# Don't You Know Who I Am?: The Hollywood Con Queen

An episode of [Ridiculous Crime](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1608230191), 17 Sep 2026, 55 min.

Audio: https://podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/0b4bcc39-7ba2-453f-aaac-ae510011dd80/13bd3ef9-e277-4bd4-bb6c-b4c7015aa6ea/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=3a4c50f5-ff69-4807-aa26-ae510011dd8e

For good or for bad, Hollywood is the land of promises and illusion. Getting the right phone call at the right time can make a career...or it can drain a bank account. The Hollywood Con Queen convinced aspriring stars that fame and fortune were within their reach, with the payment of some fees. But like most cons, it all came crashing down, this time in an ending full of Tinseltown twists. And it wouldn't be a true Hollywood episode without a celebrity cameo, now would it? See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:00] Speaker 1: Ridiculous Crime is a production of iHeartRadio.
[0:03] Speaker 2: Zarin.
[0:04] Speaker 3: Elizabeth. How are you? I'm doing pretty well. I've been
[0:06] Speaker 3: waiting in here for you. So excited to see you.
[0:09] Speaker 2: How are you, friend?
[0:10] Speaker 3: I'm doing darn good, buddy.
[0:12] Speaker 2: A question for you.
[0:13] Speaker 3: What's that, pal?
[0:15] Speaker 2: You know it's ridiculous.
[0:16] Speaker 3: Oh, yes, do I?
[0:18] Speaker 2: Go ahead, bud.
[0:19] Speaker 3: Tell me about it. So I saw this headline and
[0:23] Speaker 3: I actually had to pinch myself to see if I
[0:25] Speaker 3: was dreaming. But I don't pinch myself. I just punch
[0:27] Speaker 3: myself in the leg. And I was like, no, that hurt.
[0:29] Speaker 3: I am not dreaming. So it turns out that here's
[0:32] Speaker 3: the headline. I'll just read you the headline. You'll be like, Zarin,
[0:34] Speaker 3: did you dream this? Are we both dreaming right now?
[0:36] Speaker 2: Oh, I love this already. Stolen.
[0:39] Speaker 3: LAPD investigating Nicolas Cage movie stolen from Netflix amid a
[0:43] Speaker 3: $ 105 million lawsuit over mystery disappearance. The Los Angeles Police
[0:47] Speaker 3: Department is investigating the case of the missing Nicolas Cage
[0:50] Speaker 3: movie at Netflix, which has been missing for two months.
[0:54] Speaker 2: Wait, what?
[0:55] Speaker 3: So somebody stole a movie that Nicolas Cage is starring in.
[0:58] Speaker 3: So they stole a Nicolas Cage movie. And people don't
[1:01] Speaker 3: know what to do. They don't know where the film is.
[1:02] Speaker 2: There's only one copy?
[1:04] Speaker 3: I don't know. I don't think that's the case. Maybe.
[1:07] Speaker 3: Maybe they stole all the film, like the actual film.
[1:10] Speaker 3: And they're like, yeah, we got it. We're going to
[1:11] Speaker 3: hold it hostage or whatever. But I just love that
[1:14] Speaker 3: the people who saw this ahead of me, They were like,
[1:17] Speaker 3: this sounds like a Nicolas Cage movie about a Nicolas
[1:21] Speaker 3: Cage movie that gets stolen. It's like, how much of
[1:25] Speaker 3: an Ouroboros is this?
[1:26] Speaker 2: Right, right.
[1:27] Speaker 3: So there you go. I was like, you know, and
[1:30] Speaker 3: I'm going to obviously keep my finger on this one
[1:33] Speaker 3: and see if it actually turns into a story and
[1:35] Speaker 3: I can make it into a full episode.
[1:36] Speaker 2: Oh, that'd be amazing.
[1:37] Speaker 3: Because I, of course, love Nicolas Cage. Yeah. We must
[1:39] Speaker 3: know more. And do you know what else, Elizabeth? Huh? Ridiculous.
[1:44] Speaker 2: Very ridiculous. Do you want to know what else is ridiculous?
[1:47] Speaker 3: Oh my God, I'm here for it.
[1:48] Speaker 2: Playing pretend in order to line your pockets. It's the
[1:52] Speaker 2: Hollywood way.
[1:54] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[1:55] Speaker 2: Yeah. This is Ridiculous Crime, a podcast about absurd and
[2:18] Speaker 2: outrageous capers, heists, and cons. It's always 99% murder-free and 100% ridiculous.
[2:27] Speaker 3: Oh, you're damn right.
[2:28] Speaker 2: Yes, I'm right. Zarin, you spent time in Hollywood. You
[2:31] Speaker 2: did time.
[2:32] Speaker 3: Oh, my God, yeah. Now, by the way, if you
[2:34] Speaker 3: hear a bunch of noise, it's just the interns won't
[2:36] Speaker 3: leave me alone right now.
[2:37] Speaker 2: You're very popular with the interns.
[2:38] Speaker 3: Yeah, but they're panting. I don't know. It's a whole
[2:40] Speaker 3: deal with them.
[2:42] Speaker 2: You know, that's what I get for always bringing the
[2:44] Speaker 2: interns to work with me.
[2:45] Speaker 3: Yeah, so.
[2:46] Speaker 2: You know, I want to give them work experience so
[2:48] Speaker 2: I can sign off on it.
[2:49] Speaker 3: Yeah, real on-the-job experience that is translatable into their future tasks.
[2:53] Speaker 2: Exactly. We're all about growth.
[2:55] Speaker 3: Yeah, you know what that is?
[2:58] Speaker 2: But anyway.
[2:59] Speaker 3: Yes, I did spend time in Hollywood. Oh, my God,
[3:01] Speaker 3: did I.
[3:01] Speaker 2: You've experienced firsthand the business side of things. Yes. And
[3:05] Speaker 2: how different it is from the way the rest of
[3:07] Speaker 2: the world works.
[3:08] Speaker 3: Oh, my God. Yes. The business part is not business
[3:12] Speaker 3: in any traditional sense. No. But yet, they are very
[3:15] Speaker 3: focused on the bottom line.
[3:16] Speaker 2: Yes.
[3:17] Speaker 3: Like 19th century business was.
[3:19] Speaker 2: Right, exactly.
[3:19] Speaker 3: It's like robber barons were running a creative industry.
[3:23] Speaker 2: Basically, yeah. My only brush with it involved my book.
[3:28] Speaker 2: So not too long after that book came out.
[3:31] Speaker 3: What is the title of that book, Elizabeth? Driftwood. There
[3:33] Speaker 3: you go.
[3:33] Speaker 2: Maybe like a month or so. I don't know.
[3:35] Speaker 3: It's a great book.
[3:35] Speaker 2: I have no sense of time, but it was not
[3:38] Speaker 2: too long after the book came out. My phone went nuts.
[3:41] Speaker 3: Your phone?
[3:42] Speaker 2: One day. Notifications like crazy, like alert sounds I'd never
[3:46] Speaker 2: heard before.
[3:47] Speaker 3: What happened?
[3:47] Speaker 2: Well, I was in the middle of a very stressful situation,
[3:51] Speaker 2: so I couldn't check to see what was going on.
[3:53] Speaker 2: I was driving. It was horrible. When I finally was
[3:56] Speaker 2: able to look at my phone, I saw all these
[3:59] Speaker 2: mentions of someone named Emma Roberts. And I'm like, Emma Roberts,
[4:04] Speaker 2: did I go to high school with her or something?
[4:06] Speaker 3: Isn't that like Eric Roberts' daughter, Julia Roberts' niece? Yes.
[4:08] Speaker 2: But at the time, I had no idea who she was.
[4:11] Speaker 2: And I was like, well, who is that? And so
[4:13] Speaker 2: like the emails and phone calls and texts and social
[4:16] Speaker 2: media notifications and DMs were intense.
[4:19] Speaker 3: I bet.
[4:20] Speaker 2: And I was able to finally like determine that Emma
[4:23] Speaker 2: Roberts is an actress. I didn't go to high school
[4:26] Speaker 2: with her. And she had in a very transparent bid
[4:30] Speaker 2: for attention, been photographed leaving Earth Cafe in LA with
[4:34] Speaker 2: my book under her arm.
[4:36] Speaker 3: Oh, wow. And it hit the paparazzi got it? Yes, yes.
[4:39] Speaker 2: And the cover was like conspicuously displayed.
[4:42] Speaker 3: For the world to see. Yeah, easy to read.
[4:44] Speaker 2: She's carrying it like no one would carry a book.
[4:46] Speaker 3: TMZ runs a picture.
[4:47] Speaker 2: It ran in the Daily Mail.
[4:48] Speaker 3: Whoa, the UK tabloid.
[4:50] Speaker 2: And so apparently she wanted to play the part of
[4:53] Speaker 2: the lead character in the book, Clem, In the movie
[4:57] Speaker 2: version of the book. Oh, wow. Except there was no
[5:00] Speaker 2: movie version in the works.
[5:01] Speaker 3: Oh, there's that.
[5:03] Speaker 2: So I had calls and emails from the publisher. They
[5:06] Speaker 2: wanted to help me make this happen. But then I
[5:09] Speaker 2: remembered something. In my contract, I'd retained the film, TV,
[5:13] Speaker 2: and merchandising rights.
[5:14] Speaker 3: Smart.
[5:15] Speaker 2: 100%. Very smart. Usually you split it with the publisher.
[5:18] Speaker 2: Not me. I had it all. Uh, and so they
[5:21] Speaker 2: wanted to renegotiate.
[5:22] Speaker 3: I bet they did. Yeah.
[5:23] Speaker 2: And I said, what is your mother, a lawyer or something?
[5:26] Speaker 2: I said, big nope. Um, but that also left me
[5:29] Speaker 2: alone twisting in the wind as to how to make
[5:31] Speaker 2: this happen. Cause at this point too, I'd fired my agent.
[5:34] Speaker 3: Okay. And now they're like, there's nothing in it for us.
[5:36] Speaker 3: Good luck.
[5:37] Speaker 2: Bye.
[5:37] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[5:38] Speaker 2: Um, and so I, I don't know how to write
[5:40] Speaker 2: a movie script. You know, I'm a poet turned author, Zarin.
[5:44] Speaker 3: That's true.
[5:44] Speaker 2: So, you know, what do I know?
[5:46] Speaker 3: Emphasis on the poet.
[5:46] Speaker 2: And then Emma Roberts DM'd me on Twitter.
[5:49] Speaker 3: What? Yeah.
[5:50] Speaker 2: Back when I was on there. My claim to fame
[5:53] Speaker 2: at the time was that Erykah Badu followed me. Ooh, nice. Yeah.
[5:56] Speaker 2: I was a different person back then.
[5:58] Speaker 3: That's impressive.
[5:59] Speaker 2: Far more interesting.
[6:00] Speaker 3: I have stars in my eyes, Elizabeth.
[6:01] Speaker 2: So Emma Roberts told me how much she loved the
[6:04] Speaker 2: book and that she simply had to play Clem. And
[6:07] Speaker 2: I told her, great, let's make that happen. Yes, she said.
[6:11] Speaker 2: And then I never heard from her again. hollywood baby
[6:15] Speaker 2: that is hollywood to a d yeah so i eventually
[6:18] Speaker 2: worked with a screenwriter who adapted the book and like
[6:21] Speaker 2: shopped it around to studios except his versions just kept
[6:25] Speaker 2: getting further and further away from the plot and the
[6:28] Speaker 2: characters of the book like how's that oh like it
[6:31] Speaker 2: changed the family relationships it changed the end it changed
[6:35] Speaker 2: the point of it okay It changed the book. It
[6:39] Speaker 2: became a totally different beast.
[6:41] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[6:41] Speaker 2: But I got plenty of updates about how someone at
[6:44] Speaker 2: Sony or Paramount or whoever was reading it and really
[6:47] Speaker 2: into it and then passed. And I never saw any
[6:50] Speaker 2: notes about why. That's so frustrating. Yeah, pretty soon that
[6:54] Speaker 2: all went away too. And so I never adapted the
[6:56] Speaker 2: book to a screenplay, but I learned an incredible amount
[6:59] Speaker 2: about Hollywood. There are a million promises.
[7:03] Speaker 3: No one ever wants to say no.
[7:04] Speaker 2: No, but, and it's the kind of promises that if
[7:07] Speaker 2: you made them in any other business, someone would hold
[7:09] Speaker 2: you to it.
[7:10] Speaker 3: Oh yeah. They're almost like, wait, it's not a verbal contract.
[7:12] Speaker 3: They're like, no, it's Hollywood talk.
[7:13] Speaker 2: So not in Hollywood, yeah. Promises and words mean nothing.
[7:17] Speaker 2: But they also mean everything.
[7:19] Speaker 3: Yes, that's the other thing.
[7:19] Speaker 2: Because deals happen over phone calls. Like someone knows someone
[7:23] Speaker 2: who can make something happen. Everything's connections and timing and
[7:27] Speaker 2: luck and vibes. Well, and now bean counting too.
[7:30] Speaker 3: But yeah, that's always underneath it. But you're right about
[7:33] Speaker 3: the impetus for business is often like, I just love this.
[7:36] Speaker 3: And some star wants to do it. So it could
[7:38] Speaker 3: be totally dead. Then some star comes along and all
[7:40] Speaker 3: of a sudden everyone's super excited again.
[7:42] Speaker 2: They've totally done.
[7:43] Speaker 3: Like a 180 on how they feel about it. No,
[7:44] Speaker 3: this is the best project. We're all really excited at
[7:46] Speaker 3: the production.
[7:47] Speaker 2: And stuff gets rolling without papers signed or anything. And
[7:51] Speaker 2: so what is important for this story I'm going to
[7:55] Speaker 2: tell you is that in Hollywood, nothing is real.
[7:58] Speaker 1: No.
[7:58] Speaker 2: And you know that, and I now know that. Images
[8:01] Speaker 2: themselves aren't real, honestly, so what it's built on. But
[8:04] Speaker 2: the deals and people and promises come and go. So
[8:07] Speaker 2: like an image projected on a screen, they appear before
[8:10] Speaker 2: you as if it's just by magic. And then they
[8:13] Speaker 2: vanish into the ether just the same. So this loosey-goosey
[8:18] Speaker 2: nature of things can be maddening or exciting. It can
[8:22] Speaker 2: be the stuff of dreams or nightmares. And it is
[8:25] Speaker 2: something that is infinitely exploitable by the con artists and
[8:29] Speaker 2: flim flammers and crimers of the world.
[8:31] Speaker 3: Oh my God, they love Hollywood.
[8:33] Speaker 2: They love it.
[8:33] Speaker 3: They run rampant there and it's hard to tell them
[8:35] Speaker 3: apart because they know how to imitate the real.
[8:37] Speaker 2: Yes.
[8:37] Speaker 3: And they also just kind of act like the real
[8:39] Speaker 3: ones anyway.
[8:40] Speaker 2: And sometimes the real ones kind of step into that territory. Yeah, exactly.
[8:44] Speaker 2: So that's what I have for you today. The story
[8:46] Speaker 2: of someone that people have dubbed the Hollywood con queen.
[8:51] Speaker 3: Oh, nice.
[8:53] Speaker 2: So somebody figured out that exploitable structure or lack thereof,
[8:58] Speaker 2: and spent about seven years from 2013 to 2020 doing
[9:02] Speaker 2: almost nothing but building elaborate impersonations of powerful, accomplished women
[9:09] Speaker 2: in entertainment and high society. Hundreds of industry workers and
[9:14] Speaker 2: influencers got pulled in with this promise of like dream jobs,
[9:18] Speaker 2: particularly in Indonesia. Okay. There were fees for some of
[9:23] Speaker 2: the aspects of the job, but that's showbiz, baby.
[9:26] Speaker 3: Oh yeah, you gotta pay to play sometimes.
[9:27] Speaker 2: Yeah, so these targets were strung along, they were confused
[9:30] Speaker 2: and quietly bled of cash before the whole thing evaporated.
[9:35] Speaker 3: Over and over again.
[9:35] Speaker 2: Over and over again. So victims were coerced into paying
[9:38] Speaker 2: for what were called expenses. Stuff like acting lessons or
[9:42] Speaker 2: personal trainers early on. Then travel costs, visas, airfares, hotel stays.
[9:49] Speaker 2: And once they got there, they were asked to pay
[9:52] Speaker 2: for expensive car services and driving arrangements. Sometimes they had
[9:56] Speaker 2: to fork over sums into the thousands or tens of thousands.
[10:00] Speaker 2: always with a promise of reimbursement.
[10:02] Speaker 3: Of course.
[10:02] Speaker 2: We're going to pay you back.
[10:03] Speaker 3: Down the line. Yeah.
[10:04] Speaker 2: And I don't know if the acting classes or like
[10:06] Speaker 2: training sessions ever actually happened that they paid for. I
[10:09] Speaker 2: just know that they were paid for and they never
[10:11] Speaker 2: got their money back. So payments were wired to overseas accounts.
[10:15] Speaker 2: And so that made it really hard to trace this money.
[10:17] Speaker 3: Oh, yeah. And again, to get it back.
[10:19] Speaker 2: There was a network of all these unwitting proxies on
[10:22] Speaker 2: the ground to help carry out instructions and collect funds.
[10:26] Speaker 2: Like a money man would roll up on a moped
[10:28] Speaker 2: to collect money.
[10:30] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[10:30] Speaker 2: So multiply.
[10:31] Speaker 3: This is elaborate.
[10:32] Speaker 2: Multiply that by hundreds of victims over several years.
[10:36] Speaker 3: Hundreds.
[10:36] Speaker 2: And we're talking like seven figures taken in this.
[10:39] Speaker 3: Damn, Hollywood con queen.
[10:40] Speaker 2: Right?
[10:40] Speaker 3: It was a queen.
[10:41] Speaker 2: It was a queen. So if anyone got too curious
[10:44] Speaker 2: or started asking like really pointed questions, then a fixer
[10:48] Speaker 2: known only as the boss man, a guy who was
[10:51] Speaker 2: like fluent in both English and Indonesian, he'd step in
[10:54] Speaker 2: to smooth things over. And occasionally... Like physically step in?
[10:59] Speaker 2: Like show up at your front door?
[11:00] Speaker 3: No, no, no.
[11:00] Speaker 2: Just like.
[11:01] Speaker 3: Oh, just like start doing calls and emails or whatever?
[11:03] Speaker 2: And occasionally there would be like a light threat about
[11:06] Speaker 2: like visa status thrown in for good measure. Meanwhile, on
[11:10] Speaker 2: the phone, the targets were told they were like one
[11:12] Speaker 2: day away from meeting the director, the producer, whoever.
[11:16] Speaker 3: Oh, sure.
[11:17] Speaker 2: And then the shoot would like mysteriously slip again.
[11:20] Speaker 3: And are they in Indonesia when this is happening?
[11:22] Speaker 2: Yes. Oh, Lord. Yeah. And so, of course, there was
[11:25] Speaker 2: never a job.
[11:25] Speaker 3: That's the worst kind of isolation. That's like a cult isolation.
[11:28] Speaker 2: Yes. You don't speak the language.
[11:30] Speaker 3: Who can you go to for help? There's no one
[11:31] Speaker 3: there to say, oh, chasing after a dream.
[11:34] Speaker 2: Along the way, there were some victims who were asked
[11:37] Speaker 2: to prep mood boards for shoots at Hindu temples. Oh, no.
[11:41] Speaker 2: Or they had to memorize dialogue for scenes that would
[11:43] Speaker 2: never be filmed. Oh, no. Or they had to, quote,
[11:46] Speaker 2: audition over the phone in ways that had nothing to
[11:48] Speaker 2: do with their acting ability. So it wasn't limited to
[11:51] Speaker 2: just like actors.
[11:52] Speaker 3: Yeah, so like the above the line talent.
[11:54] Speaker 2: Yeah, the above the line crew. Hair and makeup artists
[11:57] Speaker 2: got like these glamorous gigs dangled in front of them.
[12:02] Speaker 2: One was told that he'd be working on a Tom
[12:04] Speaker 2: Cruise movie set in outer space. Yeah.
[12:08] Speaker 3: But filming in Indonesia.
[12:09] Speaker 2: Stuntmen and like ex-military types got pulled in too. One
[12:13] Speaker 2: was told that a private equity billionaire needed him for
[12:16] Speaker 2: like an elite security detail. Another one got promised a
[12:19] Speaker 2: role in the next Indiana Jones. And then these are
[12:24] Speaker 2: all rather believable.
[12:25] Speaker 3: Why are you being in Indonesia?
[12:27] Speaker 2: Right. So then like several of the guys were maneuvered
[12:30] Speaker 2: into sexually charged video calls that they hadn't signed up for.
[12:33] Speaker 3: Wait, what? Like take your shirt off there.
[12:35] Speaker 2: Yeah. What tied every version of the con together was
[12:39] Speaker 2: just the sheer amount of homework behind it. So the
[12:42] Speaker 2: impersonator did real research on each mark, built a pitch
[12:46] Speaker 2: specifically engineered to hook that person. And because the entire
[12:50] Speaker 2: scheme ran on reputation and appearances. These are the two
[12:54] Speaker 2: currencies that Hollywood trades in.
[12:55] Speaker 3: Oh, yes.
[12:56] Speaker 2: Plenty of victims were too embarrassed to admit they'd been taken.
[12:59] Speaker 3: Oh, yeah. They definitely didn't want anyone to know.
[13:01] Speaker 2: And we've seen that so often.
[13:03] Speaker 3: The rich often do that with con artists. And if
[13:05] Speaker 3: you're trying to make it, you don't want to look
[13:06] Speaker 3: like a sucker.
[13:07] Speaker 2: Right. And that's what helps the scam survive as long
[13:09] Speaker 2: as they do. So starting around 2017, the caller was
[13:14] Speaker 2: impersonating like genuinely major names. Amy Pascal, Hollywood producer and
[13:19] Speaker 2: executive director. and chair of the Motion Pictures Group of
[13:23] Speaker 2: Sony Pictures Entertainment.
[13:24] Speaker 3: Yes, the one who got up in the Sony hack.
[13:26] Speaker 2: Yes, I was going to say, she had her own
[13:28] Speaker 2: little set too, and I think you should do an
[13:30] Speaker 2: episode on that.
[13:31] Speaker 1: Oh, okay.
[13:31] Speaker 2: Sony hack. There was also Kathleen Kennedy, co-founder of Amblin
[13:35] Speaker 2: Entertainment with Steven Spielberg.
[13:37] Speaker 3: Steven Spielberg, right-hand woman.
[13:38] Speaker 2: President of Lucasfilm from 2012 to 2026. We have Stacey Snyder,
[13:44] Speaker 2: former chair of Universal Pictures.
[13:46] Speaker 3: Oh, snap.
[13:47] Speaker 2: She's also been the CEO of both DreamWorks and 20th
[13:49] Speaker 2: Century Fox.
[13:51] Speaker 3: Heavy hitter.
[13:51] Speaker 2: These are heavy hitters. So the scammer would pose as
[13:55] Speaker 2: these big bosses in order to lure industry insiders with
[13:58] Speaker 2: these job offers and then drain their bank accounts. So
[14:03] Speaker 2: individual losses range from like a few thousand dollars up to.
[14:08] Speaker 3: $ 150, 000.
[14:10] Speaker 2: Other executives whose identities were borrowed along the way included
[14:14] Speaker 2: producer and philanthropist Gigi Pritzker.
[14:17] Speaker 3: Okay.
[14:17] Speaker 2: Cousin of Illinois Governor J.B. Pritzker. You know, they all
[14:20] Speaker 2: got that Hyatt money. Former Paramount chief Sherry Lansing. Oh, yeah.
[14:25] Speaker 3: Sherry Lansing. Hell yeah.
[14:27] Speaker 2: And Leslie Linka Glatter, who was a director EP for
[14:32] Speaker 2: like Homeland, Walking Dead, Mad Men.
[14:35] Speaker 3: I don't know her.
[14:35] Speaker 2: Yeah. Leslie Linka Glatter. So whoever was behind the mask
[14:39] Speaker 2: had range. They had charm. flattery, intimidation, all on tap,
[14:45] Speaker 2: depending on what the moment called for.
[14:47] Speaker 3: Yeah, what was needed, huh?
[14:48] Speaker 2: Yeah, and people who spoke to her described a voice
[14:51] Speaker 2: that was like intense, sharp, completely convincing, fast, fluent, never
[14:56] Speaker 2: once slipping.
[14:57] Speaker 3: Like an American English accent?
[15:00] Speaker 2: Yes, yes. On one particularly industrious day, she reportedly spoke
[15:05] Speaker 2: to 436 different people.
[15:06] Speaker 1: What?
[15:06] Speaker 3: What?
[15:08] Speaker 2: And fielded emails from six continents, everywhere but Antarctica.
[15:14] Speaker 3: Could your voice hold up for 140 calls, let alone 400?
[15:18] Speaker 2: No, and my nerves couldn't either. And she could turn
[15:22] Speaker 2: on the warmth just as easily as the menace. So
[15:25] Speaker 2: she would dangle promises of five-star hotels, private islands, keep
[15:29] Speaker 2: them all dreaming.
[15:30] Speaker 3: That feels very Hollywood. If you've been there for a minute,
[15:32] Speaker 3: the charm and then also the shark flashes its teeth.
[15:35] Speaker 2: Yes, exactly. So let's pause here for an ad break.
[15:39] Speaker 2: One of the realities of the biz. And when we
[15:41] Speaker 2: come back, serious scamming in Tinseltown. Hell yeah. All right, Zarin.
[16:05] Speaker 3: Hello, Elizabeth.
[16:06] Speaker 2: I have given you an overview of this crime.
[16:08] Speaker 3: Yes, you really brought me in.
[16:10] Speaker 2: I'm scared. Now let's get to specifics. Exhibit A, The Photographer.
[16:15] Speaker 3: Okay.
[16:16] Speaker 2: Now, I want to say that the most detail-oriented article
[16:19] Speaker 2: about this is Scott Johnson's piece in The Hollywood Reporter. Okay.
[16:22] Speaker 2: It's a great source. Anyway, so The Hollywood Reporter's story
[16:26] Speaker 2: leans on one especially detailed account. A 27-year-old freelance documentary photographer...
[16:33] Speaker 2: got an email in late 2017 that appeared to come
[16:36] Speaker 2: from Amy Pascal, the former Sony Pictures co-chair. She wanted
[16:42] Speaker 2: to know if he'd be interested in a project in Indonesia.
[16:46] Speaker 2: And they spoke by phone the next day. And afterward,
[16:49] Speaker 2: he noticed that the sender's domain, pascalfilms.com, didn't correspond to
[16:55] Speaker 2: anything real online.
[16:56] Speaker 3: Yeah. She doesn't have a Pascal Films that I'm aware of.
[17:00] Speaker 2: He talked himself out of this red flag. You know,
[17:03] Speaker 2: because she'd been through that.
[17:05] Speaker 3: Hack, right? Oh, and she needed to get, okay, a
[17:07] Speaker 3: new thing going.
[17:08] Speaker 2: He's thinking, well, maybe she was just being cautious about
[17:11] Speaker 2: her digital footprint. Like, that's reasonable enough.
[17:13] Speaker 3: Yeah, that is reasonable. I won't judge him.
[17:15] Speaker 2: And then on later calls, she flattered him really convincingly,
[17:19] Speaker 2: like name-checked his photography with, like, super familiarity.
[17:22] Speaker 3: Okay.
[17:23] Speaker 2: She's dropping details about his past clients that like a
[17:26] Speaker 2: stranger shouldn't have known.
[17:28] Speaker 3: Okay. So it feels like she did her research.
[17:30] Speaker 2: She did her research and she knew people who knew people.
[17:33] Speaker 2: And so the pitch that followed was a good one.
[17:36] Speaker 2: She was reinventing herself post-hack and she wanted to make
[17:40] Speaker 2: a pair of short documentaries. And she's like, I've found
[17:43] Speaker 2: my guy. It's you.
[17:45] Speaker 3: Forget Deakins. I want you.
[17:47] Speaker 2: Yes. So she wanted someone with the right eye and
[17:51] Speaker 2: who might even graduate to directing. And you know, everybody
[17:55] Speaker 2: just wants to direct.
[17:55] Speaker 3: Everyone wants to direct Elizabeth.
[17:57] Speaker 2: So he'd fly to Indonesia, shoot landscapes and temples for
[18:01] Speaker 2: about a week to build a pitch deck for financing.
[18:05] Speaker 2: And then she'd handle the hotel while he fronted airfare, drivers, translators, food,
[18:10] Speaker 2: all of which she would reimburse him for.
[18:12] Speaker 3: Of course.
[18:13] Speaker 2: And then a contract arrived and it looked legitimate because
[18:16] Speaker 2: it was more polished than most freelance paperwork.
[18:19] Speaker 3: Oh, yeah. It wasn't just like a boilerplate contract.
[18:22] Speaker 2: Exactly. So partway through the trip, she's like, actually, can
[18:25] Speaker 2: you extend your stay? I need you to stay there longer.
[18:28] Speaker 2: And then the relationship kept escalating in like strange directions
[18:32] Speaker 2: from there. She mentioned knowing that he had parents on
[18:35] Speaker 2: the East Coast and she floated the idea of becoming his, quote,
[18:39] Speaker 2: mother in L.A. Oh, yeah.
[18:43] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[18:43] Speaker 2: I want to be your mommy here.
[18:44] Speaker 3: I mean, I had some interesting relationships, but usually they
[18:47] Speaker 3: were of the quasi-sexual relationship, not the I want to
[18:49] Speaker 3: be your mother.
[18:50] Speaker 2: Well, I have like what I call my L.A. mom
[18:53] Speaker 2: and L.A. dad, my friend Laura's parents.
[18:55] Speaker 3: Well, that's different.
[18:56] Speaker 2: Because they were like parents to me.
[18:58] Speaker 3: Yeah. I had older successful women in Hollywood try to
[19:01] Speaker 3: do the thing, but it wasn't that. It was like,
[19:04] Speaker 3: I want to be your mommy. Yeah.
[19:08] Speaker 2: This, I think, was, I don't know, maybe she called
[19:11] Speaker 2: him constantly. Oh, wow. And sometimes, like, multiple times a day,
[19:14] Speaker 2: sometimes at four in the morning.
[19:15] Speaker 3: Uh-huh.
[19:16] Speaker 2: When he admitted to being jet lagged, she snapped.
[19:20] Speaker 3: What?
[19:20] Speaker 2: And she's like, I don't work with tired people. Like,
[19:23] Speaker 2: Hollywood runs on drive, not rest. So he started doing
[19:28] Speaker 2: push-ups before dawn to, like, psych himself up for her calls.
[19:31] Speaker 2: And he was, like, sleeping even less.
[19:33] Speaker 3: Oh, God.
[19:33] Speaker 2: Like, pre-dawn push-ups is a very L.A.
[19:36] Speaker 3: Thing to me. 100%. Like, it is.
[19:38] Speaker 2: And so... Like, every time the reimbursements failed to appear,
[19:42] Speaker 2: Amy Pascal had, like, a new elaborate excuse. Like, oh,
[19:47] Speaker 2: I had the wrong ABA number.
[19:49] Speaker 3: Or like, oh, no.
[19:49] Speaker 2: A business account wire that needed extra processing time that's
[19:52] Speaker 2: what it is or well actually you know the holidays
[19:55] Speaker 2: are slowing everything down i told my assistant yes i
[19:58] Speaker 2: gotta fire another assistant over this um when he finally
[20:01] Speaker 2: got home she told him to turn right back around
[20:04] Speaker 2: for bali are you kidding yeah apparently a producer needed
[20:07] Speaker 2: quote that quintessential bali look So by this point, like
[20:12] Speaker 2: his suspicion is caught up.
[20:13] Speaker 3: That's not a cheap place to be staying.
[20:15] Speaker 1: No.
[20:16] Speaker 2: His suspicion caught up with his exhaustion.
[20:18] Speaker 3: Good.
[20:19] Speaker 2: And he's like, you know what? Can you verify your
[20:21] Speaker 2: identity over video? Can we video chat? And that detonated
[20:26] Speaker 2: the relationship. Like she was furious. Then she pivoted to guilt.
[20:30] Speaker 2: She's like, you know what? You walk away now, you're
[20:33] Speaker 2: going to waste everything you already put in. And, like,
[20:36] Speaker 2: he's pushing back hard, and then he winds up going
[20:39] Speaker 2: back to Bali anyway.
[20:41] Speaker 3: Oh, brother.
[20:42] Speaker 2: He went badly, Zarin.
[20:43] Speaker 3: People, the dreamers, they can be so manipulated because they
[20:46] Speaker 3: want it. They want it to be true. And he's
[20:47] Speaker 3: so close. It's right. You can almost feel it.
[20:50] Speaker 2: And, like, this fantasy of what could happen. Yes.
[20:53] Speaker 3: And all the stories of how people make it are
[20:55] Speaker 3: just this ridiculous.
[20:56] Speaker 2: Yes. So he, it didn't go that well. He flew
[21:01] Speaker 2: home having burned through his life savings.
[21:03] Speaker 1: Oh.
[21:04] Speaker 2: And she kept calling. She promised a meeting in New
[21:06] Speaker 2: York that never happened. By late January, his emails to
[21:10] Speaker 2: her started bouncing. And then all told, he was out
[21:14] Speaker 2: about like $ 65, 000 of his own money.
[21:17] Speaker 3: $ 65, 000.
[21:18] Speaker 2: Some of it on his own travel expenses. Yeah. Even
[21:22] Speaker 2: more on the various costs and fees he paid to
[21:25] Speaker 2: quote Amy Pascal.
[21:26] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[21:28] Speaker 2: All right, Zarin. Exhibit B.
[21:30] Speaker 3: Okay.
[21:31] Speaker 2: Kenny and the Marine.
[21:32] Speaker 1: Okay.
[21:33] Speaker 2: So the photographer wasn't an isolated case. He was just
[21:37] Speaker 2: the most thoroughly documented one. Like a few other stories
[21:40] Speaker 2: round out the picture, though, of how far this thing traveled.
[21:44] Speaker 2: So we have Kenny. Kenny landed in Jakarta and was
[21:48] Speaker 2: met by a driver who whisked him to this nice hotel.
[21:52] Speaker 2: Like nothing about the setup felt like a scam. He
[21:55] Speaker 2: had a private car. Meals were covered some days. Like
[21:57] Speaker 2: there were regular check-ins from this rotating cast of handlers.
[22:03] Speaker 2: And that included a fake line producer and a fake
[22:05] Speaker 2: show lawyer. So he's meeting these people.
[22:08] Speaker 1: Totally.
[22:08] Speaker 3: And this is very convincing. I've been flown out of
[22:10] Speaker 3: the country for a project, and you're standing in an
[22:14] Speaker 3: airport in rural Mexico, and somebody pulls up, and they're like,
[22:17] Speaker 3: and all of a sudden you get in a car
[22:20] Speaker 3: with somebody who's, you know, nothing. So you get pulled
[22:22] Speaker 3: so far out of what you expect that how do
[22:24] Speaker 3: you know what is real, what is appropriate, any of it.
[22:28] Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. So that's what happens to these guys. He
[22:32] Speaker 2: handed over his bank details for a, quote, reimbursement that
[22:36] Speaker 2: came with a confirmation number.
[22:37] Speaker 3: Oh, God.
[22:38] Speaker 2: And that made the whole thing feel like legitimate.
[22:40] Speaker 3: Yeah, of course.
[22:41] Speaker 2: Right up until it wasn't. He went on what he
[22:44] Speaker 2: believed were real location scouts. But the promised meeting with
[22:48] Speaker 2: this person D, the supposed producer, never happened. Every expense
[22:53] Speaker 2: along the way, translators, permits, guides, came with an official-looking
[22:57] Speaker 2: receipt from a logistics company.
[23:00] Speaker 3: Okay.
[23:01] Speaker 2: It's a nice touch if you're going to run this
[23:02] Speaker 2: kind of con.
[23:03] Speaker 3: Very smart. People love paperwork.
[23:05] Speaker 2: Makes it feel real. Yeah, he's thinking, oh, I've got
[23:07] Speaker 2: the paperwork. It never sees a dime.
[23:09] Speaker 3: I turn these in, they give me the week, they
[23:10] Speaker 3: recompense me.
[23:11] Speaker 2: Never sees a dime. Then there's the Marine. In March
[23:14] Speaker 2: of 2017, a former Marine and Iraq War veteran working
[23:18] Speaker 2: private security in Bangkok got a call from a man
[23:22] Speaker 2: calling himself Jason Cohen. And Jason claimed to work for
[23:26] Speaker 2: Christine Hurst Schwarzman. And she was supposedly an intellectual property
[23:32] Speaker 2: lawyer married to Stephen Schwarzman, founder of private equity firm Blackstone.
[23:36] Speaker 3: Yeah, okay.
[23:37] Speaker 2: So we're talking like billionaires.
[23:38] Speaker 3: Oh, hell yeah.
[23:39] Speaker 2: Before long, Schwarzman herself, Long Island accent and all, was
[23:44] Speaker 2: on the line.
[23:44] Speaker 1: Huh.
[23:45] Speaker 2: And, like, she would dangle a job running security because
[23:48] Speaker 2: she was, like, pursuing a directing career across Southeast Asia. Like,
[23:52] Speaker 2: as you do.
[23:53] Speaker 3: Of course.
[23:54] Speaker 2: And then things got weird. Like, so she had a
[23:57] Speaker 2: habit of testing loyalty through this odd role play.
[24:00] Speaker 3: How so?
[24:01] Speaker 2: At one point, she told the Marine to fire Cohen
[24:05] Speaker 2: just to prove that he had backbone. And he did
[24:08] Speaker 2: it on a call with the three of them. And
[24:10] Speaker 2: then she's like, hey, turn on your webcam. Okay. I
[24:13] Speaker 2: want to talk to you. And mine's off for, quote,
[24:16] Speaker 2: security reasons. And it should be noted that no one
[24:19] Speaker 2: ever saw her face on video, but she did a
[24:22] Speaker 2: lot of video calls.
[24:23] Speaker 3: Let me see you.
[24:24] Speaker 2: She asked to see his tattoos and then got all
[24:27] Speaker 2: flirtatious in a way that made him feel really uncomfortable
[24:30] Speaker 2: and just hang up.
[24:31] Speaker 3: He hung up.
[24:32] Speaker 2: He hung up. She talked about wanting to expand her security, quote, family.
[24:37] Speaker 2: And so the Marine ended up referring a bunch of
[24:40] Speaker 2: people that he knew, like good buddies, like snipers.
[24:43] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[24:44] Speaker 2: Special forces vets. Green berets. Yeah.
[24:46] Speaker 3: Damn.
[24:47] Speaker 2: And most of them got the same treatment. Like they
[24:49] Speaker 2: had to fire Cohen. They would have to.
[24:52] Speaker 3: They had to show their tattoos.
[24:53] Speaker 2: Yeah. They'd field a request for kisses.
[24:55] Speaker 3: Kisses?
[24:56] Speaker 2: Give me kisses.
[24:56] Speaker 3: Like smooch, smooch sounds?
[24:58] Speaker 2: And then in some case, like they got talked into
[25:00] Speaker 2: explicit video calls. But of course, they're the only ones
[25:03] Speaker 2: on video. The other one's off. Oh, man. Eventually, the
[25:07] Speaker 2: Marine flew to Indonesia at her request. And he spent
[25:11] Speaker 2: about $ 2, 800 of his own money on the promise of
[25:14] Speaker 2: a $ 10, 000 payday for security assessments of hotels and venues.
[25:19] Speaker 2: And like, there's just red flag after red flag.
[25:22] Speaker 3: At this point, hell yeah.
[25:23] Speaker 2: Locals kept angling for cash. And like unfamiliar men were
[25:27] Speaker 2: loitering around his car. Like it just got weirder and weirder.
[25:31] Speaker 2: And so the trip ended when his driver refused to
[25:34] Speaker 2: follow directions, ignored his request to stop. And the Marine,
[25:39] Speaker 2: like out of patience, just threatened him until he just
[25:42] Speaker 2: like was dumped on the roadside, middle of nowhere.
[25:44] Speaker 3: Like I will hurt you. I'll break your neck or
[25:46] Speaker 3: whatever until you stop this car.
[25:47] Speaker 2: And then this local bystander warned him away from the
[25:50] Speaker 2: people as quote, very bad people.
[25:53] Speaker 3: The ones that he got dropped off by.
[25:55] Speaker 2: Yeah, the random person is like, oh, I know them.
[25:57] Speaker 2: They are very bad people. That's terrifying. He makes it
[26:01] Speaker 2: back to Bangkok. And he's still like half convinced that
[26:04] Speaker 2: he's been dealing with the real Schwartzman. Like, you know,
[26:07] Speaker 2: she's just like unstable, like maybe a bit of an alcoholic.
[26:12] Speaker 2: You know, her people are shielding him. He's making all
[26:14] Speaker 2: these excuses.
[26:15] Speaker 3: That feels so bad. I shouldn't be laughing this hard.
[26:17] Speaker 2: I know, but it's funny. And so when the promised
[26:21] Speaker 2: payment kept slipping... He had a banker check the wire
[26:25] Speaker 2: details that he'd been given. Oh, finally. None of it's real.
[26:28] Speaker 3: Of course not, yeah. He's like, what's the routing number?
[26:30] Speaker 3: These are letters.
[26:31] Speaker 2: Yeah. So there were hundreds of these examples, and they
[26:36] Speaker 2: kept piling up. And then the executives decided to fight back.
[26:41] Speaker 2: Leslie Linka Glatter, remember her? Homeland Walking Dead Mad Men director.
[26:45] Speaker 3: Sure.
[26:46] Speaker 2: Once she realized that her identity was being used to
[26:49] Speaker 2: supposedly run this whole operation— She went to the police
[26:52] Speaker 2: and the FBI. Both passed.
[26:54] Speaker 3: So do the executives hear about it? Someone contacts them?
[26:58] Speaker 2: Yeah, someone contacts.
[26:59] Speaker 3: And it's like, they're like, wait a minute. I didn't
[27:01] Speaker 3: talk to this person.
[27:01] Speaker 2: Yeah, I have no idea about it.
[27:02] Speaker 3: And then they get another one like a month later
[27:03] Speaker 3: and they're like, wait a minute.
[27:04] Speaker 2: I'm not doing any project in Bali.
[27:06] Speaker 3: Then they call the FBI. Yeah.
[27:08] Speaker 2: The FBI, the cops, they don't care.
[27:09] Speaker 3: Of course not.
[27:10] Speaker 2: Apparently they weren't interested because the individual dollar amounts- per
[27:15] Speaker 2: victim were too small to move the needle. It's like
[27:18] Speaker 2: three grand to 10 grand is what most of them were.
[27:20] Speaker 3: I was going to say, yeah.
[27:21] Speaker 2: And they were like, we got bigger fish to fry.
[27:23] Speaker 2: And it's like so weird and like fluid.
[27:24] Speaker 3: It's hard to say what the crime is because the person,
[27:27] Speaker 3: because he's saying, they're telling you one side.
[27:29] Speaker 2: Yeah, they're paying for a lot of the stuff themselves,
[27:31] Speaker 2: but they don't realize they're paying to the con artist
[27:35] Speaker 2: for all these things.
[27:35] Speaker 3: It almost sounds like sour grapes, I'm sure, to these
[27:38] Speaker 3: people who are like, oh, you got LA problems?
[27:41] Speaker 2: Totally. So Leslie hired a private investigator instead. And he
[27:45] Speaker 2: traced the operation back to burner phones and disposable GoDaddy
[27:49] Speaker 2: email addresses.
[27:50] Speaker 3: Oh, damn.
[27:51] Speaker 2: And then K2 Intelligence, a New York investigation firm, they
[27:55] Speaker 2: get pulled into it, too. They're hired by a bunch,
[27:58] Speaker 2: like a group of the executives get together and they're like, OK,
[28:01] Speaker 2: let's hire K2. But then the real breakthrough came from
[28:05] Speaker 2: a New Jersey-based investigator, Nicole Katsianis.
[28:08] Speaker 3: OK.
[28:09] Speaker 2: So she was originally brought on by Amy Paschal's team. Heck, yeah.
[28:13] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[28:13] Speaker 2: She spent years chasing every lead available. She like got
[28:18] Speaker 2: the names of the impersonator's supposed staff. She did a
[28:21] Speaker 2: deep crawl through Instagram accounts. She traced email domains. It's
[28:25] Speaker 2: like stuff that I can do in my sleep.
[28:28] Speaker 3: I was about to say, it sounds like you.
[28:29] Speaker 2: Makes me think I should be an investigator for the
[28:31] Speaker 2: rich and powerful.
[28:32] Speaker 3: You would get paid, girl. Your skill level.
[28:34] Speaker 2: I think I've mentioned here before that for my birthday
[28:37] Speaker 2: one year, you got me a badge that says special investigator.
[28:40] Speaker 1: Yes.
[28:40] Speaker 2: Like a real badge from the company that makes cop badges. Yes.
[28:44] Speaker 2: And I would get so arrested if I got pulled
[28:47] Speaker 2: over and it was on me. But it's really tempting.
[28:49] Speaker 3: No, I made sure that it's legitimate in the sense
[28:51] Speaker 3: that you won't be impersonating a police officer. I looked
[28:54] Speaker 3: into what the problems were for that. So I made sure.
[28:57] Speaker 2: Because there's no jurisdiction on there.
[28:58] Speaker 3: No, and all the stuff that I put on there
[29:00] Speaker 3: isn't an indicator. It's tempting.
[29:01] Speaker 2: It's tempting to use it. Yeah, anyone would believe it.
[29:03] Speaker 2: As some sort of, like, you see police activity.
[29:05] Speaker 3: It's got the whole leather back when you flap it.
[29:07] Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm feeling nosy. I pull up, flash it.
[29:09] Speaker 3: Special investigators, show me.
[29:10] Speaker 2: What's going on here, guys?
[29:11] Speaker 3: But what.
[29:12] Speaker 2: When I lived in the South, like rural, rural area,
[29:15] Speaker 2: middle of nowhere, you didn't need a badge to do that. No.
[29:19] Speaker 2: I knew most of the cops and the police chief
[29:22] Speaker 2: and the sheriff's deputies and the sheriff in my small town.
[29:25] Speaker 2: And one time there were like a ton of cops
[29:29] Speaker 2: and the road was blocked off. And like I saw
[29:32] Speaker 2: it kind of in the distance.
[29:33] Speaker 3: Like the lights are going and all?
[29:34] Speaker 2: Yeah, lights are going they have like a blockade and
[29:37] Speaker 2: it was not in in my on my way home.
[29:40] Speaker 3: He just diverted and i like flipped a u-turn and
[29:43] Speaker 3: went up the road so you it totally is because
[29:45] Speaker 3: i was like what is this what was it.
[29:47] Speaker 2: So i pull up i'm like what's going on dude
[29:49] Speaker 2: and the officer gave me all the details like all
[29:52] Speaker 2: names background it was amazing wow And it was just
[29:56] Speaker 2: like some guy had made a run for it and
[29:57] Speaker 2: was like going through people's backyards.
[29:59] Speaker 3: You've got a very trustworthy face. If I ask questions,
[30:01] Speaker 3: people think there's something behind it. You ask questions, it's like, well,
[30:03] Speaker 3: I want to tell her.
[30:04] Speaker 2: Because the thing is, he told me and it wasn't
[30:06] Speaker 2: hurting nobody to do so. It wouldn't hurt nobody. It
[30:10] Speaker 2: would behoove cops to let us in on these details. Anyway, Nicole,
[30:15] Speaker 2: she's my new hero. She spent six months cross-referencing what
[30:19] Speaker 2: people were calling the impersonator online against common indonesian name
[30:24] Speaker 2: patterns oh wow and that's how she landed on a
[30:27] Speaker 2: name good on her every thread investigators pulled eventually led
[30:31] Speaker 2: back to the same name so then the fbi finally
[30:34] Speaker 2: gets involved like and they followed the trail that k2 built.
[30:37] Speaker 3: Yeah now they got a name.
[30:39] Speaker 2: Yeah but even with a name in hand investigators couldn't
[30:42] Speaker 2: physically locate the con queen like instagram presence scrubbed Which is, okay,
[30:49] Speaker 2: it's sort of a tempting thing to do, even if
[30:51] Speaker 2: you are not a con artist. Like sometimes I want
[30:53] Speaker 2: to vanish from all social media, which for me is
[30:56] Speaker 2: just Instagram, Blue Sky. I don't count Reddit because I
[30:59] Speaker 2: only read there. I don't post anything.
[31:01] Speaker 3: But you do leave a footprint though, right?
[31:03] Speaker 2: I guess, but it's like, I just want to, I
[31:05] Speaker 2: want to get rid of my iPhone and only have
[31:07] Speaker 2: a landline.
[31:08] Speaker 3: Oh.
[31:08] Speaker 2: And then get my news from radio and newspaper.
[31:11] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[31:12] Speaker 2: And like leave behind my busy on the go lifestyle.
[31:14] Speaker 3: So basically live like my parents.
[31:16] Speaker 2: Yeah. I want to stop bringing home the bacon and
[31:18] Speaker 2: frying it up in a pan. Just living, dude.
[31:21] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[31:21] Speaker 2: I want to be a technophobe like your parents. Okay.
[31:25] Speaker 2: So the investigation. In 2020, a mistake was made. The
[31:29] Speaker 2: con queen popped up in an Instagram live claiming to
[31:32] Speaker 2: be in London.
[31:34] Speaker 1: Oh.
[31:34] Speaker 2: And there was a skyline in the shot. But it
[31:36] Speaker 2: was in London. So Scott Johnson, the journalist who broke
[31:40] Speaker 2: the original story in 2018, Hollywood Reporter, he had spent
[31:44] Speaker 2: ages trying to track the con queen down through every
[31:48] Speaker 2: channel available. He sent a screenshot of the skyline to
[31:52] Speaker 2: a friend in the UK. And this guy had spent
[31:55] Speaker 2: years working in Manchester's northern quarter. And the friend recognized
[32:01] Speaker 2: the building immediately. And so Johnson tracked it down in person,
[32:06] Speaker 2: found the con queen.
[32:08] Speaker 3: What?
[32:08] Speaker 2: Appealing to the ego with an offer of telling the
[32:12] Speaker 2: other side of the story, Scott got an interview.
[32:15] Speaker 3: Are you kidding? Brother, oh my God, what great journalism.
[32:19] Speaker 2: Ad times, Aaron. Take a bio break. Or, you know,
[32:23] Speaker 2: we can stop and listen to these ads with intention.
[32:26] Speaker 2: We need to give them our bandwidth, however thin that
[32:29] Speaker 2: may be these days.
[32:30] Speaker 3: So paper thin.
[32:31] Speaker 2: Think about how they're basically paying people's subscription to this podcast.
[32:35] Speaker 3: There is that.
[32:35] Speaker 2: I'm going to be thankful for them. Let's put it
[32:37] Speaker 2: into perspective. When we come back, the unmasking. Zarin.
[33:03] Speaker 3: Elizabeth.
[33:03] Speaker 2: When we left off, all manner of investigators were trying
[33:07] Speaker 2: to track down the Hollywood con queen.
[33:09] Speaker 3: Totally. You got a task force.
[33:10] Speaker 2: Yeah. They had the backing of the FBI. Major Hollywood
[33:14] Speaker 2: power players are like, they're tired of having their names
[33:17] Speaker 2: used for such a strange con.
[33:19] Speaker 3: Also, your name is everything.
[33:20] Speaker 2: It's everything.
[33:21] Speaker 3: You can't be attached to this kind of nonsense. Exactly.
[33:24] Speaker 2: So the person behind all of it was Hargobind Punjabi Talramani.
[33:30] Speaker 2: And the she was actually a he.
[33:33] Speaker 3: What? Wait a minute. All the voices? Oh, wow.
[33:38] Speaker 2: Often known as Gobind. He was born in Jakarta in
[33:41] Speaker 2: like a comfortable family.
[33:43] Speaker 3: Okay.
[33:43] Speaker 2: His father had been a film producer in the 80s,
[33:46] Speaker 2: writing rom-coms and dramas out of a production house across
[33:50] Speaker 2: the street from their home in Jakarta.
[33:53] Speaker 3: So they had like a Nepo baby energy of knowing
[33:56] Speaker 3: the industry from the inside out.
[33:57] Speaker 2: Yes. Yes. He went to Jakarta's elite English instruction Gandhi
[34:03] Speaker 2: Memorial Intercontinental School.
[34:05] Speaker 3: Oh, yeah. I still got the newsletters. Yeah, yeah.
[34:07] Speaker 2: You're an alum.
[34:07] Speaker 3: I was a former alum.
[34:09] Speaker 2: Before heading to the U.S. for college.
[34:11] Speaker 3: Yes.
[34:11] Speaker 2: So first he went to L.A. City College, where he
[34:14] Speaker 2: competed on the speech team. Then he transferred to Bradley
[34:18] Speaker 2: University in Illinois in 2000.
[34:20] Speaker 1: Okay.
[34:21] Speaker 2: And that year he made the quarterfinals of a National
[34:24] Speaker 2: Forensic Association's persuasive speaking competition. So when we say forensic here,
[34:30] Speaker 2: we're talking about competitive speaking. And it comes from Aristotle's
[34:34] Speaker 2: On Rhetoric. So forensics is what Aristotle called speaking for
[34:38] Speaker 2: a rhetorical purpose. Talking for talking's sake, as I see it.
[34:42] Speaker 2: And so it's not CSI, which is both a bummer
[34:44] Speaker 2: and a relief. So I looked up examples of persuasive
[34:51] Speaker 2: speaking compositions.
[34:51] Speaker 3: I was curious. Yeah, thank you.
[34:53] Speaker 2: Dude, it's tailor-made to irritate me.
[34:55] Speaker 3: Really?
[34:55] Speaker 2: Really. Yeah. It's so dramatic, but like in the beigest way. Uh,
[35:00] Speaker 2: so even college kids perform like high school kids auditioning
[35:03] Speaker 2: for a school play. Like there I was 28 years old,
[35:07] Speaker 2: stepping off the boat at Ellis Island. My bubby had
[35:11] Speaker 2: told me always stay true to yourself. And then like,
[35:14] Speaker 2: they're like wrapping a shawl around their shoulders.
[35:17] Speaker 3: It's like worse than how you respond to like slam poetry.
[35:20] Speaker 2: Yeah, pretty much.
[35:21] Speaker 3: We had that period of time where people were like.
[35:24] Speaker 2: They take all that.
[35:26] Speaker 3: You love about poetry.
[35:28] Speaker 2: I got off the boat at Ellis Island. No, what
[35:33] Speaker 2: I really thought it was going to be is something
[35:35] Speaker 2: my cousin used to do is like debate, but they
[35:38] Speaker 2: talk really fast. Like they're auditioning for a Micro Machines commercial.
[35:42] Speaker 3: Yes, so hyper specific. What is the point?
[35:44] Speaker 2: What's the point of that?
[35:45] Speaker 3: No one communicates like that.
[35:46] Speaker 2: What is the point?
[35:46] Speaker 3: Why are you practicing being able to say so many
[35:48] Speaker 3: syllables so quickly?
[35:49] Speaker 2: That pisses me off.
[35:51] Speaker 3: Oh, I know.
[35:51] Speaker 2: Everything pisses me off, Saren. So, no, they're trying to, like—
[35:55] Speaker 2: You live right on the edge.
[35:56] Speaker 1: I do.
[35:57] Speaker 2: They're trying to be, like, show deep emotion, but it's, like,
[36:01] Speaker 2: a swing and a miss.
[36:02] Speaker 3: But also, they're not trying to, like, convey and persuade
[36:04] Speaker 3: average people or the general audience. It's this specific niche
[36:07] Speaker 3: judge cohort.
[36:09] Speaker 2: About a topic. So, like— They're trying to convince the
[36:12] Speaker 2: audience of like an opinion that they have. They're trying
[36:15] Speaker 2: to be persuasive. And it's basically prepping these dorks to
[36:19] Speaker 2: do TED Talks. Sounds like even worse than that. That
[36:23] Speaker 2: intonation and sincerity. So anyway, Gobind, he competed under the
[36:28] Speaker 2: alias Harvey, which is great. And he would come back
[36:32] Speaker 2: and use that name over and over through the years.
[36:34] Speaker 2: He later moved to California State University, Long Beach, a.k.a.
[36:38] Speaker 2: The Beach, as they call themselves, and kept competing until
[36:43] Speaker 2: he got disqualified from a tournament for plagiarism.
[36:46] Speaker 1: Oh.
[36:46] Speaker 2: Which is, for some reason, hilarious to me. Because, like,
[36:49] Speaker 2: I imagine him just cooking, like, gesticulating with open arms
[36:53] Speaker 2: about the need for nap time in colleges and office buildings.
[36:56] Speaker 2: You know what I mean?
[36:57] Speaker 3: And someone else did that already.
[36:58] Speaker 2: Why? We're all so tired.
[37:01] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[37:01] Speaker 2: Why can't we take a nap? Because it would be
[37:04] Speaker 2: so helpful. And then some judge is like, I know
[37:09] Speaker 2: I heard that last year at the finals in Cincy.
[37:13] Speaker 2: And pulls out their phone, tap, tap, tap, tap, finds
[37:15] Speaker 2: the script in their Google Drive, reads along with Harvey's
[37:19] Speaker 2: performance like, bingo, busted.
[37:20] Speaker 3: I knew it.
[37:21] Speaker 2: So Gobind wasn't just disqualified from the tourney. He got
[37:25] Speaker 2: booted from the team.
[37:26] Speaker 3: Oh, sure.
[37:27] Speaker 2: Zarin... Close your eyes.
[37:29] Speaker 3: Wait, what? My eyes are closed.
[37:31] Speaker 2: I want you to picture it. You are a communications
[37:39] Speaker 2: professor at CSU Long Beach. You are also the debate
[37:42] Speaker 2: coach for their beach forensic speech and debate team. You
[37:46] Speaker 2: guys are good and you live by a code. When
[37:49] Speaker 2: Harvey broke the code, you cut him loose. There's no
[37:52] Speaker 2: room for cheaters at the beach. You're sitting in your
[37:55] Speaker 2: office getting ready to pack up and head home. A
[37:58] Speaker 2: radio plays KUSC's soft classical music in the corner of
[38:02] Speaker 2: your office. You pause to look out at the quad
[38:05] Speaker 2: below you, the green grass, the blue sky, the puffy
[38:08] Speaker 2: white clouds. What a glorious day, you think to yourself.
[38:12] Speaker 2: Students and staff quietly chatter and laugh in the hallway
[38:15] Speaker 2: outside your office. Their footfall on the carpeted floor is
[38:18] Speaker 2: oddly comforting to you. Just as you're about to get up,
[38:22] Speaker 2: your office phone rings. Could be a student. You can't
[38:25] Speaker 2: just walk out. You set your kelp green L.L. Bean
[38:28] Speaker 2: waxed canvas briefcase bag back on the floor. You reach
[38:32] Speaker 2: over to switch off the radio and lift the receiver
[38:35] Speaker 2: off the phone. This is Professor Corn Tower. How can
[38:38] Speaker 2: I help you?
[38:39] Speaker 1: Please hold for Cate Blanchett.
[38:41] Speaker 2: A voice on the line says, then there's hold music.
[38:45] Speaker 2: You wonder if it's the Cate Blanchett. This is so weird.
[38:49] Speaker 2: You stare at the corkboard on the wall across from you.
[38:52] Speaker 2: the corner of the printed calendar page noting your office
[38:55] Speaker 2: hours beginning to curl. The line clicks back on. Hey, everybody,
[39:00] Speaker 2: it's me, Kate Blanchett. I got a smirk on my
[39:03] Speaker 2: face because I'm a fancy lady. Oh, my God, it's
[39:06] Speaker 2: really her. You'd know that voice anywhere. What can I
[39:10] Speaker 2: do for you, Miss Blanchett, you ask? You're the bait, man.
[39:14] Speaker 2: I'm calling about Harvey, Professor Harvey with the arms and
[39:17] Speaker 2: the speech in the face. Uh, yes, you tell her. Harvey,
[39:21] Speaker 2: he's no longer on the debate team. Well, why the
[39:24] Speaker 2: f * * * is that? Put him back on
[39:27] Speaker 2: the team and the talking in the contest.
[39:29] Speaker 3: Ms.
[39:30] Speaker 2: Blanchett, I cannot do that. We have rules, standards. He
[39:33] Speaker 2: plagiarized a speech. That's verboten here at the beach. I
[39:37] Speaker 2: don't want to go to the beach, Mrs. Talker. I
[39:39] Speaker 2: want Harvey back on the team. Well, I'll kick the
[39:42] Speaker 2: s * * * out of you. Ms. Blanchett, you
[39:45] Speaker 2: say I will not respond to threats or such coarse language.
[39:49] Speaker 2: When you got your PhD in communications, they did not
[39:51] Speaker 2: prepare you for being chewed out by an Academy Award winner.
[39:55] Speaker 2: Maybe this was just her being Australian. I read on
[39:58] Speaker 2: your website it says debate team. Our team is family.
[40:02] Speaker 2: We believe F-O-E. Family on everything. Family. This I treat family? Okay,
[40:09] Speaker 2: I am ending this call right now, you say. This
[40:12] Speaker 2: is completely inappropriate. But before I go, I need to
[40:15] Speaker 2: tell you that I loved you in Where'd You Go, Bernadette.
[40:18] Speaker 2: Underrated film. Thank you, you piece of s * * *.
[40:22] Speaker 2: You place the handset back on the base and sigh.
[40:24] Speaker 2: Cate Blanchett, her voice undeniably recognizable. just laid into you
[40:30] Speaker 2: over the phone to get that weirdo Harvey back on
[40:32] Speaker 2: the debate team. No way. Not going to happen. And
[40:35] Speaker 2: no one will ever believe that this just happened.
[40:38] Speaker 3: No one. How are you feeling after that brush with greatness?
[40:49] Speaker 3: I mean, I never thought one of my personal heroes,
[40:52] Speaker 3: Cate Blanchett, would call me and berate me.
[40:54] Speaker 2: It was crazy.
[40:56] Speaker 3: What a gutter mouth she has.
[40:57] Speaker 2: Well, I know, but I also debated. I was going
[41:01] Speaker 2: to call in a favor to her and be like,
[41:03] Speaker 2: can you read these lines, right? Yeah, it was incredible.
[41:06] Speaker 2: And she was like, Elizabeth. You do the best impersonation
[41:09] Speaker 2: of me and every other celebrity.
[41:11] Speaker 3: Yeah, you do me better than me do me.
[41:13] Speaker 2: I want you to take the reins and you do
[41:16] Speaker 2: my voice. And I gave her a dry run of it.
[41:18] Speaker 2: And she's like, it feels like listening to a recording
[41:20] Speaker 2: of me.
[41:21] Speaker 3: Yeah, but better.
[41:22] Speaker 2: But better.
[41:23] Speaker 3: I wish I sounded like that. That's the Cate Blanchett
[41:26] Speaker 3: I want to be.
[41:27] Speaker 2: Cate, I think I'm going to tap into your confidence.
[41:31] Speaker 2: And I'm just going to go ahead and do it.
[41:33] Speaker 3: Her versatility.
[41:34] Speaker 2: And Cate, if you're listening, I know you are. I
[41:37] Speaker 2: want you to, I hope I made you proud. I
[41:39] Speaker 2: hope I made you proud. So anyway, he literally called
[41:46] Speaker 2: and yelled at the coach saying he used Cate Blanchett.
[41:51] Speaker 3: Versatile. Why would Cate Blanchett be the factor that swayed
[41:56] Speaker 3: this guy? Is this why I'm like a super fan
[41:58] Speaker 3: of Cate Blanchett? And he just knows that? He's like,
[42:00] Speaker 3: you know what I need?
[42:01] Speaker 2: I guess. He's like, I do a good Cate Blanchett.
[42:04] Speaker 2: Let me work my magic.
[42:05] Speaker 3: What's that thing you use, Cameo?
[42:07] Speaker 2: Yeah, cameo.
[42:08] Speaker 3: They didn't have cameo yet, so he's like, I will cameo.
[42:10] Speaker 2: I don't think Cate Blanchett would do cameo.
[42:12] Speaker 3: No, I don't think so.
[42:13] Speaker 2: I mean, I got that, what's his name?
[42:16] Speaker 3: George Santos.
[42:17] Speaker 2: George Santos one, which is like a collector's item at
[42:20] Speaker 2: this point. All right, so Gobind went back to Indonesia
[42:24] Speaker 2: when that didn't work, when the bull of Cate Blanchett
[42:28] Speaker 2: didn't get him back on the CSU Long Beach debate team.
[42:33] Speaker 3: Out of here.
[42:33] Speaker 2: Out of here. His parents had died and he had
[42:36] Speaker 2: this like bitter falling out with his siblings over the estate.
[42:40] Speaker 2: His sister later described him to Scott Johnson as, quote,
[42:43] Speaker 2: a monster with a long history of cruelty and manipulation.
[42:47] Speaker 3: He does seem like a little bit of a sociopath.
[42:49] Speaker 2: A little bit. A little bit. A Jakarta prison official
[42:52] Speaker 2: said it was actually his own family who pushed the
[42:55] Speaker 2: charges that eventually landed him in prison there in the
[42:58] Speaker 2: late 2000s. Oh. While inside, he fell in with Rudy Sutopo,
[43:03] Speaker 2: who was this experienced financial fraudster who defrauded a company
[43:07] Speaker 2: of millions. while playing the part of this wealthy man
[43:10] Speaker 2: in public. And of course, like, Gorbin's like, let's do this.
[43:14] Speaker 3: I love this. The classic prison university. I learned to
[43:17] Speaker 3: be a better criminal.
[43:18] Speaker 2: Yes.
[43:18] Speaker 3: And his family pressed the charge to send him to prison.
[43:21] Speaker 2: Yeah. Prison didn't rehabilitate him. In one incident, he used
[43:25] Speaker 2: a phone that had been smuggled into his cell to
[43:28] Speaker 2: call in a bomb threat to the U.S. embassy in Jakarta. Damn, son.
[43:32] Speaker 2: I mean, why not? Why?
[43:34] Speaker 3: My powers have only grown stronger.
[43:35] Speaker 1: Why?
[43:36] Speaker 2: Because it's there.
[43:37] Speaker 3: You cut me down.
[43:39] Speaker 2: This is what I love. He cycled through American, Iranian,
[43:43] Speaker 2: and Russian accents across different calls. Really? So he's like,
[43:47] Speaker 2: I'm American. We're going to set off a bomb. Like,
[43:50] Speaker 2: I am Iranian. Like.
[43:52] Speaker 3: Being able to do all those calls. I mean, he's
[43:54] Speaker 3: not you, but I mean, like being able to do
[43:56] Speaker 3: like that many voices.
[43:57] Speaker 2: And he's not you, the king of accents over there.
[44:00] Speaker 2: So he said there was going to be explosion within
[44:02] Speaker 2: 72 hours. And the stunt bought him a longer sentence
[44:08] Speaker 2: and then got every phone in the prison confiscated. So
[44:10] Speaker 2: good job, Gobind.
[44:12] Speaker 3: Yeah, he got beat up.
[44:13] Speaker 2: Around 2011, it's unclear whether this was during or after
[44:17] Speaker 2: his time inside. He said he was organizing a Miss
[44:21] Speaker 2: Teen Indonesia pageant.
[44:23] Speaker 3: Okay.
[44:23] Speaker 2: And he pitched Tyra Banks' team on a lineup that
[44:27] Speaker 2: supposedly included Katy Perry.
[44:29] Speaker 3: Wow.
[44:30] Speaker 2: And oh, by the way, Tyra's going to need to
[44:32] Speaker 2: wear like this local batik designer's outfit.
[44:35] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[44:36] Speaker 2: That didn't, it didn't happen. And then he also, but
[44:39] Speaker 2: he did, he did book Enrique Iglesias.
[44:42] Speaker 3: Well, that guy needs work.
[44:43] Speaker 2: Yeah. He actually flew to Jakarta before realizing when he
[44:49] Speaker 2: got there that the whole thing was bogus.
[44:50] Speaker 3: Have you seen the one where he sings and they
[44:52] Speaker 3: knock out the music?
[44:53] Speaker 2: That is one of my favorite things everywhere. All I need.
[44:59] Speaker 2: I can't tell you the number of times I've watched
[45:01] Speaker 2: that over the years.
[45:02] Speaker 3: You were the one who turned me on to that, actually.
[45:07] Speaker 2: If you got us, Google search, YouTube, whatever, Enrique Iglesias
[45:12] Speaker 2: isolated vocals. Oh, God, it's so good. The Iglesias team
[45:20] Speaker 2: later posted publicly that the event was, quote, a big
[45:23] Speaker 2: fraud set up by crooks.
[45:24] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[45:25] Speaker 2: Yeah, like, big zing, we got you out here. So
[45:27] Speaker 2: eventually Gobind got out, relocated to London, and then reinvented
[45:32] Speaker 2: himself again. He was introducing himself around town as an
[45:36] Speaker 2: HBO or Netflix executive.
[45:38] Speaker 3: Yeah. The or?
[45:41] Speaker 2: Including, yeah, either one. I'm HBO or Netflix. How are
[45:44] Speaker 2: you feeling today?
[45:45] Speaker 3: Which one do you like better?
[45:46] Speaker 2: Including when he signed up for the 2017 Lululemon Sweat
[45:50] Speaker 2: Life Festival.
[45:51] Speaker 3: I'm going to pretend you didn't say that.
[45:53] Speaker 2: What on God's green earth is the 2017 Lululemon Sweat
[45:57] Speaker 2: Life Festival?
[45:58] Speaker 3: I'm worried I won't forget.
[45:59] Speaker 2: I ask the best questions. Yeah. It was an event
[46:01] Speaker 2: celebrating London's fitness, wellness, and mindfulness community. Oh. It's right
[46:06] Speaker 2: up your alley, Burnett.
[46:07] Speaker 3: Of course, yeah. All my interests.
[46:08] Speaker 2: It featured more than 140 fitness sessions, including yoga, meditation,
[46:13] Speaker 2: high-intensity workouts, and gong baths.
[46:16] Speaker 1: Oh.
[46:17] Speaker 2: What in tarnation instant breakfast is a gong bath, I
[46:20] Speaker 2: ask you.
[46:21] Speaker 3: What, Elizabeth, is a gong bath? I just asked, not
[46:23] Speaker 3: wanting to know.
[46:24] Speaker 2: It's just what it says. You're immersed in sound vibrations
[46:27] Speaker 2: produced by gongs. It sounds like an instant migraine to
[46:30] Speaker 2: me is what it sounds like.
[46:31] Speaker 3: There I am taking like a Ben Franklin style air
[46:34] Speaker 3: bath and somebody strikes a giant gong and then those
[46:37] Speaker 3: sound waves wash.
[46:38] Speaker 2: Like probably multiple gongs.
[46:40] Speaker 3: From every direction.
[46:41] Speaker 2: Every direction.
[46:41] Speaker 3: I'm being gonged to every direction.
[46:42] Speaker 2: The event also featured Ryan Lear.
[46:45] Speaker 3: Who's Ryan Lear?
[46:46] Speaker 2: Who in the wild world of sports is Ryan Lear?
[46:48] Speaker 3: Do you act like I'm supposed to know this name?
[46:50] Speaker 2: Zarin? Yeah. Close your eyes.
[46:51] Speaker 3: No, I'm not doing that again.
[46:53] Speaker 2: No, Zarin. He is a legendary Canadian yogi and global
[46:57] Speaker 2: yoga ambassador.
[46:58] Speaker 3: Sure he is. Just like you said he is. Yeah.
[47:01] Speaker 2: Someone named Chevy Ruff was there too.
[47:03] Speaker 3: Chevy Ruff?
[47:04] Speaker 2: But when I tried to search- Is this R-U-F-F? R-O-U-G-H.
[47:08] Speaker 3: Okay. Yeah.
[47:08] Speaker 2: When I tried to search for information on this person,
[47:11] Speaker 2: I pretty much only got articles about dirty throttle bodies
[47:15] Speaker 2: in S-10 pickup trucks.
[47:17] Speaker 3: Oh.
[47:17] Speaker 2: Like carbon buildup on the butterfly valve and all that.
[47:22] Speaker 2: Strike one for me. So back to Gobind. He also
[47:27] Speaker 2: built a second life as a food influencer.
[47:29] Speaker 3: Naturally.
[47:30] Speaker 2: I love that for him.
[47:30] Speaker 3: Everybody loves food.
[47:31] Speaker 2: He posted under names including Gain Ambani, Lal Gobind, Gobind
[47:37] Speaker 2: Lal Tahil, and then, of course, Harvey.
[47:40] Speaker 3: Oh, of course. You got to go back to the favorites.
[47:41] Speaker 2: Play the favorites. He ingratiated himself with chefs at some
[47:45] Speaker 2: of London's, like, best restaurants.
[47:47] Speaker 1: Really?
[47:47] Speaker 2: And he would cultivate sympathy with them by telling them
[47:51] Speaker 2: that he'd been bullied for being perceived as gay back
[47:54] Speaker 2: in Indonesia. And he'd even been forced into conversion therapy,
[47:58] Speaker 2: which is totally relevant to dining. Like, as you're trying
[48:02] Speaker 2: to get a reservation at PS.
[48:03] Speaker 3: No, but if the chef is sensitive, they would hear that.
[48:05] Speaker 2: I suppose, but come on now.
[48:06] Speaker 3: You know, they're like, oh, I don't want to hear that. Man,
[48:08] Speaker 3: you got bullied? That sucks.
[48:09] Speaker 2: They're like, here. So what food allergies do you have?
[48:12] Speaker 2: As a food blogger, he apparently wore out his welcome
[48:15] Speaker 2: badly enough that Yotam Adelangi banned him from every one
[48:20] Speaker 2: of his restaurants. Like, no.
[48:23] Speaker 3: Whatever. So is he going primarily to like Indonesian chefs?
[48:25] Speaker 2: No, no.
[48:26] Speaker 3: Just across the board.
[48:27] Speaker 2: Yeah, that guy is like an Israeli. I don't know
[48:30] Speaker 2: who he is. British chef.
[48:32] Speaker 3: I don't know.
[48:33] Speaker 2: November 2020, English authorities finally caught up with Gobind and
[48:37] Speaker 2: he got arrested in Manchester.
[48:38] Speaker 3: Remember? Yeah.
[48:40] Speaker 2: 41 years old at this point. Calling himself Gobind. Posting
[48:44] Speaker 2: as a food fluencer under the handles Pure Bites, B-Y-T-E-S.
[48:49] Speaker 2: And I spin the tails. Yeah, you do. He fought extradition,
[48:53] Speaker 2: but in 2023, a UK judge ruled that he could
[48:56] Speaker 2: be sent to the U.S., Oh, no.
[48:58] Speaker 3: No one wants that on the international level.
[49:00] Speaker 2: Well, yeah, him especially. You'll see. The judge described him
[49:04] Speaker 2: in the ruling as dishonest, manipulative. He was skeptical about
[49:08] Speaker 2: the claims of family persecution, including he said that he'd
[49:12] Speaker 2: been declared dead.
[49:14] Speaker 3: By his family?
[49:16] Speaker 2: Yeah. I suppose it's like you're dead to me. And
[49:18] Speaker 2: then the whole conversions. therapy thing, the judge is like,
[49:21] Speaker 2: that didn't happen. And then he pushed the fight further.
[49:24] Speaker 2: He said that U.S. prison conditions would violate his human
[49:27] Speaker 2: rights given his mental health.
[49:29] Speaker 3: He ain't wrong there.
[49:30] Speaker 2: Baby, that's for everybody.
[49:31] Speaker 3: He ain't wrong there. We are literally, I think, the
[49:33] Speaker 3: worst prison. You know, when we were kids, people would
[49:35] Speaker 3: be like, what is this, a Turkish prison? Now it's like,
[49:38] Speaker 3: what is this, an American prison?
[49:39] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[49:40] Speaker 2: And so his lawyer told London's high court that he
[49:44] Speaker 2: faced danger in prison as a gay man seeking asylum
[49:46] Speaker 2: in Britain. And they're like, sorry, that doesn't work. In
[49:50] Speaker 2: July of 2025, he lost his final appeal, cleared the
[49:53] Speaker 2: last legal hurdle, the blocking extradition case. He's wanted in
[49:58] Speaker 2: California on charges of wire fraud, conspiracy to commit wire fraud,
[50:03] Speaker 2: aggravated identity theft.
[50:05] Speaker 3: Oh, yeah.
[50:05] Speaker 2: He's accused of defrauding about 500 people out of about
[50:10] Speaker 2: $ 2 million, all told.
[50:11] Speaker 3: Judges hate that.
[50:13] Speaker 2: Judges hate this one trick. 2013 to 2020. The last
[50:18] Speaker 2: procedural step, like a formal extradition order from the UK's
[50:22] Speaker 2: secretary of state is still pending. And I need to
[50:25] Speaker 2: add that there are a ton of podcasts and TV
[50:28] Speaker 2: shows and documentaries about this guy.
[50:30] Speaker 3: Oh, I bet. But there's a whole series.
[50:32] Speaker 2: I work by news and magazine articles and court filings.
[50:36] Speaker 2: So if you feel like recommending a podcast episode to
[50:40] Speaker 2: us in the Instagram comments... It's too late. Hold your horses.
[50:43] Speaker 3: It's too late.
[50:43] Speaker 2: You've done the episode. It's done. It's out of the canon,
[50:46] Speaker 2: quite frankly. I'm done with it. I don't want to
[50:49] Speaker 2: hear anything more about Harvey. So, you know, I appreciate
[50:53] Speaker 2: the thoughts, but please don't tell me to watch or
[50:57] Speaker 2: listen to anything. So, Zarin, what's your ridiculous takeaway?
[50:59] Speaker 3: This man hates everybody.
[51:01] Speaker 2: Ha ha!
[51:03] Speaker 3: I mean, like, I blame his family, I think, for
[51:05] Speaker 3: some of this is a real this is a real
[51:07] Speaker 3: nature nurture one where it's like his nature screwed up.
[51:10] Speaker 3: His family's nurture was also screwed up. We didn't stand
[51:14] Speaker 3: a chance against this guy. No one sees him coming.
[51:17] Speaker 3: And if you can do all those voices, I mean,
[51:19] Speaker 3: if he can do a convincing like everybody.
[51:22] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[51:22] Speaker 3: I mean, like, damn, son. I'm just glad that he
[51:25] Speaker 3: didn't have like aspirations for political power as like a
[51:28] Speaker 3: behind the scenes guy.
[51:30] Speaker 2: Oh, totally.
[51:30] Speaker 3: You know, because then he could have been like, you know, like,
[51:32] Speaker 3: I don't know, the chief of staff for Gavin Newsom.
[51:35] Speaker 3: And that could have been really bad.
[51:36] Speaker 2: Yeah, we know how that shakes out. I'll tell you
[51:41] Speaker 2: my takeaway.
[51:41] Speaker 3: What's yours, Elizabeth? What's your ridiculous takeaway?
[51:43] Speaker 2: I feel like it's probably like a badge of honor,
[51:46] Speaker 2: like to have him impersonate you in Hollywood. So if
[51:49] Speaker 2: you're like this big executive and like you find out, well,
[51:52] Speaker 2: he never said he was me. I don't have enough juice.
[51:55] Speaker 2: So you're like, oh, yeah, they totally like the FBI
[51:57] Speaker 2: wanted to talk to me, too, because I guess when
[52:00] Speaker 2: he said he was me, he got the most money
[52:02] Speaker 2: out of people. Like, it's crazy.
[52:04] Speaker 3: Everyone wanted to work with me, I guess.
[52:05] Speaker 2: I don't know.
[52:06] Speaker 3: I was like a really good lure.
[52:07] Speaker 2: There's actually like four other people who are pretending to
[52:10] Speaker 2: be me because it's just like when you hear my name,
[52:12] Speaker 2: it just opens doors. Hold on.
[52:14] Speaker 3: I have to take this call. It's the FBI. It's
[52:16] Speaker 3: the FBI. They want me in on the case again.
[52:17] Speaker 2: This is so annoying being so powerful.
[52:19] Speaker 3: I feel like I'm– who am I, Henry Hill over here?
[52:21] Speaker 2: It's just– sometimes you're just too powerful in Hollywood. All right.
[52:27] Speaker 3: That was incredible.
[52:28] Speaker 2: Please, I need to talk back, Dave. Oh, my God.
[52:34] Speaker 3: Did he just say that?
[52:36] Speaker 2: I went cheap. I'm from South Mississippi on the Gulf Coast,
[52:46] Speaker 2: and it feels like temperature about 106 today. And, yes,
[52:50] Speaker 2: I'm tired of the heat, too. Keep on keeping on.
[52:54] Speaker 2: Thank you, brother.
[52:55] Speaker 3: We feel you.
[52:57] Speaker 2: We've had some heat waves.
[52:59] Speaker 3: And we got one coming up, too. I was going
[53:01] Speaker 3: to warn you.
[53:02] Speaker 2: It's going to get, it gets really hot here in
[53:04] Speaker 2: the studio.
[53:05] Speaker 3: Oh, yeah. Well, there's that, too.
[53:06] Speaker 2: Yeah. But, you know, we, I risk it for the biscuit, dude.
[53:10] Speaker 2: That's true. I do it for the people. That's it
[53:13] Speaker 2: for today. You can find us online at Poor Guy
[53:16] Speaker 2: in Mississippi. That is moist.
[53:18] Speaker 3: Oh, yeah.
[53:19] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[53:19] Speaker 3: That's like every party.
[53:20] Speaker 2: Take care of yourself.
[53:22] Speaker 3: Like the back of your knees are hot. Yeah, take care.
[53:23] Speaker 3: And you're just like, oh.
[53:25] Speaker 2: That's it. You can find us online at RidiculousCrime.com. We're
[53:29] Speaker 2: also at Ridiculous Crime on both Blue Sky and Instagram.
[53:32] Speaker 2: Email RidiculousCrime at gmail.com. Dear Tabby, leave us a talk
[53:37] Speaker 2: back on the iHeart app. Reach out. Ridiculous Crime is
[53:43] Speaker 2: hosted by Elizabeth Dutton and Zarin Burnett, produced and edited
[53:46] Speaker 2: by Hollywood mogul who really needs you to get to
[53:48] Speaker 2: West Java for a job, Dave Kustin. Our ridiculous assistant
[53:52] Speaker 2: is stunt coordinator stranded in Kuala Lumpur, Terry Maldonado-Fong. Research
[53:57] Speaker 2: is by president of the CSU Long Beach Debate Club,
[53:59] Speaker 2: Marissa Brown. The theme song is by world-renowned yoga mat
[54:03] Speaker 2: manufacturer Thomas Lee and pit barbecue influencer Travis Dutton. Host
[54:08] Speaker 2: wardrobe is provided by Botany 500. Producer Dave Kustin's wardrobe
[54:12] Speaker 2: by Mr. Guy of Beverly Hills. Guest hair and makeup
[54:15] Speaker 2: by Sparkle Shot and Mr. Andre. Executive producers are Indonesian
[54:19] Speaker 2: moped rental agent Ben Bolin and Indonesian life coach Noel Brown.
[54:29] Speaker 1: Ridiculous Crime.
[54:32] Speaker 2: Say it one more time. Ridiculous Crime.
[54:36] Speaker 1: Ridiculous Crime is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts
[54:39] Speaker 1: from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app. Apple Podcasts are wherever
[54:43] Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.

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