# Showhouse Secrets Part I - Breaking Down Costs and Benefits

An episode of [The Install: Life & Design with Paloma and Caroline](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1885981800), 8 Sep 2026, 45 min.

Audio: https://api.riverside.com/hosting-analytics/media/756868658109ead0fb95febaab438135e16fd0a9fd231395fcb73d54e45f0940/eyJlcGlzb2RlSWQiOiJmNDU5MjVkYS0zOWQzLTRiNjQtYjEwOC1kZjM0MDk3NmM2M2UiLCJwb2RjYXN0SWQiOiI3Y2ZlNDgzNC0zOTgyLTRlZmEtOGUxNi05MDdkZTQ4ODUyMjkiLCJhY2NvdW50SWQiOiI2OTY5MDBmYmNiNTY4OTM1YWE2NWJkYTIiLCJwYXRoIjoibWVkaWEvY2xpcHMvNmE5MzNmYWUyMWU5NTNmNDMwMmRhNzY4L3RoZWluc3RhbGxwb2RjYXN0cy1zdHVkaW8tY29tcG9zZXItMjAyNi04LTI5X18yMi0yMy0xMC5tcDMifQ==.mp3

Episode Summary Paloma and Caroline continue to endure the on-going Southern summer heat and humidity, a Botox clock that suddenly seems to be running fast, and the Sisyphean task of growing out one’s hair—fortified by probiotic ice cream and a root touch-up pen stashed in the car console. They celebrate Substack’s slower, meatier charms and make a spirited case for shelter magazines to come back thicker, more beautiful, and worth paying for. Then the gloves come off on designer showhouses: career-making exposure, multiple-six-figure rooms, the glamour of being assigned a basement hallway, and the hard-won truth that one great photograph can matter more than square footage. Part one ends with the volume turned up—and the really juicy disasters still waiting in the wings. Follow The Install Subscribe to The Install Edit on Substack for weekly essays, product links, behind-the-scenes extras, and the next installment of Ask the Install. The Install YouTube: @theinstalldesignpodcast Instagram: @theinstallpodcast TikTok: @theinstallpocast Paloma Website: www.palomacontreras.com Instagram: @palomacontrerasdesign TikTok: @palomacontrerasdesign ShopMy: @palomacontreras Caroline Website: www.carolinegidiere.com Instagram: @carolinegidieredesign TikTok: @carolinegidieredesignbts ShopMy: @carolinegidiere Chapters 00:17 — Heat Wave 02:16 — Beauty Maintenance 04:20 — Full-Fat Treats 07:44 — Hair Rescue 11:28 — Substack Revival 14:25 — Industry News 15:34 — Print Matters 19:42 — Showhouse Secrets 22:17 — Showhouse History 23:38 — Career Momentum 26:53 — Basement Reality 30:49 — Invitation Only 32:50 — Room Strategy 35:13 — Budget Shock 36:40 — Small Spaces 39:07 — Creative Freedom 43:44 — Announcement of Part Two

## Transcript

Paloma: Hey Caroline, how are you?
Caroline: Hey Paloma, I'm well, how are you?
Paloma: Doing well, thank you. Ready for this heat to be over. It is like a hundred, I think the air temperature is supposed to be 102 here today, and I am fully over it.
Caroline: Mm, geez, Louise. Yeah, no, I I get it. We, you know, what's lucky for us is like yesterday when I in the middle of the day when I w had to run an errand and it was showing like 101, 102 in my car thermometer, which is not entirely accurate. When my car sits in the sun, it's gonna
Paloma: Sure.
Caroline: take a minute for it to, So that was after I've been running around for a while. So who knows exactly what it was? But so it's getting really hot in the middle of the day. But in the mornings, for the past three mornings, we haven't had any humidity. And it's
Paloma: No.
Caroline: been in the low 70s. And so
Paloma: Wow.
Caroline: it's been really great. And in fact, tennis yesterday, as I was leaving, it was starting to get really hot, but it was nice and fresh and completely doable. I'm a
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: real nitty when it comes to heat and humidity and sports. I just like, no thank you. Like, I'm out, you know. I mean, I'll do it, but yeah,
Paloma: Yeah, catch you later. Yeah.
Caroline: but I'm not gonna try.
Paloma: Well that sounds heavenly to be in the low seventies with no humidity. I don't know what that's like, but yeah. Sure. Yeah, I mean it would be a welcome relief for sure.
Caroline: I didn't say no, I just mean lower. Lower than what we're accustomed to. Feels like you can actually breathe. And so it's p pleasant. Yeah. You can open the doors, like from our kitchen onto the patio. I'm like a real Nazi about that. I I love them being open so everybody like has gotten used to that. But when it's hot outside, you know, all that heat goes upstairs and when I've got to get ready, I'm like, guys.
Paloma: Yeah. Yeah.
Caroline: I can't I can't get this makeup to dry when I'm sweating.
Paloma: Ha ha ha.
Caroline: Anyway, anyway, okay. Tell me what did you have a high and low this week?
Paloma: well, my low is that I feel like we've talked about this before at some point, but I feel like my Botox is wearing off faster. Like really fast. If like faster than before.
Caroline: Yeah. Faster than. Mm-hmm.
Paloma: I used to be able to go like a good four months. And now I feel like trying to think back on when I did it. It might have, I can't remember if it was end of May. Which would make sense then. Or if it was in June, it might have been June. And I feel like it's worn off completely already and we're in mid-August.
Caroline: You know what I think it is?
Paloma: What's on?
Caroline: I think it's we have these cameras in front of us once a week. And so we're much
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: more cognizant of what's going on. And I think you project a lot of things too. You not you, but one projects a lot of
Paloma: One, mm-hmm.
Caroline: things onto their image of themselves, you know. but I'm coming up on I am three. months and a week. I've got three
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: weeks to go before my pi appointment. And I ask myself every morning, am I gonna make it? Am I gonna make it?
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: And truthfully, I mean again, we I just need to take a picture two weeks after I get the Botox done.
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: and then take one again at three months and take one again at four months, right before I do it. And then really look at those and compare. I'm not sure. I I mean
Paloma: Tell in my forehead because I feel like when I don't get a ton. I mean, I I have a fairly
Caroline: Mm.
Paloma: conservative approach and I go to somebody who has a more natural touch, which I
Caroline: Mm.
Paloma: like, but I can tell when it's worn off and like my you can see like in my forehead, it's not as still as I like it to be. You know, I like there
Caroline: Mm-hmm.
Paloma: to be a little bit of movement. I don't want to look
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: frozen, but yeah, I do too.
Caroline: I get di sport or de sport. Okay,
Paloma: Yeah, Disport.
Caroline: yeah.
Paloma: Mm-hmm. I do too. And we've gone back and forth between is it Disport and Juveau? Maybe. I don't know. Or maybe Juveau is a filler.
Caroline: Don't know that one. Or at least if they're using it, they haven't mentioned that they've switched it.
Paloma: Yeah. There's like two brands. Maybe it was Botox and Disport. And tried a different one and it was it wore off just as quickly.
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: So I don't know. I don't know what it is. But my high is I discovered this. Delicious treat at Whole Foods
Caroline: Mm.
Paloma: called Culture Cup. It's in the ice cream aisle. I love ice cream. That's like my guilty pleasure.
Caroline: Hmm. You and Stephen.
Paloma: I'm not guilty actually. I don't feel guilty about it. I love ice cream. Like that's just the treat I would choose over and over again. but it's great because it's this like tiny little cup, and the cup is lined with dark chocolate, and then there's
Caroline: Mm.
Paloma: ice cream inside, like a scoop of ice cream, and then there's dark chocolate layered on top. So it has like a
Caroline: Mm.
Paloma: hard shell, which is really nice. And it's like a probiotic ice cream, which is really interesting. And it has 10 grams of fiber and only 10 grams of sugar, 140 calories a cup. the strawberry flavor is delicious. I've tried strawberry and mint chocolate chip, and the strawberry was like really, really good. And both Margot and I like it. And it's got I don't really know too much about this, but it's A2 dairy.
Caroline: Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the kind of milk we used for a long time.
Paloma: Okay. So anyhow, I mean I guess like a healthier ice cream treat. And
Caroline: Yeah, yeah.
Paloma: in this heat, it's nice to have a little frosty treat every now and then.
Caroline: I think that A2 works for people that are somewhat lactose intolerant. without
Paloma: Mm, okay.
Caroline: removing the lactose, it's like a different cow or something like that is produces the
Paloma: wow, I'll have to research that.
Caroline: A2 milk and lactose intolerant people can tolerate it better than something like that. I've gotten close.
Paloma: Hmm.
Caroline: I've gotten close. I'm not I don't have that exactly right, but it's somewhere along those lines.
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: so Well, I started getting that a long time ago. But you know, we're back to full fat dairy. I don't know if you are.
Paloma: Yeah. we don't do full fat. I mean like ice cream and things like that, yes. For my Greek yogurt I do the is it the two percent? The two percent and then we do two percent milk, but you do whole milk.
Caroline: Back to whole milk. They say taking the fat out of it is like the wrong thing to do. It's kind of like why you have
Paloma: I just don't like the texture. It's too thick for me.
Caroline: Hmm. that it's almost like it's kind of like a butter and oil with bread. Like
Paloma: Mm.
Caroline: those are that's supposed to be like the fat and the carbohydrate or whatever is supposed to be actually better for you than one or the other alone. Or it's like again, I I
Paloma: Mm-hmm. Yeah, that makes sense. Mm-hmm.
Caroline: only pick up on enough to be dangerous with this information.
Paloma: Well, it's like having if you're gonna have an apple as a snack, that's good. But if you're
Caroline: Mm.
Paloma: having an apple with some peanut butter, that's an even better snack because you're balancing
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: it with healthy fat.
Caroline: Right. Something about the macros. And like the worst thing America ever did was do the skim milk thing because
Paloma: Right.
Caroline: now you're just really getting the sugar and the fat isn't there to like balance that sugar in some way in your system or something like that. I don't know. Anyway, so we're back to full fat. And I gotta say I love it. I'm I'm delighted.
Paloma: I will have like on occasion if Fabian picks up coffee for us on the weekends and we get a latte, if
Caroline: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Paloma: I'm ordering it myself, I'll get like two percent milk, but he'll get the full fat and I drink it and it's delicious, but
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: you know.
Caroline: Yeah. When I get a cappuccino, I'm f full fat. Full
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: fat. And I'm completely off of almond milk, oat milk, any of that stuff. It's all just yeah,
Paloma: Yeah, same. It's just too processed.
Caroline: chemicals. Chemicals for sure.
Paloma: Agreed. So what is your your high and low?
Caroline: Okay, I've got two hair-related highs and lows. Lows is we were talking about it, still growing this hair out. This right here is gonna be the death of me. This.
Paloma: That little bend.
Caroline: Just all of this stringiness, I won't cut it because it needs to grow.
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: And I've had the bottom of my hair cut a million times, and I feel like somebody's pranking me and coming in in the middle of the night and like pulling this out and like. cutting it frequently because
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: it feels like it's not growing. Anyway, having my hair short was great. I loved it. And if length were the only issue, I it you know, I would my hair would probably be three or four inches longer than it is right now if I hadn't been continually cutting it. So that's fine. It's right before the end I was getting frustrated with it and my hairdresser, who I love, my ride or die, went in and like chopped a bunch of hair out of it to tame it. That makes any sense.
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: And it's like that's what all this is. Anyway, it's it's
Paloma: yeah.
Caroline: frustrating. So I spend more time on my hair than I should. Although I busted out the hot rollers this morning and that may be the way that I'm going. It's a lot quicker. I'm
Paloma: Hmm.
Caroline: gonna I'm in a race to spend less time in the bathroom when I'm in a hurry. And hot rollers may just be the ticket. I may just have to roll with a hot roller or a slick back bun. I may be heading to a slick back bun. That may be what I'm doing for the next like
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: six months. Okay, but my high, so that is my perennial annoyance, is not just this week, but every week is my hair.
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: My hello. But my high is a Is a good one. Okay. I have another product. And this one is a life changer. The other one was is great. It was fabulous. I I used it this morning. It's life changing. But this little baby right here, the Tarte Dab and Go. Are you going gray? lucky you. Okay.
Paloma: Not yet, thankfully.
Caroline: Well, for all the rest of us girls out
Paloma: Mm.
Caroline: here who are. Okay. I have used many different root cover things from the sprays
Paloma: yeah.
Caroline: to the powders, to make it in between I get my hair colored every five weeks. And then towards the end, those grays start popping out, you know, as your hair grows, you can start to see them, particularly around the hairline. It is very hard, particularly to treat like right here. As you get older, you know,
Paloma: Sure. Yeah.
Caroline: this is easy.
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: But you can't just spray that spray on the side of your head without having all this brown stuff. And so it's been really hard, but they have perfected it. They finally perfected it. So it's got this little sponge on the end. I don't know if you can see that. And all
Paloma: yeah. Yeah.
Caroline: of the stuff is in the inside of it.
Paloma: Mm.
Caroline: So when you twist it in there, it gets it on there. And you can just very easily like dab it.
Paloma: Mm-hmm. Just stabbing on.
Caroline: I keep it in the console of my car and I take. pop a quick look in the mirror before I hop out. And it is it is like a powder. I mean, I don't know if you can see that. I just dabbed it on my hand.
Paloma: Is it like a powder? Like does it have a dry consistency or is it wet? Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Caroline: Now I'm gonna get that on my white shorts, guaranteed.
Paloma: gosh.
Caroline: but it's just like a powder, but it's not like a loose powder and it's
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: got a little bit of moisture in it. So it's kind of clingy, almost like a lotiony, like a cream almost like a cream, creamy
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: powder. anyway, it works like a million dollars. I I have never found anything better. It's lightweight, it's lasted forever. And it doesn't because the other like if you put the powder on, it might get all over or it might start to melt or
Paloma: Right. Yeah.
Caroline: anything like that. it's really great. It's super great solution. And it's by Tarte, Dab and Go.
Paloma: Awesome. We'll have to link that in the show notes or on Substack. Speaking of, over on Substack, we published our first volume of Ask the Install, in which we answered your questions in great detail. So be sure to send in your questions for the next installment. We'll do one each month. And you may see it on Substack or, you know, we sometimes answer questions here on the pod. So be sure to send those in. You can DM us on Instagram, send in an email, leave a comment on Substack. but be sure that you're subscribing to both so that you are in the loop and don't miss out on any of the good content.
Caroline: Yeah. Yeah. Loving the Substack. I love reading other people's Substacks too. It's I'm glad to
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: see that come back. It was missing from culture for a long time, but I really look
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: forward to having that little gift in my inbox every week.
Paloma: I do too. I also like how intentional Substack feels, like having had a blog for 15 years. and I think where that eventually ended up, you know, blog sort of fell out of favor, but a lot of people were just doing like product roundups. And I feel like Substack is it's a long format platform. It's designed that way, that's the way it was intended to be. And I f I like that people are I don't know, they're taking like a slower approach to it. You know, there's
Caroline: Mm.
Paloma: not like this craziness of churning out posts every single day just because you feel like
Caroline: Right.
Paloma: you have to. It's not that like factory mentality. It's just like when do I feel inspired? What am I gonna write about? And people are like really sharing their voices and writing about interesting things. And of course there's still like product roundups and what what I'm buying and all of that, but there's a little bit more meat behind it, which I appreciate. I really enjoy
Caroline: Mm-hmm.
Paloma: it. It's it's been fun to discover and find new substacks to follow and write our own.
Caroline: And particularly particularly with the people that I'm interested in following and what's going on, I love their substacks because I we we sh do get more, you know, like
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: you do get you know, access to things like, you know, somebody that I follow posted a list of their favorite restaurants in a particular town recently. And I was like, great. Save this.
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: We used to get that a lot with a with a blog. Now if
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: somebody does something like that on Instagram, it's there for a minute and it's kinda gone. And you might save
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: it, but you can't get back to it almost. You know, it's like it's so ephemeral.
Paloma: I know, I feel like I don't know about you, but my I save a lot of stuff on Instagram. There's a lot of stuff in that folder. And I have never once
Caroline: my god.
Paloma: gone in there to organize it. Like if I were smart, I would organize it by category. But it's
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: just this like long log of of years of posts that I have saved. And what I'll do is I'll like
Caroline: Scroll. Yeah. Recipes.
Paloma: start going down and I'll be like, I don't need that anymore, and delete as I go. And then every time I delete something, it takes me back to the top.
Caroline: Ugh.
Paloma: So I never get very far. If anybody has like a good method for organizing that, let us know.
Caroline: The game is it has been designed to prevent you from doing that.
Paloma: Yeah, for sure. I think you're absolutely right. I did want to mention a little newsworthy information that came through. congratulations to our friend Benjamin Raynert, who just announced his new appointment as US editor for Homes & Gardens magazine in the UK. he was previously at Elle Decor,
Caroline: Wow.
Paloma: and the OG listeners will remember that he was one of our first guests on the pod a few months ago, and we discussed everything about
Caroline: His book? Yeah.
Paloma: styling for photo shoots and producing shoots. So we're super excited for Ben. and look forward to yeah, look forward to seeing what he does over at Homes & Gardens. Mm-hmm.
Caroline: That's amazing. That is big. That is huge. And I'm sure he's the US editor. So that means,
Paloma: US editor.
Caroline: okay. So he'll be staying here, but creating content for them to publish
Paloma: Yes.
Caroline: in the UK.
Paloma: I yes, I believe so. Mm-hmm.
Caroline: That is so great. Man, that just saying in the context of interior design, anything that's like H & G gets me excited. Yeah.
Paloma: yeah. I know. Well, it's such a a Hallmark brand and you know, they've been around for a long time and they still produce beautiful content. So
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: super excited to see what he does over there. Yeah.
Caroline: Yeah, me too. Me too. That's great. That's great. I'm still on my bandwagon for greater investment in US magazines,
Paloma: Mm. Yes.
Caroline: shelter magazines, make them more expensive, thicker, bigger, bigger ads,
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: like make people pay for it. I really
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: I really do think that's where we are. Everybody can get
Paloma: Well
Caroline: quick stuff on Instagram all the time.
Paloma: Agreed. It goes back to the conversation we had last week about gatekeeping and discernment. I feel like they kind of go hand in hand for so long at at the peak of the shelter magazine boom, whatever, like when
Caroline: Mm.
Paloma: things were going well and all we had so many magazines to choose from and they were also beautifully produced and they had big budgets. people look to them as really guideposts for what was new, what was next, what was worthwhile, you know, who
Caroline: Mm-hmm.
Paloma: the up and coming talent was, who the you know, tried and true talent was. You know, it was really about taste and whether your taste was more modern or more traditional, whatever, there was something for you in whichever publication resonated with you. But I c you know, it's a tough industry. There's no denying that publishing and it's gotten harder and they're fighting an uphill battle because now there are smaller budgets and teeny tiny teams where each person has to wear fifty different hats. but I agree, I think making that investment would be so worthwhile because now a lot of that content can be found online where there is no gatekeeping. And it sort of takes away from the authority of a shelter publication, of an editor, to be the one ushering in, you know, a style, a trend or an idea when it's so readily available elsewhere. But I think that there's still an opportunity for them to come back strong and to inspire us in the way that they once did. Like there are there
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: are are magazines out there now who are doing that. You know, there's just not as many issues because they don't produce as many.
Caroline: And for example, if I could quite give a recent personal experience, not with a shelter magazine, but with a magazine
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: because the entire I mean across the board and publishing in the US, not in the
Paloma: Yes.
Caroline: UK, we're struggling on struggle bus unless it's a pay, a paid situation, more like Cabana and Frederick, who are thriving be you know. So there's the answer. But in any event, I I have been so slammed with work, working late, getting up early, trying to do stuff, bringing work home, working all day Saturday, working all day Sunday, doing all this kind of stuff. I've finished my book. but I've been saving my Vogue with a cover, with a new cover with Richard Gere's son and Kaia. Yeah, so thick. I've been saving
Paloma: it's this thin. It
Caroline: it and I sat there this Not this morning, last night when I got in and spent my evening out on a lounge here, like the old days, just looking at all the ads and taking in for myself like what the trends are gonna be, because there wasn't a big trend report, thankfully.
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: It that was refreshing. It was just like, here are all the ads. You can pick up the trends, here are our photo shoots. And you can see how we've styled and all the different pieces and all the interesting people that they had shot and styled and the story reading the little articles. It was just like such a treat. And it felt, I mean, it just felt so good. And we really just need more of that. I need we need
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: to go back to it.
Paloma: I think we'll get there. I think that there's gonna be a renaissance. I really do. I think people are gonna go back to print media, slower content that they can digest at a more leisurely pace rather than this like barrage and constant bombardment of information that we've become accustomed to. That's my hope anyway.
Caroline: We've got to. We've got to get off the we've got to get off the crazy train. I mean, I'm just done
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: with it. Like it's too much craziness.
Paloma: Well, speaking of craziness, I'm so excited to dig into today's topic. We're gonna talk
Caroline: Yes.
Paloma: all about designer show houses and whether they're worth it. Caroline and I have both done several show houses. We're both show house veterans. we have a lot to say and share on the topic. you know. Designer showhouses, I think, have become more popular than ever. They produce some of the most beautiful and inspiring rooms you might see. But what people don't often know or understand unless they've done one is what it takes to make that happen. so we'll dig in. Why do you think that show houses have become such an important part of the design industry?
Caroline: I think that it's much like I think all brands are trying to get directly in front of a customer and whether it's an immersive experience or it to create a tactile experience because everything is virtual. And this is one of the only ways because they're real Nazis up there at high point about letting in the public. Like average person cannot go into high point and see the new collections for themselves. They either see they mainly just see digital images of things, whether or not they're gonna
Paloma: Right, it's to the trade only.
Caroline: Yes, exactly. So show houses give brands from designer all the way down to, you know, light switch companies. An opportunity to get directly in front of the consumer.
Paloma: I also think to circle back to our our conversation on print media, with there being fewer magazines, fewer issues, it's harder nowadays for a designer to have a project published. It's harder to get noticed. And so a a show house, you know, really creates huge momentum for a designer
Caroline: Creates a lot of odds. Yeah.
Paloma: who's looking to spur their career forward, to get their portfolio, their work out there, their name out there, because you have this incredible media push, PR push behind you for
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: the duration of the show house. And it's incomparable to anything else. Like there is no other marketing effort that you can do outside of a show house that has that level of momentum. so I think that's another yeah, well,
Caroline: Right. Some of them. Some of them.
Paloma: some of them, yes. I mean something like a Kips Bay, and even that, I would say it's like some cities more than others. you know, it's just a very r highly recognized brand. It's in its fifty-first year and it's a very coveted opportunity. So I do think that a lot of designers aspire to do it if they haven't done it before because they they realize the opportunity it represents for them. How many have you participated in? Okay.
Caroline: I've done two. How about you?
Paloma: Which ones have you done? I mean I know, but tell them.
Caroline: I did Dallas and Palm Beach, Dallas and Palm Beach and Kips Bay.
Paloma: Kips Bay, okay. my first show house, I was thinking about this. I was like, I've done five or six. So my first was in 20 sev 2018, 2017. it was the Southern Style Now Showhouse in New Orleans. And at the time it was sponsored by Traditional Home. And I think that they went on to do Charleston and Savannah, and then Southern Style Now was no more. But that was my first show house experience. And then I did Kips Bay in 2019. So that would have been 2017. Kips Bay, New York in 2019. In 2020, I was the honorary chair for the Lake Forest Infant Welfare Showhouse. And I also
Caroline: yeah.
Paloma: designed the dining room, which is where the panels behind me are from.
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: I have lots of souvenirs. There's like a Kips Bay settee over there, my
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: Lake Forest panels here, but I did that in 2020. It opened in June of 2020 at the peak of COVID. So we'll get into that and the craziness later. And then 2022, I did Kips Bay Palm Beach. 20 last November 25, I did Kips Bay Dallas. And I'm currently working on the Southern Living Idea House in Fredericksburg, Texas, which opens in a couple of weeks or maybe around the time that this podcast airs. So Lots. Lots of lots of show houses.
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: Yeah. what made you say yes the first time?
Caroline: made me say yes?
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: no, I was angling. Like what made them say yes is the question.
Paloma: What made you want to do it? Why did you seek it out?
Caroline: Well, for the reasons that we have
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: discussed, I well first up at it was Kips Bay and certainly with the franchising of Kips Bay that has come through COVID, there are so many more opportunities. But when I was doing that or angling to get a position, that had not fully come to fruition. And we were coming out of this history of there being like 19 or 20 designers in New York once a year. It was published in the New York Times, you know, just a very different element. They had just started right before COVID with Palm Beach. And then they weren't gonna have Kips Bay in New York, and so they were gonna do it in Dallas. And this it was the second year and I was pushing really hard to to try to get a slot because I wanted the publicity and I wanted the feather in my cap of being associated with Kips Bay.
Paloma: Yeah, those are great reasons. I would say for me it was this very similar. with the first one, the opportunity came to me. And at the time my goal was to really legitimize myself as a designer. And I feel like it it did that for me. because I'd been a blogger. I was still blogging at that time and I wanted to be taken seriously as a designer. And so that was really my motivation at that point. And then when I did Kips Bay for the first time in New York in 2019, it was another sort of like, okay, I I want to show a larger audience what I can do. And again, it's sort of like it's I think it doing a show house can create momentum and can also catapult a designer. Like it just sort of helps push your career along. And elevate your profile in a way that eventually leads to opportunities.
Caroline: Mm.
Paloma: so that was certainly the motivation there. And then I would say, like, by the time that I did the last few, it was just sort of like, okay, we have the bandwidth. I feel like at a point I became kind of addicted to the rush, which we can get into more later because there is, it's crazy. Doing a show house is insanity. the timeline is. Crazy, the you know, the the parameters that you have to work within are not normal. You are really putting yourself and your team through your paces. And so at the end of it to feel the satisfaction of having pulled off the seemingly impossible, that became a little bit addictive to me. So I just wanted to do it again and again. I think I'm good for now. I think I'm good for
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: a while. But like last year I was like, okay, we have the bandwidth and I feel like I need a little boost. We need to elevate things. I'd come off of a book tour a couple of years later earlier. And it was like, okay, what do we, what do we do to get things moving around here? And so that was the motivation, the most recent time. well, so let's go back to your first time in Dallas. Do you remember walking into your room, your space, and thinking, what have I gotten myself into? How am I gonna manage this?
Caroline: A hundred percent. I
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: I really got I I wouldn't say I was gonna throw up, but it made me that level of an anxiety. And also
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: before I had gotten there, a little behind the scenes, as I said, I was I pardon me, I had been angling and using every avenue that I had to. Apply pressure to try to get them to say yes to me. and I had spent in the two weeks between finding out that I had gotten it and finding out what my room was, two, three weeks. I had literally done a scheme for every room in the house. Like, if I get the dining room,
Paloma: well.
Caroline: I'll do this. If I get the living room, I'll do that. And I put schemes together, I did everything just like. threw the brakes on everything else focused on this. Okay.
Paloma: Mm.
Caroline: And I got my room assignment. And you know this because I called you. I
Paloma: It was not what you expected.
Caroline: got a hallway in the basement that wasn't even showing on the the floor plan. They had to kind of like create it, plus a powder bath. And so Not anything that I had really prepared for. And as I've often said, if you want to know where you fall on the interior design totem
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: pole, sign up for a national show. They'll tell you. They'll tell you exactly
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: where you fall. And for me, it was all the way to the basement. Didn't even get a proper room. Got the hallway in between everybody else's rooms. So anyway, so I thought, hell no, I'm not doing this. And then I talked to you, I talked to Mark Sykes, and you agreed with me, but then you both said you really kind of have to do it or they won't ask
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: you again, which was good advice. So I was like, all right, let's go. But as I approached the house, Nazera Hendel from Kips Bay had indicated that a couple of people had dropped out and that there were a couple of rooms that were available if you wanted to look at those and maybe swap. When you showed up. Okay.
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: So I was like, okay, here we go. Yeah. No, I'm gonna get myself a better room. When I got there and saw like what we were actually dealing with and the size of these other rooms and what was and I was like,
Paloma: Yeah. There's a reason they dropped out, probably.
Caroline: no, I think I'm good with my hallway
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: of powder bath. This is gonna be more than I can do. So anyway, yeah. That's that
Paloma: Well,
Caroline: was my situation.
Paloma: you did the right thing. I'll tell you, the first time I did Kips Bay, I got very lucky that I had a very nice room with beautiful windows. It was a nice size. the house itself was in terrible condition. I mean, it it oftentimes in those houses it's you're getting lipstick on a pig. Like y if somebody goes in and buys that house, they they've got a lot of work ahead of them, like it might look okay. It's a kind of a hodgepodge because there's a lot of different things happening in different rooms. But once you open up those walls, I mean, nobody's doing that stuff. but my advice to you came from something that I had witnessed firsthand
Caroline: Mm-hmm.
Paloma: because there was a young, well-known designer who had been assigned a room and she didn't like it. She was it frankly, like I would have thought it was a fine room. It was a nice room, nice size room, but she was like, This is not. I'm not doing this room. This is a terrible room. Absolutely not. And dropped out. And I just know that like that I mean, she's fine now. She's doing great. But it didn't go over well. And I can't imagine she would ever be invited back if she wanted to participate. so you know, it is a community and it's serving
Caroline: Well, it's just human hu
Paloma: a charity. So you it's you when you go in and you say, I wanna do this, like, yes, there's a self serving component because you're doing it for your career and you're investing Thousands upon thousands of dollars. So you should have an ROI, but there's also a huge charity component, and there's a responsibility associated with that.
Caroline: Yeah, it's also human nature too. If you apply to do something and they make you an offer and you don't accept it, you can't expect to apply again and get that offer a second time. You know? I mean, that's
Paloma: Right. That's right. That's right.
Caroline: just nobody's gonna do that.
Paloma: So speaking of, are designers invited? Do they apply or both?
Caroline: Both, I think.
Paloma: Yeah, I think so too. I I I never knew the first time around. Like I just knew that there's an application process and you submit your portfolio and there's a committee that reviews it. But I do also know once you're in the fold and you're someone who's done like Kips Bay, for example, if you've done it before. And you have a relationship with the people there and you express interest, like they may reach out to you and say, Hey, are you interested in doing
Caroline: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Paloma: this city this year? Or you could reach out and say, Hey, I'm thinking I'd love to do the show house again. And it can be a less formal kind of situation.
Caroline: think they're trying to create a full deck of cards, right? For each show house. So
Paloma: Mm-hmm. Yes. Correct.
Caroline: bottom, middle, and top. And
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: when they don't have enough of one or the other, they're they're out there soliciting people
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: in that echelon.
Paloma: Right. And people may not know this, but for Kips Bay specifically, there's a rule. And I think it can be somewhat loose because I know that people have done Kips Bay more frequently than this. But the sort of unofficial rule is you can only do it every three years because they want to show, you know, new perspectives. They don't want the same people doing it over and over again. and to your point, I think it's a a matter of bringing in like big top tier names that are recognizable that people are gonna buy tickets for and then new talent that people are gonna feel like they're discovering when they walk through the house.
Caroline: Yeah, sure.
Paloma: did do you get to choose your room? I guess the first time you certainly didn't. Did you get to choose the second time?
Caroline: Well, I mean how much behind the scenes do we go? I don't know. I don't either.
Paloma: I know, I feel like I don't want to get in trouble, but let's just say you can express a preference and it's possible that like a preference such as I would really prefer not to do a kitchen or bath or I'm looking for a smaller space this time around. And they might take that into account as they're making their assignments. Yeah.
Caroline: Right. Yeah. Something along those lines.
Paloma: Mm-hmm. is there a strategy behind choosing a bedroom versus a living room or a tiny powder room?
Caroline: Let me tell you, it there's it really just depends. Because here's the trap of the show house that may or may not it depends on how the way the show house is gonna run. There are many show houses that like there's one like Southeast over in Atlanta that Courtney and
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: Randy were just the chairs of. They run that thing like a you know, like a well-oiled machine. They have a contractor who does it. He does all your work. You pick out your stuff. You have different sources that you pick it out from. So if you have a bathroom, you're really just designing it and somebody else is i installing it and putting it together. When you do Kips Bay, it that and the rules have changed and I think they they've adjusted to, you know, group consensus in some ways. But when I was doing it, that when you walked in to my powder bath, there was a hole in the floor and where the toilet had been and there were pipes coming out of the wall for the for the sink. and that was it and I had to be the general contractor like and do every single thing for the bathroom. And
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: that if that is happening, I think you're much better off. Not having anything that relates to plumbing. No. Unless you're that's right, nobody truly wants to
Paloma: There's also not a huge return. Those rooms are so expensive to work on and people aren't spending time in them. You know, the visitors are not like, my gosh, let me check out. You know, like sure they might be like, this is a pretty powder room, but those are not the ones that are getting all the press coverage.
Caroline: If you're not like a bathroom contractor, like or a kitchen contract yeah, exactly. Tons of sense. But if you're
Paloma: Yeah. Or like a Christopher Peacock who does the kitchens, that makes sense for him. It's his bread and butter. Yeah.
Caroline: a designer, this is a lost leader. It's lost time, energy, and precious, you know, resources. it's tough.
Paloma: Yeah. I do think there's a strategy for sure beyond that, even in terms of what you're going for. I think if you've done multiple show houses, like for me, each time I've done one, I've thought, okay, well, what was the last show house room that I did? I've done a dining room, okay, now I need to do a different space. Or, you know, I've done
Caroline: Yeah, for sure. Mm-hmm.
Paloma: several living spaces in a row now. I think if I were to do one again in the future, I might want to do, say, a bedroom, just to showcase, yeah.
Caroline: Yeah, done a hallway, don't wanna do one of those again.
Paloma: And also it you have to be real really realistic about how much budget you have to spend because it may seem
Caroline: Ugh guys.
Paloma: super exciting and glamorous and important to get a big room like the dining room or the big living room, but that's gonna be a fortune to outfit and furnish and get it to the level that it needs to be. So
Caroline: We're talking s I mean, without a doubt, six multiple six figures when you're doing a show house. And
Paloma: Multiple six figures. Yeah. Yeah.
Caroline: that I didn't know that when I signed up. I knew it the second time.
Paloma: Yeah. And also that's yeah. We'll talk more about I think the investment, because there's so much to say about that. But it is
Caroline: Yeah. Yeah.
Paloma: something that you have to plan for and you can't go in
Caroline: Mm-hmm.
Paloma: blind. And so if you're someone
Caroline: Now
Paloma: who's doing a show house for the first time, I think it's smart to do a smaller space and like just make it as fabulous as you can so
Caroline: Yeah, for sure.
Paloma: that you're not getting in over your skis, as you say.
Caroline: Right. And and they're different different show houses have different offerings. Kips Bay is a charity and you're pretty much on your own. There are sponsors, they're you know, they're
Paloma: Yes. You're on your own. Mm-hmm.
Caroline: there brand sponsorships. It's your responsibility to hook up with those. But you know, like I think Flower does a lot more, and I think
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: Southeastern Show House does a lot more.
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: And so, you know, just you should inform yourself as to
Paloma: Right.
Caroline: what will be available to you. that is that you're not gonna have to pay for because you're
Paloma: Right.
Caroline: gonna have so much you're gonna have to pay for.
Paloma: For sure. does the size okay, so I guess we talked about that a little bit. Does the size of the room matter as much as people think? I don't think it does. I think from the perspective of the person viewing the room online or touring the house in person, I don't know that anyone is ever like, this is the most incredible room because it's the biggest or one of the more important rooms. I think people are just as taken by, you know, a beautiful secondary guest bedroom or a sitting room if it's done really well. And it's just, you know, it's subjective. It's it's people different people are gonna respond to different things and that's sort of the beauty of a show house is there's something for everybody.
Caroline: Mark gave me some great advice as I was almost in tears talking to him as he was literally laughing in my face about my hallway in the basement and my powder bath.
Paloma: I can just picture it.
Caroline: Like, what am I gonna do? And he was like, Look at his tagline, make it beautiful. He was like,
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: 95% of the people are only gonna see this online and they have no clue where it is.
Paloma: Yeah, that's right.
Caroline: Make it beautiful, get at least one good picture and push that
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: out on social media, and that's all it's gonna take. It was like it won't make any difference where it is. and I've gotten a couple of clients from that Kips Bay room and a lot of people that have mentioned it later. So, you know, I think there's a lot of truth in that.
Paloma: Yeah, yeah, for sure. So would you rather have the smallest room in a major national show house like Kips Bay or the best room in a smaller regional one?
Caroline: Think I think I would do the former.
Paloma: Yeah. Well, and I can say having done all three cities for Kips Bay, also there's nothing quite like New York. You know, like you get a lot
Caroline: Yeah, I haven't done that yet.
Paloma: of exposure in Palm Beach and Dallas, but it's not to the level of New York. New York is a different animal. It's on a different level. You have editors from each publication physically walking your space. They're coming in. Like they're not all going to Dallas or Palm Beach. Very few of them actually do. And you get a lot more national coverage. I just remember thinking like that was so incredible. And it's not quite it's not quite the same. I mean, you still get a good deal of coverage, but it's not quite the same in those secondary cities that are part
Caroline: Mm-hmm.
Paloma: of the brand. and that's still a national show house. So I I agree. I think the the biggest value is in. doing the most high profile one that you can, even if you're doing a small space.
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: what changes when there is no client? Do you feel more creatively liberated, or is there more pressure because there are no no directives or parameters?
Caroline: Can it can be both, you know, both of those things
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: for sure. when I f the first one I did, I was really debilitated with a ha hallway was just a challenge 'cause though I had
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: five different designers' rooms coming off of mine, right? So
Paloma: Right.
Caroline: now like All of my original ideas I felt like were stupid once I had to interface with all these other rooms instead of just having at a moment, you know.
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: So so that was kind of hard to get started. But the second time I did it, I felt very liberated by it because it was like, I can just do whatever I want to do. Yeah. Make decisions on the fly. Yeah.
Paloma: Yeah. Well, it's really nice because you can sort of you have to do this all very quickly, you know, it all has to come together really quickly, but you can kind of shut out the outside world and outside influences and really get
Caroline: Yeah. That's right.
Paloma: back to that inner voice and like, what is my core aesthetic? What do I want to put out in the world?
Caroline: Mm.
Paloma: What am I currently moved by, inspired by? What do I want to showcase without the con you know, the the context of a client or anything else. You're bound by the timeline, the architecture to a degree because it's a show house and you can, you know, you don't have to do anything in the style of the architecture if you were not motivated to do that. And then of course, your budget. But I always, like in my mind, I'll kind of make up a pretend client, like who I envision living in this room or being, you know,
Caroline: Mm-hmm. Sure.
Paloma: the person who would live in this home that I'm designing and kind of design it for them. I think that that helps
Caroline: Yeah.
Paloma: me creatively and sort of helps me figure out how to get to the finish line. Mm-hmm.
Caroline: Having a framework for your decisions, like an infrastructure, like does this make sense? You know, so that
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: it's not completely unhinged.
Paloma: Right. I find also having done this enough times that people either fall into two camps. They're either showcasing what they do, their core aesthetic, and what they feel would be appealing to potential clients, or they're really trying to push a boundary and do something avant-garde that maybe will be more editorial and get people talking. Which camp do you fall into?
Caroline: I think I've done it both ways.
Paloma: Yeah.
Caroline: Yeah. First one, the first way, the second one, the second way. More editorial.
Paloma: Mm-hmm. I have certainly I I mean, but I think that that's still your aesthetic. Like your room in Palm Beach, you weren't like suddenly
Caroline: Yeah, but it was
Paloma: doing something, you know, you weren't like designing in the Memphis movement, you know, doing something crazy and weird and like not you.
Caroline: I can't imagine a client going that far unless it was a commercial space. You know
Paloma: Sure.
Caroline: what I'm saying? Like the mirror was like way more than I would ever recommend in a
Paloma: Mm-hmm. Yeah, the volume was turned up.
Caroline: room that size in that place in somebody's house. Does that make any sense? I'd like I would use that mirror because it was fabulous, but
Paloma: Sure, that does. Yeah. Right. Yeah.
Caroline: it's just like putting it there in that room
Paloma: Mm-hmm.
Caroline: was much more editorial to you know, so
Paloma: Right. Yes, got it.
Caroline: that's what I'm talking about.
Paloma: Yeah, I feel like I've always, I don't want to say played it safe, but I've definitely fallen more into the former camp where I'm looking at this very strategically because it is
Caroline: Mm, mm.
Paloma: a lot of time and focus off of our other projects. And it's a huge investment.
Caroline: Right.
Paloma: and so my goal is to get a return on that investment, and I'm hoping to you know, resonate with
Caroline: Mm-hmm.
Paloma: people that would want to hire me. And so I'm typically designing with that in mind. So I'm designing in my style with the volume turned up a little bit and it's, you know, really taking into account this a sense of place also. Like in Palm Beach specifically, I wanted to design a room that felt like it honored that quintessential Palm Beach spirit, which is so iconic and so identifiable. And then There were people in that house, a designer who I befriended from California, who I love. We could not be more opposite. But she was like, she designed a room that was totally modern, like had nothing to do with Palm Beach. It could have been anywhere. And she was like, I don't give a shit if I ever come back to Palm Beach. Like, I don't care. I don't care about Palm Beach. I just want to show my work. And I thought that was so interesting because I was out here like, okay, I think it's important to work within the construct of. the actual architecture, the spirit of the place, the landscape, like to honor that, but that doesn't mean that my way is right. You know, like
Caroline: Mm-hmm.
Paloma: you can certainly come at it with a different perspective and still have great success. So you can do it both ways.
Caroline: Agreed. Yeah. And when we come back, we're breaking now. And we'll be back next time, guys, to discuss
Paloma: Yes.
Caroline: what what are all the things that we have on our list. Yet the really juicy stuff is yet to come, right?
Paloma: Yes, so mu there's still so much to dig into.
Caroline: Costs, timelines, vendor relationships, you know.
Paloma: Crazy stories like when things have gone wrong, 'cause they always do. yeah.
Caroline: Exactly. Okay. So tune in next week for part two.
Paloma: See you next time.
Caroline: See you next time.

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