# Anthropic’s Compute Bet, Musk on AI, Apple’s New CEO

An episode of [Bloomberg Tech](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1611767434), 1 Sep 2026, 44 min.

Audio: https://podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/41764a4f-fc64-4e11-89ba-ae7c0030ab5e/fea8e7f7-f4e0-493f-9f9b-b4b801113d02/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=9caafc41-289c-4115-995d-ae7c0030ab75

Bloomberg’s Ed Ludlow breaks down Anthropic's $35 billion computing deal with Nvidia-backed cloud provider Lambda as the AI startup looks to expand its AI capacity. Plus, Elon Musk predicts AI will increase the global economy by up to 30%, and John Ternus officially takes over as Apple CEO as the company gets ready for a new product unveil next week. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:02] Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio, news.
[0:13] Speaker 2: Bloomberg Tech is live from the heart of Silicon Valley
[0:17] Speaker 2: with Ed Ludlow in San Francisco.
[0:22] Speaker 3: This is Bloomberg Tech. Coming up, Anthropic looks to expand
[0:26] Speaker 3: its AI capacity and agrees to a $ 35 billion computing
[0:29] Speaker 3: deal with NVIDIA-backed cloud provider Lambda. Plus, we hear from
[0:33] Speaker 3: Elon Musk at a G20 meeting predicting AI will increase
[0:37] Speaker 3: the global economy by up to 30%. And John Ternes
[0:41] Speaker 3: officially takes over as Apple's CEO today. This is the
[0:45] Speaker 3: company gets ready for a new product unveil next week.
[0:49] Speaker 3: There's a lot happening in financial markets, largely to do
[0:51] Speaker 3: with what's happening in the bond market, expectations for the Fed,
[0:56] Speaker 3: and a movement in oil. Technology shares in NASDAQ 100
[0:58] Speaker 3: and SOX, in this case, lower. And in a little
[1:01] Speaker 3: bit's time, we're going to get to what's happening in
[1:03] Speaker 3: global bonds with yields at 2008 levels. But first.
[1:07] Speaker 3: To our top story. Anthropic is writing another massive check
[1:11] Speaker 3: for AI compute. The Claude Maker has agreed to a
[1:14] Speaker 3: $ 35 billion cloud deal with NVIDIA-backed Lambda, according to a
[1:18] Speaker 3: Bloomberg source. It's the latest in a string of huge
[1:21] Speaker 3: infrastructure deals as Anthropic races to secure more computing power.
[1:27] Speaker 3: Joining us is Bloomberg's Sarah Fryer, who has the details.
[1:30] Speaker 3: It's kind of a squishy, unusual arrangement. What do we
[1:33] Speaker 3: need to know?
[1:34] Speaker 5: Well, the deal headline is that it's between Anthropic and Lambda.
[1:39] Speaker 5: But if you look at the details, NVIDIA is all
[1:42] Speaker 5: over this. NVIDIA is the backer of Lambda. It's the
[1:47] Speaker 5: provider of chips for Anthropic.
[1:49] Speaker 3: It is actually.
[1:50] Speaker 5: signing the lease in Texas where this is happening. So
[1:54] Speaker 5: this is one instance among many of NVIDIA facilitating demand
[1:59] Speaker 5: for its own chips by ensuring that its customers can
[2:04] Speaker 5: get the cloud computing resources they need and have the
[2:08] Speaker 5: ability to have a place to buy them and grow.
[2:14] Speaker 3: I would say NVIDIA Lambda and the developer on this deal,
[2:17] Speaker 3: didn't respond to our request for comment on the story.
[2:20] Speaker 3: But NVIDIA does say it's like a conduit between the
[2:23] Speaker 3: capacity and those that need it. $ 35 billion seems like
[2:26] Speaker 3: a lot. But actually, if you look at the news
[2:28] Speaker 3: flow of late, Anthropic's done quite a few deals at
[2:31] Speaker 3: that scale. What other places has it been securing some capacity?
[2:35] Speaker 5: It's just been an incredible tear. It's become one of
[2:37] Speaker 5: the most significant customers of cloud computing deals. We've got
[2:41] Speaker 5: recently the 45 billion N scale deal, the 50 billion
[2:45] Speaker 5: fluid stack deal, the 45 billion SpaceX deal. Anthropic is
[2:50] Speaker 5: just desperate right now for computing power to try to grow,
[2:55] Speaker 5: not just to meet this man for its customer base,
[2:58] Speaker 5: but to continue to train its models. And it feels
[3:03] Speaker 5: insatiable at this point. They're really trying to do deals
[3:07] Speaker 5: wherever they can, including through their cloud partners. And I'm
[3:14] Speaker 5: very curious when we see that Anthropic S1 drop, which
[3:17] Speaker 5: could be any day now, to see how this all
[3:20] Speaker 5: adds up. How much are they taking on here in
[3:22] Speaker 5: terms of commitments to these cloud providers, these data center deals?
[3:28] Speaker 5: And what does it do to that balance sheet?
[3:31] Speaker 3: Any day now, we expect Anthropic to publicly file for
[3:34] Speaker 3: an IPO. Bloomberg's Sarah Fry, managing editor for the big
[3:37] Speaker 3: tech team, thank you so much. Let's take a look
[3:39] Speaker 3: at today's big number, $ 218 billion. That's Mediatek's market value
[3:46] Speaker 3: after shares surged nearly 10% in Asia trading. The catalyst...
[3:50] Speaker 3: A deal first reported by Bloomberg 24 hours ago. NVIDIA
[3:54] Speaker 3: will invest $ 3. 5 billion into the Taiwanese chipmaker. Today's rally
[3:58] Speaker 3: added roughly $ 20 billion to Mediatek's market cap. Remember, we
[4:02] Speaker 3: spoke with Mediatek CEO Rick Tsai yesterday, who said that
[4:05] Speaker 3: this partnership with NVIDIA gives him reasons for optimism.
[4:10] Speaker 6: Being in Taiwan, in almost like a century of the
[4:15] Speaker 6: AI era, infrastructure ecosystem really helps. And we also work
[4:22] Speaker 6: closely with NVIDIA as our customer too.
[4:26] Speaker 7: But it's tough.
[4:27] Speaker 6: And I think I don't, I really see blue skies
[4:33] Speaker 6: in the future.
[4:37] Speaker 3: Okay, the big story in markets is global bond yields
[4:40] Speaker 3: climbing to their highest level since 2008. Tech has got
[4:45] Speaker 3: a part in this story. Borrowing by the biggest U.S.
[4:47] Speaker 3: technology firms to fund AI has crowded out demand for
[4:51] Speaker 3: sovereign bonds. At the same time, just six hyperscalers make
[4:55] Speaker 3: up about 5% of the U.S. high-grade index, which is
[4:59] Speaker 3: double their share globally. Just two years ago. What's going on?
[5:02] Speaker 3: Joining us now is JPMorgan Asset Management Global Market Strategist,
[5:06] Speaker 3: Stephanie Aliaga. We're trying to zero in on tech's contribution
[5:10] Speaker 3: to this global bond story. What is tech's contribution right now?
[5:14] Speaker 3: What impact are tech issuances having, do you think, on
[5:17] Speaker 3: global yields?
[5:18] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[5:19] Speaker 2: Well, just like what you cited, as a share of
[5:20] Speaker 2: the overall market, it's still quite low. But in terms
[5:23] Speaker 2: of new issuance, it is becoming a growing share of
[5:27] Speaker 2: all of this debt hitting the markets. And we do
[5:30] Speaker 2: think that this is set to just continue. Now, this
[5:33] Speaker 2: debt is coming from very high-quality issuers. I mean, relative
[5:37] Speaker 2: to the current investment-grade bond index, the leverage ratios for
[5:41] Speaker 2: the hyperscalers are significantly lower. In fact, we estimate that
[5:45] Speaker 2: they could add $ 1. 5 trillion more debt onto their balance
[5:49] Speaker 2: sheets before getting to that average least adjusted leverage ratio
[5:53] Speaker 2: of the broader market.
[5:54] Speaker 3: So it's high quality.
[5:55] Speaker 2: But to your point, I mean, this is just one
[5:57] Speaker 2: factor among many that is contributing to higher yields on
[6:01] Speaker 2: the long end. And it's something investors want to be
[6:03] Speaker 2: very nimble around.
[6:05] Speaker 3: So, Stephanie, I'm not a bond market expert by any means,
[6:08] Speaker 3: but what I see in the reporting and the news
[6:10] Speaker 3: flow is just issuance, like a flood into the market
[6:15] Speaker 3: from tech in particular. And the underlying assumption is that
[6:18] Speaker 3: you'd assume yields would rise. What has the sort of
[6:23] Speaker 3: real terms impact on this market been by daily headlines
[6:27] Speaker 3: of X hyperscaler issuing X dollar denominated debt?
[6:31] Speaker 4: Yeah.
[6:31] Speaker 2: Well, I think it shows that there's just ample demand
[6:33] Speaker 2: in the market for this, too. Now, there's going to
[6:35] Speaker 2: be some choppiness, and you see that in spread widening
[6:38] Speaker 2: during these periods of significant issuance. But, you know, we
[6:41] Speaker 2: think that the market is very capable of absorbing this
[6:45] Speaker 2: new issuance.
[6:46] Speaker 8: And if anything.
[6:47] Speaker 2: and might actually enable this AI boom to be more
[6:50] Speaker 2: sustainable because the ROI visibility on these investments is improving,
[6:55] Speaker 2: but we need a plan for the future. And debt
[6:57] Speaker 2: is not inherently bad by any means, but it can
[7:00] Speaker 2: be a really attractive form of financing for some of
[7:03] Speaker 2: these hyperscalers building data centers that they intend to use
[7:06] Speaker 2: for five, 10, or more years.
[7:09] Speaker 3: For the balance of the year, what does JPMorgan think
[7:12] Speaker 3: is going to happen with this year? So they done
[7:15] Speaker 3: or they keep going? We think they're going to keep going.
[7:18] Speaker 3: And we're talking hyperscale, the biggest technology companies that are
[7:22] Speaker 3: trying to fund AI.
[7:24] Speaker 2: In terms of their issuance to the market, yes. I mean,
[7:27] Speaker 2: over by 2030, you know, our investment bank estimates that
[7:30] Speaker 2: the total AI build-out is going to amount to $ 5. 5 trillion.
[7:35] Speaker 2: And hyperscaler cash flows can only get us a fraction
[7:37] Speaker 2: of the way there. So debt is going to become
[7:39] Speaker 2: a bigger part of the financing story. But so is
[7:41] Speaker 2: alternative capital, right? So not only public debt, but also
[7:44] Speaker 2: private debt and some of these other SPV structures and
[7:48] Speaker 2: government capital as well.
[7:50] Speaker 3: Trying to bring it back to stocks. technology stocks in particular.
[7:54] Speaker 3: I mean, there was a time not that long ago
[7:56] Speaker 3: where these big technology companies were not borrowers. That wasn't
[8:02] Speaker 3: really the story. How was that interplay between the two,
[8:07] Speaker 3: the debt story for the hyperscale US tech and the
[8:10] Speaker 3: equity picture right now?
[8:12] Speaker 2: I think what's really important to recognize is in the
[8:15] Speaker 2: midst of growing tech issuance, you also have significant growth
[8:20] Speaker 2: in the operating cash flows of these companies. In fact,
[8:23] Speaker 2: right now, operating cash flows essentially neck and neck with
[8:27] Speaker 2: CapEx expenditures this year. And what I think was the
[8:30] Speaker 2: most promising thing that we heard this earnings season is
[8:32] Speaker 2: that we're getting more visibility around ROI.
[8:35] Speaker 3: How is that the case?
[8:37] Speaker 2: Well, if you look at the backlog growth for the
[8:39] Speaker 2: top three hyperscalers, that is actually outperformed or outpaced ROI.
[8:44] Speaker 2: the growth in CapEx, which means signed commitments from customers
[8:48] Speaker 2: asking for cloud capacity years into the future. It's growing
[8:51] Speaker 2: faster than CapEx. So there is visibility on the ROI equation.
[8:55] Speaker 2: And as we get further along here, we do expect
[8:58] Speaker 2: that CapEx will decelerate and that should allow some relief
[9:01] Speaker 2: for margins and free cash flows.
[9:03] Speaker 3: So interesting. I guess the case study is NVIDIA, right?
[9:06] Speaker 3: They said that for fiscal 28, they will have top-line
[9:09] Speaker 3: growth of 70%. But were it not for supply constraints,
[9:13] Speaker 3: it would have been higher, 100% or so. That was
[9:16] Speaker 3: in the same five-day period as Jackson Hole. And so
[9:19] Speaker 3: everyone's saying the macro-level event that is NVIDIA earnings. But
[9:23] Speaker 3: did you learn something from that, them taking the step
[9:26] Speaker 3: of giving guidance, which they don't do? but also trying
[9:29] Speaker 3: to explain it in those terms. It was a forecast
[9:32] Speaker 3: based on their ability to supply, not demand in that case. Absolutely.
[9:37] Speaker 2: I think the fact that you have AI demand now,
[9:42] Speaker 2: these customers are scrambling to get a hold of compute,
[9:46] Speaker 2: that they're willing to sign medium to longer term commitments.
[9:50] Speaker 2: And that is a really good sign for these companies
[9:52] Speaker 2: that are funding the AI build out, because it means
[9:54] Speaker 2: that they continue to justify doing so. So I take
[9:58] Speaker 2: that as good news. I think the reality is we're
[10:01] Speaker 2: going to be operating in this supply-constrained environment for the
[10:04] Speaker 2: foreseeable future. So that means if anyone in this market
[10:08] Speaker 2: can find a way to bring costs down, to bring
[10:10] Speaker 2: supply online, to get around some of these memory bottlenecks,
[10:14] Speaker 2: tech is very good at clearing bottlenecks. The key question
[10:17] Speaker 2: for investors is when and who can actually succeed in
[10:20] Speaker 2: doing so.
[10:22] Speaker 3: Stephanie, later in the program, we're going to look at
[10:25] Speaker 3: how the electorate around the world voters feel about data centers.
[10:31] Speaker 3: And for some people, they've started to factor in opposition
[10:34] Speaker 3: to data center projects in the context of U.S. midterms
[10:38] Speaker 3: to their growth outlooks. Where does J.P. Morgan sit on
[10:41] Speaker 3: that as a headwind potentially?
[10:44] Speaker 2: It is a risk, but not one that we think
[10:46] Speaker 2: will derail the AI build-out, but rather shift the economics
[10:50] Speaker 2: of it. And I think ultimately what is coming out
[10:53] Speaker 2: of these debates, conversations, negotiations with state and local legislators
[10:57] Speaker 2: is that the hyperscalers are shouldering more of the cost
[11:00] Speaker 2: burden versus ordinary taxpayers. And now the nuances of that
[11:05] Speaker 2: is going to vary by state and by local area.
[11:09] Speaker 2: I think the challenges are that the benefits of AI
[11:12] Speaker 2: are very diffuse, right, across the country. But the cost
[11:16] Speaker 2: of it can be very local. So we might need
[11:19] Speaker 2: to see more policy action to help ameliorate some of
[11:23] Speaker 2: these challenges when it comes to this AI build-out. But ultimately,
[11:27] Speaker 2: I mean, most customers benefit significantly from AI. There is
[11:32] Speaker 2: this consumer surplus in AI services. I think there's just
[11:35] Speaker 2: a lot of misinformation around the benefits and costs and
[11:39] Speaker 2: who's ultimately taking what.
[11:42] Speaker 3: JPMorgan Asset Management Global Market Strategist, Stephanie Aliaga, back on
[11:46] Speaker 3: the show. Thank you so much indeed. Now coming up,
[11:49] Speaker 3: tech leaders are descending on North Carolina today for a
[11:53] Speaker 3: tech-focused G20 meeting. Those are some of the names that
[11:57] Speaker 3: we've already heard from. We'll have a break it all
[11:59] Speaker 3: down next. This is Bloomberg Tech.
[12:15] Speaker 9: And I think AI will probably increase the global economy
[12:22] Speaker 9: by 20 to 30 percent. That's my rough estimate, meaning
[12:26] Speaker 9: on the order of 20 to 30 trillion dollars per year.
[12:28] Speaker 9: And AI will be able to do anything digital, anything
[12:33] Speaker 9: that does not require shaping of atoms by hand, probably
[12:38] Speaker 9: by the end of next year.
[12:42] Speaker 3: That was SpaceX CEO Elon Musk there speaking at a
[12:44] Speaker 3: tech-focused Group of 20 ministerial meeting that kicked off in
[12:48] Speaker 3: North Carolina earlier today. Former White House AI czar David
[12:52] Speaker 3: Sachs also spoke. While NVIDIA's Jensen Wang and OpenAI's Sam
[12:56] Speaker 3: Altman are also set to appear tomorrow. All that reporting
[12:59] Speaker 3: according to sources. Bloomberg Senior Tech Editor Mike Shepard joins
[13:03] Speaker 3: us from Washington. Interesting to hear from Elon Musk and
[13:07] Speaker 3: the impact of AI in the economy. Is that what
[13:09] Speaker 3: they're there to speak about? What is the point of
[13:11] Speaker 3: this sort of adjunct to the G20 meeting where tech
[13:15] Speaker 3: CEOs are in attendance?
[13:18] Speaker 4: Well, Elon Musk is there to provide some support to
[13:21] Speaker 4: the administration. The Trump administration has brought these group of
[13:24] Speaker 4: 20 ministers to North Carolina to talk about tech and
[13:28] Speaker 4: innovation and try to get them to adopt a set
[13:31] Speaker 4: of principles that really favor a lighter touch approach when
[13:34] Speaker 4: it comes to regulation of advanced technologies and especially artificial intelligence.
[13:39] Speaker 4: And who else do you want to hear from when
[13:41] Speaker 4: it comes to innovation? Then Elon Musk, a pioneer in
[13:44] Speaker 4: rocketry and in electric cars, and somebody who also was
[13:48] Speaker 4: part of the Trump administration for a good chunk of
[13:50] Speaker 4: last year, heading Doge and was a big supporter of
[13:53] Speaker 4: the president, and somebody who has also stood in the
[13:56] Speaker 4: way of regulation, and someone who has called out, in fact, today,
[14:01] Speaker 4: the European Union, for example, for what he sees as
[14:04] Speaker 4: extraordinarily high levels of regulation. In talking about the growth
[14:08] Speaker 4: levels he just mentioned in that clip you played for us, Ed,
[14:12] Speaker 4: he is going well beyond any of the projections we
[14:14] Speaker 4: have heard from the IMF or the World Bank or
[14:16] Speaker 4: other Wall Street firms.
[14:18] Speaker 7: There's a lot of data that are.
[14:19] Speaker 3: Not in there.
[14:20] Speaker 4: But he used those numbers to justify really what he
[14:22] Speaker 4: says is, look, we need to be a little bit
[14:24] Speaker 4: more hands-off with new technologies so that we don't stifle growth.
[14:29] Speaker 3: You and I have been discussing in recent days it's
[14:30] Speaker 3: also a bit of a precursor to meetings later in
[14:34] Speaker 3: the year between the U.S. and China. where artificial intelligence
[14:38] Speaker 3: will be a point of discussion. Set the scene, therefore,
[14:42] Speaker 3: through that G20 meeting.
[14:45] Speaker 4: Well, China is part of the Group of 20 also,
[14:48] Speaker 4: and they will be listening to all of the proceedings
[14:51] Speaker 4: today with great care. And you'll remember that it was
[14:54] Speaker 4: only in June that they held their own artificial intelligence
[14:59] Speaker 4: summit in Shanghai. And that was well attended, and they
[15:02] Speaker 4: were trying to make a separate pitch to the nations
[15:05] Speaker 4: of the global south to say, hey, look, there is
[15:08] Speaker 4: a different approach to artificial intelligence adoption than the one
[15:12] Speaker 4: that you're hearing right now from Washington. We want to
[15:15] Speaker 4: offer you something that's lower cost. We want to share
[15:18] Speaker 4: with you more of these open weight models. And this
[15:21] Speaker 4: is a contrast to what we have seen pushed by
[15:24] Speaker 4: many of the leading AI labs here in the United States,
[15:27] Speaker 4: OpenAI and Anthropic. They are offering closed weight systems And
[15:32] Speaker 4: also the infrastructure is much more expensive, too. And all
[15:36] Speaker 4: of that is really one of the underlying tensions here.
[15:39] Speaker 4: And we'll see that play out as President Donald Trump
[15:42] Speaker 4: prepares to meet with Xi Jinping on September 24th.
[15:45] Speaker 3: Here in Washington.
[15:48] Speaker 4: A crucial discussion is set to take place between senior
[15:52] Speaker 4: leaders from both sides. And yet we don't know who
[15:54] Speaker 4: from Washington or Beijing yet will take part in this,
[15:58] Speaker 4: nor do we know what is on the table. We
[16:00] Speaker 4: certainly heard yesterday as we discussed the misgivings from Beijing
[16:04] Speaker 4: about the U.S. approach and in particular about anthropic. And
[16:07] Speaker 4: of course, some of those themes may be played out
[16:10] Speaker 4: here again today at the G20 ministerial in North Carolina.
[16:14] Speaker 3: Bloomberg's Mike Shepard in Washington, D.C., thank you very much.
[16:18] Speaker 3: After years of false start, Shein is finally a public company.
[16:21] Speaker 3: The fast fashion giant made its Hong Kong debut after
[16:25] Speaker 3: abandoning earlier efforts to list in New York and London.
[16:27] Speaker 3: Bloomberg's Winnie Du has the latest.
[16:30] Speaker 10: We've got the gong, we've got the open of trade,
[16:32] Speaker 10: and finally, SHEIN is listed in Hong Kong. Now, we
[16:36] Speaker 10: are seeing share prices actually on the downside during the
[16:40] Speaker 10: opening of hours, but still, the excitement in the room.
[16:43] Speaker 10: We are hearing people clapping, cheering, taking photos, and even
[16:47] Speaker 10: seeing some of the employee representatives from all over the
[16:51] Speaker 10: world from the UK, from Middle East, from the US,
[16:54] Speaker 10: all coming to join the ceremony. So really, it's showing
[16:57] Speaker 10: that global enthusiasm after the company have come so far, right?
[17:02] Speaker 10: We are talking about several years trying to be listed
[17:05] Speaker 10: in New York and London and facing lots of challenges. Now,
[17:09] Speaker 10: the IPO raised $ 1. 7 billion, taking its valuation to about
[17:15] Speaker 10: $ 26 billion, and that is just a fraction and in fact, 70%
[17:20] Speaker 10: lower than what it used to worth back in 2022,
[17:23] Speaker 10: which was at about $ 100 billion. And this is coming
[17:28] Speaker 10: as the company faces lots of challenges, whether it's the
[17:30] Speaker 10: impact from US tariffs, some of the regulatory changes, In
[17:34] Speaker 10: the U.S., in Europe, and also questions about the sustainability
[17:38] Speaker 10: of the business as well as some of the labor
[17:41] Speaker 10: practices and all of that weighing on the profitability of
[17:45] Speaker 10: the company. We saw the company, in fact, seeing a
[17:48] Speaker 10: loss of $ 99 million in the first quarter of this
[17:52] Speaker 10: year versus about $ 400 million of gains just about a
[17:56] Speaker 10: year ago. So the questions from investors would be if
[17:59] Speaker 10: the company can manage all these challenges to bring back
[18:03] Speaker 10: up its profitability and if the company can really pivot
[18:07] Speaker 10: from just a fast fashion retailer into an all-rounded e-commerce platform.
[18:13] Speaker 3: Winnie Hsu, Bloomberg News, Hong Kong. And an update on
[18:19] Speaker 3: Shein's trading debut, the stock actually erased most of what
[18:22] Speaker 3: was a sharp early sell-off. So shares have plunged as
[18:25] Speaker 3: much as 10% before staging a late comeback to finish
[18:29] Speaker 3: down just 0.1%, a tenth of a percent, nearly matching
[18:34] Speaker 3: its actual IPO price. Okay, coming up, the FTC and
[18:38] Speaker 3: a group of US states is suing Amazon for overcharging advertisers.
[18:43] Speaker 3: We've got details next. This is Bloomberg Tech. Thank you.
[18:58] Speaker 3: YouTube has tapped Amazon as its newest affiliate partner in
[19:01] Speaker 3: YouTube shopping, part of the video giant's push to prioritize
[19:05] Speaker 3: e-commerce as one of its next big bets. YouTube creators
[19:08] Speaker 3: can now tag Amazon products in their videos and live streams,
[19:11] Speaker 3: driving more business directly to the enormous global marketplace while
[19:16] Speaker 3: taking a cut from those sales. Let's stick with the
[19:19] Speaker 3: e-commerce giant. The FTC and a group of US states
[19:23] Speaker 3: sued Amazon over claims it systematically overcharged advertisers by more
[19:27] Speaker 3: than $ 20 billion since 2019. The complaint was filed on
[19:32] Speaker 3: Monday in Seattle Federal Court and alleges Amazon ultimately misled
[19:36] Speaker 3: 1.2 million advertising customers. Bloomberg's Spencer Soper, who leads our
[19:41] Speaker 3: coverage of the company, joins us now. Let's start with
[19:44] Speaker 3: just the basic allegation that the FTC and this group
[19:48] Speaker 3: of U.S. states is making against Amazon.
[19:51] Speaker 7: Yes.
[19:51] Speaker 11: So they're saying that Amazon introduced a synthetic price that
[19:56] Speaker 11: basically inflated the.
[19:59] Speaker 7: Ultimate price that advertisers pay.
[20:02] Speaker 11: This works with a on an auction basis, meaning, you know,
[20:07] Speaker 11: you bid against search terms. So someone gets on Amazon
[20:11] Speaker 11: and searches for a phone charger or.
[20:13] Speaker 7: Something like that.
[20:15] Speaker 11: You know, there's various people bidding to be the featured listing,
[20:19] Speaker 11: the featured advertisement shown against that search term.
[20:22] Speaker 3: And that's very.
[20:23] Speaker 7: Valuable real estate.
[20:24] Speaker 11: And so that's supposed to be done on an auction
[20:26] Speaker 11: where people are bidding against that search term. And what
[20:29] Speaker 11: the FTC alleges is that Amazon kind of just decided
[20:33] Speaker 11: this is what this advertisement should be valued at. And
[20:37] Speaker 11: that created kind of like a floor where the bidding
[20:42] Speaker 11: ultimately had to cross. And that inflated the value of
[20:45] Speaker 11: the advertising and led to more than 1.2 million advertisers
[20:49] Speaker 11: being overcharged over several years.
[20:53] Speaker 3: Spencer, in response to this suit, Amazon's given an email
[20:57] Speaker 3: statement that basically says the lawsuit presents no evidence of
[21:00] Speaker 3: harm to shoppers. We're going to show some of it now.
[21:04] Speaker 3: The FTC claims advertisers were harmed because they didn't understand
[21:08] Speaker 3: how our auction worked and therefore overpaid. Just take us
[21:11] Speaker 3: into what Amazon's disputing here.
[21:15] Speaker 11: Yeah, I mean, Amazon's basically saying that the market is
[21:17] Speaker 11: working fine. And their main argument is that... advertising rates
[21:24] Speaker 11: on Amazon, the cost per click has basically been about
[21:28] Speaker 11: flat when you consider inflation, like they haven't gone up
[21:31] Speaker 11: at all. And conversion rates, the number of people who
[21:34] Speaker 11: see an ad and actually make a purchase has.
[21:37] Speaker 3: Gone up over that time.
[21:39] Speaker 11: So their argument is basically that whatever the FTC is saying,
[21:42] Speaker 11: our advertiser actually actually getting better value from our advertising
[21:47] Speaker 11: system and haven't been overcharged. They're actually getting more value
[21:51] Speaker 11: for their money is their argument.
[21:54] Speaker 3: Spencer, real quick, we just got 30 seconds or so.
[21:57] Speaker 3: Is advertising an important business for Amazon?
[22:00] Speaker 7: Oh, absolutely.
[22:01] Speaker 11: It's $ 60 billion a year, not a huge number revenue side,
[22:07] Speaker 11: but huge profitability side. So you think Selling stuff online
[22:10] Speaker 11: and delivering it to your house and owning all these warehouses,
[22:14] Speaker 11: very expensive. They've been able to build this advertising layer
[22:18] Speaker 11: on top without all of those assets needed, and it's
[22:21] Speaker 11: incredibly profitable for Amazon.
[22:23] Speaker 3: Bloomberg Spencer Soper, best in the business, covering Amazon, important
[22:28] Speaker 3: details of this suit. Thank you very much. Now, coming up,
[22:32] Speaker 3: it's John Ternus' first day as Apple's CEO, and he's
[22:35] Speaker 3: got some big shoes to fill. We're going to discuss
[22:38] Speaker 3: the transition at Apple next. Halfway through the program here
[22:43] Speaker 3: from San Francisco, this is Bloomberg Tech.
[22:46] Speaker 8: Bloomberg Tech.
[22:56] Speaker 3: Welcome back to Bloomberg Tech. Generally speaking, technology shares are lower.
[23:00] Speaker 3: Earlier in the program, we talked about how it's the
[23:03] Speaker 3: global bond market that's a big driver of the narrative
[23:06] Speaker 3: with yields at their highest level since 2008. Micron is
[23:09] Speaker 3: now modestly lower, two tenths of a percent. But in
[23:11] Speaker 3: the pre-market, a report out of Taiwan that some of
[23:14] Speaker 3: Micron's workers threatening a potential strike. over how Micron shares
[23:19] Speaker 3: profits and the proposal on the table from the memory
[23:22] Speaker 3: chip maker, it spooked markets. You saw NASDAQ futures take
[23:26] Speaker 3: a leg lower. That's kind of rebalanced and hasn't really
[23:29] Speaker 3: evolved into anything in this session, but it was notable
[23:32] Speaker 3: in the pre-market. Let's talk about Apple. Apple's Tim Cook
[23:37] Speaker 3: has officially handed over the reins to John Ternus, leaving
[23:40] Speaker 3: him some big shoes to fill. Cook turned a $ 350
[23:43] Speaker 3: billion company on a market cap basis into a $ 4. 6
[23:49] Speaker 3: trillion iconic global brand. Apple shares have jumped almost 2,300%
[23:56] Speaker 3: since Cook became CEO. That was in August of 2011.
[23:58] Speaker 3: The stock pulling ahead of the S & P 500
[24:01] Speaker 3: and NASDAQ 100, and honestly, never really looking back, Let's
[24:06] Speaker 3: get the stock story with Bloomberg's Ryan Vestelica. It's a
[24:09] Speaker 3: brilliant size and scope piece on the terminal. A lot
[24:11] Speaker 3: of people are reading it. But today is day one
[24:14] Speaker 3: of John Ternus. Tim Cook becomes executive chair. Summarize the
[24:17] Speaker 3: stock story.
[24:19] Speaker 12: Yeah, so the real big takeaway is that underneath Tim Cook,
[24:23] Speaker 12: even though he has sort of the reputation for not
[24:25] Speaker 12: being nearly as exciting as, say, Steve Jobs, the stock
[24:28] Speaker 12: performed extremely well under him. The favorite stat that I uncovered,
[24:32] Speaker 12: I think, was from Bank of America saying that under him,
[24:35] Speaker 12: Apple added more than 30 million in market cap every
[24:38] Speaker 12: hour for 15 years. So just massive accumulation over time.
[24:43] Speaker 12: A real focus on building out the company's services business,
[24:46] Speaker 12: which is high margin recurring revenue. So more of that,
[24:50] Speaker 12: less of the exciting sort of, you know, new product
[24:52] Speaker 12: introductions that people associate with the Steve Jobs era. But
[24:55] Speaker 12: certainly under him, pretty remarkable outperformance, especially relative to the
[24:59] Speaker 12: broader market.
[25:02] Speaker 3: Nearer term, is there anything to talk about around how
[25:05] Speaker 3: the stocks behave since Apple announced that this was going
[25:08] Speaker 3: to happen, that Tim Cook would step down today, John
[25:11] Speaker 3: Ternes would take the CEO role today, or has it
[25:14] Speaker 3: been more closely aligned with an AI story from the
[25:17] Speaker 3: stock's perspective?
[25:19] Speaker 12: Yeah, I don't think people were expecting too much by
[25:21] Speaker 12: way of a rocky transition here. So the stock hasn't
[25:24] Speaker 12: really been pulling back on that. What has been interesting
[25:27] Speaker 12: about the stock is you alluded to the AI part
[25:30] Speaker 12: of this. Apple has had a kind of pronounced negative
[25:33] Speaker 12: correlation with AI. It's very negative correlation to semiconductor stocks,
[25:39] Speaker 12: to the NASDAQ 100. The idea is that because Apple
[25:42] Speaker 12: isn't investing too aggressively in AI the way the hyperscalers are,
[25:46] Speaker 12: it's not benefiting from it the way the chip makers are.
[25:49] Speaker 12: If sentiment towards AI starts to sour a little bit,
[25:52] Speaker 12: we see people in general rotate back into Apple and
[25:56] Speaker 12: vice versa. So today we're seeing some weakness in chip makers.
[25:59] Speaker 12: There's some concern about the state of maybe AI overall.
[26:03] Speaker 12: And that's why we're seeing Apple outperforming today or at
[26:05] Speaker 12: least contributing to that.
[26:07] Speaker 3: Bloomberg's Ryan Fraselica, thank you very much indeed. It is
[26:11] Speaker 3: John Ternus' first day as Apple's CEO, but he's the
[26:14] Speaker 3: former head of hardware, and he doesn't have much time
[26:17] Speaker 3: to get settled in before the company's new product unveil
[26:20] Speaker 3: next week. Let's get up to speed with Bloomberg's managing editor,
[26:23] Speaker 3: Mark Gurman, who leads our coverage of Apple. I appreciate
[26:26] Speaker 3: that over a number of days we've been talking about
[26:28] Speaker 3: this story. It is day one of John Ternus, the CEO.
[26:32] Speaker 3: And you outlined so clearly nothing just gets ripped up
[26:35] Speaker 3: and changed overnight. But there was a piece of the
[26:38] Speaker 3: business week story you wrote that I went back and
[26:40] Speaker 3: read this idea that John Ternus is the product guy.
[26:43] Speaker 3: He's good at hardware, but he's not necessarily good at
[26:46] Speaker 3: finance or sales or legal. He'll have a team of
[26:49] Speaker 3: people around him. Talk about that and how John Ternus
[26:53] Speaker 3: manages a veteran management team over at Apple. Yeah, it's funny.
[26:58] Speaker 13: We've been talking about this now for two and a
[26:59] Speaker 13: half years, so it feels a little repetitive rather than
[27:03] Speaker 13: day one. But it is interesting that we've finally come
[27:06] Speaker 13: to this moment. This is a big deal for Ternus.
[27:08] Speaker 13: This is a big deal for Apple. And this is
[27:10] Speaker 13: an interesting situation in which Someone who was a peer
[27:14] Speaker 13: of the rest of the staff on Apple's executive team
[27:17] Speaker 13: has now risen up to be their boss. And that's
[27:21] Speaker 13: different than when Tim Cook took over because Tim Cook
[27:24] Speaker 13: wasn't necessarily a peer when he took over the company
[27:27] Speaker 13: of the rest of the executives. He had already been
[27:29] Speaker 13: serving as Apple's interim CEO before. Two or three times
[27:33] Speaker 13: before then, he had been the COO, so he was
[27:37] Speaker 13: in a different stratosphere to everyone else, and he was
[27:39] Speaker 13: a shoo-in for the role. Ternus, until my reporting on
[27:43] Speaker 13: this about two and a half years ago, was a
[27:45] Speaker 13: bit out of left field, dark horse surprise, and it.
[27:48] Speaker 8: All came to be.
[27:50] Speaker 13: That's because of his product chops and how he's going
[27:52] Speaker 13: to lead this company, the board hopes, he hopes, Apple
[27:56] Speaker 13: employees hope, and of course customers hope, into new innovative
[27:59] Speaker 13: products for the future.
[28:01] Speaker 3: Somebody's situation who does appear to be changing, you've reported
[28:04] Speaker 3: on in the last 24 hours. There is a retirement
[28:07] Speaker 3: or there is somebody senior in that group who is
[28:09] Speaker 3: stepping back?
[28:12] Speaker 13: He's not the only one, but I'll talk about the
[28:14] Speaker 13: one that we've reported so far.
[28:16] Speaker 8: That's Phil's company's longtime head of marketing.
[28:21] Speaker 13: After stepping down from the marketing role in 2020, he
[28:23] Speaker 13: became an Apple fellow running the App Store and Apple events,
[28:27] Speaker 13: which means he's in charge of the stores on all
[28:29] Speaker 13: the company's products. as well as his product launch events.
[28:32] Speaker 13: He's stepping back for unspecified projects, so he'll remain at
[28:36] Speaker 13: the company for now, but he is en route to retirement.
[28:40] Speaker 13: And so that's another big change in the guard for
[28:42] Speaker 13: Apple as well. And there'll be one more that we
[28:44] Speaker 13: can talk about later.
[28:45] Speaker 3: Okay, you will be back on the show when that happens.
[28:48] Speaker 3: Next week, Wednesday, September 9th, we get the full iPhone event.
[28:53] Speaker 3: The centerpiece, a foldable iPhone. What have you reported on
[28:57] Speaker 3: what we expect to hear from Apple?
[28:59] Speaker 8: It's going to be pretty, and it's going to cost
[29:02] Speaker 8: a pretty penny.
[29:03] Speaker 13: I continue to hear that it's going to be priced
[29:05] Speaker 13: north of $ 2, 000 US. Obviously, this is expensive technology with
[29:09] Speaker 13: that expansive display, as well as that folding mechanism. And
[29:14] Speaker 13: you have two screens now, the inner screen and the
[29:17] Speaker 13: outer screen. And so that is going to be the
[29:19] Speaker 13: main event at this showcase. We'll also see the 18 Pro,
[29:22] Speaker 13: 18 Pro Max. There'll be a bevy of new colors,
[29:26] Speaker 13: including a new sky blue and a wine burgundy red,
[29:29] Speaker 13: whatever you prefer to call it, on the Pro models.
[29:32] Speaker 13: The Pro Max will now get a mechanical aperture, so
[29:35] Speaker 13: you can use a manual setting to let in as
[29:38] Speaker 13: much light as you want into the photos. so better
[29:40] Speaker 13: dark photography or photography at night. And then you'll see
[29:43] Speaker 13: the new Apple Watches as well. AirPods 5 is also
[29:48] Speaker 13: likely to arrive. Not major changes on the Apple Watches,
[29:52] Speaker 13: but you'll see improvements to health tracking, including a continuous
[29:56] Speaker 13: heart rate monitor. Right now, You're at random intervals. And
[30:00] Speaker 13: when you're working out, now you'll get more data all
[30:02] Speaker 13: day long.
[30:03] Speaker 3: And Mark, very quickly, is this going back to live events?
[30:06] Speaker 3: This is still recorded. We just have 15 seconds.
[30:09] Speaker 8: It'll be the.
[30:09] Speaker 13: Same as you've seen before. John Ternus will come on stage,
[30:13] Speaker 13: talk for a few minutes, introducing himself as CEO. Then
[30:16] Speaker 13: they'll play the video. That's for attendees in Cupertino at
[30:19] Speaker 13: the Steve Jobs Theater. And then everyone else can watch
[30:22] Speaker 13: that same video live online through the Apple TV, through
[30:25] Speaker 13: the Apple website, YouTube, other social sites.
[30:27] Speaker 8: So it should be a fun event. I'm really looking
[30:29] Speaker 8: forward to it.
[30:31] Speaker 3: Bloomberg's Mark Gurman, who leads our coverage of Apple and
[30:33] Speaker 3: consumer tech. Thank you so much. In other news, Airbnb
[30:37] Speaker 3: has replaced its chief business officer with a former executive
[30:40] Speaker 3: of TripAdvisor and Booking. This is it tries to expand
[30:44] Speaker 3: into new travel segments. Pepin Rivas is succeeding Dave Stevenson
[30:49] Speaker 3: in overseeing several business areas, including short-term rentals, enterprise operations,
[30:54] Speaker 3: and the company's growing hotels offering. The new appointment follows
[30:57] Speaker 3: a spate of executive changes at Airbnb over the past year,
[31:01] Speaker 3: as several tenured leaders stepped down or retired. Okay, coming up,
[31:06] Speaker 3: data centers have become a hot debate in the U.S.
[31:09] Speaker 3: midterm campaign, but candidates in Brazil's presidential race are also
[31:14] Speaker 3: leaning in. We'll discuss. This has been Big Tech. Data
[31:30] Speaker 3: centers have become politically divisive in the U.S. midterm campaign,
[31:34] Speaker 3: but not in Brazil's presidential race. Ahead of the country's
[31:38] Speaker 3: October vote, both right-wing candidate Flavio Bolsonaro and President Luiz
[31:43] Speaker 3: Inácio Lula da Silva are making multi-billion dollar data centers
[31:47] Speaker 3: and the AI investment that comes with them central to
[31:50] Speaker 3: their pitches to bolster Latin America's largest economy. Bloomberg's Peter
[31:54] Speaker 3: Miller joins us for more from Rio de Janeiro. Really
[31:57] Speaker 3: interesting data. how this plays out in different societies and
[32:00] Speaker 3: different economies. Explain the race with data centers in the
[32:05] Speaker 3: middle of it.
[32:08] Speaker 1: Yeah, thanks for having me. Brazil, like many countries apart
[32:12] Speaker 1: from the United States, there's an issue of data sovereignty.
[32:16] Speaker 1: Most of, I think, 60% of Brazil's data currently gets
[32:19] Speaker 1: processed in the United States. And so, you know, that's
[32:23] Speaker 1: a message that, you know, kind of left to center,
[32:25] Speaker 1: the left wing, if you will, government of Lula is
[32:28] Speaker 1: pressing and making that case to the public that we
[32:32] Speaker 1: need data centers so that we can process data. our
[32:34] Speaker 1: data here in Brazil. And the Trump administration has come
[32:40] Speaker 1: out against one of the apps, the popular payment app, Pix.
[32:44] Speaker 1: And so that's very popular here in Brazil. People want
[32:47] Speaker 1: to keep that and they want that data processed here
[32:49] Speaker 1: in Brazil. And, you know, the other side, Flavio Bolsonaro,
[32:54] Speaker 1: he's used data centers in his campaign as a way
[32:57] Speaker 1: to bring in investment and, you know, Similar to Trump,
[33:00] Speaker 1: he supports AI as a way to modernize the economy
[33:03] Speaker 1: and improve efficiency.
[33:06] Speaker 3: With the two different candidates, is it clear which side
[33:09] Speaker 3: the technology industry in Brazil is backing, private industry is supporting?
[33:16] Speaker 1: They don't want to side with one candidate or the other.
[33:20] Speaker 1: They would be very interested in steering clear of the
[33:23] Speaker 1: political debate so that they can pursue their projects no
[33:26] Speaker 1: matter who wins.
[33:29] Speaker 3: Bloomberg's Peter Millard joining us from Rio de Janeiro. It's
[33:31] Speaker 3: great to have you on the program. Thank you very much.
[33:33] Speaker 3: The situation in Brazil is in sharp contrast with the U.S.,
[33:37] Speaker 3: where voter anger over higher electricity bills, water use, is
[33:41] Speaker 3: putting politicians on the defensive, even in data center strongholds
[33:45] Speaker 3: like Virginia and Texas. Jason Oxman is the CEO of
[33:49] Speaker 3: the Information Technology Industry Council and joins us for a discussion.
[33:55] Speaker 3: This is fascinating because we are getting closer to the midterms.
[34:00] Speaker 3: There are specific races across the board where data centers
[34:04] Speaker 3: have become a central issue. Lay out the landscape you're
[34:07] Speaker 3: seeing in those races and why you think this is happening.
[34:12] Speaker 7: Well, it's great to be with you, Ed.
[34:13] Speaker 14: And, you know, as Peter noted, there are politicians that
[34:16] Speaker 14: recognize in Brazil, as they do in the United States,
[34:19] Speaker 14: that AI is the infrastructure of the future. And there's
[34:24] Speaker 14: been a lot of talk about construction of data centers,
[34:27] Speaker 14: which are essentially AI factories. What I find fascinating about
[34:31] Speaker 14: the political aspect here is I think the facts show
[34:34] Speaker 14: very clearly that AI infrastructure investment is creating a tens
[34:38] Speaker 14: of thousands, hundreds of thousands of jobs across construction and
[34:42] Speaker 14: the various trades, but also across the various scientists as
[34:46] Speaker 14: well that go into these data centers and operate them.
[34:49] Speaker 7: So it's good for jobs.
[34:51] Speaker 14: But there are concerns, as you noted, about the state
[34:54] Speaker 14: of the economy more broadly, the extent to which data
[34:57] Speaker 14: centers are responsible for higher power bills. The answer to that, again,
[35:01] Speaker 14: is in the facts, they're not. Data centers use a
[35:05] Speaker 14: low single-digit percentage of overall power in the country. There
[35:08] Speaker 14: are a lot of other factors that go in, but
[35:10] Speaker 14: it is incumbent on the tech industry to respond to
[35:12] Speaker 14: these concerns. I think you're seeing that response pick up
[35:16] Speaker 14: in recent weeks as well.
[35:18] Speaker 3: Jason, you represent the trade association that represents the tech industry, right?
[35:22] Speaker 3: But it's interesting, you seem to be acknowledging that the
[35:25] Speaker 3: concerns that everyday Americans have are warranted, right? Does the
[35:32] Speaker 3: industry hear those concerns? Is it taking action to at
[35:36] Speaker 3: least engage on them?
[35:38] Speaker 7: I think it's both industry and government. I'll give you
[35:40] Speaker 7: an example.
[35:41] Speaker 14: The Trump administration has convened not one, but two ratepayer
[35:44] Speaker 14: protection agreements pledge events where the tech industry in partnership
[35:49] Speaker 14: with utilities is pledging not to raise rates on consumers.
[35:53] Speaker 14: You've seen multi-billion dollar investments by the tech industry in
[35:57] Speaker 14: power generating capability and modernizing grids and other steps to
[36:02] Speaker 14: minimize the impact on consumers. So I think we are
[36:04] Speaker 14: taking it very seriously as an industry. And we do,
[36:06] Speaker 14: of course, need to work in partnership with government to
[36:08] Speaker 14: make that happen. The ratepayer protection pledge is a good
[36:11] Speaker 14: example of that. But you're right, the tech industry can
[36:15] Speaker 14: do more, and we are endeavoring to do more. Investing
[36:18] Speaker 14: in power companies themselves, you've seen Microsoft's investment in restarting
[36:23] Speaker 14: nuclear power capability adjacent to one of their data centers,
[36:26] Speaker 14: for example. Meta has invested in Louisiana in additional generation
[36:31] Speaker 14: capability as well.
[36:32] Speaker 7: So there's more to do.
[36:34] Speaker 14: And it is important that we be responsive to these
[36:36] Speaker 14: concerns that are raised.
[36:39] Speaker 3: Should we talk about advertising? It's very interesting to look
[36:43] Speaker 3: at the data that's available and see directly how the
[36:48] Speaker 3: data center industry or those that rely on data centers
[36:52] Speaker 3: are sort of getting out into the world this is
[36:53] Speaker 3: ad spending broken out by party so democrats account for
[36:58] Speaker 3: the vast majority of it 73 percent what are you
[37:00] Speaker 3: seeing among your members in the marketplace for advertising around
[37:05] Speaker 3: data centers Well, there is a lot.
[37:07] Speaker 14: Of advertising taking place because I think there's a lot
[37:10] Speaker 14: of need to correct a lot of public perception and
[37:14] Speaker 14: feelings about data centers. And data centers have been around
[37:17] Speaker 14: for decades. You know, I've lived in Northern Virginia for
[37:20] Speaker 14: 30 years. And the data centers in Northern Virginia, of course,
[37:23] Speaker 14: are the reason we have the Internet. And data centers
[37:25] Speaker 14: are the reason that. I'm able to talk to you
[37:27] Speaker 14: via this video connection. The reason we're able to send emails,
[37:30] Speaker 14: the reason that our doctors can access our medical records,
[37:33] Speaker 14: the reason we're able to do everything that we can
[37:35] Speaker 14: do to communicate and stay in touch with each other.
[37:37] Speaker 14: And that's been the case for decades and decades. There
[37:39] Speaker 14: are 5,000 data centers in the country today. And those
[37:42] Speaker 14: have been around for many, many years. So I think
[37:45] Speaker 14: the reason you're seeing a lot of communication with the
[37:47] Speaker 14: public around data centers is an effort to make sure
[37:49] Speaker 14: that we remember that they are AI factories, yes, but
[37:53] Speaker 14: they're also the factories that make all of our digital
[37:56] Speaker 14: infrastructure possible. and they are a good thing. A lot
[37:59] Speaker 14: of community concerns being raised about what they look like
[38:02] Speaker 14: and their power usage, but I think the facts really
[38:05] Speaker 14: are there to address the underlying question about data centers,
[38:09] Speaker 14: which is, are they good for the American economy, good
[38:11] Speaker 14: for the American people? And I think the answer to
[38:13] Speaker 14: that is an unequivocal yes.
[38:16] Speaker 3: If data centers have always been there, right, The difference
[38:21] Speaker 3: now is that we're in the AI age. I think
[38:23] Speaker 3: what's very interesting, Jason, is to what degree do you
[38:25] Speaker 3: recognize the distinction between the American public's concern about data
[38:30] Speaker 3: centers and the American public's concern about AI generally?
[38:36] Speaker 7: I think that's an interesting question, Ed.
[38:37] Speaker 14: And I do think there is a certain aspect of
[38:40] Speaker 14: this discussion that renders data centers a proxy for AI.
[38:45] Speaker 14: I think you're right that that is conflated in a
[38:48] Speaker 14: lot of people's views. And I do think there's a
[38:50] Speaker 14: broader discussion happening about the role that AI will play
[38:55] Speaker 14: in American society going forward. But I think there are
[38:58] Speaker 14: a couple of things that are important to keep in mind,
[39:00] Speaker 14: and we're obviously encouraging policymakers to think about that as well.
[39:04] Speaker 14: There are ways to address the concerns about the proper
[39:08] Speaker 14: regulatory environment for AI without engaging in bands of data centers,
[39:12] Speaker 14: which is what that proxy has resulted in. You've seen
[39:15] Speaker 14: Governors in red and blue states put pauses on data
[39:19] Speaker 14: center construction moratoria in place because of those concerns.
[39:23] Speaker 7: And I think you're right.
[39:24] Speaker 14: That is a proxy in some ways for AI. But
[39:27] Speaker 14: I think if we want to remain competitive, and I'll
[39:29] Speaker 14: go back to Peter. story about Brazil, the reason Brazil
[39:32] Speaker 14: is doing what it's doing is because it's in competition
[39:34] Speaker 14: with Argentina and Chile to attract data center investment.
[39:38] Speaker 7: America is in competition as well. The competition is with China.
[39:41] Speaker 14: And that competition should lead us to want to make
[39:45] Speaker 14: the AI infrastructure investment in the United States to ensure
[39:47] Speaker 14: that we have that economic growth available to us. But
[39:52] Speaker 14: the discussion is, as you noted, leading us to a
[39:54] Speaker 14: place where people are talking more about pauses on data construction.
[39:57] Speaker 14: They're going to get built and the AI investment is
[39:59] Speaker 14: going to be made. The question is, is it going
[40:01] Speaker 14: to happen here, which we certainly hope, or is it
[40:03] Speaker 14: going to happen overseas, which we hope it won't.
[40:07] Speaker 3: Jason Oxman, CEO of the Information Technology Industry Council. Great
[40:10] Speaker 3: to have you back on the show. Thank you very
[40:12] Speaker 3: much indeed. Let's get out to New York and Bloomberg's
[40:14] Speaker 3: Yahara Anand. Hi, Yahara.
[40:15] Speaker 6: Hi, Ed.
[40:16] Speaker 15: It's time now for Talking Tech. First up, SB Energy,
[40:19] Speaker 15: which is backed by SoftBank, has filed for a U.S.
[40:22] Speaker 15: IPO with OpenAI and NVIDIA among its investors and customers.
[40:27] Speaker 15: The company... is looking to capitalize on booming demand for
[40:30] Speaker 15: AI infrastructure with a data center business backlog of $ 430 billion.
[40:36] Speaker 15: SB Energy plans to list on the NASDAQ under the
[40:39] Speaker 15: ticker SBE. Plus, Baidu says its big AI bet could
[40:45] Speaker 15: soon pay off. The company's CFO tells Bloomberg that AI
[40:49] Speaker 15: now accounts for more than half of revenue with margins
[40:53] Speaker 15: potentially matching its legacy search business in the near term.
[40:57] Speaker 15: Baidu is betting stronger demand for its cloud and chips
[41:01] Speaker 15: can drive growth while keeping AI spending in check. And
[41:06] Speaker 15: the fight over Dutch chipmaker Xperia is heating up again.
[41:10] Speaker 15: A Chinese court has frozen more than $ 300 million in
[41:14] Speaker 15: assets as Xperia's Chinese owner fights to regain control of
[41:19] Speaker 15: the company. The dispute began after the Dutch government intervened
[41:22] Speaker 15: last year over concerns about technology transfers. The move has
[41:26] Speaker 15: already disrupted chip supplies to automakers.
[41:28] Speaker 11: Ed.
[41:29] Speaker 3: Thank you, Yahaira. Coming up, Dyson is sinking its teeth
[41:34] Speaker 3: into AI. Introducing a $ 499 smart toothbrush. We've got the
[41:39] Speaker 3: details next. This is Moonberg Tech. Dyson is brushing up
[41:52] Speaker 3: on AI and putting a camera in your mouth. The
[41:55] Speaker 3: company's launching a $ 499 toothbrush that uses AI and a
[41:59] Speaker 3: built-in camera. Bloomberg's Sam Kelly wrote the story and joins
[42:02] Speaker 3: us now. How does a camera-based AI toothbrush work, please, Sam?
[42:07] Speaker 7: Yeah, it's definitely interesting.
[42:08] Speaker 16: So it uses a camera and also AI paired together.
[42:12] Speaker 16: It's half toothbrush and half flosser. So basically what it
[42:16] Speaker 16: does is there's a little camera at the top And
[42:18] Speaker 16: it's tracking in real time what it sees inside your mouth,
[42:22] Speaker 16: specifically narrowing in on the little gaps in between your teeth,
[42:25] Speaker 16: which is known to develop plaque. And then it kind
[42:28] Speaker 16: of targets this little propeller of liquid mouthwash or water
[42:33] Speaker 16: into those areas to cut down on the plaque. And
[42:37] Speaker 16: certainly something we haven't necessarily seen before, toothbrushes of, you know, smart, elevated,
[42:42] Speaker 16: premium toothbrushes aren't necessarily new, but this is certainly a
[42:45] Speaker 16: new take and a whole new category for Dyson.
[42:48] Speaker 3: So that's super interesting. I mean, unsurprisingly, everyone is clicking
[42:51] Speaker 3: on your story and reading about it. From a consumer
[42:54] Speaker 3: tech perspective, very quickly, is 500 bucks a lot? Is
[42:58] Speaker 3: this the AI age of dental care?
[43:02] Speaker 6: Yeah.
[43:02] Speaker 16: I mean, toothbrushes, what, cost maybe five, six dollars. You
[43:05] Speaker 16: can even get them at the dollar store. So really,
[43:07] Speaker 16: it depends on what you're looking for. Yes, this is
[43:10] Speaker 16: very expensive. But Dyson has a knack, you know, an
[43:13] Speaker 16: engineering company, obviously turning vacuums into premium devices. It's tried
[43:17] Speaker 16: this with beauty products, you know, years ago. And now
[43:21] Speaker 16: it is, I think, 30% of its U.S. sales are
[43:24] Speaker 16: now its premium hair tools. It's had some flops before.
[43:28] Speaker 16: It's tried washing machines and experimented with an electric car
[43:31] Speaker 16: so these new categories aren't always a win but this
[43:34] Speaker 16: is something really interesting that's been rumored.
[43:36] Speaker 8: For quite a while.
[43:38] Speaker 3: A story everyone's really getting their teeth into on the
[43:40] Speaker 3: Bloomberg Terminal and the website. Bloomberg, Sam Kelly, thank you
[43:43] Speaker 3: very much indeed. That does it for this edition of
[43:45] Speaker 3: Bloomberg Tech. Lots going on in the world of financial markets, technology.
[43:50] Speaker 3: Recap everything on the podcast. You know where to find it,
[43:53] Speaker 3: on the Bloomberg Terminal, as well as online on Apple, Spotify,
[43:57] Speaker 3: and iHeart. This is Bloomberg Tech.

Shows are listed from Apple Podcasts' charts and directory, and Podcast Index where it is used. Every show and episode belongs to its publisher and plays from the publisher's own feed; this site hosts none of them.