# Joseph Nti: 9 to 5 vs Passion Projects And The Discipline to Do Both

An episode of [The Peswa Podcast](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1781537541), 23 Feb 2026, 1 h 49 min.

Audio: https://anchor.fm/s/110e1ce70/podcast/play/117753115/https%3A%2F%2Fd3ctxlq1ktw2nl.cloudfront.net%2Fstaging%2F2026-2-31%2F421135829-44100-1-88f4238c092b1359.mp3

Send a text In this powerful episode of The Peswa Podcast, we sit down with Joseph Nti — host of Sincerely Accra and founder of Off The Top Show — for an honest, inspiring deep dive into the reality of building passion projects while navigating a full-time corporate career. From his formative years at AIS to graduating from Ashesi University, Joseph shares how his creative instincts were nurtured early on, leading him to launch campus publications and eventually grow into one of Ghana’s most recognisable podcast voices.  Today, he balances a demanding 9–5 career in banking with producing culturally resonant content that speaks to urban Ghanaian youth — proving that purpose and profession don’t have to exist in conflict. In this conversation, Joseph opens up about: • The transition from student creative to corporate professional • Managing time, energy and burnout while running multiple shows • Building Sincerely Accra into a culturally influential podcast rooted in urban Ghanaian life and pop culture • The mindset required to pursue passion projects when life demands stability • Why creatives shouldn’t wait for permission to create opportunities for themselves Sincerely Accra, part of the Gold Coast Report network, has become known for its vibrant, fast-paced commentary on urban life in Accra, blending humour, pop culture, and listener interaction.  This episode is a must-watch for: • Young professionals chasing purpose beyond their day jobs • Creatives struggling to stay consistent while working corporate roles • Anyone trying to build something meaningful without quitting stability too early Joseph’s story is a masterclass in discipline, identity, and long-term vision — a reminder that you don’t always have to quit your job to build your dream… you can build in parallel. 🎧 Watch till the end for actionable insights on time management, creative discipline, and navigating the tension between security and passion. Simplify cross-border payments with WeWire — the smarter way for businesses to send and receive payments in local and international currencies across 80+ countries. Empower your business with fast, secure, and seamless global transactions. 🔗 Start today at WeWire.com 📩 Connect with us: • Follow Bill on Instagram: @billcobbinah • Follow us on all socials: @thepeswa 📢 Subscribe The Peswa on all Platforms: https://linktr.ee/thepeswa Get access to amazing royalty-free music for your projects — sign up for an Uppbeat account using the referral link: https://share.uppbeat.io/cy9fcqqxj4tg Don’t forget to like, comment, and subscribe for more conversations like this! The Fresh Patch Podcast - Where Good Pets Get It. Welcome to the Fresh Patch Podcast where we talk about everything, from dog... Listen on: Apple Podcasts Support the show

## Transcript

[0:00] I also grew up watching a lot of Ghanaian content like Home Sweet
[0:02] Home, Sun City, Quastasa, all these things.
[0:05] And then like there's this period where there was nothing
[0:07] coming out from Ghana for Ghanaians in that way.
[0:11] And so I thought to myself, oh, I want to start a shoe like back
[0:13] chat. But then I make it like
[0:15] something fun and interesting. Then I remembered it takes 2
[0:18] where it's like 2 people come and then they compete, Right?
[0:21] Exactly. So the concept of of the top was
[0:23] born from those shoes. It was a lot of work.
[0:26] Cool. And imagine having a nine to
[0:27] five. You have a personal life, you
[0:29] have family because I live with my mother.
[0:31] So they are sending you on errands and things and you'll do
[0:34] all of this. I used to sleep at like 2-3 AM
[0:36] because I'm editing and I go to work.
[0:38] I struggled a lot with like safest level depression, right?
[0:42] And I realized that the podcast requires me to perform happiness
[0:46] all the time. So you can you can have you can
[0:49] go through heartbreak, you don't go through loss.
[0:51] You can go through whatever they come.
[0:53] Hi, guys. It's another exciting episode of
[0:55] the sincere local podcast. I met somebody that I said that
[0:57] the podcast has stopped them from committing suicide, right.
[1:01] So when you have that in your head, you also cannot be like,
[1:05] I'm tired. I won't do it again.
[1:06] Like I was saying, everybody should do their very best to be
[1:09] curious enough about something to try.
[1:12] And I think that is the problem that we have in this country or
[1:16] maybe in the world is that people don't have passion
[1:20] projects, people have things going on for themselves.
[1:23] I didn't want to be somebody that creates from a place of
[1:26] desperation because when you are looking for money, want to do
[1:31] brand partnerships and things, they tend to dictate for you how
[1:34] they want things to go. Every time I've met by people
[1:37] who come to me, I have a job here.
[1:39] I was 95. I want to do the side project.
[1:41] What do you think? Should I quit my job?
[1:42] Should I keep doing it? You know, the passion is eating
[1:47] me up. The seal of the asking me, but
[1:49] what do I do? So how have you navigated that?
[1:58] Hi guys, my name is Joseph NT, host of the Sincerely a Crowd
[2:02] podcast and I was on the PESWA podcast with Bill, who is
[2:05] actually taller than he looks in pictures so do not be fooled.
[2:08] I had a really great conversation.
[2:10] We got to talk about my life, my upbringing and why Bill believes
[2:14] that everybody should live life on their own terms and low key.
[2:19] We discovered that we both like Fufu as much as the other person
[2:23] does. And so all the Fufu haters,
[2:28] sorry, but this is the podcast. It was really great.
[2:31] I I had fun and I wish it didn't stop, but it did.
[2:36] Thanks for coming you. Have we started?
[2:38] Yeah, you've started. Yeah.
[2:42] My podcast you see 321 just like that.
[2:48] Yeah, I was still. I think you're the coolest
[2:50] person on the Internet. I mean, in the Ghanaian Internet
[2:53] space, it's just cool, maybe because I think we have a couple
[2:59] of similar interests, so to speak.
[3:01] Oh really? Like what?
[3:02] Ghanaian stories, Ghanaian music, probably my experts are
[3:06] as extensive as yours because the count of the things you see
[3:08] on your podcast. Like what?
[3:12] One time you told this story about how I think you grew up
[3:14] around in Nassau, Man, around music, like used to this Joey B
[3:19] era, these guys. I think that's studio sessions.
[3:22] Something like how long was like I didn't have this.
[3:24] Let's see, I grew up around Joey this era.
[3:25] Still, you didn't like you were dead.
[3:29] Yeah. And just, you know, so even the
[3:34] when the conversations are happening, the kind of music
[3:36] people use, you know, all of that, I think you're very cool.
[3:40] Thank you, sorry, thank you. I don't think I'm the coolest
[3:44] person on the Ghanaian Internet. That is.
[3:46] Yeah, open me up for critique. Really.
[3:49] I'm sorry about that. To me, it's my.
[3:51] It's my truth, I guess. One time they held what I
[3:53] wanted, the main subject, but it was a Twitter space where they
[3:56] were debating when I was funny. Oh yeah.
[4:00] So don't you tell all that you? Need to know public discuss to
[4:04] be had about your humor level. It's it tells you everything.
[4:08] Well, you. Know and now it's it's left me
[4:11] wondering because for me I think the reason why I think I like
[4:13] music for the most part is that it's a great escape last year my
[4:17] spot I was like 99,000 minutes almost 100,000 minutes there's
[4:22] always music playing in my background in my background
[4:24] whether I'm working or in my room or in the car music.
[4:27] Everywhere. Who is your favorite artist
[4:29] right now? Currently Jenna.
[4:31] He's Jenna. Yes, he's a Ghanaian dancer.
[4:34] Afro Spiritual. Really.
[4:36] I have never heard of him. He's called him Phoenixes.
[4:38] Me. I like the underground people.
[4:41] I let's see when they blew. Then you stop listening to them.
[4:43] I don't know, I still listen to them.
[4:45] I literally have a friend who is like when an artist blows he
[4:48] stops listening to them. I think I did.
[4:51] You know, I can't stop listening to RDG.
[4:54] Even Benton and beautiful eulogy, all these guys.
[4:59] Benson. Yeah.
[5:01] When? When would you?
[5:02] Would you, Bent? Would you?
[5:03] Oh oh oh, why have you separated the name instead of?
[5:08] But I didn't know about himself. Benson.
[5:10] Oh, he changed his name. Oh, the B and the Nigerian
[5:13] artist. OK.
[5:14] I thought you remember Buju Banton.
[5:15] I was like, oh, OK, all right, cool.
[5:20] So for me, it's a great escape, right?
[5:24] It helps you just like a great companion.
[5:26] Yeah, I really want to understand what how that because
[5:30] you clearly look like a music person, music lover.
[5:32] I look like. You, I mean, you sound like you
[5:34] talk about music, you're talking to actors.
[5:37] So what? What?
[5:38] What does music do for you? I think, like you said, escape,
[5:43] but it's also like a mood enhancer, you know?
[5:51] I'm trying to trace my early origins of music.
[5:55] So I remember when I was younger, my dad, my dad had a
[5:58] lot of cassettes. So what he does was usually
[6:01] Saturday when I was living with my dad and his wife because my
[6:04] parents are not married. Saturday mornings were cleaning
[6:08] these and everybody has like their chores that they do.
[6:13] So in the morning he plays one artist the whole morning.
[6:17] So maybe if it's Lumba he will have like an album, like 3
[6:20] albums. When one is done, you change the
[6:22] cassettes. So that's how I found about
[6:25] Lumba Quadrantry, Quad day, Lord Kenya Kunty Hen.
[6:29] There was this guy called Mr. Bieber.
[6:34] I think he had like one song and he went to Germany.
[6:37] He is very good. Everybody, you know, apparently
[6:39] back then they used to like launch music career so they
[6:42] could get visas and they leave. So if you know, anyone hits one
[6:44] that was just trying to travel. Yeah.
[6:47] So I just, I think that's where a lot of my music interest comes
[6:52] from. And then I our house was big and
[6:56] so we used to have cousins come and go and I remember there was
[6:58] this cousin of mine, she was very into like the Western
[7:01] music. So that's where it came from.
[7:03] Céline Dion. Whitney Houston, TLCTL.
[7:08] Do you know TLC? Maybe, maybe not.
[7:11] Big, you know, don't go chasing waterfalls.
[7:14] Sorry, That's crazy. And they went with Chelsea, You
[7:18] know Chelsea, right? Yeah.
[7:19] And so she had. That's when CDs came along.
[7:22] So she would come in and, you know, back then, they used to
[7:24] burn, like 12 music videos on one CD.
[7:28] And then we had this one CD we just played over and over again.
[7:32] I remember it had Jennifer Lopez and LL Cool J Oh, my pride is
[7:36] all I had. And I had a Mariah Carey song.
[7:40] It had Missy Elliott's Gossip, folks, when I woke up in the
[7:43] club. Yeah.
[7:44] So it had like, those 12 songs and we played over, over again.
[7:47] So like, the early origins would definitely be other people
[7:50] playing music for me to hear. And then after Left Thai from
[7:55] Chelsea died, I discovered Destiny's Child, the Bills music
[7:59] video. And then that's when my
[8:01] adoration of Beyoncé started. And then like, a segue into,
[8:04] like, all the other pop girls. But yeah, music.
[8:08] Yeah. Like I said, it's a mood
[8:10] enhancer. When like, I'm feeling sad, I
[8:13] will listen to Adele. And you know the thing that I
[8:16] don't make sada listen, I I, me, I Romansize my life.
[8:23] If I'm sitting in the back of a car and it's raining and the sun
[8:26] comes on, I imagine I'm in a music video.
[8:29] Like, I'll put my hand on the on the window, like in my head.
[8:33] You know what I mean? Yeah.
[8:36] So, yeah. Tears.
[8:39] Oh, oh, no. I mean, not like if I'm in
[8:42] public, no. Yeah.
[8:45] So sometimes I would like use music to kind of like enhance
[8:47] what I'm feeling at the moment and or shifts what I'm feeling
[8:51] at the moment. Yeah.
[8:53] Like I'll tell you, no matter what mood I am in, if I watch
[8:55] like I just watch Beyoncé videos, like live performances
[9:00] or music videos, I feel better. Recently I think I've also
[9:04] generated this the behaviour of listening to or watching Michael
[9:09] Jackson's live performances. Yes, Oh my goodness, I feel good
[9:12] for. The past like month or so I
[9:14] just, you look at my YouTube history, it's just Michael
[9:17] Jackson performance in. Which one really stood out to
[9:19] you? This Smooth Criminal 1 he did in
[9:22] Munich in 97. See, when I had a crowd and
[9:28] everything, and then when the change starts, when you hit
[9:33] there, there's a way the crowd responds and the guy has not
[9:35] even done anything yet his his silhouette is on the wall.
[9:38] Yes. They have covered him with the
[9:40] curtain and they projected the silhouette.
[9:42] It's the anticipation. Like, yeah, he used to get
[9:45] people going crazy. Michael is, it makes me, I was
[9:48] thinking like what was going through his head?
[9:50] Like how? How can a human being live like
[9:53] this? I, you know, one of the things
[9:56] that I actually like feel sad about is that Michael died
[9:58] before the age of podcast because back then a lot of
[10:02] interviews were very curated. They were hardly ever alive.
[10:05] So we didn't really get his true wow, his true thoughts, you know
[10:10] what I mean? So some of these questions, we
[10:12] never know. Also, he had been doing music
[10:13] since he was like a child. I.
[10:15] Think he was very regimented, he couldn't really tell his mind
[10:18] but anyway, but so when you're mentioning like you're early
[10:22] interaction with interfacing with music, you mentioned your
[10:25] dad and how your dad will play one actors all morning, but then
[10:28] you said your dad live with your dad and his wife.
[10:30] I'm curious about that. Oh, come on.
[10:32] It's like this is very common in Ghana.
[10:34] So my dad has every time I This is why I don't talk about
[10:38] myself, right? Because I feel like it involves
[10:40] other people and I never know how they feel about it.
[10:42] By the way, my dad has four baby mothers, 2 wives, OK?
[10:47] He's a Muslim. He's not.
[10:49] He's not. I see he's not couldn't be
[10:52] bothered. You know, yeah, I can't.
[10:55] Understand. No, no, no, no, no, no.
[10:58] It was. Not a very comfort, trust me, it
[11:00] was very chaotic. But yes, so and my mom, she was
[11:03] like a very avid believer in like making sure I spend time
[11:07] with my father even though they were not married and he had his
[11:10] another family. So I would go and spend weekends
[11:12] there and there was the. Women knew each other.
[11:16] The women knew each other. Yes, of course they knew.
[11:20] OK. You know, to be fair, some
[11:21] people hide their families. Yeah.
[11:22] No, but they knew each other. Yes, because my father too, he
[11:24] was very like, bringing all his kids together type of thing.
[11:27] He didn't, like, keep us apart. So even in my like, I was those
[11:32] also. I have an older sister who is
[11:34] also not his wife's child. So when I would go there, like
[11:38] the two of us were like the outsiders, You know what I mean?
[11:43] I forgot what was I talking about.
[11:44] Thinking about your dad and you live with him.
[11:46] Yes. So there was a period that my
[11:48] mother had to go and work outside a car, so then I had to
[11:52] go and live with him for like 6 years.
[11:55] Yeah. So that was the mean, the period
[11:56] where like I was exposed to a lot of like the music that he
[11:58] used to listen. Outside a car, you said?
[12:00] My mom had to go outside a car, OK.
[12:02] And so then, you know, I had to go and live with somebody.
[12:05] You know, this is, this is, that's.
[12:07] A man at my father's place. No, no, no.
[12:09] Oh, so my father lives in so too.
[12:11] OK, Yeah. Charlotte's medical back then,
[12:15] like right now, Sozoom is actually very decent.
[12:17] Back then, there was the road was not done, the sand was red,
[12:20] and there was no Ubers. When you go out and you pick a
[12:23] taxi, nobody wants to come Sozoom after 9:00 PM Like, yeah.
[12:27] And I used to even be shy to say I live in Sozoom because it was
[12:29] such a crazy like wait no. No, it's cool.
[12:31] Yeah, it doesn't say shout out to medical.
[12:34] I think medical meets Sozoom. Cool, because back then you
[12:37] don't say you live at Sozoom. You know, like The thing is my
[12:40] father's dynamic and like having multiple wives, and I had a
[12:44] story where that has a lot of children, so he forgot he named
[12:48] one another. Name is yes.
[12:50] Two of your sons have the same name.
[12:51] Me and my little brother, our last one is called Joseph, guys.
[12:57] No, but you know what? I get it.
[12:59] Because at home I wasn't called Joseph.
[13:01] I like, you know, everybody has like a house name.
[13:03] And I was in high school at the time.
[13:06] And I remember one of the times that I called home, they said,
[13:09] oh, you know, we have another sibling.
[13:12] Mind you, like one of my stepmothers has five children.
[13:15] OK. So it was like every year they
[13:17] were dropping one. It wasn't even a thing.
[13:19] So it's like I had to had little brother.
[13:21] I was like, OK, cool. I didn't really like, you know.
[13:22] Then when I came home, I was like, what's he called said
[13:25] Joseph. And I was like, but I'm called
[13:26] Joseph Osam. There were a few.
[13:33] That's because of me. What now?
[13:36] It's not. It's not common place to see a
[13:37] man with multiple wives and concubines, but it was a thing
[13:40] back then, you know, like. You're saying now it's not the
[13:42] one I. Mean no, it's not, it's not it's
[13:45] people don't herald this. But then it was like a thing to
[13:48] you know, if you're manic, it would have multiple wives and
[13:50] take care of them, especially in that part of the world, right.
[13:54] But now I'm curious like in my so many children and even for
[13:57] the women to agree to want to be with him.
[13:59] You knowing the expanse of his family.
[14:03] What was he doing? Because I'm going to interrupt
[14:05] your feet for a bit, please. You shouldn't subscribe back in
[14:08] there. It goes a long way to help us as
[14:10] a team. And so kindly just say that for
[14:12] us. Thank you.
[14:13] Like, what was my father doing back then?
[14:14] Yeah. I don't understand the question,
[14:16] how he was learning in this situation.
[14:18] Like, OK, OK. My dad, he was a spare parts
[14:23] dealer. I was OK.
[14:25] I was OK. Yes.
[14:26] So actually, listen, I have. There's a whole part of my life
[14:28] where I used to go and sit at my father's shop because I don't
[14:33] know what they were thinking when I was going to take over
[14:35] the business or whatever. So every weekend I'd go and sit
[14:38] at the shop and then just observe.
[14:40] Which when I think back on it, I feel like my ability to kind of
[14:43] relate to a lot of people comes from some of these things.
[14:46] Because even before I went to live with my father for six
[14:48] years, like if my mother had to go because my mom did UCC very
[14:52] later on, you know, back then after sixth form, you can just
[14:54] work. Yeah.
[14:55] So around later on, she wanted to go back to school.
[14:58] And for the four years I would live with like different
[15:01] families. She leave me like a friend here,
[15:04] my aunt and uncle here. So like I kind of like live with
[15:08] different families, so different family dynamics.
[15:10] And then also going. So I was so kind to go and sit
[15:12] and just look at the boys I used to work for my dad carrying the
[15:14] engines and things. Just the conversations that they
[15:17] have. Yeah, I learned a lot about
[15:20] that. Yeah.
[15:20] So yeah, he spare parts. Basically I.
[15:24] See very colorful childhood. Colorful.
[15:28] Yeah, because so many components, multiple families,
[15:33] like I'm wondering your life now, right?
[15:36] I mean, it's good you mentioned that one thing that you've drawn
[15:38] from that kind of upbringing is being able to fit in any way you
[15:41] can vibe with anybody, right and not.
[15:46] I would say that like I feel like I'm able to relate to
[15:49] different realities and also maybe like if I walk into a
[15:53] room, I can observe and put people in the different
[15:57] categories based on the people that I have like being around in
[16:01] my life. You know, like I, I feel like,
[16:04] for example, the guy sitting behind, I forgot his name.
[16:06] Collins. Collins, right?
[16:08] I feel like he's not a quiet person, right?
[16:11] But it's more like we are in a space where he doesn't know me,
[16:16] so he's being quiet. I'm sure if I'm not here, he
[16:18] talks a lot. Yeah.
[16:19] So I just I can observe but doesn't mean I can relate with
[16:22] everybody. Yeah, as you read you.
[16:30] OK, wait you out. You know, at the end of the
[16:32] forecast. How about that?
[16:33] Really. I don't know the episode.
[16:34] I'll tell you. OK, you tell me.
[16:35] I feel. Like I don't have a good reading
[16:36] on you yet as I was thinking you were short, that's all.
[16:40] You told me at first, you said. Yeah, because you know, when I,
[16:44] I, I, you send a message, I went to your Instagram.
[16:46] I was like every single picture, you look short and there's a
[16:49] picture where the three of you are standing, right And you are
[16:52] literally the shortest. So it.
[16:54] Was a sticky, guys. It was a sticky.
[16:56] I didn't see that. Oh, good, good.
[17:00] But why didn't you take over your dad's business?
[17:02] Why weren't you? Why weren't you interested?
[17:06] I'm sorry. You know, like, listen, I don't
[17:13] know anything about engines and cars.
[17:14] Like, we could learn. I learned about most of the
[17:17] stuff that I know when I got a car.
[17:21] Like my first car was my mother's hand me down.
[17:23] And that car spent so much of my money, like every time something
[17:26] was posed. And I feel like that's how I
[17:28] learned about cars. But back then, I was like, when
[17:30] is that going to my father's shop?
[17:31] I was like 10 years old. Eleven years old also.
[17:35] I was interested. Yeah.
[17:37] I was just going because my mother said I should go.
[17:39] I wasn't interested. One thing I will say is my
[17:44] parents have never forced me to do anything.
[17:46] Yeah, because I was going there, but it was never a you're coming
[17:52] to take over the business kind of situation.
[17:54] No, my father was never even doing engine.
[17:57] We a friendly carburetor. We know.
[17:58] I was just sitting there, you know?
[18:00] So, yeah, it never did cross my mind.
[18:03] I think it was even later on in life that when I think back on
[18:06] it, I'm like, OK, maybe. But even back then, I didn't
[18:09] think I was going there because they wanted me to learn the
[18:11] business. I told my mother wanted me to
[18:13] spend more time with my father. He's a.
[18:15] Business driving he's. Still alive.
[18:19] So my, he's kind of like diversified now.
[18:21] He sells cars because he says the spare part business is not
[18:25] moving the way he used to bank is.
[18:27] Not banging anymore, Yeah. Oh, look at our pop culture
[18:33] reference. I'm telling you, yeah.
[18:34] I think one what I tried to understand what I was asking was
[18:37] that the money become right. You stated that your ability to
[18:41] relate with different realities council that kind of bringing
[18:45] what else, but probably why I asked about why you didn't start
[18:48] take away from this business. Do you think you're
[18:51] entrepreneurial? You know, I mean, you are
[18:52] actually. That's where that come from.
[18:55] It took me a while to realize that.
[18:56] Like having a podcast is an entrepreneurial business, right?
[19:00] But you know, I think I've just always been more interested in
[19:04] creating because when I look back on it, when I was in class,
[19:07] 5I used to write stories. I would get an exercise book and
[19:12] I'll write stories and then I, I'll pass it around and people
[19:15] read. So I write chapter by chapter.
[19:17] And then the girls in the classroom, if you be like, oh,
[19:18] write the next chapter, you know.
[19:20] So yeah, Class 5I just used to write.
[19:22] And in fact, I think one of my earliest creative ventures was
[19:25] having a blog. I had a blog.
[19:27] I used to write about music. There was a time when Native Mag
[19:30] in Nigeria reached out to me to do a piece.
[19:33] I did a review. I used to review people's when
[19:34] the oldest scene started. Yeah.
[19:37] I've even been contacted to like interpret Ghanaian music for
[19:40] some of the Nigerian outlets. So, yeah, I started off writing
[19:44] and then that went out the window at some point.
[19:47] But yeah, I've always been interested in creative stuff.
[19:49] So I've never really. Yeah, I couldn't, you know what?
[19:53] I was bad at math. Math was terrified.
[19:56] I had a math studies teacher, one of my uncles used to teach
[19:59] me math, used to knock me like when I get like math is trauma.
[20:03] So when I think about business, like running a business, doing
[20:06] the numbers, I'm like, oh, no, that's not me.
[20:08] Yeah, it. Is we have many manager books
[20:11] like your art outlets, like you know, you have the other
[20:13] podcast. So I mean with a podcast is a
[20:16] team, it's not just me, right? I literally I'm a Co creator,
[20:19] right? I'm not just and also we
[20:21] assigned to GCR network. So that's why I always like I'm
[20:25] the talent cuz the podcast is the first time where I just
[20:28] like, I don't take on as much as before when I was doing like my
[20:34] YouTube channel off the top and all of that.
[20:36] Because then I had to do the business end of things, you
[20:39] know, which was very stressful, which is why like a lot of
[20:41] people don't know like doing that show was the most chaotic
[20:44] part of my life. So when I stopped, it's been
[20:47] hard to go back anyway. I feel like I've digressed.
[20:51] Yeah, but I think so. Talking about being in trouble
[20:53] at math and having to just knock you and stuff.
[20:56] Where did you go to school? I know you went to EIS, but
[20:58] before EIS, where did you school?
[20:59] Or do you have to school in different schools since you're
[21:01] moving? No, no, no, no, no.
[21:02] So I done someone. I went to nursery school at
[21:05] Christ Ambassadors. Back then was literally the
[21:08] woman's living room. Now the school is so big.
[21:10] And then I went to Saint Benedict's, which has also been
[21:13] done so. In 1972 or something back then?
[21:16] Back then. No, because we were like the
[21:18] beginning of the nursery school. Yes, I was in Benedict and I
[21:23] went to AIS. Funny I I actually was as good
[21:26] as she wants her and I have a sister.
[21:29] She came and she was like, AIS, we should go to AIS.
[21:31] It's so cool. And we didn't know that we were
[21:33] supposed to write an entrance exam.
[21:35] So yeah, it's too serious. So I went, went to write an
[21:39] entrance exam and I got it. She didn't get it.
[21:40] And then there was this whole debate of AIS versus Achimata
[21:45] because my grandparents met and fell in love in Achimata.
[21:49] My uncle went, two of my uncles went to Achimata.
[21:52] So everybody was like Achimata, Achimata.
[21:55] And then my mom and my mom's friends were like, no, EIS, EIS.
[21:58] It was a whole thing for a week. And then I settled on, I mean,
[22:01] they settled on EIS and then I went.
[22:04] And then after EIS I actually. EIS, OH.
[22:07] Yes, it was everything. How's it in EIS?
[22:10] I did. You know, I feel like my
[22:12] multitasking actually started from EIS, because in EIS I was
[22:16] in the drama club, I was in the choir, I was in the volleyball
[22:19] team, swim team. I used to do track and field.
[22:22] That's 1500 long distance, 200 meters, 100 meters, 4 by 100
[22:26] long jump. No, no, not long jump.
[22:28] Sorry. High jump.
[22:29] And then I became a House prefect.
[22:34] And then why? You have to call the way you.
[22:39] No, I was like, I feel, you know, I that's just it.
[22:44] I feel like life is to be lived. You know what I mean?
[22:46] Yeah. So I don't know how to not do
[22:50] things. Yeah.
[22:51] So yeah, I was like, I was like I said I did everything.
[22:53] I stood for head prefect I didn't get.
[22:54] And then they give me house prefect.
[22:57] And then in the choir, I ended up becoming 10 apart leader.
[23:02] And what else? What else?
[23:03] Yeah. So yeah, it's like, I feel like
[23:05] yeah, is where I've. I got a lot of my creative
[23:08] outlets and stuff. Yeah, yeah.
[23:12] Life is to be like, I like the assessment.
[23:14] I feel like all the people live in fear and systems and like,
[23:21] 'cause people oftentimes forget that the laughing, the crying,
[23:27] the anger, the people, the heart breaks.
[23:31] Like that's the gift, like the fact that, yeah, we can be here,
[23:35] have this conversation. Yeah, tell me about all these.
[23:37] Tell me all these stories as you.
[23:39] I'm short. We make jokes, but that's this
[23:42] is really it. And I think often times people
[23:45] try try to dwell too much on like things and hold on too
[23:49] much, miss out on life because life is really to believe.
[23:53] And I, I think personally, I have, I'm digressing that it's
[23:55] like resolved to really, really, I think I'm just sitting deep
[24:00] reckoning that I'm just grateful to be here, that things go high,
[24:05] things go low. I'm going to take that trip.
[24:08] I'm going to talk to this person.
[24:10] I'm going to gather all the stories because in the next 70
[24:13] years, you and I will be here. We'll be gone.
[24:15] Talk for yourself. Oh please.
[24:18] There are people with the past hundred.
[24:20] I know there are. I mean, personally, I'm not
[24:21] saying I want to be like, I'm just saying.
[24:23] To 1000 years you'll be gone. But you know, like, you know, to
[24:26] be fair, yes, life is to be lived, but I also recognize that
[24:29] there's a lot of privilege that allows you to live a certain
[24:33] way. You know, the ability to like
[24:36] maybe relish in a heartbreak or the ability to go and talk to
[24:40] this person or whatever. It also it comes when you also
[24:43] have a certain level of privilege.
[24:46] And it's not just like maybe financial, but you know, we are
[24:49] socialized to be timid. And so if you are fortunate
[24:53] enough to have a family like mine where like they're not
[24:56] saying, Hey, whatever, then you have the personality to be able
[24:59] to be a go getter in the way that maybe I have done it
[25:02] because I, I remember when I first started the podcast, I
[25:05] always used to see this thing that like being shy is so John,
[25:08] like, why are you shy? I'll, I'll allow it.
[25:10] If you're in primary school, I'll give it a pass in high
[25:12] school, in university, I'll question it.
[25:14] But when you graduate, you are just being John.
[25:16] If you're shy, right? But I've interact with a lot of
[25:21] people and a lot of thinking and I'm like, some people are
[25:24] socialized to be shy. That's.
[25:26] Why conversations like these are important, Yes, and we some of
[25:30] us who we reason I get similar circumstances.
[25:32] Not exactly free parents, but then exposure is what changes
[25:37] everything. Conversations like these
[25:38] stories, Yeah, usually when you travel and talk to people.
[25:42] So hopefully conversation. I used to step out to see life
[25:45] differently. Yeah, I've met somebody.
[25:48] I I met somebody and he was like, oh, I listen to your
[25:51] podcast. But, you know, don't you think
[25:53] you need to like tone it down? It's like, tone what down?
[25:55] And he was like, you know, the things you see.
[25:58] I was like, what things do I say?
[26:00] You know, sometimes the language and even things happen in the
[26:03] bedroom. I was like, what happens in the
[26:04] bedroom? I sleep in my bedroom.
[26:06] What happens in your bedroom? You know, it's like he couldn't
[26:08] even, he was trying to say that like I was a bit because I like
[26:11] I was telling Anid the first three seasons of the show.
[26:15] I was like, we used to talk very raw and he couldn't just even
[26:19] say that, oh, maybe he's too sexual, just saying sexual or
[26:23] something. He was dancing around and there
[26:25] was a grown ass. Can I cuss out?
[26:28] He's a grown man, you know what I mean?
[26:30] So. Yeah, yeah.
[26:32] So for me is you went to Ashesi. Ashesi yes, I really.
[26:37] Look, I wanted to go to Tech. My mother drove to the school
[26:40] when we were writing wasi and she brought the forms.
[26:43] I had never heard of the school. I I'm telling you, I didn't know
[26:46] the school. She was like, look, I saw the ad
[26:48] on television. You're going to the school.
[26:50] And I was like, OK, can we apply to other schools?
[26:52] She was like, no, I was like, but what if I don't get it?
[26:54] You'll get in, you know, And back then, I don't know if they
[26:57] still do it now. Back then they used to do
[26:58] interviews. Why?
[26:59] Did she like the school that much?
[27:01] I don't know. I never the advert that she's on
[27:03] TV me, I didn't see it. You get it?
[27:05] Oh, actually, wait, I remember she said, so back then she was
[27:08] in Laboni and she told me this story like literally after I
[27:10] graduated, she said she saw a group of young men working in
[27:14] Laboni and they were like very well dressed and all of that.
[27:18] And then when she asked them where they're coming from,
[27:20] they're like, oh, they're coming from Assassi.
[27:21] So she said when she saw how like decent they were looking,
[27:24] she was like, this was, she was. And I, I, every time I'm like, I
[27:28] wish I, I met those three guys or whoever, right.
[27:34] And when I went to the interview, I mean, I was wearing
[27:37] the jeans and T-shirt. People were wearing long sleeves
[27:40] and tie. I was like, is it a serious leg?
[27:45] So honestly, I honestly, I didn't think I was going to get
[27:47] in. But one thing that I would say
[27:50] is like that interview was very interesting.
[27:52] I don't know how many interviews you've been in, but I could tell
[27:55] they just wanted to get an idea of who you are because it was
[27:57] just a conversation. It wasn't like, what did you get
[28:00] in mass? You know, it was just a
[28:02] conversation. And yeah, I should say it was
[28:05] another level I think I should see added a lot of
[28:10] thoughtfulness and intentional insightfulness to how I approach
[28:15] what I do. How so?
[28:18] How so? Because, you know, like you, you
[28:19] go into the school and then first year you are doing a
[28:22] course called Text and Meaning, right?
[28:25] And let me tell you, the first class this professor walks in,
[28:31] he says, my name is Kobe Graham. I'm going to be your lecturer
[28:35] and I'm also a DJ. Like, my mind was blown because
[28:39] back then I didn't know you could be more than one thing,
[28:41] right? I'm like, what, 1514?
[28:44] And like, think about it. A professor and a DJ is like
[28:47] such a crazy mix. So first of all, my mind was
[28:48] blown. Then he plays New Church in the
[28:51] Wild by Jay-Z and Kanye and Frank Ocean, Right.
[28:55] And then after he plays it, he passes out the lyrics.
[28:58] And he gives us 10 minutes to read the lyrics, plays the song
[29:01] again. And then he says, what do you
[29:02] think this song, this song is about?
[29:05] My mind was blown. Oh, I was like, this is a class.
[29:07] So cool. Yeah.
[29:08] I was like, is this a class? Really?
[29:09] And then we started debating, you know, human beings in the
[29:13] wild was a God. So a kid, everybody was like
[29:15] debating. Debating feels like, oh, I like
[29:16] this, you know. And that was his class.
[29:18] He would somebody would bring a TV show and whatever.
[29:21] And he would teach us about like different theories like
[29:24] feminism, Marxism. So that was like text and
[29:29] meaning. Then we had written in oral
[29:30] English where you are learning English by like at a collegiate
[29:33] level. This is very Americanized, by
[29:35] the way. So and then like we had courses
[29:38] like social theory where you're learning more.
[29:41] I, I did African philosophical studies.
[29:44] And that's yes. So it just like opened my mind.
[29:47] So now when I'm like approaching things, I'm thinking about the
[29:50] different lenses. I'm not just like doing
[29:52] something or talking for the sake of it.
[29:54] And sometimes, you know, when people get in trouble for the
[29:56] things that they see and things that they do, you can tell that
[29:58] you don't have some of these insights, you know what I mean?
[30:01] So yeah, actually just like kind of elevated it.
[30:04] And another thing that I liked about Jesse was they didn't do
[30:06] this whole Mr. Dis Mr. that like the president of the school,
[30:11] Patrick, he's called Patrick. No, but you don't call him
[30:15] Professor Misty. No, no, no, Patrick.
[30:17] Everybody was on a first name basis, no matter how old they
[30:20] were. We go to the cafeteria, we're
[30:22] sitting down like this. Patrick, come and sit down.
[30:25] How was your day, guys? You know, Hey, have you guys
[30:28] seen the news about like that? Is it?
[30:29] So it taught me how to like relate to older people and also
[30:34] give me this like conversational skills, because it was very like
[30:38] you, you have to be on it. You know what I mean?
[30:40] Like electric congested at your table and start talking like you
[30:44] would see how people would like kind of like be shy and things
[30:47] like that. But I I kind of trained myself
[30:49] out of it to be able to hold a conversation with them.
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[31:20] Thank you. You know, I have a friend at
[31:23] Trey. I always tell her first class
[31:25] that takes the meaning class. She went to West Legos and I
[31:29] remember she was like given her points on where she felt the
[31:33] song was, the way she spoke, like her locution, her cadence,
[31:37] her vocabulary. And I remember just listen.
[31:40] I was like, I want to finish this school talking like a
[31:43] tregry out. No, yeah, I wasn't this Polish
[31:46] though. Yeah, I was this Polish like I
[31:51] was. So I, I, yeah, I really, I
[31:55] appreciate what that's cool, added.
[31:57] So when you you sound like a very good with the flu kind of
[31:59] piercing to a certain degree, I'm very what you sound like a
[32:02] good with the flu kind of piercing.
[32:04] Not necessarily really. I don't know with every flu.
[32:07] Like I'm asking is because when you're in a chassis, did you
[32:10] have an idea of where you wanted to be after a chassis?
[32:13] I had. I had no idea.
[32:15] I had no idea. I feel like I found out in a
[32:17] chassis. How?
[32:20] What was it? So look, when I was, because I
[32:24] was an only child of my mother for 10 years before she had
[32:27] another child. And I had a lot of toys and
[32:29] stuff and I grew up, you know what they call a latchkey kid?
[32:33] So basically my mom would be at work.
[32:35] So when I close, I have the key, I go home.
[32:38] Yeah. And you know what?
[32:39] I like to watch the Oprah show. Like, you're like 12, whatever.
[32:44] 9. I was watching the Oprah show.
[32:46] I watch almost. It was on Metro TV back then.
[32:50] Sometimes Mummy Dockland show or don't need not by the far side
[32:54] or don't. It's affording that one way she
[32:56] would like help talk about some issue and bring people on.
[33:00] You don't want Nobody here knows that show.
[33:03] Don't worry. I used to watch a lot of talk
[33:04] shows basically, and so I remember very well.
[33:08] I would arrange my my toys like they're my audience.
[33:11] I'll just sit in my room and I'll be doing a show.
[33:13] You get it. So I knew that like I I had that
[33:16] interest and then I should see we had a lot of exchange
[33:20] programs and there was one Babson University.
[33:22] So you go and do SMS. Then you come back and me and my
[33:25] roommates or any were like, Hey, I've been a lot of school fees.
[33:28] So we have to get a free trip out of this school.
[33:30] We have to get. So we used to apply to every
[33:32] exchange program and in one of the exchange one, the school
[33:35] Babson. So when you're going to be
[33:37] interviewed to be picked, they want to see how prepared you
[33:40] are, right? So what?
[33:40] Mom doing haven't picked up on that.
[33:43] Oh, she worked in the banking industry.
[33:45] Oh, is that why you're a banker? Oh my goodness.
[33:52] Not necessarily, but yeah, you come to.
[33:55] That you come to that Jesus. Christ, this is little like my
[33:59] secret. No.
[34:01] So when I was in figuring out what I wanted to do, it was just
[34:04] like little, little things that I did that kind of gave me an
[34:08] idea as I should see my roommates and I, oh honey, we'd
[34:11] always say that the school is so expensive.
[34:12] We have to get like a free trip out of the school.
[34:14] And I just used to do a lot of exchange programs or things
[34:17] where do like you can travel and stuff.
[34:19] And so I applied to do an exchange program in Babson
[34:22] College. And when you're going to be
[34:26] interviewed by the board or whatever way they pick you, you
[34:28] have to know about the school. So Babson had a newspaper that
[34:31] they were running. And then I, I remember seeing in
[34:33] the interview that when I go out, join the newspaper and, you
[34:36] know, contribute, but they didn't pick me.
[34:39] But I was also still interested because, you know, when I was
[34:42] growing up, I used to like magazines a lot.
[34:44] L Marie Claire, Vogue. Hello.
[34:48] So I just kind of transformed the idea from a newspaper to a
[34:52] magazine because first of all, really.
[34:53] When like a middle class are bringing, you know, proper a
[34:57] crab radio class because where you get access to these kind of
[35:00] magazines as was growing up with 1415.
[35:02] What are you talking about when you go to look?
[35:04] I've been wearing classes since I was 7.
[35:06] Right when you go to the optician, they have magazines on
[35:08] the center table. I I didn't, so those were.
[35:12] The places. Yes, I didn't own any of these
[35:15] things. My mother didn't own them.
[35:16] Like for example, ovation ago when I go to the because I was
[35:20] wearing glasses and then I also as a point, I was wearing
[35:22] braces. My teeth were horrible.
[35:24] So when you go to waiting rooms and things, those they put it
[35:26] there for people And so I would always read it.
[35:29] And so I was kind of like interested in those things.
[35:31] So I decided I started the magazine And so I had experience
[35:34] doing like like being an editor. What do you call it when you are
[35:39] the chief? The head of the magazines was
[35:42] editing chief, something like that.
[35:43] So I had that and so I was like, OK, I had experience with print
[35:47] and you know actually they do this.
[35:49] This sounds like an actually ad. They do the thing where they
[35:53] bring the people to the school. No, we are looking for jobs,
[35:59] career fair and then vast that one.
[36:02] And look, I grew up watching TV mere obsessed.
[36:06] And you know, back then it was just TV three major TV and GTV
[36:08] then I think that's 2. So I was obsessed with TV.
[36:12] So I intend that vast that one. In the production department, I
[36:15] think 2012 or two, I don't remember, but I was a production
[36:18] intent on The One Show, Jocelyn show, The One Show, the morning
[36:21] show with Coqui and Patrice and in their life with Amaki
[36:26] Abberese. I was around for all of that.
[36:30] So I had print, then I did TV production and then my boss at
[36:36] the time, the head of production, Benny Bosu, she had
[36:40] a radio show at Hebet. Mences radio station was an
[36:44] online radio station. Is it X FM OX?
[36:47] I've forgotten what it was called.
[36:48] And I used to follow her after work because we lived in Dasman.
[36:51] So she would say, oh, just have you on call and I'll just go and
[36:54] sit in there in the radio station, right.
[36:56] She had an assistant who used to read Facebook comments.
[36:59] And one time my standard didn't come.
[37:01] He said, I just said when I went in the comments, Lama me.
[37:04] And that's how I started speaking on the radio.
[37:06] So I would be like, oh, and it from Abu Sukai says, that's
[37:10] Benny. I like your show, you know, And
[37:11] then so then so now I had prints, I had TV and I had
[37:16] radio. And then with all of that, I was
[37:19] just I was OK. You know what, I think I'm very
[37:20] interested in the media space. So I ended up doing advertising
[37:25] like when I finished, as you see, I did.
[37:27] I was a faculty in time for two years.
[37:29] At first was one year national service and I liked teaching so
[37:32] much that I stayed for another year.
[37:34] And then I decided to go into like the world of like
[37:36] advertising because, you know, around that time to social media
[37:39] was coming up and all of that. So I worked on two ad agencies
[37:42] actually. And why teaching?
[37:44] When you're a teaching assistant.
[37:46] Oh, I mean when you're a faculty intern they you get to pick like
[37:50] the memory. Of lectures.
[37:54] I forgotten. Who do you pick or they pick
[37:56] you? I forgotten.
[37:57] But anyway, I was. So the text and meaning class
[37:59] that I saw you I liked. Yes.
[38:00] I end up being an intern for the same lecture.
[38:02] No surprise. Yes.
[38:03] And then I was an intern for social theory and written in
[38:07] oral as well. So yeah, I was teaching text and
[38:09] meaning. Oh, I used to play Beyoncé for
[38:11] them all the time. You know, this December I went
[38:14] to Loved 1 and I met this person.
[38:16] Like, you know, it's so funny. I always say, I always wonder if
[38:19] teachers remember everybody that he taught.
[38:21] I went to loved one and this guy walked up to me and was like, do
[38:23] you Remember Me? He taught me in school.
[38:25] And I said, and I was like, oh, I don't remember you.
[38:27] And I said, you always used to play as Beyoncé.
[38:28] And I was so annoyed by it. I was like, I'm sorry.
[38:32] Yeah, what's it about Beyoncé? Though she look when Beyoncé OK,
[38:38] the first time I saw Beyoncé was and the bills Bills was video
[38:41] right. Can you say my name?
[38:42] And there were four girls and she really stood out to me and
[38:46] you know, I TLC like I was really into TLC as a group and
[38:51] when left eye died and this kind of like fell off I was like, I
[38:55] need to replace them. So when I saw Disney's child,
[38:59] that was it. But it's just really her work
[39:01] ethic and it for me, I realized how seriously she was when I saw
[39:06] she did a documentary when she put out the album 4 OK, and it
[39:11] was called the year of four. And it was basically her
[39:16] recording, the process of making the album, music video and
[39:19] everything she would record with her MacBook camera, her phone.
[39:25] It was like very amateurish, right?
[39:27] And at the end of it, it was like, and it said directed by
[39:31] Beyoncé. And I just because I used to
[39:33] every time I see like TV documentaries and things in my
[39:37] mind is like this complex thing, right?
[39:39] And to find out that all she did was like use her laptop camera
[39:44] and stuff. It just opened my mind to how
[39:48] dedicated and committed she was to the work that she was doing,
[39:51] you know? And so I also started doing
[39:52] documentaries. So when I, yeah, when I started
[39:55] my YouTube, that's what I was doing.
[39:56] I did 3 documentaries on people. So the first one was no, don't
[40:00] see. Don't see who?
[40:02] The engine, the artist, the producer.
[40:05] Yeah, he was in a chassis. He was in a chassis for a bit.
[40:07] And we were friends and he had an EP Tool Time of Our Lives,
[40:12] and he was in school working on the EP.
[40:15] And because I had just seen Year 4, I was so.
[40:18] And already I was very interested in documentaries.
[40:20] Asked me which documentaries. I used to watch each Hollywood
[40:22] story because I was so obsessed with celebrity culture.
[40:26] And so I was like, oh, wow, I had never done document.
[40:30] I didn't want to edit. I didn't want a camera, nothing.
[40:32] And I said, look, Odozie let me, you know, document your process.
[40:36] He was like, oh, yeah, sure. So the photographer that I was
[40:39] using, who's a student Mikaya, I was using for the magazine
[40:43] because everybody working on the magazine were all students.
[40:45] I was like, do you know how to shoot?
[40:47] He was like, well, he's the camera can shoot video.
[40:50] But me, I don't know how to edit.
[40:51] I was like, you know, let's just shoot, you know.
[40:53] And we followed Odozie around. I remember back then, the old T
[40:57] bar, I even organized because we needed a content.
[41:00] I organized a listening session. Hey, come to final, I'm the one
[41:03] that started listening session in the crowd.
[41:05] Maybe I'm just no, I'm joking, I'm joking, but I, I, I because
[41:08] we wanted a content. So I organized a listening
[41:10] session at T bar for his EP in bra.
[41:14] The place was packed, you know, it was very small, so maybe it
[41:17] wasn't that bad. It was very small, but like we
[41:19] filled the streets and everything and then we're able
[41:21] to interview people and get the opinion.
[41:23] So we had more content, you know, and then it took like 8
[41:27] months to, to, to edit because we didn't know what we're doing.
[41:30] We'll go on Google. How do you edit?
[41:32] How do you use Premiere Pro? How do you know what I mean?
[41:34] And yeah, so I started. So I did that on Odoon and I did
[41:37] another one on Bishville. I don't know if you know Kwame
[41:40] Bishops. He's like this private chef.
[41:42] Yeah. And what was the third one on?
[41:45] I can't remember. But yeah, I started doing
[41:46] documentaries before I pivoted and started off the top.
[41:50] But yeah. So we off the top came after
[41:53] Chelsea. Yes, he came after it was 2017.
[41:56] Oh, why? Why you just do that?
[41:57] So what's expired? So at the time back chat landing
[42:00] was a very popular Did you watch back chat?
[42:03] Then I make a few. Anyway, back chat landing was
[42:07] very popular and every time an episode comes out we'll be
[42:10] trending on Twitter. It was like this UK show, right?
[42:12] And then like we watch it and like we're just crazy.
[42:15] And I thought to myself, because I also grew up watching a lot of
[42:17] Ghanaian content like Home Sweet Home, Sun City, Qasr, all these
[42:21] things. And then like there was this
[42:23] period where there was nothing coming out from Ghana for
[42:25] Ghanaians in that way. And so I, I, I thought to
[42:29] myself, oh, I want to start a show like back chat, but I don't
[42:32] like the fighting that goes on on back chat.
[42:34] So how do I start a show like back chat with an ensemble cast,
[42:39] but then I make it like something fun and interesting.
[42:41] Then I remembered it takes 2 where it's like 2 people come
[42:45] and then they compete, Right? Exactly.
[42:46] So the concept of Of The Top was born from those shoes where it
[42:50] was like 2 people sit on the couch and then we asked them
[42:52] trivia questions. So that's how Of The Top
[42:54] started, basically. And before of the Top started, I
[43:00] had been working with VI Music. My God, I've done a lot.
[43:05] I'm working with VI Music. They are the ones that brought
[43:08] Aduma. You know Aduma, right?
[43:09] No. You know Aduma, she's a singer.
[43:13] Well, she's acting now. More what song?
[43:17] Converse. So she started out doing covers.
[43:19] Yeah. If you remember, one of the
[43:21] popular ones was the Stone Boy cover Barfira.
[43:25] She has like a very, like, soulful, soft voice.
[43:30] Yes. And I was in a session with her
[43:33] brother. He was my roommate and we went
[43:36] to this event where she was singing and I was like, oh, wow.
[43:40] And I saw her team like her manager and everything.
[43:43] Like Joshua, her brother was part of the team.
[43:45] And you know, there was very amateurish, like very, I mean
[43:48] this very respectfully. You could tell us like a group
[43:50] of people who were like mine. And I was just like propping her
[43:52] up. And it was like very early
[43:54] stages. And I told Joshua I wouldn't be
[43:55] part of the team. You know, I like, so you see
[43:58] from high school, I used to multitask.
[43:59] So I was always interested in learning and doing the things
[44:02] that I was interested in so that I'll get like some soft skills.
[44:05] So they added me to the team as a social media manager.
[44:08] And let me tell you something, women are really women in the
[44:13] arts, women in the public light or whatever.
[44:15] You guys go through a lot in your DMS.
[44:18] Because I was running her page, people used to think they were
[44:21] talking to Adwa the things that's into the DMS.
[44:28] But anyway, yeah, so in VI there was a Sousa, he used to shoot
[44:33] her videos, a camera guy. And then my friend Hanif from
[44:36] school as well was good with camera.
[44:37] Then of course my car that I did the magazine with, right.
[44:40] So when I I wanted to do off the top, I just because I built like
[44:44] a relationship with all these guys and I just reached out to
[44:47] them and I said this is what I want to do.
[44:48] I don't have equipment, I don't have anything.
[44:50] What do you guys think? And they bought into the idea.
[44:53] So they were we're all doing it for free.
[44:55] I wasn't paying anybody. My best friend Niapa, we started
[44:58] if you watch the first two seasons of off the top, it
[45:00] wasn't this brown couch and orange wall that was my best
[45:02] friend's house because you couldn't have money to pay for a
[45:05] location. And I would give his.
[45:07] There was a woman that lived in this house, anti fellow would
[45:10] give her money to cook jollof for us.
[45:12] And then I'll use my own salary to go and buy like drinks and
[45:15] things. If you ever came to the sort of
[45:16] off the top, it worked. During the time.
[45:18] I was working advertising agency.
[45:20] OK, but. It was called Renegades.
[45:22] It doesn't exist anymore. I was getting paid somewhere
[45:25] between 1008 and 2000 kind of series and it was all going
[45:28] through the production and but. Why?
[45:34] When people make those bets on side projects, there must be a
[45:38] conviction they ran with. What was the conviction on this
[45:40] one for you to even stick your entire?
[45:43] I had no idea where I was going with the show, I just knew that
[45:46] I wanted to create. You're interested in Yeah.
[45:49] I don't, I feel like I'm not somebody that's like I, I, I
[45:52] rarely start things with like this master plan, you know, I
[45:57] was just, I had a job and I was getting paid, but I knew that I
[46:03] wanted to create so I would always feel my free time with
[46:05] something. And I had a strong conviction,
[46:07] you know, that like I, I can't do it me.
[46:11] Like if today I wanna, I'm currently leaning out to DG, you
[46:15] know, because I'm just interested, you know what I
[46:17] mean? If I I say I want to learn how
[46:19] to be a bricklayer, I'm not going to say here.
[46:23] DJ influence is coming from your professor, but that guy, that
[46:27] guy's the experience in that guy has.
[46:30] OK, I wouldn't say that. It's just that I like music and
[46:33] recently I've been going to, I don't do a lot of mainstream
[46:36] outing anymore. I've been going to like this
[46:38] warehouse where they Playhouse and EDM music and I just really,
[46:43] when you watch the DJ's, they just seem like they're having
[46:45] fun. And I think I want to do that.
[46:47] And some when they do that, like the transitions and things, the
[46:50] effects it has on the people there.
[46:52] I want to be in charge of people's vibes, you know what I
[46:54] mean? So yeah, I didn't really have
[46:57] any master plan and I was something that I used to borrow
[47:00] money from my my friends put it in some ways.
[47:02] And when my salary comes, I pay them back.
[47:03] So I was constantly broke and, you know, I watch a lot of BTS,
[47:09] the making of like when it comes to movies, TV shows and all of
[47:14] that. So I had a fair idea of what it
[47:16] takes to like, cast people for a show.
[47:19] Like I grew up watching Charmed, you know, Charmed, Poo Piper and
[47:23] Phoebe. The power of thrill set you free
[47:25] of Bill. What did you grow up watching?
[47:28] Well, I wasn't. I wasn't watching TV growing up.
[47:32] You. Didn't watch the Parkers.
[47:33] You didn't watch Taina, you didn't watch my wife and kids.
[47:37] OK, All right. So, yeah, because of that, I had
[47:41] an idea of the kind of characters that it would take to
[47:43] make a successful show. And I used to go out.
[47:46] I remember Sewa on Off the Top. I went to Republic and I didn't
[47:50] know how she It was karaoke night, and she came and she came
[47:53] to do karaoke and it was funny. It was so fun.
[47:56] I just woke up. So I was like, can I get your
[47:57] number? And you're like, sure.
[47:59] I was like, I have a show I'm developing.
[48:00] I want you on. You're like sure 6.
[48:03] I met 6 at Seralio like most of the people that were on the
[48:05] show. And I it's I don't know, maybe I
[48:07] have magic. I didn't have any hard time
[48:09] convincing anybody. I was like this what I'm doing.
[48:11] Think about it, the show I didn't come out.
[48:13] So they didn't even have anything to like believe on.
[48:16] So I remember when I put everybody on a group chat and I
[48:19] was like, hey guys, you are going to be the cast of the show
[48:20] and everything silence. And they were all messaging me
[48:25] privately. They wouldn't talk on the group,
[48:27] you know what I mean? And I remember after the first
[48:29] day we shot, they had so much fun that now the group chat had
[48:33] to mute it, you know what I mean?
[48:35] But it was in my third season of of the top.
[48:37] I met at the agency that was at MAKE.
[48:40] Money from the show. Eventually, so that's what I'm
[48:42] coming to in season 3. I met a friend that I have now.
[48:46] It's called Raphael and he's when he was he was used.
[48:49] Oh, your show is nice and everything.
[48:51] I hope you're making money from it.
[48:52] And I was like, no, how am I going to make money from it?
[48:54] And I was like, I'm not serious. And he walks away, right?
[48:58] And he just kept frinking in my head.
[48:59] I'm like, what does he mean? I'm not serious?
[49:01] I'm he's like a serious. So I went and he was like, look,
[49:03] you have to put kids together, your followers, your reach,
[49:06] whatever, and then move to brands, right?
[49:08] So he helped me do all of that. And I think the very first 1st,
[49:12] I can't remember it was Jameson or Axe, but they were one of the
[49:15] first brands. It was either Axe, I think it
[49:16] was Axe. They paid us.
[49:18] So if you watch Season 3, you realize that we're in the studio
[49:20] because we started making some money.
[49:22] So we we did a lot of work with people.
[49:24] And one of the things I really like about what I did off the
[49:27] top was that I was able to help them launch some kind of AI,
[49:31] gave them some kind of social currency to be able to launch a
[49:33] career in a lot of things. But anyway, yeah, I don't even
[49:38] know where I was going. Now with a chassi, you're done.
[49:40] With a chassi you, you figured out somehow that you are
[49:43] interested in media you created, you go ahead to create this
[49:47] great judicial very popular show.
[49:50] But on the side you have the job right.
[49:52] You said your record that never advertise.
[49:54] Advertising agency, Yeah. So I think there are two acts at
[49:57] play here, right? Somehow.
[50:01] Did you have an idea of, I mean, after off the top?
[50:05] First of all, I have to prefer I ask the next question off the
[50:08] top. How did it end?
[50:09] Why? Why did it come to the end?
[50:11] COVID oh thank you so much. Hey no brand promo I'm COVID.
[50:17] So we were actually shooting when COVID was about that bill.
[50:20] They said they don't care about you.
[50:21] You can choke. Why did?
[50:23] It cost you their side decides to.
[50:25] The side too. Oh don't worry guys.
[50:27] Listen, I'm not. We were shooting in COVID and I
[50:33] had a plan to shoot like a full season.
[50:35] We had only shot like 4 episodes and COVID happened so we
[50:38] couldn't shoot anymore. So we just edited the four
[50:41] episodes and then I did a documentary of the making of it
[50:43] and put it out. What happened was, I don't know
[50:46] if it happened to you, but when COVID happened I realized I was
[50:49] doing too much because suddenly you couldn't do anything.
[50:54] So you're at home and I didn't realize how much of my life was
[50:59] being taken up by off the top because I wasn't doing the show
[51:07] like a joking stuff like I was doing this.
[51:08] We used to do we used to shoot preseason trailers, right.
[51:12] So we would I would always come up with the concepts before the
[51:15] season starts. Come up with the concepts where
[51:16] like who shoots like a promo video to say that the seasons
[51:20] about starts. And then I have to sit down and
[51:22] come up with the questions for every episode and I have to call
[51:25] the team together and be like guys, what do you think?
[51:27] Get their feedback and they're like they were very helpful.
[51:29] But because like it was my show, I had to take lead and then
[51:35] shooting itself was just chaotic.
[51:36] We used to take like 2 months to shoot cause and then in one day
[51:41] we tried to shoot like 6 episodes.
[51:43] And mind you, we shoot on Saturday mornings.
[51:45] Half of these guys go to the club on Friday, they come to the
[51:47] studio, lit, tired, sleepy. It was chaotic.
[51:52] Then when all of that is done editing, I used to edit the
[51:55] video. I do the cuts.
[51:57] When I finished editing it, then I sent it to my friend Hanif.
[52:00] He does the coloring. You check for sound graphics.
[52:03] Then now, because I didn't want to do the thing where it's like
[52:06] you edit and put out, edit and put out.
[52:08] I wanted to make sure that we were always consistent.
[52:10] So we don't start the season until we have like at least four
[52:12] or five edited episodes because used to come out every Wednesday
[52:15] consistently. It was a lot of vehicle and
[52:18] imagine having a nine to five. You have a personal life, you
[52:21] have family because I was living with my mother.
[52:23] So they are sending you on errands and things and you're
[52:26] doing all of this. I used to sleep at like 2-3 AM
[52:28] because I'm editing now. Go to work.
[52:30] And when you work in an advertising agency, you don't
[52:32] work at 9:00 to 5:00 because then you have a brand.
[52:34] Like for example, I remember there was a wooden show that we
[52:36] did. We closed at like 2:00 AM and
[52:39] I'm not going home. Then I have to wake up and go
[52:41] back to work. You know what I mean?
[52:43] So when COVID happened and I was like, I have all this free time,
[52:46] I was like, I'm not going, I'm not doing this thing again.
[52:49] I'm like, I'm tired, you know? So that's how it kind of like
[52:53] ended. And a lot of people always like
[52:54] bring it back, bring it back. And I'm like.
[52:56] Yeah, you avoid that question anytime you ask when you go
[52:58] somewhere. Yeah, because I was also
[53:00] younger, right? Like right now I have knee pain,
[53:02] back pain, you know, I mean, I, I played that, but like, if
[53:10] you're in your 30s, you know? Yeah, it's not the same.
[53:13] So that's energy that I had to run around and all that.
[53:16] Do the same. It's not that energy I had to
[53:19] run around. Like whenever I think about it,
[53:21] I'm like, OK, we'll be good to bring it back, but I'm tired.
[53:24] And also it's like, I currently have the podcast that I'm doing
[53:28] as well, and that takes also a lot of time.
[53:30] How? Did sincerely aircraft start
[53:32] well OK, they sincerely acquire in the timeline there's off the
[53:34] top government has happened terminated.
[53:39] How did that from the journey from that to the podcast, how
[53:42] did that? Happen.
[53:42] So The funny thing is that sincerely aircraft started when
[53:44] of the top was still happening. OK, yes, in 2014, you remember,
[53:49] were you ever on BlackBerry Messenger?
[53:51] No, please. OK.
[53:52] My God, I'm sounding very rich. Guys, listen, it was a hand me
[53:57] down phone. OK?
[53:59] No. So I was on BB pin.
[54:01] Yeah, I was on BlackBerry Messenger.
[54:03] And there was this guy that used to post his own version of Quick
[54:07] Quinance's stories and I would always read it and then I'll
[54:10] give him like I'll comments and stuff like that.
[54:12] And that was Kwami Asante. Yeah, I, well, yeah.
[54:17] I used to read. A lot of me.
[54:18] I grew up. I was reading Goosebumps, Nancy
[54:21] Drew, Hardy Boys. Who was feeling that?
[54:24] Your mom. Me.
[54:26] Well, I mean, to be fair, I grew up with books in the house.
[54:28] Yes. And it blighted and all of that
[54:30] encyclopedias. Do you guys know what an
[54:32] encyclopedia is? Before Google, yes.
[54:35] You had to open that book, go to the alphabet you want.
[54:37] Yeah, I used to read and then when we have like book fairs, I
[54:40] will buy books as well. So I used to read a lot and I
[54:43] think maybe that's why I also started writing.
[54:45] So Lord of the Rings, Harry Potter, all 88 books?
[54:48] Is it 8 or 7 books? 87777 is. 80 as they split a
[54:53] lot. What's your favorite Harry
[54:54] Potter? Which one I?
[54:56] Would say Goblet of Fire. You know what?
[55:00] I think that Goblet of Fire is a good book, but it's a horrible
[55:04] movie. Horrible movie, and the movies
[55:07] get darker. Half Blood Prince?
[55:10] Yeah, I don't. Know half blood Prince is.
[55:12] Actually, the Great I think is the greatest book out of all of
[55:15] it, Half Blood Prince. But yeah, where was I even going
[55:18] with all of this? Yeah, so he was, he lives in
[55:22] America, right? And so when he came to Ghana,
[55:24] because I used to always comment on his stuff, we just met up and
[55:28] then we became friends and he to just like he used to create.
[55:31] He did a documentary on disability in Ghana that I
[55:35] helped him with. He used to do short films.
[55:38] I'll help him. So we were always like just
[55:39] creating, creating, right? And then GCR, they had a podcast
[55:44] called Free Your Mind and they invited me on this talk about
[55:47] like creating off the top. And I remember walking away from
[55:50] the studio and I was thinking, E, I've always wanted to like,
[55:55] you know, have a talk show. You remember I said when I was a
[55:57] child, I used to watch Oprah and stuff.
[55:58] I was like, it would be nice. So I just randomly like messaged
[56:01] Kwame. I was like, hey, Kwame, I went
[56:02] to this place. It would be nice to have a
[56:04] podcast too. Little did I know Kwame went to
[56:07] school with Cyril and do now other people that started GCR
[56:10] went to that. She wanted to get that.
[56:12] And so he was like, let's start 1, you know, And then we came up
[56:16] with a concept. We sent them an e-mail.
[56:17] They liked the concept and that's how the podcast started.
[56:20] So the concept was, Oh my goodness, actually, we actually
[56:23] changed. The first thing was how I
[56:26] discovered podcast was this podcast called Serial.
[56:28] Do you know Serial? Serial, Yes.
[56:30] Not like conflict zoo, like serial killer.
[56:33] Yes. There was this podcast called
[56:34] Serial who's popular about this guy that had been sent to jail
[56:39] because he said he killed his girlfriend, but there wasn't
[56:40] enough evidence anyway. So we wanted to do an
[56:45] investigative podcast. Whereas like every season will
[56:48] be one topic, right? And the first season was going
[56:50] to be like the return of the, of the, they put our goal and study
[56:55] abroad and come back to Ghana. So it would be like a whole
[56:57] season where we are talking to different people who have gone
[56:59] steady abroad and they've come back and how like life is now
[57:02] that they've come back. But we had to change because
[57:05] Ghanaians are not honest people. I yeah, I just feel like we are
[57:10] very timid. So we are not very open.
[57:13] I remember I asked this guy, I was like, you know, you've been
[57:16] living in wherever country you believe for like 5 years now.
[57:18] You live with your parents. How has that affected your sex
[57:21] life? And he was so taken aback
[57:23] because you know me, I'm very direct.
[57:25] He was so taken aback and he was like, oh, he's fine.
[57:27] I was like, come on, what do you mean by it's fine?
[57:31] Like give me more. It's fine.
[57:33] It's fine. No, so the episode, like it
[57:36] wasn't working. And so we had to like, yeah, it
[57:39] would be a boring thing. So we had to pivot to like the
[57:41] Vox Pops. And that's how we started doing
[57:42] Vox Pops. We were like, OK, let's rather
[57:44] just do something, you know? And then that's how the podcast
[57:46] started. So when the podcast started Off
[57:48] the Top was still happening and when COVID happened, whereas of
[57:52] the top required that we go to a location and shoots, the podcast
[57:55] was audio, you know, but look, it's not that podcast is video.
[57:58] When I started podcasting was purely audio.
[58:01] And honestly, if I had known podcasting was going to become
[58:03] video, I wouldn't have done it. I tell you no, because I've I
[58:07] didn't realize that a byproduct of it was going to be some level
[58:11] of popularity. You know, like, I like
[58:13] interacting with people that listen to the podcast, but I
[58:16] don't like the exposure at all. OK.
[58:20] So trading anonymity. So I just really want to
[58:22] understand how you have managed that the absent, I mean we can
[58:27] both sides, the pros and the cons for you.
[58:32] I mean, I'm an actor. I think I'm, I'm a great actor,
[58:38] but that is not to say that when I interact with people that
[58:40] listen to the podcast, I'm like be fake or anything.
[58:44] I think what that helps me to do is look, we are human beings.
[58:47] You're not always going to run into people when you're happy.
[58:51] And that's something that I I struggled with.
[58:53] I think I post COVID like 20212223I struggled a lot with
[59:00] like, OK, I want to say depression, but it wasn't like
[59:05] depression, depression. It was like surface level
[59:07] depression, right? And I realized that the podcast
[59:10] requires me to perform happiness all the time.
[59:14] Like, yeah, you can never come on the mic and be like, today
[59:18] I'm not feeling it. So hi guys, welcome to the
[59:20] aircraft. To do that, you can't do that.
[59:22] I can't because it's upbeat. And my producer called me like
[59:28] when I send a recording, he can say the vibe is off record
[59:31] again. You can have you can go through
[59:33] heartbreak, you can go through loss.
[59:35] You can go through whatever they come.
[59:36] Hi, guys. It's another exciting episode of
[59:38] the Sincerely podcast. I'm here.
[59:40] I had to perform happiness, right?
[59:42] And when we first started, there was no performance.
[59:44] It was just me being me, right? And so when I got to that
[59:49] realization, and then also it's like you're also meeting people.
[59:53] I've met somebody that has said that the podcast has stopped
[59:55] them from committing suicide, right?
[59:58] So when you have that in your head.
[1:00:00] You also cannot be like, I'm tired.
[1:00:02] I won't do it again, at least for me, because I also know how
[1:00:05] the importance of please, the role of like in people's lives.
[1:00:13] So I was like, I was struggling for like some three years where
[1:00:16] it's like I had to perform happiness.
[1:00:19] But like I say, because I'm a, I'm a great actor, it's just
[1:00:22] like it's time for me to act. So I I will do that performance.
[1:00:26] Sometimes I meet people in very less ideal situations.
[1:00:30] I do the performance, you know what I mean?
[1:00:32] So when it comes to interacting with people and all of that,
[1:00:35] yeah, that's how I manage it. But people that know me
[1:00:38] personally know that like I post a list now, I used to me on
[1:00:43] Snapchat, I used to post every second of my life.
[1:00:45] I feel like if I had stayed, I'll probably be like a Snapchat
[1:00:49] influencer. Yeah, because I used to even the
[1:00:51] students that I used to teach, it was crazy.
[1:00:53] I'll go to the club and everything.
[1:00:54] And when I come and I'm, I'm teaching to be like, hey, we saw
[1:00:57] you at your Snap. We saw you in Soho.
[1:00:59] I'd be like, oh really? Why do you follow me?
[1:01:01] You know, so I, yeah, I've been, I've become a bit more private
[1:01:07] with my social media, I would say.
[1:01:11] Why the the? Fear of being.
[1:01:15] Perceived, I guess, you know, social media has really changed
[1:01:19] from being fun to this thing like even Twitter, right?
[1:01:23] Ever since Elon masks took over and now random people can't pay
[1:01:27] for budgets. You see intentional rage baits
[1:01:31] just to get engagement and so any and everything.
[1:01:34] Let me let me tell you how I became a topic of a Twitter
[1:01:37] space, right? My dad has this old photo of him
[1:01:42] in a plane. I look like my dad of him in a
[1:01:45] plane with a funny pack. He was standing in the aisle,
[1:01:47] right? And I remember I was traveling
[1:01:50] to Cape Town. I can't remember the year.
[1:01:53] And I, I was like, Oh, I'm going to recreate this picture.
[1:01:56] So I recreated a picture and I posted a side by side on my
[1:01:58] Twitter. And then like, you know, I got
[1:02:00] retweets and everything. And then MTN reached out to me
[1:02:03] on Father's Day and they said they wanted to do a Father's Day
[1:02:05] camping post like daddy. So they'll use like our photos,
[1:02:09] you know, got paid for it and everything great ad the day that
[1:02:12] the the Father's Day that he posted the thing some random
[1:02:18] accounts and at that time I just started my TikTok.
[1:02:22] I just had my TikTok as well as some random accounts came to
[1:02:25] quotes the MTM post and said I don't know why they use this
[1:02:28] guy. He's not even, I'm paraphrasing,
[1:02:29] he's not even funny, something like that.
[1:02:31] And then I made the mistake of responding because at the time I
[1:02:36] had 13 videos on TikTok and I remember I said something like
[1:02:40] you watched all 13 videos and came to the decision that I'm
[1:02:43] not funny. Sounds like you're a fan.
[1:02:45] Lol. This is me.
[1:02:47] Just, you know, I go off Twitter and it becomes a whole thing
[1:02:50] where like people that listen to the podcast were now defending
[1:02:52] me and I don't know who this person was.
[1:02:54] She was responding to everybody. You, they, she was responding to
[1:02:58] everybody. Like when you body here, she
[1:02:59] body you like and the whole thing.
[1:03:01] And on that day, I think there was this other girl who's dad is
[1:03:04] a politician or something, something that happened.
[1:03:06] So they're doing a Twitter space to talk about her.
[1:03:08] Then they also added me. So I was just there and then my
[1:03:10] friend was like, send me a link. I was like, what's this?
[1:03:12] Oh, they're discussing you on spaces.
[1:03:13] I didn't listen cause me things get to me a lot.
[1:03:17] You know what I mean? So I didn't listen, but that's
[1:03:19] what happened. And so for me now, even if I see
[1:03:23] people say like hateful things about me or the content of the
[1:03:25] work that I do, I don't engage because I realized that it
[1:03:28] amplifies it. Yeah, yeah.
[1:03:30] And that was back when they were not even paying for engagements,
[1:03:32] right. So yes, when I say I become a
[1:03:35] bit more private, like sometimes when they are trending issues
[1:03:38] like for example, quiz, yeah. And things like that.
[1:03:40] The best time to get engagement is to share your opinion.
[1:03:43] So I pick and choose what I will share my opinion on.
[1:03:45] In fact, if I have strong opinions about anything, I see
[1:03:48] it on the podcast. I won't tweet it.
[1:03:50] I won't because I honestly don't want to give anybody the chance
[1:03:54] to come in. When I when I was texting on
[1:03:57] Instagram, I was. Like, is he going to respond?
[1:04:00] Yeah, What was that about? I don't know when I responded.
[1:04:04] I was like, oh, he replied. And I and I get that from.
[1:04:08] A lot do you know? Let me say something I.
[1:04:10] Respond to every DMO, every single DM and I tell people I
[1:04:13] don't, I'm not verified, who am I to not respond to your DM like
[1:04:17] I don't have 10K followers, you know what I mean?
[1:04:20] I respond, yeah it's cool. But when you decide to do this
[1:04:23] though, have this conversation. Why, Yeah.
[1:04:27] I guess perception like when I saw when you sense the thing.
[1:04:31] I checked. I OK, I'd seen the the trailer
[1:04:35] for Yeah. I feel like he has some titles.
[1:04:39] I'm not saying Captain. Captain.
[1:04:41] OK. What is what is your captain of
[1:04:43] Militia? Captain.
[1:04:45] Militia Captain. OK.
[1:04:46] All right, all right. Before they come for me.
[1:04:49] One time I said I didn't know who Okra Tom David was on
[1:04:52] TikTok. I was getting, I was getting
[1:04:54] death threats for a week. Oh, yeah.
[1:04:57] That's how social media becomes crazy.
[1:05:00] No, So I saw that. So I had an idea of, you know,
[1:05:03] because I'm in podcasting. Every time I see a new podcast,
[1:05:05] I just try to like keep a mental note of it.
[1:05:08] You know, I don't want to ever be in a space where like, do you
[1:05:10] know this? But I'll be like, oh, what
[1:05:11] pocket? Then it'll be like, maybe you're
[1:05:12] looking down. What kind of mommy?
[1:05:14] I don't know. So I know the first half of
[1:05:16] because I've just not listened. And then I went to your page.
[1:05:19] It's just, you know, it's your curation.
[1:05:23] If maybe I'd come to your page, I've seen one or two things and
[1:05:25] I've said no and I wouldn't tell you the reason why, but I went
[1:05:28] to my page and I was like, Oh, obey decent.
[1:05:34] OK, so your Brandon helped you on the pass up No on your
[1:05:39] Instagram. I.
[1:05:40] Didn't I? Didn't wait.
[1:05:41] So where did I see the picture of?
[1:05:43] The three of you, is it a person?
[1:05:43] On my Instagram, yeah. So it's your your Instagram that
[1:05:46] I I. Clicked 'cause you you.
[1:05:47] Deemed me right. Uh huh.
[1:05:49] And so, yeah. And I was also going to ask you
[1:05:51] why did you ask physical on your show?
[1:05:54] So I think I was on. I was on a phone call with.
[1:05:56] A friend we were talking and I think you should have Joe on
[1:05:59] your podcast. He's very interesting.
[1:06:01] I like his podcast Quiz that I won't tell you issue actually.
[1:06:10] Because I was actually. Telling the person that I like
[1:06:12] the way you talk like you do this, like you're very
[1:06:13] synchronic. The guy boots an idea from here
[1:06:15] for the same critic guys and it's.
[1:06:19] Like I think you have him on the.
[1:06:19] Podcast like what he's doing with this for the podcast and
[1:06:21] say like why someone like people can this is the story would be 1
[1:06:24] to yeah it's cool let me try this too I open the Instagram.
[1:06:28] I said a little prayer and I sent you a message.
[1:06:30] Ah, he's not that serious, No. And also I don't get.
[1:06:34] Asked to come on people's shows yeah at all.
[1:06:38] Like I feel like if. More or less divide.
[1:06:41] And stay by plan. So Afian Zoo, they used to be on
[1:06:43] the top. So they're my friends.
[1:06:45] You know, people do this funny thing where like, and it's it's
[1:06:48] crazy when you do something like this, people feel like they know
[1:06:51] you. So they talk to you in the DMS a
[1:06:53] lot. Me, I mean, I respond.
[1:06:54] I don't have to be my friend for me to respond.
[1:06:56] And people think that we are like in competition with them.
[1:06:58] They're my friends. So like we talk so so we're
[1:07:02] really cool. I never feel like I'm in
[1:07:04] competition with any podcast ever.
[1:07:07] If somebody feels like they're in competition with me, good
[1:07:09] luck in competition. I think your podcast got
[1:07:14] recognized. By Spotify.
[1:07:15] Oh yeah, How's that? So that's what literally.
[1:07:18] Changed the trajectory. Of the podcast, right?
[1:07:20] Which was this God OK if we start in 20?
[1:07:23] 17 it happened in the 5th year. Wow.
[1:07:26] Yeah, five years. I'm going at it, Bill.
[1:07:29] You are coming in at a sweet spot because the creative.
[1:07:31] Community is kind of like open. When we started doing
[1:07:34] podcasting, you know when you get your iPhone, the podcast
[1:07:37] app, people didn't know it was so they used to delete it.
[1:07:39] So when I say this is my podcast, they don't have the app
[1:07:42] on the phone. So yeah.
[1:07:45] And like, you know how you make money is if like you have brand
[1:07:49] brands doing ads and stuff like that, but nobody was like, who
[1:07:53] are you? Yes, who are yes.
[1:07:55] So every two. Weeks.
[1:07:57] We both have jobs, so it's like we spaced it out for ourselves
[1:08:01] and then in the 5th year, you know what happened was Spotify
[1:08:04] wanted to launch? Were you looking for it to?
[1:08:05] It's becoming a financial. Like look for the financial
[1:08:08] benefit. No, no, just enjoy.
[1:08:10] It's just like over the top. I was.
[1:08:12] Like I want to like we're just talking.
[1:08:13] And for me was audio. So it was like low cost.
[1:08:16] I used to sit in my my wardrobe. I, I closed my wardrobe.
[1:08:21] I'm in between like my clothes so that it's laser sound and
[1:08:24] then my phone, this thing I just record and then I sent it to
[1:08:28] Kwame in America. Then he adds all of that and we
[1:08:31] put it out very low efforts, you know what I mean?
[1:08:33] So it wasn't, I wasn't looking for any whatever.
[1:08:35] But when we started with GCR, of course, you know, we assigned to
[1:08:38] a studio. So they have to, it has to make
[1:08:40] sense to them. And like, you'd go meetings like
[1:08:44] a label, label, kind of, yeah. Kinda, yeah.
[1:08:47] So they they help you to. Get like, stuff like brands or
[1:08:52] whatever. And then like, there's a cut.
[1:08:54] There's a whole situation. I see.
[1:08:55] Yeah. Because like, they edits, like
[1:08:56] the Kwame does the audio, but they do video and everything.
[1:09:00] I don't have to lift a finger. You should give me a check.
[1:09:02] I should get out. Listen, don't do that.
[1:09:04] Don't do that. So Spotify was coming into
[1:09:08] Africa, right? And then they realized that a
[1:09:12] good way to do it. Also empower creatives.
[1:09:15] And fortunately for us, our Spotify numbers were good.
[1:09:18] So, you know, it was they picked 13 podcasts in Africa to give a
[1:09:22] grant to and from Ghana. They only picked us.
[1:09:26] And yeah, so after we got that grant, we like you know, there
[1:09:29] was news articles and everything since that time 0 now you know,
[1:09:35] brands what's work with you now when you ask celebrities to come
[1:09:39] on now they were we have people have deemed.
[1:09:43] Is that what I want to mention? We deal people and it's so
[1:09:46] crazy. Like after yeah, after the
[1:09:48] Spotify ground, the tides change.
[1:09:50] Right now we are sitting at a place where let's see this
[1:09:54] person, this one, this and now we are like, hmm, that be yes,
[1:10:00] yeah. But I remember back when we were
[1:10:02] like it took five years. It took five years.
[1:10:04] Yes, I'm telling you. And I think that's the sad thing
[1:10:08] about creating in Ghana. Like when we came in, there were
[1:10:12] certain podcast they have all gone away, right?
[1:10:16] I think people do not have the consistency that it takes for
[1:10:20] things to become great. I always think that this thing
[1:10:25] when people say that you have to be.
[1:10:26] Consistent to achieve a level of greatness and success.
[1:10:29] I always feel like the consistency is a byproduct of
[1:10:31] something more in it. It's like if you love a woman,
[1:10:35] you want to buy things the innate thing that you love this
[1:10:38] woman or you love like your partner, you want to buy things,
[1:10:41] right? It's a byproduct of that to you.
[1:10:45] I mean, because me, I have I'm having fun having these
[1:10:48] conversations with all these people building friendships.
[1:10:51] It's fun. Gay people's stories called it's
[1:10:53] I'm having the time of my life. I texted Dick about this last
[1:10:57] year that I'm grateful for this experience, right?
[1:11:00] And now so because I am having fun it comes easy.
[1:11:04] Me, I don't mind. OK, pushing a meeting with work
[1:11:07] and coming or you know, yeah, showing up every day.
[1:11:11] Yeah, yeah, it comes, it's coming easy to me.
[1:11:13] So now I'm wondering, what do you think kept going for that
[1:11:16] five year period? I was living my dream like I.
[1:11:20] I, I grew up watching Oprah Winfrey, right?
[1:11:23] And another thing is our show is very intentional.
[1:11:26] We have production meetings every week.
[1:11:28] Or sometimes I'm even tired because The thing is Kwame works
[1:11:31] in radio production or he worked in radio production.
[1:11:34] So he is very detailed. Me, I was ready to like
[1:11:37] freestyle and come on. No, he would send me production
[1:11:40] notes. This is at this point we do this
[1:11:42] mind your inflection, right? So he's really like held with me
[1:11:46] to be a bit more like professional with it.
[1:11:49] And even being a part of that process for me is fun.
[1:11:52] Like where we're like, OK, the season is starting.
[1:11:54] What are the conversations we think we should have?
[1:11:56] Who are we going to have on? OK, this person is coming on and
[1:12:00] that's how intentional it is. For example, let's say I have a
[1:12:02] Marie on the show, right? I watch every interview she's
[1:12:08] done that I can't get my hand on.
[1:12:10] And then I see the POV that every single interview had.
[1:12:14] And then Kwame and I, we talk, OK, how can we have a different
[1:12:17] PUV, right? And then, then we start to think
[1:12:20] about it, think about it. And then we come up with the
[1:12:22] questions and that whole process.
[1:12:24] I, I enjoy it. It reminds me of when I used to
[1:12:26] teach and I used to prepare my lecture notes and everything.
[1:12:28] I enjoy it. And it's so funny because
[1:12:31] everybody that comes on and everything, I don't even take
[1:12:34] their number. I'm not talking to them.
[1:12:36] We are not friends. So when you were like, oh, you
[1:12:38] get to meet people and whatever, I guess I get to meet people in
[1:12:41] this school. But like, that's it.
[1:12:44] Interesting. But for me On the contrary,
[1:12:46] like. Friendships are form, Yeah.
[1:12:49] Does that seem like? Getting invited to people.
[1:12:52] 'S house for lunch and dinner or yeah.
[1:12:57] Maybe that's my apps? I think little apps, I just feel
[1:13:00] like I don't want to worry them. That's how I see so.
[1:13:02] Like, 'cause like when we did guilty beats, right?
[1:13:04] He was like, oh, he really enjoyed it.
[1:13:06] He was like, oh, take my number. I've never texted it if I could
[1:13:10] enter minds eye right and project five years.
[1:13:12] Into the future with regards to Sincerely acquire, what do you
[1:13:15] think it would be? I think.
[1:13:19] We we are always very intentional about, you know,
[1:13:24] being tastemakers of like the culture here in a car.
[1:13:28] So for example, last year when we started doing queue music, we
[1:13:31] used to get a lot of emails in DMS from like up and coming
[1:13:36] artists. Hey, this is what you're saying.
[1:13:37] That's emerging artists. Oh, listen, because you know, we
[1:13:41] play 90% Ghanian music. Kwame is like a music group.
[1:13:46] Sometimes people meet me and they're like, Hey, where did you
[1:13:48] get this song from? I said, I don't know, ask Kwame.
[1:13:50] Like some of the songs are Kwame, please.
[1:13:52] You even think they're all Ghanian songs, but they are
[1:13:54] really talented people, right? So we came up with this idea
[1:13:56] that list platform them because one thing is and that's how we
[1:14:00] got our RODG on when people having hits, Ghanaian media
[1:14:04] spaces are not interested in inviting them over.
[1:14:07] Do you understand they don't do that.
[1:14:10] Shout out Kuju Sheldon because I, I, I, I olive the boy.
[1:14:14] I saw him back then when he was playing piano.
[1:14:16] He was so tiny, right? I saw him on Instagram,
[1:14:20] discovered. Him before, yeah, like RC when
[1:14:23] we put RC on. He hadn't even done agenda.
[1:14:26] He had this song on Nice and Bend Kami says Instagram like
[1:14:29] this guy is good. Let's have him on, you know what
[1:14:30] I mean? So we felt like we just wanted
[1:14:32] to give people that platform because it's so interesting how
[1:14:36] you kind of have to be embraced by the global stage before
[1:14:40] Ghanaians be like, hey, hey, we want to be, you know, the kind
[1:14:45] of like taste makers of urban culture.
[1:14:47] So I definitely see as continuing to provide commentary
[1:14:52] on what Akra is and what Akra is becoming and hopefully we'll be
[1:14:57] able. One thing that we're trying to
[1:14:58] also do intentionally is when when you think about like artist
[1:15:02] rollouts or even understanding artists and how they do things,
[1:15:07] we want to provide a different POV.
[1:15:08] You know, there are different platforms that will give you
[1:15:10] different POV's. But for us, we want to
[1:15:12] interrogate the talent, where it's coming from, the decisions
[1:15:15] that are being made for the sound that, this, that.
[1:15:18] And if you listen to the interviews that we do, that's
[1:15:20] literally what it is, because I think there are a lot of
[1:15:24] talented people who look up to some of these acts and they want
[1:15:29] to understand their process, the whys and all of that.
[1:15:33] And I. And there's not a Dick at
[1:15:35] anybody. But sometimes most of the
[1:15:38] platforms that kind of highlight them, they don't ask them
[1:15:41] questions along those lines. And so I think, yeah, that's
[1:15:45] just where I see us, you know, solidifying ourself as
[1:15:50] interesting Yesterday when? I recorded, we called you
[1:15:53] Sheldon A mentioned something about, you know, he's led and
[1:15:59] admittedly so the frontier on new media in this country.
[1:16:02] And now people can wake up and say that it's a boy engineer.
[1:16:05] You can say I want to become a YouTube.
[1:16:07] No, it's true. My parents, it's true.
[1:16:10] And I have qualms with it. I think to a realized extent,
[1:16:13] you've also played the role in podcasting and now people can
[1:16:15] see I want to become a podcaster because it has worked.
[1:16:19] I've never thought about that really.
[1:16:20] No, no. You know, and I think.
[1:16:23] I I say. This in all humility, I've I've
[1:16:26] never entered. It's not an act.
[1:16:28] I've never really like been like, oh, I'm the reason why.
[1:16:31] Do you know what I mean? Even when I said a thing about
[1:16:33] like listening to, you know, like I'm joking.
[1:16:36] I I've never really thought about it like that.
[1:16:37] But you know, true with could you show them, for example, the
[1:16:41] rate at which they churn our content?
[1:16:42] Something happens out, like it's a template that exists in the
[1:16:46] global world and nobody was really doing that here.
[1:16:49] And so yes, he has definitely paved that way.
[1:16:52] And I guess you can say that about because we have stayed for
[1:16:54] a while, like this is our 9th year.
[1:16:57] That's insane. It's insane.
[1:16:59] Dick. Will we survive nine years?
[1:17:00] I think you should. I think you should see.
[1:17:03] Let me talk. We have survived our look.
[1:17:05] Kwame and I didn't talk for two years.
[1:17:08] I was about to touch on that. Yeah.
[1:17:09] And they? Can't go to yours without me.
[1:17:11] You die. He can't.
[1:17:13] Really call me every. Day he said yeah and you know we
[1:17:19] the love for the podcast we still push through it and I
[1:17:23] think look, when you are in a team or a group or whatever even
[1:17:27] your friendships you have misunderstandings yeah.
[1:17:31] But I think if you put it in your head that you you and this
[1:17:36] person is end game we are French whatever you work on it what
[1:17:39] cannot be worked on OK, let me know like.
[1:17:43] But that's what it is. And so every time when I see
[1:17:45] like a show that started and has stopped, I get very sad because
[1:17:48] I feel like if we don't have numbers, then we will not have
[1:17:52] an ecosystem. And without an ecosystem, we
[1:17:54] don't have an industry. Yeah, the more podcasts they are
[1:17:58] the. More we are able.
[1:17:59] To like now have a red card that everybody can send around and
[1:18:02] because it's like there's just three of you.
[1:18:04] So people are not taking the things serious, you know what I
[1:18:06] mean? And I just feel like
[1:18:08] consistency, something that's lacking.
[1:18:09] So please don't stop. You try.
[1:18:12] You try what you wanna stop. Dick.
[1:18:16] Maybe. When you have children and
[1:18:17] marry. You another thing pivots like
[1:18:19] you can pivot around it like, OK, now you have children.
[1:18:23] So then the conversations are going to be about like, you
[1:18:25] know, fatherhood and things like that.
[1:18:26] Don't like OK, you know what I mean?
[1:18:29] Don't don't stop. It's good you mention marriage
[1:18:31] and having kids. How?
[1:18:33] Do you prior you come to ask me about that?
[1:18:35] Yes. And I'm asking, I mean tied to
[1:18:39] something. OK, maybe I might mention it.
[1:18:42] Do you think about marriage? Do you think you're gonna get
[1:18:44] married? I feel like the only time I
[1:18:46] actually think about. It is when people ask me and to
[1:18:50] be fair, I hate having this line of thoughts because maybe it's
[1:18:56] like I'm putting blame on anybody or whatever, but it's
[1:18:58] like me growing up in there, the setup that like I had my father
[1:19:08] and all of that's like, like I said, it was, it was well, not
[1:19:12] dense, but it was very chaotic. And so for me, I don't
[1:19:16] necessarily it's not something I aspire to.
[1:19:19] That's one. And even with children, I go in
[1:19:21] and out of it. I don't even like, I go in and
[1:19:24] out of it in the sense that with my younger brother from my
[1:19:28] mother's side, I feel like I also played a lot of I played a
[1:19:31] huge role of like also like taking care of him.
[1:19:35] I used to take him to school, I walk and went to pick him back
[1:19:38] up. Now he lives with me right after
[1:19:39] another, he lives with me. So I don't feel like I'm missing
[1:19:42] out on anything in particular. And a lot of the conversations
[1:19:46] around children, people like legacy, legacy, legacy.
[1:19:48] My legacy is my my creative worker.
[1:19:50] That's true. When I die today, until 50
[1:19:54] years, these things, the digital footprints is there.
[1:19:57] People will be able to listen to the podcast and know what it was
[1:20:00] like in a car in 2018 when I was going to Saraju and asking
[1:20:03] people how much a fresh graduate should make as salaries.
[1:20:07] You know, it's going to live on. I don't.
[1:20:09] Well, last month there was a Hollywood director whose child
[1:20:13] slit his throat. He and his wife, right?
[1:20:16] They provided everything for that boy, you.
[1:20:18] So it's I, I just feel like the reasons people give for having
[1:20:22] all ones in your legacy, somebody to pick the remotes for
[1:20:24] you, all of those things, they're not strong.
[1:20:26] You know what I mean? And I'm a go getter.
[1:20:29] And one thing I tell myself is if I have not been moved to
[1:20:34] actually go and get these things, I'm not going to do it.
[1:20:36] Yeah, because if you think about this and look if people will be
[1:20:39] very. Honest with you by.
[1:20:40] Themselves, I think majority of people that are getting married
[1:20:43] and having children is because people are saying they should.
[1:20:47] People, people might might disagree.
[1:20:50] Yeah, but I feel like that's what it is sometimes.
[1:20:52] And and it's also because maybe they don't have anything going
[1:20:54] for them. I won't even lie, Bill.
[1:20:56] People get up, go to work and come home and that's it.
[1:20:59] It took me, I think it was last year, I was having a
[1:21:01] conversation with somebody and they were like, oh, what are you
[1:21:04] doing this week? And I was like, oh, I have to do
[1:21:06] this, I have to do that. And they were like, how do you
[1:21:09] do it like this? Like you are doing a lot too.
[1:21:12] And I realized that, wow, everybody doesn't have what I
[1:21:15] have going on, right? Because I go to work, I come
[1:21:18] back, I have a meeting with Kwame in the evening about the
[1:21:21] podcast and I'm doing research. Saturday I'm shooting.
[1:21:24] Then after that we are picking, we have another meeting to pick
[1:21:26] trailer carts. Then after that we have it like
[1:21:29] I always have something going on and I feel like maybe you finish
[1:21:33] school, you have a job, you are there and then they're like,
[1:21:36] Hey, they say they're waiting you, you're not worried.
[1:21:38] And then that becomes your next thing.
[1:21:40] You guys get married. Now they say, Hey, worry at you
[1:21:44] have the child who say Hey, my my backhoe for becoming like
[1:21:49] people will always tell you what to do, but do you really want to
[1:21:53] do? And that's why I'm saying if you
[1:21:54] because there are people that's like they genuinely want to be
[1:21:57] parents and things. If that's what you want to do,
[1:21:59] fine. But I'm very, very certain that
[1:22:02] a lot of people are getting my having children because, you
[1:22:05] know, social studies, there's this thing what they call rites
[1:22:07] of passage. Wasn't next, wasn't next, wasn't
[1:22:10] next. You're a highly spiritual
[1:22:13] person. I want to.
[1:22:14] Know what that means? Who said that?
[1:22:17] No, you know I. Oh my goodness.
[1:22:18] No, no, no. The thing is, I have.
[1:22:21] I had a very religious era. I used to like, sing in the
[1:22:25] choir and everything, but I was like, years ago.
[1:22:31] OK, Yeah. I mean that you said that's
[1:22:33] that's really. Religious seeing the choir, but
[1:22:36] the person said yeah, spiritual person and I want to ask you,
[1:22:39] would you would you call yourself that?
[1:22:41] No, that's why I'm surprised. Spiritual.
[1:22:43] OK, wait, it depends. What do you highly spiritual?
[1:22:46] Is that somebody's recordable? I don't know what they mean by
[1:22:51] that. Yeah, I, you know, I I stay away
[1:22:56] from the second. Here's the thing.
[1:22:58] I feel like the country that we live in, right, we have a very
[1:23:02] myopic view of things. Yeah.
[1:23:03] And it's not even a disc. So personally, on the podcast,
[1:23:06] there's certain things that I don't talk about, and religion
[1:23:07] is one of them. Yeah.
[1:23:08] People get very, very sentimental about it.
[1:23:12] And when I was doing And, you know, people always say when you
[1:23:14] go to school, then you feel you know everything.
[1:23:16] Well, we studied African philosophy.
[1:23:19] I remember there was a part about how religion played a part
[1:23:24] in the slave trade and how that also contributed to capitalism,
[1:23:29] you know, And so I just feel like in the developing countries
[1:23:34] like ours, it's been a very, you know, let me let's just, I just
[1:23:40] don't want to, you know, because somebody is like, I'm like being
[1:23:44] said, just being religious. And being special, different
[1:23:47] things. I think there are expressions of
[1:23:49] spirituality and religion is an expression.
[1:23:52] So various religious institutions are expressions of
[1:23:56] how we perceive the divine or interact with the divine right
[1:23:59] and people in very varied ways. I mean, for me, I always say
[1:24:03] that the pillars and the tools that help me navigate to that is
[1:24:09] Christian, predominantly Christian, but I am not close
[1:24:13] minded to things and how people do things, you know, because
[1:24:17] truly and truly we can't box God.
[1:24:20] I mean, we nobody can box God and offer truth to me.
[1:24:25] I mean, that's my truth. I think there's such a
[1:24:27] transcendent entity beyond all of this, beyond what we see,
[1:24:31] what we hold. There is something behind all of
[1:24:33] this as what it is. Nobody really knows.
[1:24:35] We can barely have like analogous language and like
[1:24:39] approximate. I just wait, Hold up, Does he
[1:24:41] talk like this all the time? Like he says stuff like
[1:24:43] analogous. That's crazy veil.
[1:24:46] What's it for? No, no, no, because you like you
[1:24:48] drop really big vocabulary. But you know, here's the thing.
[1:24:53] The church is a human institution.
[1:24:56] Exactly. So for me, I'm not a big fan of
[1:24:58] people who are like, oh. I don't go to church.
[1:24:59] Because the judge is a human institution, the people that you
[1:25:03] go to work with, the other people that go to church, the
[1:25:04] boys in the church with the people that go to church, like
[1:25:07] the people in church are not these like holy people that are
[1:25:10] like void of all of the things like, you know what I mean?
[1:25:13] So every time I hear that or see that critique, it's funny
[1:25:16] because people behave as if when you go to church now when
[1:25:20] they're different group of humans, they've come to go are
[1:25:21] supposed to be perfect. It's a human institution.
[1:25:25] So for me, it's never been a good enough reason for not going
[1:25:27] to church. I just generally there for me,
[1:25:31] there's just a little bit of like fundamentals that I have
[1:25:33] questioned. And then also which I came to
[1:25:36] terms with this last year, the things that I do, I need one day
[1:25:41] of rest. And for me that's Sunday.
[1:25:44] You know what I mean? Like when you're ready, I go to
[1:25:46] work. I said I record the broadcast,
[1:25:48] I'm doing research throughout the whole week.
[1:25:50] I'm exhausted like people and people say, oh, but you go out,
[1:25:54] you go out here, but not catch me out on the Sunday.
[1:25:57] Yeah, you know what I mean? So so for me like what I was
[1:26:01] seeing but like consistency, a byproduct.
[1:26:03] Of like a desire or something. Even the same with, like, going
[1:26:07] to church, for example. If you've entered a favor,
[1:26:10] you've been gripped internally by the supposed realities of the
[1:26:14] divine. Nobody will tell you to get up
[1:26:16] and go to church. You will enjoy it.
[1:26:18] That's why I'm putting that down.
[1:26:21] Yeah. Gripped.
[1:26:22] By the supposed realities of the divine.
[1:26:25] Oh my God, so poetic. So.
[1:26:28] You you go to. Like you go to church, you
[1:26:30] pursue God. Yeah, yeah.
[1:26:32] So for me, I think even podcasting, having conversation,
[1:26:35] listen to conversation. I think it speaks to my
[1:26:38] underlying desire to understand truth and how people perceive
[1:26:40] life and, you know, God And yeah.
[1:26:43] But anyway, there are two acts we've explored with your life so
[1:26:46] far. The arc where you've been a
[1:26:47] creative and like you just explore the whole media space
[1:26:51] and you built what you built sincerely acquire.
[1:26:53] And when you come back to see like we don't want to understand
[1:26:56] your partnership, how you might give the partnership with Kwame.
[1:26:58] But now there's a second arc. You have a job.
[1:27:00] Yeah, right. How does that play out in like
[1:27:04] all of this? For you, do you think you're
[1:27:05] going? To keep having a job in
[1:27:09] perpetuity? How does that look like?
[1:27:11] OK, so when how do I start? How do I start look asking this?
[1:27:18] Because I mean that's probably the reason.
[1:27:19] OK, I'm asking this. Because often time I've met by
[1:27:21] people who come to me say, hey, I have a job here at this 95, I
[1:27:25] want to do the side project. What do you think?
[1:27:27] Should I quit my job? Should I keep doing it?
[1:27:29] But you know, the passion is eating me up.
[1:27:34] But what do I do? So how have you navigated that?
[1:27:36] You know The funny thing though? When?
[1:27:40] I was working in advertising agency.
[1:27:43] I quit my job and I was like, you know what, I'm going to
[1:27:47] pursue being a creative for a whole year.
[1:27:52] And at the time of the top, I'd given us a little bit of social
[1:27:55] currency and I registered to create a production company
[1:27:59] because of the way we used to do like our promo videos and stuff.
[1:28:02] So I remember we showed a, a commercial for Uber origin.
[1:28:07] I can't remember the other brands, but like, it was good,
[1:28:09] you know, it was a lot of pre financing and then a 90 day
[1:28:12] finance. We have to wait, you know, And
[1:28:15] then after a while the gigs were not coming.
[1:28:17] So after a year of that freelance, whatever, I, I, I
[1:28:22] found a job. And what I learned in that year
[1:28:26] was I, I have met a lot of creatives, a lot of creatives.
[1:28:29] Some of them like some of the successful creatives that you
[1:28:32] see now, like way back then when we used to all start things
[1:28:36] together, sincerely cries like when I met some of them.
[1:28:39] And so another thing, people will see somebody who has blown
[1:28:43] and they're like, we were free for nobody, but they've been in
[1:28:45] the game for years. And I didn't want to be somebody
[1:28:51] that creates from a place of desperation because when you are
[1:28:55] looking for money, you want to do brand partnerships and
[1:28:58] things. They tend to dictate for you how
[1:29:00] they want things to go. A brand will come on, they like
[1:29:04] your podcast, they are doing how we are doing right now.
[1:29:06] Then a brand will come on and say that, oh, this table is
[1:29:08] high, let's make it low so that you can put alcohol on it.
[1:29:11] When you put, if you're able to put alcohol, then you can get
[1:29:13] other alcoholic brands to sponsor you.
[1:29:16] They will come and try and change and let's say because you
[1:29:18] don't have a source of income and this is where you're making
[1:29:21] money from, you feel like your hand is tied.
[1:29:24] Yeah, and I came across a lot of stories like that.
[1:29:27] Personally, I had experience with that when waiting off the
[1:29:29] top, there will be certain brands that will come and
[1:29:31] they'll be like, oh, we don't like this person on this show.
[1:29:33] Can you remove the person now? See, I've walked away from a lot
[1:29:35] of brand people that came and tried to you know, and, and it
[1:29:41] like something clicked in my mind and I was like, if I have a
[1:29:44] source of income, I will never have to be beholding to any.
[1:29:50] I can walk away from deals because, like I said, I was
[1:29:52] watching E true Hollywood story. I was learning about the lives
[1:29:55] of different people who have made it.
[1:29:57] And one of the things that I I would see what I was Beyoncé,
[1:29:59] Rihanna, whoever the celebrity was who had made is like they
[1:30:03] were very accessible about what they want, what they will do and
[1:30:05] what they will not do. Unfortunately, in this part of
[1:30:07] the world, when you do that, they say you have to know they
[1:30:10] will call you names. We are trying to hold any but if
[1:30:13] you know what you want and what you, you are, you will do and
[1:30:16] what you won't do, it helps you yourself because if you're not
[1:30:19] able to say no, you go and say yes to something, then you'll be
[1:30:22] stuck in a thing and you can't get out of it.
[1:30:23] Right. So I wanted to be able to create
[1:30:26] from a place of like intention and passion, not oh, discover or
[1:30:30] brand new. It's Yami Castle, you know what
[1:30:32] I mean? And then and so I, I told
[1:30:34] myself, you know what, let me just keep a job.
[1:30:36] I'm just going to keep a job and I don't even, I don't see the
[1:30:41] podcast has like a side whatever.
[1:30:45] It's something that I love doing.
[1:30:47] Yeah. And I think that is the problem
[1:30:49] that we have in this country or maybe in the world is that
[1:30:53] people don't have passion projects.
[1:30:57] People don't have things going on for themselves outside of
[1:31:00] their problems. Life will always present
[1:31:03] problems. But at the end of the day, I
[1:31:05] know that this weekend I'm talking to Black Hole.
[1:31:09] I'm so happy. I'm going to talk to Black Hole.
[1:31:12] Then when I'm done, the problem is there again.
[1:31:14] Or the new child Mike, you know something having a good weekend
[1:31:18] then your car will go and breakdown right when you have
[1:31:21] money. So it's it's is.
[1:31:23] When some money hits, No, I, I told people.
[1:31:25] That our cars listen to our. Bank accounts I.
[1:31:27] Will not lie anytime like there's some fresh wave of money
[1:31:30] coming to. You.
[1:31:31] That's just when, yeah, like one time, one time I went to like.
[1:31:35] Put a in my tie and it's almost our tie.
[1:31:38] We are say you so they made me do that and I saw that oh tie
[1:31:41] Nari then they said they are checking one.
[1:31:44] I went to pump 10 CDs. I bought 2 brand new ties that
[1:31:47] day just like that. But anyway, yeah, so, so I feel
[1:31:51] like if people would like lend themselves to passion projects
[1:31:54] and things would have less abrasion because you'll be
[1:31:58] channelling your energy into other things, you know, read a
[1:32:01] book, start a series. Life is to be lived.
[1:32:04] Yeah, life is to be lived. So for me, I look, if you, if
[1:32:10] you even follow like maybe like successful people, they don't do
[1:32:13] just one thing. Do you have maybe like a
[1:32:16] business here? They are doing this yet?
[1:32:17] So I get it. People are like, oh, should I
[1:32:20] quit my job or should I do this? It does.
[1:32:22] It's you are able to do more than one thing.
[1:32:25] You just have to find a good plan.
[1:32:28] And that's why the podcast, when we did it for the time that
[1:32:31] we've done it was bi weekly. I'm not, I'm not crazy to say
[1:32:35] I'm going to be chilling out weekly episodes when I know that
[1:32:38] I have a 9:00 to 5:00 and then I have all of these things going.
[1:32:40] So you have to plan. And it's the same way with of
[1:32:43] the top is like until I have 5 finished edited episodes, I'm
[1:32:46] not going to start releasing so that we could come where we've
[1:32:49] not we don't have a video. Then people say this would this.
[1:32:51] We didn't release because I was very intentional about
[1:32:54] consistency. Yeah.
[1:32:55] So for me, that's it. It's just being able to create
[1:32:59] intentionally. And then, you know, I don't know
[1:33:07] about you, but you know how we are growing up.
[1:33:10] Your parents, if they're able to, they give you a certain
[1:33:13] standard of living. And then all of a sudden you're
[1:33:16] out of the nest and they realize that that standard of living, it
[1:33:19] doesn't come cheap. And so I also have like things
[1:33:23] that I enjoy doing and I need, I need money.
[1:33:27] And the creative economy here is not as developed as elsewhere.
[1:33:30] Just to feed you. You know what I mean?
[1:33:33] I'm sure Dick has a source of income that is not the Peso
[1:33:36] Podcast. He's a very rich man.
[1:33:39] Exactly. So that's just my mindset.
[1:33:41] Around. Keeping a job whilst doing
[1:33:43] creative stuff? Yeah, yeah, I wish.
[1:33:46] I think for me they get the take away here is.
[1:33:48] Everybody should try create something.
[1:33:50] The world is like a Collington, the holiday Stripe brothers.
[1:33:53] He put out a tooth a couple of years ago.
[1:33:55] I still remember. So the world is like a Museum of
[1:33:57] passion project into the traffic lights, the mobile phone, the
[1:34:01] microphone we're using here right now, the face shield, like
[1:34:05] somebody would just sit. In there let me create.
[1:34:07] Something I I enjoy the what could become, you know, I think
[1:34:12] that's the the call we've all been called to just do something
[1:34:15] outside the regular system. That that's why it means to be
[1:34:18] human, you know, to to create things and to experience things
[1:34:22] and let what is inside you come out.
[1:34:25] Yeah. I mean it's all good to have
[1:34:27] like Sief bachelors course for me as I'm sitting here, I'm a
[1:34:30] I'm a businessman. I'm not going to come sitting
[1:34:32] here or I do podcasts or exactly.
[1:34:35] Exactly. And so.
[1:34:37] Yeah. But the encouragement is that.
[1:34:38] Just live. And to live is to create, to do
[1:34:40] something. Just do something anyway.
[1:34:44] Deaf, hey? Wow, what a hard pivot.
[1:34:50] Yeah. Death.
[1:34:51] Do you think about death? I'm asking I'll.
[1:34:53] Ask you, I'll tell you why I'm asking.
[1:34:56] Should I answer? You can answer, yes.
[1:34:58] So when I moved out. Oh my goodness, I have never
[1:35:03] thought the way I have thought when I I started living alone.
[1:35:09] How long are you living alone? Well.
[1:35:11] Technically this is the fourth year, but my.
[1:35:14] Brother moved in with me last year, so it's not really living
[1:35:18] alone, but like I had a good two years where I was just living
[1:35:21] alone and I realized that's when you're not living with your
[1:35:25] mother and you're not calling you every two seconds and all
[1:35:28] those kind of things and you just have peace and quiet, you
[1:35:32] think. And honestly, I don't know
[1:35:35] whether I was like being in my 30s or whatever I was, but I
[1:35:39] would constantly think so. I haven't lost any apart from my
[1:35:44] father's father. Everybody, like my mother's
[1:35:47] father and mother are both alive, 91 and 92, Both of my
[1:35:51] parents are alive. Like, I haven't really lost
[1:35:53] anybody. That's like very outside
[1:35:55] classmates. I haven't lost anybody that's
[1:35:57] like, you know, And so I just realized that I started to think
[1:36:00] a lot about death. I can be in my apartment and
[1:36:04] then I'll think about, let's say my mother dying, writing an
[1:36:08] obituary, the process of planning a funeral, like I'm
[1:36:12] constantly, it used to happen a lot.
[1:36:14] I had to like snap out of it because then it would put me in
[1:36:17] a very sad place. And I think that was also in the
[1:36:20] years when I told I was like surface level difference.
[1:36:22] Exactly what I'm asking. You know, I think if I talk
[1:36:28] about my death, I think about my death or my idea of what I think
[1:36:31] about death. Death, I mean your death.
[1:36:34] I mean the one in the same. OK, when I think about my death,
[1:36:38] Oh no. I.
[1:36:38] I think in the process of so this is how me I, I am, right?
[1:36:43] I talk to myself. I don't know if you do that when
[1:36:47] I'm driving and you see me, it's a lot of people.
[1:36:49] There's this guy that lives in my neighborhood.
[1:36:51] Every time he sees, he's like you.
[1:36:52] Every time you're talking in your car, people think I'm
[1:36:54] talking on the phone, I'm talking to myself and I love it
[1:36:56] because the windows are up and I'm like, everybody was zoomed
[1:36:59] out on the phone. But I have a full on
[1:37:01] conversations with myself. I, I audit like us.
[1:37:06] This thing here when I'm going, I'll think through everything
[1:37:10] that I said, what I shouldn't have said, what you said, What
[1:37:12] does that mean or anything. So I, I, I went through the
[1:37:16] whole process of it and I, I, I think there are a lot of things
[1:37:21] that I want to do I've not done yet.
[1:37:23] But if I were to die today, I feel like I would be at peace,
[1:37:27] peace with it. I remember when I was a kid, my
[1:37:30] mom would always go to funerals and bring the funeral brochures,
[1:37:33] right? And that was my favorite thing
[1:37:34] to do. I would look at it because I
[1:37:37] wanted to see the life that people had lived.
[1:37:39] And it's so stupid. But when I'm looking at the
[1:37:41] pictures and I said the person has traveled outside Ghana, I'd
[1:37:44] be like, he lived a good life, the good life.
[1:37:47] If I don't see any brochure pictures, I'd be like, Oh, this
[1:37:49] man didn't travel. He has died.
[1:37:51] You know, it was a it was a game I used to play with myself when
[1:37:54] I was young. And so in my mind, before I ever
[1:37:57] traveled out of Ghana, I always used to see to myself ego.
[1:38:00] Don't let me die you let me travel before I die you.
[1:38:02] I cannot live this world. And all I saw was I crying down.
[1:38:05] So, you know, and then like when I started traveling, I would say
[1:38:09] things like, Oh no, I've traveled.
[1:38:10] So if I die, cry, it's not bad. Then I'll be like, no, no, no,
[1:38:13] yes. But when I think about it, I
[1:38:15] feel like I've pursued a lot of things.
[1:38:19] You know, last year somebody called me brave.
[1:38:22] I feel like sometimes it takes people telling me before I, I
[1:38:26] internalize some of the things that I've done, said, Oh, you're
[1:38:29] brave. And I thought about like, I
[1:38:31] guess I am because I just when I think about doing something, I
[1:38:34] don't let anything stop me. Like last year I was watching
[1:38:37] Culture FM after Yeah the DJs as I had gone to one of the.
[1:38:42] Houses. I say I go to.
[1:38:44] They do it every month and I said I want to learn how to DJ
[1:38:47] and I called a friend, Welby and he came to my house.
[1:38:50] He downloaded the software. He did one session with me and I
[1:38:53] started, you already see me somewhere DJ and I started to be
[1:38:58] like, how does he do it? I don't have children.
[1:39:04] So I think I have made peace with death in the sense that I,
[1:39:07] I feel like I have lived. I And, you know, you come across
[1:39:11] a lot of the those videos on social media where old people do
[1:39:15] ask you that, Oh, if you had any advice for young people, what it
[1:39:18] is. And they tell you worry less,
[1:39:22] talk to people, make friends. I feel like that is my everyday
[1:39:25] life. I talk to people very easily.
[1:39:28] And I'm genuinely curious about people.
[1:39:30] You know what I mean? Yeah.
[1:39:31] Like when you told me that Edna was a fan, I just kind of like
[1:39:35] when I interacted with her, I was going to see how much
[1:39:38] because I meet people and and she's not doing that.
[1:39:42] So I know she's one of those fans that are like, oh, I'm shy.
[1:39:45] I don't know, you think about me liking the fucker so much.
[1:39:48] So let me not say anything and when I leave should be telling
[1:39:51] you for everything. So if I was going to stay here
[1:39:54] for the rest of the day, I would literally interrogate that,
[1:39:57] right? If I was going to stay for the
[1:39:58] rest because the I've forgotten her name, but she's spoken to
[1:40:01] now that went to we've like, you know, she even asked me a
[1:40:04] question. So it's cool if I was going to
[1:40:05] stay for the rest of the day, I'll talk to Edna.
[1:40:07] I'll talk to him because he's very quiet to try and get on.
[1:40:10] I'm always me. I'm always trying to get into
[1:40:12] people's heads, right? So I don't feel like.
[1:40:16] I don't really, I don't like if I think the scary thing about
[1:40:20] death is like when you are religious, the whole thing of
[1:40:24] afterlife where you're going to go right.
[1:40:26] But I've kind of like gotten over that.
[1:40:29] I, I know I'm not going to church, but I don't think I'm a
[1:40:32] bad person. I think I do my very best with
[1:40:34] what I've got to always give people a pleasant experience
[1:40:38] around me. In the instances where I'm not
[1:40:42] at my very best, I hope people understand that I'm a human
[1:40:45] being. Yeah.
[1:40:46] I hate when, like, let's say somebody experiences you one
[1:40:49] time. Oh, I mean, he was not nice to
[1:40:51] me. Then that's the conclusion that
[1:40:54] you're not a nice person, but you're a human being.
[1:40:56] No, you know what I mean? There can be a day where you
[1:40:59] meet me where I'm having a horrible day, so I will not
[1:41:01] smile. Then you go and stand them and
[1:41:03] say I'm a nice person. Why ask them?
[1:41:05] You know what I mean? But yeah, with death, my, my, my
[1:41:08] biggest fear with death is losing people that I love.
[1:41:13] Like for example, my mom, my dad, because I, I've seen that
[1:41:17] people say that losing maybe your parents or whatever changes
[1:41:20] you changes you. And I'm like.
[1:41:24] What is? That what?
[1:41:25] What if I lose somebody and then I'm like, I'm done with the
[1:41:29] podcast or I become a quiet person where it's like when I
[1:41:33] come here, I'm not even into interacting with you, but I'm
[1:41:35] just quiet because I've lost out.
[1:41:37] That's what I think. That's what the fear I have with
[1:41:38] death is. Not me.
[1:41:40] Like losing somebody and how it will change who I am.
[1:41:45] I think for me. The idea that we are like under
[1:41:49] the shade of a gamer tech mortality is like a real budget
[1:41:54] for me to wake up every day and just want to do things because
[1:41:57] in the grass of things, if I ask you, what's the name of your
[1:41:59] great grandfather, would you know?
[1:42:02] No. Your mother, you don't know?
[1:42:03] No, because. I know my.
[1:42:04] Great grandmother though her name was.
[1:42:06] Mina Kumi Nelson. She was rich.
[1:42:09] No, no, look. Hey.
[1:42:11] Because she had money. Why can I Do I feel like we're
[1:42:14] gonna? Finish this up.
[1:42:15] I'd be like, oh, this boy comes. From money.
[1:42:16] No, no, she was a market woman and she was rich.
[1:42:19] And you know, funny thing about my great grandmother, she had
[1:42:22] different baby daddies. She was there.
[1:42:24] She was the OCA. She had like 7 half.
[1:42:27] Is it 7 or 6 children? You know they were they had
[1:42:31] different daddies like she was a bowler.
[1:42:34] She I met her before she passed. Yeah, but I don't know my Google
[1:42:37] for that. Generally like the to the second
[1:42:40] generation. 3rd generation, I mean if you're if you're like
[1:42:42] build great wealth, they'll mention you in passing breath
[1:42:45] and to passing, but nobody really cares.
[1:42:48] Nobody really cares like intelligent nobody really cares.
[1:42:50] And so it might sound depressing, but to a very large
[1:42:52] extent, make live life on your own terms, like, oh, is that why
[1:42:58] your heart says on my own terms? Yeah, like live life on your own
[1:43:01] terms, but you know, it's not easy.
[1:43:02] To live life on your own terms. Especially when you are living
[1:43:05] in this country where everybody feels like they can tell you how
[1:43:09] you should live. And when you do live life on
[1:43:11] your own terms, you are judged fiercely.
[1:43:13] Look as if you don't like on their own terms.
[1:43:15] Or for some reason we have been socialized thing that if you
[1:43:17] wear clothing that reviews your skin too much, you wear harlots.
[1:43:21] Where is that from? And you know what pains me about
[1:43:24] how we judge other people? We never care for the context in
[1:43:28] the context from where they come from or who they are.
[1:43:31] We had a few other on the podcast and because I really,
[1:43:34] really want other people to understand who she was and I met
[1:43:37] people who are like E, you know, if it wasn't for that episode,
[1:43:41] me, I just thought that she was some girl that follows artists
[1:43:43] around. If you're looking to this
[1:43:45] country because she wants to be an actress, you know what I
[1:43:47] mean? So I guess it's live, live with
[1:43:49] your own team, but it's not easy.
[1:43:50] I just need can use to be interested in investigating
[1:43:54] things. Stop stop taking the opinions of
[1:43:57] your favorite online personality and then that's it.
[1:44:01] Like be curious and learn on your own.
[1:44:04] That's just I wish. What do you do when you're not
[1:44:07] building? When you're do your 95 or
[1:44:08] building? Sincerely acquired a lot of
[1:44:13] things living life. I consume a lot, I think a lot
[1:44:17] of my. Ability to create and also
[1:44:19] create to fit the modern times is what I consume.
[1:44:22] I watch a lot of Youtubers a lot, you know, and I mean
[1:44:30] friendships too. I have, you know, I think I have
[1:44:32] a very interesting group of friends.
[1:44:35] We're all like very interesting in the conversations.
[1:44:38] I like conversations though. I guess even what I mean, when I
[1:44:41] first moved on, what I used to do was I used to host our
[1:44:44] cooking and I'll invite like friends over and we would just
[1:44:47] talk. It's my favorite thing to do,
[1:44:49] our talks and get people's opinion on things.
[1:44:53] I like listening to music, reviewing albums, so you see
[1:44:57] something if you follow me on Twitter.
[1:44:58] Sometimes I do a review of albums that I read, like RJ.
[1:45:01] The first time I met RJ, his formerly just flunked me and I
[1:45:05] didn't know who he was and it made me go and listen to the
[1:45:09] album. No, no, no, no.
[1:45:11] Before the Odyssey. Nemo.
[1:45:13] Finding Nemo. Yeah, And I was like, wow, this
[1:45:15] is weird. I did a review.
[1:45:17] I like going out to dance. So what's it called?
[1:45:21] Communion do you know S village Oh no, you're you're a man of
[1:45:24] God. Yeah Oh, please.
[1:45:28] I don't think you go, but yeah they have like they do house DJ
[1:45:31] sets right house I'm a piano three-step.
[1:45:33] There's GI don't know how to pronounce this, but it's but
[1:45:36] it's or whatever I like going and listening to it and just
[1:45:40] like dancing that one when I go it's not really to interact
[1:45:43] people just getting lost in music.
[1:45:46] What else I like doing yeah TV shows and series.
[1:45:49] I think I get a lot of my personality from characters that
[1:45:53] I've watched over the years. Desperate Housewives, Prison
[1:45:57] Break, Oz, What have I I've seen so many shows.
[1:46:02] Insecure, like, yeah, I there's a if you ask me, there's a lot
[1:46:06] of things. Oh, editing documentaries.
[1:46:08] Do you know what I do? I do.
[1:46:10] I record my friends a lot and then I do, I don't put it out.
[1:46:14] So I'll edit like maybe two months in our life, I'll edit it
[1:46:17] and then I'll send it to them. I don't put it out.
[1:46:19] I love to edit documentaries. And so thanks for loving
[1:46:23] conversations, I think. If anybody, anybody who follows
[1:46:26] this podcast, you realize that I've shared more about myself
[1:46:29] than any episode. Yeah.
[1:46:31] Oh, we have to bring you on the. Unsincerely a crap Dick.
[1:46:37] He said he won't come. Yeah, where was I right now
[1:46:41] from? My hops are plenty.
[1:46:43] I'm. Kidding.
[1:46:44] Absolutely. Is it cold?
[1:46:47] Thanks for what you do Inspiring.
[1:46:49] Thanks for being cool. Thanks for just living life on
[1:46:53] your own term to a certain degree.
[1:46:54] I, I believe, and I really wish you for your podcast.
[1:46:59] Hopefully it's like you you, you, you get the global voice
[1:47:03] and, you know, help to speak on issues on the culture and stuff.
[1:47:06] And so all the best. Thank you for coming.
[1:47:09] Thanks for sending the DM even though you don't.
[1:47:11] Have to respond. How do you sign?
[1:47:15] Out you. Don't do anything you don't join
[1:47:19] the. Conversation.
[1:47:20] Oh yes, yes, I do. Like, I feel like, you know.
[1:47:23] People don't ask me questions the way you have asked me
[1:47:26] questions. Very interrogating last words I
[1:47:30] call it Director calling me nosy.
[1:47:33] I think a nosy person is the best kind.
[1:47:35] Of person to host a show, you know what I mean?
[1:47:38] Because if you are not nosy, that's when you you say things
[1:47:40] like our star. What do you have forgotten like
[1:47:48] in fact this is my last word. Yes you listen.
[1:47:52] Hey, can we do better and retire some of these generic things?
[1:47:57] How many comes before your country?
[1:47:58] Is he? What do you have for Ghanaians?
[1:48:00] Girl, do better. What do you have for Ghanaians?
[1:48:06] The names was wrong Ayasta anyway.
[1:48:09] Anyway, no, I had a really quick chat and like I was saying,
[1:48:15] everybody should do their very best to be curious enough about
[1:48:18] something to try. And I think failure gets a bad
[1:48:25] Rep. You don't want to feel you.
[1:48:27] Failure is so important. It gives you a lot of character,
[1:48:30] like who are you when you feel? And then when you feel what you
[1:48:33] learn out of it. And you know that song at first
[1:48:37] you don't succeed. Pick yourself up and try again.
[1:48:40] Yeah, you know it. Yes, the way people listen to
[1:48:43] lyrics you. But you don't listen to music
[1:48:46] and pick like brick and List told you love this weekend.
[1:48:48] And y'all are just winding always.
[1:48:50] And there's a #5 If I don't stop, I'll just.
[1:48:56] Yeah. Thank you very much.
[1:48:57] Thank you very much. Yeah.
[1:48:58] So community that was. Joseph NT and it was been a
[1:49:02] great conversation and my trust not changed, just build
[1:49:05] something.

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