# Trade, Tariffs, and a New Normal: Kelly Ann Shaw

An episode of [NatSec Matters](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1711240452), 3 Sep 2025, 39 min.

Audio: https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/6ef5eecd-b84d-413c-9ce6-9db304c42390/Episode_100_-_Kelly_Ann_Shaw_mixdown-final.mp3?dest-id=4161986

Michael is joined by Kelly Ann Shaw, a partner at Aiken Gump and former Deputy Assistant to the President for International Economic Affairs. They explore the critical state of U.S. trade policy through a national security lens, including with an eye on China. Following decades-long trade negotiations, Kelly Ann says U.S. trade policy has entered a "new normal" where it is now driven by domestic political needs and the economic concerns of American voters. Kelly Ann also discusses the evolving role of import protections and presidential trade authority.

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