# OKC Takes Game 5 Over Pacers, Durant Wants To Join Spurs, Ja Morant’s Future? Desmond Bane Perfect For Magic

An episode of [The Colin Cowherd Podcast](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1551365571), 17 Jun 2025, 45 min.

Audio: https://podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/arttrk.com/p/D5CA5/pscrb.fm/rss/p/prfx.byspotify.com/e/pscrb.fm/rss/p/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/4013d28e-5f67-4885-bff1-ae3300346830/22140f5b-bb76-43bb-9cc5-b2ff0050f092/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=e829cf60-fc06-4d61-8691-ae330034683e

Colin’s joined by Jason Timpf, host of “Hoops Tonight” to break down game 5 of the NBA Finals plus some of the top stories from around the league! They begin with the Thunder taking a 3-2 lead over the Pacers, powered by SGA and Jalen Williams 71 combined points and tip their cap to Williams for the years of work he’s put in to reach his high level of play (3:30). They also highlight Chet Holmgren and the OKC defense as one of the biggest factors in the win (9:00) and discuss why they feel the eastern conference will be wide open going forward (14:15). They react to the massive haul paid by the Magic in the Desmond Bane trade but also point out why he’s the perfect piece for Orlando to add (25:30). They discuss the tumult surrounding the Grizzlies, what to make of Ja Morant’s future as his trajectory is pointing down (29:00), and why Morant is a cautionary tale (34:00). Finally, they react to the reports that Kevin Durant prefers the Spurs as a trade destination, debate whether it’d be the best fit out of his potential suitors (44:00) and comment on the positive trends in the league (53:00). (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) Follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates! #Volume #Herd #HoopsTonight See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

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[1:08] Speaker 3: All right, well, good too, Tonight You're at the volume.
[1:09] Speaker 3: Have you Monday, everybody. Hope all of you guys are
[1:11] Speaker 3: having a great start to your week.
[1:12] Speaker 1: Well.
[1:12] Speaker 3: The pivotal game of the NBA Finals tonight, series tied
[1:16] Speaker 3: at two back in Oklahoma City and the thunder behind
[1:19] Speaker 3: seventy one combined points from Shay, Gilgess, Alexander and Jalen
[1:24] Speaker 3: Williams take a three to two lead in the series.
[1:26] Speaker 3: Colin Coward is joining us again. Colin, you and I
[1:29] Speaker 3: talked last after Game three, I believe about the rosters,
[1:34] Speaker 3: and we talked about how down the roster Indiana's pretty
[1:37] Speaker 3: close in terms of depth of talent, but at the
[1:40] Speaker 3: top end on Oklahoma City can be tough to contend with.
[1:43] Speaker 3: And I thought both JDub and Shay were brilliant tonight.
[1:46] Speaker 3: What were your thoughts on game five?
[1:49] Speaker 1: Jalen Williams is such an interesting player. So he goes
[1:52] Speaker 1: to a small college, Santa Clara, and you know is
[1:56] Speaker 1: a slow developing player and the last part of his
[2:01] Speaker 1: game to mature was scoring. You know, he was long,
[2:04] Speaker 1: He worked really hard. I think both of his parents
[2:06] Speaker 1: were in the military. You know, classic like hard working
[2:10] Speaker 1: no bs. You know, you can see his game. You
[2:13] Speaker 1: can see the work he's put into it. Whenever you
[2:15] Speaker 1: see a guy with great touch around the rim. A
[2:19] Speaker 1: lot of guys can hit jumpers. Everybody had, you know,
[2:20] Speaker 1: everybody sits and shoots jumpers all day at practice. But
[2:23] Speaker 1: when I see a guy that's elegant and soft around
[2:26] Speaker 1: the rim, like that's work, that is years of working
[2:31] Speaker 1: in the gym, often by yourself, and you know, so
[2:36] Speaker 1: here's the guy small college developed, slowly comes into the NBA.
[2:41] Speaker 2: And you and I have talked about this.
[2:43] Speaker 1: I always thought, because Chuck Holmgrin was he's a really
[2:45] Speaker 1: good defender. First half the night he was incredible. And
[2:50] Speaker 1: I always thought, because his body type is so unique,
[2:53] Speaker 1: can you pay homegren SJ and Jalen Williams And I
[2:56] Speaker 1: always thought they just keep Homegrin But his offense is so.
[3:00] Speaker 2: All over the map.
[3:02] Speaker 1: And Jalen Williams is just such a natural easy score
[3:07] Speaker 1: that you just feel like if I said for the
[3:09] Speaker 1: rest of his career, he averaged twenty seven and like,
[3:13] Speaker 1: not all of them are memorable.
[3:14] Speaker 2: It's just he just.
[3:16] Speaker 1: Fills the box like it's jumpers, it's touch. It's just
[3:23] Speaker 1: he's just such a natural easy score.
[3:26] Speaker 2: I don't even know if he has a go to
[3:27] Speaker 2: move almost every guy.
[3:29] Speaker 1: Like if I said close your eyes Jason twenty seven
[3:33] Speaker 1: points a game, if I said Durant or staff and
[3:35] Speaker 1: I give you players, you can kind of see the
[3:40] Speaker 1: the archetype of their offense. Like you could say, Okay,
[3:42] Speaker 1: that's his move. That Halliburton's three with Jalen Williams. It's
[3:46] Speaker 1: just all over the place, threes driving transition. I just
[3:52] Speaker 1: there's not a lot of guys in the league like him.
[3:56] Speaker 3: Yeah, his power, I think is his signature. And I've
[3:58] Speaker 3: actually found this really fascinating because if you dig back
[4:01] Speaker 3: through NBA history recently, we're on like a decade plus
[4:05] Speaker 3: nowhere where power dominates in the NBA finals unless your
[4:09] Speaker 3: name is Steph Curry. Like you go back and it's like,
[4:13] Speaker 3: in twenty twenty four, you know, Luca, Luca is the
[4:16] Speaker 3: best player in the playoffs. He brings a ton of
[4:17] Speaker 3: power to the position. Twenty twenty three, it's Jokic obviously,
[4:20] Speaker 3: Stephan twenty twenty two, But in twenty one, it's Yannis power.
[4:24] Speaker 3: Twenty twenty it's Lebron power, twenty nineteen it's Kawhi power.
[4:28] Speaker 3: You go back again more, Steph Curry but then it's Lebron,
[4:31] Speaker 3: it's dunkin in Kawhi. There's a reason why power thrives
[4:35] Speaker 3: in this setting, and it's because it gets super physical.
[4:37] Speaker 3: I mean, it's you know, it's really fascinating to me.
[4:39] Speaker 3: I've talked about this concept with you before, but to me,
[4:41] Speaker 3: ball pressure in physicality on the perimeter in the NBA
[4:44] Speaker 3: is similar to me like a pass rush in the NFL.
[4:47] Speaker 3: And we see this so often in the NFL playoffs,
[4:49] Speaker 3: where a pass rush gets hot and nobody can protect
[4:52] Speaker 3: the quarterback and plays all breakdown within the first second
[4:55] Speaker 3: and a half after the snap, and it changes the
[4:57] Speaker 3: entire dynamic of a game. And that's the t you
[5:00] Speaker 3: have to pass with this Oklahoma City Thunder team, with
[5:02] Speaker 3: this Indiana Pacers team with their ball pressure. These two
[5:05] Speaker 3: teams they pick you up full court. They're super physical,
[5:08] Speaker 3: and it's the powerful guys that thrive. I mean, you
[5:11] Speaker 3: don't think it's a coincidence that TJ McConnell was awesome
[5:14] Speaker 3: again tonight because he brings power to the guard position.
[5:17] Speaker 3: And what Jdubb is is he is a big, strong
[5:21] Speaker 3: wing that brings downhill power. And you're right, like I
[5:24] Speaker 3: would argue j Dubb's you know, skill, talent, imposition on
[5:29] Speaker 3: the game is his versatility. He's just really good at everything. Ever,
[5:32] Speaker 3: look at other power players from the wing, like look
[5:37] Speaker 3: at Jlen Brown from the Celtics, nowhere near the passer
[5:41] Speaker 3: that Jadub is and the processor that Jaydub is. JDub
[5:45] Speaker 3: brings this mix of downhill power with shot making from
[5:49] Speaker 3: all three levels, the soft touch around the basket, the
[5:52] Speaker 3: mid range pull ups, the three point shooting, but also
[5:55] Speaker 3: the playmaking to boot and then he's also been a
[5:58] Speaker 3: guy that's been one of the most important defense of
[6:00] Speaker 3: players for the Thunder all season. He is, to me,
[6:03] Speaker 3: the definition of the type of player that's going to
[6:06] Speaker 3: thrive into playoffs for a long time. A big, strong
[6:08] Speaker 3: forward that can do everything. He is the Jimmy Butler
[6:12] Speaker 3: of this era.
[6:13] Speaker 2: Yeah, and he's one of those guy. Yeah, that's right.
[6:15] Speaker 1: I was thinking about his comp tonight, and he's got
[6:18] Speaker 1: Jimmy Butler. He feels, you know, he he's only about
[6:25] Speaker 1: six five and a half, like he plays bigger than
[6:27] Speaker 1: his size, and I think that's his length and his touch.
[6:31] Speaker 1: But I really thought the story of the game wasn't SGA.
[6:34] Speaker 1: I thought the story of the game was Holmgren's defense.
[6:36] Speaker 1: First half around the rim, I mean the Pacers probably
[6:39] Speaker 1: missed eight chippies. And then I thought in the second half,
[6:42] Speaker 1: every time they got close, it was really j Dubb
[6:46] Speaker 1: that hit a shot, and I mean so did SGA.
[6:50] Speaker 2: But I was like encouraged.
[6:52] Speaker 1: I thought the fact that Indiana got it down at
[6:54] Speaker 1: two or three, I was like, this is not impossible.
[6:57] Speaker 1: This is not winning this game. You know, without Halliburton
[7:03] Speaker 1: to be pretty competitive in the second half, I think
[7:05] Speaker 1: speaks well to Indiana. I think they'll play really competitive
[7:08] Speaker 1: basketball in game six. You know, I think we've kind
[7:14] Speaker 1: of established defense wins championships. And I thought the last
[7:17] Speaker 1: three minutes of the last game and tonight, early and late,
[7:22] Speaker 1: it's just what we're seeing this defense. Like you say,
[7:26] Speaker 1: they clog you up and suffocate you on the perimeter.
[7:29] Speaker 1: You drive sort of sometimes out of control because you
[7:33] Speaker 1: just they got a body on you, and then you
[7:36] Speaker 1: throw up kind of a wild shot, and it's often
[7:38] Speaker 1: met with resistance at the rim. Even the follow ups
[7:42] Speaker 1: to your misses, even the follow ups are contested. There's
[7:45] Speaker 1: just length and hartenstein and home grin and bodies. So
[7:49] Speaker 1: I think we're seeing and I talked about this the
[7:51] Speaker 1: other day with Jmack on the air. When we have
[7:53] Speaker 1: historically great defenses, great against great offenses, defense usually wins.
[7:57] Speaker 2: It's just disruptive.
[7:59] Speaker 1: We've We've seen Patrick Mahomes blown out twice in his career,
[8:03] Speaker 1: both in Super Bowls when he couldn't be protected.
[8:05] Speaker 2: I feel like.
[8:05] Speaker 1: Indiana's just has just been disrupted, and they without Halliburton
[8:10] Speaker 1: at full strength, they just don't have a flow.
[8:12] Speaker 2: There's no flow to their offense.
[8:14] Speaker 3: Yeah, I thought Shae was great again tonight. I thought,
[8:17] Speaker 3: you know, it's been interesting. He's had a couple of
[8:19] Speaker 3: higher scoring total games in this series. He had thirty
[8:22] Speaker 3: five in Game four. Didn't think he was particularly great
[8:24] Speaker 3: in that game. Dad, I think he had thirty four
[8:28] Speaker 3: in Game one. I didn't think he was particularly great
[8:30] Speaker 3: in that game. But in this game you could tell
[8:32] Speaker 3: right out the gates he was making that concerted effort
[8:35] Speaker 3: to keep his teammates involved. Colin, they only attempted sixteen
[8:38] Speaker 3: threes in Game four. They had seventeen three point attempts
[8:42] Speaker 3: just in the first half tonight because of the better
[8:44] Speaker 3: floor game that Shaye was playing, keeping everybody involved. But
[8:47] Speaker 3: every time I think about this Thunder team. It is
[8:50] Speaker 3: the defense that I'll remember, Like when people talk to
[8:53] Speaker 3: me about this Thunder team, I will remember them as
[8:56] Speaker 3: a defensive juggernaut and like it's the two layer approach
[8:59] Speaker 3: and you had you described it perfectly. It is the
[9:01] Speaker 3: physical ball pressure that causes you to rush and panic
[9:06] Speaker 3: that is then layered by the rim protection and it
[9:09] Speaker 3: even extends beyond Shell or beyond Shet, like she several
[9:12] Speaker 3: times tonight deflections around the basket because he's got super
[9:16] Speaker 3: long arms down there. You know. Chet to me is
[9:19] Speaker 3: like kind of the secret sauce of this defense though,
[9:21] Speaker 3: because you know Colin. We saw a great example in
[9:23] Speaker 3: the Houston of Golden State series in round one. You
[9:27] Speaker 3: can have really good perimeter defenders, but every team needs
[9:30] Speaker 3: to have big guys on the floor because big guys
[9:32] Speaker 3: are a part of basketball, right, Like he can't just
[9:33] Speaker 3: go out there and play five guards, You'll have all
[9:36] Speaker 3: sorts of issues. And big guys are targets. They are
[9:38] Speaker 3: the point at which every offense tries to get into
[9:41] Speaker 3: your defense by attacking your big guy in pick and roll.
[9:45] Speaker 3: And Chet is just this freakish weapon because he can
[9:48] Speaker 3: do all the big guy stuff in terms of length
[9:50] Speaker 3: around the rim, but he can also switch out onto
[9:53] Speaker 3: the perimeter and guard these guards. And so it's like
[9:56] Speaker 3: the it's like the ace in the hole for this
[9:59] Speaker 3: thunder defense. Like a lot of times you'll fail the
[10:02] Speaker 3: first test, like when Pascal hit that three to make
[10:05] Speaker 3: it ninety five to ninety three. From that point forward,
[10:08] Speaker 3: Indy could barely get the ball across half court without
[10:10] Speaker 3: turning the ball over. So like their guards can do
[10:13] Speaker 3: an insane amount of damage. But it's like even if
[10:16] Speaker 3: you pass that test and you get through the ball
[10:18] Speaker 3: pressure and you move the ball through their defense and
[10:21] Speaker 3: you get something around the rim, it's just arms everywhere
[10:25] Speaker 3: that you're dealing with at the rim and all of
[10:27] Speaker 3: those misses, all of those contested rebounds that they came
[10:30] Speaker 3: down with, Oklahoma City's defense is layered. It's frightening. It
[10:35] Speaker 3: wears you down. I mean like Indy was right there
[10:37] Speaker 3: and they let go of the rope for like ninety
[10:39] Speaker 3: seconds and they're down thirteen points. And I'm with you,
[10:42] Speaker 3: as we had the game six, I think Indiana always
[10:45] Speaker 3: is gonna have a chance at home with the energy
[10:48] Speaker 3: Oklahoma City's young we have discussed on this show, Oklahoma
[10:51] Speaker 3: City on the road is not the same team. But
[10:54] Speaker 3: I thought Indiana's chance to win this series was to
[10:57] Speaker 3: win the home games because I just think Oklahoma City
[10:59] Speaker 3: can leverage their athleticism at home in a way that
[11:03] Speaker 3: Indy just can't match.
[11:05] Speaker 1: Yeah, and again Halliburton's heart, it's not the same team.
[11:08] Speaker 1: It'd be like taking you know, to some degree, Sga out.
[11:11] Speaker 1: So I thought Caruso again tonight, I mean, they forced
[11:15] Speaker 1: twenty three turnovers. The thunder did think about that. INDI
[11:19] Speaker 1: is a team all year that didn't turn the ball over,
[11:21] Speaker 1: like Halliburton doesn't turn the ball over. So you take
[11:24] Speaker 1: Halliburton out a lot tonight and it looks really sloppy,
[11:28] Speaker 1: really fast. Again, They're just they're just a special team,
[11:34] Speaker 1: you know. I think you know, Indiana is a surprise
[11:39] Speaker 1: to be here. And the West is much better than
[11:42] Speaker 1: the East, and so like in the football, the AFC
[11:46] Speaker 1: is much better than the NFC. So the AFC becomes
[11:48] Speaker 1: much more predictable because you have four or five elite
[11:50] Speaker 1: teams Chiefs, Bills, Ravens, And I think the West is
[11:54] Speaker 1: more predictable because you have like Oklahoma City has the
[11:56] Speaker 1: leading scorer and the best defense and Denver has the
[11:59] Speaker 1: best player in the world, and the Warriors have this
[12:02] Speaker 1: Steve kerr At Draymond and Butler and Stephen. You kind
[12:05] Speaker 1: of know what you're getting in the West, oras in
[12:07] Speaker 1: the East, it's like who's healthy and who's hot. So
[12:10] Speaker 1: Indiana just flies through. But I will say, is so
[12:15] Speaker 1: I think the East is wide open, and I think Indiana's.
[12:21] Speaker 2: Pop or now.
[12:22] Speaker 1: They were in the Eastern Conference finals last year, but
[12:24] Speaker 1: I mean they flew through Milwaukee, flew through Cleveland, controlled.
[12:31] Speaker 2: New York, and we're.
[12:32] Speaker 1: Two to two with this team. And I think some
[12:35] Speaker 1: of the trade that Memphis and Orlando made was Orlando going, Okay,
[12:40] Speaker 1: the Knicks don't have a coach, Tatum's hurt next year,
[12:44] Speaker 1: why can't we do in Indiana? We got Sugs, we
[12:48] Speaker 1: got Benkaro, we got Wagner. Let's go get a Western
[12:53] Speaker 1: player whoeverage is nineteen, he may average twenty two over here.
[12:57] Speaker 1: And I think I think Orlando Indiana and thought why
[13:02] Speaker 1: not us. I mean, they don't have a guy that
[13:06] Speaker 1: scores over twenty. Man Carroll could be first team All
[13:09] Speaker 1: NBA next year. So I think when I watch Indiana,
[13:12] Speaker 1: I think they're they're they're encouraging. They've got young, ascending players,
[13:17] Speaker 1: they've kind of meshed together in the East, and you're like, Okay,
[13:20] Speaker 1: it was one thing when Boston was winning with a
[13:22] Speaker 1: stacked roster Indiana, Like you didn't I think I said
[13:27] Speaker 1: it during the Boston Orlando series. I'm like, man, they're
[13:29] Speaker 1: about a year away from being really really good. So
[13:32] Speaker 1: I think Indiana is one of those teams that may
[13:34] Speaker 1: not make it back and it may just be lightning
[13:38] Speaker 1: in a bottle. I really like him a lot, but
[13:42] Speaker 1: I think okay See is historically special defensively, and we're
[13:45] Speaker 1: seeing it.
[13:46] Speaker 3: Yeah, The East to me feels wide open in a
[13:49] Speaker 3: different way where I agree with you. Like the Boston
[13:52] Speaker 3: was like this clear number one out Yeast, but then
[13:55] Speaker 3: you had this like group of three four teams that
[13:57] Speaker 3: you knew were going to be in the mix, you know, Milwaukee,
[13:59] Speaker 3: New York. That was the mix that we knew was
[14:01] Speaker 3: going to be at the top. But now with Boston
[14:04] Speaker 3: kind of dropping out of that group, it does feel
[14:07] Speaker 3: wide open. Like Cleveland is very good, but everyone knows
[14:09] Speaker 3: they're beatable, Like the Bucks will be there if Giannis
[14:13] Speaker 3: is still there, but like we know that they're beatable.
[14:15] Speaker 3: The Knicks. We know that they have their flaws and
[14:18] Speaker 3: their issues. They have a front court that you can
[14:19] Speaker 3: attack defensively, and I think what the Pacers have demonstrated
[14:22] Speaker 3: in a lot of ways is that you can, you know,
[14:25] Speaker 3: OutKick your coverage, so to speak, in terms of the
[14:27] Speaker 3: talent on your roster, when there is a great deal
[14:30] Speaker 3: of one that the coaching that maximizes the talent. But
[14:34] Speaker 3: the second piece is from a general management perspective, like
[14:37] Speaker 3: actual complimentary pieces that fit and accentuate each other. And
[14:41] Speaker 3: that to me is what I look at with the
[14:42] Speaker 3: Desmond Bain trade, because like, your initial reaction when you
[14:45] Speaker 3: see that sort of thing is to go for first
[14:48] Speaker 3: round picks unprotected. Like, my goodness, that's a steep paycheck,
[14:51] Speaker 3: and like I get that on the surface, and ultimately
[14:54] Speaker 3: whether or not that ends up being worthwhile will be
[14:57] Speaker 3: whether or not this team has success, and if they
[14:59] Speaker 3: have success, they make the finals. No one's going to
[15:01] Speaker 3: care about those four first round picks. It's about whether
[15:05] Speaker 3: or not this pays off. Right, Desmond Baine is a
[15:08] Speaker 3: perfectly complementary player. Yes to what those two guys do
[15:12] Speaker 3: is he is one of the best jump shooters in
[15:14] Speaker 3: the NBA among fifty eight players this year to attempt
[15:17] Speaker 3: at least five hundred jumpers, he ranked twelve in efficiency.
[15:19] Speaker 2: By the way, and the Magic couldn't shoot last year.
[15:22] Speaker 2: That's why they couldn't shoot.
[15:23] Speaker 3: They couldn't shoot, by the way. You want to know
[15:25] Speaker 3: his number one on that list, Kevin Durant. Kevin Durant
[15:27] Speaker 3: is still the best jump shooter in the NBA. I
[15:29] Speaker 3: thought that was interesting when I was digging into the data.
[15:32] Speaker 3: But he specifically shot sixty percent from the field on
[15:38] Speaker 3: shot attempts coming off of off ball screens. So when
[15:42] Speaker 3: he comes running off of action off the ball, he
[15:45] Speaker 3: knocks it down at an extremely high rate. He shot
[15:47] Speaker 3: fifty two percent on threes specifically coming off of off
[15:51] Speaker 3: ball screens. The Magic could not create space for Palo
[15:55] Speaker 3: in fronts. That was the problem the Desmond Baane in Memphis.
[15:59] Speaker 3: They so desperately needed him to hit shots because he
[16:02] Speaker 3: was their secondary shot creator. It was a little bit
[16:05] Speaker 3: too much for him. But in this setting, next to Franz,
[16:07] Speaker 3: next to Polo, it's more important for him to be
[16:10] Speaker 3: able to create openings for them. His ability to shoot
[16:13] Speaker 3: on the move, shoot it out of screens, shoot off
[16:16] Speaker 3: the dribble. Specifically, in the context of Franz and Paolo,
[16:20] Speaker 3: you're gonna get a it's a force multiplier rather than
[16:24] Speaker 3: a diminishing return, and that really is the key. Like,
[16:26] Speaker 3: when I'm looking at talent, it's like they could have
[16:28] Speaker 3: gone and got Bradley Beal and maybe that's a player
[16:32] Speaker 3: that you think is maybe a higher regarded player in
[16:36] Speaker 3: the league or something like that. Desmond Bain's talent fits
[16:39] Speaker 3: perfectly with those guys in a wide open conference, and
[16:43] Speaker 3: that's a huge, big, strong team that should be able
[16:47] Speaker 3: to cause a lot of damage with their physicality. And
[16:49] Speaker 3: the last thing I'll say about it, Colin, Desmond's not
[16:51] Speaker 3: the best defender in the world, but he's pretty solid.
[16:54] Speaker 3: Jalen Suggs is the best guard defender in the world,
[16:58] Speaker 3: and so he will never have to guard the best
[17:00] Speaker 3: scarred on the other team. He's going to be in
[17:02] Speaker 3: favorable matchups, He's going to be surrounded by physicality. His
[17:05] Speaker 3: skill set perfectly matches what Franz and Paolo do. I
[17:10] Speaker 3: think it was a type of swing that could legitimately
[17:13] Speaker 3: put them in the finals. And Colin, you're the one
[17:15] Speaker 3: who's always preaching this on your show. Yes, it was expensive,
[17:19] Speaker 3: so was Kawhi for the rafts in twenty nineteen. That's
[17:21] Speaker 3: at a certain point you got to push your chips
[17:23] Speaker 3: in the middle if you want to try to win.
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[18:48] Speaker 1: I think Orlando looks at it and thinks, listen the
[18:50] Speaker 1: banes like twenty five or twenty six years old. It's
[18:53] Speaker 1: like Oklahoma City, you don't have this aged star, you
[18:57] Speaker 1: don't have this one gigantic paycheck. It's like everybody's pulling
[19:01] Speaker 1: in the same direction. Like did they bring in Hartenstein.
[19:04] Speaker 1: He's a starter, but like kind of a role player,
[19:07] Speaker 1: but great energy, and everybody welcomes him. In like everybody
[19:10] Speaker 1: that like Bain. I was watching the videos today when
[19:13] Speaker 1: that when he got to Orlando, the guys were.
[19:15] Speaker 2: Like, it's just like he's one of the guys.
[19:17] Speaker 1: He's a young guy who, by the way, because he
[19:19] Speaker 1: was in Memphis behind Jahn Morant, probably didn't get appreciated
[19:23] Speaker 1: a lot or a lot of attention. And Bain was
[19:25] Speaker 1: the more mature player, the more consistent player, the more
[19:27] Speaker 1: available player, and the better shooter. But John Morant's great
[19:31] Speaker 1: for highlights, so Bain gets overlooked, but not by smart GM.
[19:34] Speaker 1: So Bain's probably like, Okay, now I get into a
[19:38] Speaker 1: more you know this is I mean Sugs a Gonzaga guy,
[19:40] Speaker 1: Benko a Duke guy.
[19:42] Speaker 2: Vogner's a Michigan guy. Like there, these are grown ups.
[19:45] Speaker 1: They're ready to play. And I thought, I think we
[19:47] Speaker 1: talked about this in the Boston series. It was like
[19:51] Speaker 1: two or three times you and I were like, what
[19:52] Speaker 1: the hell is this series so competitive? Like like Orlando
[19:57] Speaker 1: can't shoot, Boston takes the mot this should we should
[20:01] Speaker 1: have some blowouts.
[20:02] Speaker 2: And we didn't.
[20:03] Speaker 1: The games were really competitive. We felt that way about
[20:06] Speaker 1: the Knicks and the Pistons too. It's like what Scott
[20:09] Speaker 1: Cade Cunningham's really graduated to another class And so I
[20:13] Speaker 1: liked it, and I also just aggressive wins. Go get
[20:15] Speaker 1: Katie and Golden State, the Lakers, you know, trade for gasol,
[20:18] Speaker 1: trade for shock, take big swings. Absolutely poor Zingis and
[20:24] Speaker 1: Drew Holliday Boston, Like, you have to take swings in
[20:27] Speaker 1: this league because you're not gonna be able to bank
[20:30] Speaker 1: these stars. You're not gonna have the Heatls, You're not
[20:32] Speaker 1: gonna have Katie to the Warriors. So what you're gonna
[20:34] Speaker 1: do is, can you get a group of really good
[20:38] Speaker 1: B plus A minus guys that all fit and Orlando fits,
[20:44] Speaker 1: Baine literally fits perfectly with a team. Yeah, it'd be
[20:48] Speaker 1: better if it was two first not four, but those
[20:50] Speaker 1: are gonna be low first round picks anyway, So I
[20:53] Speaker 1: can live with it.
[20:54] Speaker 3: And there's like this, the splitting the difference two timelines
[20:58] Speaker 3: approach comes with its own shortcoming, Like obviously Golden State
[21:01] Speaker 3: was very fortunate on the strength of Steph to win
[21:03] Speaker 3: in twenty twenty two, but they've been paying the price
[21:06] Speaker 3: for not cashing in on some of their assets over
[21:08] Speaker 3: the course of the last few years. I feel like
[21:11] Speaker 3: Dallas is kind of staring down the barrel of a
[21:13] Speaker 3: similar type of situation, Like you got to capitalize on
[21:16] Speaker 3: the value that ad tris to the table if you
[21:19] Speaker 3: want to have sustained success around Cooper Flag And like,
[21:23] Speaker 3: I just look at it as I look at it
[21:25] Speaker 3: as just an aggressive move that fits perfectly. Desmond Bain
[21:27] Speaker 3: has grown a lot too as a passer coming off
[21:31] Speaker 3: of screening actions, and I look at that as something
[21:33] Speaker 3: like a simple dynamic in the NBA that can cause
[21:35] Speaker 3: all sorts of problems is if you can run a
[21:37] Speaker 3: two man game where they don't want to switch. And
[21:40] Speaker 3: the problem is is when Franz and Paalo are together,
[21:42] Speaker 3: they get guarded by similar players, big strong forwards, and
[21:46] Speaker 3: with Jalen Suggs, he never shot the ball well enough
[21:48] Speaker 3: for teams to really account for him in those actions.
[21:52] Speaker 3: If you, as Desmond Bain, as one of the best
[21:54] Speaker 3: shooters in the league, come flying off of a screen
[21:57] Speaker 3: with Paolo, you have no choice but to either switch
[22:01] Speaker 3: or to show, in which case Powlo will get better matchups,
[22:04] Speaker 3: He'll get more smalls to attack, he'll get more openings
[22:06] Speaker 3: to attack. I think it's just a really, really smart fit.
[22:10] Speaker 3: John Moran on the other hand gonna be twenty six
[22:13] Speaker 3: years old at the start of next season. I like,
[22:16] Speaker 3: I want to hear your take on the John Moran
[22:18] Speaker 3: Memphis situation.
[22:19] Speaker 2: Okay, so I feel vindicated, So I have been.
[22:22] Speaker 1: This has been one of my strongest NBA takes forever,
[22:26] Speaker 1: which is, if you're under six' four in this league
[22:29] Speaker 1: and have the ball in your hands a, lot if
[22:31] Speaker 1: you cannot Shoot John, wall you, Know, Westbrook Derek, Rose John,
[22:39] Speaker 1: morant you're going to have to drive to the basket
[22:41] Speaker 1: against bigger players and you're going to get hurt more.
[22:44] Speaker 1: Often if You're Steve nash Or Steph currian can, shoot
[22:47] Speaker 1: it can prolong your. Career you can do at you,
[22:50] Speaker 1: know you don't have to. Drive you get a lot
[22:51] Speaker 1: of no contact. Looks and my take On John morant, was,
[22:56] Speaker 1: YES i saw it was. SAID i thought he was
[22:58] Speaker 1: a poor Man's Dereck. Rose he's about fifty pounds less
[23:00] Speaker 1: Than Derek. Rose and you, KNOW i understand.
[23:03] Speaker 2: THE nba, media he's a highlight.
[23:05] Speaker 1: Player forget the maturity for a, second which Is i'm
[23:09] Speaker 1: never too hard on guys about. Maturity i'm much tougher
[23:11] Speaker 1: on football players because they're twenty three and twenty four years.
[23:15] Speaker 1: Old you bring twenty two year, old you bring eighteen
[23:18] Speaker 1: nineteen year old guys into THE, Nba, okay they're gonna screw,
[23:22] Speaker 1: up like the first couple of. Years just just build
[23:24] Speaker 1: in a really bad. Decision now With, jaw it was
[23:27] Speaker 1: worse than. That but for, me it wasn't the maturity
[23:30] Speaker 1: stuff because he's a. Kid it Was, okay he's wildly
[23:35] Speaker 1: he's wildly. Entertaining he's an incredible highlight, player but he's
[23:40] Speaker 1: not an effective. Shooter and by the, way the last
[23:43] Speaker 1: several years it's gotten worse and he's hurt more.
[23:46] Speaker 2: So he has aged very.
[23:47] Speaker 1: Quickly So i've never been a fan of hyper athletic
[23:50] Speaker 1: guards that aren't particularly good. Shooters, Now westbrook was so
[23:54] Speaker 1: athletic that he could be a poor. Shooter and you,
[23:58] Speaker 1: know he's bouncing around the league, now but he there's
[24:00] Speaker 1: just not a lot Of westbrook's. Historically And westbrook mostly is.
[24:03] Speaker 1: Healthy he's a sturdy he has a running. Back jaw's
[24:07] Speaker 1: NOT i, mean what's job one, eighty you, know one seventy,
[24:11] Speaker 1: Eight so he's. Spindily SO i just it's not THAT
[24:14] Speaker 1: i wasn't a. Fan he was a spectacular. Talent BUT
[24:17] Speaker 1: i think everybody in the league Thought zion And jaw
[24:19] Speaker 1: were going to take it, over and it's gonna be
[24:22] Speaker 1: a it's gonna be Bang caro AND sga and these.
[24:24] Speaker 1: PLAYERS i, mean it's just it's just interesting how much
[24:29] Speaker 1: maturity and hard work, matters you, KNOW.
[24:32] Speaker 2: JDW, sga Home.
[24:35] Speaker 1: GRIN i, mean it's just like really, focused, driven aspirational.
[24:40] Speaker 1: Players AND i think it was just too much too
[24:43] Speaker 1: soon form and he got banged. Up AND i Think,
[24:45] Speaker 1: memphis by the, trade is telling you we're going to start.
[24:48] Speaker 1: Over we're going to start and it's the right. Move
[24:51] Speaker 1: they can't. Compete we knew it this. Year it's the
[24:54] Speaker 1: right move By. MEMPHIS i actually like What memphis. Did
[24:57] Speaker 1: it's just they won't be very good for a couple of. Years.
[25:01] Speaker 3: Yeah you, know we were talking about power, earlier and
[25:06] Speaker 3: the one example of a guy who succeeded despite a
[25:10] Speaker 3: lack of power Is. Steph And steph is both a
[25:14] Speaker 3: great shooter and someone who has been consistently available to his.
[25:17] Speaker 3: Team he's been. Healthy, yeah. Yeah and the tricky thing
[25:20] Speaker 3: with Like john's going to be twenty six years old
[25:22] Speaker 3: at the start of next season and he's just straight
[25:25] Speaker 3: up not as good as he was three years. Ago,
[25:28] Speaker 3: like he's just not as good as at, basketball and
[25:31] Speaker 3: like this is the. Age twenty six to twenty seven
[25:33] Speaker 3: is typically the age when players, Peak Like tatum best
[25:37] Speaker 3: season of his career right at this, age this is
[25:39] Speaker 3: the age when everyone seems to kind of figure it.
[25:41] Speaker 3: Out it's where it's kind of where like the meeting
[25:44] Speaker 3: point of the mental part of the game and the
[25:45] Speaker 3: physical part of the. Game and from this point, forward
[25:48] Speaker 3: it's kind of like a trade. Off you get a little,
[25:49] Speaker 3: smarter a little more, skilled but you get a little less.
[25:51] Speaker 3: Athletic this is the, peak right and, instead like his
[25:54] Speaker 3: scoring volume Has like in twenty twenty, two takes his
[25:57] Speaker 3: team to within two wins of the conference, finals he's
[26:00] Speaker 3: going head to head With steph talking shit to him
[26:02] Speaker 3: having such a great breakout playoff. Run and ever since,
[26:06] Speaker 3: then his scoring volume has dropped every season since that,
[26:09] Speaker 3: year his efficiency has gone. Down he just posted his
[26:13] Speaker 3: two lowest games played totals of his career in the
[26:16] Speaker 3: last two. Seasons he's played fewer games in the last
[26:18] Speaker 3: two years than he did three years ago. Combined like
[26:21] Speaker 3: it's been a downward, trajectory and so if You're memphis
[26:26] Speaker 3: and you're looking at, it you just got four unprotected
[26:29] Speaker 3: first round picks From. Orlando there still is some, young
[26:33] Speaker 3: exciting talent on the, roster some guys Like Gigi jackson
[26:37] Speaker 3: that are, Interesting Zach edy that's. Interesting they have guys
[26:40] Speaker 3: in house that they can continue to develop and be,
[26:42] Speaker 3: fun but they can bring in a massive trove of
[26:45] Speaker 3: draft picks by Trading Moranton bain and just doing a full.
[26:48] Speaker 3: Pivot not to Mention Jaron, jackson WHO i think carries
[26:51] Speaker 3: a great deal of value somewhere around the. League and
[26:53] Speaker 3: SO i look at it as like a basically it's
[26:56] Speaker 3: a turning point For John. Rant you either got to
[26:58] Speaker 3: commit to him or you've got to get off the,
[27:00] Speaker 3: ship and the trade is a clear sign that they're
[27:03] Speaker 3: going to get off the. Ship not to mention like
[27:04] Speaker 3: they might look to TRADE. KCP i wouldn't be surprised
[27:07] Speaker 3: IF kcp gets moved to a contender at some point
[27:10] Speaker 3: in the next. SEASON i think it's Just memphis looking
[27:12] Speaker 3: at their situation and going, like we're sick of being
[27:15] Speaker 3: in this.
[27:15] Speaker 2: Business it's So.
[27:18] Speaker 1: Jaw is such a cautionary tale when you look at
[27:21] Speaker 1: at big stars that explode and then and then fall
[27:25] Speaker 1: off and don't eventually rise to the. Level it's always
[27:29] Speaker 1: kind of a maturity. Thing it's almost always that like
[27:31] Speaker 1: you just couldn't handle a, spot like Like zion couldn't
[27:34] Speaker 1: handle his. Weight wasn't it terribly focused. Player ZION i
[27:38] Speaker 1: thought was a tremendously just massive. Torque there's just nothing like.
[27:42] Speaker 1: HIM i Thought jaw was. Spectacular BUT i think it's
[27:46] Speaker 1: it's one of the REASONS i like nil. As kids
[27:49] Speaker 1: are going to stay in college and they're going to
[27:51] Speaker 1: be surrounded by non basketball, players and they're going to
[27:53] Speaker 1: be coached, hard and they'll go to class and it's
[27:56] Speaker 1: like a it's a it's a big broad life beyond
[28:00] Speaker 1: basketball and A g. League SO i, think And i've
[28:04] Speaker 1: talked about this multiple, TIMES i Think nil's were gonna
[28:06] Speaker 1: help THE nba and college basketball and you're gonna get more.
[28:11] Speaker 1: Guys The auburn player WHO J mack, Loves auburn's got
[28:14] Speaker 1: a guard that's. Explosive he's coming back To. Auburn he
[28:17] Speaker 1: could play in THE. Nba he'll make him a BETTER
[28:20] Speaker 1: nba player and a great college. Player so and some
[28:23] Speaker 1: of These european guys now are coming over to college.
[28:25] Speaker 1: Basketball SO i think the coaching in college basketball has
[28:27] Speaker 1: always been, excellent sometimes almost too, dogmatic, right like it's
[28:34] Speaker 1: just so coach. Oriented BUT i look At jaw AND
[28:37] Speaker 1: i think the story Of jaw is a little too,
[28:40] Speaker 1: much too, soon and just wasn't quite ready for the.
[28:43] Speaker 1: STAGE i, mean there was a moment in time where you,
[28:47] Speaker 1: thought for about a year maybe, two you're, Like, oh
[28:52] Speaker 1: he's gonna be the face of the. LEAGUE i mean
[28:55] Speaker 1: that was about three years, ago and then it all just,
[29:00] Speaker 1: unraveled AND i don't think we need to face the.
[29:04] Speaker 1: LEAGUE i thought he for a while looked like. It
[29:06] Speaker 1: he just wasn't ready for. It it's a lot to
[29:09] Speaker 1: ask and he wasn't ready for.
[29:10] Speaker 3: It, yeah you know what happens in this. League it's
[29:14] Speaker 3: success is so short lived because people are coming for.
[29:17] Speaker 3: You you, know Like jannis looks like he climbs the
[29:19] Speaker 3: mountaintop in twenty twenty, one looks like he's gonna launch
[29:22] Speaker 3: this New, nope here Comes jokich and he's the. Problem
[29:25] Speaker 3: it's Like jah looks like he's about to climb the
[29:27] Speaker 3: mountaintop in twenty twenty. Two shay And ant have both
[29:30] Speaker 3: lacked him since they've kind of reached their collective. Ceilings and,
[29:34] Speaker 3: LIKE i, think you, KNOW i do believe In John.
[29:37] Speaker 3: MORANT i. Do he has a supreme athletic trait in
[29:41] Speaker 3: the ability to get. Downhill he actually is an underrated
[29:45] Speaker 3: shot maker close to the rim in terms of like
[29:47] Speaker 3: his floater and like little short. STUFF i do think
[29:50] Speaker 3: there's somebody that should probably consider taking a bet on
[29:54] Speaker 3: him or a chance on. Him AS i look. Around you,
[29:57] Speaker 3: know we're gonna talk ABOUT kd here in a second
[30:00] Speaker 3: AND kd as we're gonna talk about it in more
[30:02] Speaker 3: detailer in a. Second but the athletic is reported That
[30:04] Speaker 3: katie is preferring The, spurs which we'll get to in a.
[30:06] Speaker 3: Minute but Like, houston If houston can't GET, kd, like
[30:12] Speaker 3: would they consider a guy Like John? Morant is there
[30:15] Speaker 3: a team out there that has the that's in a
[30:19] Speaker 3: tough position that can afford to take that kind of,
[30:21] Speaker 3: risk maybe A sacramento a team that's been kind of
[30:24] Speaker 3: stuck in, Mediocrity, like is there a team out there
[30:27] Speaker 3: that is willing to take a risk on a guy like?
[30:30] Speaker 3: Him BECAUSE i do think the upside is their calling,
[30:32] Speaker 3: Like i've seen a lot of stuff over the last
[30:35] Speaker 3: couple of days ranking him at various points in the,
[30:37] Speaker 3: league AND i do think when he's, healthy he's still
[30:40] Speaker 3: like a right around the fourteenth or fifteenth best player
[30:43] Speaker 3: in THE nba because no one can keep him in.
[30:45] Speaker 3: Front he is an extremely talented. Player that's the frustrating
[30:49] Speaker 3: part is that it hasn't come. Together BUT i do
[30:51] Speaker 3: think that there's some somebody out there that's going to
[30:54] Speaker 3: take a chance on. Him but, ultimately whether or not
[30:56] Speaker 3: it works out is going to be whether or Not
[30:58] Speaker 3: jaw actually makes the changes that he needs. To like
[31:00] Speaker 3: you got to, improve like, you you have to develop
[31:03] Speaker 3: as a jump shooter to take it easier on your.
[31:04] Speaker 3: Legs if he develops as a jump, shooter it will
[31:08] Speaker 3: make his downhill drives more dynamic and less, frequent which
[31:11] Speaker 3: will help him stay healthier and available to his. Team
[31:13] Speaker 3: there is a real upside, there he just hasn't been
[31:16] Speaker 3: able to capitalize on.
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[32:03] Speaker 3: Podcast, colin what are your thoughts on the report That
[32:06] Speaker 3: Kevin durant prefers The. SPURS i was not a huge
[32:09] Speaker 3: fan of this. Fit we were talking last week about
[32:11] Speaker 3: How wemby being very, THIN kd being very, thin even
[32:16] Speaker 3: Deeron fox is he's a super fast, guard but he's
[32:18] Speaker 3: not a power. Player not a lot of power on that. Roster,
[32:21] Speaker 3: colin what are your thoughts ON kd potentially going to The? Spurs,
[32:24] Speaker 3: WELL i.
[32:25] Speaker 1: Mean to, Me Wembin yama And Stefan castle are the. Team,
[32:30] Speaker 1: like that's nothing against De aaron And, vassal BUT i
[32:35] Speaker 1: think those two guys are all, stars one of them
[32:37] Speaker 1: ALL nba so AND i think they're just getting better.
[32:40] Speaker 1: FAST i Think i'm always cautious to Say Kevin durant
[32:48] Speaker 1: doesn't fit. ANYWHERE i think he fits. Everywhere like my
[32:52] Speaker 1: Wife olasa, says like salt works with, Everything like like
[32:58] Speaker 1: like my son was a, chef my step, Son it's, like, Yeah,
[33:01] Speaker 1: Bacon grease And butter work with.
[33:03] Speaker 2: Everything That's Kevin.
[33:06] Speaker 1: Durant like you can just find a spot for a
[33:08] Speaker 1: guy who's the best jump shooter at any given juncture
[33:12] Speaker 1: in the. League so AND i also Think kevin it
[33:17] Speaker 1: just kind of figures it.
[33:18] Speaker 2: Out you.
[33:20] Speaker 1: KNOW i don't always like his decision making on, teams
[33:24] Speaker 1: but even In, brooklyn he was the one THING i
[33:26] Speaker 1: liked about. It he was the one THING i mean In,
[33:30] Speaker 1: arizona In, phoenix it Was Bradley beale that drove us.
[33:33] Speaker 1: Nuts Kevin durant was giving me twenty six and twenty.
[33:36] Speaker 1: Seven i'm not disappointed with. Him i've been disappointed with you,
[33:41] Speaker 1: know his like team, selection BUT i just kind of
[33:45] Speaker 1: feel like he's water like he just he just kind
[33:49] Speaker 1: of floats and finds his. Level AND i think he'll fit.
[33:53] Speaker 1: Anywhere AND i also think you've got really smart Between
[33:58] Speaker 1: Chris paul and De Aaron, fox you have good guiters
[34:01] Speaker 1: on that team like really smart, guys and.
[34:06] Speaker 2: You can be a.
[34:07] Speaker 1: Really flawed team if you're. Intelligent we've talked about The
[34:10] Speaker 1: Miami heat like one of the smartest teams in league.
[34:12] Speaker 1: History it's Like, Alan, Lebron, Wade, Bosh battie A, Haslam
[34:18] Speaker 1: it's like she's high. Functioning they didn't have a. Center
[34:23] Speaker 1: chalmers drove everybody. Crazy wade And lebron kind of had duplicate,
[34:27] Speaker 1: games and you're, like, yeah they got the four straight,
[34:29] Speaker 1: finals like they just figured shit out. Right AND i
[34:33] Speaker 1: kind of feel like if you Put wemby and and
[34:36] Speaker 1: And It's fox and it's you'd have to move. OFF
[34:39] Speaker 1: i Think Harrison barnes we talked about, BEFORE i think
[34:41] Speaker 1: it was the BUT i, MEAN i just Think katie would.
[34:44] Speaker 1: WORK i think it would just. WORK i think. IT
[34:47] Speaker 1: i Think houston needs him. More BUT i MEAN i
[34:52] Speaker 1: think he looks At houston and, thinks all, right like Like, Sangoon,
[34:58] Speaker 1: YEAH i Mean, mpson is he a great offensive, player
[35:02] Speaker 1: yet he's more of an athlete defensive.
[35:04] Speaker 2: PLAYER i don't.
[35:06] Speaker 1: KNOW i THINK kd smart and looks at it and just, thinks,
[35:09] Speaker 1: MAN i could have bad shooting nights and we could
[35:12] Speaker 1: score one twenty eight In San, Antonio, LIKE i think
[35:14] Speaker 1: that's how he looks at.
[35:15] Speaker 2: It Maybe i'm, wrong you, KNOW.
[35:19] Speaker 3: I want to be. Clear just BECAUSE i say it's
[35:22] Speaker 3: not my favorite fit doesn't mean it can't. Work Like
[35:25] Speaker 3: i'm a big believer in don't overthink things like don't
[35:28] Speaker 3: Overthink Kevin durant next To Victor weinbinyama And Darren, Fox
[35:33] Speaker 3: like they're gonna score a lot of points and they're
[35:35] Speaker 3: gonna be able, to uh to get a certain number of.
[35:37] Speaker 3: Stops THERE'S i there is you were just talking about
[35:41] Speaker 3: With Desmond. Bain there's a reason Why Desmond baine's shooting
[35:45] Speaker 3: is so incredibly valuable in The orlando context on a
[35:48] Speaker 3: team that not only doesn't have a guy who can
[35:50] Speaker 3: make jump, shots but doesn't have a guy who can
[35:52] Speaker 3: make jump shots off the. Move so it's uniquely super
[35:55] Speaker 3: valuable to that. Team kd anchored by the physicality Of.
[35:59] Speaker 3: HUGHES i like the kind of like force multiplier effect
[36:03] Speaker 3: he could have. There that, said even in the context
[36:06] Speaker 3: Of San, antonio he's obviously a massive. Upgrade he's obviously
[36:10] Speaker 3: going to make them way. Better there's even like some
[36:13] Speaker 3: interesting stuff you could look at in the big, PICTURE
[36:15] Speaker 3: kd is like probably the best shooting workout guy in
[36:19] Speaker 3: the league to Pair Victor Webbin yama. With he's legendary
[36:24] Speaker 3: for the quality of his shooting, workouts him going game,
[36:27] Speaker 3: speed him working on shots that are specifically available IN
[36:30] Speaker 3: nba games off of certain. Actions kat is like a
[36:33] Speaker 3: legend in his workouts off the. Floor wemby's going to
[36:37] Speaker 3: be doing all those workouts with, him you know he,
[36:39] Speaker 3: is and it would lead to a certain development in
[36:42] Speaker 3: terms Of wemby's big picture. Health but it looks to
[36:46] Speaker 3: me more like less of a immediate contender juggernaut and
[36:52] Speaker 3: more of like kind of a fun place For katie
[36:54] Speaker 3: to end his career where he can go hand in
[36:56] Speaker 3: hand In. Wemby you, Know.
[36:57] Speaker 1: That's WHAT i. THINK i think kat looks at it
[36:59] Speaker 1: and thinks this would be. Fun is that it wouldn't
[37:02] Speaker 1: BE i wouldn't have to drop twenty eight, points would come.
[37:05] Speaker 1: Easy AND i Think katie looks at it and, thinks,
[37:08] Speaker 1: okay Dearon. Fox you Know wemby the structure of the.
[37:13] Speaker 1: Organization they draft smart. Players they don't draft a lot of,
[37:16] Speaker 1: ego they don't draft a lot of. DUMMIES i Think
[37:19] Speaker 1: katie looks at himself and, Thinks, Okay houston's got. This
[37:22] Speaker 1: there's a lot of stuff In houston That i'm not
[37:25] Speaker 1: sure it's ever going to be. Great in the, playoffs
[37:28] Speaker 1: it's a lot of hyper athleticism and length and running
[37:32] Speaker 1: AND i AND i and that's.
[37:33] Speaker 2: Fun BUT i THINK i don't think at this point
[37:36] Speaker 2: he wants to be a, mentor right LIKE i think
[37:38] Speaker 2: he wants to.
[37:38] Speaker 1: GO i Think i'll have some fun and play with
[37:41] Speaker 1: really smart, players highly functional, players and all put the
[37:45] Speaker 1: pressure on me to figure out WHERE i, fit you,
[37:49] Speaker 1: know like they don't need.
[37:50] Speaker 2: HIM i Think houston needs. HIM i think The knicks
[37:53] Speaker 2: could really use.
[37:53] Speaker 1: Him SO i, think you, KNOW i think FOR, kd
[37:56] Speaker 1: it IS i think you're it's. Perfect that would be.
[38:00] Speaker 2: Fun it would be fun for, him AND i think
[38:02] Speaker 2: it would be fun for.
[38:03] Speaker 3: Us it falls in line with the same ideology that
[38:06] Speaker 3: led him To Golden. State you, Know, like to your,
[38:09] Speaker 3: POINT kd could win a title In, houston but it
[38:14] Speaker 3: would be a chore and offense would come very. Difficult
[38:18] Speaker 3: he'd be facing crazy Looks, now the flip side of
[38:21] Speaker 3: that is he wouldn't have to be the same statistical
[38:25] Speaker 3: monster In houston that he would be in other situations
[38:28] Speaker 3: Because houston's defense is so good that he would just
[38:30] Speaker 3: need to basically lift them over the top on the
[38:33] Speaker 3: offensive end of the. Floor but there is something to
[38:35] Speaker 3: be said about basketball is more fun when the ball's
[38:38] Speaker 3: moving around and you're playing with more offensive skill and
[38:40] Speaker 3: when you LIKE. Kd if there's one weakness at this
[38:43] Speaker 3: point in his, career he doesn't pressure the rim a
[38:45] Speaker 3: ton well Dearon fox sure as hell does so like
[38:48] Speaker 3: he's going to get to play off of those advantages
[38:50] Speaker 3: and play off the ball like there is A kd
[38:54] Speaker 3: has told us to our faces exactly who he is for.
[38:57] Speaker 3: Years he loves basketball and he wants to play a
[39:00] Speaker 3: fun brand of. Basketball that's. Right and so even if
[39:03] Speaker 3: we look on it added on paper and, go Oh, houston, big,
[39:06] Speaker 3: strong physical, team they could anchor him with. Defense Emy
[39:10] Speaker 3: udoka is not the best offensive coach in the. World
[39:12] Speaker 3: that team doesn't have a lot offensive. Talent it would
[39:15] Speaker 3: be a lot Like Oklahoma city in twenty. Sixteen And
[39:17] Speaker 3: i'm thinking he looks at that and, Goes i'd rather play,
[39:20] Speaker 3: fun free flowing basketball with some more talented offensive. Players
[39:23] Speaker 3: and so with that being the. CASE i, Mean San
[39:25] Speaker 3: antonio is going to be a really interesting. Team if
[39:27] Speaker 3: they pulled something like this off all of a, sudden
[39:29] Speaker 3: a guy Like Jeremy sohan becomes super important because he'd
[39:32] Speaker 3: have to be such a defensive anchor for them in
[39:35] Speaker 3: terms of size and. Strength Stefan cassel obviously defensively as a,
[39:39] Speaker 3: guard would have to do a lot of that. Work,
[39:40] Speaker 3: Again i'm not sure THAT i would view That spurs
[39:43] Speaker 3: team as exceptionally, Dangerous but what a fun way For
[39:48] Speaker 3: wemby to start his career and what a fun way
[39:51] Speaker 3: For katie to end his.
[39:52] Speaker 2: Career, WELL i.
[39:52] Speaker 1: Think Also katie looks At lebron and Thinks lebron's always
[39:55] Speaker 1: figured it out Is lebron doesn't want to do a
[39:58] Speaker 1: lot of the dirty. Work like if he went To,
[40:00] Speaker 1: Houston katie'd have to do some of the dirty. Work
[40:03] Speaker 1: he'd be, like he'd be Like steph And Golden, state
[40:05] Speaker 1: where it's, like, Oh steph plays, poorly that's the narrative
[40:10] Speaker 1: when they. Lose it's Not Jimmy butler And steph In.
[40:12] Speaker 1: Houston very quickly he would be because Because Jalen green's
[40:16] Speaker 1: a hot and cold, shooter and very quickly If houston,
[40:19] Speaker 1: loses it's, like, Well, katie you, know an off shooting, night.
[40:23] Speaker 3: We traded for. Him he was supposed to save us from.
[40:25] Speaker 1: This that's, right and it's just not the case In San.
[40:28] Speaker 1: Antonio he'll be Part AND i do think as players get,
[40:31] Speaker 1: older they're.
[40:32] Speaker 2: Looking for, fit and you know it's And i'm okay with.
[40:37] Speaker 1: THAT i think As i've, Aged i've always liked. Fit
[40:40] Speaker 1: it's just fun to be part of a, group a
[40:43] Speaker 1: mix of young and. Old but you don't want to
[40:46] Speaker 1: be a, mentor LIKE i.
[40:47] Speaker 2: Just don't Think.
[40:48] Speaker 1: Katie at this, POINT i think fun is a really
[40:50] Speaker 1: interesting word Because kyrie is fun to play. With that's
[40:55] Speaker 1: why he went there And Golden state no longer because of.
[40:58] Speaker 1: Relationships wasn't he wasn't having a good. Time he was,
[41:02] Speaker 1: Winning and so, Yeah i'm okay with.
[41:06] Speaker 2: It he's had an all time.
[41:09] Speaker 1: Career he's a different. Cat but you, Know i've come
[41:11] Speaker 1: to terms with not everybody's the. Same when you want
[41:14] Speaker 1: to enjoy life simpler, pleasures reach For Green river. Whiskey
[41:18] Speaker 1: whether it's dry whiskey or single barrel, bourbon you're getting
[41:22] Speaker 1: over a century of craftsmanship packed into every. Bottle hop
[41:26] Speaker 1: on over To Green River whiskey dot com and discover
[41:29] Speaker 1: a legend in a bottle. TODAY i really do, think,
[41:33] Speaker 1: though what you're seeing right now in THE, NBA i
[41:38] Speaker 1: really like AND i know we don't have a super,
[41:41] Speaker 1: team but it's becoming like THE. Nfl it's a VERY
[41:44] Speaker 1: gm driven. League like the smart gms are going to.
[41:47] Speaker 1: WIN a lot of them are in The west and
[41:50] Speaker 1: they have been for thirty. Years that's why The west
[41:53] Speaker 1: is overwhelmingly top to, bottom always deeper than The.
[41:56] Speaker 2: East you just have more good owners and more good.
[41:58] Speaker 1: Gms and the other thing, IS i think what we've
[42:02] Speaker 1: really seen this there's a lot of maturity in the
[42:05] Speaker 1: league right. Now Like indiana And Oklahoma. CITY i, mean
[42:09] Speaker 1: these are grinding. OUTFITS i MEAN i Think indiana plays
[42:12] Speaker 1: pretty good. DEFENSE i mean, again juxtaposition With oka se
[42:18] Speaker 1: jecktposed to, that, well it doesn't look the. Same but
[42:20] Speaker 1: there was there was a in the second quarter in this.
[42:22] Speaker 1: GAME i was, Like, God india has given them. Problems
[42:25] Speaker 1: SO i JUST i think the league right now it
[42:28] Speaker 1: went through a cycle where it felt kind of you
[42:31] Speaker 1: had old stars and two young guys.
[42:34] Speaker 2: Like you, know and you had these jaws and These.
[42:36] Speaker 2: Zions it's like they're just not.
[42:38] Speaker 1: READY i just feel like we've got this group Of
[42:41] Speaker 1: halliburton AND sga And Jalen williams and and it's just
[42:46] Speaker 1: like really Good, tatum really good young, players totally dedicated
[42:51] Speaker 1: to the, league and fewer and fewer old guys are.
[42:56] Speaker 1: Relevant AND i think IT'S i Don't it may not get,
[42:58] Speaker 1: ratings BUT I I'M i really like okay see In,
[43:03] Speaker 1: Indiana LIKE i really respect top to bottom both.
[43:07] Speaker 3: Organizations the point about maturity is is a good one
[43:10] Speaker 3: because these two teams are relatively, young and young teams
[43:14] Speaker 3: young YOUNG nba teams famously don't play defense because young
[43:17] Speaker 3: guys in, general it takes time for them to learn
[43:20] Speaker 3: how to prioritize how they spend their. Energy but, YEAH
[43:23] Speaker 3: i you, Know I'm I'm i'm generally pretty happy with
[43:25] Speaker 3: the trajectory of THE. Nba every era in THE nba
[43:29] Speaker 3: has some stars that are a little bit more, boring you, know,
[43:32] Speaker 3: like for, instance to Meet Shake shae's like the guard
[43:35] Speaker 3: version Of Tim. Duncan he's not the most exciting player
[43:37] Speaker 3: in the world for me to, watch but he's incredibly
[43:39] Speaker 3: dominant at his. Position but we do have musty, Television
[43:43] Speaker 3: LIKE i Think wemby is mussy. TELEVISION i Think Anthony
[43:46] Speaker 3: edwards is musty. Television there are certain guys in this
[43:49] Speaker 3: league that bring the, pop and so we just need
[43:52] Speaker 3: to take some time over the next couple of years
[43:54] Speaker 3: for the public to kind of ingratiate themselves with these.
[43:57] Speaker 3: Guys And i'm still a big believer in THE. Nba
[43:58] Speaker 3: there's stuff they need to clean, up there's certain things
[44:00] Speaker 3: that can get. Better it's not. PERFECT i wish they'd
[44:02] Speaker 3: shortened the season a little, bit but like this has
[44:05] Speaker 3: been a fun playoff, Front. Colin i've really really enjoyed,
[44:08] Speaker 3: it and The pacers have like reinvigorated my love of
[44:11] Speaker 3: basketball in a real way just because of the just
[44:13] Speaker 3: a super super fun brand of basketball that they've. Play
[44:17] Speaker 3: i've really really enjoyed. It But, colin we really appreciate
[44:20] Speaker 3: you giving us your time. Tonight, man you bet for
[44:23] Speaker 3: all of you guys that are hanging out on the YouTube,
[44:25] Speaker 3: tream we are headed over to play back when we're,
[44:26] Speaker 3: Done so playback dot tv Slash hoops. Tonight we'll take
[44:28] Speaker 3: some callers and watch some. Film. Colin it was good
[44:30] Speaker 3: to see, you, buddy and we'll see you next, time all,
[44:32] Speaker 3: Right jason
[44:35] Speaker 1: The volume

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