# 175. Ex-Director of GCHQ: China, Russia, and the Threats Facing the UK (Jeremy Fleming)

An episode of [The Rest Is Politics: Leading](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1665265193), 9 Feb 2026, 1 h 10 min.

Audio: https://pdst.fm/e/traffic.megaphone.fm/GLT6776647229.mp3?updated=1770590573

Do Russia or China represent a bigger risk to UK national security? Why are we underestimating the threat posed by cybercriminals? Who holds the real power - ministers or spies? Rory and Alastair are joined by Jeremy Fleming, formerly of GCHQ and MI5, to answer all this and more. Join The Rest Is Politics Plus: Start your free trial at therestispolitics.com to unlock exclusive bonus content – including Rory and Alastair’s miniseries – plus ad-free listening, early access to episodes and live show tickets, an exclusive members’ newsletter, discounted book prices, and a private chatroom on Discord. Social Producer: Celine Charles Video Editor: Josh Smith Producer: Alice Horrell Senior Producer: Nicole Maslen Head of Politics: Tom Whiter Exec Producers: Tony Pastor + Jack Davenport Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Shows are listed from Apple Podcasts' charts and directory, and Podcast Index where it is used. Every show and episode belongs to its publisher and plays from the publisher's own feed; this site hosts none of them.