# The File That Surfaced 26 Years Later.

An episode of [Badge of Betrayal](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1852919243), 18 Jun 2026, 23 min.

Audio: https://p.podderapp.com/2544644999/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/2fb3740d-3436-44af-8cc0-a91900716aa5/fbab9570-a7a3-4fd4-a673-b3940044b1b8/cfcb9df7-f732-4879-b9e4-b46d00059597/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=2f1fa4b5-119b-41b5-8749-b3940044b5a4

For 26 years, the official record told one story. Then a previously unseen police file surfaced. In the final days of a respected Tasmanian emergency services leader’s life, he was questioned over a serious allegation, admitted to a sexual relationship he said was consensual, and moved to retire. Two days later, he was dead. This episode examines the newly released documents, a missing briefing note, disturbing allegations from someone connected to the family, and claims of a warning that have never been independently verified. What happened in those final 48 hours and why did it take more than two decades for the file to emerge? Trigger warning: This episode discusses allegations of sexual abuse, childhood trauma and suicide. Some listeners may find the content distressing. The allegations discussed in this episode remain unproven unless otherwise stated. No court has made findings. Where allegations are raised, they are presented as allegations and distinguished from information contained in official records. If this episode raises anything for you, support is available through Lifeline on 13 11 14, by text on 0477 13 11 14, or via online chat 24 hours a day. If you or someone else is in immediate danger, call 000. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:10] Speaker 1: This episode examines serious historical allegations. Joe Paul, Myra Paul
[0:15] Speaker 1: and their two children are deceased and can't respond. In
[0:19] Speaker 1: this podcast, where allegations are raised, we distinguish them from
[0:22] Speaker 1: information contained in official records.
[0:29] Speaker 2: It was with great sadness that we learned of the
[0:33] Speaker 2: death of Mr Joe Paul the Director of the State
[0:38] Speaker 2: Emergency Service. Joe joined the State Emergency Service in late
[0:45] Speaker 2: 1975 as a Senior Training Officer. His talents were quickly
[0:51] Speaker 2: recognised and within a matter of weeks he was promoted
[0:56] Speaker 2: to the position of Principal Staff Officer, Operations. He was
[1:02] Speaker 2: appointed Deputy Director of the State Emergency Service in June
[1:06] Speaker 2: 1990 and became director a short time later. Joe brought
[1:14] Speaker 2: to all his appointments within the service, but especially as
[1:19] Speaker 2: its director, a total commitment to the safety of the
[1:23] Speaker 2: community and the environment. He especially valued the dedicated and
[1:30] Speaker 2: professional contribution of the service's volunteers.
[1:35] Speaker 1: That's an excerpt from the Police Anna report from 2000,
[1:37] Speaker 1: and it's about a man called Joseph Michael Paul, who
[1:40] Speaker 1: died on July 26, 2000. And that's an important date
[1:45] Speaker 1: that we'll come back to soon. But before we do,
[1:48] Speaker 1: I think it's important to explain the role Joe Paul
[1:51] Speaker 1: played in Tasmania. At the end of his career, he
[1:54] Speaker 1: was the director of the State Emergency Service of Tasmania. Now,
[1:58] Speaker 1: that sits inside the Department of Police, Fire and Emergency Management,
[2:02] Speaker 1: Tasmania's SES department. sits as the emergency response and emergency
[2:06] Speaker 1: management arm, not as a police oversight body. Its role
[2:10] Speaker 1: is to protect life, property and the environment during emergencies,
[2:13] Speaker 1: with volunteers responding to storms, floods, road crashes, general rescues
[2:18] Speaker 1: and community support jobs. It also assists Tasmanian Police with
[2:22] Speaker 1: things like search and rescue operations and supports the Tasmanian
[2:26] Speaker 1: Fire Service during bushfires and other major incidents. So while
[2:31] Speaker 1: the SES works inside the same broad department as the police,
[2:34] Speaker 1: its job is operational support and emergency coordination, helping prepare
[2:39] Speaker 1: the state of Tasmania for response to and recover from disasters.
[2:46] Speaker 3: Mr.
[2:47] Speaker 1: Paul was lauded within that organization, and in fact, he
[2:50] Speaker 1: seemed like a model citizen. He served as a commissioned
[2:53] Speaker 1: officer in the Army Reserves for 17 years. As a
[2:56] Speaker 1: result of his defense service, Mr. Paul was awarded the
[2:59] Speaker 1: Vietnam Logistics and Support Medal, the Active Service Medal, and
[3:03] Speaker 1: the National Medal in the Reserve Force Decoration. He was
[3:06] Speaker 1: also a long-term member of the Rotary Club, serving on
[3:09] Speaker 1: various committees before being elected president from 1993 to 1994.
[3:15] Speaker 1: During this presidential year, a joint project was launched with
[3:19] Speaker 1: the Hobart City Council to try and resolve the problem
[3:21] Speaker 1: of street kids and homeless youth in Hobart. This project
[3:25] Speaker 1: won a National Anti-Violence Award. Here's something from an official
[3:28] Speaker 1: report back in 2000.
[3:30] Speaker 2: It said, Joe Paul made a major contribution to emergency management,
[3:35] Speaker 2: not only in Tasmania, but throughout Australia.
[3:40] Speaker 4: In 1999, in recognition of his outstanding contributions, Joe was
[3:45] Speaker 4: awarded the Emergency Services Medal in the Queen's Birthday Honours List.
[3:50] Speaker 1: Joe Paul, as part of his role in the SES,
[3:53] Speaker 1: played a part in the response to one of Australia's
[3:56] Speaker 1: and Tasmania's darkest days.
[3:58] Speaker 4: Helicopters began ferrying the injured to Hobart from Port Arthur
[4:02] Speaker 4: after a gunman opened fire there this afternoon.
[4:05] Speaker 2: We've had a gunman run amok on the Port Arthur
[4:07] Speaker 2: historic site.
[4:09] Speaker 5: That's 85 Ks from Hobart.
[4:11] Speaker 3: It happened mid-afternoon.
[4:12] Speaker 4: There are at least 12 confirmed dead, if not 22.
[4:15] Speaker 1: There's a further 15 injured at the moment.
[4:18] Speaker 3: We have a hostage and siege situation which we're attempting
[4:20] Speaker 3: to contain and control.
[4:22] Speaker 1: But that's not why we're talking about Joe Paul in
[4:24] Speaker 1: this episode. In fact, we're talking about him because of
[4:27] Speaker 1: the allegations of his own dark past. This is James.
[4:32] Speaker 5: My mother was to tell me this later on. She
[4:35] Speaker 5: told me this in around 2001.
[4:37] Speaker 3: If I recall.
[4:38] Speaker 1: James was happy to go on record and talk about
[4:41] Speaker 1: Joe Paul. The conversation started around six months ago and
[4:45] Speaker 1: then went quiet for a little bit. And then recently
[4:47] Speaker 1: we reconnected. Now some background on James. He lived in
[4:50] Speaker 1: Tasmania as a kid. His family also lived there. He's
[4:54] Speaker 1: since moved, but the allegations he's brought to this podcast
[4:57] Speaker 1: are worth investigating. It starts with explaining who was in
[5:04] Speaker 1: the Paul family. There was Joe Paul and his wife Myra,
[5:08] Speaker 1: and then his two kids, Sarah Paul and Michael Paul.
[5:11] Speaker 1: All of these family members are now deceased. Michael and
[5:15] Speaker 1: Sarah took their own life. Joe Paul also took his
[5:21] Speaker 1: own life, and Myra, the wife and mum, died in
[5:25] Speaker 1: the last 10 years. James explains how he fits into
[5:29] Speaker 1: this picture. So I'm going to step back just a
[5:31] Speaker 1: little bit here. So the way you know the Paul
[5:34] Speaker 1: family is a connection through.
[5:38] Speaker 3: My sister. My sister was married to Michael Paul.
[5:42] Speaker 1: And Michael Paul was the young man who took his
[5:46] Speaker 1: own life.
[5:47] Speaker 5: Yep.
[5:48] Speaker 3: In 1998. Yep.
[5:50] Speaker 1: And they had a child.
[5:52] Speaker 5: Yes.
[5:53] Speaker 1: Michael has passed.
[5:55] Speaker 3: Yes.
[5:57] Speaker 1: Who has custody of.
[5:58] Speaker 3: My sister had custody of.
[6:01] Speaker 5: My parents were heavily involved in the upbringing and care
[6:03] Speaker 5: of them, and they covered the school fees and, you know,
[6:07] Speaker 5: had her over all the time, but my sister could
[6:08] Speaker 5: do a bit of work.
[6:09] Speaker 1: Michael Paul's death obviously was shocking for anyone that knew him,
[6:13] Speaker 1: least to say his child and his wife. Michael Paul's mum,
[6:18] Speaker 1: Myra Paul, wanted to try and get custodial access to
[6:21] Speaker 1: his child when he died. And this didn't go down well,
[6:25] Speaker 1: given some of the allegations, which we're going to share shortly,
[6:28] Speaker 1: about Joe Paul. Back in the day, Mara was looking
[6:33] Speaker 1: to try and be the guardian.
[6:36] Speaker 5: Well, get custodial access, either some or all of the time, correct?
[6:40] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[6:41] Speaker 5: And that was indicated to my parents, who were obviously
[6:43] Speaker 5: very distressed by that proposition.
[6:45] Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah.
[6:46] Speaker 1: And you were pretty distressed about it too. You went
[6:48] Speaker 1: down to see her.
[6:49] Speaker 3: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[6:50] Speaker 1: And so you went down to her. What did you
[6:52] Speaker 1: say to her?
[6:52] Speaker 5: It was some pretty firm language was used and pretty
[6:56] Speaker 5: firm physical gestures. And she was quite upset by that.
[7:01] Speaker 5: She didn't like it, obviously. But I stayed at the
[7:05] Speaker 5: property for a number of hours. And I said, you know, basically, yeah.
[7:12] Speaker 5: How do I say this without getting myself into trouble?
[7:15] Speaker 5: It was a persuasive enough agreement where most people would
[7:18] Speaker 5: have agreed with me. Now, obviously, later I formed a
[7:20] Speaker 5: view of, well, jeez, would anyone have admitted to anything
[7:24] Speaker 5: under that sort of pressure?
[7:25] Speaker 3: Probably.
[7:26] Speaker 5: But I had been privy and had read some of
[7:29] Speaker 5: the psychologist notes from Michael's interviews before he passed away.
[7:33] Speaker 5: So I was a bit like hanging the consequences. I
[7:36] Speaker 5: was at that stage unmarried. Man with no kids, no responsibilities,
[7:42] Speaker 5: and I suppose I took that responsibility for the rest
[7:44] Speaker 5: of the family and for that poor young.
[7:48] Speaker 3: to have that conversation.
[7:50] Speaker 1: James has brought serious allegations to this podcast, which we've
[7:54] Speaker 1: attempted to examine against the available records. Joe, Myra, Michael
[7:59] Speaker 1: and Sarah-Paul are now all deceased and therefore are unable
[8:03] Speaker 1: to respond to the allegations raised in this episode. The
[8:07] Speaker 1: allegation James made to me about six months ago is
[8:10] Speaker 1: that Joe Paul was abusing young people. James believes Joe
[8:14] Speaker 1: Paul's wife was in some way complicit in this abuse.
[8:18] Speaker 1: He says that she admitted to him while he was
[8:20] Speaker 1: at the house many years ago.
[8:23] Speaker 5: So she was on the property, you know, living with
[8:27] Speaker 5: the horses and sort of playing the character of the
[8:30] Speaker 5: aggrieved sort of widow, do you know what I mean?
[8:33] Speaker 5: But we had a lot of information at the time
[8:35] Speaker 5: to indicate that Myra was heavily involved and she admitted
[8:38] Speaker 5: that to me.
[8:38] Speaker 3: Firsthand as well.
[8:41] Speaker 1: How did she admit that?
[8:44] Speaker 3: To be fair, it was under duress, but she did
[8:46] Speaker 3: admit it.
[8:47] Speaker 1: What did she say?
[8:50] Speaker 3: She said that Joe made her do it.
[8:51] Speaker 5: Of course, it would blame Joe, but they were both
[8:54] Speaker 5: actively engaged in instances of abuse.
[8:58] Speaker 1: And the abuse against young boys, young girls.
[9:02] Speaker 3: young boys and young girls.
[9:05] Speaker 1: James claims that during the highly confrontational encounter, Myra Paul
[9:09] Speaker 1: made statements that he interpreted as an admission of involvement
[9:12] Speaker 1: in abuse. James also accepts that she was distressed and
[9:16] Speaker 1: under significant pressure. There's no recording or independent witnesses capable
[9:21] Speaker 1: of verifying what was said, so the allegations remain unproven.
[9:26] Speaker 1: So the only way of getting some sort of insight
[9:28] Speaker 1: to see if these allegations hold any merit at all
[9:31] Speaker 1: is to go back to the records. The first stop
[9:34] Speaker 1: is the search of the archives. But what I can
[9:36] Speaker 1: say is there is nothing in any of the archives
[9:39] Speaker 1: that even hints that Joe Paul did anything wrong. To
[9:42] Speaker 1: the contrary, everything I've read about him is exemplary. One
[9:47] Speaker 1: source of truth might be an RTI disclosure about any
[9:50] Speaker 1: of Mr. Paul's service records. If he died, then surely
[9:53] Speaker 1: there's a coronial inquest or at least a finding that
[9:56] Speaker 1: might lead us to determine whether Any available official records
[10:00] Speaker 1: provided independent support for the allegations. The records we later
[10:05] Speaker 1: obtained didn't establish James' allegations concerning children. So back in
[10:12] Speaker 1: April of 2026, I reached out to the RTI office
[10:16] Speaker 1: to ask the following. I seek access to records concerning
[10:19] Speaker 1: any complaints, allegations, referrals, reviews, inquiries, assessments, misconduct processes, disciplinary
[10:26] Speaker 1: considerations or investigations concerning Joe Paul. This includes, but doesn't limit,
[10:32] Speaker 1: records relating to whether such matters were proposed, commenced, considered, deferred,
[10:37] Speaker 1: discontinued or not proceeded with. Our request, look to records
[10:43] Speaker 1: that were held in email systems, complaint files... HR files,
[10:48] Speaker 1: professional standards or misconduct files, briefing materials, electronic documents and
[10:53] Speaker 1: record management systems, or handwritten or typed file notes. We
[10:58] Speaker 1: asked that the search covered the period from 1975 to
[11:01] Speaker 1: the 27th of July 2000. Now we know that this
[11:06] Speaker 1: was a very broad request, like finding a needle in
[11:09] Speaker 1: the proverbial, but it was worth a shot. It was
[11:12] Speaker 1: a very long period of time to ask for information.
[11:15] Speaker 1: And it was also a time when paperwork might not
[11:17] Speaker 1: have been kept as diligently as it is now. On
[11:25] Speaker 1: the 11th of June, we received feedback from the RTI office. Now,
[11:29] Speaker 1: I have to say, whenever an RTI request comes back,
[11:32] Speaker 1: I'm hopeful it might actually answer some questions. We've received
[11:35] Speaker 1: many that pretty much tell us there is nothing to see,
[11:39] Speaker 1: all the files are with the coroner, and we can't
[11:42] Speaker 1: access them. However, on this occasion... We received a response,
[11:46] Speaker 1: and it was eight pages long. The first page was
[11:50] Speaker 1: a Tasmanian police file note on Joseph Paul, which confirmed
[11:54] Speaker 1: his death on 26 July 2000. The next page was
[12:00] Speaker 1: a briefing note dated 24 July 2000, just two days
[12:04] Speaker 1: before his death. The heading? Investigations of Allegations of Sexual Assault,
[12:09] Speaker 1: Joseph Michael Paul. It's signed by a detective inspector, Tom Tully.
[12:15] Speaker 1: This was a redacted document to omit some of the
[12:18] Speaker 1: names of the allegations in the document, but there is
[12:21] Speaker 1: enough to ask even more questions. We've used an AI
[12:25] Speaker 1: voice actor to read the contents.
[12:27] Speaker 4: Further to the briefing note of the 19th July 2000,
[12:30] Speaker 4: Mr Paul was re-interviewed on the 21st and 24th of
[12:34] Speaker 4: July and on the latter occasion agreed to the recording
[12:37] Speaker 4: of that interview on videotape. During that interview... He denied
[12:42] Speaker 4: the allegations of sexual assault on the complainant during 1987-88.
[12:47] Speaker 1: But disclosed the following.
[12:49] Speaker 4: He now admits to knowing the complainant and first met
[12:52] Speaker 4: him approximately two to three years ago. He admitted that
[12:56] Speaker 4: the sex sometimes occurred in his departmental vehicle and on
[12:59] Speaker 4: at least one occasion at a room at the Racecourse Hotel.
[13:03] Speaker 4: He claimed that the incidents occurred sometimes at night and
[13:06] Speaker 4: sometimes during the day when he was on his lunch hour.
[13:10] Speaker 4: Despite his earlier denial, Mr Paul's frank admission about his
[13:14] Speaker 4: sexual relationship with the complainant makes it unlikely that there
[13:18] Speaker 4: is sufficient evidence upon which to lay any charges and
[13:22] Speaker 4: at this stage, that is my recommendation. He admits to
[13:26] Speaker 4: discussing aspects of his private life with the complainant during
[13:30] Speaker 4: their contacts and this may account for the complainant's knowledge of.
[13:33] Speaker 3: Some issues revealed in his statements.
[13:36] Speaker 4: The issue of any possible acts of misconduct on the
[13:39] Speaker 4: part of Mr Paul as a consequence of his admissions
[13:43] Speaker 4: is the only remaining matter for determination.
[13:46] Speaker 1: This document doesn't establish that sexual assault occurred. It records
[13:49] Speaker 1: an allegation of assault and Mr Paul's denial of that
[13:52] Speaker 1: assault and his admission to a sexual relationship which he
[13:56] Speaker 1: maintained was consensual. The line at the top of this
[13:59] Speaker 1: file note said further to a briefing note on the
[14:02] Speaker 1: 19th of July 2000. just five days before this actual
[14:07] Speaker 1: briefing note. But that briefing note is not included in
[14:10] Speaker 1: the RTI submissions. This omission was called out by the
[14:14] Speaker 1: RTI officers themselves when they sent us over the file.
[14:17] Speaker 6: Please note, page two of the disclosed documentation references a
[14:22] Speaker 6: previous briefing note. Unfortunately, I have been unable to locate
[14:27] Speaker 6: this documentation.
[14:28] Speaker 1: So it would seem there were allegations of sexual assault
[14:31] Speaker 1: by Mr Paul to another male person. Initially, from how
[14:34] Speaker 1: the file note reads, Mr Paul was questioned first about
[14:37] Speaker 1: the allegations on tape and he denied it. Then later,
[14:41] Speaker 1: as it says in this file note, he agreed to
[14:43] Speaker 1: some of it. But the file note reads like he
[14:45] Speaker 1: claims it was more consensual. That taped interview that was
[14:49] Speaker 1: done on the 19th of July 2000 wasn't supplied in
[14:53] Speaker 1: our RTI request. A reminder again, the date of this
[14:57] Speaker 1: file note July 24, 2000. As we read it on
[15:02] Speaker 1: through the supplied RTI documents, there's a letter on page
[15:05] Speaker 1: 8 of the documents. It's from Joe Paul, and it's
[15:08] Speaker 1: to the Director of Administrations at Police Headquarters. We've used
[15:11] Speaker 1: a voice actor to read this letter.
[15:13] Speaker 7: I have been considering for some time the prospect of
[15:16] Speaker 7: early retirement to allow me to spend time at home
[15:19] Speaker 7: with my wife and on my farm. With this in mind,
[15:23] Speaker 7: and after discussions with my wife... I would like to
[15:26] Speaker 7: cease employment with the department as of 16th August 2000.
[15:31] Speaker 7: Please arrange for the necessary documentation. Yours faithfully, J.M.
[15:36] Speaker 3: Paul.
[15:37] Speaker 1: So on the 24th of July 2000, Mr. Paul is
[15:40] Speaker 1: questioned and admits to a sexual encounter with another man.
[15:44] Speaker 1: The other man alleges this was sexual assault. Joe Paul
[15:47] Speaker 1: denies that. The next day, he says he wants to
[15:49] Speaker 1: retire early and spend more time at home with his
[15:52] Speaker 1: wife Myra. and on his farm. He says he'll finish
[15:55] Speaker 1: up with the department in his role as the head
[15:57] Speaker 1: of the SES in August of 2000. Then, in a
[16:01] Speaker 1: further file note, it says that Joe Paul met with
[16:03] Speaker 1: the Deputy Commissioner and the Director of Corporate Services prior
[16:07] Speaker 1: to his resignation letter. This meeting was to discuss his
[16:11] Speaker 1: options and his future plans, and it was held at
[16:14] Speaker 1: 11am on the 25th of July. So let's step through
[16:20] Speaker 1: the timelines. On the 19th of July 2000, there was
[16:24] Speaker 1: a meeting. That meeting was referenced in another file note
[16:27] Speaker 1: on the 24th of July when Joe Paul is questioned
[16:30] Speaker 1: about an alleged sexual assault. He denies the sexual assault,
[16:34] Speaker 1: but says he did know the man and says it
[16:37] Speaker 1: was consensual. On the 25th of July, he says he
[16:40] Speaker 1: wants to retire. And then, in the early hours of
[16:44] Speaker 1: the 26th of July 2000, Joe Paul takes his own life.
[16:49] Speaker 7: It was with great sadness that I learned this morning
[16:52] Speaker 7: of the death of Mr. Joe Paul, the Director of
[16:55] Speaker 7: the State Emergency Services. On behalf of the Department, I
[16:59] Speaker 7: would express my sincere sympathy to his wife and family.
[17:04] Speaker 7: Joe Paul will be missed by all of those people
[17:06] Speaker 7: with whom he came in contact in his role as
[17:09] Speaker 7: Director of the SES. He joined the Police Department in
[17:13] Speaker 7: February 1981 on a transfer from the Premier's Department and
[17:18] Speaker 7: was appointed Deputy Director of the State Emergency Service in
[17:22] Speaker 7: June 1990, and he became Director a short time later.
[17:28] Speaker 7: Joe was an integral part of Australia's natural disasters organisation
[17:32] Speaker 7: for many years, and travelled extensively overseas to both increase
[17:36] Speaker 7: his own knowledge base and to pass on the benefits
[17:39] Speaker 7: of his undoubted expertise to other emergency services. He was
[17:45] Speaker 7: renowned as a very professional presenter, at a wide range
[17:48] Speaker 7: of emergency management conferences. In Tasmania, Joe led the local
[17:54] Speaker 7: state emergency service with great pride and professionalism, and just
[17:59] Speaker 7: last month was deservedly awarded the Emergency Services Medal in
[18:03] Speaker 7: the Queen's Birthday Honours List. Joe Paul made a major
[18:08] Speaker 7: contribution for many years to emergency management, not only in Tasmania,
[18:12] Speaker 7: but throughout Australia. He will be sadly missed.
[18:16] Speaker 1: That's the official announcement of Joe Paul's death by Mr
[18:20] Speaker 1: Richard McCready, who at the time was Secretary of the
[18:23] Speaker 1: Department of Police and Public Safety. Richard McCready later went
[18:27] Speaker 1: on to serve as the Commissioner of Tasmanian Police from
[18:30] Speaker 1: 1996 to 2008. At the time it made him the
[18:33] Speaker 1: longest serving police commissioner in Australian history. James, who you
[18:41] Speaker 1: heard from earlier, thinks this timeline of three days is
[18:45] Speaker 1: suspicious at best. It rings true with the other cases
[18:49] Speaker 1: we've mentioned, Reynolds and Griffin. James also had another allegation,
[18:55] Speaker 1: which is unproven. Is it your belief, and I don't
[19:01] Speaker 1: want to mention names here, that you believe that Joe
[19:06] Speaker 1: Paul got a tip-off from someone prior to him taking
[19:10] Speaker 1: his life?
[19:12] Speaker 5: In the range of 100% upwards, yes. That person told
[19:17] Speaker 5: me as much too on the phone.
[19:20] Speaker 1: So you're saying the allegation is that someone made a
[19:23] Speaker 1: phone call to you.
[19:26] Speaker 3: Yep....
[19:27] Speaker 1: And said what?
[19:29] Speaker 5: Well, he raised some concerns about my actions at the
[19:32] Speaker 5: property in Mangalore in question, about how the conversation with... Well,
[19:37] Speaker 5: the nature of the conversation with Maura Paul... And I said, well,
[19:40] Speaker 5: I deny those. And I said, I bet she's not
[19:42] Speaker 5: going to make a statement either. And I said, I said, mate,
[19:47] Speaker 5: I've heard that you actually tipped this pedo off the
[19:49] Speaker 5: night before.
[19:50] Speaker 3: You did that, didn't you? And he said, well, Joe's
[19:51] Speaker 3: a mate of mine. I'll never forget it.
[19:54] Speaker 1: And so... when you went to see Myra Paul, Joseph
[19:57] Speaker 1: Paul was still alive?
[19:59] Speaker 3: Oh, no, he was gone.
[20:00] Speaker 1: Okay.
[20:00] Speaker 3: Yeah, he was dead.
[20:05] Speaker 1: So he was dead by that stage, and this was
[20:08] Speaker 1: a conversation that happened after he had died, who... was
[20:14] Speaker 1: calling you to tell you that Myra had made a complaint,
[20:19] Speaker 1: but she wasn't going to be taking it any further.
[20:21] Speaker 1: Is that, is that correct?
[20:22] Speaker 4: Yeah.
[20:22] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[20:23] Speaker 5: Basically trying to warn me off basically was how I
[20:26] Speaker 5: read it.
[20:27] Speaker 1: And as part of that conversation, you asked this person
[20:30] Speaker 1: the question that he had tipped off Joseph Paul back
[20:35] Speaker 1: in the day.
[20:36] Speaker 5: I think he tipped him off. You've obviously been, you
[20:38] Speaker 5: obviously know you're being investigated. There's been a complaint. Um,
[20:42] Speaker 5: We had been made aware of that complaint, that it
[20:44] Speaker 5: wasn't just a departmental complaint, that it had been escalated
[20:47] Speaker 5: to the police.
[20:48] Speaker 3: So, and that, you.
[20:50] Speaker 5: Know, that they told him, Joe, they're going to come
[20:53] Speaker 5: and arrest you.
[20:55] Speaker 3: You're going to get charged.
[20:56] Speaker 1: And do you think that is the reason that he
[20:58] Speaker 1: took his life?
[20:59] Speaker 3: Oh, absolutely. Yeah.
[21:01] Speaker 7: Yep.
[21:02] Speaker 3: Look, Tasmania being the way it is, is it... It
[21:08] Speaker 3: was almost like, I mean, what would you think someone
[21:11] Speaker 3: would do in that situation? Is it highly likely? And
[21:14] Speaker 3: would that be convenient for a lot of people? Yeah, absolutely.
[21:16] Speaker 5: Because that way there's no criminal prosecution. How many people
[21:19] Speaker 5: have turned a blind eye? And that's what I have
[21:21] Speaker 5: a thing. And I thought, well, I'm not seeing a
[21:23] Speaker 5: blind eye, be damned.
[21:24] Speaker 1: These documents established that police investigated an allegation of sexual
[21:28] Speaker 1: assault against Joe Paul in early July 2000. They record
[21:33] Speaker 1: that he denied the assault but admitted a sexual relationship
[21:37] Speaker 1: which he maintained was was consensual. A detective recommended there
[21:40] Speaker 1: was insufficient evidence to charge him, while leaving open the
[21:44] Speaker 1: question of possible departmental misconduct.
[21:48] Speaker 3: Mr.
[21:48] Speaker 1: Paul subsequently sought early retirement and died shortly afterwards. The
[21:54] Speaker 1: records don't prove James' allegations concerning children. They don't establish
[21:58] Speaker 1: that anyone tipped Mr. Paul off, and they don't establish
[22:01] Speaker 1: why he took his own life. Those questions remain unsolved.

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