# GIL'S ARENA Debates Zion Williamson's PAIN, Jokic & the Nuggets' Chances & D-LO Going OVERSEAS Part 1

An episode of [Gil's Arena](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1689097415), 1 Oct 2026, 1 h 40 min.

Audio: https://podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/pscrb.fm/rss/p/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/895dfae1-64b0-4981-adea-b4b300f0d0f6/87b63ee6-1e9e-41e6-8491-b4d6016ef2d4/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=d110bf8d-fc65-45fb-856f-b4b300f0d117

Gilbert Arenas, DeMarcus Cousins, Nick Young and Josiah Johnson bring you the best NBA show on the planet! This episode the couch discusses Zion disappointed how his career is going, Skip Bayless and Shannon Sharpe Reunited and KAT Beef + more! Presented by Polymarket - the world's largest prediction market. Use code ARENA when you sign up for a $50 bonus with a qualifying deposit of $10. https://app.polymarket.us/S8ac/ARENA 18+ Only. Restrictions and eligibility requirements apply. Not available in all jurisdictions. Trading is risky. 100% loss can occur. See http://polymarket.com/tos for more information. The Polymarket US App serves as an independent software provider and affiliate of Polymarket US and Polymarket Clearing, the CFTC-regulated exchange and clearing organization. Follow Gil's Arena on socials: Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/gilsarena0/ Facebook https://www.facebook.com/GilsArena0 Threads - https://www.threads.com/@gilsarena0 Twitter/X - https://x.com/GilsArenaShow Twitch - https://www.twitch.tv/gilsarenashow TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@gilsarena TimeStamps: 0:00-Cast Intro 6:08- Zion on his NBA Career 50:12-Skip Bayless and Shannon Sharpe Reunited 1:03:30-KAT Beef (Timestamps may vary based on ads) See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:00] Speaker 1: Welcome back to Gil's Arena presented by Poly Market and
[0:02] Speaker 1: powered by PlayMaker. Good job. We got energy today. It's Thursday.
[0:10] Speaker 1: Week almost over. Gil got us doing these five days
[0:13] Speaker 1: a week.
[0:14] Speaker 2: Turn a big rock into a little rock.
[0:18] Speaker 1: It's going to work. We're making up for last year.
[0:20] Speaker 1: Two days a week. I enjoyed that. That was crazy.
[0:25] Speaker 1: Got to sleep in multiple days a week.
[0:28] Speaker 3: That's like the New York Knicks coming for this season.
[0:31] Speaker 3: Coach only played them half the time.
[0:34] Speaker 1: We're going to play these new niggas more. I'm merely
[0:37] Speaker 1: your host, Josiah Johnson. I'm here with NBA legend, 2K Unk,
[0:40] Speaker 1: with badges, Gilbert Arenas. Gil, you're doing the double bangers.
[0:48] Speaker 1: You got Gil's Arena presented by Polymarket Power by Playmaker.
[0:52] Speaker 1: You got We Said What We Said in the evening.
[0:55] Speaker 1: I see you all the time. Everywhere you want to be.
[0:58] Speaker 1: Join us on the couch. We got NBA champion of
[1:00] Speaker 1: the world, Swaggy P, Nick Young, back here with us. MJ. Styler.
[1:08] Speaker 1: And back with us, we got four-time All-Star, two-time All-NBA selection,
[1:11] Speaker 1: DeMarcus Cousins in the building.
[1:16] Speaker 2: Thanks.
[1:17] Speaker 1: Hey, wait, wait. Was you all NBA? Yeah, three times.
[1:20] Speaker 2: Three times?
[1:21] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[1:22] Speaker 2: You got to put some respect on my dog's intro there.
[1:24] Speaker 1: Now he's the youngest in NBA history to do it.
[1:27] Speaker 1: I didn't need all that. I didn't need all that.
[1:29] Speaker 1: I'm just saying.
[1:29] Speaker 2: I'm just saying. Put some respect on my dog's intro.
[1:33] Speaker 1: 2K Uncle with badges. You know what I mean? Nah, nah, nah.
[1:36] Speaker 2: I like the 3.
[1:37] Speaker 1: Nah, nah, nah. Not because you want to throw the
[1:39] Speaker 1: ring around like that shit. Nah, nah. They don't respect
[1:42] Speaker 1: your shit. Yeah, yeah. They better start respecting my dog. Nah, nah, nah.
[1:45] Speaker 1: Y'all don't respect nothing but rings. And the ring around
[1:50] Speaker 1: their eyes. 2K Uncle with badges. With badges, baby. Boogie,
[1:54] Speaker 1: I seen you had a little bit of beef with
[1:55] Speaker 1: the Sacramento media. Oh. I'm heavy on Twitter. Hey, Angle,
[1:59] Speaker 1: I'm going to just let you know. We get ourselves
[2:02] Speaker 1: some shit. I see you. Damn, man. We stay in
[2:04] Speaker 1: some shit. We start in the morning like this. All right,
[2:07] Speaker 1: what we got? Oh, no, I'm not. I'm just. No,
[2:09] Speaker 1: that ain't no beef, man. That's just a little straightening.
[2:12] Speaker 1: It just seems like it's been lingering. Been lingering.
[2:15] Speaker 4: I mean, it's lingering on that end, but I'm going to.
[2:18] Speaker 4: Keep it what it is every time you speak on this.
[2:20] Speaker 1: We appreciate you.
[2:21] Speaker 2: It's all good.
[2:22] Speaker 1: It's all good on my end. Hope everybody is well.
[2:24] Speaker 1: I'm just saying right now, they at a disadvantage. Man.
[2:28] Speaker 3: We five days a week. You know, we can bless
[2:31] Speaker 3: you five.
[2:32] Speaker 1: Days a week. Five days. That's true. Monday through Friday,
[2:35] Speaker 1: ladies and gentlemen. Shit different now. Angels shut up and dribble.
[2:38] Speaker 1: I got something to say. And I'm going to say it.
[2:41] Speaker 1: And I'm going to say it. We got a lot
[2:42] Speaker 1: of things to discuss. Here's what's cracking in the arena today.
[2:46] Speaker 1: Zion Williamson. says he's not where he wants to be
[2:50] Speaker 1: in his NBA career, but is there still hope for
[2:52] Speaker 1: the former number one pick to reach his potential? The
[2:56] Speaker 1: Nuggets haven't advanced past the second round since winning the
[2:59] Speaker 1: chip in 2023. Is Denver doing enough to keep a
[3:02] Speaker 1: contending level team around their three-time MVP? And Joker also
[3:05] Speaker 1: has some things to say about him wanting NBA players
[3:08] Speaker 1: to go to play in Europe for six months to
[3:10] Speaker 1: see what it's really like. We will discuss. And D-Lo,
[3:13] Speaker 1: also known as Little D-Lo here in the arena, getting
[3:15] Speaker 1: ready to learn how to speak Chinese, buddy, after taking
[3:18] Speaker 1: his talents to the Shanghai Sharks. Is this the end
[3:21] Speaker 1: of the former number two overall picks NBA career swagger?
[3:24] Speaker 1: Give him some smoke, y'all. Give him some smoke.
[3:26] Speaker 2: No smoke?
[3:27] Speaker 1: Shanghai Sharks?
[3:28] Speaker 3: I'm happy for him, man. I'm happy for him, y'all.
[3:31] Speaker 3: Stay playing that ball.
[3:32] Speaker 1: Yeah, D-Lo. Go get that check, D-Lo. He was leaning.
[3:37] Speaker 1: He about to live it up in time. Ni hao.
[3:40] Speaker 1: You played for the Sharks, right? Yeah. Mosey fans, back
[3:45] Speaker 1: for our Super Chat. Throw some in the offering plate
[3:47] Speaker 1: and drop your questions, and we'll pick some to answer.
[3:51] Speaker 1: At the end of the show, we appreciate y'all supporting us,
[3:54] Speaker 1: all the love that you've been giving us with these
[3:56] Speaker 1: Mostly Fans questions. But, hey, I need to tell y'all
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[4:59] Speaker 1: at Polymarket, keeping us blessed and stressed five days a week.
[5:04] Speaker 1: We're not stressed. I'm stressed every night. We were stressed
[5:06] Speaker 1: last year. Every night. Got to bring a good show
[5:09] Speaker 1: for the people. We were stressed last year. Got to
[5:12] Speaker 1: keep Playmaker happy. This is a breeze. It was stressful.
[5:15] Speaker 1: It was stressful last season. Gills Arena, everywhere you want
[5:18] Speaker 1: to be. Shout out to everybody watching the show on Twitch.
[5:22] Speaker 1: If you have not done so already, subscribe to our
[5:24] Speaker 1: Twitch channel at Gills Arena Show. And we appreciate you
[5:26] Speaker 1: in advance for the subs. So we're going to get
[5:29] Speaker 1: into it. Zion Williamson. Birthday. Tell your mama happy birthday, man. Yeah,
[5:36] Speaker 1: happy birthday, moms. Yeah, pops. Yeah, they both. I didn't
[5:39] Speaker 1: say your pops. Is both their birthday?
[5:42] Speaker 2: Well, it's like a week apart.
[5:43] Speaker 1: No, it wasn't. Charles, I'm not. I wasn't thinking Charles, man.
[5:50] Speaker 1: Charles in charge. I've been trying to replace him for
[5:52] Speaker 1: a long time now. You know? It's going to be
[5:56] Speaker 1: one of those days that a show goes through.
[5:57] Speaker 2: Yeah, you feeling good today. Huh?
[5:59] Speaker 1: No, I'm just saying. Feeling good?
[6:03] Speaker 2: You know?
[6:03] Speaker 1: I see you pops out there jogging. You know? I'm
[6:07] Speaker 1: lurking still. Speaking of jogging, Zion Williamson came into the
[6:10] Speaker 1: NBA in 2019 as the number one overall pick with
[6:14] Speaker 1: the most hype since LeBron James. The dunks, the highlights,
[6:17] Speaker 1: the swag. We thought we were witnessing the next face
[6:20] Speaker 1: of the league, but now he's entering year eight with
[6:22] Speaker 1: just two all-star appearances Still hasn't played a single playoff
[6:26] Speaker 1: game as his career has been marred by injuries. Through
[6:29] Speaker 1: seven seasons, Zion has missed more regular season games than
[6:31] Speaker 1: he's played, missing 276 games while playing only 276. 278
[6:35] Speaker 1: missed games, 276 games played. So for the past few seasons,
[6:40] Speaker 1: it's been the same story. Zion talks about how this
[6:43] Speaker 1: season will be different for him and his team, and
[6:45] Speaker 1: by and large, it ends up being the same thing.
[6:47] Speaker 1: We keep waiting for him to fulfill the prophecy, and
[6:49] Speaker 1: it doesn't happen. Well, during Pelicans Media Day Monday, Zion
[6:53] Speaker 1: was very candid about how he views himself and his career. Zion,
[6:57] Speaker 1: where do you feel like you're at in your NBA career?
[7:03] Speaker 1: I'm not where I want to be.
[7:08] Speaker 5: Where do you want to be? I'm just not where
[7:14] Speaker 5: I need to be. I'm not where I need to be,
[7:16] Speaker 5: not where I want to be.
[7:18] Speaker 6: Well, Joe was talking about and commending your work ethic
[7:21] Speaker 6: this offseason, so it seems like a good start to
[7:24] Speaker 6: get to where you want to be. Did you change
[7:27] Speaker 6: anything about your offseason regimen at all, and what were
[7:31] Speaker 6: you kind of really working on this offseason?
[7:36] Speaker 5: For me, it was just trusting Chris with his process.
[7:40] Speaker 5: You know, my body, working with Teaspoon a little bit,
[7:43] Speaker 5: working with Sham a little bit, working with Coach a
[7:46] Speaker 5: little bit, Just working with different people, looking at the
[7:49] Speaker 5: game different ways, just trying to find different ways just
[7:53] Speaker 5: to get better.
[7:54] Speaker 1: How does it make you feel when you hear that
[7:55] Speaker 1: you've been in the league eight years? If you look
[7:57] Speaker 1: back to 19-year-old Zion, what would you say to him?
[8:01] Speaker 5: The fact that it's year eight, time has flown.
[8:10] Speaker 1: As I was getting dressed, I was like, wow, this
[8:13] Speaker 1: is year eight for me.
[8:15] Speaker 5: Uh and you know looking back on it what would
[8:16] Speaker 5: i tell my younger self 19 year old self uh
[8:21] Speaker 5: i wouldn't tell him anything you know i feel like
[8:23] Speaker 5: we go through the experiences we go through uh because
[8:26] Speaker 5: that's just what was supposed to happen and you know
[8:28] Speaker 5: it helps make us into who we are you know
[8:30] Speaker 5: help shape our mindset and you know the decisions we
[8:32] Speaker 5: make in the future so i wouldn't i wouldn't tell
[8:35] Speaker 5: him anything i would just let him go through the process.
[8:39] Speaker 1: So zion and the pels agreed to a five-year 193
[8:42] Speaker 1: million dollar max extension in the summer of 2022 Got
[8:45] Speaker 1: two years left on that deal. That deal had incentives
[8:48] Speaker 1: potentially increasing its value, but it also included a weight
[8:51] Speaker 1: clause giving the Pells an out to end the relationship
[8:53] Speaker 1: if necessary. But Zion appeared in 60 games last season,
[8:56] Speaker 1: the second most of his career. Entered training camp weighing
[8:59] Speaker 1: 271 pounds, 13 pounds lighter than his previously listed weight
[9:03] Speaker 1: of 284 pounds. So an article from the Athletics' Will
[9:06] Speaker 1: Gilroy Wednesday detailed why this season might be different, crediting
[9:11] Speaker 1: Zion's trainer Chris Crisp with helping to get him right.
[9:14] Speaker 1: Zion also mentioned him in his media day. So Zion
[9:17] Speaker 1: brought Chris Bond on the beginning of last season, right
[9:19] Speaker 1: before suffering a grade one hamstring strain, which forced him
[9:22] Speaker 1: to miss a few weeks. And then Zion had an
[9:24] Speaker 1: adductor injury that was, he was able to come back
[9:27] Speaker 1: from sooner than expected. He was supposed to miss two
[9:29] Speaker 1: months with that guilt. Came back in two weeks, thanks
[9:31] Speaker 1: to the help of his new trainer. And he proceeded
[9:35] Speaker 1: to play 35 straight games after that. The longest streak
[9:38] Speaker 1: of his career. Had a stretch where he played 52
[9:40] Speaker 1: or 53 games, also during that time frame. So for
[9:43] Speaker 1: the season, he averaged 21 points and six boards, which
[9:46] Speaker 1: are both career lows, but shot 60% from the field.
[9:50] Speaker 1: With a new training regimen and outlook on his basketball
[9:52] Speaker 1: career and health, Zion's still only 26 years old. He's
[9:56] Speaker 1: still holding out hope of reaching the level that once
[9:58] Speaker 1: seemed all but guaranteed. So Swaggy, we will start with
[10:01] Speaker 1: you because it's been a minute since we've seen you.
[10:04] Speaker 1: What are your thoughts on Zion saying he's not where
[10:07] Speaker 1: he wants to be in his NBA career?
[10:09] Speaker 2: Man, I feel him. If he eight years, it's crazy
[10:14] Speaker 2: how fast that goes. He got about Four years left
[10:19] Speaker 2: before it's just completely bust.
[10:22] Speaker 1: Two years left on this show.
[10:23] Speaker 2: Zion is a bust.
[10:25] Speaker 1: Why four?
[10:27] Speaker 2: I say 30, because after 30, you're Zion now. Maybe
[10:34] Speaker 2: he could get over this hump. If he attacked the
[10:37] Speaker 2: game like he attacked these hoes I've been hearing about,
[10:40] Speaker 2: he would be motherfucking an all-star.
[10:43] Speaker 1: But shit.
[10:46] Speaker 2: But it's good to see him looking in shape. Freaky Z.
[10:53] Speaker 1: Yeah, Freaky Z, boy.
[10:55] Speaker 2: He's a quiet assassin. He need to just be who
[10:57] Speaker 2: he is off the court, on the court, man. And
[11:01] Speaker 2: I think it's time to get traded, too. It's time
[11:03] Speaker 2: for them to do what they did with John Memphis.
[11:05] Speaker 2: Just trade him. Probably need a new scenery. He needs
[11:09] Speaker 2: some vets around him, I feel like. And it'll work
[11:14] Speaker 2: out for him. Hopefully this year it'll work out because
[11:16] Speaker 2: he's He's one of them guys that I feel like
[11:20] Speaker 2: got the name, the game, but it just ain't. It's
[11:24] Speaker 2: like that curl. Like, he ain't got a full jerry curl.
[11:27] Speaker 2: It's like it ain't all the way there yet.
[11:29] Speaker 1: Not fully activated. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Got a haircut without
[11:34] Speaker 1: the line.
[11:34] Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like.
[11:36] Speaker 1: He had the line up. He had the little part.
[11:38] Speaker 1: I'm just saying. I'm just saying. At media day. So Zion,
[11:41] Speaker 1: through seven seasons, like we said, has missed more than half.
[11:45] Speaker 1: Other regular season games in his career, also missed a
[11:46] Speaker 1: full season, obviously dealing with injury. So he's really only
[11:50] Speaker 1: played like three and a half seasons worth of basketball
[11:52] Speaker 1: at 26 years old. But, Boogie, when you look at Zion,
[11:54] Speaker 1: saying he's not where he wants to be, not where
[11:56] Speaker 1: he needs to be in his NBA career, what's your
[11:58] Speaker 1: reaction to that? I ain't mad at it.
[12:02] Speaker 4: I guess you could say it's a form of accountability,
[12:05] Speaker 4: looking yourself in the mirror. One more for himself. But
[12:11] Speaker 4: I do believe it's time for it. you know, like
[12:13] Speaker 4: a change of scenery. I think that'll actually benefit him
[12:16] Speaker 4: really greatly. It's hard to sit here and just, you know,
[12:22] Speaker 4: put the blame all on the things that he can
[12:26] Speaker 4: like control naturally, like which is his game, his effort
[12:29] Speaker 4: and things like that. But dealing with injuries, those types
[12:33] Speaker 4: of things happen is usually out of your control. I
[12:35] Speaker 4: don't think nobody's walking into the season. Like I hope
[12:37] Speaker 4: I get hurt or, you know what I mean? I
[12:39] Speaker 4: really would love another hamstring strain.
[12:41] Speaker 1: Exactly.
[12:42] Speaker 4: So, uh, I feel like some things are just unfortunate
[12:46] Speaker 4: and out of your control throughout your career. The narrative
[12:51] Speaker 4: around his name is he's an eight-year player that hasn't
[12:56] Speaker 4: made the playoffs, but it's more context to that. That's
[13:00] Speaker 4: the easy way of bashing this athlete. Even though some
[13:04] Speaker 4: of it is true, there's still a lot of context
[13:06] Speaker 4: that comes with it. Injuries play a huge part in
[13:09] Speaker 4: this game. He's not the first player we've seen going
[13:12] Speaker 4: through this. Some guys find that success early and can
[13:15] Speaker 4: never capitalize off of it because they end up finding injuries.
[13:18] Speaker 4: So you can start off great and bad. You can
[13:21] Speaker 4: start off bad and great. The good part about this,
[13:25] Speaker 4: he's still got time to write his story. He still
[13:27] Speaker 4: has plenty of basketball to play. The part where he
[13:32] Speaker 4: talked about what would he tell his 19-year-old self in
[13:36] Speaker 4: year eight, I don't believe that. I think he would
[13:39] Speaker 4: have a lot more to say than, you know, nothing,
[13:42] Speaker 4: go through the process.
[13:43] Speaker 1: Lay off the work. Yeah. Control, you know, controlling your body.
[13:49] Speaker 4: I mean, working on your body, working on your craft earlier,
[13:51] Speaker 4: I think it's a lot of things that could have
[13:53] Speaker 4: helped prevent it. Shit, I can even say that for myself,
[13:55] Speaker 4: you know what I mean? Once you start going through
[13:57] Speaker 4: those injuries, you think back on some of the, you know,
[14:00] Speaker 4: things that could have prevented it. And not necessarily saying
[14:03] Speaker 4: that it's a thing that you could have controlled, but
[14:07] Speaker 4: it's things that it's prevention put in place for those
[14:10] Speaker 4: reasons you know what i mean maybe i should have
[14:11] Speaker 4: put those extra reps in or i should have lifted
[14:14] Speaker 4: after the game that day so it can be simple
[14:16] Speaker 4: things like that but uh you know i still believe
[14:19] Speaker 4: in the kid's talent he's i mean his talent speaks
[14:23] Speaker 4: for itself dude been shooting damn near 60 percent since
[14:26] Speaker 4: he walked in 20 and 10 um I do feel
[14:31] Speaker 4: like he's finally got over that hurdle as far as
[14:33] Speaker 4: getting his body in order. You look at him coming
[14:35] Speaker 4: into the season, he's 13 pounds down. 274, 65, 66
[14:38] Speaker 4: frame is still crazy. Everybody's bodies are different. I played
[14:48] Speaker 4: at 280. I'm 6'11.
[14:51] Speaker 1: When I think about it, and they were telling me
[14:53] Speaker 1: I was too big. You know what I'm saying?
[14:56] Speaker 4: When I think about it like that, yeah, you look
[14:58] Speaker 4: better than you did But that don't mean that's still
[15:00] Speaker 4: your best form. So I think he can still continue
[15:02] Speaker 4: to work on his body. The other thing, has his
[15:06] Speaker 4: game really grown since he's came into the league? We
[15:09] Speaker 4: all knew he was this freak athlete. You know what
[15:11] Speaker 4: I mean? But has his game really grown? Has he
[15:13] Speaker 4: become a better shooter? Has he become a better playmaker,
[15:16] Speaker 4: a better defender? All of those things are still to
[15:19] Speaker 4: be determined. So I still think he got a lot
[15:23] Speaker 4: of life left. It's just on him at this point.
[15:26] Speaker 1: We talk about the injuries, some of those things beyond
[15:28] Speaker 1: his control, but I think Zion has been more accountable
[15:30] Speaker 1: as the years have gone on, dealing with the weight issues,
[15:32] Speaker 1: living in New Orleans, the culinary offerings that that city provides. Gil,
[15:36] Speaker 1: he ran up on us, Summer League, I believe, 2023,
[15:39] Speaker 1: when we had first started this show. Ran up? We
[15:42] Speaker 1: were at the win in Vegas. He put the claws
[15:46] Speaker 1: on Gil. He kind of crashed the set. He was
[15:49] Speaker 1: walking by, saw us, looked like he had something he
[15:51] Speaker 1: wanted to say to Gil, much like a lot of
[15:52] Speaker 1: people out there. Hey, big fella. We're talking about Bron
[15:59] Speaker 1: having the blueprint, him wanting to follow that blueprint, the
[16:01] Speaker 1: difficulties of being young with a bunch of money in
[16:04] Speaker 1: the league and trying to deal with the weight issue
[16:07] Speaker 1: and all those various things. New Orleans don't help either,
[16:11] Speaker 1: if we're being honest.
[16:12] Speaker 4: I love New Orleans. I love it for that exact reason.
[16:14] Speaker 4: I'm going to go down there and I'm going to
[16:16] Speaker 4: eat good.
[16:17] Speaker 1: It don't help. I remember 2019 when I said.
[16:26] Speaker 3: You're praising a kid in college at 19 for being
[16:31] Speaker 3: too 80.
[16:31] Speaker 1: When have being heavy was a positive.
[16:37] Speaker 3: You remember they were pushing, oh, he's heavier than the second,
[16:40] Speaker 3: you know, I guess there was one center that was
[16:43] Speaker 3: heavier than him. And I said, this is not a
[16:45] Speaker 3: good thing. I said, he's 19 right now. This is
[16:48] Speaker 3: the most running he's ever going to do in college.
[16:50] Speaker 3: When he gets to the NBA and he has to
[16:52] Speaker 3: sit around, club, be 19, be 20, be 21, I said,
[16:58] Speaker 3: he can fuck around and be 310 by his second year.
[17:02] Speaker 1: At least he's been down.
[17:03] Speaker 3: But I said, he's going to be injury prone due
[17:05] Speaker 3: to I don't think anybody.
[17:07] Speaker 1: Was ready.
[17:10] Speaker 3: For the explosion that he was bringing to the game, right?
[17:16] Speaker 3: No one's ever seen it. So the trainers wasn't going
[17:20] Speaker 3: to be able to understand how to train him. You're
[17:22] Speaker 3: going to train him like a basketball player, but his
[17:24] Speaker 3: body doesn't move like a basketball player. He should be
[17:27] Speaker 3: training in the summer with Miles Garrett.
[17:33] Speaker 1: Or on a track learning how to.
[17:35] Speaker 3: Explode Because that means he got to, you know, like
[17:39] Speaker 3: work on the little hip flexors, work on these little
[17:42] Speaker 3: muscles that NBA players don't work on. Because when you're
[17:46] Speaker 3: talking about taking off, right, you know, it's like Derrick Rose.
[17:53] Speaker 1: You're like Hancock.
[17:55] Speaker 3: You got so much torque coming out if your body
[17:58] Speaker 3: is not ready for the movement. if you're a little heavier,
[18:02] Speaker 3: if you're not in tune, if your muscles is not
[18:05] Speaker 3: ready for that kind of explosion and dropping, you're gonna
[18:08] Speaker 3: stay injured. So it was like, I seen it then,
[18:13] Speaker 3: like I'm seeing some of the explosion, and I'm like, man, college,
[18:17] Speaker 3: you lift fucking.
[18:17] Speaker 1: Five days a week. NBA, you by yourself.
[18:21] Speaker 3: So if you don't have a great team with you
[18:23] Speaker 3: that's micromanaging the little things, you're going to lose control
[18:29] Speaker 3: of this body. And meaning like, you're not going to
[18:31] Speaker 3: be able to, it's too much torque for him.
[18:34] Speaker 1: Right? So that's all this has been. It ain't the lifestyle.
[18:37] Speaker 3: Well, I mean, the beginning is a lifestyle because being
[18:43] Speaker 3: 19 in a city with all the money, being Zion,
[18:47] Speaker 3: everybody you with, just getting in the club.
[18:50] Speaker 1: Right?
[18:50] Speaker 3: So you're going to, you're going to lose a lot of,
[18:54] Speaker 3: energy just being 19 in the NBA yeah right so
[18:57] Speaker 3: if you don't have the right guidance around you you
[19:00] Speaker 3: know you were going to be you know some of
[19:02] Speaker 3: those fatigue nights and you coming in and you're trying
[19:04] Speaker 3: to play right um I I seen I seen that
[19:08] Speaker 3: coming and I said man listen they should train you
[19:13] Speaker 3: as a shooting guard meaning you should come into the
[19:17] Speaker 3: season every year trying to get to 235.
[19:21] Speaker 1: 240 at the max. I'm thinking 250.
[19:24] Speaker 3: But even if he's at 250, he's a shooting guard
[19:26] Speaker 3: in the NBA. I said, you're coming downhill. Are you
[19:29] Speaker 3: coming downhill? You got to be on the street. I mean,
[19:31] Speaker 3: you might have a big fucking head, but.
[19:32] Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm about to say that.
[19:34] Speaker 2: You got to shoot up for that.
[19:36] Speaker 1: But, like, coming down, being.
[19:37] Speaker 3: I said, you're like a god as a shooting guard.
[19:40] Speaker 3: If you was a shooting guard, you coming downhill.
[19:43] Speaker 1: there's.
[19:43] Speaker 3: Nobody stopping you. You're just fucking D-weight 10.0.
[19:47] Speaker 1: Yeah. Right? So it was one of those thoughts.
[19:49] Speaker 3: Like, I said, his biggest challenge in the NBA career
[19:55] Speaker 3: was just maintaining his weight.
[19:57] Speaker 1: That's his only challenge. That's it.
[19:58] Speaker 3: Talk to Al Harrington. Talk to Carmelo. Talk to, you know, shit, Dwight, LeBron.
[20:05] Speaker 3: Talk to those guys.
[20:06] Speaker 4: I talked to them.
[20:07] Speaker 1: Who had to worry about their eating. I say Udonis Haslam.
[20:11] Speaker 1: We're talking about guys like Kevin Love, guys that have
[20:13] Speaker 1: been able to completely transform their bodies.
[20:15] Speaker 3: That's just a food point, but you're talking about guys
[20:17] Speaker 3: who kind of, like, moved with fast-touch muscles. Like, there's
[20:21] Speaker 3: nothing like him in the NBA. And, you know, like
[20:23] Speaker 3: his background is football. His father was a football player.
[20:26] Speaker 3: So they had to be thinking like that, like basketball
[20:29] Speaker 3: in a season. We gained weight. I gained weight. Too
[20:32] Speaker 3: much motherfucking Gatorade.
[20:34] Speaker 1: Right. Too much Gatorade on it. But like, if you
[20:36] Speaker 1: look at our muscles, you eat late after every game,
[20:38] Speaker 1: every game, 10, 11.
[20:39] Speaker 3: O'clock on the plane, get to the hotel two in
[20:42] Speaker 3: the morning, we ordering food.
[20:44] Speaker 1: So it was all spiking and shit. Diabetes kicking in.
[20:49] Speaker 1: But as a bus, no. He's, no, there's, there's a bus,
[20:55] Speaker 1: a bus is. A bus for what? You trash. A
[21:00] Speaker 1: bus is you trash. A bus for like you.
[21:02] Speaker 2: What we thought you was going to be. That's what
[21:03] Speaker 2: we're saying.
[21:04] Speaker 1: Not like. But it's like you went out there. He
[21:07] Speaker 1: hasn't showed that he can't play. I'm not saying a
[21:10] Speaker 1: bus like that. No, I'm saying you went out.
[21:12] Speaker 2: There and played.
[21:13] Speaker 1: He underachieved. He's underachieving.
[21:16] Speaker 2: That's what I'm saying.
[21:17] Speaker 3: But you went out there and played, right? Like a
[21:19] Speaker 3: bus says you went out there and played. You got
[21:21] Speaker 3: the minutes. You just didn't perform.
[21:24] Speaker 2: I know that part.
[21:24] Speaker 3: He's averaging 20-something and 10 for his career.
[21:28] Speaker 1: But I'm saying, when do it get.
[21:30] Speaker 2: To that point where you know he can't do that?
[21:33] Speaker 1: He's not a bust. He's just underachieved. That's what I'm saying.
[21:36] Speaker 1: Let's do different things, though. I know what a bust is.
[21:39] Speaker 3: Even if he was healthy, 21 and 6... If he
[21:47] Speaker 3: was healthy, he's.
[21:48] Speaker 1: Making every All-Star game still.
[21:50] Speaker 2: When did you give up on the hype, though?
[21:52] Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. They've done
[21:55] Speaker 1: that already. Is the hype gone, though, Swaggy? I mean, Gil,
[21:59] Speaker 1: you said previously a bust means, bitch, you should have tried, right? Yeah.
[22:02] Speaker 1: It seems like he's trying. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[22:05] Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying. I don't think it's from a
[22:06] Speaker 1: lack of work, but.
[22:07] Speaker 3: If you look at his comments and you can see
[22:10] Speaker 3: it in his eyes.
[22:15] Speaker 1: Some people just love, like the love of the.
[22:18] Speaker 3: Game has always been in this. And I think that's
[22:22] Speaker 3: why he's hurt and he.
[22:24] Speaker 1: Can't answer because he loves the game.
[22:27] Speaker 3: His body is just, he just hasn't been disciplined enough
[22:31] Speaker 3: to really understand that.
[22:34] Speaker 1: What his body needs for him to just get out
[22:36] Speaker 1: there and play. He wants to play.
[22:38] Speaker 3: Like, I mean, losing this kind of weight every year,
[22:41] Speaker 3: you're like, yeah.
[22:42] Speaker 1: That's what I'm talking about, right? We've been happy.
[22:46] Speaker 3: With every time he's came into training camp, right? Like,
[22:49] Speaker 3: he has not disappointed anybody coming into training camp. So
[22:52] Speaker 3: that means he's really working in the summer. He just
[22:54] Speaker 3: got to figure out how to work, you know, during
[22:56] Speaker 3: the season, too. The season is going to be your problem.
[23:01] Speaker 1: Summer, you got that. That's easy. The sun's out, motherfucker,
[23:03] Speaker 1: you running. You can jog, you can lose more weight.
[23:06] Speaker 3: The season, when you're on them flights, you're sitting around more, right?
[23:09] Speaker 3: There's no three times a day. There's none of that shit.
[23:13] Speaker 3: But you couple that with the fact... If I was T-Wills,
[23:14] Speaker 3: I would have tried to train Julius Randle and somebody.
[23:17] Speaker 1: But I'm just like... He's training my boy C's, Emilio C's.
[23:21] Speaker 1: I'm just like New Orleans. Yeah. But is it hard?
[23:25] Speaker 1: I got a lot of clauses in there. How much
[23:28] Speaker 1: blame is on him and how much is on New Orleans?
[23:33] Speaker 1: I will blame... I can't blame a 19-year-old for.
[23:36] Speaker 3: Not knowing how to be a professional.
[23:39] Speaker 4: Even when it comes to him learning how to take
[23:41] Speaker 4: care of his body, that's a process.
[23:43] Speaker 1: You learn how to do that.
[23:45] Speaker 3: I can't blame the organization the first two, three years.
[23:51] Speaker 1: Because... You've never had that before, right?
[23:56] Speaker 3: There's not a lot of teams that can say they
[23:59] Speaker 3: had a freakish athlete.
[24:01] Speaker 1: That just jumped out the charts.
[24:03] Speaker 3: So we know, and my little trainer knows how to
[24:07] Speaker 3: train his body and get it ready for the game.
[24:10] Speaker 3: But I always thought and always expressed it. Hey, you
[24:14] Speaker 3: got the Saints out here. The Saints is right down there.
[24:18] Speaker 3: There's some running backs out there. There's some linemen. There's
[24:21] Speaker 3: some people that has this body, right? They got to
[24:25] Speaker 3: explode through shit. They got to take off. His problem
[24:29] Speaker 3: is taking off. When he decides to get a rebound
[24:31] Speaker 3: and take off, and he's, oh, hamstring?
[24:34] Speaker 1: I've never seen, like, Hussein Boat?
[24:36] Speaker 2: Hussein?
[24:37] Speaker 3: Hamstring is when he got older, when he's not practicing
[24:41] Speaker 3: as much, right? That's their issues, right? One thing we know,
[24:45] Speaker 3: track athletes, They got to worry about their hammies and Achilles,
[24:51] Speaker 3: which they never have. So there's something they're doing in
[24:54] Speaker 3: their training to protect this and this, right?
[24:58] Speaker 1: And that's his problem. His problem is always going to
[25:00] Speaker 1: be hammy and thigh.
[25:02] Speaker 3: Is the hammy and thigh strong enough to get off
[25:05] Speaker 3: the floor, come down?
[25:07] Speaker 2: And is it hard to expand your game when you're
[25:10] Speaker 2: always dealing with injuries too? That's why I feel like
[25:12] Speaker 2: this game ain't changed that much because you're always fighting
[25:15] Speaker 2: to get on the court and you don't have time
[25:18] Speaker 2: to work on.
[25:19] Speaker 1: Too busy rehabbing.
[25:21] Speaker 4: But at the same time, when you do get hurt,
[25:24] Speaker 4: that's when everybody becomes a better shooter.
[25:27] Speaker 1: True.
[25:28] Speaker 4: The first thing you can do before you do anything
[25:31] Speaker 4: basketball is spot shoot. So you're doing that more than
[25:36] Speaker 4: any part of the rehab program. That probably has the most,
[25:40] Speaker 4: that takes up most of the rehab program.
[25:42] Speaker 1: Spot shooting.
[25:43] Speaker 2: For sure.
[25:45] Speaker 1: But for him, don't you work on explosive?
[25:47] Speaker 3: Yeah, like for us, it's easy because you've been shooting
[25:51] Speaker 3: since day one, right?
[25:53] Speaker 1: Yeah, but I still gradually became better at shooting.
[25:57] Speaker 4: And more so around the time, I think my shooting
[26:00] Speaker 4: became even better once I got injured.
[26:02] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[26:04] Speaker 4: And part of that is, one, once I got injured, obviously,
[26:07] Speaker 4: I'll never have the athleticism I had before the end.
[26:10] Speaker 4: So now I have to become better as another part
[26:13] Speaker 4: of my game. And that's why I asked the question earlier.
[26:16] Speaker 4: Has Zion gotten better since he came in the league?
[26:19] Speaker 4: I think his game is the exact same.
[26:22] Speaker 3: He got smarter and wiser because he's gotten older. But
[26:26] Speaker 3: when you're talking about.
[26:29] Speaker 1: He plays the same exact style of play. You know
[26:34] Speaker 1: what the problem really probably is for him? Spot shooting.
[26:39] Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure they've done that. for the last eight years.
[26:42] Speaker 1: Has he become a better catcher shooter?
[26:44] Speaker 2: Nope.
[26:44] Speaker 1: The problem is... It ain't translated. The problem is that Hammy,
[26:48] Speaker 1: these right here.
[26:49] Speaker 3: These amenities that he needs, he's probably just shooting flat-footed,
[26:53] Speaker 3: doing that, and then when his ass get in the
[26:54] Speaker 3: game and he got his explosion back and he's jumping
[26:57] Speaker 3: out the mood trying to shoot a jump shot, that
[26:58] Speaker 3: didn't translate.
[27:00] Speaker 1: None of that shit gonna translate.
[27:02] Speaker 3: You just did practice shots for no reason. And that
[27:05] Speaker 3: happens too because just like anybody knows, For something you
[27:11] Speaker 3: work on in the summer, for the translate in the game,
[27:15] Speaker 3: your basketball game, you have this speed. I'll say it's
[27:23] Speaker 3: probably like a 80-85. You know how to move 80-85, right?
[27:28] Speaker 3: When you're training, you have to train at a 90-100.
[27:33] Speaker 1: Right? You can't slow bop.
[27:35] Speaker 3: You know, slow bop. Nah, you got to run into kids.
[27:39] Speaker 3: You got to really over-prepare. Yeah, you got to over-prepare.
[27:44] Speaker 3: That's what kids do now, though. The kids do that now.
[27:48] Speaker 3: They be so last minute. And they want a guy
[27:49] Speaker 3: they can't show.
[27:50] Speaker 4: Greatest example I ever seen of that was Kevin Durant, bro.
[27:55] Speaker 4: His workouts are way more intense than the game.
[27:59] Speaker 1: Like, everything is.
[28:01] Speaker 4: Game speed, it's like he's playing an imaginary defender every rep. And,
[28:07] Speaker 4: you know, being a guy that's also had to have
[28:10] Speaker 4: his own training to just see that, it's hard. That
[28:13] Speaker 4: shit hard as hell to do. Especially when there's nobody
[28:16] Speaker 4: in front of you. Every rep, a hundred miles, that's
[28:20] Speaker 4: hard to do. But it also is the reason Kevin
[28:23] Speaker 4: Durant plays the game the way he does because once
[28:26] Speaker 4: he's in the.
[28:26] Speaker 1: Game, that game speed is natural for him. You know
[28:30] Speaker 1: what I mean? Yeah.
[28:32] Speaker 4: I think that's a technique within itself, and that's also
[28:35] Speaker 4: something that gets overlooked, especially when it comes to the
[28:38] Speaker 4: younger generation.
[28:40] Speaker 2: For sure.
[28:41] Speaker 1: I said, when you look at somebody like Zion, right,
[28:43] Speaker 1: hamstring injuries, what level of conditioning can you do with
[28:46] Speaker 1: a hamstring injury? So you're talking about injuries.
[28:48] Speaker 4: I mean, the first thing they put you on is
[28:50] Speaker 4: that bike.
[28:51] Speaker 1: Yeah. Slow, but like, that wind bike though, you got
[28:56] Speaker 1: a strong strength. Hamstring, foot injury, missed a season with
[28:58] Speaker 1: a foot injury. It's all here, but. But it's like
[29:00] Speaker 1: you can't even, I'm out for two, three months, I
[29:03] Speaker 1: can't do nothing but you.
[29:04] Speaker 4: That don't stop conditioning. When I tore my Achilles, I was, shit,
[29:08] Speaker 4: I basically learned how to swim.
[29:09] Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[29:11] Speaker 4: I tore my Achilles the first, I would say, four
[29:15] Speaker 4: months of the injury. I got up to swimming 60
[29:17] Speaker 4: laps a day.
[29:18] Speaker 1: In the Olympics, man.
[29:20] Speaker 4: It still forms a condition. It's just, what are you
[29:23] Speaker 4: willing to go do? And for a guy that's 3,000 meters?
[29:26] Speaker 4: What age did you learn how to swim at?
[29:29] Speaker 1: What was that, 27? Damn. Yeah, that's crazy. See? I
[29:33] Speaker 1: know how to swim, though. You can't swim that long.
[29:38] Speaker 1: You be like, yeah, I'm good on this one. Right? Yeah.
[29:40] Speaker 1: in breath. Like, hey, I know how to swim, brother.
[29:47] Speaker 1: That's crazy. That's hard, though. Depending on how this year looks.
[29:50] Speaker 1: Pool party, too. I would tell him, I would tell him,
[29:57] Speaker 1: spend his summers- Working out with Miles Garrett. And Jamal Crawford. No.
[30:07] Speaker 1: A little bit of both. Miles Garrett. Who? Jamal Crawford.
[30:10] Speaker 1: Jamal Crawford. He need a little. Let me just throw
[30:15] Speaker 1: this in. I think that was kind of some of
[30:16] Speaker 1: the previous issues with the Pelicans medical staff. It was
[30:18] Speaker 1: more of a football centric staff. Because the owners own
[30:21] Speaker 1: the Saints. Oh, then they're done then. The owners own
[30:24] Speaker 1: the Saints as well. But now they've shifted to more NBA-centric.
[30:27] Speaker 3: Then you're dumber than I thought. If you got all
[30:32] Speaker 3: these great-ass athletes that's pushing mass muscle.
[30:38] Speaker 1: and fibers.
[30:40] Speaker 3: And twitch muscles like this, and you're saying you have
[30:43] Speaker 3: that same body style in here, and you're not understanding how.
[30:47] Speaker 1: To do it? But, Gil, the difference between football and basketball,
[30:50] Speaker 1: the football bursts is for 12, 15 seconds, right? It's
[30:52] Speaker 1: a quick one, and you're killing it. That's when he
[30:53] Speaker 1: gets hurt. But you're killing it for 30 seconds. You're
[30:55] Speaker 1: not going continuously up and down. It's a play, 30-second rest. Play,
[30:59] Speaker 1: 30-second rest.
[31:00] Speaker 3: Michael Parsons, like, that explosion, how he has to move
[31:04] Speaker 3: his hips and go and take off. That's the same thing.
[31:07] Speaker 3: When he gets that movement and take off, those are.
[31:10] Speaker 1: Where he's getting hurt. But you have to sustain that
[31:12] Speaker 1: for up and down, offense, defense, and a basketball. That's
[31:15] Speaker 1: just regular running.
[31:16] Speaker 3: I'm talking about when those muscles get activated.
[31:21] Speaker 1: That means when.
[31:22] Speaker 3: He gets the ball, like we know when LeBron, like
[31:24] Speaker 3: when LeBron runs all day, there's moments in the game
[31:27] Speaker 3: where he sees a fast break and that motherfucker get
[31:30] Speaker 3: his head down and take off.
[31:31] Speaker 1: Those, that's what his muscles are getting.
[31:34] Speaker 3: When he's getting up and he sees that ball going
[31:36] Speaker 3: up and he, boom, those little drills right there is
[31:41] Speaker 3: what his muscle needs to learn how to do.
[31:43] Speaker 2: But LeBron, I think he needs a little finesse in
[31:46] Speaker 2: his life too, though. Everything is.
[31:49] Speaker 1: Explosive. He can't even control that right now. Work with Curry.
[31:54] Speaker 2: That's what I was like.
[31:54] Speaker 1: Work with Curry. Work with some soccer coaches. Like, you
[31:57] Speaker 1: need to learn how to, like.
[31:59] Speaker 3: These ligaments, these little ligaments that's supporting all this muscle
[32:03] Speaker 3: mass needs to be strong.
[32:05] Speaker 1: That's what LeBron told us in the last 24 years.
[32:07] Speaker 1: What's the closest type player to him? That's what I'm saying.
[32:09] Speaker 1: LeBron got a little. What's the closest type player to
[32:11] Speaker 1: him that came through our league? Closest to him?
[32:15] Speaker 2: Bo Jackson. Bo Jackson.
[32:16] Speaker 1: Rodney Rodgers. I said in our league. I mean, it
[32:21] Speaker 1: would be Charles Barkley. Yeah, I was about to say
[32:24] Speaker 1: Charles Barkley. Grandmama, Larry Johnson. Larry Johnson, yeah. Not quite.
[32:29] Speaker 1: In the beginning? Not quite. Like the closest thing, Malik Rose.
[32:34] Speaker 1: If you look at early Charles Barkley.
[32:38] Speaker 4: No, Charles Barkley for sure.
[32:40] Speaker 1: That exposure, that jumping. Charles for sure. I'm going to
[32:43] Speaker 1: say Rodney Rodgers. Rodney Rogers was kind of taller, though, right? 6'7.
[32:48] Speaker 1: Rodney had a jumper, too, right? A wetter, but just
[32:52] Speaker 1: the build, like the football build in a basketball. Was
[32:55] Speaker 1: he crazy athletic? I'm thinking about that. Darvin Ham. Darvin Ham.
[33:01] Speaker 1: Darvin Ham.
[33:03] Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure.
[33:04] Speaker 1: Forlis? Williamson? Hmm. I don't think Quartz was super duper
[33:11] Speaker 1: out there. He was athletic. Definitely a similar build, though.
[33:15] Speaker 3: But he's still coming in heavier than Darvin and him.
[33:20] Speaker 1: Should I say Sean Kemp? No. He was framed.
[33:25] Speaker 3: You're going to be talking about muscle magic.
[33:28] Speaker 1: You're going to be talking about 80s, 70s.
[33:29] Speaker 2: They're talking about Orlando Magic, Sean Kemp.
[33:34] Speaker 1: Daryl Dawkins. You're talking about people like that, but that's...
[33:40] Speaker 1: We got Zion Seven Seasons of the League entering the race.
[33:42] Speaker 1: I want to know his shoes, too. What kind of
[33:44] Speaker 1: soles you have, what kind of shoes you're using. Because
[33:47] Speaker 1: you got to remember, when you get up, you got
[33:49] Speaker 1: to come down. And you're coming down with power. Chastain
[33:53] Speaker 1: Julius Peppers, I think that's a good comp. Julius played...
[33:56] Speaker 1: But he played at UNC. But that's what I'm saying.
[33:58] Speaker 3: I'm thinking about... That's actually a good one. I'm thinking
[34:00] Speaker 3: about football. When we watch Miles Garrett in the Western Am.
[34:04] Speaker 3: Like he's taking off so his body understands how to
[34:07] Speaker 3: move like this because he does these movements every day.
[34:09] Speaker 1: That's real. I think Brandon Hayward could probably speak to that,
[34:12] Speaker 1: but Julius Randle on the basketball court.
[34:13] Speaker 2: I was going to say Julius Randle.
[34:14] Speaker 1: Free gas. Or Julius Pepper, excuse me. Julius Pepper. Julius Pepper.
[34:18] Speaker 1: Julius Pepper. Julius Pepper. Julius Pepper. He just rides. He
[34:23] Speaker 1: don't get hurt. We talking about that. Like even like
[34:26] Speaker 1: somebody like Derrick Rose, right? Yeah.
[34:29] Speaker 3: We never seen nothing like that. Like, that rocket ship
[34:33] Speaker 3: speed and explosion.
[34:35] Speaker 1: So, to bring up my next question, Zion, seven seasons
[34:36] Speaker 1: in the league, missed more games than he's played in, what,
[34:39] Speaker 1: 24 and six and four assists, career averages. Yeah. Shooting
[34:43] Speaker 1: about 59% from the field. So, when Zion says he's
[34:46] Speaker 1: not where he needs to be, where should he actually be?
[34:50] Speaker 1: He know where. He know where. Yeah, he know where.
[34:53] Speaker 3: He's supposed to be in that realm of, you know,
[34:57] Speaker 3: the face of the league.
[34:59] Speaker 1: I know. He should be a top 15 guy at
[35:04] Speaker 1: worst right now. Babish, I mean. At worst. All right, really?
[35:09] Speaker 1: Top five.
[35:10] Speaker 3: He should be competing for the best player in the
[35:12] Speaker 3: NBA every year. You're talking about a guy whose second
[35:16] Speaker 3: year he was already an all-star.
[35:17] Speaker 1: 27-7. 27-7 as a 19, 20-year-old. 27-7 at four, shooting 61%
[35:18] Speaker 1: from the field. Played 61 games that season.
[35:30] Speaker 3: Yeah, you're talking about a guy who was on his
[35:33] Speaker 3: way of being a.
[35:34] Speaker 1: He's a megastar. I mean, fuck. His worst year is
[35:38] Speaker 1: last year averaging 21 and 6.
[35:40] Speaker 3: That's his worst year.
[35:42] Speaker 1: Right? So... Damn. I'm going to just be honest with you.
[35:54] Speaker 2: Can he still be a Hall of Famer?
[35:56] Speaker 4: Yeah.
[35:57] Speaker 1: Because... Eight years is eight years, but he's only 26.
[36:00] Speaker 1: He's only 26.
[36:01] Speaker 3: He's averaged a dub for his career.
[36:04] Speaker 1: The only thing that's going to stop Zion in the
[36:07] Speaker 1: next 10 years is if Some hoes, man. If he's
[36:10] Speaker 1: sitting there at 280.
[36:11] Speaker 2: Some hoes going to stop him.
[36:13] Speaker 1: Hell no, man. Because, man, everybody.
[36:14] Speaker 2: The hoes almost stopped him. The hoes almost got him traded.
[36:17] Speaker 2: She said, I'm going to leak the tape to y'all.
[36:20] Speaker 1: Man, Magic Johnson was great. Listen, we can look right
[36:22] Speaker 1: down there. Hoes, hoes, hoes, hoes. Yeah, he was great
[36:25] Speaker 1: for nine years, right? Great for 10 years. About 90%
[36:28] Speaker 1: of people on this wall, Gus, you mentioned, were married.
[36:31] Speaker 3: We're going to say Mary first because we can't... About 90%
[36:34] Speaker 3: avid fans of the work.
[36:37] Speaker 1: No, no, we're going to say 90% are great men.
[36:39] Speaker 3: If they see the picture, there's going to be men
[36:41] Speaker 3: in here. There's great men in here. All right, let's
[36:43] Speaker 3: say 62%.
[36:44] Speaker 2: Just say half.
[36:45] Speaker 1: Okay. Well, we got one, two, Mary, Mary, Mary. Larry
[36:48] Speaker 1: Bird getting it in. Mary. Actually, it's a lot of
[36:51] Speaker 1: squares in here. It's a lot of squares. It is
[36:52] Speaker 1: a lot of squares. I'm sorry. But I think... I think... Listen,
[36:58] Speaker 1: if he plays... If he plays 65 to 70 games
[37:03] Speaker 1: for the next five years, all those years are going
[37:06] Speaker 1: to be all-star years. If he plays 65 to 75
[37:08] Speaker 1: games a year? Has he played 65 in his career?
[37:10] Speaker 1: He's played 71 times. 62 this season was the most,
[37:12] Speaker 1: and 61 before that was the third high. And you're
[37:15] Speaker 1: saying 65 to 75. They make all NBA because that's
[37:17] Speaker 1: the threshold. The threshold is because of the new rule.
[37:31] Speaker 3: But making an all-star game average in 27 and seven
[37:35] Speaker 3: will be his worst years. If he goes to 25, 26,
[37:38] Speaker 3: he's making an all-star game. You give him three, four
[37:41] Speaker 3: more all-stars, first ballot off that, just that alone.
[37:45] Speaker 1: First ballot? Yeah. The thing about his worst year is 21.
[37:50] Speaker 2: He just needs to get.
[37:51] Speaker 1: So when he's out there, he is dominating. He just
[37:54] Speaker 1: got to stay out there.
[37:55] Speaker 2: Any team could use Zion and win. There's some teams
[37:58] Speaker 2: that could win with Zion.
[37:59] Speaker 1: Listen, if I'm a Pelican, I'm going to be Pelican zone. No,
[38:02] Speaker 1: because they... If you don't shut the fuck up.
[38:04] Speaker 2: Everybody that left the Pelicans end up winning.
[38:08] Speaker 1: And that's why I'm not giving away another one. What
[38:12] Speaker 1: would be a good spot? Timberwolves. Lakers? Lakers would be
[38:17] Speaker 1: a good spot, actually. Him and Luka? Yeah. You need
[38:20] Speaker 1: a guy that's going to be pick and roll. I'm
[38:22] Speaker 1: glad you said that.
[38:23] Speaker 4: Do you think part of the problem with Zion's success
[38:26] Speaker 4: is him being the first option?
[38:29] Speaker 1: Nah.
[38:32] Speaker 4: Is he a first option? Or would you say he's
[38:37] Speaker 4: better suited at being a Robin or a second option?
[38:40] Speaker 1: His style is the best. one of the best second
[38:47] Speaker 1: options that you can find. Right.
[38:50] Speaker 3: Because you don't need plays for him for him to
[38:54] Speaker 3: average 20.
[38:55] Speaker 1: Exactly. Right? He's going to office rebounds.
[38:58] Speaker 3: He just– like, if you ever watch him, he just
[39:00] Speaker 3: plays hard like shit, right?
[39:02] Speaker 1: He's damn near like Cooper Flagg.
[39:03] Speaker 3: One thing they do is they're going to play hard,
[39:06] Speaker 3: so you don't have to call plays for him. So
[39:08] Speaker 3: you can put him with a fucking selfish guy, and
[39:11] Speaker 3: he's going to rock out.
[39:14] Speaker 1: I think that's part of the issue. If I'm Detroit,
[39:17] Speaker 1: I might say, you know what? If I'm Detroit and
[39:23] Speaker 1: I got to pay two something. That's a good fucking call.
[39:25] Speaker 2: Sign a trade? That's a good one. That's a good one.
[39:29] Speaker 3: I'm thinking about Kay, someone who just needs this guy.
[39:32] Speaker 1: That's set picks and roll and stuff. Detroit would be
[39:34] Speaker 1: on fire. On fire? Oh, my God. That'd be nice.
[39:38] Speaker 3: Just any dominant guard or wing that's just going to
[39:44] Speaker 3: relieve pressure, and he can just be the cleanup man,
[39:46] Speaker 3: hit him with a couple bounce passes, he dunking on him,
[39:48] Speaker 3: sitting him on the backside, he's throwing lobs.
[39:51] Speaker 2: You don't have that much pressure on you trying to, yeah.
[39:54] Speaker 2: got to do too much and these.
[39:56] Speaker 1: Ain't going to work. That's a good call.
[39:57] Speaker 3: He plays like that slip and under game. He plays
[40:00] Speaker 3: like that old basketball. It's like a Dennis Rodman style
[40:05] Speaker 3: of play where he's sitting behind the defense coming in.
[40:08] Speaker 3: You know, like Dennis Rodman mixed with a Paul Pierce cut.
[40:12] Speaker 1: He just got all these little things with him.
[40:13] Speaker 3: But also you can put him in, you got a
[40:16] Speaker 3: nice little ISO package that he's going to sit through with.
[40:19] Speaker 1: A little love. He's going to blow past them. So
[40:21] Speaker 1: Zion extension, Ellsworth has two seasons left on his deal.
[40:23] Speaker 1: He's signing that. People aren't expecting– No. You crazy as–
[40:26] Speaker 1: I wouldn't sign up on Zion. The waterfall goes– I'm
[40:29] Speaker 1: just kidding. But people aren't expecting much from the Pelicans
[40:31] Speaker 1: this season, but their roster is interesting. They got a
[40:34] Speaker 1: good roster. Their roster is interesting. That's the crazy part. So,
[40:36] Speaker 1: along with Zion, they have Trey Murphy, DeJounte Murray, Sadiq Bae,
[40:40] Speaker 1: who I think they just extended, Herb Jones. Got Jeremiah
[40:42] Speaker 1: Fears and Derrick Queen entering their sophomore seasons. Also added
[40:45] Speaker 1: Benedict Matherin. They got a squad. And they got a
[40:47] Speaker 1: former NBA champion, Jordan Poole. It's a pool party. Trey
[40:50] Speaker 1: Poole and– So, if Zion stays healthy this season, the
[40:52] Speaker 1: Pelicans still struggle– Would this be the time for them
[40:55] Speaker 1: to try to move on from him?
[40:57] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[40:59] Speaker 1: I think it's been time.
[41:01] Speaker 2: It's not like a bad thing, but I'm just saying
[41:03] Speaker 2: for him.
[41:04] Speaker 1: Oh, for him? Yes. For Jadred? Oh, I'm okay. You
[41:07] Speaker 1: don't see, like, he need a new environment? Yeah, y'all
[41:09] Speaker 1: got to stop talking for these owners. Like, everybody ain't dumb,
[41:13] Speaker 1: all right? They are dumb.
[41:14] Speaker 3: Memphis, listen, nobody paying attention to y'all no more. Y'all
[41:17] Speaker 3: ain't selling no jerseys out there no more.
[41:20] Speaker 1: Ain't nobody coming to the game no more.
[41:21] Speaker 3: Like, Memphis– You got to win at a very high
[41:26] Speaker 3: rate to get recognition. Ja gave you that just his
[41:31] Speaker 3: style of play, right? LaMelo gave you that, Charlotte, with
[41:35] Speaker 3: his style of play. Zion's going to give, you know,
[41:38] Speaker 3: Pelicans that style of play.
[41:40] Speaker 1: I'm on the business side of things, and I realize
[41:43] Speaker 1: that everyone's not tradable.
[41:46] Speaker 3: Not to my pocketbook. Unless I got a team that's
[41:48] Speaker 3: going to win and bring people in this arena.
[41:52] Speaker 3: And I just got to rely on fucking LeBron coming
[41:54] Speaker 3: fucking once a year. Like, no, no, I got a
[41:58] Speaker 3: guy who can bring people in here that's going to
[42:00] Speaker 3: keep me over the threshold until I figure that out.
[42:03] Speaker 1: Zion's that for Pelicans.
[42:05] Speaker 3: And you getting rid of him, you better build a
[42:07] Speaker 3: goddamn team that's going to win and get into the
[42:09] Speaker 3: playoffs every year, every year for you to sustain. Other
[42:12] Speaker 3: than that, your superstar is what brings the people in.
[42:16] Speaker 2: But you could get something.
[42:17] Speaker 1: Good for Zion. I don't want nothing good.
[42:20] Speaker 2: But For Zion's sake, don't you feel like he's wasting
[42:24] Speaker 2: his career there? It's eight years, and nobody's still.
[42:28] Speaker 1: Watching the Pelicans. I don't give a fuck what he's playing. No, no.
[42:30] Speaker 2: We watch the highlights and see what Zion did. He's
[42:33] Speaker 2: not watching no Pelican game thinking they're going to win
[42:36] Speaker 2: the game.
[42:36] Speaker 1: Exactly. We're watching the highlights. He leaves. We're not watching. Yes, yes.
[42:41] Speaker 2: We're not watching nothing. Because you can end up winning.
[42:44] Speaker 2: You can buy a team.
[42:45] Speaker 1: When was the last time you watched the Wizards? It's
[42:50] Speaker 1: been a long time. Exciting team this year.
[42:51] Speaker 3: You're watching it now. You're going to watch it this year.
[42:54] Speaker 3: My boy's going to tune in.
[42:55] Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying. My boy's going to tune in
[42:56] Speaker 1: to Utah.
[42:57] Speaker 2: They could get the number one pick. You could trade
[42:59] Speaker 2: him for a pick.
[43:00] Speaker 1: Names, man. Names. You said a pick. Picks and some
[43:04] Speaker 1: other shit.
[43:04] Speaker 2: You could get some picks for Zion like OKC did.
[43:08] Speaker 2: Nobody watching OKC. They traded.
[43:10] Speaker 1: You mean like a lot of picks? Or like a pick?
[43:14] Speaker 1: A lot of picks. You might have to give up
[43:16] Speaker 1: a pick. For Zion? Damn. Fuck no.
[43:24] Speaker 4: It depends on if they look at it as a
[43:26] Speaker 4: bad contract or not.
[43:28] Speaker 2: Two years left on his deal, though.
[43:30] Speaker 3: I got a motherfucker right now asking for 285.
[43:34] Speaker 2: That's what I'm saying.
[43:36] Speaker 1: His bad numbers is 20. I ain't got like two years.
[43:40] Speaker 1: I'm a beast. I like him in Detroit. That's a
[43:43] Speaker 1: little bit too much. I ain't got like two years,
[43:45] Speaker 1: 87 left on his deal, so.
[43:48] Speaker 2: See, I can work with that.
[43:50] Speaker 1: That's too much. Knowing damn well, if they even.
[43:54] Speaker 3: Think about not giving me that deal, I'm taking the
[43:58] Speaker 3: Zion deal every time.
[44:01] Speaker 1: If I'm Pelicans, I'm signing to an extension. Listen, otherwise.
[44:07] Speaker 4: You're signing to Zion to an extension.
[44:11] Speaker 1: I'm happy to. No. I'm happy to.
[44:14] Speaker 2: He's 28.
[44:14] Speaker 3: Eight years is cool, but he's 26.
[44:18] Speaker 1: Now, I want you to think about.
[44:19] Speaker 2: That's what I was talking about. When do that stop
[44:21] Speaker 2: right there?
[44:21] Speaker 1: Think about history.
[44:22] Speaker 2: That's what I was talking about. At what age do
[44:24] Speaker 2: that stop?
[44:25] Speaker 1: 26 years old.
[44:26] Speaker 3: Remember, Jordan didn't get his first championship to win. LeBron
[44:29] Speaker 3: didn't get.
[44:29] Speaker 1: His first championship to win. I mean, technically, he's still...
[44:32] Speaker 1: That's why I said 30.
[44:33] Speaker 2: That's when that stops.
[44:36] Speaker 1: That's still young. 26 was old prime. Right.
[44:40] Speaker 3: These niggas' primes right here are starting at 30 now. Like,
[44:43] Speaker 3: even with Anthony Davis, I'm sitting.
[44:44] Speaker 1: Here like, wait, he's only what? Oh, man, I'm maxing
[44:47] Speaker 1: you out still. Right. Or you may be trading in
[44:52] Speaker 1: for Jalen Dern, just depending on what the move feels like.
[44:55] Speaker 1: If I'm with... I would do that, too. I would
[44:59] Speaker 1: do that, too. There's talks about those two teams in
[45:01] Speaker 1: the conversation. I ain't mad at that move either. But
[45:03] Speaker 1: if you're Zion, man.
[45:05] Speaker 4: But more on a timeline basis, I would like Cade and.
[45:10] Speaker 2: That would be crazy, bro.
[45:12] Speaker 3: The NBA, if he has a really healthy year and
[45:17] Speaker 3: he makes an all-NBA team or some shit like that.
[45:20] Speaker 1: They got the best middle class.
[45:22] Speaker 3: I don't know if they still do, but I need
[45:24] Speaker 3: him in a bigger market. I need him with money behind.
[45:28] Speaker 3: I need him with a franchise that got money behind him. Clippers?
[45:34] Speaker 3: That got money behind him that can really give him the...
[45:37] Speaker 3: They can pay attention to his physical part.
[45:40] Speaker 2: Man, I told y'all I would've traded Julius Randle for that.
[45:42] Speaker 1: Flippers wouldn't be a bad slot. Flippers might, you know what?
[45:44] Speaker 1: Flippers could trade for him. Yeah.
[45:46] Speaker 3: If I'm Bomber, that might be a move I would make.
[45:50] Speaker 1: Out of all the moves you done made, I would
[45:52] Speaker 1: take my risk on that. I would, too.
[45:54] Speaker 2: For sure.
[45:55] Speaker 1: That makes sense. Because even with Kawhi, you're sitting there like,
[45:58] Speaker 1: you know what?
[46:00] Speaker 3: At the end of the day, he's still... is considered,
[46:02] Speaker 3: damn near, a top three Clipper. It could be Live
[46:05] Speaker 3: City 2.0. I mean, what I'm saying, it's still a
[46:08] Speaker 3: top three Clipper of all time.
[46:10] Speaker 1: For sure. For sure. Chad also saying Timberwolves, I don't
[46:15] Speaker 1: think that's... I said Timberwolves. Yeah, you said Timberwolves. That's
[46:16] Speaker 1: too much. I don't want to win Timberwolves now.
[46:18] Speaker 2: No, I'm saying we should have traded Julius Randle.
[46:20] Speaker 1: That's the way it be.
[46:21] Speaker 2: I'm going to get a trade of Julius Randle for him.
[46:23] Speaker 1: I like Kaminga in that role better. Boy, that team
[46:26] Speaker 1: would be magnificent. I need him.
[46:32] Speaker 2: Him flying around. You still got the live city over
[46:36] Speaker 2: there with Melo.
[46:37] Speaker 4: I think that takes them down a notch defensively, though.
[46:41] Speaker 1: Hell no.
[46:41] Speaker 2: That makes them super athletic.
[46:45] Speaker 1: And Goldberg down there.
[46:48] Speaker 4: They still super athletic. I just feel like it makes
[46:50] Speaker 4: them worse defensively. Now we're depending on Zion to match
[46:52] Speaker 4: up with Wendy.
[46:54] Speaker 2: But you still got Goldberg down there.
[46:56] Speaker 1: But I'm playing.
[46:57] Speaker 2: I know Goldberg, but.
[46:59] Speaker 1: I'm playing him at the, I'm playing him at the.
[47:00] Speaker 2: He jumped as high as.
[47:01] Speaker 1: I'm playing him at the two, three, three, four. Two, three, three, four.
[47:05] Speaker 1: Like I'm at the four. Two, three, three, four. Wait, wait,
[47:09] Speaker 1: not on Minnesota though. No, I'm saying that's. Like if I'm,
[47:11] Speaker 1: if I'm coaching him, two, three, three, four. I say three, four.
[47:15] Speaker 1: I like three, four. I can't say two, four. Hey, Clay,
[47:17] Speaker 1: Clay guard you. Drop it. Drop it. Drop it. Let's go.
[47:22] Speaker 2: I'm taking the charge.
[47:23] Speaker 1: Drop it. I'm taking the charge. I know he going
[47:25] Speaker 1: to go rawr. And how many shooting guards? Because he's
[47:28] Speaker 1: not about to do nothing.
[47:29] Speaker 3: Listen, how many shooting guards, how many shooting guards is
[47:33] Speaker 3: actually taking him off the dribble like that? Remember, top
[47:36] Speaker 3: shooting guards, Jalen Brown. Jalen Brown ain't getting the box.
[47:40] Speaker 3: It's not like that foot spree.
[47:41] Speaker 1: I think you are. I mean, the only people that's
[47:43] Speaker 1: going to mix him will be Booker and Ant-Man get
[47:47] Speaker 1: in foul trouble. For the most part.
[47:49] Speaker 2: They get in foul trouble. Jimmy Butler's not really... Because
[47:52] Speaker 2: he just want to jump.
[47:54] Speaker 1: He's going to have to be smart going for them
[47:57] Speaker 1: pump kicks and shit. He going to guard twos?
[48:00] Speaker 7: That's what I'm saying. I'll have him guard a saw.
[48:05] Speaker 7: There's certain twos. I wouldn't have him guard... Two on offense,
[48:09] Speaker 7: three on defense? Three, four on defense?
[48:11] Speaker 1: So, Normie said, Super Chat question for the end of
[48:13] Speaker 1: the show, but got a good one from RG Basketball. Said,
[48:15] Speaker 1: how do y'all feel about Zion in Portland? I like Portland. Nah.
[48:21] Speaker 1: I always wanted Zion to go back with me. You
[48:23] Speaker 1: had to trade. Who would you trade for? And they
[48:27] Speaker 1: got all them damn assets. Oh, yeah?
[48:30] Speaker 2: You can change Shannon Sharp and Scoop.
[48:32] Speaker 1: I got a lot of awesome. Yeah. John Zion together.
[48:36] Speaker 1: You can do that. I always wanted John Zion. Because
[48:38] Speaker 1: they need to get rid of Scoop.
[48:39] Speaker 2: It's just, you don't like it because it's just nasty.
[48:41] Speaker 1: It's boring. He's going to be a clipper. I can
[48:45] Speaker 1: see him being a clipper.
[48:46] Speaker 2: I can see him being a clipper.
[48:47] Speaker 1: Clipper or boss. He can fuck around and be a
[48:51] Speaker 1: boss insulting. Yeah, he could use him too. Mm. Five-out offense.
[48:56] Speaker 1: And who they got? PG? PG would probably be gone.
[48:59] Speaker 1: They got enough money for that?
[49:01] Speaker 2: Yeah, they got rid of $ 200.
[49:02] Speaker 1: They can find some money around there. They got rid
[49:06] Speaker 1: of Danny Burke? If I'm Clippers and I know I
[49:09] Speaker 1: don't have no more draft picks.
[49:10] Speaker 3: And stuff like that, and I'm looking at somebody who's like,
[49:12] Speaker 3: that's what I'm saying.
[49:14] Speaker 4: I feel like the Pelicans they're going to have to
[49:16] Speaker 4: add a pick to get rid of Zion.
[49:18] Speaker 1: So if I'm the Clippers, I'm definitely looking at that move.
[49:25] Speaker 1: Depending on if they look at it as a bad move.
[49:28] Speaker 1: I know that his game would just take off, and
[49:32] Speaker 1: he'd be that Sean Kim style, would be Holland Burton.
[49:37] Speaker 3: Playing with somebody like him. Indiana would be nice. His
[49:41] Speaker 3: muscles got to be just moving right. Indiana would be nice.
[49:45] Speaker 1: Him and Hallie?
[49:46] Speaker 2: You could say any team really with Zion like that now,
[49:50] Speaker 2: but Indiana would be nice.
[49:51] Speaker 1: For us to be like, oh shit, Zion back. Trae Young,
[49:55] Speaker 1: picking roles with Trae Young. You keep him. Who play
[49:59] Speaker 1: the four? Where? They interchangeable. 3-4? Just add some athleticism
[50:02] Speaker 1: to it. Because they do got that Where?
[50:07] Speaker 2: The dunk contest, dude, at that three.
[50:10] Speaker 1: Obie? Obie, yeah. All right, well, let's keep this thing moving.
[50:12] Speaker 1: We're going to talk about a subject that hits close
[50:14] Speaker 1: to home for us. So for seven years, Shannon Sharp,
[50:17] Speaker 1: Skip Bayless formed a dynamic duo working together on Undisputed.
[50:21] Speaker 1: From controversial takes, heated debates, and memeable moments, the two
[50:24] Speaker 1: were a legendary pairing like a two-piece with a biscuit.
[50:26] Speaker 1: The show had highs and lows, with the infamous put
[50:29] Speaker 1: your glasses back on moment during a heated debate on
[50:31] Speaker 1: Tom Brady. Shannon taking offense to a Skip tweet about
[50:34] Speaker 1: DeMar Hamlin We had his situation go down. And also
[50:37] Speaker 1: Shannon wanted to further establish his own digital brand, serving
[50:40] Speaker 1: as some of the catalysts for their breakup. So Duo
[50:43] Speaker 1: linked up recently with Skip pulling up to Club Shay Shay,
[50:45] Speaker 1: where they detailed the unceremonious end of Undisputed and the
[50:49] Speaker 1: factors which led to that end. Let me ask you this.
[50:53] Speaker 1: Why do you think the show finally ended? Yo ass.
[51:00] Speaker 8: I think that the people upstairs going all the way
[51:03] Speaker 8: to the top were more impacted by that kind of
[51:09] Speaker 8: clash than you and I were. And I think that
[51:14] Speaker 8: like everybody else in this world, they were prisoners of
[51:17] Speaker 8: internet overreaction. Like you said, the internet decided that's the
[51:21] Speaker 8: end of Undisputed as we knew and loved it. And
[51:26] Speaker 8: it felt like from that moment on that our clock
[51:30] Speaker 8: was ticking and they just decided we need to go
[51:33] Speaker 8: in a different direction. But it went all the way
[51:36] Speaker 8: to the bitter end when we started counting down days
[51:41] Speaker 8: to what I was told was your last day. And
[51:44] Speaker 8: then maybe three days before your last day, I came
[51:48] Speaker 8: to your dressing room.
[51:50] Speaker 1: And we went back and forth.
[51:52] Speaker 8: And you said, hey, I don't want to leave.
[51:54] Speaker 1: And I'm like, you don't?
[51:55] Speaker 9: No. They didn't give me much of a choice in
[51:58] Speaker 9: the matter, Skip. To be honest, and this is something
[52:00] Speaker 9: that I've never shared. They said, this is over. They
[52:04] Speaker 9: said it was over. I'm not finna argue with you
[52:07] Speaker 9: and fight with you. If you don't think I'm good
[52:09] Speaker 9: enough to do the job, okay.
[52:10] Speaker 8: And then you told me in your dressing room you
[52:13] Speaker 8: absolutely did not want to leave and that if, in fact,
[52:17] Speaker 8: we could revitalize from that point forward, you said, hey,
[52:22] Speaker 8: I'd be.
[52:23] Speaker 1: Good to stay.
[52:24] Speaker 9: Just let me have the podcast. They said, let us
[52:28] Speaker 9: think about it. I don't want to tell you because
[52:32] Speaker 9: they said, let us think about it. I'm going to
[52:34] Speaker 9: my attorney's office. I'm going to Marvin's office. When I
[52:37] Speaker 9: get there, there's a fax already coming through my termination.
[52:43] Speaker 1: Also didn't mention the it's my turn moment. Yep. It's
[52:47] Speaker 1: my turn. Skip. So Shannon went on to thank Skip
[52:51] Speaker 1: for giving him the opportunity to be on Undisputed, crediting
[52:53] Speaker 1: him with the success he's had since breaking off and
[52:57] Speaker 1: continuing Club Shea Shea and Nightcap, with Skip pointing out
[53:00] Speaker 1: that the powers that be at Fox Sports shoving Shannon
[53:03] Speaker 1: out ended up being the best thing for his career.
[53:05] Speaker 1: So Gil, I know you've worked with both these gentlemen. Uh-huh. Nightcap,
[53:09] Speaker 1: you got to play. Sometimes.
[53:12] Speaker 3: You was on time some of the times.
[53:16] Speaker 1: The reason I targeted all three is when you're talking
[53:21] Speaker 1: about the best in the business, you have to get
[53:26] Speaker 1: under the hood to see what makes them the best, right?
[53:30] Speaker 3: Preparation, right? Like I'm looking through the Instagram, right? I'm, I'm,
[53:35] Speaker 3: you know, calling them.
[53:36] Speaker 1: Hey, are you up?
[53:36] Speaker 3: Like I, I wanted to know what made them as
[53:40] Speaker 3: good as they, they were. And it's crazy because all
[53:44] Speaker 3: three are very different.
[53:47] Speaker 1: Um, Stephen A as well in that mix. Yeah. Stephen A. Yeah. Uh, they're,
[53:51] Speaker 1: they're all, they're all different. Um, they all have their
[53:55] Speaker 1: own unique way of preparing. Um, they're all very prepared. Um, Like,
[54:03] Speaker 1: you know, when you're talking about, you know, Shannon, you know.
[54:07] Speaker 3: He's going to make sure, like, you can't be a
[54:10] Speaker 3: second league, right? Like, he needs everything to go perfect, right?
[54:14] Speaker 3: It's a well-oiled machine. Like, he's very hardworking. Like, if
[54:21] Speaker 3: we're starting at six, I was on that motherfucker like.
[54:23] Speaker 1: Five o'clock, right?
[54:25] Speaker 3: Like, you know, making sure everything is right. Like, you know,
[54:28] Speaker 3: I don't, you know, he's militant, like football player. Like,
[54:31] Speaker 3: you can see you know, how his body is right now,
[54:34] Speaker 3: that he's really disciplined in, you know, the things he does, right?
[54:39] Speaker 1: Skip, too. Like, Skip is, you know, he's going to
[54:44] Speaker 1: write all his notes down. He's going to make sure
[54:46] Speaker 1: he has his talking points.
[54:47] Speaker 3: He's going to, you know, be very research in everything
[54:51] Speaker 3: he's doing, right?
[54:52] Speaker 1: So even if you think he.
[54:54] Speaker 3: Sounds wrong, he's researched it.
[54:58] Speaker 1: Like, he's technically right.
[55:01] Speaker 2: It's just.
[55:02] Speaker 3: In his form, like if he thinks the person sucks,
[55:04] Speaker 3: he's going to find out everything.
[55:06] Speaker 1: But he'll tell you everything that sucks. He'll tell you
[55:08] Speaker 1: everything that sucks. He's right in what the guy sucks at, right? But,
[55:12] Speaker 1: you know, it's just going to be his angle.
[55:14] Speaker 3: But they're very great at what, like Skip, like they'll
[55:17] Speaker 3: have a show at 11.
[55:19] Speaker 1: Skip here at 9 o'clock. He done drove.
[55:21] Speaker 3: He going to be in there reading everything, going through
[55:25] Speaker 3: his routine, right?
[55:26] Speaker 1: And, like, love sports. Right? Like, sports is life. Like,
[55:33] Speaker 1: it's sports, then wife. Right? And it was a pleasure
[55:40] Speaker 1: to have, to be with all three. Like, I know
[55:45] Speaker 1: Stephen A. tested me, too. I told him I'd wake
[55:48] Speaker 1: up at 4 o'clock. I said, I'd wake up at 4.
[55:50] Speaker 3: Like, we had the show at 7 o'clock.
[55:54] Speaker 1: And I said, I'd wake up at 4 every morning. Right? Right.
[55:58] Speaker 3: I said by 430 I'm already you know like doing
[56:00] Speaker 3: my research I got a call at 430 on the
[56:04] Speaker 3: dot right him testing to see if I was actually
[56:09] Speaker 3: up I was like yeah I'm.
[56:11] Speaker 1: Up Did you answer his call good? Yes. Because you
[56:15] Speaker 1: don't take incoming calls. I was up. I'll be taking
[56:18] Speaker 1: from Stephen A.
[56:18] Speaker 3: I know when the test is coming.
[56:19] Speaker 1: He don't answer that.
[56:20] Speaker 2: He don't answer R.
[56:23] Speaker 1: That's funny on the line.
[56:25] Speaker 3: I'll text you niggas back.
[56:28] Speaker 1: It's amazing. No, wait. What time do you go to sleep, though? 12-1?
[56:31] Speaker 1: It doesn't matter. No. No. You can't go to sleep
[56:36] Speaker 1: at 1 or wake up at 4.
[56:37] Speaker 2: You go to sleep early.
[56:38] Speaker 1: That's why I was better than everybody, bro.
[56:40] Speaker 2: You take naps, though. You look like an old nigga.
[56:42] Speaker 2: You take naps. You do take naps. Like, after this,
[56:44] Speaker 2: you're taking naps.
[56:45] Speaker 1: I'm a napper, too. It's like something I can't control. Like,
[56:48] Speaker 1: it's just part of my DNA. Like, no matter what
[56:50] Speaker 1: time I go to sleep, I'm going to be up
[56:52] Speaker 1: around the same time.
[56:53] Speaker 2: You got older kids now, too.
[56:54] Speaker 1: Like, even when I was a young kid, right?
[56:58] Speaker 3: Like, my dad goes to work at, like, he did
[57:00] Speaker 3: the graveyard shift. And when he left the house, I'll
[57:03] Speaker 3: be on the video game playing.
[57:05] Speaker 1: What time would this be at? It's easy to take
[57:07] Speaker 1: naps in that room you had. What time would you
[57:09] Speaker 1: go to sleep at?
[57:10] Speaker 2: Your room was pitch black, that's why.
[57:12] Speaker 1: He had a dark room. Ask my wife. He had
[57:14] Speaker 1: a dark room. I go to sleep 1, 2 o'clock,
[57:16] Speaker 1: and I be back up two hours later, ready to go.
[57:19] Speaker 1: I wake up the same time every day, so I
[57:21] Speaker 1: get it. Good to have routine. 5.36. Damn.
[57:26] Speaker 4: No alarm, just automatically. I can come in the night before,
[57:30] Speaker 4: like you said, 3, 4 in the morning. I'm automatically
[57:33] Speaker 4: waking up. That's why I can't do no drugs.
[57:35] Speaker 1: I already got too much energy. You can't tell me
[57:37] Speaker 1: y'all not on dope. That's what I'm saying. I can't
[57:39] Speaker 1: do it. I'm scared. Crackheads wake up at that time.
[57:43] Speaker 1: I ain't on no crack. I smoke a little Bud.
[57:47] Speaker 1: We are in California, a beautiful state. Andy, hey, when
[57:49] Speaker 1: I wake up. I would too. I'd wake up at
[57:52] Speaker 1: 4 a.m. Yeah, baby. Stopping on shit and hoping to
[57:57] Speaker 1: do it free. Shower, what's going on? I'd be driving
[58:01] Speaker 1: to get some coffee. Coffee. I'd be at the coffee.
[58:03] Speaker 1: Coffee and some mother. It's a good morning. I'd drive
[58:06] Speaker 1: 30 minutes for a dollar coffee. Gil has three coffee
[58:08] Speaker 1: machines here just for context and perspective. One right over here.
[58:12] Speaker 2: Big baby can't catch you at 5 in the morning.
[58:13] Speaker 2: Big baby can't catch you at 5 in the morning.
[58:15] Speaker 2: He can't catch us.
[58:16] Speaker 1: Oh, yeah. You did. Listen to that. Hearing about their breakup.
[58:23] Speaker 1: What's your reaction to Skip coming to club Shay Shay
[58:26] Speaker 1: talking about the dark side of the sports media game.
[58:28] Speaker 1: Fox pushing Shannon Sharp.
[58:30] Speaker 3: And that's why a lot of the companies have fallen off.
[58:37] Speaker 1: Because they this is not the 90s.
[58:40] Speaker 3: This is not the early 2000s where outside opinion matters.
[58:46] Speaker 3: You're not selling a product. but the product you are
[58:49] Speaker 3: selling is views, is drama. You are in the drama
[58:53] Speaker 3: business now, right? So just like you sold the game then,
[58:58] Speaker 3: it's no different here, right? Where your best views, let's
[59:05] Speaker 3: put your glasses on, what you standing up for?
[59:07] Speaker 1: Like, we tuned in to see this back and forth. Right.
[59:11] Speaker 1: So you get scared. Oh, the radio. And then you
[59:15] Speaker 1: you you want to let someone go.
[59:17] Speaker 3: Right.
[59:17] Speaker 1: Those are the those are the decisions that's ruining life.
[59:23] Speaker 1: The companies.
[59:24] Speaker 3: And you got to shut down and you're losing views
[59:26] Speaker 3: because you haven't adjusted to the landscape. Bring in younger people.
[59:32] Speaker 3: Old heads, y'all times is over. Like, I'm sorry, your
[59:35] Speaker 3: times is over. You just don't understand.
[59:37] Speaker 1: What's going on. In all media fields, please go around
[59:39] Speaker 1: with the old school mindset. Nobody cares. Nobody cares. Like, no, serious.
[59:44] Speaker 1: For real. Like, I blame the whole brainwash motherfucker. Yeah,
[59:49] Speaker 1: I agree. Like, you see what is getting viewed.
[59:51] Speaker 3: So you had this real, like, the two, this was
[59:57] Speaker 3: the Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen style, right? You're talking about, like,
[1:00:02] Speaker 3: The Sidney Dean and Billy Ford. You know what I mean?
[1:00:05] Speaker 3: So when that happened, that just broke more eyes to
[1:00:09] Speaker 3: the situation.
[1:00:10] Speaker 2: Bruh, the hen dog, the black ass on national TV.
[1:00:15] Speaker 3: And you're letting it go, not realizing what you had.
[1:00:20] Speaker 1: You haven't replaced it. The channel had to be shut down. Right?
[1:00:23] Speaker 1: You're losing so much. It's been brought back to life.
[1:00:26] Speaker 1: They lost the whole show, right? Huh? They lost the
[1:00:27] Speaker 1: whole show. Yeah, Page and everything. Page is now, I believe, Speakeasy.
[1:00:31] Speaker 1: I've been monitoring social situations.
[1:00:33] Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, what's unfortunate for them is, Speakeasy is,
[1:00:39] Speaker 3: you have the numbers of the page. The audience could
[1:00:43] Speaker 3: never be yours. That's just not how YouTube works, right?
[1:00:46] Speaker 3: You're better off starting from fresh. So when the algorithm
[1:00:51] Speaker 3: is pushing... That channel out, it's all you. So anyone
[1:00:55] Speaker 3: who's clicking around the world, they're going to be pushing you.
[1:00:58] Speaker 3: That channel itself was built off of whoever built it first.
[1:01:03] Speaker 1: Sounds like other channels that I've met.
[1:01:06] Speaker 2: But don't people build channels to sell them?
[1:01:08] Speaker 1: Yeah, but it doesn't work. It don't work.
[1:01:11] Speaker 3: If they said, if he puts, if Speakeasy, if they
[1:01:15] Speaker 3: put Shannon and Skip on that channel right now, he
[1:01:19] Speaker 3: did an episode on, With them two, it will reactivate
[1:01:23] Speaker 3: the page.
[1:01:25] Speaker 1: That episode, and they put Skip and Shannon in the title.
[1:01:28] Speaker 3: The page will get the views that it used to get.
[1:01:30] Speaker 1: So you can't cheat the grind, basically. You can't cheat
[1:01:32] Speaker 1: the grind. With a YouTube channel, especially, right?
[1:01:33] Speaker 2: You can't.
[1:01:34] Speaker 1: It's just an algorithm. Some people make money off of that, though.
[1:01:38] Speaker 2: People make money doing this.
[1:01:41] Speaker 1: Don't hate on us.
[1:01:42] Speaker 2: I'm not saying it's relevant from that situation. I get it,
[1:01:45] Speaker 2: but some people do do that, though.
[1:01:48] Speaker 1: It does happen all the time.
[1:01:48] Speaker 2: Yeah, I was about to say it.
[1:01:50] Speaker 3: No, I know, but you can't unlock. It's like a code.
[1:01:55] Speaker 3: The algorithm is coded and it's never going to unlock
[1:01:59] Speaker 3: for the next person. It's just hampered on them. Buying
[1:02:03] Speaker 3: people TikToks. But I'm glad they backed. I'm glad they
[1:02:07] Speaker 3: had that talk to realize that they both still wanted
[1:02:13] Speaker 3: to work with each other and upper management is like, yeah, nah,
[1:02:17] Speaker 3: we don't need this type of.
[1:02:18] Speaker 1: That's usually how it go. The business end of this
[1:02:20] Speaker 1: shit will turn your friends against you. You think they
[1:02:22] Speaker 1: can make another show? Yes. I think they could. Because
[1:02:27] Speaker 1: they're both great at what they do. I think they could.
[1:02:32] Speaker 1: At this point? Right now, they just would have been like, what?
[1:02:34] Speaker 1: Who would they have been right now? I'm going to
[1:02:36] Speaker 1: just be honest with you.
[1:02:39] Speaker 2: I think they're going to make something.
[1:02:40] Speaker 1: The three-headed monster get together, that might be some shit
[1:02:43] Speaker 1: we've never seen before.
[1:02:47] Speaker 3: Because remember, they never actually worked together. It was replaced.
[1:02:53] Speaker 3: Them three worked together. That would be a very, very
[1:02:57] Speaker 3: different show. That would be must watch.
[1:03:00] Speaker 1: That's real.
[1:03:02] Speaker 3: Because you're going to have them two against each other,
[1:03:05] Speaker 3: and then Stephen A is just going to figure out.
[1:03:07] Speaker 1: He's the one.
[1:03:08] Speaker 3: He don't need to run down. He's just going to go.
[1:03:11] Speaker 3: He's just going to go mix you up in some
[1:03:13] Speaker 3: shit you done forgot about. You know what I mean?
[1:03:15] Speaker 3: That would be great.
[1:03:17] Speaker 1: Well, you had the unique perspective working with all three
[1:03:19] Speaker 1: of them, so I thought we would hit that real quick.
[1:03:21] Speaker 1: Shout out to Shannon, Club Shea Shea on the Playmaker Network,
[1:03:25] Speaker 1: as well as Nightcap. So we all on the same
[1:03:28] Speaker 1: crew and same team. But let's keep this thing moving.
[1:03:31] Speaker 1: Carl Anthony Towns had a lot of critics during his
[1:03:34] Speaker 1: NBA career, including one on this couch here. Hold on,
[1:03:38] Speaker 1: hold on.
[1:03:38] Speaker 2: Yeah, go get the strap.
[1:03:41] Speaker 1: Go get the.
[1:03:42] Speaker 2: If you're talking about Towns.
[1:03:43] Speaker 1: It's a 22. So a lot of critics during his
[1:03:47] Speaker 1: NBA career, including fans, media, even former teammates. But after
[1:03:51] Speaker 1: helping deliver a chip to the Knicks, ending a 53-year drought,
[1:03:54] Speaker 1: the man known as the Big Bodega got his get back,
[1:03:58] Speaker 1: talked his cash shit, sent out a strong message to
[1:04:01] Speaker 1: all of his haters for all the years of disrespect.
[1:04:03] Speaker 1: And Cat's dad, Carl Anthony Towns Sr., echoed those sentiments
[1:04:07] Speaker 1: at one of his son's former teammates. So Jimmy Butler
[1:04:09] Speaker 1: and Cat had a strained relationship during their brief time
[1:04:12] Speaker 1: together with the Wolves. in parts of two seasons between
[1:04:15] Speaker 1: 2017 and 2018, before Butler was traded to the Sixers.
[1:04:18] Speaker 1: Butler took issue with the Wolves giving Cat and Andrew
[1:04:21] Speaker 1: Wiggins contract extensions before him, demanding a trade shortly before
[1:04:25] Speaker 1: training camp in the 2018-19 season, with Butler famously pulling
[1:04:28] Speaker 1: up to practice for the first time a month after
[1:04:30] Speaker 1: the request, smacking the starters while playing with the Wolves'
[1:04:33] Speaker 1: third stringers, while saying Cat and Wiggins were soft and
[1:04:37] Speaker 1: couldn't win without him. Beef continued in the aftermath of
[1:04:39] Speaker 1: Butler's trade, with Jimmy Buckets calling Cat a loser amongst
[1:04:43] Speaker 1: other things. So during an interview with The Athletic's John Krasinski,
[1:04:47] Speaker 1: Cat Sr., known as Big Carl, pulled out the receipts
[1:04:50] Speaker 1: offering these thoughts on Cat and Jimmy's beef. Carl Sr. said,
[1:04:54] Speaker 1: it only hurt me as a father to hear people
[1:04:56] Speaker 1: saying stuff that was negative, that wasn't true, to bring
[1:04:59] Speaker 1: him down. But in the end, it all paid up.
[1:05:02] Speaker 1: Jimmy Butler ain't got no championship. Carl bypassed him. So Boogie,
[1:05:06] Speaker 1: we will start with you. What's your reaction to Cat's
[1:05:09] Speaker 1: dad Is he spending her trip and saying, Cat has
[1:05:13] Speaker 1: bypassed Jimmy Butler by winning a chip?
[1:05:15] Speaker 4: I don't think it's the same, but I don't understand
[1:05:18] Speaker 4: where Cat, I got a lot of love for Cat's pop,
[1:05:22] Speaker 4: and Cat himself, but I think it's more so just
[1:05:26] Speaker 4: the father kind of defending his kid. That was a
[1:05:29] Speaker 4: crucial part in Cat's early career, so kind of stained
[1:05:34] Speaker 4: his name and that part of his career, so I'm
[1:05:38] Speaker 4: sure that's something that he's kind of held on to
[1:05:40] Speaker 4: and his family has held on to up to a
[1:05:42] Speaker 4: certain point.
[1:05:43] Speaker 1: So I get why his pops.
[1:05:47] Speaker 4: Is, you know, saying and doing what he's doing. But
[1:05:50] Speaker 4: at the same time, I just think it's two type
[1:05:52] Speaker 4: different situations.
[1:05:53] Speaker 1: You know, you got it.
[1:05:55] Speaker 4: Jimmy Butler was a guy that was leading the team,
[1:05:57] Speaker 4: you know, Carl Anthony Towns, one of the chip, you know,
[1:06:00] Speaker 4: being the help. And I don't mean that in a
[1:06:03] Speaker 4: disrespectful way, but being more of a role player, not
[1:06:06] Speaker 4: the number one, he's not the number one option. That was,
[1:06:08] Speaker 4: Jalen Brunson. So, yeah, he got a chip before Jimmy,
[1:06:13] Speaker 4: but the part that I'm, you know, did he surpass
[1:06:18] Speaker 4: Jimmy or I just think it's two different type of,
[1:06:20] Speaker 4: you know, scenarios. So, like I said, I get why
[1:06:23] Speaker 4: he did it, but I don't think it's real, you know,
[1:06:26] Speaker 4: correlation between the two. And, I mean, at the end
[1:06:31] Speaker 4: of the day, you know, Cass continued to grow as
[1:06:33] Speaker 4: an individual, as a player. You know, he's finally got
[1:06:36] Speaker 4: to that point of, you know, winning a championship. But
[1:06:40] Speaker 4: I think it's still more to prove in his game
[1:06:43] Speaker 4: as an individual. So, you know, just I think that's
[1:06:47] Speaker 4: more so the focus compared to, you know, what.
[1:06:51] Speaker 1: Happened with Jimmy and the Timberwolves.
[1:06:53] Speaker 4: But to answer that question in general, I just don't
[1:06:57] Speaker 4: see the correlation.
[1:06:59] Speaker 1: So, ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to Gil's Arena. Wow.
[1:07:04] Speaker 1: For real? Yeah. You don't want, okay. Chip City. Rocking me.
[1:07:08] Speaker 2: Four finger you.
[1:07:09] Speaker 1: Carl Anthony Towns. Chip, chip. You know this is new.
[1:07:12] Speaker 1: That is. Got the finals pass. It ain't signed though,
[1:07:15] Speaker 1: so I see you don't fuck with me.
[1:07:16] Speaker 2: It ain't signed.
[1:07:17] Speaker 1: Everything else signed in here. Not signed.
[1:07:19] Speaker 2: Not signed.
[1:07:20] Speaker 1: I got you, Gil. Let me get that signed for you.
[1:07:22] Speaker 1: I got you. Nah, not the way you just talked
[1:07:25] Speaker 1: about it. No, not on Towns. Not on Towns. Championship
[1:07:31] Speaker 1: Towns now, baby.
[1:07:32] Speaker 2: Yeah, I hate to give Towns credit, but he did
[1:07:38] Speaker 2: pass Jimmy.
[1:07:39] Speaker 1: Swag, you feel like one of these Towns, Gil, so
[1:07:42] Speaker 1: I'll read the quote again since you were busy putting
[1:07:44] Speaker 1: a jersey on. Cass Sr., known as Big Carl, had
[1:07:47] Speaker 1: this to say about Cass beef with Jimmy Butler. He said,
[1:07:49] Speaker 1: It only hurt me as a father to hear people
[1:07:51] Speaker 1: saying stuff that was negative, that wasn't true to bring
[1:07:54] Speaker 1: him down. But in the end, it all paid up.
[1:07:56] Speaker 1: Jimmy Butler ain't got no championship. Carl bypassed him. Okay,
[1:08:03] Speaker 1: you can go.
[1:08:04] Speaker 2: I'm saying that just because Jimmy tried to do the
[1:08:09] Speaker 2: same thing by going to the Warriors. And he actually
[1:08:11] Speaker 2: said he is number two or a role player for
[1:08:16] Speaker 2: the Warriors or something like that along those lines. His
[1:08:18] Speaker 2: Kirby team let Kirby do all that. And Towns played
[1:08:23] Speaker 2: a big part in this New York run. And you're
[1:08:27] Speaker 2: talking about giving him, what, two-something?
[1:08:30] Speaker 1: Looking for an extension. Making more than everybody on the team.
[1:08:34] Speaker 1: Currently the highest-paid player on the New York Knicks. Trade him,
[1:08:36] Speaker 1: calling him soft and all that.
[1:08:38] Speaker 2: And as a dad, I would fight back for my
[1:08:41] Speaker 2: son because you hate to see your kids just.
[1:08:44] Speaker 1: Being talked about in a negative light anyway. So.
[1:08:48] Speaker 2: I got to give Towns his respect, you know, through
[1:08:51] Speaker 2: all the.
[1:08:53] Speaker 1: Stuff I say. I thought it was a three. You
[1:08:58] Speaker 1: cast Pop Tigger Fence with your I thought it was
[1:09:00] Speaker 1: a three comment. Yes.
[1:09:01] Speaker 2: I thought it was a three. You know, he was
[1:09:04] Speaker 2: mad at me. I got to give him his due.
[1:09:07] Speaker 2: You know, he might get a statue in New York
[1:09:11] Speaker 2: one day, you know. Carl Anthony Towns, statue in New York.
[1:09:15] Speaker 2: I told him to get everybody on that starting five
[1:09:17] Speaker 2: down there, a statue.
[1:09:18] Speaker 1: So Gilbert Jay. Gil Jr. Let's move on. What was
[1:09:24] Speaker 1: the question again? Is Cat's dad spending their trip and
[1:09:27] Speaker 1: saying Cat has bypassed Jimmy Butler by winning a chip?
[1:09:31] Speaker 1: Bypassed or passed? Bypassed him as in what exactly? As
[1:09:36] Speaker 1: in NBA career? That is a question for a big car.
[1:09:40] Speaker 1: Like if they both stopped right now, who would be
[1:09:42] Speaker 1: in front of the other? As a winner, however you
[1:09:45] Speaker 1: want to frame it. No, no, no. You got to
[1:09:46] Speaker 1: phrase it a certain way. There's only one.
[1:09:47] Speaker 2: Remember he went to the T-Wheels and To call everybody
[1:09:51] Speaker 2: ass and soft.
[1:09:52] Speaker 3: No, what I'm saying is, like, if we had to, like,
[1:09:55] Speaker 3: there's going to be, like, this poll ranking, and it's
[1:09:58] Speaker 3: on you as a player and your career.
[1:10:04] Speaker 2: Take that jersey off. If you say something, take the
[1:10:07] Speaker 2: jersey off. I know you're going to say Jamie just
[1:10:11] Speaker 2: because you got to fight against the championship shit.
[1:10:13] Speaker 1: No, I don't want to fight against the championship shit.
[1:10:15] Speaker 1: We champions. I'm just saying. We are champions. You are
[1:10:20] Speaker 1: a New York Townsend. Okay. I'm done fighting big men.
[1:10:23] Speaker 1: You know what I mean? I just like every big
[1:10:25] Speaker 1: man around the country want to rip my ass for
[1:10:26] Speaker 1: some reason.
[1:10:27] Speaker 2: But don't the Irish 20 and 10, though?
[1:10:29] Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah. If their careers ended right now, today,
[1:10:40] Speaker 1: Pops would just be, he would be a little off
[1:10:43] Speaker 1: on timing. Maybe a couple more years.
[1:10:46] Speaker 2: You think so?
[1:10:47] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[1:10:48] Speaker 2: How many all-stars Jimmy got?
[1:10:50] Speaker 1: Six.
[1:10:51] Speaker 2: How many towns got?
[1:10:52] Speaker 1: Six.
[1:10:53] Speaker 2: And a chip. All-stars and a chip.
[1:10:55] Speaker 3: Jimmy has five all-NBAs and five-time all-defensive team.
[1:11:00] Speaker 1: Damn. And a steals champ.
[1:11:03] Speaker 2: But who averaged more? They have about the same amount
[1:11:07] Speaker 2: of points. But rebounds matter, too.
[1:11:09] Speaker 1: Jimmy averaged 20 on his career? Let me see. 18. 18?
[1:11:15] Speaker 1: Read it on.
[1:11:16] Speaker 3: When you're talking about, when they're talking about, like... 18-5-4.
[1:11:19] Speaker 3: When they're talking about your accolades.
[1:11:21] Speaker 1: 18-5-4?
[1:11:21] Speaker 3: Your accolades, you're talking about, like, making an All-NBA on
[1:11:24] Speaker 3: both sides of the game.
[1:11:25] Speaker 1: Cat 23-11-3. Man, fuck. Come on, man. 23-11? Six All-Stars.
[1:11:28] Speaker 2: 18-6.
[1:11:28] Speaker 1: Come on. It's not the points per game. What does
[1:11:30] Speaker 1: All-NBA mean? Top 15, right?
[1:11:46] Speaker 3: So Jimmy Butler in his position is top three. He's
[1:11:49] Speaker 3: done that five times. And then on a defensive end,
[1:11:52] Speaker 3: he's on that list five times. So he's on both
[1:11:56] Speaker 3: sides as a top player. I'm trying to tell you.
[1:12:00] Speaker 2: Where he would go. 23-11 champion, yes.
[1:12:05] Speaker 1: Second option champion.
[1:12:07] Speaker 2: It still was a dub. He still has a dub
[1:12:09] Speaker 2: as a second album.
[1:12:10] Speaker 1: Hey, man, I don't make the fucking rules. I'm just
[1:12:12] Speaker 1: letting you know. Gil, you actually do. You are the
[1:12:14] Speaker 1: media now.
[1:12:14] Speaker 2: Is Jimmy a one?
[1:12:15] Speaker 1: You're the media now, Gil. Is Jimmy a one? You
[1:12:17] Speaker 1: get to make the rules.
[1:12:18] Speaker 2: Is Jimmy a one?
[1:12:19] Speaker 1: Jimmy took a team to the finals. But was he
[1:12:22] Speaker 1: that year considered a one? Oh, I'm sorry. And he
[1:12:25] Speaker 1: has the Eastern Conference Finals MVP.
[1:12:27] Speaker 2: Was he considered a one still, though?
[1:12:29] Speaker 1: Yes.
[1:12:30] Speaker 2: No, Jimmy going to nobody's team.
[1:12:31] Speaker 1: When he took the team to the finals, it was
[1:12:33] Speaker 1: the first option. And he has a most in two awards.
[1:12:36] Speaker 1: Two teams to the finals.
[1:12:37] Speaker 2: In a position, Tal's been a higher, ranked higher in
[1:12:41] Speaker 2: his position than Jimmy in his position.
[1:12:43] Speaker 1: It can't be because one is five times all NBA.
[1:12:47] Speaker 2: All right.
[1:12:48] Speaker 1: Okay. Can't three times. What position he play? Butler, Jimmy.
[1:12:52] Speaker 2: Is it three or two? If he play a three,
[1:12:56] Speaker 2: he got a couple people in front of him.
[1:12:58] Speaker 1: Two. Two. No.
[1:13:00] Speaker 3: If he's playing a three, if I make 13, there's
[1:13:04] Speaker 3: only two people.
[1:13:05] Speaker 1: In front of me. I'm just saying. Who would you
[1:13:08] Speaker 1: say is in front of him?
[1:13:09] Speaker 2: Of course the two. KD, then you got Kawhi.
[1:13:12] Speaker 1: That was it. Would you throw LeBron in? At the
[1:13:15] Speaker 1: time when he's making his list, it was only two.
[1:13:18] Speaker 1: It was just them. LeBron, KD, Kawhi. LeBron was playing
[1:13:21] Speaker 1: the shooting guard, point guard, playing the center, playing the
[1:13:23] Speaker 1: power forward. Paul George in there? Brother. Come on, man. Stop, man. Brother,
[1:13:26] Speaker 1: we can only go on an award. We can only
[1:13:29] Speaker 1: go with the award, what the award says. I know,
[1:13:31] Speaker 1: and we can go with 23 and 11 in the ring.
[1:13:33] Speaker 1: I get it. So when that award, when we put
[1:13:35] Speaker 1: our accolades, one says we both got six. He has
[1:13:38] Speaker 1: three All-NBAs. I got five.
[1:13:40] Speaker 3: I got a skills champ. I got an Eastern Conference
[1:13:43] Speaker 3: Finals MVP. I made the All-Defense team five times.
[1:13:46] Speaker 1: You have a West Waggie? I got a chip. A championship.
[1:13:49] Speaker 2: And 23 and 11.
[1:13:50] Speaker 1: So your answer is he passed, Jimmy? Mm-hmm. Did he
[1:13:54] Speaker 1: bypass Jimmy, brother? What you got, Gil? Not yet.
[1:13:58] Speaker 3: Like, if this started right now, the voters are having
[1:14:01] Speaker 3: Jimmy in front of them. His body of work has
[1:14:03] Speaker 3: just been better right now.
[1:14:04] Speaker 1: Hell no. Like, but remember, Cat is only, what, 32?
[1:14:07] Speaker 1: How old is Jimmy? 37. That's what I said. Just
[1:14:12] Speaker 1: a tad bit too early. Cat plays. By the time
[1:14:15] Speaker 1: Cat gets to 37, yes, at the same trajectory, yes.
[1:14:18] Speaker 1: Cat 30 will be 31 in November. Yeah.
[1:14:19] Speaker 3: Like, it just ain't been in the league as long. But, yes,
[1:14:23] Speaker 3: when he finishes his career, he will be in front
[1:14:26] Speaker 3: of Jimmy.
[1:14:27] Speaker 2: He's already in front.
[1:14:28] Speaker 1: Just don't use the championship. I think it's crazy. Seven
[1:14:30] Speaker 1: or eight. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Seven, eight. Just don't use that.
[1:14:35] Speaker 1: because y'all going to automatically have them double-double. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[1:14:39] Speaker 1: That's why there ain't no correlate. But do you understand
[1:14:43] Speaker 1: where Cass Pops is coming from, all the slander? I
[1:14:45] Speaker 1: understand where it's Pops from. He said with eight seconds
[1:14:49] Speaker 1: left to go in the finals when he knew it
[1:14:50] Speaker 1: was real, he was shedding tears and thinking about all
[1:14:53] Speaker 1: the haters and critics. Yeah. All the shit.
[1:14:56] Speaker 2: Down there killed my son's career, though.
[1:14:58] Speaker 1: People saying, yeah. Yes, that day. People saying he was
[1:15:01] Speaker 1: built like a WNBA player.
[1:15:02] Speaker 2: And they traded Wiggins that same year. And he was
[1:15:06] Speaker 2: never a one after that, Towns.
[1:15:10] Speaker 3: But, again, that's just an organization that, wait, he's only 30?
[1:15:17] Speaker 1: Only 30. 31 in November. I didn't know that. Hmm.
[1:15:25] Speaker 1: I mean, I'm still trying to figure out.
[1:15:31] Speaker 3: Why they would have traded him in the first place.
[1:15:34] Speaker 1: They say he's soft. Remember? I said he was soft
[1:15:36] Speaker 1: or something like that. They wanted toughness. That's why they
[1:15:39] Speaker 1: brought in Julius Ramsey. So Cat, I believe, entering his
[1:15:42] Speaker 1: 12th season. Jimmy Butler entering his 16th season. It's just
[1:15:46] Speaker 1: the age.
[1:15:47] Speaker 3: You know, you got seven more years, so you got
[1:15:49] Speaker 3: a little bit more accolades on him. But by the
[1:15:50] Speaker 3: time Cat is done playing... He plays another... He'll finish.
[1:15:54] Speaker 1: But calling him a loser, saying he didn't impact winning basketball,
[1:15:57] Speaker 1: I mean, it was more than just... Nah, I got
[1:16:00] Speaker 1: a chip. In New York, making cameos on Saturday Night
[1:16:04] Speaker 1: Live with Jalen Brunson. He didn't impact winning basketball? That
[1:16:09] Speaker 1: was what the commentary was around, okay? He's not a winner.
[1:16:11] Speaker 1: Jimmy Butler called him a loser. Yeah, called him a loser.
[1:16:15] Speaker 1: A loser hurt.
[1:16:16] Speaker 2: I don't care what you say.
[1:16:17] Speaker 1: That word, loser, hurt. Yeah. What was his best team?
[1:16:27] Speaker 1: The one with Jimmy? I think they were third in
[1:16:30] Speaker 1: the West. That's what I'm saying. But, like I said,
[1:16:35] Speaker 1: it's two different positions. That's why it hurt. But that's
[1:16:38] Speaker 1: why it hurt. Now I see. His best team before
[1:16:42] Speaker 1: the Knicks was with Jimmy.
[1:16:43] Speaker 3: Yeah, so if I'm here losing and you come over
[1:16:47] Speaker 3: here and you have this winning spirit and we win
[1:16:49] Speaker 3: and then you call me a loser after you leave,
[1:16:52] Speaker 3: you're basically telling everybody like there's something.
[1:16:54] Speaker 1: Under the hood here. Yeah, that's what I'm saying, man.
[1:16:58] Speaker 1: Let me pull it up.
[1:16:59] Speaker 2: That was a good thing. But that year, the West
[1:17:01] Speaker 2: was crazy.
[1:17:02] Speaker 1: Man, first three years, 82 all game, 82 every year. Yeah,
[1:17:05] Speaker 1: that was. That's what made the playing start, right? So
[1:17:09] Speaker 1: that 2017-18 season, they were 47-35. And they was tied
[1:17:16] Speaker 1: with somebody, right? Finished, I believe, fourth or eighth in
[1:17:19] Speaker 1: the league. Yeah, eighth.
[1:17:20] Speaker 2: So that's what made the plans.
[1:17:22] Speaker 1: Hold on. The Timberwolves? Yeah, that's what made the plans.
[1:17:24] Speaker 1: But Jimmy got hurt. Yeah. Before Jimmy got hurt that year,
[1:17:29] Speaker 1: they were third in the West.
[1:17:30] Speaker 2: Okay.
[1:17:31] Speaker 1: Jimmy got hurt and then they dropped. But then 18, 19,
[1:17:33] Speaker 1: after Jimmy dipped, they were 36 and 46, so I
[1:17:35] Speaker 1: can understand, and then proceeded to.
[1:17:37] Speaker 2: Be asked the next two years after that.
[1:17:40] Speaker 1: Were able to obviously acquire.
[1:17:42] Speaker 4: Oh, but nah, he went to the conference finals. Yeah,
[1:17:45] Speaker 4: you can't say that. That was his best team besides Jimmy.
[1:17:50] Speaker 4: But then he got traded the next year.
[1:17:53] Speaker 1: Yeah. I don't understand.
[1:17:56] Speaker 3: He's only $ 30.
[1:17:59] Speaker 1: Who did they lose to? I'm still stuck at 30.
[1:18:01] Speaker 1: Who did they lose to? Dallas? In their conference? Dallas. Yeah, Dallas. Oh,
[1:18:07] Speaker 1: and he didn't really.
[1:18:08] Speaker 2: He didn't play that well.
[1:18:11] Speaker 1: I remember that. Yeah. He didn't play that well. Yeah,
[1:18:15] Speaker 1: he was stuck in that West. Oh, yeah. I mean, oh. Oh,
[1:18:23] Speaker 1: he didn't make all NBAs because... And all stars because
[1:18:27] Speaker 1: it hurt. Yeah, I mean, he had the year average
[1:18:30] Speaker 1: of 27, but only played 30-something games. Yeah, it's just injury.
[1:18:33] Speaker 1: Every time he was actually healthy, he made the All-Star Game.
[1:18:35] Speaker 2: Yeah, because it was, at one point, we can be
[1:18:39] Speaker 2: him and Joker, yeah.
[1:18:42] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[1:18:44] Speaker 3: Yeah, so he's going to finish with 10.
[1:18:47] Speaker 1: All-Stars, probably about six All-NBAs. Huh?
[1:18:51] Speaker 2: Who?
[1:18:51] Speaker 1: Towns. He play against me? Yeah. Yeah.
[1:18:54] Speaker 2: I'm talking about, like, sack days.
[1:18:57] Speaker 1: No, no, he didn't come in. Oh, he didn't? No.
[1:19:00] Speaker 1: He came in the league 2015-16. Oh, shit. Number one
[1:19:02] Speaker 1: overall pick, so. Yeah, he didn't leave that long? Mm-hmm.
[1:19:07] Speaker 1: He'll finish better. I mean, he'll finish. I'll ask you this.
[1:19:11] Speaker 1: Does Jimmy Butler deserve more credit for taking the hit
[1:19:14] Speaker 1: to the finals twice as the first option that Cat
[1:19:16] Speaker 1: does for winning the ring? Absolutely. Think about it. Does
[1:19:23] Speaker 1: he deserve more credit? Yeah. Yeah. And it wasn't like
[1:19:27] Speaker 1: they were a top team in the East when he
[1:19:29] Speaker 1: did it. They do it as, I believe, an eighth seed. Yeah.
[1:19:33] Speaker 1: Both years were like stunning the Bucs. I don't know.
[1:19:40] Speaker 1: You don't get credit for taking a bite, do you? No, no, no, no, no, no.
[1:19:44] Speaker 1: They get credit. They get more credit than towns. That's
[1:19:47] Speaker 1: what it is. So you don't get as much credit
[1:19:50] Speaker 1: as being the first option taking the team to the
[1:19:52] Speaker 1: finals than the guys. Sorry, Team 2. A role player
[1:19:56] Speaker 1: and wins the championship. Took a fifth seed to the finals,
[1:19:58] Speaker 1: fifth seed in the East of the finals in the
[1:20:00] Speaker 1: COVID year. Eighth seed to the finals, 22-23. The hardest championship.
[1:20:08] Speaker 1: You know what's so funny?
[1:20:09] Speaker 3: They both did something that wasn't expected.
[1:20:14] Speaker 2: Yeah, you trade me and you win too.
[1:20:16] Speaker 1: Nobody expected Miami to be in the chip those two years.
[1:20:20] Speaker 1: So he don't get enough credit for those. I remember
[1:20:25] Speaker 1: when people was talking about Miami might win.
[1:20:27] Speaker 3: I'm like, nigga, that's an AAU team. You remember I
[1:20:29] Speaker 3: said that's an AAU team. They're going to get swept. NBA,
[1:20:33] Speaker 3: they're going to probably give them one. It's going to
[1:20:34] Speaker 3: be a gentleman's sweep. That's how bad they are, right?
[1:20:38] Speaker 1: Same thing with Miami against Lakers. That's it. You ain't
[1:20:43] Speaker 1: got no chance of winning. This is irrelevant. Y'all are
[1:20:46] Speaker 1: just there. Y'all are the OKC of LeBron's first championship.
[1:20:50] Speaker 2: You got to give them credit.
[1:20:50] Speaker 1: Y'all just there, right? Now, Cat, you get traded to
[1:20:57] Speaker 1: New York. Mm-hmm.
[1:20:59] Speaker 3: They didn't really want you there. They thought you was
[1:21:03] Speaker 3: too soft when you got there. And then they were
[1:21:06] Speaker 3: trying to do that whole Giannis getting traded there.
[1:21:09] Speaker 1: Your name was getting traded. And you had to really, like,
[1:21:15] Speaker 1: suck in your pride to fit in to win a
[1:21:19] Speaker 1: championship no one even phantom starting that season off with. Right? So.
[1:21:26] Speaker 3: The fact that the championship was won because.
[1:21:29] Speaker 1: You sacrificed, right? Like, Brunson gets his credit, right?
[1:21:33] Speaker 3: Because you need a lead horse, but you also need
[1:21:37] Speaker 3: someone to sacrifice to make it all work. So that's
[1:21:42] Speaker 3: a big step because a lot of people, a lot
[1:21:44] Speaker 3: of guys can't do it and the team's greatness gets
[1:21:47] Speaker 3: broken up because of it.
[1:21:48] Speaker 1: But first season with the Knicks... Average 24 and 13.
[1:21:50] Speaker 1: They go to the conference finals, lose their paces. And
[1:21:54] Speaker 1: he did what? He took a backseat. Average 20 and
[1:21:58] Speaker 1: 12 the next season, this past season, in the regular season.
[1:22:01] Speaker 1: Sacrificing the postseason as well. What was his playoff numbers
[1:22:05] Speaker 1: both years? I'm right there on it. I got you.
[1:22:11] Speaker 2: 21 and 11.
[1:22:11] Speaker 1: 21 and 12 in 2025.
[1:22:12] Speaker 3: 16 and 10.
[1:22:19] Speaker 1: For the playoffs itself, 21-12, and then last year, 16-10.
[1:22:23] Speaker 1: In the finals? Let me pull it up for you.
[1:22:27] Speaker 2: In the finals, he had some big games, though.
[1:22:30] Speaker 1: But also didn't score a lot in the fourth quarter.
[1:22:31] Speaker 1: He had some big halves. He averaged 13-11 in the finals,
[1:22:34] Speaker 1: is what I thought. In the finals, he averaged like 13. Yeah, because, yeah.
[1:22:39] Speaker 1: All in the first three quarters. He only had two
[1:22:43] Speaker 1: points in the game clincher.
[1:22:44] Speaker 6: See?
[1:22:44] Speaker 1: No, I'm not. You can't go around him no more.
[1:22:47] Speaker 1: The Towns family ain't going to have you in the house, though.
[1:22:49] Speaker 1: Who that?
[1:22:50] Speaker 2: The Towns daddy.
[1:22:51] Speaker 1: Nah. There ain't no smoke with me.
[1:22:54] Speaker 3: What's so funny is in the whole playoffs, in the
[1:22:57] Speaker 3: whole playoffs, he was only a minus one time.
[1:23:00] Speaker 1: That was the last game. Minus four. I think he
[1:23:03] Speaker 1: only had two points and rebounds in that.
[1:23:05] Speaker 2: Damn, you trying to get on the good side, ain't you?
[1:23:08] Speaker 2: I ain't never heard him bring up plus-minus.
[1:23:09] Speaker 1: Yeah, you did previously make some commentary about Kathy that
[1:23:11] Speaker 1: seems like you're trying to... That plus-minus shit is so stupid.
[1:23:14] Speaker 1: I ain't never heard him bring up plus-minus. No, no, no. Look,
[1:23:16] Speaker 1: because it's just... A stat line of goose eggs with plus-41. Like,
[1:23:21] Speaker 1: get the fuck out.
[1:23:21] Speaker 3: No, I'm just saying, because I'm looking at it, and
[1:23:23] Speaker 3: I'm like, all right, oh, damn, he only had two points?
[1:23:26] Speaker 1: Nobody noticed that.
[1:23:27] Speaker 3: Nobody noticed you had two points because, obviously, Brunson was
[1:23:30] Speaker 3: going to stink, so... I mean, damn, it's... And then
[1:23:37] Speaker 3: it was a minus four, and then you look up,
[1:23:39] Speaker 3: and like, oh, shit, that was the only minus he
[1:23:40] Speaker 3: had that whole playoff.
[1:23:41] Speaker 2: But speaking on the Jimmy situation, I think that's what
[1:23:44] Speaker 2: I was talking about with, and I hate to bring
[1:23:47] Speaker 2: that up, like the TMAC thing. I think, like, your
[1:23:49] Speaker 2: greatness is supposed to do that at least once or
[1:23:53] Speaker 2: twice out your career.
[1:23:54] Speaker 1: If you're healthy. Get you out the first round, bro.
[1:23:56] Speaker 2: Yeah, get you, like, you're supposed to be able to
[1:23:58] Speaker 2: carry yourself to that Out the first round. Your greatness should.
[1:24:03] Speaker 2: That's what I was talking about, like Jimmy did. Y'all
[1:24:06] Speaker 2: forget about Bam. Y'all talk about Miami. You think Bam
[1:24:09] Speaker 2: and my, I'm going to be number one now. So
[1:24:12] Speaker 2: you forget about Bam. He was on that team, too.
[1:24:15] Speaker 2: But Jimmy personally, like, carried the team over the hump.
[1:24:21] Speaker 2: At some point in your career, I say your greatness.
[1:24:23] Speaker 1: Is supposed to be. If you're healthy, yes, you can
[1:24:26] Speaker 1: do that. Yeah, you should.
[1:24:27] Speaker 3: If you're a healthy guy, you can't pretend someone is
[1:24:33] Speaker 3: actually healthy and playing and they failed. Like, that's just
[1:24:37] Speaker 3: like saying, oh, Zion ain't got out of the playoffs,
[1:24:39] Speaker 3: but he's hurt at the end of the season every year.
[1:24:41] Speaker 3: It ain't because he was healthy. You know what I mean?
[1:24:44] Speaker 1: It's like they.
[1:24:45] Speaker 3: Acting like he played all 82 games and then the
[1:24:48] Speaker 3: nigga was just trash all year and it was just.
[1:24:50] Speaker 2: How many excuses he got, though?
[1:24:51] Speaker 1: No, it's the context. Use the context.
[1:24:55] Speaker 4: Anybody can create a negative. You can find negative in
[1:24:58] Speaker 4: anything and you can create a narrative based on that.
[1:25:01] Speaker 4: That's the easiest shit to do. But once you bring
[1:25:04] Speaker 4: the context into it, it tells a whole nother story.
[1:25:06] Speaker 2: But was I hurt getting to the playoffs? Yes. That
[1:25:08] Speaker 2: I got my team in the third spot and all that?
[1:25:13] Speaker 1: Yeah. The year Lakers went to the championship.
[1:25:15] Speaker 2: But when I get there, I'm hurt because I lose
[1:25:18] Speaker 2: in the first round.
[1:25:19] Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying.
[1:25:21] Speaker 2: I played down there in 70-some games, 80 games.
[1:25:26] Speaker 1: 06, 47 games. Like, he had a bad back. Like,
[1:25:28] Speaker 1: I mean, what do you want somebody to do? And
[1:25:31] Speaker 1: same shit at the end of his career. Like, y'all mean, right?
[1:25:36] Speaker 3: Like, y'all mean I got my Kobe and I got
[1:25:38] Speaker 3: my Shaq with me, right? I got my, you know,
[1:25:40] Speaker 3: Tracy and.
[1:25:44] Speaker 1: Y'all.
[1:25:45] Speaker 2: Y'all played... If I'm hurt, I can't say stuff.
[1:25:49] Speaker 1: Y'all played 57 games, 48 games, 55 games. 77 games,
[1:25:55] Speaker 1: the nigga's done. That's the end of his career.
[1:25:57] Speaker 3: So this is my second best player that I'm counting
[1:26:00] Speaker 3: on that is a dominant.
[1:26:01] Speaker 1: Force in the league... And his foot, he's done. He's done.
[1:26:09] Speaker 1: Why do we do that, though?
[1:26:11] Speaker 4: Like, certain guys, you too talented to never make it,
[1:26:14] Speaker 4: but then the guys that we consider great, when they
[1:26:17] Speaker 4: don't make it, it's a pass.
[1:26:20] Speaker 1: That's why. Why we keep doing this shit, bro? Like,
[1:26:24] Speaker 1: it applies to everybody. Can't nobody go out on the
[1:26:27] Speaker 1: court and do it by themselves. It's impossible. I don't
[1:26:30] Speaker 1: give a fuck how good you are. You got to
[1:26:32] Speaker 1: have a team with you. It really just depends what
[1:26:34] Speaker 1: the perception is around that player. Yeah. And that's exactly
[1:26:37] Speaker 1: what it is. Some players get passes. Some players are expected.
[1:26:41] Speaker 1: Jokic won the ring in what? Last year was 23? Mm-hmm.
[1:26:45] Speaker 4: He hasn't been passed a second round since. Ain't nobody saying, oh,
[1:26:50] Speaker 4: but he's so great. Maybe his team ain't where it
[1:26:53] Speaker 4: was the last year they won it.
[1:26:55] Speaker 3: It's the same thing. And it ain't because of him.
[1:26:58] Speaker 3: We are watching Jokic. We're watching Giannis. We're watching the owners.
[1:27:06] Speaker 3: Move wrong pieces around.
[1:27:08] Speaker 1: But it's the star player's fault because he's too good. Like, stop, bro. Stop.
[1:27:14] Speaker 4: It's five players on the floor. You need five. You
[1:27:17] Speaker 4: need a bench. You need a good coach. You need
[1:27:19] Speaker 4: a good GM. You need an owner that's bought in.
[1:27:23] Speaker 4: You need all of these things in place to get
[1:27:26] Speaker 4: to the promised land. But the moment Tracy McGrady can't
[1:27:30] Speaker 4: get past the first, oh, he ain't good.
[1:27:34] Speaker 1: Like, what? You know the one thing that I, it's
[1:27:37] Speaker 1: like it has this horrible stain on it where they say, right,
[1:27:44] Speaker 1: he just don't care. He didn't play hard enough. The
[1:27:47] Speaker 1: person averaged 33. You know how hard that seems?
[1:27:51] Speaker 3: You know what type of workout and summer programs these
[1:27:55] Speaker 3: people got to go through.
[1:27:56] Speaker 1: Conditioning. What did Curry, what did Curry's year?
[1:28:01] Speaker 3: What year did they make that? Because if we use him,
[1:28:05] Speaker 3: because everyone watched him.
[1:28:06] Speaker 1: Right. What year was it when he averaged 30? Is
[1:28:10] Speaker 1: it comeback player of the year? But they didn't make
[1:28:14] Speaker 1: the playoffs. What year was that?
[1:28:15] Speaker 2: 23, 24?
[1:28:15] Speaker 1: That was after they lost. No, that's 19 or 20
[1:28:17] Speaker 1: or something like that. 23, 24, comeback player of the year, right?
[1:28:20] Speaker 2: He averaged 26, right?
[1:28:20] Speaker 1: Team sucked. Ooh. Right, the 23-24 season, right? No, I
[1:28:33] Speaker 1: thought that was after Clay got hurt. No, a comeback
[1:28:35] Speaker 1: player of the year was 22-23. Okay, then. They won
[1:28:36] Speaker 1: in 23. won in 23. No, 23-24. Oh, wait, he
[1:28:42] Speaker 1: finished ninth. My bad. Well, CPO-wise, right? 23-24, you're right. Right? So, yeah, 23-24,
[1:28:47] Speaker 1: they didn't make the playoffs. Average 26. Right? Average 26.
[1:28:52] Speaker 1: We watched how hard that was for him. Losing year, right?
[1:28:56] Speaker 1: You know why? Because everybody around him hurt. They're not there.
[1:28:59] Speaker 1: The team sucks. He has to do everything.
[1:29:03] Speaker 2: Exactly.
[1:29:03] Speaker 1: They still finished 46th and 36th. A star player on
[1:29:05] Speaker 1: a team And they're this good. You're talking about all NBA.
[1:29:11] Speaker 1: That means top in the position. You're talking about a
[1:29:12] Speaker 1: top five in his position all the time. Like, so
[1:29:15] Speaker 1: when you're saying, oh, he didn't do enough. Like, I
[1:29:18] Speaker 1: didn't do enough.
[1:29:20] Speaker 3: Like, when I finally had the team that was going
[1:29:23] Speaker 3: to be there, we all got hurt.
[1:29:26] Speaker 1: Right?
[1:29:27] Speaker 3: Lakers went to the championship. We took them to game seven.
[1:29:30] Speaker 3: We didn't have me nor y'all. The one and the
[1:29:34] Speaker 3: two option is going off this series. They take a
[1:29:37] Speaker 3: team to game seven.
[1:29:39] Speaker 1: Right?
[1:29:40] Speaker 3: I mean, you know, so when they had the team
[1:29:41] Speaker 3: to let's do this, it just got hurt. When Kobe
[1:29:44] Speaker 3: had the dynasty team, when everybody's like, oh, yeah, they're
[1:29:48] Speaker 3: about to sweep.
[1:29:49] Speaker 1: Calm along. Nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah. The
[1:29:52] Speaker 1: other one. When Dwight came and Steve Nash, what happened?
[1:29:58] Speaker 1: Same thing that happened with Gary. Got hurt. Calm along.
[1:30:02] Speaker 1: Dwight can't play. He's hurt. Steve Nash is hurt. They
[1:30:06] Speaker 1: can't play. That team wasn't going to win.
[1:30:09] Speaker 3: Was Steve Nash and Dwight?
[1:30:12] Speaker 1: He was healthy though. No, he wasn't. He played, but
[1:30:16] Speaker 1: he wasn't healthy. He just got off the back surgery.
[1:30:18] Speaker 3: He could move up and down like that, but what
[1:30:20] Speaker 3: I'm saying is what stopped that team is he got hurt.
[1:30:24] Speaker 3: You can't fault that team and say, oh, on paper,
[1:30:28] Speaker 3: this is the.
[1:30:28] Speaker 1: Team you had. Like, no, no, no. You got to
[1:30:30] Speaker 1: go look. They was hurt. Context.
[1:30:34] Speaker 2: But at the end of the day, you can't say stuff, too.
[1:30:38] Speaker 1: Why can't he? I know what you're about to say.
[1:30:41] Speaker 2: Oh, finally about to get out to the first round.
[1:30:43] Speaker 2: I'm not hurt then. You make Tayshaun Prince a Hall
[1:30:47] Speaker 2: of Famer.
[1:30:47] Speaker 1: I'm not hurt then.
[1:30:48] Speaker 2: Like, nobody knows who Tayshaun Prince is when he's a
[1:30:50] Speaker 2: Hall of Famer now.
[1:30:51] Speaker 1: But what I'm saying is I'm not hurt. Tayshaun, he
[1:30:52] Speaker 1: was a part of a great team. Well-respected. I'm not
[1:30:55] Speaker 1: hurt at that moment in time.
[1:30:56] Speaker 2: Tons of girls get 42 on you, 47. He was
[1:30:59] Speaker 2: a part of a great team.
[1:31:01] Speaker 1: I'm just saying. If I'm hurt. But I'm not hurt then.
[1:31:05] Speaker 1: But what I'm saying is I'm not hurt.
[1:31:07] Speaker 3: When I'm making those statements, nigga, what am I averaging
[1:31:09] Speaker 3: in this series?
[1:31:10] Speaker 1: 31. There's great defensive team that can't stop me. So
[1:31:13] Speaker 1: I get hurt after I say it. You got... Yes.
[1:31:16] Speaker 2: Let's just move around.
[1:31:21] Speaker 1: Bro, you're talking about the series that Detroit versus what's
[1:31:25] Speaker 1: the name, right? He played all seven games.
[1:31:27] Speaker 3: He had 43. Remember, they were the eighth seed. Report,
[1:31:32] Speaker 3: they're going to get swept. 43-7, 46-5, 29-7, 27-4, 9, 19-8, 37-11,
[1:31:35] Speaker 3: and then 21-6. Yeah, the game we're in, man. That's
[1:31:39] Speaker 3: when Tayshaun first came in.
[1:31:41] Speaker 1: Yeah, keep going. No, no, no, 27-9 assists. Oh, I
[1:31:43] Speaker 1: thought you said nine. I'm like, what? And nine assists. Right?
[1:31:45] Speaker 1: Now his team, you got a young Drew Gooden, second year.
[1:32:02] Speaker 1: Jacques Vaughn. The legend. Gordon.
[1:32:04] Speaker 3: Three players on this team.
[1:32:09] Speaker 2: Nobody was saying Tayshaun Prince and all of them was good.
[1:32:13] Speaker 1: Stop.
[1:32:13] Speaker 2: Let's just stop.
[1:32:14] Speaker 1: Brother, they were the.
[1:32:15] Speaker 2: By the time Chauncey Bullock got there, he was already
[1:32:18] Speaker 2: traded from four different teams.
[1:32:19] Speaker 1: Who? Bro. Richard Hamilton.
[1:32:22] Speaker 2: Tayshaun Prince was young. He was two years in, too.
[1:32:26] Speaker 1: If one is an eighth seed, what seed do you
[1:32:29] Speaker 1: think the other one is?
[1:32:30] Speaker 3: A one seed, correct? One is an eighth seed, one
[1:32:34] Speaker 3: is a one seed.
[1:32:34] Speaker 1: Sounds like they handled their business. They did what a
[1:32:37] Speaker 1: one seed is supposed to do. It was no different
[1:32:40] Speaker 1: like Orlando.
[1:32:40] Speaker 4: It still didn't stop Trace McGrady from being great.
[1:32:44] Speaker 1: He still went and dropped multiple 40s on them. That's
[1:32:48] Speaker 1: the point I'm making.
[1:32:49] Speaker 4: Context matters and the team matters.
[1:32:53] Speaker 3: Now let me tell you what this eighth seed, the
[1:32:55] Speaker 3: rest of the team looked like.
[1:32:58] Speaker 1: Starting point guard. Two shots. No, no, no. So you
[1:33:01] Speaker 1: can understand.
[1:33:02] Speaker 3: So we can see how hard this game could have
[1:33:04] Speaker 3: been for a man like him. Starting point guard took
[1:33:07] Speaker 3: two shots that game. Starting shooting guard took two shots
[1:33:10] Speaker 3: that game. The jock Vaughn took three shots that game.
[1:33:14] Speaker 3: The starting five took a total of six shots or
[1:33:17] Speaker 3: six threes.
[1:33:18] Speaker 1: Tracy McGrady took all six of those threes.
[1:33:21] Speaker 3: He was three for six. They had a total of
[1:33:23] Speaker 3: five threes. That means somebody on the bench. Two people
[1:33:27] Speaker 3: on the bench.
[1:33:28] Speaker 1: Can I read off?
[1:33:29] Speaker 2: I hate this.
[1:33:30] Speaker 1: No, no, no.
[1:33:30] Speaker 3: So you can read off. Now, can I ask you something?
[1:33:33] Speaker 3: I don't know what you mean.
[1:33:34] Speaker 1: If three of my players on this team, three players
[1:33:36] Speaker 1: on the team take a total. What was the second
[1:33:37] Speaker 1: highest average? In the series. It would have probably been
[1:33:41] Speaker 1: Drew Gooden. Which was what? It was the only two
[1:33:43] Speaker 1: people that had double digits. He had 18 points. This
[1:33:45] Speaker 1: was the first game.
[1:33:46] Speaker 2: He had 18. All right, now can I give another example?
[1:33:49] Speaker 1: The rest of my team is 2-4, 2-2, 5-4. Like,
[1:33:51] Speaker 1: come on.
[1:33:53] Speaker 2: Can I get another example?
[1:33:54] Speaker 1: It was the eighth seed.
[1:33:56] Speaker 2: Who did LeBron have on his team? When he whipped
[1:33:59] Speaker 2: y'all ass. And it was you, Karan, and everybody else.
[1:34:02] Speaker 2: You had three people averaging 20. You had LeBron. You
[1:34:06] Speaker 2: had Damon Jones.
[1:34:07] Speaker 1: Y'all lost two games. Damon Jones didn't play.
[1:34:08] Speaker 2: You had Boobie Gibson.
[1:34:10] Speaker 1: Drew Gooden.
[1:34:11] Speaker 3: See, now, now, if you're going to talk facts, if
[1:34:13] Speaker 3: you're going to talk facts, don't just make up.
[1:34:15] Speaker 2: No, I'm just saying, who was on the team? Who
[1:34:18] Speaker 2: was on the team? Would you consider you, Karan Butler,
[1:34:23] Speaker 2: Antoine Jamerson better than everybody besides LeBron on that team?
[1:34:26] Speaker 1: Hell yeah.
[1:34:27] Speaker 2: All right, then. That's what I'm talking about.
[1:34:29] Speaker 1: We wasn't on each team. But look at LeBron. It
[1:34:31] Speaker 1: was a 4-5. We was a 4-5 seed. It's a
[1:34:32] Speaker 1: 4-5 seed. That's a matchup. But the same type of team.
[1:34:36] Speaker 1: You're overlooking the context again. No, I'm not. 4-5. 4-5.
[1:34:39] Speaker 1: Cleveland won first. First of all, they won 50 games
[1:34:41] Speaker 1: that year. Look at, name they team. 50 games. Just
[1:35:00] Speaker 1: name they team.
[1:35:01] Speaker 2: Then name AI team after that. If you're going to
[1:35:05] Speaker 2: bring up teams, you want to throw everybody else on
[1:35:07] Speaker 2: his team under the bus. Name they team.
[1:35:09] Speaker 1: 50 games, bro.
[1:35:10] Speaker 2: Who was on his second.
[1:35:11] Speaker 1: Outfit with Boobie Gibson? They won 50 games.
[1:35:13] Speaker 2: Who?
[1:35:13] Speaker 1: LeBron. When they beat us? That's when they went to
[1:35:16] Speaker 1: the Spurs.
[1:35:17] Speaker 2: They played the Spurs. And the championship.
[1:35:20] Speaker 1: When they beat us, it was like Larry Hughes would
[1:35:22] Speaker 1: have been there. I'm off your damn bench. I know.
[1:35:25] Speaker 1: Larry Hughes and Gauskis was an all-star. Come on, man. Stop.
[1:35:29] Speaker 1: So now, what you going to say about the Gauskis?
[1:35:33] Speaker 2: I better stop. He was good, but he was old then.
[1:35:35] Speaker 2: Come on, stop.
[1:35:36] Speaker 1: He was an all-star when LeBron was there. Not when
[1:35:39] Speaker 1: they went to the finals. Man, stop. Please. When did
[1:35:41] Speaker 1: they go to the finals? 07. I was hurt. That's
[1:35:43] Speaker 1: not my year. They swept you guys. You didn't play
[1:35:50] Speaker 1: that year? No, I didn't play that year.
[1:35:51] Speaker 2: Well, I know they beat y'all a couple times. I
[1:35:54] Speaker 2: wasn't there that year. That was the year before.
[1:35:57] Speaker 1: And that was the first time he got in in
[1:35:58] Speaker 1: three games.
[1:36:00] Speaker 2: That's what I'm saying.
[1:36:02] Speaker 1: He had one moment. You were not there? I know
[1:36:04] Speaker 1: I wasn't there. You did not play?
[1:36:06] Speaker 2: The first year then. Then you played. But what's on
[1:36:12] Speaker 2: that team though? I just told you the team.
[1:36:16] Speaker 1: Hold on. Let's pull it up. So every great player
[1:36:18] Speaker 1: is supposed to make playoffs.
[1:36:20] Speaker 2: No. They're great and they're supposed to show at least
[1:36:24] Speaker 2: once or get them out the first round.
[1:36:27] Speaker 1: And if not, they're not great in your eyes? Is
[1:36:30] Speaker 1: that what you're saying? That's what the nigga's saying. I
[1:36:34] Speaker 1: need you to answer this.
[1:36:35] Speaker 2: I'm not talking about injuries.
[1:36:37] Speaker 1: I'm not either.
[1:36:37] Speaker 4: I'm talking about the great players if they don't individually
[1:36:42] Speaker 4: carry their team because of their individual talent.
[1:36:45] Speaker 2: That'd be put up in that statue?
[1:36:46] Speaker 1: Yes.
[1:36:48] Speaker 4: So is it a year-by-year thing or this is just
[1:36:51] Speaker 4: a stamp thing?
[1:36:51] Speaker 1: You had you, Anton Jamison, and Ron Butler. Do you
[1:36:54] Speaker 1: think Steph is great? The 2005-06 season. Yeah, that's what
[1:36:58] Speaker 1: I said. All averaging damn near 20. You averaged 34
[1:37:01] Speaker 1: in that series against Steph. Do you know what LeBron
[1:37:03] Speaker 1: averaged in that series? Do you think Jokic is great? 36.
[1:37:07] Speaker 1: He's missed the playoffs.
[1:37:08] Speaker 4: Do you think Giannis is great? Do you think Giannis
[1:37:10] Speaker 4: is great? Do you think Giannis is great? He's missed
[1:37:14] Speaker 4: the playoffs. But their greatness showed that they got there.
[1:37:18] Speaker 4: That's what I'm saying.
[1:37:19] Speaker 2: At some point in your career, your greatness is supposed
[1:37:21] Speaker 2: to get you over the top. I'm not saying you're
[1:37:23] Speaker 2: supposed to be great every year. You're not going to
[1:37:25] Speaker 2: win every year. But at some point, you're.
[1:37:27] Speaker 1: Supposed to get over it. The years they did win,
[1:37:28] Speaker 1: they had great teammates. So why didn't they win? Great teams. No,
[1:37:34] Speaker 1: what I'm saying is Giannis has played majority of the season.
[1:37:37] Speaker 1: Jokic has played the most of the season. They didn't
[1:37:38] Speaker 1: win these championships. Why? What happened?
[1:37:41] Speaker 3: They traded off these pieces. The pieces that helped them
[1:37:43] Speaker 3: win got paid. They had to move those pieces. The
[1:37:46] Speaker 3: weapons he had before, he didn't have them no more.
[1:37:50] Speaker 2: Now I'm talking about you need other guys now.
[1:37:52] Speaker 1: You've always said that.
[1:37:54] Speaker 2: You just said. I thought we disrespected all the other people.
[1:37:57] Speaker 1: I said history does. Now I'm going back to these people.
[1:38:00] Speaker 1: We need them now. In order to win a championship,
[1:38:03] Speaker 1: you need a good team. Every team needs a good team.
[1:38:06] Speaker 1: Simple as that. It ain't never been no one-man show championship.
[1:38:11] Speaker 1: This even makes it worse.
[1:38:13] Speaker 3: Hey, the second best player Orlando that year in the
[1:38:16] Speaker 3: playoffs was Drew Gooden.
[1:38:18] Speaker 1: It was his rookie season. And what did he average? 14.
[1:38:21] Speaker 1: Come on, Swaggy. What are we talking about?
[1:38:23] Speaker 10: He was the same person on lebron team rookie season
[1:38:27] Speaker 10: rookie he's a rookie he's a rookie which means how
[1:38:33] Speaker 10: good do you think the team is if my rookie
[1:38:36] Speaker 10: is the second best player or my rookie is the
[1:38:39] Speaker 10: second person.
[1:38:40] Speaker 3: That i gotta count on I have three people that
[1:38:44] Speaker 3: can't shoot the ball on the court.
[1:38:46] Speaker 1: Oh, my God. The one, two, and the three. The one, two,
[1:38:48] Speaker 1: and the four. One, two, and the five.
[1:38:50] Speaker 3: They can't shoot a lick. They won't shoot a lick.
[1:38:53] Speaker 3: That means I'm getting quadruple teamed. I mean, third option. Nine, nine, six, four, three.
[1:39:02] Speaker 1: I see why they were supposed to get swept. They
[1:39:03] Speaker 1: took them, and I asked this question. I said, hey. Technically,
[1:39:06] Speaker 1: they weren't supposed to make the playoffs. I asked this question,
[1:39:09] Speaker 1: and they said, they said, It's changed, even though it's
[1:39:14] Speaker 1: the same outcome. I said, you know what? You're supposed
[1:39:18] Speaker 1: to get swept.
[1:39:19] Speaker 3: They took it to game seven. Why they don't get
[1:39:22] Speaker 3: credit for that? And it was like, well, they.
[1:39:25] Speaker 1: Were up 3-1. I said, yeah, but they wasn't supposed
[1:39:29] Speaker 1: to be up 3-1. They were supposed to get 0-4,
[1:39:31] Speaker 1: but they pushed it to seven games.
[1:39:33] Speaker 3: So does the context of how they lost matter? Or
[1:39:37] Speaker 3: they took it like, why don't they get credit for
[1:39:39] Speaker 3: winning three games they didn't supposed to get?
[1:39:41] Speaker 1: No, because it was up 3-1. I mean, I'm not...

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