# Most Disturbing Serial Killer Cases Ever | True Crime Compilation | 172

An episode of [Lazy Chill True Crime](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1815534472), 29 Jan 2026, 59 min.

Audio: https://traffic.megaphone.fm/APO1412626921.mp3

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## Transcript

[0:00] The term golden years is meant to evoke a sense of peace, a
[0:04] well earned reward of quiet comfort after a long life.
[0:08] It's a time for front porches, familiar neighbors, relaxing
[0:13] with family and the safety of home.
[0:17] But between 1990 and 1996, in the historic West End of
[0:22] Richmond, VA, that promise was shattered.
[0:26] For at least 13 elderly women, their golden years became a
[0:30] season of unimaginable terror, their homes transformed from
[0:34] sanctuaries into mortuaries. This is the story of the Golden
[0:39] Years slayings and a horror which began on July 1st, 1990
[0:45] when 89 year old Mabel Venable was found cut down inside her
[0:49] house. It was a brutal, shocking crime
[0:52] that served as a dark omen of the six year nightmare to come.
[0:58] Following the slaying of Mabel Venable, a chilling and specific
[1:02] pattern began to emerge. Over the next two years, five
[1:07] more elderly women were eliminated in their homes, each
[1:11] attack bearing the same terrifying signature.
[1:14] The victims were all black women ranging in age from 61 to 85,
[1:19] who lived by themselves. The list of the dead grew
[1:23] steadily. 80 year old Eva Jones and 61 year old Mary Coffee in
[1:28] October, 19, 9061, year old Robinette Mickelberry in May 19,
[1:33] 9185, year old Pearl Gash in December 1991 and finally 81
[1:40] year old Martha Bolden in May 1992.
[1:45] The method in each of these first six attacks was consistent
[1:49] and brutal. The women were stabbed.
[1:52] This consistent modus operandi suggested a single predator was
[1:56] at work, a perpetrator with a clear and horrifying preference
[1:59] for a specific type of victim. The community was paralyzed by a
[2:04] unique kind of fear that can only be evoked from violating
[2:08] the home. Then, as suddenly as the attacks
[2:12] had begun, they stopped. For two years, an uneasy silence
[2:18] settled over Richmond's West End.
[2:21] Residents wondered if the predator had died, been
[2:24] imprisoned for another crime, or simply moved on.
[2:29] But the monster hadn't vanished. It was merely dormant.
[2:33] And when it re emerged, it would be terrifyingly different.
[2:39] On August 16th, 1994, the uneasy piece was broken with the
[2:44] slaying of 59 year old Phyllis Harris.
[2:47] The terror was back, but the perpetrator's signature had
[2:51] completely changed. The new victims, beginning with
[2:55] Harris. We're all white women.
[2:59] Even more jarring was the change in method.
[3:02] He now preferred strangulation. After the slaying of 82 year old
[3:07] Inez J Childress in September 1994, the attacker once again
[3:12] went dormant for a time. Unfortunately, he would be back
[3:16] in 1996 to unleash a final terrifying onslaught. 5 women
[3:22] were slain in just four months. Lucille Boyd, 75 in January.
[3:27] Gertrude Gardner, 77 in February.
[3:30] Mamie Harris Verlander, 84, in March.
[3:34] Then, in the most brazen set of attacks, there was Elizabeth
[3:38] Seibert, 69, and Jane Foster, 55, on consecutive days in
[3:44] April. The rapid succession of attacks
[3:48] sent a fresh wave of panic through the city.
[3:52] As the body count rose, Richmond transformed into a city under
[3:56] siege. The slayings provoked widespread
[3:59] outrage not just because of their brutality, but because of
[4:04] the victims profound vulnerability.
[4:07] Fear became a tangible part of daily life, especially for
[4:11] elderly women. Sales of weapons, door locks and
[4:15] guard dogs surged as residents took security into their own
[4:20] hands, no longer trusting that they were safe in their own
[4:24] homes. In some neighborhoods, citizens
[4:28] patrols were formed with police assistance, a clear sign that
[4:32] public faith in the authority's ability to protect them was
[4:35] eroding. In 2004, years after the last
[4:41] attack, a suspect finally emerged.
[4:44] But he was far from the criminal mastermind some might have
[4:47] imagined. Leslie Burchard was a 51 year
[4:50] old homeless man with a long and documented history of severe
[4:54] mental illness, including a diagnosis of schizophrenia.
[4:59] Burchard was already in prison serving a life sentence for
[5:03] confessing to the slaying of three homeless men in 1996.
[5:07] Then in 1999, he contacted authorities and confessed to
[5:13] four of the Golden Years attacks.
[5:16] He admitted to having taken the lives of the last four victims,
[5:20] Lucille Boyd, Mamie Verlander, Elizabeth Seibert and Jane
[5:25] Foster. His confession was stunningly
[5:29] detailed. He provided information about
[5:32] the crime scenes that was supposedly known only to
[5:35] investigators, making his claims seem highly credible.
[5:39] For a Police Department under immense pressure, it was the
[5:42] breakthrough they desperately needed.
[5:45] However, the confession was built on a foundation of sand.
[5:49] Burchart was a man known to suffer from hallucinations and
[5:52] hear voices. Some believe that he may have
[5:55] been purposely or inadvertently fed information during the
[5:59] confession process. Others suspect that he may have
[6:02] talked to someone in prison who actually committed the
[6:06] disturbing acts. Compounding the doubt, shortly
[6:10] before he died in prison from natural causes in 2002, he
[6:14] recanted his confession entirely and proclaimed his innocence.
[6:19] Due to the lack of any physical evidence connecting him to the
[6:22] crimes, Birchart was never formally tried, though he
[6:26] remains the prime and only significant suspect.
[6:31] With Leslie Birchart dead and no forensic evidence to provide
[6:35] clarity, the Golden Years slayings remain a puzzle with
[6:38] several competing solutions. The first theory is that a
[6:42] single serial perpetrator was responsible for all 13 deaths.
[6:47] This would require a psychological explanation for
[6:50] the dramatic shift in both method and victim race, a change
[6:53] that is highly unusual for serial predators.
[6:58] A second, more plausible theory suggests that Richmond was
[7:01] plagued by at least two separate monsters whose crimes were
[7:05] mistakenly linked by police. This is the theory that I
[7:09] strongly prefer because personally, I'm not seeing the
[7:13] strong connection to the two sets of attacks that the cops
[7:16] see. Under this scenario, one
[7:19] predator slew 6 elderly black women between 1990 and 1992 and
[7:25] then disappeared. Two years later, a different
[7:29] attacker, perhaps Burchard, began strangling elderly white
[7:33] women in the same geographic area.
[7:36] The only common thread was the age of the victims and the fact
[7:40] they lived alone, which may have led to a critical case of
[7:43] confirmation bias by investigators. 1/3 theory
[7:49] suggests that the entire investigation was essentially
[7:52] botched, and we can't really know what is true or what isn't.
[7:56] This theory stems from 2013 claims of a retired detective
[8:00] named Ron Reed who worked on the case.
[8:04] Reed alleged that his supervisors forced him to
[8:07] suppress parts of Burchart's testimony, fearing that more
[8:11] negative publicity would destroy the department's reputation.
[8:15] The Police Department officially denied this, but did state that
[8:19] the other deaths Burchard allegedly confessed to were
[8:22] determined to have been from natural causes.
[8:26] For instance, Reed had tossed in the name of a woman who was
[8:30] known to have died of natural causes in 1996 while in a
[8:35] nursing home under round the Clock care.
[8:38] Burchard readily provided details about how he slew the
[8:41] woman in her home. This allegation, if true, paints
[8:45] a picture of an investigation where controlling the public
[8:49] narrative may have taken precedence over uncovering the
[8:52] full truth. Decades later, the dust has
[8:57] never settled in Richmond. The Golden Years Predator case
[9:01] remains officially unsolved. Leslie Birchart, the only person
[9:06] ever named as a suspect, will never face justice regardless,
[9:10] and it's unclear to what extent the cops continue to investigate
[9:14] the case. Whether this was 1 perpetrator
[9:17] or multiple perpetrators, the final injustice is the silence
[9:21] that continues to surround their deaths decades later.
[9:25] Imagine you're a traveler in southeastern Kansas in the early
[9:28] 1870's. The country still has the fresh
[9:31] scars of conflict, and the promise of a new life of 160
[9:36] acres to call your own has pulled you West.
[9:40] The landscape around you is an immense, unforgiving Prairie.
[9:44] It's a lonely expanse where homesteads are scattered like
[9:47] islands in a sea of grass. And your nearest neighbor might
[9:50] be miles away. This is Labette County, a place
[9:54] carved out of land recently seeded by the Osage Nation, a
[9:58] place defined by both boundless opportunity and profound
[10:02] isolation. Your journey follows the Great
[10:07] Osage Trail, a path worn into the earth, first by migrating
[10:11] Buffalo, then by Native American tribes, and now by the wagons of
[10:16] settlers like yourself. It's a vital artery of westward
[10:20] expansion, but it's also a place of great danger.
[10:24] The weather is harsh and unpredictable, with tornadoes,
[10:28] blizzards and floods that can erase a homesteaders dreams
[10:32] overnight. Violence is a constant threat,
[10:36] whether from conflicts with displaced tribes or from the
[10:39] battle hardened American men who now work their way onto the
[10:43] frontier. In this vast emptiness, people
[10:47] simply vanish, and when they disappear, the Prairie keeps
[10:51] their secrets. As dusk begins to settle,
[10:56] casting long shadows across the plains, you spot a light.
[11:00] It comes from a small one room cabin, a welcome sign of life in
[11:04] the desolate landscape. A crude hand lettered sign above
[11:08] the door reads Groceries. This is the Bender Place, a
[11:14] wayside inn offering the promise of a hot meal, supplies, and
[11:18] most importantly, a safe place to rest for the night.
[11:24] For a weary traveller, it seems like a sanctuary, a fragile
[11:28] outpost of civilization where the unspoken code of frontier
[11:32] hospitality offers a moment of peace.
[11:36] You approach, unaware that the trust you're about to place in
[11:39] these strangers is the last mistake you'll ever make.
[11:43] This humble cabin wasn't a refuge, it was a slaughterhouse.
[11:47] And for at least a dozen travellers, this beacon of hope
[11:50] on this great migratory trail was the end of the line.
[11:55] This is the disturbing story of the Benders, a supposed family
[11:59] of innkeepers who committed horrific actions before
[12:03] performing one of American history's greatest vanishing
[12:06] acts. To understand the horror that
[12:11] unfolded in Labette County, one must first try to understand the
[12:15] perpetrators. But the Bender family itself is
[12:19] an enigma, a collection of four individuals whose true
[12:23] identities, origins and relationships remain a mystery.
[12:28] They presented themselves as a simple homesteading family, but
[12:32] they were a carefully constructed criminal conspiracy,
[12:36] a human machine where each member played a specific and
[12:39] deadly role. The patriarch, John Bender
[12:42] Senior was a man of about 60, described by those who met him
[12:47] as a repulsive and brutish figure.
[12:50] He was a giant of a man with piercing eyes and a sullen I'll
[12:54] tempered demeanour. Like the other members of this
[12:57] so-called family, he claimed to be from Germany.
[13:01] As with all the members of the family, it remains unclear what
[13:05] their true origins were as German was commonly spoken
[13:08] across Central and Eastern Europe.
[13:11] And to get in my 1 mandatory Simpsons reference per video, no
[13:15] one who speaks German could be an evil man, right?
[13:21] His wife, Elvira Bender, was around 55 and equally disliked
[13:26] by her neighbors, who called her a she devil.
[13:30] Unfriendly and sinister, she was rumoured to have slain previous
[13:33] husbands before arriving in Kansas, and she dabbled in folk
[13:37] magic, claiming to be a medium who could cast spells while she
[13:42] claimed not to understand English.
[13:45] A moment of rage during a confrontation later revealed her
[13:49] command of the language was far better than she led on.
[13:54] The younger generation presented a stark contrast.
[13:58] John Bender junior, about 25, was handsome and spoke English
[14:02] well, though with a German accent.
[14:05] He had a peculiar habit of laughing without cause, which
[14:09] led many in the community to suspect there was something
[14:11] wrong with him. This perception, whether genuine
[14:15] or an act, made him seem harmless and non threatening, a
[14:20] perfect disguise for the violence he was capable of.
[14:26] The public face and undisputed star of the operation was Kate
[14:29] Bender, around 23 years old. She was universally described as
[14:34] beautiful, intelligent and intensely charismatic.
[14:39] She was fluent in English and was the only member of the
[14:42] family who actively engaged with the surrounding community.
[14:46] Kate was the family's lure, and her chosen bait was
[14:49] spiritualism. In an era when communicating
[14:53] with the dead was a popular and widespread belief, Kate
[14:57] advertised herself as a powerful psychic, healer and spiritualist
[15:02] medium. She distributed Flyers and gave
[15:05] lectures claiming she could cure blindness and deafness with the
[15:09] laying on of hands, contact the spirits of the deceased and
[15:14] locate lost possessions. Her lectures also promoted
[15:18] radical ideas like free love, which, while scandalous, only
[15:22] added to her notoriety and drew curious visitors to the family
[15:26] inn. And by curious travellers, I
[15:30] mean men travelling alone who definitely thought they had a
[15:33] chance with this frontier cutie. Kate's persona was the perfect
[15:38] tool for disarming travellers and she was basically the
[15:42] honeypot that lured victims in. With her charm and supposed
[15:46] supernatural gifts, she could win their trust.
[15:50] This would draw them into intimate conversations where
[15:53] they would reveal their travel plans and most importantly,
[15:57] their financial situations. The very foundation of this
[16:03] group was built on lies. While they were widely believed
[16:07] to be German immigrants, no official documentation of their
[16:10] origins or even their real names has ever been discovered.
[16:15] The name Bender itself, while a fairly common German name, was
[16:20] almost certainly an alias. Even their family ties were
[16:25] likely a complete fabrication. Neighbors reported that the
[16:29] intimacy between John Junior and Kate seemed more like that of a
[16:33] husband and wife than siblings. The reason for doing this was
[16:37] also a part of their ruse. In a society built on the family
[16:41] unit, the image of a family run in offered a veneer of safety
[16:46] and respectability that was crucial to their predatory
[16:49] success. The Bender's genius for evil was
[16:54] not just in their deception, but in their engineering.
[16:57] They transformed their humble one room cabin into a highly
[17:02] efficient machine capable of quote UN quote processing
[17:06] guests. The cabin was a simple wooden
[17:09] structure measuring about 16 by 24 feet.
[17:13] Inside they had made a simple but critical modification.
[17:18] A large heavy canvas wagon cover was hung from a rope splitting
[17:22] the single room in 2. The front area was the public
[17:26] face of their operation, a small general store and a dining room
[17:31] where travellers could get a meal.
[17:34] The area behind the curtain was the family's private quarters,
[17:37] but it's true purpose was to serve as a blind from which to
[17:40] launch their ambush. Their modus operandi was a
[17:46] chillingly refined process. After Kate identified A suitable
[17:50] victim, usually a man traveling alone with significant money, he
[17:55] would be invited to dinner and given the seat of honor at the
[17:58] table. This seat wasn't a gesture of
[18:00] hospitality, it was a tactical position.
[18:04] It placed the guest with his back directly against the canvas
[18:07] partition, perfectly silhouetting his head for the
[18:11] attacker waiting behind it. As the unsuspecting traveller
[18:16] ate his meal, captivated by Kate's charm and conversation,
[18:20] one of the male benders would slip behind the curtain.
[18:24] At the right moment, the attacker would swing a heavy
[18:27] hammer, striking the victim on the back of the head with
[18:30] crushing force. Beneath the victim's chair, or
[18:34] immediately beside it was a concealed trap door.
[18:38] The stunned or dead man was immediately dropped through the
[18:41] opening into a dark stone lined cellar that was 6 feet deep.
[18:47] This allowed for the instant removal of the body from the
[18:49] main room, minimizing mess and the risk of discovery should
[18:54] another guest arrive. The body was then stripped of
[18:57] every valuable before being disposed of.
[19:02] Under the cover of night, the bodies were removed from this
[19:05] subterranean abattoir and buried in the family's two acre
[19:09] vegetable garden and apple orchard just north of the cabin.
[19:14] In a particularly macabre detail passed down through local lore,
[19:18] it was said that Elvira Bender used the apples from the trees
[19:21] growing over her victims graves to bake pies for future
[19:25] travellers. The Bender's reign of terror
[19:30] lasted for nearly two years, from May 1871 to the spring of
[19:34] 1873. During that time they eliminated
[19:38] at least a dozen people, though the true number may be much
[19:41] higher. Their victims were the forgotten
[19:44] travellers of the frontier, men whose disappearances created
[19:48] distant ripples of concern but no organized alarm.
[19:51] Until it was far too late. After all, Kate was an expert at
[19:56] finding men who were very far from home and whose
[19:59] disappearances wouldn't be noticed for months or even
[20:02] years. The case that finally brought an
[20:06] end to the Bender's slaughter began with the disappearance of
[20:09] George Newton Longcore and his 18 month old daughter, Mary Ann
[20:13] in the winter of 1872. A recent widower, Longcore, was
[20:19] travelling back to Iowa and was carrying a significant sum of
[20:23] money. When they vanished, Long Core's
[20:26] former neighbor from Independence, a physician named
[20:29] Doctor William York, became concerned and set out to find
[20:33] them in the spring of 1873. Doctor York's search led him
[20:38] along the Osage Trail and inevitably to the Bender Inn,
[20:42] where he, too, disappeared. The attack on Doctor York was
[20:48] the Bender's final overreach. For two years, they had preyed
[20:52] on the anonymous and the transient, individuals whose
[20:55] disappearances could be easily dismissed.
[20:59] Dr. York, however, was a prominent man and more
[21:03] importantly, his brother was Colonel Alexander York, a Kansas
[21:07] State senator. Unlike the families of other
[21:10] victims, Colonel York had the influence, resources and
[21:14] unwavering determination to mobilize a search and demand
[21:18] answers. In March 1873, Colonel Alexander
[21:25] York arrived at the Benders Inn, methodically retracing his
[21:28] brother's last known movements. During his initial questioning,
[21:33] the family deployed their well practiced deception.
[21:36] They admitted Dr. York had stopped there, but insisted he'd
[21:40] continued on his way. They casually suggested he might
[21:44] have fallen victim to an attack by a local tribe or by
[21:47] highwaymen, common and convenient explanations for such
[21:51] disappearances. Kate, the master manipulator,
[21:56] pretended to be deeply concerned and offered to hold a seance to
[21:59] contact his spirit. Telling the Colonel to return
[22:02] another day. She let him know that he needed
[22:06] to come back alone in what was a brazen attempt to make the
[22:09] investigator their next victim. But Colonel York was not easily
[22:14] fooled, and he sensed A profound evil in the small cabin and left
[22:19] deeply suspicious. His doubts were confirmed when
[22:23] he learned of another traveler, a woman who had recently fled
[22:27] the inn in terror after Elvira threatened her with a knife.
[22:34] York returned, this time with an armed posse of men that
[22:37] definitely weren't clowning around.
[22:40] The confrontation was tense, and Elvira's subsequent explosion of
[22:44] rage shattered her facade as a simple woman who couldn't speak
[22:49] English. This outburst further solidified
[22:53] Colonel York's conviction that the family was hiding a dark
[22:56] secret, but in the end, nothing happened.
[22:59] Yet as York's investigation intensified, the wider
[23:04] community, already on edge from the string of disappearances,
[23:08] reached a breaking point. A town meeting was convened
[23:14] where dozens of local men gathered to decide on a course
[23:17] of action. They resolved to obtain a
[23:20] warrant and conduct a search of every single homestead in the
[23:23] Township. In an act of astonishing
[23:26] audacity, the Bender men were also present at that meeting.
[23:31] They sat among their neighbors, listening as the community
[23:34] organized the very search that would inevitably unearth the
[23:38] bodies buried in their own garden.
[23:40] It was a final, desperate gamble to appear innocent, an attempt
[23:45] to deflect suspicion that was doomed to fail.
[23:50] The benders knew the moment the vote was taken that their time
[23:53] was up. They could perhaps deceive a
[23:56] lone questioner, but they couldn't survive a systematic
[24:00] official search of their property.
[24:03] Sometime in the days following the meeting, under the cover of
[24:07] the vast Kansas night, they packed what they could,
[24:11] abandoned their homestead and vanished.
[24:15] Their escape was discovered a few days later when a neighbor
[24:18] noticed their farm animals were starving and the inn was eerily
[24:22] silent. Unfortunately, a spell of bad
[24:26] weather delayed a formal investigation, giving the
[24:29] benders A crucial head start of nearly a month to disappear into
[24:32] the American frontier. When the search party finally
[24:37] forced their way into the abandoned Bender cabin in early
[24:40] May 1873, they were met with a scene of hurried departure and
[24:45] an overpowering stench of death. The source of the odor was
[24:49] quickly traced to a trapdoor under a bed which had been
[24:53] nailed shut. After prying it open, they
[24:57] peered down into the stone lined cellar.
[25:00] The pit was empty of bodies, but the floor was caked with so much
[25:04] clotted blood that it had soaked deep into the earth below,
[25:08] irrefutable proof that this had been a place of slaughter.
[25:15] The search then moved outside to the family's small apple orchard
[25:18] and vegetable garden. The ground in the orchard was
[25:22] soft and appeared to have been recently disturbed.
[25:26] The men began to probe the soil and it wasn't long before they
[25:29] made their first horrific discovery, the body of Doctor
[25:33] William York buried in a shallow grave.
[25:37] The news spread and a full scale excavation began.
[25:41] Over the next day, the searchers unearthed a graveyard.
[25:45] One by one, they uncovered the remains of at least 10 more
[25:48] people, including George Longcore and his infant
[25:51] daughter. The story of the Bender's House
[25:55] of horrors became a national sensation.
[25:58] Newspapers from New York to Chicago sent reporters to the
[26:02] remote Kansas Prairie, and their lurid accounts of the Devil's
[26:06] Kitchen captivated the public. These accounts took the already
[26:10] horrific realities and added new fictionalized elements in an
[26:14] effort to sell more papers. After fleeing their farm, the
[26:20] Benders Trail quickly went cold. Investigators found their
[26:24] abandoned wagon near the town of Thayer, just 12 miles to the
[26:28] north, but from there, the trail vanished completely.
[26:33] A massive manhunt was launched and the Kansas governor offered
[26:37] a $2000 reward, a fortune at the time for information leading to
[26:42] their capture. What happened to the benders
[26:47] remains one of the great unsolved mysteries of the Old
[26:50] West, a narrative vacuum that has been filled with two
[26:53] powerful and competing theories. The first is that they simply
[26:57] got away. In the vast, unmapped expanse of
[27:01] 19th century America, it was entirely possible for four
[27:05] people to change their names, split up, and begin new lives
[27:10] without a trace. This theory is bolstered by the
[27:13] numerous false sightings and wrongful arrests that plagued
[27:17] investigators for decades. In 1880, a couple in Nebraska
[27:21] was arrested and even confessed, but they were soon exposed as
[27:26] imposters. In 1889, two women were arrested
[27:31] in Michigan and extradited to Kansas on suspicion of being
[27:34] Elvira and Kate, only to be exonerated when their alibis
[27:39] proved solid. These incidents reflect a
[27:42] public, desperate foreclosure, but they also highlight how
[27:45] easily the fugitives could have blended back into society,
[27:49] either in America or elsewhere. The second, more pervasive
[27:55] theory is that the benders met a swift and brutal end at the
[27:58] hands of a vigilante posse. According to this version of
[28:02] events, a group of enraged neighbors caught up with the
[28:05] family shortly after they fled. They dispensed their own form of
[28:09] frontier justice, forcing confessions from the benders
[28:14] before eliminating them. While no physical evidence
[28:17] supports this story, it aligns with the harsh realities of the
[28:21] frontier, where communities often took the law into their
[28:25] own hands when official channels failed.
[28:28] The secrecy of such an extrajudicial act would neatly
[28:31] explain why no one ever came forward to claim the substantial
[28:34] reward. Today, more than 150 years
[28:40] later, the search for answers continues and who the benders
[28:44] were and what happened to them remains a historical, unsolved
[28:48] mystery. For decades, the slaying of
[28:52] three women in Toronto and its surrounding region haunted
[28:56] investigators and families with no answers or arrests.
[29:00] The cases of 25 year old Christine Prince, 23 year old
[29:04] Claire Sampson, and 41 year old Graceland Greenwich were all
[29:09] unsolved cold cases. They were separate tragedies
[29:13] with seemingly nothing linking them beyond their brutality.
[29:17] Yet in late 2025, cops announced A shocking breakthrough.
[29:23] The killer in all three cases was the same man, a previously
[29:27] unknown serial predator named Kenneth Smith.
[29:31] Astonishingly, Smith had died years earlier in 2019, meaning
[29:36] the long sought culprit was identified only after his death.
[29:41] This revelation brought both relief and frustration.
[29:45] Relief that the mystery was finally solved, but frustration
[29:49] that the perpetrator would never face justice in a courtroom.
[29:54] The cold case trail began in the early 1980s Christine Prince, a
[29:59] 25 year old woman from Wales working as a nanny in Toronto,
[30:03] vanished after a late night outing in June 1982.
[30:07] She was last seen boarding A streetcar along Saint Clair Ave.
[30:10] West just after 1:00 AM on June 21st, 1982.
[30:16] The next morning, her body was discovered in the Rouge River
[30:20] near the Toronto Zoo. Christine had been subjected to
[30:24] a vile assault, after which she was struck on the head and then
[30:27] drowned. Despite an intensive
[30:30] investigation at the time, no suspect was identified and the
[30:34] case eventually went cold. Just over a year later, in
[30:39] September 1983, another young woman met a horrific fate.
[30:45] Claire Sampson, 23, was last seen on the night of August
[30:49] 31st, 1983, near the downtown core.
[30:54] Witnesses recalled seeing her in front of the Essex Hotel on
[30:57] Jarvis St. getting into a car with an unidentified man.
[31:02] To put it in context, if you're not from the city, this is the
[31:06] area of town that's produced a fast food restaurant known by
[31:09] locals as the Hooker Harvey's. The following day, Claire's body
[31:15] was found dumped on a rural property off a side Rd. in Oro
[31:19] Medante Township, about 50 miles north of Toronto.
[31:24] Notably, that case was handled by the Ontario Provincial
[31:27] Police, meaning that an entirely different set of investigators
[31:31] were working the case. Claire had been shot twice,
[31:35] succumbing from her wounds. Like Christine's case, Claire's
[31:39] slaying remained unsolved and police had no immediate evidence
[31:43] tying it to any other crime. Many years passed before the 3rd
[31:47] victim lost her life under similar mysterious
[31:50] circumstances. Grace Greenwich, originally from
[31:54] Barbados, was 41 years old in the summer of 1997, living in
[32:00] the Jane and Finch area of Toronto and working as a nursing
[32:04] assistant. When Grace failed to show up for
[32:07] her shift on July 29th, 1997, a concerned Co worker went to her
[32:12] apartment on Driftwood Ave. and found her dead.
[32:16] She had been brutally attacked and died of blunt force trauma.
[32:20] Once again, detectives collected evidence but couldn't find the
[32:24] perp. At first, investigators saw no
[32:29] reason to connect these three attacks.
[32:32] The victims didn't know each other, and their backgrounds and
[32:35] ages differed markedly. The crime against Grace also
[32:38] happened nearly a decade and 1/2 after the other two crimes.
[32:43] The methods of killing were also different.
[32:46] One woman was assaulted and drowned, another was shot, and
[32:51] the third was beaten to death. With no obvious pattern and
[32:55] crime scenes in different jurisdictions, the cases were
[32:58] handled independently. However, one common clue lay in
[33:03] storage all along genetic evidence from the unknown
[33:07] attacker. For each victim, forensic teams
[33:11] had recovered samples believed to be the perpetrator's DNA.
[33:16] In 2016, decades after the slayings of Christine Prince and
[33:21] Claire Sampson, cold case detectives had crime scene DNA
[33:25] from those two cases reanalyzed. This led to a stunning
[33:29] discovery. The DNA profile from Christine's
[33:32] killer matched the profile from Claire's killer.
[33:36] For the first time, authorities realized they were dealing with
[33:40] a serial predator. A joint task force was formed to
[33:44] dig deeper into these linked cases, and in 2017, further
[33:49] testing linked that very same DNA to the killing of Graceland
[33:53] Greenwich. As well.
[33:55] All three crimes spanning from 1982 to 1997 were definitively
[34:00] tied to one person. Unfortunately, that DNA profile
[34:05] still didn't match any known individual and criminal
[34:08] databases. The killer remained
[34:10] unidentified, known only as a genetic fingerprint.
[34:15] With conventional investigative leads exhausted, Toronto police
[34:19] and the Ontario Provincial Police turned to genetic
[34:22] genealogy to finally unmask the mystery man.
[34:26] In 2022, the team enlisted A specialized forensic lab to
[34:31] analyze the offender's DNA and search for relatives in public
[34:35] genealogy databases. The hope was that if distant
[34:40] cousins or other relatives of the unknown killer had uploaded
[34:43] their own genetic profiles online and those could provide
[34:47] clues to his family tree, the gamble paid off.
[34:52] By late 2025, genetic genealogists identified a
[34:56] network of individuals related to the suspects DNA.
[35:00] Working backward from those relatives, investigators zeroed
[35:04] in on a single name that fit the age and profile of the cold case
[35:08] killer, Kenneth Earl Smith. To confirm their suspicions, the
[35:14] Center of Forensic Sciences performed a direct DNA
[35:17] comparison between crime scene evidence and a sample from
[35:21] Smith. No word on how that was done,
[35:24] given that he was already deceased, but they were somehow
[35:27] able to get their mitts on his biological material.
[35:31] On December 3rd, 2025, the test results came back conclusive and
[35:37] the DNA was a perfect match, identifying Kenneth Smith as the
[35:41] perpetrator in all three slayings.
[35:45] Far from a notorious criminal, Smith lived a largely
[35:49] unremarkable life that kept him off the public radar for the
[35:52] most part. He was born in South Porcupine,
[35:55] Ontario, and as a younger man he resided in Toronto during the
[35:59] 1980s and 1990's, the period when he committed these crimes.
[36:05] Years later, in 2013, he moved to Windsor, ON.
[36:10] Smith died there of natural causes in 2019 at age 72, never
[36:16] having faced charges. Although he was never caught for
[36:20] his most serious crimes during his lifetime, Smith was very
[36:23] much known to police. He had a history of violence,
[36:27] with records showing he was convicted and incarcerated for
[36:30] disturbing assaults on women on multiple occasions.
[36:34] In fact, he served prison time both before the early 1980s
[36:37] attacks and again before the late 1990s slaying, indicating a
[36:42] pattern of criminal behavior punctuated by periods behind
[36:46] bars. Investigators now believe Smith
[36:49] chose his victims opportunistically, with no clear
[36:52] pattern or connection between them.
[36:55] They believe he may have intentionally chose women who
[36:58] were entirely different from one another and employed different
[37:01] methods to kill them. According to investigators, this
[37:05] may have been done because he knew that serial predators
[37:09] generally develop a profile of victims and a method by which
[37:13] they like to commit their sick acts.
[37:17] With Kenneth Smith exposed as a serial killer, police have
[37:20] widened their investigation to see if he could be linked to any
[37:23] other unsolved crimes. Investigators say it's possible
[37:27] that additional victims of Smith exist who have not yet been
[37:31] identified. They're urging anyone with
[37:34] information about Smith's activities or other cold cases
[37:38] from that era to come forward. From my perspective, it's almost
[37:44] impossible to believe Kenneth Smith stopped at 3 victims.
[37:48] What we know about his crimes doesn't suggest restraint,
[37:52] escalation, control, or a single triggering event.
[37:56] It suggests opportunity, compulsion, and confidence.
[38:02] These attacks span 15 years, multiple jurisdictions, and
[38:06] radically different methods. That alone tells me he wasn't a
[38:10] man experimenting or learning, but rather someone who had
[38:14] actively figured out how not to be caught for his worst
[38:17] offenses. His modus operandi was, in
[38:21] essence, doing something different every time he went on
[38:24] the hunt for a victim. Given that he was originally
[38:27] from Northern Ontario, and given how many unsolved disappearances
[38:31] there are in that neck of the woods, the authorities need to
[38:34] look heavily into crimes in that region.
[38:41] In 1982, Fisherman discovered the stabbed body of 20 year old
[38:45] Susan Becker in a Colorado mountain ravine.
[38:48] The man responsible was nowhere to be found, at least not by
[38:52] investigators at the time. In reality, the perp was a
[38:55] recently paroled convict who had already killed before and would
[39:00] kill again. This is the chilling story of
[39:03] John Agrou, a predator who evaded justice for decades.
[39:10] John William Mcgrew was born in 1947 and by age 18 he was
[39:15] already a killer. On July 21st, 1966, Aggrew lured
[39:21] his 15 year old sister-in-law, Suzanne Marino, to a forest
[39:25] preserve in Joliet, IL. When she resisted his romantic
[39:30] advances, he snapped and stabbed her approximately a dozen times,
[39:35] brutally ending her life. That same day, Egg Rue
[39:39] shockingly confessed to his wife about the slaying, even driving
[39:43] her to the wooded crime scene to point out Marino's discarded
[39:47] purse and shoes as proof of his guilt.
[39:51] Urged by his wife to surrender, Egg Rue instead went to a church
[39:55] and confessed to a priest, who immediately alerted the
[39:58] authorities. He was arrested two days later.
[40:01] And readily admitted he killed Susan because she had spurned
[40:05] him. With his confession and strong
[40:08] evidence, Aegrew was swiftly convicted and given a 20 to 50
[40:12] year prison sentence. The convict began serving his
[40:17] time in Illinois, but his criminal saga was nowhere near
[40:21] over. In late 1975, he was approved
[40:26] for a hospital visit in Chicago to donate a kidney to his sick
[40:30] sister, an event that presented an unexpected opportunity.
[40:35] On May 11th, 1976, during his recuperation after the surgery,
[40:40] he slipped out of a bathroom window, fled the hospital, and
[40:44] stole a car to make his escape. He drove across state lines
[40:49] using fake identities and switching stolen vehicles to
[40:52] evade capture. His taste of freedom lasted
[40:56] about a week. In mid-May 1976, police in
[41:01] Central City, NE spotted John Agrou with a stolen car and
[41:06] arrested him without incident. He was promptly extradited back
[41:10] to Illinois to finish his prison term, bringing his daring escape
[41:14] to an end. In January 1982, after serving
[41:20] roughly 15 years, this future serial predator was somehow
[41:24] paroled and moved to Colorado to live with relatives.
[41:28] He initially stayed in Boulder and later settled in Longmont.
[41:32] That summer he crossed paths with 20 year old Susan Becker
[41:35] near Boulder. Becker was a local young woman
[41:38] who loved the outdoors. She often went sunbathing in
[41:42] Boulder Canyon and was last seen by a friend on June 20th, 1982.
[41:48] Heading into the mountains in late June, A Grew ambushed
[41:53] Becker, stabbing her thirteen times in the chest and neck
[41:57] before dumping her body in the wilderness of Boulder Canyon.
[42:01] Fisherman discovered Becker's remains on July 1st, 1982.
[42:06] A Grew was interviewed as a possible suspect, but
[42:09] investigators had no hard evidence linking him to the
[42:11] crime at the time. About a week after Becker's body
[42:15] was found, A Grew struck again. This time his victim was his 94
[42:21] year old neighbor, Orma Smith. Smith was a friendly widowed
[42:25] librarian who likely saw Agrue as a helpful new neighbor and
[42:29] trusted him. In early July 1982, Agrue
[42:34] invaded Orma Smith's apartment and brutally stabbed the
[42:38] defenseless woman to death. He then transported her body to
[42:42] a remote area in the Rocky Mountain foothills and left her
[42:46] in a Creek bed. On July 9th, 1982, Smith's body
[42:52] was discovered in a stream and a Grew was immediately suspected
[42:55] in Smith's killing. Once again though, they didn't
[42:59] have enough evidence to make an arrest and a Grew, despite
[43:03] committing 2 slayings in two weeks, remained a free man.
[43:08] On July 15th, 1982, a Gru attempted 1/3 violent crime on
[43:13] this spree, an abduction that would finally lead to his
[43:17] capture. He accosted a 26 year old woman
[43:20] at knifepoint in the University of Colorado parking lot, trying
[43:24] to force her into her car. The woman fought back and
[43:28] managed to flag down a passing university employee for help,
[43:32] causing a Gru's plot to unravel. Police arrived and arrested A
[43:37] Grew on the spot. In 1983, he was convicted of the
[43:41] attempted kidnapping and received a prison sentence in
[43:44] Colorado. His Illinois parole was revoked
[43:47] as well, so A Grew was sent back to Illinois to serve out the
[43:51] remainder of his original sentence for the slaying.
[43:54] Disturbingly, he only remained incarcerated until 1989, after
[43:59] which he was released and settled quietly in Joliet, IL.
[44:04] During his later years of freedom, Agrue stayed off the
[44:07] official radar, and he wasn't linked to any new violent
[44:11] crimes. However, those who knew him
[44:14] noted his disturbing behavior, and he even bragged to his niece
[44:18] that he had once slain an elderly woman in Colorado.
[44:23] John Agrue died on June 29th, 2009 at age 61 from an apparent
[44:29] accidental overdose of prescription medication at his
[44:33] home in Joliet. However, startling evidence came
[44:37] to light immediately afterward. While cleaning out his home,
[44:41] relatives found multiple women's purses and pieces of jewelry.
[44:46] They also found newspaper clippings about the 1982
[44:49] slayings of Smith and Becker and the attempted abduction.
[44:53] These grim trophies strongly suggested a Grue's connection to
[44:57] the unsolved crimes and prompted investigators to take a fresh
[45:01] look. In 2010, detectives finally got
[45:05] the proof they needed, and they were able to test a Grue's DNA
[45:09] with genetic material found at the two 1982 crime scenes.
[45:15] This evidence proved beyond a shadow of a cat's ass that John
[45:19] A Grue was the one who committed these horrific acts.
[45:24] Federal and state authorities began reviewing other unsolved
[45:28] killings in Illinois and Colorado from the years a grew
[45:31] was free, investigating whether he could be linked to any
[45:34] further victims. However, as of 2025, no
[45:39] additional crimes have been definitively connected to him
[45:42] beyond the three victims already known.
[45:49] Hey everyone, just a reminder that there's also a YouTube
[45:52] membership and a Patreon, and you can support my work for as
[45:55] little as a dollar a month. You wake up in the dead of
[46:02] night, vulnerable and alone in a remote location, only to be
[46:07] confronted by the one figure you're trained to trust, a
[46:10] police officer. That symbol of safety, however,
[46:14] was twisted into the key that unlocked an isolated motorhome
[46:18] for a ruthless predator. The initial victims were Gourd
[46:24] and Jackie McAllister, a couple from Lindsay, ON, enjoying their
[46:28] retirement travels in their motorhome.
[46:32] They chose a secluded picnic area near Blind River in
[46:35] northern Ontario for a peaceful overnight stop.
[46:39] Sleep came easily until 12:55 on June 28th, 1991, when a heavy
[46:46] pounding shook their vehicle. The man outside identified
[46:50] himself as a police officer and insisted the couple needed to
[46:53] move their recreational vehicle. This pretense of law
[46:57] enforcement, a simple psychological tactic,
[47:01] successfully coaxed Jackie into opening the door, circumventing
[47:05] the need for forced entry. The assailant immediately barged
[47:08] inside, destroying the illusion of safety.
[47:12] He was armed with two powerful weapons, a high caliber rifle
[47:16] and a 20 gauge shotgun, and he swiftly demanded money and
[47:20] valuables. Jackie reached for her purse in
[47:23] compliance with his demands, likely thinking this was going
[47:27] to be a horrific robbery but nothing more.
[47:31] But then the true nightmare began to unfold as the gunman
[47:34] opened fire. Tragically, Jackie perished
[47:37] almost instantly. Gord McAllister was also shot,
[47:42] but in the chaos, he managed an extraordinary survival maneuver.
[47:47] He rolled out of the motorhome and hid underneath it, praying
[47:50] the attacker hadn't noticed his escape and would continue
[47:54] running after the initial assault.
[47:57] This decision saved his life and allowed him to bear witness to
[48:00] both what happened to his wife and what would happen next.
[48:06] While Gourd lay hidden beneath his vehicle, a motorist drove
[48:10] into the isolated rest stop, likely just trying to get some
[48:13] shut eye. This individual was 29 year old
[48:17] Brian Major, a family man who left behind a wife and a young
[48:20] son. Major's unfortunate timing
[48:23] placed him squarely in the predator's path.
[48:26] The gunman instantly diverted his attention from the
[48:29] Mcallister's vehicle, seeing Major as a new threat who had to
[48:32] be eliminated. The killer quickly shot Major
[48:36] dead before fleeing the area on foot.
[48:39] Once the assailant disappeared, Gord McAllister, despite his
[48:43] wounds, crawled out and rushed to the driver's seat of the
[48:47] motorhome. He drove immediately to the
[48:50] highway to flag down a passing trucker for help.
[48:53] Sadly, when emergency services arrived, both Jackie McAllister
[48:58] and Brian Major were pronounced dead at the scene.
[49:02] The sheer randomness and brutality of the incident
[49:05] terrified the small communities of Northern Ontario, who quickly
[49:09] understood that a highly dangerous individual was now at
[49:12] large. The Ontario Provincial Police
[49:17] initiated an immediate and massive manhunt.
[49:20] The sole survivor, Gord McAllister, provided crucial
[49:24] information to investigators, working with them to develop a
[49:28] detailed composite sketch of the gunman.
[49:31] And seriously, this is perhaps the most bizarre and lifelike
[49:35] composite I've ever seen, so you're going to want to have a
[49:38] quick look if you're just listening.
[49:41] My understanding is that this composite was actually put
[49:44] together by a primitive computer program based upon gourd,
[49:47] choosing a variety of features from actual people.
[49:52] A key lead materialized quickly. An eyewitness reported seeing a
[49:56] blue van speeding out of the rest stop area around 1:00 that
[50:00] morning, moments after the attack.
[50:03] The van was headed due E traveling towards Sudbury, a
[50:07] small city in the vast rural expanse of northern Ontario.
[50:11] Given this valuable clue, the cops focused substantial
[50:15] resources on the van. The authorities investigated
[50:19] almost 4000 blue vans in northern Ontario and across
[50:23] parts of the United States. However, despite this exhaustive
[50:28] search effort, the blue van and its driver vanished into the
[50:32] vast, desolate northern landscape.
[50:35] The failure to match the composite sketch or locate the
[50:38] specific vehicle meant the trail went cold almost immediately in
[50:42] 1991. While the active investigation
[50:48] stalled in 1991, the case never truly closed.
[50:53] For years, the Blind River Killer has remained A terrifying
[50:57] enigma. A breakthrough in Canadian cold
[51:00] case investigations came only years later, providing a
[51:03] possible, deeply unsettling answer to the identity of the
[51:07] man who terrorized the rest stop.
[51:10] Investigative focus eventually centered on Ronald Glenn, WA
[51:14] former Toronto police officer. West had been serving time for
[51:18] unrelated robberies in 1995 when authorities linked him through
[51:23] preserved DNA evidence to two killings in 1970.
[51:29] Notably, in both these cases the attacker used the same sort of
[51:32] high caliber rifle used at Blind River.
[51:37] The circumstantial evidence tying West to the 1991 rest stop
[51:41] attacks was compelling despite his never being formally charged
[51:45] in connection with those specific deaths.
[51:48] W had lived in the Blind River area at the time of the 1991
[51:52] attacks, and he somewhat fit the description used in the sketch.
[51:57] Notably, he had a history of impersonating an officer to gain
[52:01] control over victims, and he reportedly owned a blue vehicle
[52:05] matching the crucial lead. Although W later pled guilty to
[52:09] the 1970s slayings, the deaths of Jackie McAllister and Brian
[52:14] Major have remained officially unsolved.
[52:19] At present, W is still alive, and he's in his 80s.
[52:23] Fortunately, if he's the one who committed this horrific act,
[52:26] he's locked up for life unless he drops a deathbed confession.
[52:31] At this point, it looks like the Blind River case may forever
[52:34] remain an unsolved mystery. There's a long stretch of
[52:40] asphalt traversing the Hungarian plains, connecting cities and
[52:45] economies. It's called Main Road 4, But
[52:48] between 2007 and 2010 this ordinary National Highway became
[52:54] something else entirely. The chilling reality is that a
[52:59] lone predator turned this critical transportation corridor
[53:02] into a systematic hunting ground, targeting vulnerable
[53:06] women who sought a living on the outskirts of society.
[53:10] The case of the Main Road Four killer represents 1 of Hungary's
[53:13] most perplexing modern cold cases, involving multiple
[53:17] confirmed killings and at least one disappearance.
[53:21] Also, apologies in advance to anyone who speaks Hungarian,
[53:25] because I can assure you I'll be mispronouncing every name to
[53:29] some degree despite my best efforts.
[53:34] The victims associated with the Route 4 series share a common
[53:37] denominator. They were women engaged in
[53:40] illicit work along the highway, placing them squarely in a high
[53:44] risk demographic. This inherent vulnerability
[53:47] played directly into the perpetrators operational
[53:50] strategy, allowing him to select targets whose movements might
[53:54] not be immediately tracked. This also allowed him to easily
[53:58] get the victims into his vehicle without raising too much
[54:01] suspicion of a truly serious crime.
[54:04] The earliest known case involved a 34 year old woman, identified
[54:09] only by her last name, Zoltan. She vanished in late summer
[54:15] 2007. As she was estranged from her
[54:18] family, her disappearance went unreported for several months
[54:23] and her remains were eventually recovered in 2011.
[54:27] The violence intensified in 2010.
[54:31] A woman identified as Peraska, 24 years old, was slain on June
[54:36] 19th, 2010. Disturbingly, she was a known
[54:41] regular along the highway and someone had seen her alive just
[54:44] 15 minutes prior to the discovery of her body.
[54:48] Two months later, on August 20th, 2010, 24 year old Erzabet
[54:54] was killed after leaving a local bar or nightclub.
[54:58] Her body was found the next day in a water ditch along the
[55:01] highway. The final known incident
[55:04] involved an 18 year old named Angela who disappeared on May
[55:08] 22nd, 2010 near Karkag, also along the highway.
[55:14] A witness saw her entering a vehicle, described as red or
[55:18] maroon, heading toward the city of De Brecon.
[55:22] Notably, all the attacks are believed to have occurred on a
[55:24] weekend, which suggested to the cops that the predator was
[55:28] constrained by his job duties. From Monday to Friday, Hungarian
[55:33] criminal profilers were brought in to create a psychological
[55:36] portrait of the serial predator. Their findings suggested the
[55:40] victims were symbolic, serving as proxies on to whom the killer
[55:44] displaced rage stemming from rejection experienced with women
[55:48] in his life. The analysis indicated the
[55:52] violence was intrinsically about the desire for dominance and
[55:55] revenge. According to this profile, he
[55:59] likely had the appearance of a normal life, despite the
[56:02] disturbing acts he routinely committed.
[56:06] They also agreed that he was almost certainly gainfully
[56:08] employed and likely wouldn't have any meaningful gaps in his
[56:12] employment history. He was also believed to live
[56:16] somewhere close to the highway and may have travelled along
[56:19] this route during his Monday to Friday commute.
[56:23] This may have been the time when he singled out the women he
[56:26] would ultimately target, and he may also have engaged in
[56:29] stalking behaviors on the weekend before striking.
[56:33] Despite the completion of this profile, this would ultimately
[56:37] bring the authorities no closer to cracking the case.
[56:42] Perhaps the most telling and frustrating piece of evidence in
[56:45] the case is the sudden stop after August 2010.
[56:49] Since a serial predator's actions are driven by
[56:52] overwhelming, constant psychological needs, it's highly
[56:56] improbable that the individual voluntarily stopped.
[56:59] An offender driven by such intense and deranged pathology
[57:04] rarely ceases activity unless they find a replacement behavior
[57:08] or are externally blocked. The abrupt end to the series of
[57:12] attacks strongly suggested an external involuntary situation
[57:17] prevented the continuation of his predatory behavior, at least
[57:21] according to officials. Investigators generated 4
[57:26] primary theories to account for this silence, which are honestly
[57:29] just a list of everything that could have possibly happened.
[57:32] They speculated that he died, suffered A debilitating injury
[57:36] or serious illness, was incarcerated for an unrelated
[57:40] crime, or left the region or country permanently.
[57:44] That said, I do think it's possible that he stopped, and my
[57:47] evidence for this is that his attack on Angela was his last
[57:50] known crime. During that attack, someone saw
[57:54] his vehicle and got a description, which may have
[57:57] spooked the predator. His self preservation instincts
[58:01] may have caused him to be one of the rare cases where a predator
[58:04] can simply stop his deranged spree.
[58:09] Despite the detailed behavioral profile and extensive efforts,
[58:13] the case of the main Road Four killer remains unsolved with no
[58:17] suspects having been named. Unfortunately, it appears that
[58:21] no forensic evidence tied to the perpetrator was discovered at
[58:25] any of the crime scenes, which further complicates solving this
[58:29] crime. But even if his genetic material
[58:33] was discovered, cutting edge techniques like forensic genetic
[58:36] genealogy just generally don't work in Europe for a variety of
[58:40] reasons. The primary one is European
[58:43] Union privacy laws. But also, there's just much less
[58:46] reason for a Hungarian to seek out an ancestry test.
[58:50] After all, if all your Hungarian great grandparents came from
[58:53] your Hungarian village, you're going to be much less inclined
[58:57] to pay a few 100 bucks to find out your Hungarian.
[59:01] Or maybe I'm totally misreading the situation and Hungarians are
[59:05] desperate to know that they're an eighth German or something.

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