# Beardo Gets Scared Interview | Debunking Paranormal Evidence & Real Ghost Experiences

An episode of [Pursuit of the Paranormal](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1541466512), 26 Apr 2026, 1 h 41 min.

Audio: https://content.rss.com/episodes/397292/3048371/pursuit-of-the-paranormal/2026_08_05_08_41_37_2014e9be-5340-4538-95b3-742a70e97575.mp3

In this episode of Pursuit of the Paranormal, we sit down with Beardo Gets Scared — one of the UK’s most well-known paranormal debunkers… and a believer. From childhood ghost encounters to exposing fake paranormal videos, Beardo shares the truth behind the investigation world — and why debunking is essential to uncovering what might actually be real. ⚡ We dive into: - The ghost experience that started it all - The infamous Ouija board incident that changed everything - Why most paranormal content online is fake - The problem with ghost hunting equipment (K2 meters, spirit boxes & more) - Real experiences Beardo still can’t explain - The fine line between debunking and believing Is the paranormal real… or are we being fooled? 🎧 Listen now and decide for yourself. --- 👻 Follow Beardo Gets Scared: YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@BeardoGetsScared --- 🎙️ Follow Pursuit of the Paranormal: 🔗 Podcast: www.linktree.com/pursuitoftheparanormal --- #paranormal #ghosthunting #beardogetsscared #debunking #haunted #ufo #paranormalpodcast #ghosts #supernatural #investigation Got a strange story to tell us? Drop us a voicemail and it may appear on an up coming episode

## Transcript

[0:00] Whilst I am a debunker, I am a paranormal investigator
[0:04] at heart. I only want to remove the false from
[0:08] a claim. I want the truth, and if I've got to
[0:10] tear people apart to get to it, I'll do it. But
[0:13] I believe in the paranormal, I want the paranormal
[0:15] to be real, and I want to prove it for me. So,
[0:19] yeah, it's not about, that's fake, everything's
[0:23] fake, that's not what I do. Disproving the normal,
[0:27] you can reveal the abnormal. So you look at everything,
[0:32] absolutely everything. You've got to take into
[0:34] account every variable, every variation. And
[0:38] I don't believe you can do it in one visit, which
[0:40] is why I'll never say somewhere is or isn't haunted.
[0:42] I believe there's a few places I've been to where
[0:45] there is something going on. I just don't know
[0:47] what that something is. You're listening to Pursuit
[1:01] of the Paranormal Podcast with your hosts, Ash
[1:04] Ellis and Greg Tomlinson. Good evening, Greg.
[1:09] How are you doing? How's it going? Yeah, I'm
[1:12] good, thanks. How are you doing? I'm very well,
[1:14] I'm very well. So, like the last one, we're doing
[1:19] the intro after the episode, which I think works
[1:23] a bit better, so we can tell people what to expect.
[1:26] And we actually had a debunker on. So this episode
[1:34] is us chatting with Beardo. Beardo gets scared,
[1:37] so a lot of people, particularly in the UK, will
[1:40] have watched his stuff on YouTube. Yeah. He's
[1:43] got something like 60 ,000 subscribers on YouTube
[1:46] and he does it full time. That's his job. And
[1:52] we had a really interesting conversation about
[1:55] the paranormal and his own experiences growing
[1:59] up and how he got to where he is today. Yeah,
[2:03] it's good going back into his life and the man
[2:07] behind Beardo, I guess. Yeah. It was a good chat.
[2:10] It was a good chat. So, yeah, I thoroughly enjoyed
[2:14] it. I really hope everybody else does. Let's
[2:17] just get straight into it, I suppose. Yeah, enjoy.
[2:22] So, Beardo, welcome along. Thanks for joining
[2:24] us today. How are you doing? I'm doing well,
[2:27] thank you. It's nice to be here. Nice to be invited
[2:29] on. Yeah, it's cool. I'm glad we've got to talk
[2:33] to you because we go out as paranormal investigators.
[2:37] We do UFO... as well, particularly Ash. Ash has
[2:45] got the largest UK UFO current day sighting database.
[2:51] All right. Is that right, Ash? That's the one.
[2:53] That's the one. And so we flick between UFOs
[2:59] and the paranormal in what we do and cryptids
[3:02] and everything weird. But we've never had somebody
[3:06] on who's a debunker. Reached out. Thank you for
[3:11] coming on. Yeah, no worries. But before we get
[3:13] into the debunking side, it's a good opportunity
[3:17] because I've watched your stuff for years. I
[3:20] know my partner is one of the twins and we sit
[3:26] and watch your stuff all the time. We even watch
[3:29] the paranormal investigations you do, like at
[3:32] Priest Cottage when you went there. So it's a
[3:35] good opportunity for us to sort of go back a
[3:37] bit. and understand where the name Beardo come
[3:41] from. I imagine it's quite obvious. Because I'm
[3:44] lazy. And really, what got you to where you are
[3:51] today, doing YouTube and having tens of thousands
[3:54] of subscribers? So how did you get here, basically?
[3:59] I suppose if I have to start right at the very
[4:02] beginning, it's because I believe that I saw
[4:05] a ghost when I was a child. Okay. My parents
[4:09] both, I'm an 80s kid and, you know, 80s kids,
[4:12] both your parents worked and your grandparents
[4:14] kind of took over the parental role Monday to
[4:17] Friday because my mum worked nights, my dad worked
[4:19] days and dad was a carpenter. My mum did whatever
[4:22] she could. Weekends now and again, I'd be in
[4:26] my grandparents as well. And my grandparents
[4:28] lived near the school and they drove. I had my
[4:31] own bedroom there. because my uncle was in the
[4:33] forces, so I had his room when he was sort of
[4:35] posted out wherever he was. I was in bed. I can
[4:40] remember it. I can remember I was watching Return
[4:43] of the Jedi, because back when I was a kid, it
[4:44] was my favourite Star Wars film. As an adult,
[4:46] it's always Empire. And I wasn't sleeping. I
[4:50] wasn't getting ready for sleep or anything. I
[4:52] remember just having jam and toast, and I looked
[4:55] to my right, and there's just a guy stood there.
[4:57] And I was very young. four to six years of age.
[5:03] And it's a very distinct early memory. And I
[5:06] remember screaming, crying, and then my grandfather
[5:10] coming in. And my grandfather, he swore a lot.
[5:14] He's an ex -sailor, or ex -navy. My grandfather
[5:18] comes in, sort of in his pants, all tattooed
[5:20] up. Len, Len, bloody hell, he's lost the plot,
[5:23] do you have? I'm like, well, there's a man, there's
[5:25] a man. And it wasn't like he turned the light
[5:27] on and he disappeared. It was like, one minute
[5:30] he's there, and I looked. directly into him and
[5:32] he was looking at me and then he was gone it
[5:35] was sort of as i've let out this scream he's
[5:38] gone um when my grandmother asked who i saw and
[5:44] i remember saying he was wearing a nice suit
[5:46] and that's a green nice suit and that's the only
[5:49] way i could describe him so for years after My
[5:53] grandparents were like, I know you had a dream.
[5:55] And I'm like, no, no, I was watching The Empire
[5:56] Strikes Back. I was wide awake. But for years
[5:58] and years and years, your family chip away. Because
[6:00] I was scared of everything when I was a kid.
[6:02] My uncle let me watch Nightmare on Elm Street
[6:03] when I was a kid, and it traumatised me. Dreams
[6:06] of O 'Freddy and all sorts. But years later,
[6:11] my grandparents had a wedding anniversary, and
[6:15] all the family got together, and then the Cole
[6:17] family went back to my grandparents' house, who
[6:19] were a very close -knit family. three aunties,
[6:23] my mum and my uncle, all of the kids, we were
[6:26] all in the house. And then my uncle starts telling
[6:29] a story about when he saw a man in his bedroom.
[6:34] And then he describes the exact same experience
[6:36] that I had. Now, had I listened to his story
[6:40] at some point in my childhood and then remembered
[6:44] it as my own, but other people remember me telling
[6:47] them that I had seen this guy stood in the bedroom.
[6:51] And then my grandmother says, right, I'll come
[6:52] back. She comes in, she's got this big dusty
[6:55] old photo album, opens it up, and she said, is
[6:57] that him? And the hairs on the back of my neck
[6:59] stood up. And I was like, yeah. She was like,
[7:02] that's your Greek great -grandfather. Now, at
[7:04] this point, my Greek grandmother was still alive.
[7:07] But my Greek grandfather, he had either died
[7:10] just before my nan was born or just after she
[7:13] was born. And it was lung conditions due to something
[7:17] with the Second World War. And that's what I
[7:20] saw. And my uncle was like... That's exactly
[7:23] who I saw. The reason my grandmother never showed
[7:26] us was, A, I was a very young, sensitive child.
[7:29] B, it was the only photograph that she had of
[7:32] her dad. So she never brought it up for anyone
[7:35] for love nor money in case, you know, younger
[7:37] kids spilling drinks or somebody grabbed it or,
[7:39] you know, babies in the family and stuff. And
[7:42] that's where it started for me. And then it was.
[7:47] You'd see TV shows about the paranormal and the
[7:51] thing with Jonathan Freaks. I loved Star Trek
[7:53] Next Generation. So anything with Commander Riker
[7:56] in it, I'd watch it. And he did the strange but
[7:58] true and sort of involved into even things like
[8:01] UFOs. And I couldn't, you know, unexplained mysteries.
[8:06] I'd watch them. And it would be like this, you
[8:08] know, DB Cooper. And I'd be like, oh, that's
[8:09] boring to me. As soon as there was a UFO or a
[8:13] cryptid or a ghost, I'm in. And I fully believed
[8:16] in all of it when I was a kid, up until my teens.
[8:20] Okay. And what happened in your teens to make
[8:25] you, because you said you were fully into it
[8:27] until your teens. Yeah, I did. I did a Ouija
[8:31] board. There was a group of us. We did a Ouija
[8:33] board and we all had a very bad experience with
[8:36] it. The quick side of it is we were all between
[8:39] 15 and 17. My parents had gone away, had a house
[8:43] party after being told not to. We were all drinking,
[8:46] a few of us were smoking weed and stuff, doing
[8:48] a Ouija board. It starts going like crazy and
[8:51] we're all blaming each other for pushing it.
[8:53] And then the glass, it was that amateur. It was
[8:57] a Nutella glass rinsed out that my dad used as
[9:00] a whiskey tumbler on the back of a Monopoly board.
[9:03] We just drew on it with a marker pen and it sounded
[9:06] like somebody had flicked the glass, but it kicked
[9:08] up the right way, shot across the room and just
[9:10] showered one of the boys in glass. And it was
[9:14] sort of him that seemed to be targeted by what
[9:16] was being said. And he was like, you boys wouldn't
[9:18] have known about my dad. None of us knew that
[9:20] he had a dad. It's one of those things you didn't
[9:22] ask. Scared the crap out of us. And then for
[9:26] a couple, about a year, two years, I thought
[9:28] it negatively impacted me. And I may have had
[9:31] like this. dark entity attached to me because
[9:34] I'd run a bad luck but it wasn't it was just
[9:36] me being a dickhead teenager doing stupid things
[9:39] you know and then I got a bit older and I wouldn't
[9:45] touch reach boards didn't want anything to do
[9:47] with them and then every time I was seeing people
[9:49] doing them I'm like you're pushing it you're
[9:52] pushing it and I was trying to do them on my
[9:55] own and nothing ever happened and I'm like ah
[9:59] And I was still nervous of them, but I'm like,
[10:01] if I'm scared, surely something should be happening.
[10:04] And then I kept going out, you know, oh, this
[10:07] is a haunted house. It wasn't, it was just an
[10:09] abandoned house in villages and whatever. We'd
[10:12] go in them pretending to, not pretending, trying
[10:15] to catch ghosts, you know, but as sort of 16,
[10:19] 17, 18 year olds. And then I got a bit old for
[10:21] that and it just seemed to just fizzle out. And
[10:25] then Most Haunted landed and I was, hook, line,
[10:30] sinker. There were elements of it, like Derek's
[10:33] stuff. I've never, despite how much I believed,
[10:37] I never, ever believed in psychic mediums. I
[10:40] always just, it always just seemed like a con
[10:43] to me. But then I remember watching James Randi
[10:46] busting Uri Geller and things like that. So that
[10:49] was always in the back of my mind. And the first
[10:52] couple of years, Kieran O 'Keefe of Most Haunted,
[10:54] to me, was the villain. He's like, he's just
[10:57] this boring guy. They're saying that none of
[10:59] it's real. And then I started to go out again.
[11:02] I used to go down to Neath Abbey, me and the
[11:04] boys. It was like a most haunted watch party,
[11:07] not just for the lives, for an episode. All piling
[11:10] into two cars down to Neath Abbey, calling out,
[11:12] where's the knocks? Where's the bangs? Why is
[11:14] nothing getting thrown? Why is it so quiet? Right,
[11:17] let's try this place that's supposed to be haunted,
[11:19] like Margam. And then we're like, nothing's happening.
[11:23] Nothing at all is happening. It's not real. And
[11:27] then Kieran sort of... instead of being the villain
[11:30] of the piece, then became sort of the guy that
[11:32] I modelled myself after, just a bit more sweary
[11:35] and ranty. So kind of going back to that original
[11:40] kind of Ouija board experience, how do you look
[11:43] back on that sort of being older and wiser and
[11:45] obviously what you're doing now? So say, for
[11:47] example, someone's showing you that video of
[11:48] that happening. Yeah. How would you kind of,
[11:51] what's your kind of thoughts on that looking
[11:53] back now? I wish... I wish there was video evidence
[11:57] of it because it sounds so fantastical that I
[12:00] don't trust my own memory of it. And then when
[12:03] I told that story on my channel, one of the guys
[12:06] that was there was watching and I didn't realise.
[12:08] And then he messaged me and he was like, why
[12:10] are you lying about the date? So what do you
[12:14] mean? He said, you said it was on Halloween and
[12:16] it wasn't. It was on Valentine's Day. It's like,
[12:20] what are you on about? And then he said, oh,
[12:21] that was the other one. He said, we weren't watching
[12:23] Friday the 13th. We were watching. Oh, it's gone.
[12:29] I thought we were watching Friday the 13th. And
[12:31] he said we were watching the original Pet Sematary
[12:33] before it happened. I was like, I don't know.
[12:36] And then we got a hold of three or four. There
[12:38] were eight of us around the table and we've spoken
[12:40] to three or four of us. We all remember different
[12:42] people being there. We all remember different
[12:44] movies. There's bits that we all. sort of can
[12:47] put together and like well that definitely happened
[12:49] because we all remember that but false memory
[12:52] is such a bizarre thing and what it can do because
[12:56] i assumed that i'd remembered it beat by beat
[12:59] exactly what happened and i don't and even as
[13:03] skeptical as i am these days i mean i'm still
[13:05] a skeptical believer i don't know what caused
[13:10] that to me that can't happen and that's the one
[13:12] thing we did all agree on that glass sounded
[13:14] like somebody flicked it It took off and then
[13:16] it burst midday. We all agreed on that. Looking
[13:21] back, when people are saying like the poltergeist
[13:23] activity around teenagers and stuff, could it
[13:25] actually be something to do with teenagers and
[13:27] hormones? Well, there's a lot of anger in that
[13:30] room. And one of the guys was really upset because
[13:33] the Ouija board was talking about his passed
[13:35] away father that we, as far as I knew, none of
[13:39] us knew anything about. I certainly didn't. So
[13:41] I'm wondering if like... It sounds almost as
[13:47] ridiculous that we telekinetically made a glass
[13:49] explode as a demon jumped on the board with us,
[13:53] you know? So I'd love to see something. I wish
[13:57] there was sort of, I mean, back then video cameras,
[13:59] very expensive, very cumbersome and not, you
[14:03] know, on tape. So I don't know. There's part
[14:06] of me thinks that what we experienced something
[14:08] creepy. But for the most part, it was just drunk,
[14:12] stoned teenagers being idiots. It's funny you
[14:16] should talk about the telekinesis. I've done
[14:18] a couple of talks where I talk about poltergeist
[14:23] activity being a result of the manifestation
[14:26] of a troubled mind. So I do believe that there
[14:32] is something to that. I mean, a lot of the cases
[14:37] revolve around that. Would you do a Ouija board
[14:42] now? I've done them. I've done them at the Ancient
[14:44] Ram Inn. I've done them at the East Drive. A
[14:49] couple of abandoned plates. I don't always include
[14:52] them in my video because it doesn't move. And
[14:55] it's also led me to questioning the ideomotor
[14:59] effect because I'm like, well, where's the ideomotor
[15:01] effect when me and people I trust are doing it?
[15:03] Surely if the ideomotor effect is pushing this
[15:06] 100 % of the time. we should be getting movement,
[15:08] whether we believe it or not. And we're not.
[15:12] So even as sceptics, because the ideomotor effect
[15:14] is described as, you know, minute movements,
[15:16] but your brain is telling you what the next letter
[15:18] is. Well, where's our minute movement? Because
[15:21] if you tell somebody not to do something, like
[15:24] if I say to you, don't think of a red polar bear,
[15:28] well, you're either going to think of it or try
[15:31] not to think about it, but think about it because
[15:33] you're not thinking about it. I don't know. I
[15:38] don't know. It's really weird and bizarre. And
[15:41] for a long time, I was really nervous of them.
[15:43] I wouldn't be around them. I wouldn't have Ouija
[15:46] board. It's like people have Ouija board backpacks
[15:49] and T -shirts. I wouldn't have those near me.
[15:51] I was terrified of them. But now I've got three
[15:54] in this room. I mean, my wife wouldn't let me
[15:56] have one in the house. But now there's three
[15:58] in here. She's not happy about it, but... So
[16:04] I was going to say, so... Getting on from there
[16:07] to kind of your channel and the kind of debunking
[16:09] side of things. Yeah. What sort of made you go
[16:13] down that sort of lane? So obviously on your
[16:16] videos, you are quite outspoken. You don't put
[16:18] any punches. It's probably led to sort of kind
[16:21] of your kind of how well known you are. That's
[16:24] what sort of made you go down the channel of
[16:26] as well doing the Panamigas games, but also kind
[16:28] of just calling out these teams that are doing
[16:31] these, well, a lot of fake or possibly fake videos.
[16:37] The reason I get as aggravated as I do is because
[16:41] of what Most Haunted did to the paranormal and
[16:44] what the fakers do to the paranormal. Because
[16:47] every time I say that I saw a ghost when I was
[16:49] a child, the first thing people do is, well,
[16:52] like this, and they'll show you Most Haunted
[16:54] or Lainey and Ben or Really Haunted or... whoever
[16:58] that because that's what's popular and it's so
[17:00] over the top dramatic and stupid that it makes
[17:04] my experiences look stupid to other people and
[17:07] that wasn't a stupid experience to me it was
[17:10] real and it scared the shit out of me and it
[17:12] impacted my life to a point where I've spent
[17:15] since 2003 lurking around abbeys derelict buildings
[17:19] and you know in search of more proof, you know,
[17:24] because I don't trust my young mind. I trust
[17:26] my mind more now. But every time they fake something
[17:31] or every time, you know, Carl getting pulled
[17:33] up the stairs in 30 East Drive, that and obviously
[17:36] the lady flicking coins off the banister and
[17:39] stuff, that has made 90 % of people say that
[17:43] there is nothing at 30 East Drive. It made me
[17:45] say there was nothing at 30 East Drive. I've
[17:48] been there seven times, but nine nights in total.
[17:51] And I've had two experiences there that I've
[17:53] never had anywhere else. I'm like, there may
[17:55] be something to 30 East Drive. And it's not the
[17:59] knocks on the walls and it's not a violent poltergeist,
[18:01] but there's something just strange on occasion
[18:05] in that house. People I trust have had strange
[18:07] occurrences in that house where people phone
[18:09] me from the house, like, can you debunk this?
[18:11] I'm like, well, no, I don't know what it is.
[18:14] But every time somebody puts a fake video out
[18:16] from 30 East Drive, that's what people remember.
[18:18] People are not remembering people's experiences
[18:20] because they're more mundane than the guys launching
[18:23] stuff about or putting knives in sofas. And it's
[18:28] ruined, to me, most haunted, ruined the TV paranormal
[18:33] for me. I loved taps when I was younger. Obviously,
[18:36] I've become really good friends with Jason Hall.
[18:39] Some people are like, oh, but they used K2 meters.
[18:43] And I'm like, back then, yeah, we didn't know
[18:45] any different. Nobody did. My channel, when I
[18:48] first started, I was using K2 meters until I
[18:51] learned different. It's all about the learning
[18:53] process. Weed out what's not real and then latch
[18:57] on to something new. My biggest gripe with the
[19:01] paranormal right now is there's no new ideas.
[19:03] There's no new experiments. It's the same thing.
[19:06] And the definition of madness is to keep doing
[19:09] the same thing over and over and expect different
[19:12] results. I'm a little different because I go
[19:16] into haunted locations and I investigate them
[19:18] the same as YouTubers do because that's how they
[19:20] get their experiences. So I win either way. If
[19:24] I get an experience, fantastic. I've had an experience
[19:27] and it sort of bolsters this thing to me that
[19:29] the paranormal is real. And if I can debunk everything
[19:32] or catch fakery or prove fakery, well, I win
[19:34] anyway because I'm a debunker as well as an investigator.
[19:38] But every investigator should be a debunker.
[19:42] Take the falseness out of a clean and then look
[19:45] at what's left over. We went to 30th Drive and
[19:49] we had some mad stuff happen there. I've been
[19:53] a couple of times now. That was Ash's first time.
[19:56] It is a strange place. It is a strange place.
[19:59] And I don't know whether that's because of the
[20:03] hype around it. I say hype because... It's had
[20:07] the movie made and all that kind of stuff. So
[20:10] people have this impression of what it's like,
[20:12] and it is a weird vibe in there, regardless of
[20:14] what you like. Yeah, the reputation is kind of,
[20:20] it's on a knife edge because some people go there
[20:23] and they're like, oh, it's a con because nothing
[20:26] happened. And I'm like, well, doesn't that lead
[20:29] to more credibility? Because if it happened every
[20:32] day. then the paranormal wouldn't be the paranormal.
[20:34] It'd be the very normal because you can pay and
[20:36] experience it. Same as buildings with CCTV cameras
[20:41] and stuff. And they capture the odd thing here
[20:43] and there. And it's like, well, what about the
[20:47] rest of the time? Well, it's not that normal.
[20:49] Otherwise we'd know about it. We'd understand
[20:51] it and we could quantify it. Scientists. We put
[20:54] more time, effort, money and resources into it
[20:57] and they don't. Well, I was quite surprised how
[21:00] many universities are actually still putting
[21:02] a lot of money into the paranormal and work into
[21:04] the paranormal. Yeah, we've had somebody on and
[21:09] she was struggling to be taken seriously in the
[21:13] paranormal because she was a woman. And she decided
[21:16] she would go to university. She studied parapsychology
[21:20] and she got a doctorate and part of her thesis
[21:23] was EVPs. And that, to her, gave her the credibility.
[21:28] But I do think you can actually study parapsychology
[21:32] as part of a psychology degree, which is super
[21:37] cool. My daughter's actually in her third year
[21:39] of psychology. Really? Why didn't you do parapsychology?
[21:44] I've got a younger daughter. She's just about
[21:46] to go to university in September to do psychology
[21:49] as well. And I'm like, please get into the paranormal.
[21:52] Please. I mean, Ira, do you think with Uncanny,
[21:58] obviously Uncanny's insanely popular. It's like
[22:01] the most recent thing with any sort of buzz around
[22:04] it in the paranormal. With it being more accepted
[22:08] by mainstream audiences and being less insulting
[22:11] to everyone's intelligence, because obviously
[22:12] you've got Team Skeptic, Team Believer, Danny
[22:15] is like us in the situation, just hearing the
[22:18] story and asking these two experts. Do you wonder
[22:22] if it could... make or influence more people
[22:26] doing parapsychology because they're like i could
[22:29] make a tv show or an amazon prime or a netflix
[22:33] documentary or something because it seems to
[22:37] be gaining traction and it's the less ridiculous
[22:39] stuff that's gaining traction yeah i think it
[22:42] could do absolutely i think people see when it
[22:46] starts to be taken a bit more seriously which
[22:49] i think over the years, it's becoming normal
[22:53] to talk about the paranormal. Yeah. You can go,
[22:57] I'll say to people at work, what we do, we do
[23:01] the podcast and we go out and they go, I could
[23:04] never do that. I said, okay, do you believe in
[23:07] it? They go, no, not really. They go, but I did
[23:10] have this experience when I was younger. my mum
[23:14] or my auntie or my uncle, they've had this weird
[23:16] experience. And so like, oh, okay. And I've got
[23:18] a guy at work and he's like, I don't believe
[23:20] in it. I want solid proof from you, Greg, because
[23:22] we go out all the time, me and Ash and the girls.
[23:26] And we're just like, I show him stuff. He goes,
[23:30] no, not good enough. We've had some really good
[23:32] evidence. Look, we believe good evidence. Yeah.
[23:36] Or stuff happening. We've had weird stuff happening
[23:39] all the time. all at different locations, different
[23:43] nights. Sometimes we've not had stuff, which,
[23:47] like you said, that's good that stuff doesn't
[23:51] happen. Yeah. But he's like, no, don't believe
[23:54] it. But he's actually had an experience himself
[23:57] that he can't explain. I'm like, well, you don't
[24:01] believe in it, but you've just told me you've
[24:03] had this weird experience that you can't explain.
[24:06] I said, I don't know how I can ever get... Get
[24:10] you to believe if you don't even believe the
[24:12] experience. Some people will never believe and
[24:15] they'll put it down to their own mind playing
[24:17] tricks on them, biology or mould or whatever.
[24:21] And they're probably more right than we will
[24:23] ever be. I just happen to believe that there
[24:27] is something else to it all. I don't like the
[24:31] idea that we're here for however long our lifespan
[24:34] is and then that's just it. It's not even like
[24:37] there's darkness after. There is nothing. you
[24:40] cease to exist what a horrible thought and it's
[24:44] like oh you're living in the cuckoo cloud cuckoo
[24:47] land and yeah i'd rather live with my head a
[24:49] little bit in cuckoo land and think there may
[24:51] be something after yeah what do you what do you
[24:56] think happens then what are your thoughts i don't
[24:59] know i genuinely don't know um i don't know if
[25:03] we level up or we go into a different dimension
[25:05] or We just cease. I don't like to think that.
[25:10] My head says we just cease to exist, but my heart
[25:13] says there's got to be more experiences I've
[25:16] had, and it's a more comfortable feeling to me.
[25:22] But when we get further into quantum physics
[25:25] and dimensions and things, I think that's where
[25:29] science may say, actually, all of these experiences,
[25:33] not all of them, but a lot of these experiences
[25:35] that people... thought they had that were written
[25:38] off could have an element of realness to them
[25:42] because of some displacement of a dimension or
[25:45] some tear in the fabric of something that we
[25:48] don't yet know a name for it because it hasn't
[25:50] been discovered. Science is always discovering
[25:52] new things and maybe one day, hopefully in our
[25:54] lifetime, scientists will discover something
[25:57] where it proves my experiences as me not being
[26:02] a crazy kid and even crazier adult, I guess.
[26:08] Have you had any experiences as an adult that's
[26:11] come close to the one you had when you were a
[26:14] child? Not seeing a full -bodied apparition,
[26:18] no. That's the holy grail for me, is to see a
[26:21] full -bodied apparition as an adult. I don't
[26:23] care if I capture it on camera and I don't care
[26:25] if anyone believes me, as long as I know for
[26:27] me that it's happened twice, you know. But I
[26:33] thought I saw something at 30 East Drive. But
[26:36] it wasn't quite corner of the eye. I was almost
[26:39] looking direct. It sort of crossed into my direct
[26:41] vision. And I didn't assume paranormal. I thought
[26:44] Carol was in the house, the cleaner from next
[26:46] door. But she wasn't. That was a bit weird. And
[26:49] I stupidly completely dismissed it due to high
[26:53] EMF under the kitchen strip light. Because I'd
[26:56] always been told that high EMF can cause hallucinations.
[26:59] And it can't. There's no proof of that. The same
[27:02] night, Dean saw something cross at the top of
[27:05] the stairs, but his was more of a light anomaly
[27:07] that he saw with his eyes than, you know, like
[27:11] an orb, because orbs, no. I don't believe in
[27:15] orbs. But I was at a care home with a channel
[27:18] called Exploring the Entity. We had permission
[27:20] to go there. Basically, a door was left open
[27:23] for us by somebody who was looking after the
[27:24] place. And we're doing the investigation. They
[27:27] had stuff there all the time, every time they
[27:30] went. pretty much they were capturing stuff and
[27:33] I'm like, there's something up with that. Either
[27:35] it's really active or my friends have been lying
[27:38] to me and I don't want to think that I'm a friend.
[27:40] So I went with them and I walked in and they
[27:43] were like, isn't it creepy? I was like, no, it
[27:45] looks really nice. This could be, you know, it's
[27:48] being salvaged. It's being rescued. It'd be a
[27:51] fantastic wedding venue with that nice sprawling
[27:53] stake. So we're walking around and I'm like,
[27:56] I'm not. creeped out by it. There's still power
[27:59] there to a degree. You know, not everywhere,
[28:00] but there's power. There's certain areas we weren't
[28:02] allowed in. We go up the stairs. I'm like, can
[28:06] you knock or can you do something? And there's
[28:08] a door in front of me and I've just checked this
[28:11] room. I've gone in there. It's a little tiny
[28:13] bathroom. The toilet's clogged. No windows open.
[28:16] I've opened it and gone, oh! Closed the door
[28:18] because it reeks in there. And as I'm walking
[28:21] away, I'm called out and it sounded like somebody
[28:23] just banged on the door behind me. And I'm like...
[28:26] Like, did I not shut it? So I spent, in the video,
[28:29] I just walk over there and go, no, it's not moving.
[28:32] But in real time, I was an hour. Like, did I
[28:35] leave it on a latch there that much? And then
[28:37] it popped open instead of closing. I'm like,
[28:39] I can't recreate that. That on its own was nothing.
[28:43] I didn't care about that, but it was still interesting.
[28:46] And then we go downstairs and they were like,
[28:48] why are you so quiet tonight when we've got a
[28:50] friend here? And my brain is going, it's quiet
[28:53] because I'm here. It happens all the time. And
[28:57] then Lucy says, oh, is it time for bed? Are we
[29:00] keeping you up? And I hear this really loud shh
[29:04] right in my ear. And it's the only time I've
[29:08] ever like proper jumped on investigation, looked
[29:11] and been like, and I didn't know what to do.
[29:13] I sort of froze, but turned my head. And Carl
[29:16] says, what did you hear then? I said, I swear
[29:18] I have just heard someone tell me to shush. And
[29:22] he went, I heard it as well. And then Lucy said,
[29:24] I heard words. Nathan says, I heard words. I
[29:27] was like, I just heard a shh, but it was loud.
[29:29] Well, I don't think my camera's going to capture
[29:31] it because there's a door there where my head
[29:33] is, but I've got a camera resting on a banister
[29:35] looking up the stairs. So there's a wall in front
[29:38] of my directional microphone. So I go into this
[29:41] room and I'm like, there's got to be an air freshener,
[29:43] you know, electronic air freshener or the timer.
[29:46] And that's where I couldn't find the air freshener.
[29:49] And I'm like, there's somebody here messing with
[29:50] me then. All the doors are locked. I'm like,
[29:53] that was really weird. When we played the footage
[29:58] back, my camera didn't capture it. Carl's did.
[30:00] Lucy's did. Nathan didn't because he was looking
[30:03] up the stairs. And they had a Zoom H2 microphone
[30:06] on a chair. And what it sounds like it says is
[30:10] go to sleep. And it was that sleep bit that I
[30:13] thought somebody shushed me. It made me like,
[30:17] oh, I really didn't like it. I went upstairs
[30:19] and they're like, can you knock? And then we
[30:21] were getting knocks back. And I've never, ever
[30:24] experienced. that anywhere else. And I was like,
[30:27] that's got to be an echo. So I'm walking around
[30:29] because the building is basically a big square
[30:31] building, but the middle of it is blocked off.
[30:36] And I stood further down the corridor, further
[30:38] down the corridor, and these knocks are still
[30:39] coming. And I'm like, it's an echo from you guys.
[30:41] It's coming from this room. And I go in a room,
[30:44] right, guys, knock now. Nothing. Oh, that's weird.
[30:50] And then nobody knocks. And then it sounds like
[30:52] somebody knocked the mirror in the room that
[30:54] I was in. And I was like. Now, I'm not saying
[30:56] it was a ghost, but I've not experienced that
[30:59] before. And I was like, that was really, really
[31:01] bizarre. And then it went flat, really quiet.
[31:05] And the end of the night, Carl was like, so is
[31:07] this place haunted? I said, I don't know. It's
[31:10] the only place I've said I don't know, apart
[31:11] from East Drive. I'm not going to say it is,
[31:14] but I'm certainly not going to say that it isn't,
[31:16] because there's certainly something here we need
[31:17] to come back and... It's quite a drive for me.
[31:20] And as it was, we lost access to there because
[31:22] some urbexers had found it. And even though they
[31:25] didn't damage the place, they put it back, everything
[31:27] as it was. But the staff were like, we can't
[31:30] leave a door open because people have got in.
[31:31] So massive shame that we couldn't go back and
[31:34] investigate it. But the building has been saved.
[31:37] This beautiful building is now being transformed
[31:39] into a hotel instead of a care home. So at least
[31:42] we're not just losing a building of, you know,
[31:45] an old, beautiful building. So kind of. So I'll
[31:52] go into debunking a little bit. I wanted to ask,
[31:54] because the word debunk and debunker can stir
[31:56] up emotions in people, let's say. And you've
[31:59] had some quite public spats with different people,
[32:03] especially in the past couple of weeks. I've
[32:04] seen some of the polls you've put on, some of
[32:06] the disgusting comments that one particular person
[32:09] was making. How does that kind of affect you
[32:12] doing this stuff? I mean, obviously you have
[32:15] your sort of public sort of face and obviously
[32:18] response to it, but how... Does that kind of
[32:21] affect you when you're doing this work and getting
[32:22] these comments and threats and stuff from people?
[32:24] I'm an ex -doorman and an ex -bailiff, so...
[32:26] I've dealt with all of it before, but normally
[32:33] that far away from my face. So I think because
[32:39] it's not to my face, I deal with it worse. Not
[32:42] so much I deal with it worse, like I go off afterwards
[32:46] and I'm like, oh, my feelings. It's more I deal
[32:49] with it worse, like... I don't really de -escalate
[32:52] like I would because somebody may punch me in
[32:54] the face while I'm stood there. I'm just like,
[32:56] I'm just some guy on the internet. You'll have
[32:58] your back both barrels. And a lot of people seem
[33:01] to think that I wouldn't be the way I am in real
[33:04] life. And my wife will tell anyone he's worse.
[33:08] Like I'm the type of guy, if somebody spits,
[33:10] if I'm walking on the street, somebody spits
[33:12] next to me, I can't help it. I'm just like, you
[33:15] dirty, what the fuck are you doing? It's disgusting.
[33:18] And she's like, come on. I'm like, no, why do
[33:21] that? There's a bin there or a tissue or something.
[33:25] I've always just been, as a child, I was very
[33:28] shy. I was bullied horrendously in school. And
[33:32] then I got to my teenage years. College was really
[33:34] different for me. I became very popular in college.
[33:38] And then I was always the smallest bailiff, the
[33:41] smallest doorman. You know, I'm six foot, but
[33:45] I was always really slim. I mean, obviously I'm
[33:47] not anymore. But I sort of made up for being
[33:52] a smaller doorman and a smaller bailiff with
[33:54] being overly confident and really gobby. And
[33:57] I do have an ability to talk my way out of a
[34:00] lot of situations, even if I've got to back down
[34:02] and be like, yep, do you know what? Sorry. I
[34:05] could have, the recent stuff with those disgusting
[34:08] comments, I could have made that so much worse.
[34:11] And when I was apologised by one of them, I believe
[34:15] genuinely. I could have just said, nah, forget
[34:17] that, your channel. And I could have kept going
[34:20] at them. But I'm like, nah, if he's going to
[34:21] be a man and apologise to me, it's only fair
[34:23] that I put out there that he's apologised to
[34:25] me, apologised on behalf of the guy that made
[34:28] those comments. Some people will see that as
[34:31] me pandering. I think it's me just being a human
[34:35] being. If somebody's going to take the time to
[34:37] private message me over it, then I've got a bit
[34:39] of time for them. Yeah, I think the ability to
[34:44] admit you're wrong or apologise to someone, I
[34:49] think that in itself can be very challenging
[34:53] for people to do. Especially publicly. Yeah,
[34:57] publicly and across social media where it's there.
[35:05] Everyone's seeing it. It's in black and white.
[35:08] And if you've written it, you've written it.
[35:11] Or if you've apologised privately, yeah, that's...
[35:14] That, to me, as well, I would be in a similar
[35:17] position. I would accept their apology or go
[35:22] to some way of saying, well, that's respectful.
[35:26] Regardless of what's happened, that's respectful
[35:28] to me. Like you say, you could just carry on
[35:32] doing stuff. The fact that he inboxed me privately
[35:37] rather than just a public apology for audiences.
[35:43] He came to me first. That meant a bit more to
[35:47] me. He was like, all right, you haven't done
[35:48] this for his fan base. He hasn't done this. Maybe
[35:50] he did. I don't know. But I'll take a chance
[35:53] on that. He just genuinely didn't know what that
[35:56] guy was doing and felt really bad about it. And
[35:59] he told me I can make whatever videos I want
[36:00] on his channel and ridicule him and ridicule
[36:03] the history they go wrong and stuff. And I'm
[36:05] like, it's no fun then. It's a mad one because...
[36:14] I'm mainly UFO kind of person. Greg mentioned
[36:18] the sort of website in the group that I've grown
[36:20] over the past six or seven years. So we have
[36:24] the database and we investigate UFO sightings
[36:26] kind of across the UK. My organisation name is
[36:32] UFO Identified. We get these sighting reports
[36:36] and we go and investigate them and speak to the
[36:37] witness. We'll go to location. We will 99 % of
[36:41] the time explain that as... balloons, ISS, whatever
[36:45] it is. Swamp gas. Swamp gas, Venus, all these
[36:50] things. And even from the witnesses themselves,
[36:53] when I saw, we do the case reports, we do it
[36:55] all quite formally with case reports and write
[36:58] up some reports and everything and give that
[37:00] back to the witness. And stuff that I've been
[37:04] called just from, because it's their site and
[37:07] it's their story they told to people. And I'm
[37:10] basically saying, it's nothing unusual. It was
[37:12] this, it was that. And they always explain the
[37:14] reasons why. And you get some people that are
[37:16] like, yeah, cool, they just wanted an answer
[37:17] and we give them the answer. You get people that
[37:19] just won't accept that it's not an alien spaceship
[37:23] that's come to take them or whatever. And I've
[37:27] been called the bunker government shill. We've
[37:31] been called government shills many times. Also,
[37:34] just for... telling the truth. Like say 99 %
[37:37] of the science we get, if we get hundreds reported
[37:39] every year, we can explain. And we put all the
[37:43] reports on the website and then we get the few.
[37:45] I think there's three or four over the past six
[37:47] years that I cannot explain. And they're the
[37:49] ones that, obviously the ones we want, because
[37:51] you sort of have to go through the chaff to get
[37:53] to the wheat. So we sort of pass off it like
[37:58] what you do, where you've got to go through the
[38:00] crap, you've got to go through the shit to get
[38:02] to the... to the goal to think, I've actually
[38:04] got something here. And the thing that, again,
[38:07] adds credibility because if every report on our
[38:10] website was UFO, UFO, can't explain, can't explain,
[38:12] can't explain, then it's like, are we actually
[38:14] looking into it properly? Or whereas half of
[38:16] motorized ports are, yeah, this was this or whatever.
[38:19] But you get the people where, you get the people
[38:21] that are always going to believe no matter what.
[38:23] And you get the people that are always going
[38:24] to not believe no matter what. Which is like
[38:27] you said, kind of at the top of the show where...
[38:29] It's the ones that are clearly fake or whatever,
[38:32] that get these millions of views and these popular
[38:35] TikTok accounts and social media accounts where
[38:37] it's all fake stuff. So I find it really annoying.
[38:41] I've always said from the start, I'm happy to
[38:44] have 10 people visit our website or subscribe
[38:46] to our channel or our TikTok because it's real.
[38:50] I'd rather have 10 people liking our real stuff
[38:53] than having a million people that... Following
[38:55] us because we're putting fake stuff out. It can
[38:58] be a hard line because are people, the millions
[39:02] of people watching it because it's entertainment
[39:04] and they see it as entertainment or are they
[39:06] actually believing it? Where do you think that
[39:08] kind of line is with these channels, I guess?
[39:13] I'm probably the wrong one to ask because even
[39:17] though I'm a debunker, I mean, I never called
[39:20] myself a debunker. That's been... bestowed upon
[39:23] me by the community i was just my original idea
[39:26] was just to do reaction videos to scary videos
[39:29] and basically i was going to be a really cheap
[39:33] carbon copy of casper site my daughter loves
[39:37] casper so i've spoken to ben over the years i
[39:40] was initially very cruel to him and he's been
[39:41] very forgiving of it and we've you know we've
[39:44] had a few very pleasant conversations over the
[39:46] years um And that's where I was going. But it
[39:50] was like, I'm watching these top five videos.
[39:52] And I think my first two, I was like, oh, that's
[39:54] creepy. That's cool. I don't know about that.
[39:56] And then it was like, bullshit, bullshit. But
[39:59] how was people falling for that? And then I was
[40:02] like, I'm going to go start looking at channels
[40:04] that I used to watch and that I used to enjoy.
[40:08] I was like, oh, why was I believing this stuff?
[40:13] But then I also went back to channels that. I
[40:16] tried to watch and was like, this is boring.
[40:18] Nothing's happening. Channels like the Ouija
[40:20] Brothers. And then obviously I started watching
[40:23] them again three or four years ago. And I pretty
[40:28] much watched their entire back catalogue. And
[40:30] I'm like, in six years, they've had three things.
[40:33] Three things where you could be, that could be
[40:36] paranormal, that could be weird. And that's it.
[40:39] And I'm like, that's the real life. That's the
[40:41] experience that I have when I'm investigating
[40:44] or been investigating. Very rare, very few and
[40:48] far between. But we all do B -roll on our investigations.
[40:51] We all use music in the intros. We all try to
[40:54] tell the dramatic story. And then, you know,
[40:57] we all blow our load early. We've got this video
[40:59] with all these creepy cinematics and, you know,
[41:02] bars at the top and bottom of the screen. And
[41:04] we've darkened the corners and we've colour graded.
[41:06] But then as soon as you go into night vision,
[41:07] we just stood around like that, weren't we? Anyone?
[41:12] No? Knock. There's that entertainment element
[41:17] to all of it. Otherwise, I wouldn't do YouTube.
[41:20] Even if I was writing an article, which I'm not
[41:23] a writer. I've tried, and I'm terrible at it.
[41:26] I'm far better suited to using my voice and my
[41:29] personality and joking. I mean, most people,
[41:31] I make a joke, and people are offended, and I'm
[41:33] like, do you not watch comedians? Because I'm
[41:36] tame. But, yeah, there's an element of entertainment
[41:39] for anything that's put online that's not. a
[41:43] thesis or a paper or something that's been accredited
[41:47] or looked at by professionals. So to a degree,
[41:51] it's all entertainment. I guess I specialize
[41:55] in the entertainment side of the paranormal.
[41:59] I'm not a parapsychologist. I've never been to
[42:02] university for anything. I went to college, but
[42:05] I did music. I did performing arts. So, you know,
[42:08] the... The only thing from my real life that
[42:11] comes into play with debunking is I was a CCTV
[42:15] operator for years. So I know a fair bit about
[42:18] CCTV cameras and CCTV footage, which is how I
[42:21] started debunking was, that's not a ghost. That's
[42:24] a video bleed from an old tape. Look, you can
[42:28] see the scan lines there and things like that,
[42:30] because these are things I experienced in the
[42:31] real world that I can take forward. But it's
[42:35] all entertainment, whether it's a podcast, YouTube
[42:38] or... um a radio show or something you know uncanny
[42:43] it's entertainment there's a scientific element
[42:45] to it you know we've got a parapsychologist on
[42:48] there that's just like none of it's real but
[42:51] it's all entertainment um i don't see the problem
[42:54] with entertainment as long as it's labeled as
[42:57] such if you're going out and you're faking your
[43:00] ghost hunts have at it but let people know what
[43:03] you're doing because tim moore is off in russia
[43:06] he does fake Things where he shoots demons with
[43:09] an assault shotgun and stuff. He's got witches
[43:12] bursting out of wardrobes. It's incredible. The
[43:15] trickery that he does is so well made. It's like
[43:18] a 30 to 40 minute horror movie every week. Really
[43:22] well made. But his disclaimer at the beginning
[43:24] in Russian says, this is for entertainment. I've
[43:26] written this. None of it's based on any real
[43:28] life events. Well, I can enjoy that and I can
[43:32] enjoy it and try to work out how the hell he's
[43:34] doing it because he's really clever with it.
[43:36] But then when you watch somebody go somewhere
[43:38] like East Drive and make up stuff or worse, the
[43:42] ITC channels that are like, oh, I'm talking to
[43:45] the dead, and you're not. You're just capitalizing
[43:47] on the income of a dead celebrity trending on
[43:50] Google. You're just disgusting, you know? Wrong.
[43:55] But it's all entertainment. And I make my own
[43:58] end of it entertainment by... I record my video.
[44:03] I'll put a 20 -minute video out. It's probably
[44:05] been an hour, and I've had to chop out 75 % of
[44:09] the stuff I've said because I get so aggravated
[44:13] by some of them. Some of it, I'm guessing. But
[44:16] when it comes to ITC, all the guys are just sitting
[44:18] in their houses pretending their house is haunted,
[44:19] making an absolute killing. It pisses me off.
[44:22] It's lazy, generic bullshit. everybody's having
[44:30] a go at me or calling my friends boring because
[44:34] this guy is making it look like the paranormal
[44:36] can just happen in your house by sitting there
[44:38] watching TV. Granted, that's how most people
[44:41] have their experiences. They're just doing something
[44:43] ordinary, but not every night. I mean, how can
[44:48] he put out four or five videos a week and every
[44:50] one of them has got paranormal activity? There'd
[44:52] be scientists camped in his house. Absolutely.
[44:55] Absolutely. I do think, like you, Like you say,
[44:58] there is a place in this paranormal thing for
[45:04] everybody. You've got the entertainment stuff,
[45:07] like you say. You've got people like fucking
[45:09] Smug Puppy. That's... You've got lots of others
[45:17] over the years. Like, I got banned from Ghost
[45:20] of Britain. their facebook pages because i was
[45:23] calling them out and they just blocked me he
[45:25] loves me i couldn't get i couldn't get on there
[45:29] for for love no money to watch their stuff because
[45:32] i was calling them out but so you've got back
[45:35] in the day sorry to interrupt you but you know
[45:37] back in the day lee steer was actually really
[45:40] well respected in the community he was actually
[45:43] a debunker an on -site debunker yeah my oh he's
[45:47] fallen He's a nice guy. He is a nice guy. But
[45:52] his videos, fuck me, their clickbait is unreal.
[45:56] So there is a spectrum. Like you say, if people
[46:02] put out that it's made for entertainment, this
[46:07] is essentially, this is not paranormal. I know
[46:14] a lot of them won't say that, but they'll say...
[46:16] This is made for entertainment purposes only.
[46:18] I think that there is a place for all of that.
[46:22] And then you've got the fuzzle. We know the guys,
[46:25] Mark and Tony at PSI. And they go into it and
[46:32] they try and recreate stuff, debunk stuff. We've
[46:35] been to talks with them and they've been doing
[46:38] all this stuff. And they go into it fully to
[46:42] try and explain what's happening. And then you've
[46:45] got Smug Puppy. I hate saying that, but there
[46:51] is a place for, yeah. I don't see, a lot of people
[46:55] are like, Smug Puppy is the worst of the worst.
[46:57] And I'm like, he's not. I like watching him.
[46:59] I like watching him, but. He's no different to
[47:02] Laney and Ben and really haunted. The only difference
[47:05] is his editing is not as good. No, no. He's doing
[47:09] the same thing as them. But he's only doing the
[47:12] same thing. He's just easier to catch. I had
[47:16] a channel reach out to me the other day. Look,
[47:18] we can't afford all these locations. We're going
[47:20] to get into debunking. I've been watching. I'm
[47:22] not even going to say their name because you'll
[47:24] get shit for it. I've been watching this channel.
[47:27] I can't catch them. And I'm like, I've caught
[47:30] them once or twice. But they've always got an
[47:34] answer for everything. And a small channel like
[47:36] yourself, they'll just crush you under their
[47:38] boot. So don't bother. I said, look, start small
[47:40] and work your way up. I said, what's my puppy?
[47:43] If you want to learn how to fake something, what's
[47:45] my puppy? Because you can see the mistakes he's
[47:48] making, but then you refine that. You learn how
[47:51] to do it. I learned really from Really Haunted.
[47:55] I used to just replicate what he was doing for
[47:57] a laugh. You know, the haunted Alexa. It took
[48:02] me ages to work out how he was doing it. And
[48:04] it was just as simple as Simon says, and then
[48:06] overlay it. But to get the ring, ring the light
[48:10] up on there and all the rest. Eventually it was
[48:13] a dead pixel that gave him away what he was doing
[48:15] with that and the SLS. But it took, it took me
[48:18] and another debunker and we were like, that's
[48:21] a dead pixel and it's disappeared. And then reappeared
[48:23] dead pixels cannot disappear. Even if you put
[48:26] white over them, you can still see a dead pixel,
[48:29] but. And Smug Puppy is no different to them.
[48:34] The only difference is that he is far more rude
[48:38] when he deals with criticism. The way he speaks
[48:41] to people. At one point, he was going to come
[48:43] clean. He told a friend of mine, I'll speak to
[48:46] you and I'll speak to Beardo and we'll come out
[48:48] and just say it's for entertainment. And I think
[48:49] he would have done better for it instead of arguing
[48:53] and all the rest. Because now he's a laughingstock
[48:56] and a joke of most people. If he had said it's
[48:58] for entertainment, he'd have got away with it.
[49:00] Same as Yasko have. I went at Jasko a couple
[49:03] of times. Jasko emailed me, what have I got to
[49:05] do to get you off my back? And I went, just be
[49:07] honest. And then he sends me a video link. This
[49:11] is my new video, Is This Good Enough? Text at
[49:14] the beginning. This is a weekly horror episode
[49:17] I hope you enjoy. Not everything in this is paranormal.
[49:20] It's a horror show every week. And I looked at
[49:25] the description and he's got it in the description
[49:27] at the top, not right at the bottom under all
[49:29] his subscribers and sponsors and all of that.
[49:32] And I'm like, I'm never going to cover Yasco
[49:33] again. The second he drops it, I'll do it again.
[49:37] But he's, it's not good enough for every debunker
[49:40] and that's fine. That's up to them. It's good
[49:43] enough for me. If somebody says for entertainment
[49:45] purposes only, but it's not at the bottom of
[49:48] the description, it's got to be on screen. I'm
[49:50] good with it. I'll leave them alone. There's
[49:52] no point. I can still debunk them. I can still
[49:54] work out what they're doing, but it's a different
[49:57] thing. Like there's a channel called Robbie and
[50:00] Penny. They've got millions of subscribers and
[50:03] the shit they do in their house, Penny's the
[50:06] dog. It's incredible. Like I'm going to capture
[50:08] a ghost and he's throwing hula hoops down a corridor
[50:11] while the ghost is leaving footprints and stuff.
[50:13] And I'm like, how has he done that? And then
[50:17] I did a debunking video on it. It's all clearly,
[50:19] he doesn't save entertainment, but he overacts
[50:21] it and winks at the camera. I can forgive that.
[50:24] I did this video and I'm like, it's either going
[50:26] to be a copyright strike or he'll ignore me.
[50:29] And then he came in the comment section and he
[50:30] was like, you were so close on so many parts
[50:33] of it, but there was no green screen. It's all,
[50:36] and there's not two people, it's me on my own.
[50:38] I was like, right, so I know you've done it,
[50:40] I'm just a little bit off. And he was like, yeah,
[50:42] feel free to use any of my content, debunk away
[50:44] and I'll tell you whether you got it right or
[50:45] wrong. That's fun for me then. And it's better
[50:50] made. Tim Moore, all of the guys I see for entertainment
[50:53] purposes, they can go further with it. They can
[50:57] do so much more incredible stuff because they're
[50:59] not trying to convince anyone that it's real.
[51:01] Some people still believe it, which blows my
[51:03] mind. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. So are there
[51:09] channels that you've watched or videos you've
[51:14] seen? You mentioned like the top five stuff.
[51:17] I've watched some of those and I'm like, how
[51:18] the fuck are people even thinking that's a top
[51:21] five video? yeah and it's interesting you say
[51:24] about the cctv because people use like door um
[51:28] ring doorbell footage not knowing how like night
[51:32] time or night vision on one of those things works
[51:36] so somebody walks past clearly and it becomes
[51:39] like this weird shadow figure yeah they've got
[51:42] to look at the depth of The field of view, the
[51:46] depth of the view. They've got to look at the
[51:48] lighting. They've got to look at what settings
[51:50] the ring doorbell is on. Because if you've got
[51:52] it set down to 720p, you'll have ghosts everywhere.
[51:56] We've got ours on 4K and I've never had one of
[51:58] those anomalies. So I'm utterly convinced a lot
[52:01] of these people are lowering the resolution just
[52:05] either to save their battery or because they
[52:07] know they'll capture some weird stuff on there.
[52:10] I've got CCTV all outside my house and I've got
[52:13] the Ring doorbell and we have never, ever captured
[52:15] anything that remotely looks like a ghost. So
[52:18] why is everyone else doing it? Yeah, I think
[52:22] a lot of people don't understand how equipment
[52:28] works. No, not at all. What kind of equipment?
[52:32] So I mentioned the Ring doorbell. Obviously,
[52:34] that's not a piece of equipment, but that is
[52:35] something that seems to capture a lot of spirits
[52:38] for want of a better. term um what so me and
[52:46] ash have talked about apps over the years all
[52:48] that kind of thing there's a lot of people use
[52:51] apps um spirit talker whatnot an acrometer um
[52:56] i don't have those but what piece of equipment
[53:02] do you think people use the most that they don't
[53:04] understand how it works So by not understanding,
[53:08] like the K2, for example, don't understand how
[53:10] it works. So it's already lighting up. They're
[53:12] in this house, but they don't realise they're
[53:14] next to the wall where the washing machine is,
[53:18] for example. And every time the washing machine
[53:20] seems to go on, the ghosts appear. But even at
[53:22] that point, they have already misunderstood that
[53:25] piece of equipment because they've taken no baseline
[53:27] reading. and they don't realise that that baseline
[53:30] reading is no good on specifically the K2 or
[53:33] K2 type devices because to get a baseline, you've
[53:36] got to spin it 360 on all of its axis. So by
[53:40] the time you've moved four metres to do your
[53:42] baseline, it's already changed behind you. It's
[53:45] something I used for ages and they are just completely
[53:49] redundant. My wife will argue that with me till
[53:52] the cows come home because we've got a piano
[53:54] in the conservatory. One night it sounded like
[53:56] somebody played it herself. It played itself.
[53:59] And I'm like, heating and cooling. And she was
[54:02] like, explain that. And she holds the key two
[54:03] out. And she's got a red. And I'm like, all right.
[54:08] In line with a piano key. That could be quite
[54:11] interesting. But there's a plug socket there.
[54:14] There's not even screwed into the wall properly.
[54:15] And I'm rationalizing it. And she's like, well,
[54:18] no, you're just looking for a way to debunk it
[54:21] now, aren't you? You're a fun sponge then, aren't
[54:23] you? Yeah. Yeah. The biggest one that people,
[54:30] it's got to be the spirit box because people
[54:34] are like, oh, but he scans the radio stations
[54:36] backwards. No, he doesn't. You're just turning
[54:39] the dial. If you turn the dial all the way to
[54:42] one end on an old radio, we'll remember them.
[54:44] You turn the dial all the way to one end, you've
[54:46] gone past all the stations. That's my not. No,
[54:48] he looks a bit younger. All it's doing is going
[54:52] that way. So you're starting at the right -hand
[54:55] side of the band and working left. So nothing
[54:58] is coming through there backwards. You haven't
[54:59] got to disseminate anything. That's why when
[55:02] you hear music, it's the right way. I've heard
[55:05] people, I've seen it in videos. People are like,
[55:07] oh, the spirit said yes. I'm like, it's Lady
[55:09] fucking Gaga. Everybody knows it. Oh, and it
[55:13] said the name of this disaster. And I'm like,
[55:15] you're in that area. That person has just died.
[55:19] Of course it's come out of there. People were
[55:21] doing it with Nicola Bullion. I got a lot of
[55:23] shit for what I did there. Because I went at
[55:25] all of them. And I was like, you're absolutely
[55:27] fucking disgusting. Of course your spirit box
[55:29] has said Nicola. Because that's all that was
[55:32] over all of the radio stations. Not just news
[55:34] stations. Every news station, breaking news,
[55:37] Nicola Bullion case. And I went so hard at one
[55:41] of them specifically. I mean, that's part of
[55:44] the reason I had to buy as much CCTV on my house
[55:46] as I've got, because he really wasn't happy with
[55:50] me. But, you know, people were getting arrested
[55:53] over that. They were interfering with crime scenes
[55:55] because they were just trampling stuff and going
[55:58] in people's houses, or not in their houses, but
[56:00] jumping in their backyards, knocking on their
[56:01] back doors, like, can I speak to you about Nicola?
[56:03] What the fuck? You're ghost hunters. She wasn't
[56:06] even dead as far as we knew at that point. Yeah,
[56:09] that was a particularly high profile. recent
[56:12] case wasn't it that yeah it seemed to attract
[56:16] loads of people for some reason like you mentioned
[56:18] everybody was going down there but then you you
[56:22] do see i've spoken to michael jackson or videos
[56:25] that i've spoken to alvis and i just like but
[56:30] then you say that about the the um scanning the
[56:35] frequency we've actually had some weird experiences
[56:37] with those devices in Cannock Chase. Was the
[56:43] aerial plugged in? The aerial was plugged in.
[56:49] I'll have to send you the video, see what you
[56:51] think to it. We've got many videos that I could
[56:54] send to you, actually. It would be interesting
[56:57] to get your take on a lot of the stuff. Because
[57:00] we do try and debunk, me and Ash. We're out in
[57:03] the field, things happen, and we go, how the
[57:05] fuck did that just happen when it was supposed
[57:08] to happen? So we've got like a word bank device.
[57:14] Yeah. So I make it, me and my partner, Sarah
[57:21] from the twins. We developed, we've coded it
[57:25] so I know exactly how it works. Yeah. Exactly
[57:27] how it works. The only bit I don't know is why
[57:31] that particular word comes through. So I can
[57:34] plug it into my Mac. I can show you with the
[57:37] movement, with the temperature and everything.
[57:38] And it hits certain. Oh, so yours really has
[57:43] the scanners in it that the rest of them see
[57:45] they do. Not the scanners. Yeah, so ours works
[57:49] on movement, temperature, magnetic change. Yeah.
[57:55] And if it's a higher temperature of 0 .2 degrees
[57:59] change, because we felt that was a big enough
[58:02] jump to get a trigger, but in an area you're
[58:07] not going to get, you'll get fluctuations, but
[58:10] they tend to be a bit more gradual. i've got
[58:12] magnetic ones and the movement and i can plug
[58:15] it i plug it into the mac i've got the the serial
[58:17] monitor for the device and it yeah it goes has
[58:20] to hit say five triggers in um eight seconds
[58:25] for it to to fire so i can show you exactly how
[58:28] it works i can tell you or i can show you the
[58:31] code in respect i've spent hours on this coding
[58:34] yeah but i can't tell you why that word comes
[58:38] out and we've had some mad words come out of
[58:43] it i was i've got a video in this house where
[58:47] i am now i've got my dad died when i was young
[58:50] and i've got his plaque yeah and his i picked
[58:55] up the device and his name came through so his
[58:59] first name brian yeah which no nobody knows that's
[59:02] brian he was always called douglas and then the
[59:05] word douglas came through all right How the fuck
[59:10] did that work? So it's got two and a half thousand
[59:12] words. Yeah. It's got 500 names from the last
[59:16] 200 years, the top 500 names. I specifically
[59:18] put those words on. I'll send you the video.
[59:25] It's interesting. It's nothing else. And I'm
[59:27] happy to, but we've had weird words come through.
[59:31] We were at Cannot Chase. We've got a book out,
[59:33] me and Ash, about the United States. And we had
[59:38] a series where we went through each. and we come
[59:41] up and talked about paranormal happenings in
[59:45] each state. And we were in Cannock Chase on a
[59:49] live stream on TikTok, just me and Ash in the
[59:51] middle of Castle Ring, Cannock, and we were talking
[59:56] about the book and the word book comes through
[59:58] on the device. It doesn't listen. I haven't programmed
[1:00:01] it to listen because I don't know how to. Fair
[1:00:04] enough. I'm fairly stupid, but I had enough nails
[1:00:09] to do that. And just weird stuff like that comes
[1:00:13] through. We were at the Masonic Lodge, the lodge,
[1:00:16] which you probably heard about, I imagine. I've
[1:00:20] heard of it, yeah. With the tapping on the table.
[1:00:26] Yeah. So I've been there, actually. I have been.
[1:00:33] We're going back tomorrow night, me and Ash.
[1:00:35] Ash is going for the first time. I was a complete
[1:00:36] sceptic, and I was happy to have a conversation
[1:00:39] with Saz and Gibbsy, which I did, and they knew
[1:00:42] I was coming up as a sceptic. What I saw that
[1:00:45] night, I have no explanation for. I cannot explain
[1:00:49] how it happened. Can you do me a fever when you
[1:00:52] go there? Yeah, yeah. Camera under that table.
[1:00:55] I've got a video under the table. I was pointing
[1:00:59] to where the noise was coming from. What I experienced
[1:01:04] that night, it was only a couple of weeks ago.
[1:01:06] We didn't live stream it. I've got video under
[1:01:09] the table because they were like, get under the
[1:01:10] table if you want. We've got no problem with
[1:01:12] that. I've scaled the table. There's a little
[1:01:15] panel there. I put my hand in the panel. I can't
[1:01:19] explain it. Ash tomorrow. We're there to... So
[1:01:25] I was still like, I didn't want to go, so I'm
[1:01:26] like, this is BS. But that's reason to go, though,
[1:01:32] isn't it? The BS. He nearly didn't go. It's after
[1:01:36] I saw how much you changed your mind, kind of,
[1:01:40] because you were quite, again, adamant, no, it
[1:01:43] can't be. That's like real paranormal, the...
[1:01:45] video on it as well and stuff but how you change
[1:01:49] so much honestly okay i trust you yeah and that's
[1:01:53] the thing like emma to investigate emma she came
[1:01:57] back and she's like oh my god it's amazing i'm
[1:01:59] like it's bullshit i watched the videos it's
[1:02:01] bullshit the sat i watched a live stream it's
[1:02:03] bullshit and i called bullshit from the start
[1:02:06] and i'm like no and they knew because i i know
[1:02:10] them that i was Coming up, I was on their live
[1:02:14] stream early in the day, and they're like, hopefully
[1:02:17] you'll understand, Greg, when you get here. We
[1:02:20] know you're sceptical. I had conversations with
[1:02:22] them about it. I said, look, it's too good to
[1:02:24] be true. I said, it's genuinely too good to be
[1:02:26] true. It's happening all the time, like you said,
[1:02:29] Bearday. But what happened... Really fucked in
[1:02:37] my head. And I can't even explain it. And I've
[1:02:39] seen the videos that Real Evidence did. He put
[1:02:42] out a video shortly after they sort of started
[1:02:47] doing stuff, saying, like, Gibson's legs under
[1:02:50] table not moving and whatnot. But I don't know.
[1:02:56] Speaking to the guy as well at the time, we had
[1:02:59] a really good off -camera conversation about...
[1:03:02] essentially the meaning of life, mortality, all
[1:03:06] that kind of stuff. We were trying to get them
[1:03:07] to pull my dad through, which is what I try and
[1:03:10] do at a lot of places. The twins, they lost their
[1:03:15] mum last year, so they were trying to get whatever
[1:03:18] this thing is in the room to see if we could
[1:03:21] get their mum through. And honestly, it's fucking
[1:03:27] nuts. We've got CCTV to put under the tables
[1:03:31] tomorrow. Yeah. We're going to be live streaming
[1:03:34] it. I've just got a little Osmo Pocket 3 that
[1:03:40] we're going to be setting up. So we'll capture
[1:03:42] it in 4K. We're going to be all over the table.
[1:03:47] We're private hiring it, so me, Ash, and the
[1:03:50] girls and AD. And it's just us. So it'll be interesting.
[1:03:58] It's fucking nuts, that place. Are they going
[1:04:01] to be there? Yeah, so it's really difficult to
[1:04:10] explain until you've been. Yeah, obviously for
[1:04:14] me, obviously the knocking and tapping phenomena,
[1:04:18] it went hundreds of years ago. And the way you
[1:04:21] can make it travel. I'm not saying that's what
[1:04:25] they're doing, because I haven't been there,
[1:04:26] and I've not seen definitive proof that it's
[1:04:29] bollocks. There's enough for me to question it,
[1:04:31] same as you. Oh, yeah, absolutely. So, obviously,
[1:04:33] cameras under the table, cameras on the table.
[1:04:37] It's a shame you haven't got, like, a Seismo
[1:04:39] device or something. It basically triggers for
[1:04:43] vibrations, but I wouldn't put it on the table.
[1:04:45] You've got that, haven't you, Ash? Yeah. I've
[1:04:47] got, like, a vibrations sensor. Don't put it
[1:04:51] on the table. because obviously there's sound
[1:04:53] coming from somewhere, you think it's coming
[1:04:54] from the table, put it on the table for a time,
[1:04:57] but then put it on their shoes. Because if they're
[1:05:02] hammer -toeing, because obviously the table legs
[1:05:05] are in contact with the floor, if they are flicking
[1:05:07] that toe to cause that snapping or their ankle
[1:05:09] or something, then you should be able... I mean,
[1:05:12] if it was me, I'd probably be under the table
[1:05:14] with a friend and be like, right, I'll hold his
[1:05:16] feet, you hold his feet, right, now knock. And
[1:05:18] then if he knocks and it still comes from the
[1:05:20] table and I can't see anything knocking... At
[1:05:26] that point, they're going to have to say, right,
[1:05:28] there's something weird that I can't explain.
[1:05:30] It doesn't, for me, make it paranormal, but it
[1:05:32] makes it fucking weird. Yeah, and we came out
[1:05:35] there saying it wasn't paranormal. We don't think
[1:05:38] it's paranormal. It's just fucking weird. That
[1:05:41] was our thing. I wasn't scared. I don't get scared,
[1:05:44] to be fair. We walked around Delamere Forest
[1:05:46] in the middle of the night, and we're not. You
[1:05:48] went to Cannock with all the doggers, so you
[1:05:50] survived that. I'll tell you what. The last time
[1:05:54] you went won it. Oh, God, the Duggars. Fucking
[1:05:57] hell. We've walked up to this car park and there's
[1:06:00] a load of vans there. And we got out and we're
[1:06:05] like, there was like this couple came from behind
[1:06:08] the van. Fucking hell. So we walked off. We were
[1:06:13] on a live stream at this point. We walked off.
[1:06:15] We thought, well, the cars are probably going
[1:06:17] to be safe because they're just going to be fucking
[1:06:19] each other and fishing and whatnot. Anyway. But
[1:06:22] the signal got really crap. So we had to go back.
[1:06:27] And we ended up in this little bit of wooded
[1:06:30] area right near the car park. And they were playing
[1:06:34] like dance music all night. It was the weirdest
[1:06:38] thing. Must have been about 20 cars coming and
[1:06:40] going. This was like middle of the night. It's
[1:06:42] like, what is... I know it's popular for it,
[1:06:45] but this is actually insane. I know. That was
[1:06:48] mad. That was mad. But I don't know where we're
[1:06:53] going now. So it's a super weird place. And we
[1:06:59] got down. So this is the weird thing. This is
[1:07:03] the weird thing. So I purposely, I put the word
[1:07:06] lodge in there, in this little device, just to
[1:07:13] see if it'd come up. Obviously, from an entertainment
[1:07:18] point of view, that's quite good, I think. Yeah.
[1:07:21] If you've got words associated with the, which
[1:07:24] I can do, I don't, because we've just got that
[1:07:27] word bank set of words. And it come up with the
[1:07:34] word Daisy. And the guy there, Ollie, the head
[1:07:39] mason, he was like to the others, look at that.
[1:07:45] And Daisy is the name of one of the spirits that
[1:07:47] is one of whatever it is. yeah we're speaking
[1:07:51] to it come up on the i just had it on the table
[1:07:53] just had it there just in just firing out words
[1:07:56] um and when it's when nothing's happening and
[1:08:02] there's no movement it goes into like an ambient
[1:08:04] mode and it will just fire out a word every i
[1:08:07] think i've programmed it for every 30 to 90 seconds
[1:08:10] just so people just don't have nothing happen
[1:08:14] on it but it still triggers in the same way it
[1:08:16] just pulls out a random word And it came up with
[1:08:19] Daisy. And then the next word was lodge. So it's
[1:08:23] just, it's just weird shit like that. Yeah. Coupled
[1:08:28] with all these knocking that I couldn't even
[1:08:30] explain. I went in there for a bullshit caller
[1:08:33] and I was happy to call them out because I had
[1:08:39] my concerns. But I flipped within 10 minutes
[1:08:42] of being there. I was like, fucking hell, this
[1:08:44] is mad. So Ash. You need to do it tomorrow. So
[1:08:48] by the time this goes out next week, we'll have
[1:08:50] already been. So we'll have to do a follow -up
[1:08:52] just to let everybody know. It's interesting.
[1:08:56] I don't know how to explain it. That's the thing.
[1:08:59] It's one of them places that I was adamant I
[1:09:03] could go in there and figure out what was going
[1:09:04] on. Couldn't. So when you do get, say you're
[1:09:09] watching a video for the first time on YouTube,
[1:09:12] what are kind of the things you're looking for?
[1:09:13] So these red flags. Do you have any certain looking
[1:09:20] for you just kind of anything and everything?
[1:09:22] I suppose I autopilot to a degree. Now it's a
[1:09:26] certain channel name. I'm just autopilot. I know
[1:09:29] what I'm looking for. And those videos, they
[1:09:32] don't excite me as much, but I've got to make
[1:09:34] them because you know, it's my living. I hate
[1:09:38] making twin paranormal videos and Simon Colby
[1:09:40] videos. It's the same shit, but I've got to make
[1:09:43] them. But then. There'll be the odd video come
[1:09:46] through and it's like, oh, can you, like today,
[1:09:49] I got a video and he was like, oh, do you think
[1:09:52] he's faked this? And I'm watching a really well
[1:09:54] -known UK paranormal investigator smack a door
[1:09:57] with his elbow and then run off going, wasn't
[1:09:59] me, wasn't me. And I'm like, really? You called
[1:10:02] us a bully a week ago, like two months ago for
[1:10:04] calling you fake. That's boring. That's easy.
[1:10:08] I know they use draws. fishing wire under a door
[1:10:11] so you don't get a glint and a drawing pin in
[1:10:14] these shoes because one of them told me about
[1:10:15] it when we were almost getting along and I'm
[1:10:18] like the second I catch you I'm outing you for
[1:10:20] it so they all stop doing it it's a double -edged
[1:10:24] sword because they stop doing the things that
[1:10:26] we catch them doing really haunted when I leave
[1:10:28] him alone he stops doing I'll debunk him and
[1:10:31] he'll stop doing that thing for ages. And once
[1:10:33] it's been a couple of months, he'll be like,
[1:10:34] oh, Beardo's fucked off. Let's introduce poltergeist
[1:10:38] activity again. And then I'll catch him again
[1:10:40] and then he'll stop. But I don't go into videos
[1:10:44] for channels that I've never heard of. I don't
[1:10:48] go into them with the express intention of catching
[1:10:50] them. If they see I've captured poltergeist activity,
[1:10:54] a shadow figure or something. I'm looking to
[1:10:57] see if that is poltergeist activity or a shadow
[1:10:59] figure or whatever the claim is. I want to look
[1:11:02] at the claim and see if there's any truth in
[1:11:05] it or if I can, a lot of the time, I'm not looking
[1:11:07] for fakery. I'm looking for logic, common sense,
[1:11:10] and hoping there's something left over that I'm
[1:11:12] like, I don't know. That's the exciting bit for
[1:11:15] me. It's just so rare for me to be like, I don't
[1:11:18] got a clue. But artifacting and things like that.
[1:11:26] editing tricks because the one thing that I have
[1:11:30] really apart from the live streaming and growing
[1:11:32] an audience and a community and all of that the
[1:11:35] thing I've enjoyed more than anything is learning
[1:11:37] to edit because I didn't know how to edit just
[1:11:41] I cut I move on I cut I move on and I do all
[1:11:44] these nobody notices it but like things like
[1:11:47] my camera sliding across the monitor from a full
[1:11:50] screen and then going I didn't do that in OBS,
[1:11:52] even though I could. It was like, I wonder how
[1:11:54] I track that and I make it look a bit cooler,
[1:11:56] put a drop shot. Nobody ever notices it. Sometimes
[1:11:59] somebody will go, oh, I like what you did there.
[1:12:01] That's cool. But it's the editing process, learning
[1:12:04] to edit, and then watching people like SmugPup
[1:12:07] be really haunted. I'm like, how have they done
[1:12:09] that? Learning how to do it and then making my
[1:12:12] own version of it, but really funny, like the
[1:12:14] annual help my house is not haunted and all of
[1:12:17] that sort of stuff. where I can flex a bit of
[1:12:20] editing stuff, but it's always tongue in cheek
[1:12:22] and a bit of a laugh. I've toyed with the idea
[1:12:25] of doing a legitimate investigation and then
[1:12:29] a rug pull just to show how easy it is because
[1:12:32] it's so much easier. I mean, you'll know this.
[1:12:34] You go out and investigate. It's so much easier
[1:12:37] to go out and fake everything. So you go for
[1:12:39] two hours, you fake everything. You've got a
[1:12:42] banger of a video that's only going to be an
[1:12:44] hour long and everything's ready. You know where
[1:12:46] your markers are. You know where your editing
[1:12:47] points are. You go out and you have nothing all
[1:12:50] night and you've still got to put out a video
[1:12:52] where you know nothing has happened and you've
[1:12:54] got to trawl through six to eight hours of footage.
[1:12:56] It's fucking soul destroying. But there's a fun
[1:13:01] element to that. It's like, how do I make the
[1:13:03] video flow better? So you put the B -rolls in,
[1:13:06] the transitions to the B -rolls. That stuff's
[1:13:08] really fun to me. But yeah, I look for editing
[1:13:11] stuff. The days of people pulling wires and stuff,
[1:13:15] they are slowly disappearing. And I think the
[1:13:17] next one is going to be AI. I've seen my first
[1:13:20] AI ghost clip. I was like, holy shit, that's
[1:13:23] good. The way the ghost cast a shadow, there
[1:13:27] was no six or seven fingers. It literally looks
[1:13:30] like an old woman peeks out of a door, casts
[1:13:32] a shadow, and then peeks back in. I was like,
[1:13:34] it's too good to be true. There is no way. But
[1:13:38] there's something that's really good at detecting
[1:13:40] AI, is AI. Because as a debunker, I can't see
[1:13:46] individual pixels. I look for... Like even though
[1:13:50] our cameras are artifacting, you can see little
[1:13:52] dark patches pulsing and like your jumpers doing
[1:13:56] it when you nod your head and stuff. That's natural
[1:13:58] artifacting on the camera because of the light
[1:14:00] or whatever. AI can scan that and can tell what
[1:14:06] artifacting is natural to the camera, natural
[1:14:09] to the light and what has been manipulated and
[1:14:12] how it's been manipulated. I downloaded a 30
[1:14:15] second clip from Smug Puppy. I knew exactly how
[1:14:18] they did it. I dropped it into AI, and AI basically
[1:14:22] said, this is how we did it, and it was shot
[1:14:25] for shot what I said it was. The only thing AI
[1:14:29] couldn't get right was how they fucked up the
[1:14:30] shadow so bad. It was like AI didn't even realise
[1:14:33] how stupid they were with it. Like, that shadow
[1:14:35] shouldn't be there. It's like, yeah, but how
[1:14:37] did they do it? It shouldn't be there. But AI
[1:14:41] is good for detecting AI so far. So there's a
[1:14:45] thing on my editing software specifically called
[1:14:47] a scene detector. So I drop something peaks from
[1:14:51] behind the door. I did it to two guys up north.
[1:14:54] They were, oh yeah, this is really real. They
[1:14:57] were stupid enough to send me their own footage,
[1:14:59] knowing it was fake. I watched it, sent it back
[1:15:02] to them. And I was like, you've poked out a 2D
[1:15:04] image of the grudge bitch. So no, we didn't.
[1:15:10] So you did. And there were eight cuts for you
[1:15:11] to do it. Are you lying? I was like, well, I'm
[1:15:14] not, because an AI scene detector has picked
[1:15:16] up on the eight cuts that I couldn't see. But
[1:15:19] it's because just before it pops out, before
[1:15:22] you turn back, they make sense after AI has told
[1:15:25] me where it is. I said, more to the point, your
[1:15:29] photo was on the mantelpiece. You weren't at
[1:15:30] somebody else's house, or they just really like
[1:15:32] you and your wife. Isn't it funny that some of
[1:15:38] these top five videos, top ten videos, whatever,
[1:15:40] the... Like the girl from The Ring or The Grudge.
[1:15:49] How often that appears as an entity in the back
[1:15:53] of a video. So what the fuck? How's that? Not
[1:15:56] only that, but how is it appearing in the UK?
[1:16:00] People going ghost hunting in UK forests and
[1:16:03] woodlands and stuff, being like hunting a skinwalker.
[1:16:06] It was like, that's Staffordshire. You've got
[1:16:09] to go to the Navajo. You're on the wrong continent,
[1:16:13] you lunatic. Oh, we're going after this cryptid
[1:16:17] or this ghost. It's like you're in the wrong
[1:16:19] region, the wrong part of the world. If you're
[1:16:23] going to bullshit, at least do a little bit of
[1:16:25] research so it's not immediately obvious to everyone
[1:16:29] with a brain cell. So you mentioned 30 East Drive
[1:16:35] as a venue or location. where you've had experience,
[1:16:42] and that care home. You went to Priest Cottage.
[1:16:46] We went to Priest Cottage a couple of weeks after
[1:16:49] it became a public thing. So we went there and
[1:16:53] private hired it, just me and Ash. And there's
[1:16:56] a weird vibe in there when we went. We went back
[1:16:59] with the twins. Yeah. And instead of live streaming
[1:17:03] straight away, because that's what we tend to
[1:17:05] do, we done a kind of seance. We had crystals
[1:17:09] out, we had candles. And we were talking and
[1:17:12] we captured a laugh on camera. We all heard it.
[1:17:17] We got it on camera. The guys, Rhiannon and FX
[1:17:22] Paranormal, got it on their cameras. And it was
[1:17:27] freaky, to say the least. And the weird things
[1:17:34] happened throughout the night, but that was like
[1:17:35] the weirdest thing. When you were at Priest Cottage,
[1:17:38] I saw your video and you were laying down on
[1:17:40] one of the morgue slab. On the slab of my back.
[1:17:42] Yeah. And then you were like, you were on one
[1:17:47] of the tables going, I could sleep here all night.
[1:17:50] How did you find Priest Cottage? I don't want
[1:17:57] to sleep the place because I think the people
[1:18:00] running it are amazing people, what they're doing
[1:18:02] for charity and all of that. It was really flat,
[1:18:05] really flat when I went. But that doesn't mean
[1:18:09] that it's not haunted. It's just my experience
[1:18:11] on that one night. Initially, I found myself
[1:18:15] a bit on edge, which I don't get. It was a bit
[1:18:18] like, oh, I don't know. There's something about
[1:18:21] it. But it wasn't the basement. It was the living
[1:18:23] room. I just didn't like the living room for
[1:18:25] a little bit of time. But then you acclimatize
[1:18:28] and stuff. But they've reached out to me. They
[1:18:33] want me to go back with Mike from Real Evidence
[1:18:35] and do a charity live stream with them. But basically,
[1:18:37] they told me I can go back whenever I want. And
[1:18:40] it's a bit far for me. It took me six hours to
[1:18:43] get there last time because of traffic and stuff.
[1:18:45] Are you in Wales? Yes, I'm south of South Wales.
[1:18:49] I'm borderline on the coast. Okay. But it was
[1:18:52] the traffic. It was snowing on our way up as
[1:18:55] well. And we were like, oh, shit. It took me
[1:18:57] an hour to get to Bristol and then from Bristol
[1:18:59] all the way up there. It was a horrendous drive
[1:19:03] up. Coming back was absolutely fine. But yeah,
[1:19:05] they're lovely people. It's one of those places
[1:19:08] where people I trust have had experiences there.
[1:19:11] So it's not going to be a one and done for me.
[1:19:13] Like, I mean, even the ancient Ramin that I can't
[1:19:15] stand. I've been there twice because I've got
[1:19:18] to try. But the flattest place I've ever been
[1:19:21] was the Ramin. The scariest place I've been is
[1:19:24] Ramin. Is it? It's the one place where I have.
[1:19:28] Literally shit myself. I used to be part of a
[1:19:31] team down in Oxfordshire. I'm in Whitney in Oxfordshire.
[1:19:36] We had a little group and obviously COVID fucked
[1:19:39] everything up for everybody. But before that,
[1:19:41] we went to the Ram Inn. We private hired it for
[1:19:43] the night. There were six of us. We got there.
[1:19:46] One person said, I've just seen a book move in
[1:19:49] the window up there. Could have been anything,
[1:19:50] to be fair. I got in there. We walked around
[1:19:53] and... Me and this guy were in the garage area,
[1:19:57] that sort of like garagey bit. And we heard something
[1:20:00] behind us, like a stone or something, like a
[1:20:03] weird tapping. We both looked at each other and
[1:20:05] was like, did you hear that? And I was like,
[1:20:07] yeah. So we went back to the group. But as we're
[1:20:11] going to the bar area, we both heard a growl.
[1:20:14] And from that moment on, I was on edge all night.
[1:20:19] I wouldn't even go to the loo by myself. I was
[1:20:22] like, somebody needs to stand outside the door.
[1:20:25] It was horrendous. But I'd been before, and it
[1:20:29] was okay. Stuff happened, but it was okay. But
[1:20:32] that night was the scariest. I've never even
[1:20:36] had to debunk anything there, because literally
[1:20:39] the building was just completely silent both
[1:20:42] times I went. And the first time I went, I went
[1:20:45] with Staffies, who, you know, James is a believer,
[1:20:47] Rhian is not. So I was like, you know, that's
[1:20:50] a better mix for me. The second time I went,
[1:20:53] you know, four debunkers. And people are like,
[1:20:56] oh, well, it's not going to happen when you're
[1:20:58] there because you're all four to bunkers. I'm
[1:20:59] like, it's not how the paranormal works, surely.
[1:21:02] Because how many people will tell you, I didn't
[1:21:04] believe in ghosts until, or I don't believe in
[1:21:07] ghosts. But those stories are the incredible
[1:21:10] ones. But that's the only, I've never, I'm not
[1:21:14] psychic. I don't get vibes and all that sort
[1:21:17] of stuff. But 30s Drivers made me have a bit
[1:21:19] of a, oh, I don't know about that. It's done
[1:21:21] it to me twice. The priest's cottage a little
[1:21:26] bit when I first walked in. Ancient Ram Inn,
[1:21:29] I was just like, there it is. Fuck all year.
[1:21:31] And apart from you, everybody else I've spoken
[1:21:34] to that's been there have all said the same thing.
[1:21:36] Nobody, hardly anyone has anything there, which,
[1:21:40] you know, it doesn't mean there's not anything
[1:21:43] there, but it seems to be one of those places
[1:21:47] that's far more missed than any of the others
[1:21:49] for most people. No, I agree. I agree. So, Is
[1:21:55] there any place or any location that you'd really
[1:21:58] like to go to? So it doesn't have to be UK, anywhere
[1:22:02] that you think that will be the location there
[1:22:05] where if anything's going to happen, it's going
[1:22:07] to happen. The big one for me would be Alcatraz.
[1:22:11] And I'm kind of cheating because there's two
[1:22:14] reasons for it. I'd like to go. I'd like to take
[1:22:17] all of the teams that I trust, enjoy and have
[1:22:20] worked with and would work with. All go, they
[1:22:23] just do this massive investigation for like a
[1:22:25] week. Architraze to ourselves, because it's massive.
[1:22:29] Well, then the last day, give everyone paintball
[1:22:31] guns and be like, let's play Call of Duty in
[1:22:33] real time. I know the map inside out from Call
[1:22:37] of Duty. But at the same point, it's like, that
[1:22:41] was one of the most horrendous prisons. And it's,
[1:22:44] you know, there's rumoured hauntings in a lot
[1:22:46] of the buildings there. It's just one of those
[1:22:49] things to have to get a helicopter out. That
[1:22:51] would be amazing. To have Alcatraz Island, it's
[1:22:56] probably the most famous prison in the world
[1:22:58] for most people. And then the little Call of
[1:23:01] Duty aspect of it. And I'm like, can you imagine
[1:23:04] a bunch of 45 -year -old men running, thinking
[1:23:06] they can play Call of Duty, and then you're like...
[1:23:08] Hip goes, hip goes. I can't. Yeah, Alcatraz would
[1:23:16] be the ultimate for me. But depending on who
[1:23:20] owns it, I'd like to do The Conjuring House.
[1:23:23] If Jason gets The Conjuring House and if the
[1:23:27] scientific element starts up where he allows
[1:23:29] the Centre for Inquiry to put something there
[1:23:31] so they can measure the ground and all of that,
[1:23:34] I would love to get involved in that. Jason's
[1:23:35] promised me I can get involved in that. That's
[1:23:39] high up on the list as well. But if that clown
[1:23:42] and the comedian take it... Matt Rife, isn't
[1:23:46] it? Is it Matt Rife? Matt Rife and Elton Casties.
[1:23:49] I'll have nothing to do with it. Yeah. There's
[1:23:51] a great documentary on Amazon Prime about the
[1:23:54] Cundren house that this small team went to to
[1:23:56] do proper investigation out. I can't remember
[1:23:59] what it is for the life of me. It's Entity 7
[1:24:02] Joe Vitale and Matt... I can't remember his name.
[1:24:08] I don't know. They used some light thing in the
[1:24:10] forest and... some device that measures lower
[1:24:15] light frequencies. I can't remember what it's
[1:24:17] called. Hell on Earth? No, that was the song.
[1:24:21] I know you're on about it. It's Joe Vitale. He's
[1:24:23] got a YouTube channel called Entity 7, but he
[1:24:26] works with a guy called Matt something. Me and
[1:24:29] him don't get along so well. But the documentary
[1:24:32] was good. Yeah, I enjoyed that. But he's got
[1:24:35] the weird helmet on. Any other ways of stab vest
[1:24:43] or a helmet investigate. And I'm like, what are
[1:24:45] you doing? Nobody's ever been stabbed by a ghost.
[1:24:48] Stop it. No, no. But he's well prepared just
[1:24:51] in case. So before we sort of wrap up the conversation,
[1:24:59] is there any piece of footage or any channel
[1:25:04] that you've been sent, say, multiple times where
[1:25:07] people have gone, this must be bullshit, that
[1:25:09] you've... watched and you're like i can't i can't
[1:25:14] see either how they've done it or it is actually
[1:25:17] what they say is is there do you get those yeah
[1:25:22] um i can't always tell exactly how things are
[1:25:27] done but you get it you get an idea and you're
[1:25:28] like oh that's clearly bullshit one of my favorite
[1:25:31] ones i was sent was people i made friends with
[1:25:34] after loads of people sent me the same clip Adelaide
[1:25:38] Haunted Horizons, they faked the doll coming
[1:25:40] down the stairs at 30 East Drive. And I was like,
[1:25:42] right, send it to me. So I looked at the clip
[1:25:44] and I was like, it looks sus. Hang on, how old
[1:25:49] is this woman? No disrespect to Alison, but she's
[1:25:53] not in her younger years. And I'm like, but this
[1:25:57] wasn't a pre -recorded video. This was a live
[1:25:59] stream it was taken from. So if she had set up
[1:26:02] wires, there is no way could she have avoided
[1:26:04] them because I've tried. I've tried all of the
[1:26:07] fake. to see how they've done it. I can't call
[1:26:10] it fake if I can't do it. I was like, there's
[1:26:13] no way she's done that. As it is, I think it's
[1:26:15] probably just the doll is top heavy and gravity's
[1:26:18] done its thing. Those stays, things come down
[1:26:20] them all the time. But back then, 30s drive to
[1:26:23] stays were fucking creepy to me. And I got excited
[1:26:26] when the pram came down when I was there. And
[1:26:28] I still, other debunkers will tell me it's vibration,
[1:26:31] it's micro movement. And I'm like, I don't know.
[1:26:33] It seemed to go up a little bit for me. Like
[1:26:35] it was slapped. It is what it is. I'm not telling
[1:26:39] people it's paranormal, but I'm certainly not
[1:26:41] going to write it off as the carpet sprung because
[1:26:44] that carpet is fucked. Yeah. But yeah, loads
[1:26:48] of people. She's faked it. She's faked it. She's
[1:26:50] faked it. I'm like, you're looking at a clip.
[1:26:51] You're not looking at the entire video, which
[1:26:53] is something people don't realize I do. I don't
[1:26:55] just look at the clip. I look at the entire video
[1:26:57] to get a feel for them. And I'm like, this is
[1:26:59] a woman in her 60s on her own in 30s drive. with
[1:27:03] a video camera in one hand for a recorded video
[1:27:06] and a phone in the other hand for a live stream,
[1:27:08] and she's pulled a string how. Oh, she's got
[1:27:11] a friend there. Cag is with her. Cag's in Australia.
[1:27:15] So I look at her and I look at her and I'm like,
[1:27:18] I can't tell you it's a ghost, but I can tell
[1:27:20] you with certainty she did not fake it. There
[1:27:23] is no evidence at all for me to suggest that
[1:27:26] she has faked that in any way. And then when
[1:27:29] I've spoken to them loads and then I met up with
[1:27:32] them, worked with them, And I'm like, she is
[1:27:35] the clumsiest woman I have ever met in my life.
[1:27:37] She just falls over everything. And I was like,
[1:27:39] there's no way, absolutely no way did she rig
[1:27:42] up wires and avoid them all on a live stream
[1:27:44] without breaking her own neck. She's far too
[1:27:47] clumsy. And the other one is, again, 30s Drive,
[1:27:50] was Griff with the chest push. I've seen people
[1:27:54] say it's just the quilt moving and artifacting,
[1:27:57] which I don't believe it is. To me, the bed almost
[1:28:01] bows a little under him. It freaked me out. Obviously,
[1:28:07] they went months before I went. I think it was
[1:28:09] my third time. But the video came out the week
[1:28:13] before I went, and I was in that house, and I
[1:28:16] was calling Fred everything you can. I'm like,
[1:28:19] I want to get a violent reaction, so let's proper
[1:28:21] go for it. I had to cut most of my video. I went
[1:28:24] that hard at it, calling him everything. Everything
[1:28:28] you can think of that would really anger a man.
[1:28:30] I went that far with it. I sat on the sofa about
[1:28:33] three o 'clock in the morning. The couple I was
[1:28:35] there with, they were like, oh, we only live
[1:28:37] like eight miles away, so we're off. And I went,
[1:28:39] all right, cool. And I went, what? I've just
[1:28:42] been shit -talking Fred for nine hours. What
[1:28:44] do you mean you're going? And it wasn't quite
[1:28:47] that. That's more of a comedic take on it. But
[1:28:49] they left and they were like, just post the keys
[1:28:51] to Carol's letterbox. I was like, all right.
[1:28:52] I sat there for an hour. I heard a little bang
[1:28:55] upstairs, which was probably Carol or Carol farting
[1:28:58] or something. And I went, I can't stay. And I
[1:29:02] walked out of there. I posted the keys to the
[1:29:04] letterbox. I got in my car. It's a four and a
[1:29:07] half, five hour drive for me with, you know,
[1:29:09] no traffic. And I'm driving home. I got the Birmingham
[1:29:13] sort of area. I was like, oh, Steve will be awake
[1:29:16] now. And I rang him. He said, something happened.
[1:29:18] And I went, no. He said, is that your car egg
[1:29:21] in the air? He said, it just set off of you.
[1:29:23] I was like, no, I'm halfway home. He said, what
[1:29:25] happened? I said, I've been calling out all night.
[1:29:27] I'm sat on this sofa. And then I just had this
[1:29:30] image of the chest pushed for a griff. And it
[1:29:32] freaked me the fuck out. And I was like, I can't
[1:29:34] stay. And I was kicking myself all the way home.
[1:29:36] Like, why did you leave when you're scared? If
[1:29:39] you're scared, something may happen. And I left
[1:29:41] like a right coward. I was like, I shouldn't,
[1:29:44] I regret it. But at the same point, it's the
[1:29:47] power of that video. It freaked me the fuck,
[1:29:51] it scared Griff. That's the bit other people
[1:29:53] don't realize is we all talk behind the scenes.
[1:29:56] And for Griff to be that worried about it, not
[1:29:59] that it was a ghost. that he's a large man and
[1:30:02] it may have been a heart issue. So he went to
[1:30:05] the doctor. Griff is a very... Every bit as bolsterous
[1:30:08] as you see on camera, that's how he is in real
[1:30:09] life, goes to the doctor, throws his phone on
[1:30:12] the table and goes, what the fuck is that? Because
[1:30:15] he was concerned that it was something to do
[1:30:18] with his heart angina or his lungs because he's
[1:30:20] got sleep apnea. He was genuinely concerned from
[1:30:23] a health concern. The doctor went, I don't know.
[1:30:27] And that... That has stuck with me that potentially
[1:30:31] something could have put this weight on him in
[1:30:33] a bedroom in there. And that's the bedroom I
[1:30:35] always sleep in because it's the scary one. But
[1:30:38] yeah, I couldn't debunk it. Other people have
[1:30:41] said it could be this. Nobody's definitively
[1:30:43] said that's exactly what it is. Lots of ideas.
[1:30:46] None of them are wrong. Well, maybe they're all
[1:30:48] wrong, but that's the whole point of it. But
[1:30:50] yeah, that freaked me out. And that's the one
[1:30:52] where I'm like, didn't like that whatsoever.
[1:30:58] Weird. Weird. I think we need to go back to 30s
[1:31:01] drive again. Yeah, definitely would. Definitely
[1:31:04] would. So thank you so much for tonight. So for
[1:31:09] people who don't know your channel, there can't
[1:31:13] be that many that don't know you, especially
[1:31:14] in the paranormal community in the UK. Most people
[1:31:17] know who you are. But we have 60 % of our listeners
[1:31:23] are in America. So there might be some that don't.
[1:31:26] Don't know where to find you. So where can people
[1:31:29] find you? What platforms? We're in the show notes
[1:31:34] as well. Yeah. Right. So it's Beardo Gascade
[1:31:37] on YouTube. I've also got a second channel, but
[1:31:40] it's nothing to do with the paranormal. It's
[1:31:42] just all my geeky stuff and fun stuff. And it's
[1:31:45] a more lighthearted version of me. That's called
[1:31:49] Beardo's Man Cave. I'm on Facebook as Beardo
[1:31:53] Gascade, where I let rip. a bit more than my
[1:31:56] YouTube, just with funny memes and stuff. I've
[1:32:00] just gone to Rumble as well with Beardo Gets
[1:32:02] the Truth. But I'm just re -uploading stuff there
[1:32:06] because I'm worried about the future of YouTube
[1:32:08] with the way it's going with the monetizing and
[1:32:11] everyone's views decreasing by 50 % in four months.
[1:32:15] It seems silly to put all my eggs in one basket.
[1:32:18] But yeah, Beardo Gets Scared pretty much everywhere.
[1:32:20] But Rumble, Beardo Gets the Truth. One thing
[1:32:24] I would like to put out there, though, is that
[1:32:27] whilst I am a debunker, I am a paranormal investigator
[1:32:30] at heart. I only want to remove the false from
[1:32:35] a claim. I want the truth. And if I've got to
[1:32:38] tear people apart to get to it, I'll do it. But
[1:32:41] I believe in the paranormal. I want the paranormal
[1:32:43] to be real. And I want to prove it for me. So,
[1:32:47] yeah, it's not about that's fake. Everything's
[1:32:51] fake. That's not what I do. Yeah. Okay. And beforehand,
[1:32:57] me and Ash were saying that I think we're going
[1:32:59] to have a good conversation with you because
[1:33:01] you're a debunker, but you're also a paranormal
[1:33:05] investigator. And like you said, you're here
[1:33:09] to remove the bullshit and call out the fake
[1:33:12] and try and prove the power. And that's what
[1:33:14] we're all in it for. We're trying to find that
[1:33:15] holy grail for ourselves. We've spoken to a lot
[1:33:19] of people who have had paranormal experiences.
[1:33:22] and sometimes it you mentioned it as well it's
[1:33:25] not people don't really get it until it happens
[1:33:28] to them and then they go oh people have a paranormal
[1:33:32] experience and it can be completely personal
[1:33:35] to them like you see in that spirit when you're
[1:33:38] younger that that's the kind of stuff that will
[1:33:41] stay with you yeah it's life -changing it's life
[1:33:44] -changing for people my mum was a staunch skeptic
[1:33:48] all of her life Two years ago, she came into
[1:33:51] the living room. I will never, ever tell her
[1:33:53] story because it's hers. She told me what happened
[1:33:58] and said, I need you to debunk that. I went,
[1:34:00] I can't. Why? I said, number one, I wasn't there.
[1:34:03] Number two, I'm a video analyst, if anything.
[1:34:06] Number three, I don't want to take that from
[1:34:09] you, even if I could, because you needed that.
[1:34:13] Believe it. By all means, believe it. And my
[1:34:15] mum believes she saw a ghost, a full -bodied
[1:34:17] apparition that meant something to her. And I'm
[1:34:19] like, I'll never take that. I don't take that
[1:34:21] from anyone. I don't debunk people's personal
[1:34:23] experiences. If somebody comes to me and says,
[1:34:26] I'm scared, I'll get them the help they need.
[1:34:29] There was a guy in America, a well -known, a
[1:34:33] very famous paranormal channel, went to his house,
[1:34:35] scared the shit out of him, convinced him he
[1:34:37] had a demon. Obviously, I can't go there and
[1:34:40] help him. I'm not mentally health -chained. I'll
[1:34:42] never do a private residence. I'll never do it
[1:34:46] because I've got to understand the impact of
[1:34:48] saying it is or isn't haunted on somebody's mental
[1:34:50] health. So I put him in touch with somebody that
[1:34:53] does understand that, that went to his home,
[1:34:55] convinced him that it, in fact, wasn't haunted.
[1:34:57] It was all to do with infrasound because of railway
[1:35:00] lines. And we potentially saved that guy's life
[1:35:03] because he was at his wit's end. It cost him
[1:35:05] his marriage. His marriage is back on track.
[1:35:08] And the other one was a guy in the UK. I'm getting
[1:35:10] all these experiences and I'm like, have you
[1:35:12] ever had your boiler checked? No. That's the
[1:35:15] first thing I tell everyone. Get a carbon monoxide
[1:35:17] detector. The reason his pets wouldn't go in
[1:35:20] this bedroom and the reason his daughter was
[1:35:22] having sleepless nights was carbon monoxide.
[1:35:24] And he's like, you've saved my daughter's life.
[1:35:26] No, I just gave you advice. You saved your daughter's
[1:35:29] life by asking and not just assuming it's a ghost.
[1:35:36] Yeah. That's really cool that you did that. and
[1:35:40] give him that advice, to be fair. And it's a
[1:35:43] shame that people will want to believe so much
[1:35:49] that they thought it was a spirit rather than
[1:35:52] anything else. And I think that's one good thing
[1:35:55] about being a debunker or being a paranormal
[1:35:57] investigator, that something will happen, and
[1:36:02] I know we're like, oh, how did that happen? Can
[1:36:05] we replicate that again? Because if we can replicate
[1:36:08] it, chances are, especially in the moment, chances
[1:36:12] are it's normal. If we can't replicate it, then
[1:36:15] first of all, okay, something has happened. Whatever
[1:36:19] it is, it's happened. And then we'll have a look
[1:36:22] and we'll, like at the lodge, I was under the
[1:36:26] table. Yeah. Touching the table, I've got videos
[1:36:29] of when the sound's going off, I've got videos
[1:36:32] of me pointing on the table as to where it is.
[1:36:35] We're changing seats, all that kind of stuff
[1:36:38] to try and not necessarily disprove, but to prove
[1:36:44] that what was happening was paranormal as well.
[1:36:47] By disproving the normal, you can reveal the
[1:36:52] abnormal. So you look at... Absolutely everything.
[1:36:57] You've got to take into account every variable,
[1:36:59] every variation. And I don't believe you can
[1:37:02] do it in one visit, which is why I'll never say
[1:37:04] somewhere is or isn't haunted. I believe there's
[1:37:07] a few places I've been to where there is something
[1:37:09] going on. I just don't know what that something
[1:37:11] is. I'd love to know. I mean, I'd love to get
[1:37:14] under that table and have seismos on everyone's
[1:37:17] shoes and stuff. I reckon they'd probably let
[1:37:19] me in all because they seem. quite open to it.
[1:37:23] Oh, 100 % they were. Then that's the other bit.
[1:37:26] They're absolutely happy for you to do whatever.
[1:37:28] We've got a microphone. We've got some small
[1:37:30] microphones that we've just ordered. So we're
[1:37:33] going to put them on the table to see if we can
[1:37:35] sort of triangulate sound or we've got cameras
[1:37:39] going to be put. How many have you got? How many
[1:37:41] microphones have you got? Well, between us, we'll
[1:37:45] have maybe four or five. I've got a few as well.
[1:37:50] Yeah. So then we can start to, if we position
[1:37:53] them around the room, we can obviously try and
[1:37:56] understand from the loudness of each one and
[1:37:58] where it happens. We're pointing at the shoes.
[1:38:02] Yeah. Not just catch them out, but to discount
[1:38:07] it. If you get a knock and it's not coming from
[1:38:09] the shoes, we can write that off, move on to
[1:38:12] the next. And they're open for that. That's the
[1:38:16] mad thing, is that they'll come and do whatever
[1:38:19] you want to do. Yeah, I've got time for people
[1:38:21] like that. Which is great. And I know, Ash, I
[1:38:25] was complete sceptic. But once you've been there,
[1:38:29] Ash, we'll see. We'll see next time. This time
[1:38:32] tomorrow. This time tomorrow. I'll send you an
[1:38:34] email, Beardo, saying he's converted. Yeah, I
[1:38:38] want to hear either he's converted or, oh, bollocks.
[1:38:41] Yeah, yeah, we've called it. But, yeah, no, really
[1:38:45] appreciate your time tonight. It's been great
[1:38:47] to get to know the person other than the mass
[1:38:52] debunker that we see on the YouTube channel.
[1:38:55] So I do appreciate you taking the time to come
[1:38:57] and speak to us. It's been good. I enjoyed it.
[1:39:01] Yeah, well, you'll have to come back on again.
[1:39:03] We like to have people on for like a second.
[1:39:06] interview because then we've we've done all that
[1:39:08] the intro bit we can get into more more conversational
[1:39:11] about the paranormal and like the the extra dimensional
[1:39:17] stuff we're massively into that as proponents
[1:39:21] of of stuff time slips time um you'll see tomorrow
[1:39:27] ash when we talk about time it's it's wild there
[1:39:31] we got down to believe that we were speaking
[1:39:35] to somebody from 1936 Don't ask me how we got
[1:39:40] there, but you'll see tomorrow how we got there.
[1:39:43] That they were actually communicating with us
[1:39:45] and thought we were the dead ones and they were
[1:39:47] alive. And they were using a Ouija board to communicate
[1:39:50] with us. See, that's one of those mad ones, isn't
[1:39:53] it? It's fucked up. I've had those conversations
[1:39:56] with people. Do you think that we are the ghosts?
[1:39:58] Yeah, and they were coming out saying they were
[1:40:01] alive and that we were dead. So we changed our
[1:40:05] questions. as though we were the ghosts asking
[1:40:09] questions. It was fucked. Honestly, that's blew
[1:40:13] my fucking mind. I'm not going to lie. I wonder
[1:40:15] how many times, if it's something to do with
[1:40:18] time, where you go, can you copy me? And you
[1:40:20] go, and then somebody's in the living room like,
[1:40:23] it's done it again. Fuck, we need to get a paranormal
[1:40:28] team in. But, yeah, no, really do appreciate
[1:40:31] your time. It's been great. I wish you all continued
[1:40:34] success on your channel because I've watched
[1:40:37] it grow over the years, and it's great to see
[1:40:39] the paranormal get in recognition because it
[1:40:44] is still fairly niche. People don't like to talk
[1:40:46] about it. Although it's more mainstream now,
[1:40:48] people still a bit. It's one of them topics that
[1:40:52] scares a lot of people. So, yeah, good work,
[1:40:55] and hopefully we'll speak soon. Yeah, will do.
[1:40:58] Thanks for having me on. Cheers, Ash.

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