of where I am. But I would say go
[19:14] Speaker 3: with one of the major brands of Buris. I'm not
[19:17] Speaker 3: trying to remember who's making pistol long I relief pistol
[19:20] Speaker 3: scopes loophole. I don't think Vortex has any pistol scopes though,
[19:25] Speaker 3: does it? No?
[19:27] Speaker 10: I don't think so, and I learned that the hard way.
[19:29] Speaker 10: But I do have a Borus on a BFR forty
[19:32] Speaker 10: five seventy that's been mounted. So yeah, that hard enough.
[19:37] Speaker 10: Oh it's pretty good. That's a handful too. But that
[19:41] Speaker 10: one actually has pretty good hand release. I'm sorry, iron lease,
[19:45] Speaker 10: So that one's pretty good, and I may going back
[19:47] Speaker 10: to them. It's just that this thing, it's such a
[19:50] Speaker 10: long barrel, and I do want to take it out
[19:52] Speaker 10: to one hundred and fifty two hundred yards, So I
[19:55] Speaker 10: do want a good quality scope. And I figured it
[19:57] Speaker 10: one day it would be great, and I had one
[19:59] Speaker 10: laying around.
[19:59] Speaker 11: But you're right, and.
[20:03] Speaker 3: Scope, you definitely cannot use a rifle scope on your pistol.
[20:06] Speaker 3: The other thing is, you know, the question becomes how
[20:08] Speaker 3: much magnification do you need? And I would think something
[20:11] Speaker 3: along the top end of seven or eight is enough,
[20:14] Speaker 3: and honestly, probably would be just fine with five. Again,
[20:18] Speaker 3: depending on what you want to shoot. If you're shooting,
[20:20] Speaker 3: you know, groundhogs or something, you want a little bit
[20:22] Speaker 3: more magnification. But if you're talking about shooting a deer
[20:24] Speaker 3: or an elk, honestly, a six five or six powers plenty, Yes.
[20:29] Speaker 10: Sir, that's what I'm thinking. That's what I'm thinking too,
[20:32] Speaker 10: because even when I look down at I'm like, wow,
[20:34] Speaker 10: I'm not shooting out to you know, five hundred yards
[20:36] Speaker 10: with a five hundred magnet, But no, no, you're not.
[20:39] Speaker 3: Yeah, and just remember a you know, say you're shooting
[20:43] Speaker 3: at one hundred yards and you're using a five power scope,
[20:46] Speaker 3: it's going to look like it's twenty yards away. So
[20:48] Speaker 3: it's just just not that big a deal. Look, gi
[20:50] Speaker 3: me a favor. When you figure it out and you
[20:51] Speaker 3: start shooting another scope on there after you've had a chance,
[20:54] Speaker 3: give me a call and let me know which one
[20:56] Speaker 3: you got and how it's holding up to that recoil.
[20:58] Speaker 10: Okay, yes, sir, we'll do. Thank you, mister Gresham. Thanks
[21:02] Speaker 10: for having me on all.
[21:03] Speaker 3: Right, appreciate the calls there. I just grabbed Ray in
[21:06] Speaker 3: Denver on line three. Hey, Ray, you're on gun Talk.
[21:10] Speaker 3: What's going on? Hi?
[21:12] Speaker 12: Tom, Thanks for taking the call. I purchased a Smith
[21:16] Speaker 12: and Wesson five to seven for my wife to use
[21:18] Speaker 12: as a defensive handgun, primarily because arthrits in her hands.
[21:23] Speaker 12: She was having trouble racking and slide back on some
[21:27] Speaker 12: of the nine milimeters, and we bought the guns. She
[21:31] Speaker 12: loved shooting it. We test fired several beforehand, and but
[21:36] Speaker 12: it kept jamming on her. So my jamming, I'm it
[21:40] Speaker 12: was a failure to go into battery and it was
[21:43] Speaker 12: pretty consistent, So sending in Smith and Wesson. They well
[21:48] Speaker 12: took it to a gun smith first and he said
[21:51] Speaker 12: he couldn't figure out that if there's any problem with it,
[21:54] Speaker 12: senating Smith and Wesson. Four weeks later they ship it
[21:57] Speaker 12: back saying they polished it and brain tests and everything
[22:01] Speaker 12: is good.
[22:03] Speaker 3: I'm thinking, I'm just gonna throw in a thought here.
[22:06] Speaker 3: It doesn't and I don't have very much time. Does
[22:09] Speaker 3: it do the same thing when you shoot it as
[22:10] Speaker 3: when she shoots it? Yes, Okay, then it's probably not her.
[22:16] Speaker 3: Tell you what, do me a favor? Shoot me an
[22:18] Speaker 3: email director Tom at gun talk dot com and let's
[22:21] Speaker 3: see if we can't figure out what's going on and
[22:23] Speaker 3: maybe get Smith and Wesson in the three way conversation
[22:26] Speaker 3: and we can help you out. Tom at gun talk
[22:28] Speaker 3: dot com and I'll go to that for you. Okay,
[22:31] Speaker 3: We're worked on that. We appreciate the call, sir, eight
[22:33] Speaker 3: six y six talk gun I'm Tom Gresher. I'll just
[22:41] Speaker 3: figure it out the upcoming class I'll be doing that
[22:44] Speaker 3: gun site and the classes I take it at Raine
[22:47] Speaker 3: ready in the other places and think of that. What
[22:50] Speaker 3: are the takeaways when people say, well, what do you
[22:54] Speaker 3: learn there? I've had actually people say, well you don't.
[22:57] Speaker 3: I shot with a guy went to gunsite and you know,
[23:00] Speaker 3: he didn't come out of there being a really great shot. Okay,
[23:04] Speaker 3: that's not really what it is. It's not about competition
[23:08] Speaker 3: shooting or target shooting. There are schools you can go
[23:12] Speaker 3: to for that. You can go train with top competitive
[23:15] Speaker 3: shooters now teacher to shoot a little bit groups or
[23:18] Speaker 3: to shoot really fast, you know, and there's are fun.
[23:23] Speaker 3: It's good, there's nothing wrong with that. You just got
[23:26] Speaker 3: to figure out what it is you're wanting out of
[23:29] Speaker 3: a class, and you've got to find the right place
[23:31] Speaker 3: to go. I mean, there are shotgun classes you can
[23:34] Speaker 3: take at gun site, but you're not gonna shoot in
[23:37] Speaker 3: clay targets. And then you can go take a shotgunning school,
[23:41] Speaker 3: wing shooting school with Brian Bolenski at Field Sport up A,
[23:44] Speaker 3: Traverse City, Michigan, and you'll learn all about swinging a shotgun,
[23:48] Speaker 3: hitting clay targets. Or you can go to the Orvis
[23:51] Speaker 3: wing shooting school. You got to figure out what you're
[23:53] Speaker 3: looking for. And Taylor that at Rain's ready, you will
[23:59] Speaker 3: ern to shoot. Chris is going to teach you how
[24:02] Speaker 3: to shoot well, and he's really good at that. There
[24:06] Speaker 3: may be a little bit of shooting faster, but mostly
[24:09] Speaker 3: it's going to be about let's put good shots on target.
[24:13] Speaker 3: And that's a wonderful thing. It's a good baseline thing
[24:15] Speaker 3: to know. At gun sight, you're going to learn how
[24:20] Speaker 3: to draw and shoot and move, and how to put
[24:23] Speaker 3: two shots in the torso and then one in the head,
[24:27] Speaker 3: and how to shoot a little bit more quickly with
[24:30] Speaker 3: turn targets. And they're going to do a building block
[24:33] Speaker 3: system and starts you from this is the gun and
[24:35] Speaker 3: this is the holster, and we're going to draw slowly
[24:38] Speaker 3: and smoothly, and how do we get the good grip
[24:40] Speaker 3: and how do we align sits? And how do we
[24:41] Speaker 3: press the trigger? Speak of trigger? Did you notice in
[24:45] Speaker 3: the interview with jay Lee's Williams we had I said,
[24:48] Speaker 3: what would be the one thing that you could just
[24:50] Speaker 3: teach people over the radio? She said, well, she had
[24:53] Speaker 3: an experienced two years ago that really changed her shooting
[24:57] Speaker 3: and proved it quite a bit. She real that she
[25:00] Speaker 3: had smaller hands and she needed a shorter trigger, so
[25:07] Speaker 3: you may have to hold your hand up if you
[25:09] Speaker 3: shoot right hand it, hold your right hand up, extend
[25:12] Speaker 3: your figure out like it's a gun. But now that's
[25:14] Speaker 3: your trigger finger. Now curl it back in like you're
[25:16] Speaker 3: gonna pull the trigger. If the trigger is too far
[25:19] Speaker 3: away from where your hand is, your finger contacts the
[25:22] Speaker 3: trigger before it has come to a ninety degree angle.
[25:26] Speaker 3: If you hit a ninety degree angle, you can press
[25:28] Speaker 3: the trigger straight back. But if the finger is contacting
[25:33] Speaker 3: the trigger and it's still swinging to the side, then
[25:36] Speaker 3: when you press the trigger, the gun is going to
[25:39] Speaker 3: move to the side. And then she said, also, if
[25:41] Speaker 3: my trigger finger is flat against the side of the gun,
[25:46] Speaker 3: when I pull the trigger, it's going to move the
[25:49] Speaker 3: gun to the left a little bit. With a nineteen eleven,
[25:52] Speaker 3: you can get different length triggers. It's very easy to
[25:56] Speaker 3: replace the trigger on a nineteen eleven, and you can
[25:59] Speaker 3: with other guns, and she's done it with her ars.
[26:01] Speaker 3: But it goes to show the level of detail that
[26:06] Speaker 3: competitive shooters do with this. I've heard other people talk
[26:10] Speaker 3: about that it's part of getting the fit right, and
[26:15] Speaker 3: a lot of our striker fired pistols we have now
[26:18] Speaker 3: come with different size palm swells or hand grips or
[26:22] Speaker 3: inserts in the back, and that, for lack of a
[26:25] Speaker 3: better term, gives you a different length of pull, the
[26:28] Speaker 3: distance between your hand and the trigger so that you
[26:31] Speaker 3: can get the trigger finger just right. Just things that
[26:36] Speaker 3: you haven't thought about that you learn from people like that.
[26:39] Speaker 3: You go, oh huh. My attitude on these classes is
[26:44] Speaker 3: pretty simple. And some might say, well, it's not a
[26:49] Speaker 3: cost effective attitude. I'll accept that, But my attitude is
[26:55] Speaker 3: simple as this. If I come away from a class
[26:59] Speaker 3: with one solid thing I've learned, then it was worthwhile
[27:05] Speaker 3: because I learned something and went, wow, Okay, that's the
[27:08] Speaker 3: thing I can take and work on. Or that's a
[27:11] Speaker 3: thought I could put in my head. And it may
[27:13] Speaker 3: be in the case of a self defense class, not
[27:16] Speaker 3: even a shooting thing. It's like a oh, that's a
[27:19] Speaker 3: different way of looking at that. That's the way I
[27:21] Speaker 3: could get out of a situation without having to go
[27:24] Speaker 3: to my gun, and that's a really valuable skill. It
[27:28] Speaker 3: may be more valuable than learning how to shoot. Frankly,
[27:32] Speaker 3: you're in traffic, you get blocked off, there's something going
[27:34] Speaker 3: on out there. What do you do now? I don't know. Well,
[27:38] Speaker 3: let's talk about it. Let's think about that. How about
[27:41] Speaker 3: number one, stay out of the center lane. When you're
[27:46] Speaker 3: in the center lane and you've got to land of
[27:48] Speaker 3: cars to your right and a land of cars to
[27:51] Speaker 3: your left, you have nowhere to go, do you. If
[27:55] Speaker 3: you're on either side, you might no guarantees here, but
[27:58] Speaker 3: you might have the opportunity to pull off the road
[28:02] Speaker 3: to go around somebody, to do whatever it takes to
[28:05] Speaker 3: get away. But if you're jammed up in the center
[28:08] Speaker 3: lane and there are cars stopped in front of you
[28:11] Speaker 3: and behind you and to either side of you, you
[28:14] Speaker 3: kind of got to take what comes your way and
[28:15] Speaker 3: then deal with it. And that may involve shooting. And
[28:17] Speaker 3: I'd rather drive away from it than get involved in
[28:20] Speaker 3: a shooting thing. So there you go. Oh, we had
[28:23] Speaker 3: a call from Jim in Redford. He didn't want to
[28:25] Speaker 3: be on, but he said on that issue with the
[28:27] Speaker 3: five seven that our caller had, he said he had
[28:30] Speaker 3: the same problem. I said if when he went to
[28:34] Speaker 3: Fiochi Ammo the problem went away. Interesting. I knew or
[28:42] Speaker 3: know how Finicky twenty two Rimfire Ammo is. For some reason,
[28:46] Speaker 3: it did not click into my head to think of
[28:49] Speaker 3: trying different Ammo in the five to seven. So that's
[28:54] Speaker 3: an awfully good idea. I mean, talk about your cheapest
[28:57] Speaker 3: fix ever if you can get it to run with
[28:59] Speaker 3: a different kind of AMMO, just switch Ammo and go
[29:01] Speaker 3: with that. Tell you what, David, don't go anywhere I'm
[29:04] Speaker 3: gonna uh oh no, no, we can do that. We'll
[29:06] Speaker 3: get you in. Let's go grab David right now in
[29:08] Speaker 3: line three out of Oklahoma City. Hey, David, what's up.
[29:12] Speaker 11: I'm the guy that called in about this time last
[29:15] Speaker 11: year that I'll apparently I walked in my sleep and
[29:18] Speaker 11: throw my guns away.
[29:20] Speaker 3: Uh okay, I kind of remember that. That was weird.
[29:24] Speaker 11: I found it, do tail. I have to We have
[29:31] Speaker 11: a farm and I have to do the farm taxes
[29:33] Speaker 11: for my mom and my brother. And I was going
[29:36] Speaker 11: through my file cabinet getting all their tax info and
[29:40] Speaker 11: I thought, man, something doesn't look right, and I'll look down.
[29:44] Speaker 11: Sure enough, there was that pistol.
[29:48] Speaker 3: Okay, I can tell the story again. Were you sleep
[29:51] Speaker 3: walking and you took your pistol and put it somewhere?
[29:55] Speaker 13: Yeah?
[29:56] Speaker 11: Uh? I sleep occasionally do KSD and sometimes I'll try
[30:04] Speaker 11: to cook. But apparently this time I wanted to be
[30:08] Speaker 11: anti gun, and I thought I threw it in the
[30:11] Speaker 11: trash because I couldn't find it anywhere in the house.
[30:15] Speaker 11: I even had the bomb sniffing dog from the school
[30:17] Speaker 11: district that I worked for come over to my house,
[30:20] Speaker 11: ran it through the house, didn't hit on anything. The
[30:26] Speaker 11: room that I have my file cabinet in is also
[30:31] Speaker 11: the room that I store all my reloading powders, so
[30:34] Speaker 11: I got in or twelve pounds of reloading power, so the.
[30:37] Speaker 3: Dog can't smell the gun with all that going on another.
[30:40] Speaker 11: Exactly, So, I was digging through the file cabinet and
[30:46] Speaker 11: something didn't look right, and sure enough I hid it
[30:49] Speaker 11: from myself.
[30:51] Speaker 3: Well, I want to know that. The important question is
[30:54] Speaker 3: was it filed under F for firearm or a P
[30:56] Speaker 3: for pistol?
[30:59] Speaker 13: Neither?
[30:59] Speaker 11: It was down in the very bottom.
[31:00] Speaker 3: It was.
[31:03] Speaker 11: Actually it was down there right next to my mortgage,
[31:06] Speaker 11: original mortgage statement. So it was just like, why did
[31:10] Speaker 11: I do that? I have no clue.
[31:13] Speaker 3: There you go, Well, that's a great story. I'm glad
[31:16] Speaker 3: you found your pistol. Man. Thanks, I appreciate the call, sir.
[31:21] Speaker 3: That's good stuff. Let me do this. I want to
[31:23] Speaker 3: grab Tom in Flagstaff, Arizona. This sounds interesting. Hey Tom,
[31:27] Speaker 3: you're on gun tar. What's going on?
[31:30] Speaker 13: Mister Gresham, Thank you for taking my call. It's a
[31:32] Speaker 13: privilege speaking to you. I was down at a ranger
[31:36] Speaker 13: ready and I got to train with the Cole team
[31:38] Speaker 13: and Julie and she's just an incredible individual. So this
[31:41] Speaker 13: day I hear her voice in my head telling me
[31:44] Speaker 13: to take up the trigger and you know, giving me advice.
[31:48] Speaker 13: They're just their astounding sisters. You know, you hear their
[31:52] Speaker 13: accomplishments and their championships. But to see those two shoot
[31:56] Speaker 13: head to head when they were shooting the lollipops, yeah,
[31:59] Speaker 13: it's like a sub machine gun going off. Those guys
[32:01] Speaker 13: are incredible.
[32:03] Speaker 3: Well, and the other part of it, don't you find
[32:05] Speaker 3: it's like this incongruous thing. It's like, Okay, I'm hearing
[32:09] Speaker 3: a really good firearms instructor and shooter talk, but I'm
[32:13] Speaker 3: seeing what I mean. Honestly, to older folks like us
[32:17] Speaker 3: were thinking, she's just a little girl. How does she
[32:19] Speaker 3: know this stuff? Right?
[32:22] Speaker 13: It's like she has ten pinkies, her fingers are so small,
[32:26] Speaker 13: but she has a grip on a gun that if
[32:28] Speaker 13: the Lord reached down to pick that nineteen eleven out
[32:31] Speaker 13: of her hand. She's going up back to heaven with it.
[32:34] Speaker 4: She is so strong.
[32:35] Speaker 13: And powerful with that grip. The way she even loads
[32:39] Speaker 13: a magazine. She can load a magazine with those little
[32:42] Speaker 13: fingers faster than I can do it with a mag
[32:44] Speaker 13: rei loader. But exactly what you're saying them when we
[32:49] Speaker 13: started to clash. You hear about all their accomplishments and
[32:52] Speaker 13: the championships they won. But once you see those young
[32:55] Speaker 13: ladies pick up a firearm and they start shooting the
[32:59] Speaker 13: nineteen eleven and she had a broken she had broken
[33:02] Speaker 13: bones in her foot, and she's, you know, hopping around
[33:04] Speaker 13: with a boot on her foot. You know how range
[33:07] Speaker 13: reading is a gravel range, But she's tell them the
[33:09] Speaker 13: gravel for two full days, you know, not Grimace in
[33:12] Speaker 13: just just tough as nails taking the paint. And still
[33:15] Speaker 13: when they had to shoot off with the sisters, the
[33:18] Speaker 13: issue just started the class with that, because that that
[33:21] Speaker 13: blew my mind, how they just empty those rounds and
[33:25] Speaker 13: those lollipops exploded.
[33:28] Speaker 3: Yeah, all right, So I got a fish for the
[33:32] Speaker 3: compliment here, but I got to just ask you Raine, ready,
[33:36] Speaker 3: it's something else, isn't it.
[33:38] Speaker 13: Yes, sir, you said, is it cost effective?
[33:41] Speaker 4: It was.
[33:42] Speaker 13: It's been a dream of mine to get out there,
[33:44] Speaker 13: and I'd really wanted to. Heck, I closed out a
[33:46] Speaker 13: savings account. I'm kind of a low budget kind of guy.
[33:49] Speaker 13: I closed out, you know, a savings account and took
[33:52] Speaker 13: my wife and I out there for the privilege to
[33:55] Speaker 13: train with Chris and his whole team. His whole team's
[33:58] Speaker 13: top notch and Dan and I just happened to be
[34:00] Speaker 13: on the side of the line, in the side of
[34:02] Speaker 13: the classroom that we spend more time with. Now Jalice
[34:07] Speaker 13: is opposed to me. And I got to, you know,
[34:09] Speaker 13: talk to the cult ferry and I knew she was
[34:12] Speaker 13: teaching classes, but and that was down in Phoenix, and
[34:15] Speaker 13: I am, I.
[34:16] Speaker 3: Sure today that's the day she wore the tutu out there.
[34:22] Speaker 13: Yeah, the cult fairy, exactly.
[34:24] Speaker 3: The cult Fairy showed up. She's got a wand and
[34:26] Speaker 3: wearing a tutu and out shooting everybody. It was hilarious.
[34:30] Speaker 13: Oh, it was awesome. It's totally worth it. It's it's
[34:34] Speaker 13: when you say, what do you come out of the class.
[34:36] Speaker 13: I've come out with so much that I'm one of
[34:38] Speaker 13: those kind of people you've been making fun of all
[34:40] Speaker 13: these years that has guns and goes out in the
[34:42] Speaker 13: woods and shoots, that doesn't know what the hell he's doing.
[34:45] Speaker 13: I wasn't even holding my nineteen eleven correctly because with
[34:48] Speaker 13: my fat hand and without the top of beaver tail,
[34:52] Speaker 13: I was ditting at my thumb in the right spot.
[34:54] Speaker 13: But with those new nineteen eleven Colt competitions, you know,
[35:00] Speaker 13: it's a big beaver tail. It plus like that's super
[35:02] Speaker 13: your GT. Twenty five, It's got that killer beavertail on
[35:05] Speaker 13: the ruder. It puts my hand in the right spot.
[35:08] Speaker 13: I learned so much. I been doing everything wrong for
[35:11] Speaker 13: thirty forty years.
[35:13] Speaker 3: Yeah, but Tom, how do you find out? How do
[35:15] Speaker 3: you know you're doing it wrong? If you'd never go
[35:18] Speaker 3: get instruction, You.
[35:20] Speaker 13: Just don't, mister Gresham. You just don't know what you
[35:23] Speaker 13: don't know? Like you always say, it really is just
[35:26] Speaker 13: like you know, I've been doing it.
[35:28] Speaker 3: I'm shooting, I'm enjoying it, but and you think I'm
[35:31] Speaker 3: doing fine. That's the problem is you think I'm doing fine.
[35:33] Speaker 3: I'm thinking how would you know? Now? If you ever
[35:37] Speaker 3: went to shot competition, you would know because you'd see
[35:39] Speaker 3: people who could outshoot you. But if you're not shooting competition,
[35:42] Speaker 3: and if you haven't had instruction, you just as you say,
[35:46] Speaker 3: you just don't know. Well, look, I appreciate the call.
[35:48] Speaker 3: I appreciate you. I mean, jay Lee's and Justine, these
[35:51] Speaker 3: Willim's sisters are amazing, and yeah, a chance to get
[35:54] Speaker 3: a little instruction from her on the YouTube channel and
[35:57] Speaker 3: you can go there and do that. It's a jay
[35:59] Speaker 3: Lee's Williams shooting over on YouTube and check that out.
[36:03] Speaker 3: Great great range report too. I appreciate that they are impressed.
[36:07] Speaker 3: I mean, well, like I said, we were, we're shooting
[36:10] Speaker 3: video of them. They had to be twelve, and I
[36:14] Speaker 3: mean there were little young girls and thinking, okay, how's
[36:17] Speaker 3: this going to work. We're told, yeah, these are professional shooters, okay,
[36:22] Speaker 3: and then they start shooting and you're just going, holy cow. Yeah,
[36:27] Speaker 3: I get it's kind of like watching Tiger Woods, I
[36:30] Speaker 3: guess when he was twelve and hitting long drives and
[36:33] Speaker 3: doing what I mean. There are people who are blessed.
[36:36] Speaker 3: You know, Jerry Mitchellick was blessed. You know, these people
[36:39] Speaker 3: are blessed, and it is not true what people will
[36:42] Speaker 3: occasionally say where they said, well, you know, if I
[36:44] Speaker 3: had a sponsor, but I had an AMMO sponsor, I
[36:47] Speaker 3: could shoot that much. I could be that good man.
[36:51] Speaker 3: Maybe probably not more than likely not, But there's a
[36:58] Speaker 3: way to find out. If you think that way, just
[37:02] Speaker 3: go sign up for a local competition, you know, just
[37:05] Speaker 3: do your best, see what you can do, and if
[37:08] Speaker 3: you do like I do, where I showed up and went, oh, okay,
[37:10] Speaker 3: there are twelve year olds who are out shooting me here,
[37:13] Speaker 3: and you know, I can do what I can do,
[37:15] Speaker 3: and I know where I am at least because I've
[37:18] Speaker 3: gotten some training and I did try my hand in
[37:20] Speaker 3: competition a little bit and went, well, there's people are good.
[37:23] Speaker 3: You know something else I've figured out and I don't
[37:26] Speaker 3: know what it is. I guess that's the way you're made. Originally,
[37:29] Speaker 3: I am not a competitive person. Don't care if somebody
[37:34] Speaker 3: beats me, don't care if I beat somebody else. There
[37:37] Speaker 3: are people I know who it would just kills them
[37:41] Speaker 3: if somebody beats them. So I never did well at
[37:45] Speaker 3: competitive sports because I just didn't care. I mean, apart
[37:50] Speaker 3: from the lack of you know, athletic ability, that's a
[37:53] Speaker 3: problem too. I mean, I did athletic things I just
[37:56] Speaker 3: didn't do competitive athletic things. I did every kind of
[38:01] Speaker 3: water skiing. You can do ski shows, and you know,
[38:05] Speaker 3: we would we would pull the lid off of a
[38:08] Speaker 3: Niggoo cooler seriously, and we would ski on the lid
[38:13] Speaker 3: of a nig cooler. Just anything we could get on
[38:16] Speaker 3: to the top of a tabletop. We would ski on
[38:19] Speaker 3: a boat, paddle, whatever it took, and obviously we'd barefoot
[38:22] Speaker 3: ski and do all of that. I guess that's athletic,
[38:24] Speaker 3: but it's not competitive. So when I am around people
[38:28] Speaker 3: like the Williams sisters and Jerry and all these competitive shooters,
[38:31] Speaker 3: they live and die for that. They just can't believe
[38:34] Speaker 3: that people don't have that competitive drive and for whatever reason,
[38:39] Speaker 3: never had it, never was able to develop it. And
[38:42] Speaker 3: I mean, I'm okay with that. I'm glad there are
[38:45] Speaker 3: people like that, because if they didn't have that kind
[38:47] Speaker 3: of drive, they wouldn't work hard to figure out what
[38:51] Speaker 3: works best and how they can make themselves better. And
[38:55] Speaker 3: by them working figure out what works best and how
[38:59] Speaker 3: they could shoot, they passed that along to us and said,
[39:02] Speaker 3: you know, we've learned that that way. We used to
[39:05] Speaker 3: hold a pistol. That's not so good anymore. We can
[39:07] Speaker 3: do better than that. Here. Let me show you a
[39:09] Speaker 3: different way to hold that pistol. Let me show you
[39:11] Speaker 3: a different way to massage that trigger. Let me show
[39:14] Speaker 3: you a way to acquire the sites or that red
[39:17] Speaker 3: dot that we've worked on developed and it works, and
[39:20] Speaker 3: because they are that competitive, we benefit from it. I
[39:31] Speaker 3: was looking at the new you probably have seen it,
[39:33] Speaker 3: the new enhanced video of the guy who was charging
[39:37] Speaker 3: through the security station at the White House correspondence dinner,
[39:43] Speaker 3: and gene Piro is now saying that it's definitive that
[39:47] Speaker 3: he did in fact shoot the Secret Service agent, that
[39:51] Speaker 3: the agent was not shot by friendly fire. He was
[39:53] Speaker 3: shot by this guy with his shotgun. Okay, fine, we
[39:57] Speaker 3: were wondering, I mean a lot of us wondered about that.
[40:00] Speaker 3: I didn't stake out a position on it because, oh gee,
[40:03] Speaker 3: I didn't know a lot of people had real strong opinions.
[40:06] Speaker 3: And this is how it is. Well, guess what you
[40:09] Speaker 3: don't know and staking out position like that can often
[40:14] Speaker 3: come back and bite you, make you look foolish, and
[40:16] Speaker 3: it has. But let's go back to what do we
[40:20] Speaker 3: get out of this. Think about the reaction time we
[40:25] Speaker 3: had one officer who reacted very quickly got his gun
[40:28] Speaker 3: out and started shooting at this guy, and everybody else
[40:31] Speaker 3: is like clueless, like in It's like they're running in mud.
[40:37] Speaker 3: And I realized that they had all gone into condition white.
[40:41] Speaker 3: Jeff Cooper, who we talk about a good bit next week,
[40:45] Speaker 3: created the color code. White is what you are in
[40:49] Speaker 3: when you're at home and the doors are locked and
[40:52] Speaker 3: you're safe and you're not worried about anything. The moment
[40:54] Speaker 3: you step out of your house, you got to be
[40:55] Speaker 3: in yellow, which is just being actively alert, paying attention
[40:59] Speaker 3: to what's going on. And then there are other color codes,
[41:04] Speaker 3: but they ramp up. But frankly, I took a piece
[41:08] Speaker 3: of yellow duct tape, but I put it on in
[41:11] Speaker 3: the middle of the steering wheel of my car, just
[41:13] Speaker 3: a little piece of yellow tape. It stays there all
[41:16] Speaker 3: the time. It's my reminder. When I get in the car,
[41:19] Speaker 3: I go into condition yellow and I don't come out
[41:22] Speaker 3: of yellow until i'n get back in my house. What
[41:26] Speaker 3: does that do for you? Really, what it does for
[41:31] Speaker 3: you is it reduces your reaction time because you're looking
[41:36] Speaker 3: for things, You're not scared, you're not worried, you're not apprehensive.
[41:40] Speaker 3: You're not frightened, you're just aware. You're just looking. You're
[41:44] Speaker 3: scanning your left, you're scanning your right, you're kind of
[41:47] Speaker 3: looking around. You're seeing people's hands. It's not a big
[41:50] Speaker 3: deal once you get used to it doesn't require any
[41:53] Speaker 3: extra effort. But what it also means is you are
[41:58] Speaker 3: less likely to be surprised. When you're surprised, you're way
[42:03] Speaker 3: way behind the power curve and you're moving slowly. When
[42:10] Speaker 3: you can see it coming sooner, you can react more quickly,
[42:15] Speaker 3: sooner into the event. Maybe get out of the way
[42:20] Speaker 3: in the case of an oncoming vehicle. Maybe get your
[42:23] Speaker 3: gun out if that's what's necessary. Maybe fire shot if
[42:27] Speaker 3: that's what's necessary. And remember getting your gun out doesn't
[42:30] Speaker 3: mean you're gonna have to shoot. Something can happen between
[42:33] Speaker 3: the time you draw and when you press the trigger
[42:36] Speaker 3: that says, oh okay, we're not shooting today. It's part
[42:42] Speaker 3: it's becoming a different person a bit, and honestly, it's
[42:46] Speaker 3: one of the things you get out of a class
[42:47] Speaker 3: at gun side. You come away a changed person. I've
[42:51] Speaker 3: told people that I've said, prove me wrong. If you're
[42:56] Speaker 3: a class there and you think it didn't change you
[42:58] Speaker 3: and who you are, and you change your life, call
[43:00] Speaker 3: me and let me know you never had anybody say that.
[43:04] Speaker 3: How does it change? It just makes you more aware,
[43:08] Speaker 3: and frankly, I think it allows you to enjoy life
[43:11] Speaker 3: more because you're seeing more things, You're paying attention, you're
[43:13] Speaker 3: going out and doing stuff. If you want to pick
[43:15] Speaker 3: this up and have this conversation, we can do that
[43:17] Speaker 3: during the after show, which is coming up in just
[43:19] Speaker 3: a few minutes. Give me a call right now at
[43:21] Speaker 3: Tom Talk Gun. We'll get you in this week. As
[43:24] Speaker 3: you go through your life, try to stay in condition yellow.
[43:28] Speaker 3: When you step out of your house. What's going on
[43:31] Speaker 3: in that car next to you? What's going on down
[43:33] Speaker 3: the road? Five cars in front of you, not just
[43:35] Speaker 3: the bumper of the car in front of you, Know
[43:37] Speaker 3: what's going on? Look far down the road, look left
[43:40] Speaker 3: and right. See what's happening. Is that a moose? Is
[43:45] Speaker 3: that to step out in front of you. The more
[43:48] Speaker 3: you look, the more you're aware. The more you're aware,
[43:50] Speaker 3: the safer you are. It's as simple as that, he's
[43:53] Speaker 3: safe out there. Oh yeah, and carry all the time.

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