# Conversation 1 w/ Lisa Barrett, Ben Lyons, Eli Sennesh, Jordan Theriault-Brown, and Karen Quigley

An episode of [Thoughtforms Life](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1805908099), 17 Jan 2026, 56 min.

Audio: https://media.transistor.fm/850bbe58/a65241cf.mp3

This is a discussion with with Lisa Feldman Barrett (https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=WF5c0_8AAAAJ&hl=en), Benjamin Lyons (https://interestingessays.substack.com/), Eli Sennesh (https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=3z4ALYgAAAAJ), Jordan Theriault-Brown (http://www.jordan-theriault.com/), and Karen Quigley (https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=aZ3qhVUAAAAJ&hl=en) about topics related to allostasis and top-down control across cognitive science and developmental biology. CHAPTERS: (00:00) Framing interdisciplinary synthesis (03:18) Bioelectric collective intelligence (16:00) Constraints versus bioelectric memory (20:06) Neurodevelopment and allostasis (27:10) Plasticity and dirty genomes (35:59) Relational structure and constraints (40:24) Agency across biological scales (45:04) Goal-like molecular networks (48:49) Allostasis and control hierarchies PRODUCED BY: https://aipodcast.ing SOCIAL LINKS: Podcast Website: https://thoughtforms-life.aipodcast.ing YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC3pVafx6EZqXVI2V_Efu2uw Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thoughtforms-life/id1805908099 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7JCmtoeH53neYyZeOZ6ym5 Twitter: https://x.com/drmichaellevin Blog: https://thoughtforms.life The Levin Lab: https://drmichaellevin.org

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