# Hothouse w/ Aya Cash

An episode of [That's Messed Up: An SVU Podcast](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1540370040), 17 Mar 2026, 2 h 12 min.

Audio: https://podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/cf7e6913-a01e-4666-a095-b24c0047c637/a5c6d960-34c2-4313-aac1-b40f00e872e6/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=c3a2c876-20bf-449b-8d54-b24c0047c64d

Today, Kara and Liza tackle the episode “Hothouse” (Season 10, Episode 12) and the disturbing real-life murder of teenager Kirsten Costas. Plus, they have a lovely chat with the wonderful Aya Cash (The Boys, You're the Worst). SOURCES: Los Angeles Times The New York Times Time United Press International WHAT WOULD SISTER PEG DO: SAMHSA’s National Helpline Next week’s episode will be “Reasonable Doubt” (Season 15, Episode 22). Support this podcast by shopping our latest sponsor deals and promotions at this link: https://bit.ly/3yb7hqu See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

## Transcript

[0:00] Speaker 1: Of the Law and Order franchises, SVU is considered especially watchable.
[0:04] Speaker 2: We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the
[0:07] Speaker 2: vicious felonies. These episodes are based on. These are our stories, done.
[0:11] Speaker 3: Done, yays, that's messed up an SVU podcast.
[0:34] Speaker 1: I'm Liza Tragger and I'm Kara Klank And every week
[0:38] Speaker 1: it's SVU. It's true crime, it's interviews with people from
[0:42] Speaker 1: the show, and it's chatting in gossip. To be honest
[0:45] Speaker 1: at the beginning.
[0:46] Speaker 2: Yeah, it's jam packed. It's jam packed. Today, Casey's watched
[0:49] Speaker 2: Cheated Rivalry. I have huge news. Kara came in saying
[0:53] Speaker 2: she's got something. I mean, we're here to chat, yeah,
[0:58] Speaker 2: but I can't. We fucked up the intro. I fucked
[1:02] Speaker 2: up the chords. I didn't plug the.
[1:03] Speaker 1: Cord in like.
[1:05] Speaker 2: I'll never blame weed for my behavior, but it's something
[1:08] Speaker 2: to question. It's something the question when really regular things
[1:12] Speaker 2: get me down. And I did just post this on
[1:14] Speaker 2: Instagram and I can't believe this happened. But like my lock,
[1:17] Speaker 2: you have to really press and go up into the left.
[1:19] Speaker 2: And sometimes I'm wasted and too powerful and I bend
[1:23] Speaker 2: the key and then it's an issue. So then I
[1:25] Speaker 2: go to the locksmith and they're taking it personal. They're like,
[1:28] Speaker 2: our keys are key. I go, your key making is fine?
[1:32] Speaker 2: I go, it's me, it's the door. I'm aggressive, it's
[1:35] Speaker 2: not you. They're like so self conscious. And then they
[1:37] Speaker 2: lured out so much information. He knows where I live,
[1:40] Speaker 2: the in between streets, my super and my management company.
[1:43] Speaker 2: And I'm like, I can't believe I just told him
[1:46] Speaker 2: everything when we have a crime podcast and I know
[1:48] Speaker 2: not to give out. As I was speaking and saying it,
[1:50] Speaker 2: I'm like, why are you telling the locksmith where you live?
[1:53] Speaker 1: Yeah? Like right before we hopped on this, I like
[1:56] Speaker 1: opened my sigh and your video came up right away,
[1:59] Speaker 1: and I was like, oh, oh no, I don't know
[2:01] Speaker 1: what happened. Like anyone can be.
[2:02] Speaker 2: Manipulated, is all I'm saying. Like I'm on edge all times,
[2:05] Speaker 2: I'm suspicious, and I gave him everything, but I love
[2:08] Speaker 2: my super.
[2:09] Speaker 1: It was just an easy way to get information out.
[2:11] Speaker 1: I don't know. Wow, So if anything happens, he has
[2:15] Speaker 1: climbed on in.
[2:16] Speaker 2: And found me. But he must just be friendly. I
[2:19] Speaker 2: think he's a friendly locksmith or a murderer who's to say,
[2:24] Speaker 2: who's to say?
[2:24] Speaker 1: I don't know. I feel like locksmiths must be under
[2:30] Speaker 1: don't they have more? They have to probably like register themselves.
[2:34] Speaker 1: I mean, you can't just go around being like a
[2:36] Speaker 1: person that could break into wherever, right, Like, aren't they
[2:39] Speaker 1: isn't there like oversight of them? I don't know. I
[2:41] Speaker 1: don't know remember when I know. So a lot of
[2:44] Speaker 1: locksmithing is like a full scam as well. We've talked
[2:46] Speaker 1: about this is an old school, this is like a
[2:48] Speaker 1: brick and mortar. But yeah, I have been scammed and
[2:51] Speaker 1: spent over seven hundred dollars to drill open a lot.
[2:54] Speaker 1: But the god they're immoral because I didn't I couldn't
[2:57] Speaker 1: prove I was staying there. I was staying at a
[2:58] Speaker 1: friend's house. So thank god they opened the door. You're like,
[3:02] Speaker 1: enough money, well we'll let you in anywhere.
[3:05] Speaker 2: Well, you know, when I get spot pay, I just
[3:06] Speaker 2: have hundreds and so it's like, sorry, unrelatable, but like
[3:09] Speaker 2: that is how I make money. And so I think
[3:11] Speaker 2: he saw the wads of cash in my hands and
[3:15] Speaker 2: now knows where you live. No separate, these are separate.
[3:18] Speaker 2: The one with a scam. This guy's he's like you
[3:20] Speaker 2: live in the neighborhood. Who's your super I know all
[3:22] Speaker 2: the guys. Yeah, friendly, And then all of a sudden,
[3:25] Speaker 2: I go, I'm giving you my cross streets.
[3:28] Speaker 1: This is this is insane. Yeah, okay, shame. We can
[3:34] Speaker 1: hope for the best. We can hope for the best.
[3:36] Speaker 1: What's up? Well, I am excited to Casey watch heat rivalry.
[3:41] Speaker 1: I went to a birthday party of our friend Steph
[3:44] Speaker 1: Toolev over the weekend and I was with a lot
[3:47] Speaker 1: of Canadians and non Canadians, but there was a lot
[3:50] Speaker 1: of heated rivalry talk and uh, yeah, I'm excited to
[3:54] Speaker 1: hear what Casey. I saw Sophie Buttle and she said
[3:57] Speaker 1: that two of the people like people that have small
[4:00] Speaker 1: all our parts in it, our comedians and she knows
[4:02] Speaker 1: them and stuff. So it's exciting.
[4:04] Speaker 2: I mean, any Canadian that's not behind it, I'll kill him.
[4:07] Speaker 1: JK. Steph still hasn't watched now. I know.
[4:11] Speaker 2: I know she's going to get now. She's she's doing
[4:14] Speaker 2: it out of protest. She's so annoying. Everyone's annoying. Who
[4:16] Speaker 2: doesn't watch it, Casey, You're off the annoying list, You're
[4:19] Speaker 2: on the beloved list now.
[4:21] Speaker 1: What are your thoughts, Casey, I would say, I'm like,
[4:25] Speaker 1: legitimately nervous for you right now, Like I don't know
[4:27] Speaker 1: what you could say.
[4:28] Speaker 2: I don't know what you could face. Before we started
[4:31] Speaker 2: when he told me, and I go, you didn't like it?
[4:32] Speaker 2: I could see it all over your face, and he goes,
[4:34] Speaker 2: why would you say that? And look at him now, pausing, pausing.
[4:37] Speaker 4: Honestly, I would say, I absolutely loved it. Okay, really,
[4:43] Speaker 4: I thought it was fabulous. Yes, I thought it was
[4:47] Speaker 4: I thought it was incredible. I was moved to tears
[4:50] Speaker 4: several times. I thought it was here's I have a
[4:54] Speaker 4: real problem with I'm having like an existential crisis with
[4:57] Speaker 4: television right now. We're like so many percent television shows.
[5:01] Speaker 4: It's like her, It's like Judy McCree was saying, She's like,
[5:04] Speaker 4: nothing happens. I have that same problem. But I felt
[5:08] Speaker 4: like he did Rivalry. Every episode was like vital and
[5:13] Speaker 4: full and great, and so I loved it. I thought
[5:16] Speaker 4: this was a great use of like the mini series format,
[5:19] Speaker 4: and I was, yeah, I was totally moved and I
[5:22] Speaker 4: loved it.
[5:23] Speaker 1: I loved it.
[5:23] Speaker 4: I love that, you said, Lisa, you said you said
[5:27] Speaker 4: that you didn't like the storyline, you didn't care about the.
[5:30] Speaker 2: Oh, but I take it back, because after I read
[5:32] Speaker 2: the book, I like love Scott and Kidnaw so much.
[5:34] Speaker 1: Like after I reading the book, I was.
[5:35] Speaker 4: Gonna say that, but that that the the episode where
[5:40] Speaker 4: Kip comes out of this I mean, spoiler alert.
[5:44] Speaker 2: Spoiling these people know if they haven't seen the memes.
[5:47] Speaker 1: When Kip comes out of the stands, I mean the
[5:50] Speaker 1: longest walkdown in history. Amazing. I loved it. Oh, I
[5:55] Speaker 1: loved that moment. No, I love it all.
[5:57] Speaker 2: It's just like I'm so into the a story that
[6:00] Speaker 2: like sometimes on my rewatches, but even with Scott and Kip,
[6:03] Speaker 2: I've still watched that episode at least eight times. It's
[6:06] Speaker 2: not like I'm not into it, but I needed to
[6:10] Speaker 2: read the books to be more deep into it. Like
[6:14] Speaker 2: I like, because people are saying the long Game the
[6:16] Speaker 2: next book is so much and they're like, we need
[6:17] Speaker 2: more episodes than Jacob's. Like, no, I'd rather jam pack
[6:20] Speaker 2: six and see how much I can put in then
[6:22] Speaker 2: like make it longer and so it's interesting, stretch it out.
[6:27] Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, it didn't feel stretched out at all.
[6:31] Speaker 1: And did you love the cinematography and acting, and.
[6:35] Speaker 4: I thought it looked it's very you know, I feel
[6:37] Speaker 4: like people these are the things I heard before, not
[6:39] Speaker 4: from you, but like people were like, it's softcore porn.
[6:44] Speaker 1: It's hard as.
[6:45] Speaker 2: Kara and her family says, soft smooth brand pudding heads.
[6:50] Speaker 4: Maybe I'm just like you know, I'm in those like
[6:53] Speaker 4: extreme art house film streets. I mean, I watched a
[6:56] Speaker 4: movie recently where a guy came into his own mouth,
[6:59] Speaker 4: So I was like.
[7:00] Speaker 1: Yeah, like, I'm sorry. I grew up on skin Imax,
[7:03] Speaker 1: Like we were seeing like a ton more twenty years
[7:07] Speaker 1: ago than we see even see in this show. You
[7:10] Speaker 1: don't see it.
[7:11] Speaker 4: So I was like yeah, But I was like, it's
[7:14] Speaker 4: sexual because it needs to be, because that's like the
[7:16] Speaker 4: trajectory of the relationship. But I didn't feel like it
[7:19] Speaker 4: was even like over the top. It was like for
[7:22] Speaker 4: the plot, So that was one thing I was like,
[7:24] Speaker 4: that's not like that. And then I didn't find it
[7:27] Speaker 4: very soapy at all. I found it very like grounded
[7:31] Speaker 4: and emotionally like. Everything felt very organic and like I
[7:37] Speaker 4: loved that scene where Hollanders talking to his girlfriend I
[7:40] Speaker 4: guess or the woman he's like dating and she and
[7:43] Speaker 4: he's just like like shaking his head and like you
[7:46] Speaker 4: can see the tears in his eyes. I mean it
[7:48] Speaker 4: was incredible. I mean there were some really beautiful moments
[7:51] Speaker 4: in this.
[7:51] Speaker 1: Wow, you really had me. I thought you're gonna have
[7:53] Speaker 1: some criticisms. Well, and the music in that scene is
[7:56] Speaker 1: so good.
[7:57] Speaker 4: And all music is really good and it all looks
[8:00] Speaker 4: really tight, and like it reminded me of like a
[8:03] Speaker 4: Steven Soderberg or like even like a David Fincher movie,
[8:06] Speaker 4: Like it just felt like very technically.
[8:09] Speaker 1: Sound, and uh, yeah, it was great. I loved it.
[8:13] Speaker 1: I don't know what else to say. Casey gives it
[8:16] Speaker 1: two thumbs up. The lighting is so good.
[8:19] Speaker 2: I love when it like the I mean the beginning
[8:21] Speaker 2: start of the show is like so dark tonally and
[8:24] Speaker 2: then not talk about like the tones, like the lighting,
[8:27] Speaker 2: and then in the cottage just the full sunlight or
[8:29] Speaker 2: even in my in Florida, like I just loved the
[8:31] Speaker 2: sunshine like metaphorically and the song stuff and kept coming
[8:35] Speaker 2: down but also just like all the sunshine. And then
[8:38] Speaker 2: today I saw a new meme where Jacob Tierney, I
[8:40] Speaker 2: guess the note he told or the way he talks
[8:42] Speaker 2: about Shane at the cottage He's like, it's like a
[8:44] Speaker 2: puppy learning how to play, and I was like, that's
[8:46] Speaker 2: like so cute.
[8:49] Speaker 4: I think my one criticism, which is like a very
[8:51] Speaker 4: silly criticism, is like I think the first two episodes,
[8:54] Speaker 4: there was like so many like two months later, three months, Yeah,
[8:59] Speaker 4: I did not know where I was like, we don't
[9:01] Speaker 4: need I was like, I don't need that exactly.
[9:03] Speaker 2: I don't know you do, because I think it's like,
[9:06] Speaker 2: because even how the relationship progresses, it's they don't see
[9:09] Speaker 2: each other for months at a time, they are they're
[9:11] Speaker 2: they're see each other two three times a year.
[9:13] Speaker 1: Without that, you would without that, you would almost like
[9:16] Speaker 1: you would almost create the illusion that they're seeing each
[9:19] Speaker 1: other week after week at different games or whatever, but
[9:22] Speaker 1: they're not.
[9:22] Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, yeah, no, I mean I think it's probably necessary,
[9:26] Speaker 4: but it almost got I was just kind of like, okay,
[9:28] Speaker 4: we're going like it just kind of became kind of
[9:30] Speaker 4: like silly to me.
[9:31] Speaker 2: But I loved watching their faces text like, I did
[9:35] Speaker 2: really love watching their face show expressions as they were.
[9:38] Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean I can understand why there's such a frenzy.
[9:40] Speaker 4: I mean those two leads, I mean, you really fall
[9:43] Speaker 4: in love with them. I mean, they're just such beautiful men.
[9:46] Speaker 4: They're great love.
[9:47] Speaker 2: I'm just so glad you get a case because I
[9:49] Speaker 2: think you were kind of like, what's going on with Lisa.
[9:51] Speaker 2: We're worried, but you understand why people would be in love.
[9:56] Speaker 1: Well, I think he's still probably worried at.
[9:58] Speaker 4: Yeah, still slightly worried, but I understand friend worried.
[10:02] Speaker 1: I mean, he's probably listened to a Taylor Swift song
[10:03] Speaker 1: that he likes also, but you know, I think there's
[10:05] Speaker 1: still some worry there. That's probably fine.
[10:08] Speaker 2: No, before you got on, I told him, I'm like,
[10:10] Speaker 2: I've read six Rachel read books.
[10:11] Speaker 1: I'm on my seventh. And he said, all the years
[10:13] Speaker 1: i've known you, I've never heard you once say you've
[10:15] Speaker 1: read a book. I go, I know you famously say
[10:18] Speaker 1: I don't read. I mean like that, like, yeah, this
[10:21] Speaker 1: book is. I was telling them at the party because
[10:24] Speaker 1: I was seeing like people that you know and uh
[10:27] Speaker 1: like our friend Emily and some other people, and I
[10:31] Speaker 1: was like, yeah, they're like, oh yeah, I like I
[10:34] Speaker 1: really love you the right way go. Yeah. But with
[10:37] Speaker 1: Le's it's like rewired her entire like life, like it's
[10:40] Speaker 1: like really she's I'm like, she's up in the morning,
[10:43] Speaker 1: she's like going, she's reading, like there's a lot happening.
[10:47] Speaker 1: But yeah, it's a full chemical transformation.
[10:50] Speaker 2: But let's I'm I'm going to give you guys a
[10:53] Speaker 2: chemical transformation soon.
[10:56] Speaker 1: I can't wait. I was reading this weekend also, I
[11:03] Speaker 1: randomly got you know, I always get targeted with these
[11:06] Speaker 1: like long New Yorker articles that take like days to
[11:10] Speaker 1: read because they're so fucking.
[11:11] Speaker 2: I wonder if they try to get us to read
[11:12] Speaker 2: the same one. What'd you read? I read the Ronan
[11:15] Speaker 2: Pharaoh one. You read it?
[11:17] Speaker 1: Oh, you probably posted about it.
[11:19] Speaker 2: That's how I saw it, and then clicked the Oh okay, okay.
[11:22] Speaker 2: There was another serial killer one from like twenty twenty two,
[11:25] Speaker 2: some weird one that was like heavily tried to force
[11:28] Speaker 2: down my throat on Instagram.
[11:29] Speaker 1: But go ahead, Well this guy this article is about
[11:32] Speaker 1: a serial rapist, and you know, everybody loves a serial killer,
[11:37] Speaker 1: but like this this story, like I gotta I mean,
[11:41] Speaker 1: Ronan Pharaoh, I gotta give it to him. I've read
[11:42] Speaker 1: his stuff before, but like this is like really well researched,
[11:45] Speaker 1: really well presented. And the article is called how police
[11:49] Speaker 1: let one of America's most prolific predators get away, and
[11:52] Speaker 1: it's like, I shouldn't be shocked because it's literally straight
[11:55] Speaker 1: out of an SBU. If they haven't done an SVU
[11:56] Speaker 1: on this one, I checked and I don't think they have.
[11:59] Speaker 1: But like, there were so many fucking elements of SVU,
[12:03] Speaker 1: down to the fact that at one point the police
[12:07] Speaker 1: come to present this guy with an arrest warrant and
[12:09] Speaker 1: he repels out the window with repelling equipment, and because
[12:13] Speaker 1: people in the area called him spider Man, so it
[12:16] Speaker 1: was like that episode manipulated where he escapes at one
[12:21] Speaker 1: point by getting out all the getting out the window
[12:23] Speaker 1: with repelling gear or whatever. So I was like, it
[12:26] Speaker 1: was just so sview. But there were so many points
[12:28] Speaker 1: in this article where I kept going no, like I
[12:31] Speaker 1: couldn't believe, But then I was like, why can't I believe?
[12:34] Speaker 1: Of course this is happening, But essentially it's just about
[12:36] Speaker 1: this huge cover up in Johnson City, Tennessee, where this
[12:39] Speaker 1: man was. He had friends that would go get him women,
[12:43] Speaker 1: bring them back to his place drugs and partying, and
[12:45] Speaker 1: then he would He was keeping a list. Literally. The
[12:48] Speaker 1: reason this came to this prosecutor who was the only
[12:51] Speaker 1: reason that probably anybody really even knows about this shit
[12:54] Speaker 1: at all is because this female prosecutor got obsessed with
[12:57] Speaker 1: the case to the point that she got fired because
[13:00] Speaker 1: they thought she was too obsessed with it because she
[13:02] Speaker 1: was like, why is nobody doing anything about this person?
[13:05] Speaker 1: He had a list in his apartment when they checked
[13:07] Speaker 1: it that said of women's names with the word raped
[13:11] Speaker 1: written on top. So like it's fully out of an
[13:14] Speaker 1: SVU and then his crimes get worse and worse if
[13:17] Speaker 1: you can believe it as you read the article. But
[13:20] Speaker 1: I mean, you know, I hoped the paywall to watch it.
[13:22] Speaker 1: I'm sorry to read it, but like it was my
[13:27] Speaker 1: kids were like, is mom coming out? Because it was
[13:29] Speaker 1: like my morning to sleep in and I was just
[13:30] Speaker 1: reading this fucking New Yorker article.
[13:32] Speaker 2: Yeah, but it was to listen to it at sixty
[13:34] Speaker 2: six minutes and I'm like trying to mentally prepare how
[13:37] Speaker 2: to read things.
[13:37] Speaker 1: That aren't you know, gay hockey love stories. But yeah,
[13:42] Speaker 1: I mean it's definitely SVU adjacent, and it's just like, yeah,
[13:46] Speaker 1: this guy was just being fully protected. Well this is
[13:50] Speaker 1: that I've seen stuff, because like.
[13:51] Speaker 2: The whole idea is like Oh, these guys are secretive,
[13:54] Speaker 2: and it's like, oh no, they're pretty blatant open. There's
[13:56] Speaker 2: I guess he wrote raped over the photos.
[13:58] Speaker 1: You know. It's like, well, but that like and that's
[14:00] Speaker 1: the other thing too, is like you think about Epstein
[14:03] Speaker 1: and you're like, oh, this is people with private planes.
[14:05] Speaker 1: This is like the upper echelon, this is like whatever.
[14:08] Speaker 1: This guy was like wealthy for Johnson City, Tennessee. Like
[14:12] Speaker 1: he was a he owned a glass and concrete contracting company. Like,
[14:17] Speaker 1: so we had some money. But it's not like he
[14:19] Speaker 1: was you know what I mean, like old illuminati wealth.
[14:23] Speaker 2: Like I didn't even compare him in terms of money.
[14:25] Speaker 2: I just compared it to the boldness No, yeah, comfortability, yes.
[14:31] Speaker 2: But to me, it's like it's the whole.
[14:34] Speaker 1: This was very much gave me Epstein, but on a
[14:36] Speaker 1: smaller scale and in the sense that like I'm sure
[14:39] Speaker 1: with Epstein there was like millions of dollars and stuff
[14:42] Speaker 1: and all this stuff flowing around. This is like the
[14:44] Speaker 1: cops were just getting payments of like a few thousand
[14:46] Speaker 1: dollars and they were just like, we're gonna just turn
[14:49] Speaker 1: the other cheek. I was reading it on International Women's
[14:51] Speaker 1: Day and I was furious. I was just like, I
[14:54] Speaker 1: cannot believe that they just didn't give a shit about
[14:57] Speaker 1: this guy having any repercussions because he was us hurting
[15:00] Speaker 1: women and then later they find out children of course,
[15:03] Speaker 1: and also you know, he's the perpetrators the victim of
[15:06] Speaker 1: abuse as well, Like it is the cycle that we
[15:08] Speaker 1: talk about all the time, but it's it's a wild read.
[15:12] Speaker 1: Takes a long time, but it's fucking I mean, he
[15:14] Speaker 1: had like a full he had a guy that was
[15:16] Speaker 1: his galain. He had a guy who every single victim
[15:19] Speaker 1: was a friend of this guy who would go out
[15:21] Speaker 1: and meet girls and go come on up, let's party
[15:23] Speaker 1: and then fucking nuts and just needed to bring it up.
[15:30] Speaker 1: Needed to bring it up. Want everybody to read it,
[15:32] Speaker 1: because I'm going to read it.
[15:34] Speaker 2: I'm going to read it last time we record. Okay,
[15:38] Speaker 2: you guys, the greatest thing in my life happened. Oh
[15:42] Speaker 2: my god, what so you know? I told you guys,
[15:45] Speaker 2: I'll be off camera that like mon last Monday night,
[15:48] Speaker 2: I got blacked out and unintentionally but I'm fine, interrupted
[15:52] Speaker 2: Andrew Schultz's set and then kind of fought with his
[15:55] Speaker 2: manager at the bar and was escorted out by a
[15:58] Speaker 2: few comedians and so whatever. I don't give a fuck.
[16:02] Speaker 2: I'm living my life. And then Thursday he comes up
[16:05] Speaker 2: to me. I'm sitting at the table and he goes,
[16:07] Speaker 2: can we please talk? And I go, okay, sure, And
[16:11] Speaker 2: for forty five minutes in a booth, I said to
[16:13] Speaker 2: him everything I've ever said to you, every piece, like
[16:18] Speaker 2: everything I've ever thought. I was like, you will never
[16:21] Speaker 2: outlive this. I was like, you will always be known
[16:25] Speaker 2: as someone who had a pedophile human trafficking fascist and
[16:27] Speaker 2: gave a puff piece interview. And I go and I
[16:30] Speaker 2: know you're not sorry because you still haven't donated one
[16:33] Speaker 2: fucking dollar to anyone. I said, I want you pepper
[16:36] Speaker 2: sprayed in the face, and he goes, well, that's not
[16:38] Speaker 2: gonna happen. But like everything, I said, everything I've thought
[16:41] Speaker 2: of about him for over a decade, how much money
[16:44] Speaker 2: I want him to donate, everything he's done.
[16:46] Speaker 1: I called him a coward, like everything. Wait for forty
[16:50] Speaker 1: five minutes, and then everyone at the cellar table like
[16:52] Speaker 1: when I came back, They're like, what happened? But I
[16:54] Speaker 1: mean it's like, oh, my neck was crank trying to see.
[16:56] Speaker 2: And then people were like obviously watching because they know
[16:59] Speaker 2: we don't like each other. And I mean, he sat
[17:02] Speaker 2: there and took it and at the end thanks me.
[17:05] Speaker 2: No excuses, no, of course excuses, and it's self serving.
[17:08] Speaker 2: And I know he's not changed in any capacity because
[17:11] Speaker 2: I said, you had mom, donnian did you donate that money?
[17:13] Speaker 1: He goes, well, what do you mean?
[17:14] Speaker 2: I go, well, you made money off of grifting for
[17:16] Speaker 2: someone else, and now your apology tour, which is about
[17:19] Speaker 2: your platform and your rehab. And I go, as a human,
[17:21] Speaker 2: I get like feeling embarrassed and like I've done humiliating
[17:24] Speaker 2: things and feeling like everyone hates you. I go, I
[17:26] Speaker 2: see you as a human, like you can have those emotions.
[17:28] Speaker 2: But to me, it's irrelevant. I'll never forgive you all
[17:30] Speaker 2: your fucking friends. You're all the same to me, I go,
[17:33] Speaker 2: you're all the richest of our business, while you bitched
[17:35] Speaker 2: and complained about women, gay people, minorities the whole fucking time.
[17:39] Speaker 2: And I go, I go, why don't you have an
[17:42] Speaker 2: abortion doctor who went to jail because of like your voting?
[17:45] Speaker 2: How about that on your podcast? Why is it politicians?
[17:48] Speaker 2: And I go, and you continue to make money.
[17:50] Speaker 1: You're such a truth teller if you're such a modern
[17:53] Speaker 1: day philosopher. He goes, how much money? I go, A
[17:55] Speaker 1: million dollars? A million dollars. He asked you for a number.
[18:00] Speaker 1: I am gagged. I'm so you literally got to do
[18:04] Speaker 1: what like everybody wants to do, no Kate, Like somebody
[18:09] Speaker 1: goes get in a booth with one of these fucking
[18:12] Speaker 1: podcasters and say whatever you want. It was like he
[18:16] Speaker 1: could have walked away after ten minutes. You got forty
[18:18] Speaker 1: five minutes. Yeah.
[18:19] Speaker 2: Yeah, And then he had to go up but I
[18:20] Speaker 2: mean up top. I was like I was on professional
[18:22] Speaker 2: to interrupter set and then he goes. But also, you know,
[18:24] Speaker 2: like the way you spoke to my manager, Like if
[18:25] Speaker 2: I bring someone, talk to me, not them, I go, well,
[18:27] Speaker 2: I assume he's a piece of shit if he's working
[18:29] Speaker 2: with you, so like I don't know why I can't
[18:30] Speaker 2: talk to him like that. I go pay, I go
[18:33] Speaker 2: pay a family's rent that you've destroyed. I'm like pay,
[18:35] Speaker 2: Like I'm like the fact that you haven't even thought
[18:37] Speaker 2: of a way to like roll up your sleeves and
[18:39] Speaker 2: get involved. And then he tried to like kind of
[18:41] Speaker 2: get one on me, and I went, what you want
[18:43] Speaker 2: to say, I'm a hypocrite. I go, I don't give
[18:44] Speaker 2: the fuck.
[18:45] Speaker 1: I go.
[18:45] Speaker 2: I'm not here to give you a thesis. Like maybe
[18:46] Speaker 2: we can, I go if you need time to think.
[18:48] Speaker 2: But I'm like, I feel differently about because he was like, well, mom,
[18:51] Speaker 2: Donnie talked to Trump, Like, why aren't you as mad
[18:52] Speaker 2: at him? I go, are elected official who tried to
[18:54] Speaker 2: get a woman out of ice, who's prioritizing New York
[18:58] Speaker 2: City When it was a private conversation, Like why are
[18:59] Speaker 2: you even compare? It's like, I'm not trying to catch
[19:01] Speaker 2: you up. I'm like, it seems like you are. And
[19:02] Speaker 2: I don't care if you think I'm a hypocrite, Like
[19:04] Speaker 2: I don't have to be. This isn't a debate, so
[19:06] Speaker 2: I said, I'm like, this isn't philosophical. I'm like, you
[19:08] Speaker 2: fucking ruin nights here constantly. I'm like, you fought with me.
[19:11] Speaker 1: Your mom Donnie didn't talk to Trump for personal games. Yeah,
[19:15] Speaker 1: he's talking to him because these guys you have to
[19:17] Speaker 1: fucking at a certain level talk to the fucking president
[19:20] Speaker 1: of the United States when you're the mayor of a
[19:23] Speaker 1: major city.
[19:24] Speaker 2: Oh and I and then he's like, do you feel vindicated.
[19:27] Speaker 2: I go, no, I go, I'd rather be known as
[19:30] Speaker 2: a crazy bit who is wrong all along than any
[19:32] Speaker 2: of this time.
[19:33] Speaker 1: Do you feel like you were getting through to him
[19:35] Speaker 1: at all? Because he doesn't actually care.
[19:36] Speaker 2: He wants to be seen, right, He goes, but you
[19:38] Speaker 2: admit it, like having a platform.
[19:39] Speaker 1: It's good to still platform these people.
[19:41] Speaker 2: I go, sure, but like unless you have like a
[19:43] Speaker 2: family who you've destroyed, or an immigrant who had to
[19:45] Speaker 2: be like sitting in custody, and like, it doesn't fucking matter.
[19:48] Speaker 2: I'm like, you're not h I'm like, you haven't helped
[19:50] Speaker 2: a person. That's all I need to know. That's all
[19:52] Speaker 2: I need to know. You feel so bad. I'm like,
[19:54] Speaker 2: you haven't atoned, you haven't been accountable, you haven't done anything,
[19:57] Speaker 2: Like you haven't shown it. So and he goes, well,
[19:59] Speaker 2: I don't want people to think I'm like being performative.
[20:01] Speaker 2: I go, if it's authentic, it doesn't matter, but you
[20:02] Speaker 2: can also do it anonymously. Like but the fact that
[20:05] Speaker 2: that wasn't even you feel bad for yourself, Like that's
[20:08] Speaker 2: proof enough, Like that's all the proof I actually need
[20:10] Speaker 2: that Like you haven't because if I was, like, fuck,
[20:13] Speaker 2: I fucked over immigrants, and I love immigrants, Like this
[20:16] Speaker 2: is this is fucked. I'd be like, okay, let me
[20:18] Speaker 2: see if I could bail someone. Is there a legal
[20:20] Speaker 2: aid I can? I like, yeah, I don't know.
[20:22] Speaker 1: And the thing is is he could have lied and
[20:24] Speaker 1: said that he did do some of that shit, and
[20:25] Speaker 1: he and when you said you haven't given a dollar,
[20:27] Speaker 1: he didn't even say anything right.
[20:29] Speaker 2: He didn't even say yes, I have whoa And then
[20:32] Speaker 2: he was like, well, what percentage do I have? I go,
[20:34] Speaker 2: it's all of you. I go, it's the culture. It's
[20:35] Speaker 2: all of you. You sold out Madison Square Garden. And
[20:38] Speaker 2: he goes well twice and I was like, exactly, I go,
[20:42] Speaker 2: so stop acting like you didn't have an influence. But
[20:44] Speaker 2: I'm like, you're all the same to me, and I'll
[20:45] Speaker 2: never forgive you. Because at one point he's like your energy.
[20:47] Speaker 2: I go, yeah, I'm seeing. I'm like, my heart is
[20:49] Speaker 2: beating fast. I go it like sickens me to sit here.
[20:51] Speaker 2: I don't know what to tell you. I go, I
[20:52] Speaker 2: will never respect you, like I don't know what you want.
[20:55] Speaker 1: I can't believe it. I wish it was on tape. Well,
[20:58] Speaker 1: I mean in time line.
[21:00] Speaker 2: I guess I feel bad, like fully airing it out
[21:02] Speaker 2: because because he's like, this is what I've wanted, Like
[21:03] Speaker 2: no one will sit down with me. But then yeah,
[21:06] Speaker 2: one of my friends was like I told another comic.
[21:07] Speaker 2: They were beaming. I sent voice notes to another comic
[21:10] Speaker 2: who I knew would want to know, and they're like,
[21:11] Speaker 2: oh my god, thank God, Like why does any have
[21:14] Speaker 2: you on? I would not, I know, I know, I
[21:16] Speaker 2: don't want to. I don't want to. I don't I would,
[21:18] Speaker 2: I just I would not. I don't want to.
[21:21] Speaker 1: Well, you don't want to, cause his listeners are probably
[21:24] Speaker 1: nightmare people. But also like if you what I'm saying,
[21:28] Speaker 1: is he oh he says you want or not? Don't
[21:30] Speaker 1: say I've been wanting to have this conversation. I just
[21:32] Speaker 1: want someone to sit down and go count counterpoint with me,
[21:36] Speaker 1: point counterpoint with me. When you have that opportunity, you
[21:38] Speaker 1: are surrounded by people all the time who disagree with
[21:41] Speaker 1: you. You could have had any of them on your podcast
[21:43] Speaker 1: to tell you what you've done wrong, and you're sitting
[21:46] Speaker 1: here going you're the first person brave enough, Lisa, like,
[21:49] Speaker 1: come on, no, someone said that to me. I go no.
[21:52] Speaker 2: My mom used to fight at work all the time.
[21:53] Speaker 2: I'm like, it's kind of a shanetic thing. It's like
[21:56] Speaker 2: there's no bravery or like true, I wish I could
[21:58] Speaker 2: calm myself down, but it was all this is in
[22:00] Speaker 2: your g this is in your dream. But it was
[22:02] Speaker 2: also a post hypnosis. It was my first hypnotherapy appointment.
[22:05] Speaker 2: It was like a few hours after that, so I
[22:07] Speaker 2: was locked in.
[22:09] Speaker 1: Wow. It's like locked in wow, wow, wow, wow, feeling free.
[22:15] Speaker 1: This is amazing. I'm obsessed. Yeah, because I went and
[22:20] Speaker 1: being like because I was like, I did get blacked
[22:22] Speaker 1: out Monday, but the next day and no one likes him.
[22:25] Speaker 2: So the next day, like I went to someone that worked,
[22:27] Speaker 2: I was like, oh am I in trouble. They're like,
[22:28] Speaker 2: I don't think anyone saw anything, did you? And I
[22:30] Speaker 2: was like, yeah, I guess not. But now I'm talking
[22:32] Speaker 2: about it on the pod always.
[22:34] Speaker 1: But yeah, but he wants to bring he wanted he
[22:36] Speaker 1: called you over to talk about it. So it's like
[22:38] Speaker 1: you're not instigating, but I mean, it's good that you
[22:41] Speaker 1: apologize for interrupting his set.
[22:42] Speaker 2: Well, I made sure not to say the words I'm sorry,
[22:45] Speaker 2: so I didn't apologize. You said it was unprofessional and
[22:48] Speaker 2: professional inappropriate.
[22:50] Speaker 1: It was, you know, disrespectful as a profession do not really,
[22:54] Speaker 1: but I can acknowledge that it was not a good
[22:56] Speaker 1: thing to do.
[22:57] Speaker 2: That's what I also told his manager, because he's like, say,
[22:59] Speaker 2: it's his face.
[22:59] Speaker 1: I'm like, can you was what I feelbout him?
[23:00] Speaker 2: And at the end of the day, I'm not like
[23:02] Speaker 2: rich or successful enough for him to care what I
[23:04] Speaker 2: actually think about him, you know what I mean.
[23:05] Speaker 1: Like, but he sat there. It was like a dream
[23:09] Speaker 1: come true. I've been writing that. Does he live in
[23:11] Speaker 1: New York?
[23:12] Speaker 2: Oh, that's another thing. I He goes, can I tell
[23:14] Speaker 2: you why I voted for him in twenty twenty four
[23:15] Speaker 2: or whatever? Because he didn't vote for him in the
[23:17] Speaker 2: other elections.
[23:19] Speaker 1: But he was like, I go, I don't want to.
[23:22] Speaker 1: I don't know no, And he goes, can I just
[23:24] Speaker 1: tell you for me? I go fine?
[23:26] Speaker 2: And so he said that he thought like the institutions
[23:31] Speaker 2: would hold strong, like that the institutions would not fail.
[23:34] Speaker 2: And I said, and you're a New Yorker, you claim
[23:36] Speaker 2: to be a New Yorker, and you didn't know this
[23:38] Speaker 2: motherfucker was a bankrupt motherfucker who can't even start a
[23:40] Speaker 2: charity in the city. As a New Yorker, you thought
[23:43] Speaker 2: the institutions wouldn't fail from this bit, like at least
[23:46] Speaker 2: other people are public servants, Like what the fuck are
[23:48] Speaker 2: you talking about? But whatever, It's like, think, I don't
[23:51] Speaker 2: know whatever.
[23:52] Speaker 1: We're here.
[23:53] Speaker 2: It is what it is. We're in a war, and
[23:55] Speaker 2: good good for you, Like anyone he's like.
[23:57] Speaker 1: Well, what percentage? I'm not the only one, Like well,
[24:00] Speaker 1: it's like it doesn't matter.
[24:01] Speaker 2: All of you did it and now we're here, and
[24:03] Speaker 2: now we're here suffering people are suffering.
[24:06] Speaker 1: Yeah, fuck, oh my god. Yeah, it was like so cool,
[24:12] Speaker 1: the people's princess. Everybody really, but I'm like, that is
[24:18] Speaker 1: not what I thought you were gonna say. That is
[24:19] Speaker 1: fucking great. That must have felt good. What'd you do after?
[24:22] Speaker 1: Oh my god? I went back to the table and
[24:24] Speaker 1: everyone was like what happened?
[24:27] Speaker 2: And then I got people so riled up, like like
[24:29] Speaker 2: a guy who doesn't really drink that off and like
[24:31] Speaker 2: he got a martini. I ordered a Manhattan. I'm like
[24:33] Speaker 2: I need a celebratory drink. And then everyone just got
[24:36] Speaker 2: riled up and kind of like pumped because they everyone
[24:40] Speaker 2: feels this way. And then I had probably one too
[24:44] Speaker 2: many Manhattans had a fun set and like walked home
[24:46] Speaker 2: and then probably had to be up at six am
[24:49] Speaker 2: to do stuff because I keep getting drunk, but like.
[24:53] Speaker 1: And then wait, so and then he went up and
[24:54] Speaker 1: did a set and did he like me?
[24:56] Speaker 2: So I don't know like he had to because when
[24:57] Speaker 2: I sat down at the table and I looked at
[24:59] Speaker 2: the schedule, I saw name a few times that night
[25:01] Speaker 2: and I was like, okay, so I am going to
[25:02] Speaker 2: see him, and I'm like in my head, I'm like,
[25:03] Speaker 2: I'm sure I'm gonna have to like interact with him.
[25:05] Speaker 2: I did like scream, you know, scream I fucking hate
[25:07] Speaker 2: you during your set, so like.
[25:11] Speaker 1: You know, tail between my legs.
[25:13] Speaker 2: But I thing, I don't know if you thought it
[25:14] Speaker 2: was gonna go different, that I would just apologize and
[25:16] Speaker 2: be like, I don't know, I don't know what he thought.
[25:18] Speaker 2: I'm glad he sat for it. He didn't raise his voice,
[25:20] Speaker 2: he took it all. He was really like I would.
[25:23] Speaker 1: Say, I think was not expecting that you were just
[25:27] Speaker 1: like fully ready to unleash like that, and that he
[25:32] Speaker 1: probably thought if I go to her calm, she'll be like, hey,
[25:36] Speaker 1: sorry about the other night. I know that We're just
[25:38] Speaker 1: different and it's okay, like we can we can have
[25:41] Speaker 1: different opinions. That's what comedy is all about. And you
[25:43] Speaker 1: were like, not today, bitch, I'm obsessed. Not since it.
[25:48] Speaker 2: Felt really good, And then I saw Joyel yesterday and
[25:51] Speaker 2: I was like, do I have a story for you?
[25:53] Speaker 2: Like people just hate him so much, it's like like
[25:56] Speaker 2: everyone kind of gets like a fun moment out of it. Yeah,
[25:58] Speaker 2: so it's pretty exciting brought to you by heated rivalry.
[26:03] Speaker 1: Honestly, Yeah, it's made Leason more positive but also willing
[26:08] Speaker 1: to channel the negative into a positive, you know, conversation. Ultimately,
[26:14] Speaker 1: I think that's awesome. Oh my god, doing the fucking
[26:19] Speaker 1: work that all? I mean, what a what a sleigh,
[26:22] Speaker 1: What an opportunity. I'm so I'm always you know you
[26:26] Speaker 1: really are just no you. I think you inspire you
[26:30] Speaker 1: and you have inspired me a lot. But ye, I
[26:32] Speaker 1: know you inspire a lot of our listeners to be
[26:35] Speaker 1: more like people like who are people accountable? Yeah?
[26:39] Speaker 2: There are definite consequences throughout the years, I'm sure, But
[26:41] Speaker 2: the way I feel after this, like I definitely feel emboldened,
[26:45] Speaker 2: Like I felt nice because I said to him, I
[26:47] Speaker 2: go I've been talking shit about you for like over
[26:49] Speaker 2: a decade, so it feels nice to kind of just
[26:50] Speaker 2: say it to your face, to be honest, I love
[26:53] Speaker 2: oh my god.
[26:54] Speaker 1: And then when like getting up where you just like okay.
[26:56] Speaker 2: Bye, oh, I would both just like tape and it's
[26:58] Speaker 2: me going you guys, I just got to front and enemy,
[27:00] Speaker 2: like I'm riding high, like no, I have a jack
[27:06] Speaker 2: on the rocks on stage, and I'm I'm like in
[27:08] Speaker 2: a my ba bar sweater.
[27:09] Speaker 1: Like but like when you two when you were leaving him,
[27:13] Speaker 1: are you like okay, I'm done bye and just got
[27:16] Speaker 1: up or like, well thanked.
[27:17] Speaker 2: Me, he said if I wanted his number. I declined,
[27:21] Speaker 2: and he went downstairs, and I sat at the table
[27:25] Speaker 2: kind of everyone, you know, everyone wanted to recap.
[27:28] Speaker 1: I'm surprised they didn't fucking put you on their shoulders
[27:31] Speaker 1: and parade you out into the streets. You know.
[27:33] Speaker 2: A few black people gave me really nice handshakes in
[27:36] Speaker 2: a way that felt the same, felt like better than
[27:40] Speaker 2: a parade, to be honest, right right.
[27:42] Speaker 1: I felt the same as a parade. I love that.
[27:44] Speaker 1: I love that. But then there was one girl, Casey,
[27:46] Speaker 1: So I'm telling the story from the night I was
[27:49] Speaker 1: blacked out and I'm telling I was like, well, then
[27:51] Speaker 1: I talked to you.
[27:51] Speaker 2: She goes, I had long gone. I go, what are
[27:53] Speaker 2: you talking about? She goes, I wasn't there. I go,
[27:55] Speaker 2: the whole time I've been retelling the story. I'm like,
[27:57] Speaker 2: you've been there, Like you've been there, Like I guess.
[28:00] Speaker 2: She's like I had left.
[28:04] Speaker 1: Not in my mind. She's Louise. Okay, Casey just gave
[28:09] Speaker 1: us the thirty. But this was worth I know, I've
[28:12] Speaker 1: never been usual.
[28:13] Speaker 2: I usually don't want to be as such a brag
[28:15] Speaker 2: a bragger, but like my Simpson's Sea rivalry thing is
[28:18] Speaker 2: really cool and this is really exciting.
[28:21] Speaker 1: So that's that. And I read an article about a
[28:27] Speaker 1: serial rapist. You can also check that out. Okay, we're sorry.
[28:31] Speaker 1: Out Lisa's website. She's gonna be in Burlington this weekend.
[28:36] Speaker 1: Go check out. And today Saint Patrick's say, I'll be
[28:38] Speaker 1: blacked out. You could find me on the streets of
[28:41] Speaker 1: New York. My best friend's leaving record. But Lisa takes
[28:44] Speaker 1: it off like a religious holiday. We will not be
[28:46] Speaker 1: recording on that day and pick a religious holiday for
[28:49] Speaker 1: the Trigger family.
[28:49] Speaker 2: Julia's fucking leaving town. It's like the rudest thing she's
[28:52] Speaker 2: ever done in our friendship.
[28:53] Speaker 1: Oh No.
[28:54] Speaker 2: And then I message other Chicago and Irish loving people
[28:57] Speaker 2: and they're all like, I might be truly alone in
[28:59] Speaker 2: a green like I don't know.
[29:01] Speaker 1: You're gonna find no the things. Something's gonna come up
[29:04] Speaker 1: that doesn't happen for you. Come on, someone is around
[29:07] Speaker 1: and we'll drink. Come on, but I need them up
[29:09] Speaker 1: at ten. I want to be up at the bar.
[29:11] Speaker 1: They need to be at it all day. I want
[29:13] Speaker 1: to believe we'll bring from some names. This is crazy, okay,
[29:17] Speaker 1: but if you go to That's Messed Up Live dot com,
[29:20] Speaker 1: you can get links to Lisa Tragger dot com with
[29:23] Speaker 1: all of Lisa's show she's in Vermont. You can get
[29:26] Speaker 1: links to our merge. We've got our Lewis Lowis whatever shirt.
[29:30] Speaker 1: Steph Tola, who I brought up earlier in the episode.
[29:35] Speaker 1: We are interviewing her on the Patreon this week, and
[29:37] Speaker 1: she's a huge SVU nut. She actually told me a
[29:40] Speaker 1: huge just view thing that I can tell you off
[29:43] Speaker 1: camera but or off whatever, Mike and uh, but so
[29:48] Speaker 1: come check out our patreon. We we talked about the
[29:52] Speaker 1: Tyra doc. We've got a lot of good episodes. Somebody
[29:55] Speaker 1: wrote us and was like, are they all gonna be
[29:56] Speaker 1: about housewives? I'm like, no, they're not. Just the first
[29:58] Speaker 1: two happen to have a little bit of a housewife theme.
[30:00] Speaker 1: They're all over the place. We have some really fun
[30:02] Speaker 1: episodes coming up for the Patreons. So that's Patreon dot
[30:05] Speaker 1: com slash that's messed up anything else.
[30:08] Speaker 2: Lisa no excited to start a classic episode, classic episode.
[30:13] Speaker 1: A hot one? All right, today we are doing the
[30:21] Speaker 1: episode hot House, season ten, episode twelve. And if you're
[30:25] Speaker 1: thinking to yourself as this recap goes along, I think
[30:29] Speaker 1: I've heard this before, maybe you were at Zany Chicago
[30:32] Speaker 1: in June of twenty twenty two. We did do this
[30:35] Speaker 1: show once live on the road. I'm say for yeah,
[30:40] Speaker 1: it was a little it's a little iconic episode because
[30:44] Speaker 1: Sarah Hyland's performance is widely regarded to be one of
[30:48] Speaker 1: the best guest episode performances. I think of this franchise's history,
[30:52] Speaker 1: but it's really not even our PowerPoint skills. I don't
[30:56] Speaker 1: think could could fluff this baby up enough to be,
[30:59] Speaker 1: you know, a fun summer night out.
[31:02] Speaker 2: But there's just a lot of zoom in on a
[31:04] Speaker 2: dead child's body. It is what it is. It's a
[31:07] Speaker 2: little little graphic for the stage.
[31:09] Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean there's also two red herrings that are
[31:12] Speaker 1: also awful, and then what actually happens is awful, and
[31:15] Speaker 1: then there's another layer to that. So it's like, you know,
[31:18] Speaker 1: it's not great, it's not good, but there is some
[31:21] Speaker 1: Russian so that's exciting. Yes, we're leaning in. We're leaning
[31:25] Speaker 1: in to nothing. Just this episode, I would say a
[31:28] Speaker 1: classic a Maloney era from two thousand and nine.
[31:31] Speaker 2: It's so weird when people someone actually asked me recently,
[31:34] Speaker 2: they're like, oh Russian, Like what are your thoughts on Russia?
[31:36] Speaker 2: And it's like, I love Putin. What are you talking about?
[31:38] Speaker 2: What are my thoughts on Russia? Like it's terrible. I
[31:42] Speaker 2: think people should be gay and have the news just
[31:44] Speaker 2: like love Russia. Is that why you're learning the language? Like, yeah,
[31:49] Speaker 2: it's so strange. But I guess there are people that
[31:52] Speaker 2: believe in this Russian war, I guess, but like where
[31:55] Speaker 2: not here?
[31:56] Speaker 1: Maybe an Oligark or two, Yeah, yeah, anyone I've talked to. Okay,
[32:04] Speaker 1: So we open on people doing tai chie outside in
[32:08] Speaker 1: the freezing cold, on the river in Manhattan. Couldn't be me.
[32:12] Speaker 1: The instructor asks, does anyone know what the next move is?
[32:15] Speaker 1: And this older woman goes body and water and the
[32:17] Speaker 1: instructor's like, no, asshole, it's snake creeps down and she's like, no,
[32:22] Speaker 1: I mean there's a body in the water. An amazing opening.
[32:26] Speaker 1: This woman didn't know any of her like I don't
[32:30] Speaker 1: even know what the word in like prepositions, Like she
[32:33] Speaker 1: didn't know any prepositions. She's just a body in water.
[32:35] Speaker 1: But she actually does know that there's a body in
[32:37] Speaker 1: the water. Melindash now is there with Benson and Stabler.
[32:41] Speaker 1: We're getting the full lowdown. She couldn't have been in
[32:43] Speaker 1: the water long. She's got a massive head wound and
[32:46] Speaker 1: she was alive when the attack happened because like her
[32:50] Speaker 1: blood was pumping, and she has puncture wounds to the breast,
[32:53] Speaker 1: scars all over her body. She's half naked wearing jewelry.
[32:57] Speaker 1: So obviously Benson is Stabler barely ever look for another
[33:01] Speaker 1: context clue. They're always like sex worker, right, They're like
[33:04] Speaker 1: trick gone wrong. Melinda's like or angry pimp syndrome. And
[33:08] Speaker 1: then Stabler peeps her Tribar Cross, which he obviously knows
[33:12] Speaker 1: his Christian jewelry by heart, and he's like that's Russian Orthodox,
[33:15] Speaker 1: and Benson points out like, wow, this girl was beaten
[33:18] Speaker 1: and tortured but still believed in God. And Stabler goes,
[33:21] Speaker 1: you think you would have protected her just a little bit,
[33:23] Speaker 1: and it's like, I don't know, dude, it's season ten
[33:25] Speaker 1: of this show. God is not protecting any of these girlies.
[33:29] Speaker 1: Like how many girls have you seen on the fucking
[33:32] Speaker 1: pavement with their heads blasted open? God's not out there
[33:36] Speaker 1: for them. Okay, So then that's the credits at top
[33:41] Speaker 1: of act one Melinda's house. She's like, okay, well, I
[33:44] Speaker 1: can tell you that the victim is fourteen years and
[33:47] Speaker 1: two months old because we carbon dated the crystalline proteins
[33:51] Speaker 1: in her eyes. Oh fuck yourself. So I'm telling you, man,
[33:55] Speaker 1: the science. The science. So she was dead before she
[33:59] Speaker 1: hit the river. She got four blows to the head.
[34:02] Speaker 1: She has a lot of long term injuries, like her
[34:04] Speaker 1: wrist has been reset with a pin, she's got cigarette burns,
[34:08] Speaker 1: other scars. And they're like, well, we'll just find the
[34:11] Speaker 1: doctor who did the wrisk surgery, and she's like best
[34:14] Speaker 1: of luck. You're not going to she said, isotope ainalysis
[34:18] Speaker 1: of her hair shows that she's been in New York
[34:20] Speaker 1: the last couple of months, but before that she was
[34:22] Speaker 1: in Ukraine. So Benson and Stabler immediately jumped to this
[34:25] Speaker 1: girl's been sex trafficked, and Melinda's like, well, I know
[34:28] Speaker 1: of an organization that helps traffic girls. Call my girl,
[34:31] Speaker 1: Grace Metcalf. So now we're at the very very simply
[34:34] Speaker 1: named Center for Abused Women, and Grace doesn't recognize the
[34:38] Speaker 1: picture of this girl, but she says Kiev too. New
[34:41] Speaker 1: York City is a major trafficking corridor. The economy over
[34:45] Speaker 1: there sucks. These traffickers tell the girls you're gonna have
[34:47] Speaker 1: all these opportunities and a great life in the US.
[34:50] Speaker 1: What they get is life in hell, which you know,
[34:53] Speaker 1: shockers kind of life for all of us now. But
[34:56] Speaker 1: she tells the stories of all these different girls that
[34:59] Speaker 1: have been adopted, ducted, and shipped abroad. One of these
[35:02] Speaker 1: girls sold her daughter and her little sister for fifty euros,
[35:06] Speaker 1: so that's not a lot of money. The traffickers changed
[35:11] Speaker 1: their names like you change underwear, she says to Benson,
[35:13] Speaker 1: and it's like, okay, so I can assume once a
[35:15] Speaker 1: day they changed their names and then they she says,
[35:19] Speaker 1: we pulled a girl from Kiev last summer out of
[35:21] Speaker 1: a brothel and queens. She's still here. She's too afraid
[35:24] Speaker 1: to go home, and she's constantly afraid that her kidnappers
[35:26] Speaker 1: will kill her. And they're like, give us the name,
[35:29] Speaker 1: and she's like, her name's Veronica Pankovic. She works in
[35:32] Speaker 1: a laundry and she pretends she doesn't speak English. So
[35:35] Speaker 1: Olivia goes to laundry to see this girl and I
[35:37] Speaker 1: thought I recognized this actress, but I don't. And she
[35:40] Speaker 1: is from Transylvania, though, which shout out to Hotel Transylvania,
[35:43] Speaker 1: Like that's a funny.
[35:44] Speaker 2: So you know, obviously Connor's story cover of Vogue, but
[35:47] Speaker 2: it was like Vogue Adria, and I was like, what
[35:49] Speaker 2: the fuck is that?
[35:50] Speaker 1: Like it was like a.
[35:51] Speaker 2: Commotion in the morning when the new photos dropped, But
[35:53] Speaker 2: then it was like, what exactly is what.
[35:55] Speaker 1: Is that exact Adriatic?
[35:57] Speaker 2: Okay, so my friend messaged me and it basically so
[36:01] Speaker 2: it's Albania, Bosnia, her Sgavina didn't know about that, Croatia, Italy,
[36:07] Speaker 2: Montenegro and Slovenia. But it's like, are we gonna be
[36:10] Speaker 2: able to get our hands on this magazine? I'm not sure.
[36:13] Speaker 1: If we have any listeners in Bosnia, Croatia, Montenegro, Serbia, Slovenia,
[36:18] Speaker 1: please suddenly's out copy? Would we would really appreciate it?
[36:22] Speaker 2: And her Savina, I mean, I hope we have a
[36:24] Speaker 2: h I hope we have a listener there.
[36:27] Speaker 1: Yeah, it's crazy when I look at where the listeners
[36:30] Speaker 1: come from. We do have a few kind of everywhere,
[36:32] Speaker 1: it feels, but if you're listening, please so get me
[36:37] Speaker 1: a magazine, get me there. Yeah. So this actress is
[36:41] Speaker 1: like very pretty and it's from Transylvania, but I've never
[36:43] Speaker 1: seen her anything else. She's like, I don't know this girl,
[36:47] Speaker 1: and if you found me, my trafficker's gonna find me.
[36:49] Speaker 1: Like what the fuck? She's panicking and lives like tell us,
[36:51] Speaker 1: tell us like who he is, and we'll get you
[36:54] Speaker 1: transferred out of New York City And she's like, great,
[36:58] Speaker 1: get me on a ticket out of here. And then
[36:59] Speaker 1: she tells liv his name is Alik. He smuggled her
[37:02] Speaker 1: in and made her a sex worker, and she has
[37:04] Speaker 1: a cell phone number, but he'll never talk to a cop.
[37:07] Speaker 1: Not a problem, because the NYPD has a wardrobe budget. Okay.
[37:11] Speaker 1: At Little Odessa Cafe, Olivia struts in with her sex,
[37:15] Speaker 1: traffick or swagger, and the look is a big step up,
[37:19] Speaker 1: I would say, from the blue leopard satin that we
[37:20] Speaker 1: see when she's working Super Bowl Sunday. Right, Like she's
[37:23] Speaker 1: in like a sort of skirt suit with a fur
[37:26] Speaker 1: draped over one side, leather gloves. You know. I don't
[37:30] Speaker 1: know what the budget is over there at NYPD for
[37:32] Speaker 1: the undercover ops.
[37:33] Speaker 2: But she looks like she can afford a few girls.
[37:35] Speaker 2: She can get some slaves.
[37:37] Speaker 1: Yeah, she's not in here in like a forever twenty
[37:39] Speaker 1: one blouse being like I need ladies. You know. She
[37:42] Speaker 1: is playing Claudia and she needs well, she said Claudia,
[37:45] Speaker 1: but I think he said it Cloudia. So I was like,
[37:48] Speaker 1: that's what it is. She needs eight girls, newcomers, the
[37:51] Speaker 1: younger the better, I mean, straight out of the Epstein files.
[37:54] Speaker 1: And she's like, I'm from Chicago, bitch, I'm from Chicago.
[37:58] Speaker 1: And she's like, I need And he's like, why don't
[38:00] Speaker 1: you shop at home? There's a lot of pretty girls
[38:02] Speaker 1: in Chicago. And she's like, I need girls from my
[38:04] Speaker 1: clients that are here and they like variety, and flying
[38:07] Speaker 1: them from Chicago is too risky. I'm not putting these
[38:09] Speaker 1: girls on planes. One of your girls gave me your
[38:11] Speaker 1: phone number, told me to phone you. I like when
[38:13] Speaker 1: she says phone you, she's like trying to use more
[38:15] Speaker 1: international language, and Olivia is like, okay, if you don't
[38:21] Speaker 1: want to talk about this, I'm leaving. Like she bluffs
[38:23] Speaker 1: that she's gonna bounce, and then he bites. He's like,
[38:25] Speaker 1: wait a second. Next thing, we see three teens on
[38:27] Speaker 1: a dirty couch. Olivia's inspecting their teeth. This scene has
[38:30] Speaker 1: haunted me forever.
[38:32] Speaker 2: The teeth are wild well, and isn't there also yeah,
[38:36] Speaker 2: don't get yeah, it's it's a tough one for me.
[38:39] Speaker 1: Well, the first two girls have perfectly fine teeth, and
[38:41] Speaker 1: then the third girl, I mean like, it's really not okay,
[38:45] Speaker 1: Like I don't know how they thought they were going
[38:47] Speaker 1: to get away with that. And she goes, this one's
[38:49] Speaker 1: teeth are a rotten mess. You gotta get off the meth, honey,
[38:52] Speaker 1: And then he's like, my girls don't do drugs, and
[38:55] Speaker 1: then he Olivia's checks the toes and is like, oh,
[38:57] Speaker 1: like right here where I see the toes, the heroin
[39:00] Speaker 1: marks or whatever. And she tells Alikh, no deal on
[39:04] Speaker 1: cheese teeth, but I'll take the other two. And then
[39:07] Speaker 1: she says it's a done deal into her sleeve, and
[39:10] Speaker 1: that cues the cops, who busts down the door. Immediately.
[39:12] Speaker 1: Finn's leading the charge. He grabs Alik and smacks his
[39:16] Speaker 1: head into like a stairwell by accident, which is quote unquote.
[39:19] Speaker 1: I will say, you say, alick. Oh, I'm just saying
[39:24] Speaker 1: it the way the first girl said it, but Aleck,
[39:28] Speaker 1: because Benson was saying, Alec, yeah, that's like the English
[39:33] Speaker 1: version of it. But it was like, yeah, it so
[39:36] Speaker 1: Alick okay, Alick. So in cement room bars, Aleck is
[39:41] Speaker 1: helping them. He's like, I'm helping these girls. I'm helping
[39:45] Speaker 1: them find work. It's the American dream. And then they
[39:47] Speaker 1: show a picture of the victim and he's like, well,
[39:49] Speaker 1: that's not me. I've been in Miami all week. You
[39:52] Speaker 1: can check my tickets in my hotel. And they're like, oh,
[39:54] Speaker 1: in Miami, trolling for more girls, and he's like, don't
[39:57] Speaker 1: make it sound so tragic. Their lives aren't that bad
[40:00] Speaker 1: lives like okay, so like daily beatings, rape, exposure to HIV,
[40:03] Speaker 1: that's the good life. And he's like, it's better than
[40:05] Speaker 1: in Ukraine rotting their livers on grain, alcohol and trading
[40:09] Speaker 1: sex for drugs. I give them nice clothes, food, a
[40:12] Speaker 1: place to stay. And he's and he's like, you know,
[40:15] Speaker 1: it's a shame the girl. This girl didn't deserve to die,
[40:17] Speaker 1: like that's she's not one of mine, but I do
[40:21] Speaker 1: know who she is. And then he's like, I want
[40:24] Speaker 1: a deal, and Stabler goes, cough up a name, and
[40:26] Speaker 1: the guy does a fake cough and goes nope, nothing,
[40:29] Speaker 1: and you know, Stabler goes, you know, your balls are
[40:32] Speaker 1: in a vice and he's like, all right, listen, I
[40:34] Speaker 1: don't do American time. You deport me to Ukraine and
[40:37] Speaker 1: I do my sentence there. So our least favorite Ada
[40:41] Speaker 1: of all time Gray Lick is on the other side
[40:43] Speaker 1: of the glass with Kragan and she's like, yeah, right,
[40:45] Speaker 1: he's gonna go back to Ukraine, do like three weeks
[40:48] Speaker 1: of time, buy his way back out. He'll be trafficking
[40:51] Speaker 1: in like a month. And Craigan is like, yeah, well,
[40:54] Speaker 1: we'll give his file to Interpol, like at least he'll
[40:56] Speaker 1: be on international watch lists, Like that'll slow him down
[40:59] Speaker 1: a little bit. Graylck is like, well a deal makes
[41:02] Speaker 1: us look soft, and Craigan's like not finding the killer
[41:05] Speaker 1: makes us incompetent. So graylic walks in and he's like
[41:09] Speaker 1: bus lady and she's like save the grin ass wipe,
[41:12] Speaker 1: and uh he gives it up. He goes. Her name
[41:15] Speaker 1: is Elsalychkoff. But guess what, she's not a working girl.
[41:19] Speaker 1: She's one of those genius math kids. I've just seen
[41:22] Speaker 1: her in the Ukrainian newspaper. So it's great that this
[41:25] Speaker 1: guy not only keeps up on hometown news but memorizes
[41:27] Speaker 1: the names of these girls that are geniuses so that
[41:31] Speaker 1: he could try some and then tracking like math athletes
[41:35] Speaker 1: as well. Yeah yeah, this smart's like Elsa Lynchcoff. I
[41:38] Speaker 1: got my eyes on her. She's won in the math Prize. Okay,
[41:41] Speaker 1: so like this guy does the deal? Still stand that
[41:45] Speaker 1: He's like, I just know who she is from the papers,
[41:48] Speaker 1: But now we see a video of Elsa winning the
[41:51] Speaker 1: Bradshaw Prize for Applied Mathematics, and this girl, it's like,
[41:55] Speaker 1: this little actress looks like a baby. She's like, I
[41:57] Speaker 1: am so excited that my paper dense triangle free graph
[42:01] Speaker 1: conjecture has won this prize. This is my dream and
[42:05] Speaker 1: she's the youngest winner ever. She goes to the more
[42:07] Speaker 1: Woods School. Stable goes, never heard of it, and it's like, duh,
[42:10] Speaker 1: it's not a Catholic school. That's why I've never heard
[42:12] Speaker 1: of it. Finn goes, I know it. It's a genius factory.
[42:15] Speaker 1: So my classmates got shipped off there, but they never
[42:18] Speaker 1: came back and they're like, oh, where'd they go? And
[42:19] Speaker 1: he's like, MIT, Caltech, Harvard, like these people go on
[42:23] Speaker 1: to do huge things. And then we go back to
[42:26] Speaker 1: the Elcibdia and she goes, this is the most exciting
[42:28] Speaker 1: moment of my life. And she's just like grinning and
[42:31] Speaker 1: hugging this math prize to her body. So yeah, she
[42:36] Speaker 1: knows math is very happy. He loves math, loves dense triangle,
[42:40] Speaker 1: dense triangles, loves a dense triangle. I don't know what
[42:43] Speaker 1: that is, but she loves it. At the more Woods School,
[42:46] Speaker 1: they're walking and talking with I don't know, Dean of
[42:48] Speaker 1: Admissions principle, whatever you call it, and she's like, oh,
[42:52] Speaker 1: what a tragedy. She was about to get into MIT,
[42:54] Speaker 1: Like she does not even care really that the girl
[42:57] Speaker 1: is dead at fourteen years old, but that she was
[42:58] Speaker 1: about to get into MIT, which at fourteen also is
[43:02] Speaker 1: totally Doogie Houser territory. She's been at Morewood for one year.
[43:06] Speaker 1: This woman explains that Elsa was only in Ukraine for
[43:09] Speaker 1: an extended family trip to visit her dying grandmother. She's
[43:11] Speaker 1: a US citizen, she was born in the US, and
[43:13] Speaker 1: all the students born at this school, so we didn't
[43:16] Speaker 1: even know she was missing because she signed herself out
[43:18] Speaker 1: for the weekend. She left at noon on Saturday, and
[43:20] Speaker 1: she wasn't due back until tonight. So how about her parents?
[43:24] Speaker 1: And she goes, well, they're supportive, they know Elsa needs
[43:27] Speaker 1: genius training. And she's they're like, ma'am, can you tell
[43:30] Speaker 1: us anything about the broken wrists and the cigarette burns?
[43:33] Speaker 1: And this woman like is not at all taken aback
[43:35] Speaker 1: that one of her students was abused. She's like, are
[43:37] Speaker 1: you insinuating that that happened at more Wood? Like she's
[43:40] Speaker 1: as big of a like achievement freak as the students are, Like,
[43:45] Speaker 1: she just doesn't even She's not like, oh my god,
[43:47] Speaker 1: she had cigarette burns on her. That's terrible, And they're like,
[43:51] Speaker 1: tell us about her relationship with the teachers. Well, she
[43:54] Speaker 1: outpaces some of them intellectually, but there's no animosity, which
[43:58] Speaker 1: is pretty funny. I feel like teachers are usually pretty
[44:00] Speaker 1: Uh there's animosity when a kid is smarter than you
[44:04] Speaker 1: other students. Uh, she says. They are all competitive here,
[44:08] Speaker 1: but they are fiercely loyal to one another. Are there
[44:10] Speaker 1: any loyal friends we can talk to? While she was
[44:12] Speaker 1: close with her roommate Jennifer Banks, So now we are
[44:15] Speaker 1: in the dorm room meeting Jennifer Banks, and it's Haley
[44:18] Speaker 1: Dunfey herself, Sarah Hyland, who I think is so great
[44:23] Speaker 1: in this episode. We've also seen her in the other
[44:25] Speaker 1: episode with Bosh where right, No, no.
[44:32] Speaker 2: But she's not in gymnastics. Wait, oh wait, let me look.
[44:37] Speaker 2: She's a little kid.
[44:39] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[44:40] Speaker 2: I think it's a family, like a dad pedophile family
[44:43] Speaker 2: and maybe someone lies. Yeah, let me look here they
[44:48] Speaker 2: kill the dad but he's actually not a pedophile and
[44:50] Speaker 2: the therapist was lying.
[44:51] Speaker 1: Is he she in that one? Yeah? She's in an
[44:53] Speaker 1: episode from season three, the first episode of season three
[44:57] Speaker 1: called Repression that the I just yes is the therapist
[45:01] Speaker 1: get bringing back memory, false memories. God, I'm good. That
[45:05] Speaker 1: felt good? Yeah felt yeah yeah yeah yeah so she
[45:10] Speaker 1: remember yeah yeah. And that episode is from She's Good
[45:14] Speaker 1: And I loved her, I like Hayley funny. Yeah, I
[45:20] Speaker 1: love her. I saw her at Kady No she's not.
[45:24] Speaker 1: And I saw at a party and sadly did not
[45:26] Speaker 1: say hi. But I should have n't been like, please
[45:27] Speaker 1: be on our podcast chance at the Thanksgiving Day parade,
[45:31] Speaker 1: and she did. She nailed it. Oh yeah, I forgot.
[45:34] Speaker 1: She's like a great singer. Yeah, she's like very talented.
[45:39] Speaker 1: All right. So we're in this dorm room, we're with
[45:42] Speaker 1: Sarah Hyland and she's like, I can't believe it. Elsa
[45:44] Speaker 1: was my best friend and she said no, she wasn't
[45:48] Speaker 1: fighting with anyone. And the teachers all love her. She's
[45:51] Speaker 1: the smartest kid in class. Even after she stopped studying,
[45:54] Speaker 1: everything came easy to her. She never had to cram.
[45:57] Speaker 1: All she does is win, win, win. And Jennifer plays
[46:00] Speaker 1: chess and is nine points away from becoming a candidate
[46:05] Speaker 1: master and the school hired two grand masters to coach her.
[46:07] Speaker 1: So Jennifer's also got stuff going on. Okay, what was
[46:11] Speaker 1: Elsa up to it when she was not studying, and
[46:13] Speaker 1: Jennifer acts like sketchy and goes, I don't really know,
[46:16] Speaker 1: and Olivia goes tell me, and she goes okay, and
[46:18] Speaker 1: then she's like that's it. Olivia just goes, no, but
[46:21] Speaker 1: tell me, and she goes all right, and then she
[46:23] Speaker 1: spills the tea and she says, Elsa would sneak out
[46:26] Speaker 1: at night. She didn't have a boyfriend, but she flirted
[46:28] Speaker 1: a lot. And she's like, I don't know where she
[46:30] Speaker 1: went because she wouldn't let me go with her. Oh,
[46:31] Speaker 1: I thought you were best friends. If your best like
[46:33] Speaker 1: immediately what But she didn't want anyone to see her
[46:37] Speaker 1: be bad. So when she snuck out, she dressed kind
[46:39] Speaker 1: of slutty and then she pulls out the Duffel bag
[46:41] Speaker 1: with patent leather pants, a mesh thong, et cetera. And
[46:45] Speaker 1: Jennifer goes, we have a dress code, like you could
[46:47] Speaker 1: get to marriage just for having that stuff. And if
[46:50] Speaker 1: her dad found out, and she goes, well, what's the
[46:53] Speaker 1: story with her dad? And she was like, well, Elsa
[46:55] Speaker 1: wouldn't talk about abuse. But when she changed I could
[46:58] Speaker 1: see the scars and the burns on her skin. Oh
[47:00] Speaker 1: my god. Now yeah. Now we're at the lich Coof
[47:03] Speaker 1: house in Queens and the father is distracting me because
[47:07] Speaker 1: he sounds like grew from Despicable Me. Okay, and I
[47:09] Speaker 1: would love it if there were some minions in this episode.
[47:12] Speaker 1: And he's like, Elsa's a genius. You have to let
[47:15] Speaker 1: her and uh she was recruited from and she's like,
[47:19] Speaker 1: he's a She's a genius prodigy like me. I know
[47:22] Speaker 1: how she feels. I was recruited from Ukraine to do
[47:25] Speaker 1: aerospace shit here in the US. And they're like, okay,
[47:28] Speaker 1: well why did you send her away? And he's like, more,
[47:30] Speaker 1: what was the best place for her? A superior inelect
[47:32] Speaker 1: does not come around very often. Elsa's gift had to
[47:35] Speaker 1: be nourished. And then he goes mother's coddle too much
[47:38] Speaker 1: and the mom is so sad and cradling a photo
[47:41] Speaker 1: of her dead daughter while her asshole husband talks about
[47:43] Speaker 1: how she was too soft on her and dad says
[47:47] Speaker 1: she needed discipline and Stabler's like, oh, like a dislocated
[47:50] Speaker 1: shoulder or being burnt by cigarettes as the dad puts
[47:53] Speaker 1: out a cigarette and uh, he goes, did you, Stabler goes,
[47:57] Speaker 1: did you know she was stinking out of school and
[47:59] Speaker 1: discipline her. And the dud goes, I never raised a
[48:02] Speaker 1: hand to her, and Stabler gets kissing distance away from
[48:05] Speaker 1: missus Litchkoff and goes, do you know anyone that would
[48:07] Speaker 1: hurt Elsa? And she looks terrified and you know, says no,
[48:12] Speaker 1: and he goes, I love Alsa, She's all I live for.
[48:15] Speaker 1: Like he just keeps like the way he talks. This
[48:17] Speaker 1: guy is so crazy to me. I don't think this
[48:19] Speaker 1: actor is even Russian, but I think he plays a
[48:22] Speaker 1: lot of Russian characters. But the dad starts to flip
[48:25] Speaker 1: and says, stop wasting my time and find the bastroom
[48:28] Speaker 1: who killed my shining star. So now we're back at
[48:31] Speaker 1: the precinct where Finn is giving us the lowdown on
[48:35] Speaker 1: Papa Lichkof. And he worked for Boeing for six months
[48:38] Speaker 1: and then got fired, and then Lakheed got hired him
[48:41] Speaker 1: and he got fired after a few months there also,
[48:44] Speaker 1: so it sounds like our genius is a dummy. So
[48:47] Speaker 1: he supports the family through scams and Ponzi schemes. He
[48:50] Speaker 1: has thirteen fraud cases against him right now, nothing violent,
[48:53] Speaker 1: but bank leans up the wazoo according to Finn, and
[48:56] Speaker 1: he owes the irs ae hundred k, so that could
[48:59] Speaker 1: drive someone over the edge. But Live goes to torture
[49:01] Speaker 1: your only child, and then we hear he tortured both
[49:05] Speaker 1: of us. We spin around and we see the actress
[49:08] Speaker 1: Aya Cash from Your the worst standing there, and she's like,
[49:12] Speaker 1: I'm Katrina Lichkoff, Elsa's older sister, the one my dad
[49:16] Speaker 1: threw away. So and she's in a little dying lady uniform. Yeah,
[49:21] Speaker 1: she's like in a little diner uniform, and she's got bangs.
[49:24] Speaker 1: And so now they're interviewing Katrina and she's like, dad said,
[49:28] Speaker 1: get with the programer get out, And the program was
[49:32] Speaker 1: unwavering dedication to intellectual superiority from the moment they were born.
[49:36] Speaker 1: She Katrina has an IQ of one hundred and thirty five,
[49:39] Speaker 1: which is high. I was looking it up and it's like,
[49:42] Speaker 1: I guess one hundred is kind of average. IQ. One
[49:45] Speaker 1: hundred and fifteen is like gifted, but like anywhere above
[49:48] Speaker 1: thirty is pretty up. One thirty is pretty smart. And
[49:51] Speaker 1: then Daddy and Elsa were both one hundred and sixty five,
[49:54] Speaker 1: she said, which is Einstein territory. And then they said,
[49:59] Speaker 1: well he died leaving the school to visit your parents.
[50:02] Speaker 1: Do you think your dad did it? And she's like, well,
[50:04] Speaker 1: you know, there's a secret area where he used to
[50:06] Speaker 1: teach us quote unquote, I'll show it to you. So
[50:09] Speaker 1: at the Lichkov house, Katrina brings Benson and Stabler downstairs
[50:13] Speaker 1: into a freezing cold basement and they're like, wow, it's
[50:16] Speaker 1: freezing cold down here. And Katrina goes, that's funny because
[50:19] Speaker 1: my dad used to call this hot housing, which is
[50:21] Speaker 1: an actual verb to which means to educate a child
[50:25] Speaker 1: to a high level at an earlier age than as usual.
[50:28] Speaker 1: So like you could say that school has a reputation
[50:30] Speaker 1: for hot housing its students, but also a hot house,
[50:34] Speaker 1: like where you grow an orchid, Benson points out, like
[50:36] Speaker 1: making something grow faster. So there's the name of the episode.
[50:40] Speaker 1: You can drink or puff or whatever you're doing. According
[50:43] Speaker 1: to the dad, cold stimulates the mond. You could do
[50:46] Speaker 1: a jumping jack if you don't want a substance. Yeah, yeah,
[50:51] Speaker 1: just get that like high that you get from doing
[50:53] Speaker 1: a couple of jumping jacks, just one and just one,
[50:57] Speaker 1: one single jack, A solitary jack. I had to do
[51:01] Speaker 1: one hundred jumping bocks in a jackosing class. I had
[51:06] Speaker 1: to do one hundred jumping jacks in a boxing class
[51:08] Speaker 1: last week, and it broke my spirit. Really what happened?
[51:11] Speaker 1: It was so hard. It was just so many jumping jacks.
[51:13] Speaker 1: It's like counting to one hundred. I don't want to
[51:15] Speaker 1: do that. But so she basically Katrina is reliving some
[51:22] Speaker 1: of this. She starts reciting a math rule like the
[51:25] Speaker 1: slope is only equal to its parts and slams a
[51:28] Speaker 1: yardstick on the table and so she goes, I learned
[51:33] Speaker 1: that on my sixth birthday and then shows them scars
[51:35] Speaker 1: on her arm. And then Stabler notices rice on the
[51:38] Speaker 1: ground and he goes, what's with the rice? Did he
[51:40] Speaker 1: force you to eat down here too? And it's like, no,
[51:42] Speaker 1: dumb ass, He made them kneel on the rice while
[51:44] Speaker 1: he drilled them. And she says, you know, at first
[51:47] Speaker 1: it's not so bad, but then it digs into your
[51:49] Speaker 1: skin and we see these like rice shaped scars on
[51:52] Speaker 1: her knees. It's like so fucked. And that feels like
[51:56] Speaker 1: it was a very big thing that happened in like
[51:59] Speaker 1: ancient There was like a church near where I lived
[52:01] Speaker 1: in Rome that was like famous for making people do
[52:06] Speaker 1: penance by like walking up the staircase on their knees
[52:10] Speaker 1: with rice on it like that just that was what
[52:12] Speaker 1: that reminds me of. And it just feels like an
[52:15] Speaker 1: old school torture like device. So she goes, I went
[52:21] Speaker 1: to school down here till I was sixteen, and then
[52:23] Speaker 1: last year he kicked me out to devote his time
[52:26] Speaker 1: to Elsa. And she's like, my dad was right. Look,
[52:28] Speaker 1: I could only get a job as a waitress. And
[52:30] Speaker 1: Olivia's like the voice of reason. She goes, girl, you
[52:33] Speaker 1: were sixteen. You didn't even get a chance to go
[52:34] Speaker 1: to college. Like, no one's really hiring a genius sixteen
[52:37] Speaker 1: year old to do anything without like a college degree.
[52:40] Speaker 1: You know. She's like, and I couldn't save my sister.
[52:43] Speaker 1: I wanted to take away from Papa. But more Wood
[52:45] Speaker 1: is just as bad. And the press, like they were
[52:47] Speaker 1: talking about the pressure is too intense, and they're like, yeah,
[52:51] Speaker 1: but apparently it wasn't even that hard for her, so
[52:54] Speaker 1: the pressure's not really hitting with Elsa. She goes, no,
[52:56] Speaker 1: the pressure to make money. Morewood gave her a scholarship,
[52:59] Speaker 1: but they also paid my dad a bonus for sending
[53:02] Speaker 1: her there, plus he entered her into competitions for prize money,
[53:05] Speaker 1: so they're getting the picture that she's the family cash cow.
[53:08] Speaker 1: And suddenly the mom and dad come home and the
[53:11] Speaker 1: mom is like Katrina and the dad goes, stop it.
[53:13] Speaker 1: She is dead to us, and she he goes, you're trespassing,
[53:17] Speaker 1: and I'm pressing charges, but Stabler arrests him immediately for
[53:20] Speaker 1: assaulting Elsa. So back in cement room, bars Grew is like,
[53:24] Speaker 1: I would never heard el saw. She's my pregnant joy
[53:27] Speaker 1: and lives like schwartz There at the end, I know
[53:31] Speaker 1: it's I'm having a hard time. I really, I've seen
[53:33] Speaker 1: a lot of where he's like my minions. But like
[53:38] Speaker 1: then I'm going Schwartzenegger. I need help, I need another,
[53:40] Speaker 1: I need a coach. So lives like, h, well she
[53:46] Speaker 1: missed a math problem and then what you beat her
[53:47] Speaker 1: like a mule. And then he's like, well it worked
[53:50] Speaker 1: for me. That's how I was taught, and I got
[53:52] Speaker 1: my PhD at twenty three. And now we're intercutting between
[53:55] Speaker 1: Live and the dad and Stabler and the mom, and
[53:58] Speaker 1: Craigan's on Walkie kind of playing both sides, relaying all
[54:02] Speaker 1: the information that they get from the wife to live
[54:04] Speaker 1: who I guess is like wearing an earpiece like a
[54:06] Speaker 1: football coach. I've never really seen them do that, but
[54:09] Speaker 1: here they are. The mom is like, actually, the mom
[54:14] Speaker 1: is actually outing the dad as like a flop genius,
[54:16] Speaker 1: Like he failed his PhD exam so they moved to
[54:19] Speaker 1: the US, and he just told everyone that he had
[54:21] Speaker 1: a degree and lives Like what about that? And then
[54:24] Speaker 1: Craigan's like, bring up the PhD and lives like you
[54:26] Speaker 1: sure about that PhD, honey, because we heard it doesn't exist,
[54:29] Speaker 1: And he's like, I'm very smart. And then he's like,
[54:32] Speaker 1: I love Alsa. What about Katrina? You kicked her out
[54:36] Speaker 1: for not being a genius? You love her too? And
[54:38] Speaker 1: he's like, I was only trying to provide for my family.
[54:39] Speaker 1: Katrina was never going to succeed. I couldn't waste my
[54:42] Speaker 1: time on her. Yeah, she was probably just going to
[54:44] Speaker 1: go to like a regular like Ivy League school and
[54:46] Speaker 1: like not you know, just become a lawyer or something
[54:48] Speaker 1: like really really bad. This man is unhinged. And I
[54:52] Speaker 1: bet you most CEOs don't even have a high IQ.
[54:54] Speaker 1: Like I don't even think IQ is what makes a
[54:57] Speaker 1: good Yeah, yeah, just to have you a socio not
[55:01] Speaker 1: give a fuck, unbridled ambition and no empathy. Yeah yeah,
[55:05] Speaker 1: pedophile socio CEOs. That's everything we're run by. And then
[55:10] Speaker 1: all these little cooks are just like whatever you want.
[55:13] Speaker 1: Pedophile daddies. Yeah, so crazy. So back to the wife.
[55:19] Speaker 1: She ain't happy, okay, She's like, he's always getting fired,
[55:22] Speaker 1: going to the casino to play cards, losing all her money.
[55:25] Speaker 1: She goes, I had to get a job cleaning offices
[55:27] Speaker 1: and then a second job and live. They're like, live.
[55:30] Speaker 1: He's a gambler. So now she goes, you piece of shit.
[55:33] Speaker 1: You're living it up in Atlantic City while your wife
[55:35] Speaker 1: breaks her back cleaning and he's like, yeah, I count cards.
[55:38] Speaker 1: It's easy money. And she's like, only if you're good
[55:40] Speaker 1: at it. You lost eighty k on blackjack in the
[55:42] Speaker 1: last year. This guy is a flop with delusions of grandeur.
[55:47] Speaker 1: Oh my god. So they're like, so you needed Elsa
[55:49] Speaker 1: to make money, and he keeps being like, I never
[55:52] Speaker 1: heard her. So we cut to the mom who's like,
[55:54] Speaker 1: I saw the bruises and the burns, and he kept
[55:57] Speaker 1: telling me it's what's best for her, and her grades
[55:59] Speaker 1: show that she was succeeding. So I let him do it.
[56:02] Speaker 1: I let him hurt my baby. And I just like
[56:04] Speaker 1: don't know if I feel bad for this dumb bitch
[56:06] Speaker 1: or not, because I'm sure he was hurting her too, like,
[56:08] Speaker 1: but she was like allowing it to happen, and she
[56:11] Speaker 1: allowed him to like, you know, exile her older daughter
[56:15] Speaker 1: as well, So I don't know, I can't decide. Liv
[56:18] Speaker 1: is pushing the dad, still accusing him of murdering Elsa
[56:22] Speaker 1: after she started rebelling, and then he freaks out. He
[56:25] Speaker 1: stands up and starts bashing his own head against the wall,
[56:28] Speaker 1: going forgive me, Elsa, forgive me. It's soup. It's wild,
[56:31] Speaker 1: Like we haven't really seen a self head bash in
[56:35] Speaker 1: a while. Liv tries to stop him. She's very shocked,
[56:39] Speaker 1: and she's like, bad bash is definitely jarring. Yeah, yeah,
[56:44] Speaker 1: like maybe it's Stabler doing it, you know, or a
[56:46] Speaker 1: perp grabs hung and puts him up against the wall.
[56:49] Speaker 1: We don't really see them doing it to themselves. And
[56:51] Speaker 1: he does it until he passes out, and then Craigan
[56:53] Speaker 1: yells someone call a bus, which is also sort of
[56:56] Speaker 1: SVU bingo. I would allow you to drink also for
[56:58] Speaker 1: that so Dad is now at the top of act
[57:01] Speaker 1: three getting wheeled off of a stretcher with around the
[57:03] Speaker 1: head bandage. Finn pipes in with some bad news for
[57:06] Speaker 1: the case. The casinos in Atlantic City say, Daddy dumbass
[57:09] Speaker 1: was down there for like two full days, so he's
[57:11] Speaker 1: not the guy who killed Elsa. Let's take another look
[57:14] Speaker 1: at the school. They go speak to three kids at
[57:16] Speaker 1: the school who have a rap sheet. The first is
[57:19] Speaker 1: a nerd who got busted for arson and I don't
[57:22] Speaker 1: know why, but I look this guy up because I
[57:24] Speaker 1: was like, oh, I wonder what if he's done anything else.
[57:27] Speaker 1: And he's played by a guy named Eric Gores, and
[57:30] Speaker 1: he is the son of a billionaire who is a
[57:32] Speaker 1: Forbes billionaire named Gores. I forgot the guy's first name.
[57:36] Speaker 1: And he used to live next door to Tom Arnold
[57:38] Speaker 1: and he was in a movie with Tom Arnold called
[57:40] Speaker 1: The Kid and I where Tom Arnold has to like
[57:45] Speaker 1: write a sequel to a movie that he was in
[57:47] Speaker 1: when he was a successful actor. Now he's washed up.
[57:49] Speaker 1: And then this kid who has cerebral palsy as this
[57:52] Speaker 1: actor Eric does is gonna it wants to be in
[57:54] Speaker 1: the movie. So I think it's like probably like a
[57:57] Speaker 1: touching buddy movie about overcoming your adversity and like also
[58:02] Speaker 1: finding your purpose after you're washed up. I guess I'm
[58:05] Speaker 1: assuming from the cover. And anyway, this kid is like
[58:09] Speaker 1: I was doing chemistry. I knocked over a Bunsen burner
[58:12] Speaker 1: and they're like, yeah, but the cop said there was accelerant.
[58:14] Speaker 1: He goes, duh, I need accelerant. That's the organic compounds
[58:17] Speaker 1: I need for my research. I'm not like a kid
[58:19] Speaker 1: playing pyro. Okay, I have three patents and I'm going
[58:22] Speaker 1: to Harvard in the fall, so let's move on. Next Nerd.
[58:25] Speaker 1: He was like, I was with my older brother for
[58:27] Speaker 1: a breaking and enter ring robbery. When I knew what
[58:29] Speaker 1: was going on, I ran. The judge bought it, made
[58:31] Speaker 1: me a deal with my parents, and sent me to
[58:33] Speaker 1: more Wood, which he said is basically the same as jail.
[58:35] Speaker 1: So he's being punished as well. The last kid is
[58:38] Speaker 1: a douchebag. Okay, he's maybe the only one we've talked
[58:41] Speaker 1: to you so far with social skills, but he seems
[58:42] Speaker 1: like a douche He got accused of rape too, and
[58:45] Speaker 1: he goes, there wasn't even any sex. But he's like,
[58:48] Speaker 1: but I rejected this girl when I told her it
[58:50] Speaker 1: was one and done and she flipped out. And it's like,
[58:52] Speaker 1: but one and done means that there was sex. Do you?
[58:56] Speaker 1: I don't know if you understand that. So, like the
[58:57] Speaker 1: something about that story is that how you get into Morewood?
[59:00] Speaker 1: Huh yeah? Yeah. So anyway, he's like this, He's like,
[59:04] Speaker 1: my story doesn't really matter. Like what he wanted know
[59:06] Speaker 1: about Elsa? She liked older guys, and Finn goes, how old?
[59:11] Speaker 1: And he goes, oh, not like pervy old like you?
[59:13] Speaker 1: And Finn is stonefaced, zero reaction. It's amazing. I love
[59:17] Speaker 1: it so much. A former grad, he says, named Danny Burke.
[59:21] Speaker 1: He lives in Newark. Now he's a former grad of Morewood.
[59:24] Speaker 1: So now we're at Danny's place and he's twenty three
[59:27] Speaker 1: years old and he's never dated Elsa, but he met
[59:29] Speaker 1: her at a party and he became like a big
[59:31] Speaker 1: brother to her. I mean again, this goes back to,
[59:34] Speaker 1: like Drake and Millie Bobby Brown, are we needing to
[59:36] Speaker 1: in our twenties be big big brother sister figures to teens,
[59:43] Speaker 1: not in an official capacity like through the Big Brothers
[59:45] Speaker 1: and Sisters of America organization like I don't know, not
[59:48] Speaker 1: through a cousin, not through like a family friend, just
[59:51] Speaker 1: like you know, so who knows? I don't know. But
[59:53] Speaker 1: Olivia is like, oh, wow, yeah, I'm sure she really
[59:56] Speaker 1: wanted to be like her big bro in this dump
[59:58] Speaker 1: of an apartment and get up a promising future for
[1:00:01] Speaker 1: a dead end life. And this dump, she says, and
[1:00:04] Speaker 1: he goes, yeah, whatever, but it's my dump and I
[1:00:06] Speaker 1: don't have to do what they tell me to do,
[1:00:07] Speaker 1: and he starts into imitating the indoctrination at more Wood
[1:00:11] Speaker 1: like while he plays on some weird soundbar which I
[1:00:14] Speaker 1: did look up and it is called a theremin. It
[1:00:17] Speaker 1: is a unique touchless a lot of looking up. You
[1:00:20] Speaker 1: know what the theorem in was in my subtitles, so
[1:00:23] Speaker 1: I just googled what it was, okay. And because it
[1:00:26] Speaker 1: says strums theoremon you know, like place like in you
[1:00:31] Speaker 1: know what it is, I know about it. Oh okay,
[1:00:33] Speaker 1: I didn't know what they were.
[1:00:34] Speaker 2: It's because I saw a video on the internet of
[1:00:36] Speaker 2: a like a woman got one for Christmas and she
[1:00:39] Speaker 2: was so happy and it was just like fun to
[1:00:42] Speaker 2: watch her. Oh that's yeah, So that's why I know,
[1:00:45] Speaker 2: not like an old time. It's not like an old
[1:00:47] Speaker 2: time past time of mine.
[1:00:49] Speaker 1: It feels like something like Reggie Watts would love to
[1:00:51] Speaker 1: have part of his act. You know. It's like a
[1:00:53] Speaker 1: touchless electronic instrument that was invented by a Russian physicist,
[1:00:57] Speaker 1: Leon Thereman in nineteen twenty out. You know, Russia's given
[1:01:01] Speaker 1: us some gifts, the theoremon being one. Uh, he says
[1:01:05] Speaker 1: more Wood. This guy, Danny goes Morewood was toxic. I
[1:01:08] Speaker 1: dropped out a month before graduation. I couldn't take it anymore.
[1:01:11] Speaker 1: Neither could Elsa. We just wanted to be kids, not
[1:01:14] Speaker 1: their fucking robot. She hated it there. She wanted a
[1:01:17] Speaker 1: way out. I mean, she looked pretty happy clutching that
[1:01:19] Speaker 1: math prize. But I guess she was a good actor.
[1:01:21] Speaker 1: And then they're like, oh, away out like through a window,
[1:01:25] Speaker 1: dressed like a slut, says Stabler. Okay, they bring up
[1:01:29] Speaker 1: the slutty clothes and he's like, you guys got it wrong.
[1:01:32] Speaker 1: That's not Elsa. And they're like, well we heard that
[1:01:34] Speaker 1: from Jennifer, and he's like, well, Elsa hated that little bitch,
[1:01:37] Speaker 1: like she like bought her way into Morewood. But she
[1:01:40] Speaker 1: was never as smart as Elsa, and she was pathologically
[1:01:43] Speaker 1: jealous of Elsa. She begged her to tank just one
[1:01:45] Speaker 1: exam so she could be number one. So wow, this
[1:01:48] Speaker 1: twenty three year old guy really knows what's up with
[1:01:50] Speaker 1: all the fourteen year olds at his old high school.
[1:01:53] Speaker 1: Like he really is just tuned in to what's happening
[1:01:56] Speaker 1: at the old alma mater. Elsa asked for a new
[1:01:59] Speaker 1: roommate at the school said no, so she just gave
[1:02:01] Speaker 1: Jennifer the silent treatment, and they're like, how did that go?
[1:02:04] Speaker 1: And he goes, you ever see a nerd spaz out?
[1:02:07] Speaker 1: It's ugly. So now they go talk to Jennifer and
[1:02:10] Speaker 1: she's acting one eighty different than she was the other day.
[1:02:13] Speaker 1: The other day she's like a chill nerd being like,
[1:02:16] Speaker 1: check out this stuffel bag of mesh thongs, And now
[1:02:18] Speaker 1: she's like playing chess hyper focus. They're asking her questions
[1:02:22] Speaker 1: and she's not answering, but she's not looking up from
[1:02:24] Speaker 1: her game at all. And she says, what the sludy
[1:02:27] Speaker 1: clothes remind from Halloween? Also like them, so I let
[1:02:29] Speaker 1: her wear them. And then they tell her, well, they
[1:02:32] Speaker 1: know that you and Elsa aren't friends, and she's like well,
[1:02:34] Speaker 1: who told you that she's And they're like Danny, she goes,
[1:02:37] Speaker 1: He's a prevaricator synonym for liar, and prevaricator does remind
[1:02:41] Speaker 1: me of Margo Kidder's line from the Chadlow episode where
[1:02:46] Speaker 1: from Peak, where she goes, I don't like cryptic conversations.
[1:02:50] Speaker 1: They require a prevaricating nature that I don't possess. It's
[1:02:53] Speaker 1: like one of my favorite lines from this show. Ever,
[1:02:56] Speaker 1: so whenever anyone talks about prevarication, I like to bring
[1:02:59] Speaker 1: that up. She tells them, I don't have time for
[1:03:02] Speaker 1: elsa murder talk. I've got a chess tournament and I'm
[1:03:04] Speaker 1: freaking out. I need to study Molnar Nagy nineteen sixty six,
[1:03:07] Speaker 1: but I'm in Zugzwang and if I could solve it,
[1:03:11] Speaker 1: I could. And she starts going over all these chess
[1:03:13] Speaker 1: moves like maybe it's BHDG. I mean, she's like, she
[1:03:15] Speaker 1: does not have the cool of the Queen's Gambit woman. Okay,
[1:03:17] Speaker 1: she's freaking out, so she starts to get really shaky
[1:03:20] Speaker 1: and teary and asks for her mom. So, now at
[1:03:23] Speaker 1: the precinct, Jennifer's mom, Suzanne, walks in, and this woman's
[1:03:26] Speaker 1: been in a bunch of other s fews, but like
[1:03:28] Speaker 1: nothing that I recall being remembering too well. And she
[1:03:32] Speaker 1: sees Jennifer through the grass and she's like, why is
[1:03:33] Speaker 1: she alone in there? What did you do to her?
[1:03:35] Speaker 1: And Stabler goes, you mean what did she do to Elsa?
[1:03:37] Speaker 1: And the mom's like, weren't they best friends? So now
[1:03:40] Speaker 1: in interrogation, the first thing Jennifer says is I'm glad
[1:03:43] Speaker 1: Elsa's dead, and she's like, she got all the attention scholarship.
[1:03:47] Speaker 1: She's like, we have to be the best. There's no
[1:03:50] Speaker 1: second place, and the school wants us to push each other,
[1:03:52] Speaker 1: but it wasn't fair. She never studied. I worked so hard,
[1:03:55] Speaker 1: but she was smarter than me. She goes, I'm smart,
[1:03:57] Speaker 1: but she's a genius, and talk to me. She ignored me,
[1:04:01] Speaker 1: like I was too insignificant and stupid to waste time on.
[1:04:04] Speaker 1: And she starts pacing. I mean, this whole scene is
[1:04:06] Speaker 1: like so fucking good, like I would love I bet
[1:04:10] Speaker 1: you this is a good audition scene, like if you
[1:04:13] Speaker 1: can memorize this whole thing and like do it really well?
[1:04:15] Speaker 1: Pretty good saying she starts pacing, being like I just
[1:04:20] Speaker 1: wanted to be the best and like she didn't even
[1:04:22] Speaker 1: want to go to MIT, she was going to drop out,
[1:04:24] Speaker 1: so why couldn't she just let me win? She couldn't
[1:04:26] Speaker 1: speak to me, so I followed her onto the ferry,
[1:04:28] Speaker 1: and then when she went to go visit Danny, she
[1:04:30] Speaker 1: couldn't run away from me in the middle of the
[1:04:31] Speaker 1: Hudson River and her mom's like, okay, baby, let's quiet, now,
[1:04:34] Speaker 1: let's zip it up. But she can't stop. She's like
[1:04:36] Speaker 1: word vomiting. She's like, I'm so sick of everyone telling
[1:04:39] Speaker 1: me what to do, what to say, what to think,
[1:04:42] Speaker 1: And she just wanted to talk to her, but Elsa
[1:04:44] Speaker 1: screamed at her and called her a loser, empathetic and dumb,
[1:04:46] Speaker 1: and said she was only at Morewood because her family
[1:04:48] Speaker 1: is rich and she would never succeed on brain brains alone.
[1:04:52] Speaker 1: She grabbed her arm and she pushed her, and then
[1:04:54] Speaker 1: she jabbed her in the chest with the pen and
[1:04:56] Speaker 1: then grabbed her hair and slammed her head into the
[1:04:58] Speaker 1: railing over and and over. And then when she's done
[1:05:02] Speaker 1: telling the story, she's like creepy smiling, like she's like
[1:05:05] Speaker 1: crying smiling. It's manic. Okay, everyone was inside. She said
[1:05:09] Speaker 1: no one saw this happen because they were all inside
[1:05:11] Speaker 1: because it was raining. Elsa tried to scream, but the
[1:05:14] Speaker 1: fairy horn started to blow so no one could hear her.
[1:05:17] Speaker 1: And this girl really timed this attack very perfectly to
[1:05:19] Speaker 1: all this like noise sound effects. That's when she fell
[1:05:23] Speaker 1: and I pushed her into the river and she goes, Mommy,
[1:05:25] Speaker 1: look I'm the best. Now I'm number one? Aren't you
[1:05:27] Speaker 1: happy for me? And like the mom looks like she's
[1:05:29] Speaker 1: gonna throw up, and I'm just gonna tell Rosie to
[1:05:32] Speaker 1: aim for bees. I'm sorry, like this is too much
[1:05:34] Speaker 1: like watching this soul scene. I'm like, do the best
[1:05:36] Speaker 1: you can. Also, yeah, because it's like all right, I'll say,
[1:05:40] Speaker 1: maybe she's not that dumb, like she's a dumb bitch,
[1:05:44] Speaker 1: but like she's still not the you know what I mean? Yeah,
[1:05:48] Speaker 1: you mean Jennifer. Jennifer's still kind of smart, you know
[1:05:51] Speaker 1: what I mean? Dude. They later say she has an
[1:05:53] Speaker 1: IQ of one sixty, so she's smart. She's just not like,
[1:05:57] Speaker 1: you know, maybe it just like doesn't come to her
[1:06:00] Speaker 1: as easily as this girl in terms of like test taking,
[1:06:02] Speaker 1: you know, like there's a million ways to be smart.
[1:06:06] Speaker 2: Yeah, but I always go back to Eureka being like,
[1:06:08] Speaker 2: no one even knows how hard drag race is, and
[1:06:11] Speaker 2: then Bob going, oh, it's easy for me.
[1:06:16] Speaker 1: It's like one of my favorite things I think about it.
[1:06:19] Speaker 1: I mean, he's not wrong there, It's did seem quite
[1:06:22] Speaker 1: easy for him. But I also was realizing one thing,
[1:06:27] Speaker 1: like we've just heard exactly how the crime went down.
[1:06:30] Speaker 1: We don't get to the bottom of why Elsa was
[1:06:32] Speaker 1: found in the water in her underwear, Like did this
[1:06:35] Speaker 1: bitch like rip her skirt off before she threw her overboard?
[1:06:38] Speaker 1: Like maybe the waves. I don't know. Yeah, she's like
[1:06:41] Speaker 1: not in her underwear, which is like what led them
[1:06:44] Speaker 1: to think that she was like a sex worker immediately,
[1:06:46] Speaker 1: and they never addressed that. Just another catch from someone
[1:06:50] Speaker 1: that's watched these episodes twelve thousand times. Anyway. Top of
[1:06:55] Speaker 1: the final act, Benson and Stable are downloading gray Lick.
[1:06:57] Speaker 1: They're like, well, this girl made a full confession. The
[1:06:59] Speaker 1: mom left it happen, and gray looks like foaming at
[1:07:02] Speaker 1: the mouth to prosecute this child and lives like, okay,
[1:07:05] Speaker 1: but there are some issues and Graylett goes, oh, cue
[1:07:07] Speaker 1: the violins, and Benson as Stabler are like, well, she's
[1:07:10] Speaker 1: a child, she needs help, she's fourteen, Like, can't we
[1:07:13] Speaker 1: just try her as a juvenile? And Gray looks like
[1:07:15] Speaker 1: I would if I could, but it's not my call.
[1:07:17] Speaker 1: I got Warner's results on the tide charts and Elsa's
[1:07:20] Speaker 1: body went into the river just off Hoboken. So done done,
[1:07:25] Speaker 1: this is Jersey's case.
[1:07:26] Speaker 2: Yeah, because I was kind of shocked at how early
[1:07:28] Speaker 2: the confession was, you know, I'm like I was, yes
[1:07:30] Speaker 2: early in the episode.
[1:07:32] Speaker 1: Yeah. And also I didn't realize that, like if something
[1:07:38] Speaker 1: happens in the Hudson River, is it just whichever is
[1:07:41] Speaker 1: like a little bit closer, Like does it happen you know,
[1:07:43] Speaker 1: like is it a little closer to New York or
[1:07:45] Speaker 1: a little closer to New Jersey then it's there. Or
[1:07:48] Speaker 1: like if something happens in the East River, is it
[1:07:51] Speaker 1: Manhattan or is it Queens that takes it? You know,
[1:07:53] Speaker 1: based on where the body washes up. I guess, But
[1:07:56] Speaker 1: like this, for this, it was phone floating in the water.
[1:07:59] Speaker 1: So although I did think the people doing tai chi
[1:08:03] Speaker 1: were in oh, it floated back. It floated back to Manhattan. Okay,
[1:08:07] Speaker 1: So anyway, Gray Lick is like, yeah, bad news for Jenny.
[1:08:11] Speaker 1: New Jersey tries kids her age as adults and sends
[1:08:14] Speaker 1: them to prison for life. And I didn't realize New
[1:08:17] Speaker 1: Jersey there was one more bad thing about New Jersey, Like,
[1:08:19] Speaker 1: I had no idea they were this strict about kid crime.
[1:08:24] Speaker 1: But Benson and Sabler are now walking and talking with
[1:08:28] Speaker 1: the bitchy New Jersey Ada, and she's played by Gretchen eGolf.
[1:08:34] Speaker 1: She's playing New Jersey Ada Kendra Gill And this is
[1:08:37] Speaker 1: the first of four s FU episodes that we see
[1:08:39] Speaker 1: Kendra Gill in, so she's in a few more. So
[1:08:41] Speaker 1: they're trying to explain to this Ada that Jennifer is
[1:08:44] Speaker 1: just a troubled girl, not a stone cold killer. And
[1:08:47] Speaker 1: she's like, well, there's lots of trouble girls in the world,
[1:08:49] Speaker 1: and most of them don't all commit murder. And Sabler
[1:08:51] Speaker 1: is like, yeah, but the only other country in the
[1:08:53] Speaker 1: world that charges kids as adult is Somalia? Is that
[1:08:55] Speaker 1: really a club you want to belong to? And she's like, whatever,
[1:08:58] Speaker 1: I just enforce the laws I don't make. And he's like, well,
[1:09:01] Speaker 1: you put three kids in the past eight months away
[1:09:04] Speaker 1: for life, two Black one Latino. I bet like if
[1:09:07] Speaker 1: you put away a rich white girl, it'll make you
[1:09:09] Speaker 1: look colorblind. And so he's like accusing her of being
[1:09:11] Speaker 1: like using this as like a political chess move, and
[1:09:14] Speaker 1: the Ada is like she has a one sixty IQ
[1:09:17] Speaker 1: genius with no hard background or mental issues that have
[1:09:21] Speaker 1: been reported. And Olivia is like really going hard for Jennifer, saying, look,
[1:09:25] Speaker 1: she's not a psychopath, but she seemed pretty psycho in
[1:09:28] Speaker 1: the confession I'm not having alive. It's druggy, you know,
[1:09:31] Speaker 1: it's like drug eaved for me. Yeah, but like, why
[1:09:33] Speaker 1: hasn't she undergone a psych evaluation? Like we're already at trial,
[1:09:37] Speaker 1: Like what I mean? I guess they're just trying to
[1:09:40] Speaker 1: do what they can. But it's just funny to me
[1:09:43] Speaker 1: the way this episode plays out, because I don't think
[1:09:45] Speaker 1: anything would play out like this at all in real life.
[1:09:48] Speaker 1: Like I mean, I could explain more in a second,
[1:09:52] Speaker 1: but like, so the Ada is like she knew right
[1:09:56] Speaker 1: from wrong. She's cold and conniving and she's going to
[1:09:58] Speaker 1: face the consequences. And the hearing is tomorrow and I'm
[1:10:01] Speaker 1: calling you both as witnesses. Bye. So now we're in
[1:10:04] Speaker 1: the New Jersey court room and Jennifer is sitting there
[1:10:06] Speaker 1: in an orange jumpsuit, which I clocked, and the Wikipedia
[1:10:11] Speaker 1: of Sbu was like, no lawyer would let her do that.
[1:10:14] Speaker 1: It makes you look like a criminal to the jury.
[1:10:16] Speaker 1: Most people do not go into court in their orange
[1:10:19] Speaker 1: jumpsuit or their jumpsuit from jail. You're allowed to put
[1:10:22] Speaker 1: on other clothes specifically because it like humanizes you to
[1:10:25] Speaker 1: the jury. I think sometimes when we see people go
[1:10:28] Speaker 1: in in the jumpsuit, it's because they're pleading guilty or
[1:10:32] Speaker 1: like they're going to allocute or something, because I really
[1:10:34] Speaker 1: think most times you get put into regular clothes. We
[1:10:38] Speaker 1: have so many lawyers. I'm sure you guys are going
[1:10:40] Speaker 1: to write in and tell me what the deal is
[1:10:41] Speaker 1: with that. But so now we're bouncing back and forth
[1:10:44] Speaker 1: between Benson and Stabler's testimony. On the stand. She gets
[1:10:48] Speaker 1: Kendrick Gill gets Benson to admit that Jennifer had no
[1:10:50] Speaker 1: remorse and said she was glad that Elsa was dead.
[1:10:53] Speaker 1: Olivia tries to soften it and say that Jennifer jabbed
[1:10:57] Speaker 1: Elsa with a pen, and the EDA is like, was
[1:10:59] Speaker 1: it a job or was it a stab? Because the
[1:11:01] Speaker 1: Emmy report talks about stab wounds, so there's not really
[1:11:04] Speaker 1: jab wounds. It feels like a different thing. And also
[1:11:07] Speaker 1: Olivia admitted that Jennifer confessed to everything. And then and
[1:11:11] Speaker 1: you know, cut to Jennifer tapping her fingers on the table,
[1:11:13] Speaker 1: not focusing on what's happening, like she looks like she's
[1:11:15] Speaker 1: having a mental breakdown. And any lawyer would be like,
[1:11:19] Speaker 1: let's do mentally unfit to stand trial. Let's do something here,
[1:11:23] Speaker 1: like we're just gonna let a teen. But this is
[1:11:26] Speaker 1: the this is the trial to determine whether it's going
[1:11:28] Speaker 1: to go to family court or adult court. So now
[1:11:31] Speaker 1: it's Jennifer's lawyer's turn, and Stabler says that Jennifer did
[1:11:35] Speaker 1: not come to the boat with plans to kill Elsa,
[1:11:38] Speaker 1: only to talk, and Liv says that she has the
[1:11:40] Speaker 1: intellect of an adult, but the emotions of a child.
[1:11:43] Speaker 1: She was forced to compete and excel in a grown
[1:11:45] Speaker 1: up world and she cracked. Can that crack be repaired,
[1:11:47] Speaker 1: the lawyer asked, and Liv goes, only if she gets help.
[1:11:50] Speaker 1: Feels like an objection A. Benson's not a psychologist, but whatever,
[1:11:53] Speaker 1: I'm not a lawyer. On cross Gil asks Stabler if
[1:11:58] Speaker 1: Jennifer knew her actions were wrong, and he goes, I'm
[1:12:00] Speaker 1: not a shrink. He's like, I'm not going to speculate
[1:12:02] Speaker 1: on that, and then Gil asked Stabler, well, what about
[1:12:06] Speaker 1: the whole fake story with the clothes and the slutty
[1:12:08] Speaker 1: sneaking out and everything. That was a false narrative that
[1:12:10] Speaker 1: she concocted to cover her own tracks. And at that point,
[1:12:14] Speaker 1: the judge goes, I've heard enough. I'm going to hear
[1:12:16] Speaker 1: this case in adult court, because that's the other thing.
[1:12:19] Speaker 1: It's like, I'm all for where this episode goes, like
[1:12:22] Speaker 1: trying to make a statement about drugs and stuff like that,
[1:12:25] Speaker 1: but like she did fully cover her tracks and lie
[1:12:29] Speaker 1: to the cops, and she was within her right mind
[1:12:31] Speaker 1: doing all that covering up her tracks, So I don't know.
[1:12:35] Speaker 1: So the judge says adult court, and the bitchy Ada
[1:12:38] Speaker 1: goes game over, thanks for your help to Stabler on
[1:12:41] Speaker 1: the stand, which is pretty unprofessional. But then also when
[1:12:44] Speaker 1: Jennifer hears game over ding ding ding, that's like a
[1:12:47] Speaker 1: fucking buzzer. She flips out. She's like, it's never game over,
[1:12:51] Speaker 1: there's always another move, which I don't think is how
[1:12:53] Speaker 1: chess works, like the game does, and yeah, you gotta
[1:12:57] Speaker 1: know the rules of chess if you're going to be
[1:12:59] Speaker 1: a grandmaster, and I don't even know them, and she
[1:13:02] Speaker 1: starts having a fully manic episode. She's talking to herself.
[1:13:05] Speaker 1: She gets up on the table like off the courtroom
[1:13:07] Speaker 1: and like, I'm like, how have we not tried mental
[1:13:10] Speaker 1: disease or defect? Is what I've written in my notes?
[1:13:13] Speaker 1: And Benson and Stabler and the bailiffs have to carry
[1:13:16] Speaker 1: her out of the courtroom. Her mom looks distressed, but like,
[1:13:19] Speaker 1: not that upset. Her mom looks like, oh god, this
[1:13:21] Speaker 1: is gonna be annoying. And then the girl the guards
[1:13:24] Speaker 1: carry her to a holding cell. She calls them stupid idiots.
[1:13:27] Speaker 1: They throw her in a cell and then it's just
[1:13:29] Speaker 1: her and Olivia alone, and she's I mean again, it's
[1:13:32] Speaker 1: like Olivia doesn't have other cases to work on. This
[1:13:33] Speaker 1: is like a New Jersey case now. But she's like
[1:13:35] Speaker 1: following it through and they throw her in a cell.
[1:13:38] Speaker 1: She's begging Olivia. She's like, wait, don't go, why am
[1:13:41] Speaker 1: I here? She doesn't even remember why she's there, and
[1:13:44] Speaker 1: Olivia is like, uh, do you remember killing your roommate?
[1:13:47] Speaker 1: She's like, I did. Nothing makes sense, It's all black.
[1:13:50] Speaker 1: I'm trapped in a chess game and I don't remember
[1:13:52] Speaker 1: sitting down to play, and lives like, Sweetie, you confessed,
[1:13:55] Speaker 1: and she goes, I can remember things, but then I can't.
[1:13:57] Speaker 1: Am I dreaming. I can't be. I can't be dreaming
[1:14:00] Speaker 1: because I don't sleep. I never sleep. I go for
[1:14:02] Speaker 1: days until I crash. And she's like, how do you
[1:14:05] Speaker 1: do that? She goes, I use my secret weapon, and
[1:14:07] Speaker 1: she admits, admits to taking pro vigil, which I do
[1:14:11] Speaker 1: like that name. They've got a lot of you know, aptrill,
[1:14:13] Speaker 1: They've got all these like names for fake drugs on
[1:14:14] Speaker 1: the show. Provigil is like a good that could totally
[1:14:18] Speaker 1: be like an add medication, and I like it. The
[1:14:21] Speaker 1: SVU it basically it's the SVU name for like Riddle
[1:14:24] Speaker 1: and adderall concert of vive ance whatever. She helps her,
[1:14:27] Speaker 1: She says it helps her study. She buys it from
[1:14:29] Speaker 1: kids with add Everyone is on drugs at more Wood.
[1:14:32] Speaker 1: The school tells you how to game your doctor into
[1:14:35] Speaker 1: prescribing it to you. But then, why haven't you gained
[1:14:37] Speaker 1: a doctor into prescribing it for you? Why are you
[1:14:39] Speaker 1: buying it anyway? Whatever, She has plenty of money, so
[1:14:41] Speaker 1: it doesn't matter, But how long have you been awake?
[1:14:43] Speaker 1: How long had you been awake? Live asks the day
[1:14:46] Speaker 1: that you killed Elsa and she goes six days, which
[1:14:49] Speaker 1: like fuck, and she goes, I was cramming for exams,
[1:14:54] Speaker 1: and then she said I took more when I was
[1:14:55] Speaker 1: prepping for the chess tournament. So how long have you
[1:14:57] Speaker 1: been up? Now? She's like three days. But it's not
[1:15:00] Speaker 1: working this time. My mind is a jigsaw puzzle. It's
[1:15:02] Speaker 1: a mess, like we can't put it back. To live
[1:15:05] Speaker 1: longer without food than without sleep, yeah, yeah, sleep is.
[1:15:10] Speaker 3: Well.
[1:15:11] Speaker 2: We were famous in an uber car ride where the
[1:15:15] Speaker 2: driver fell asleep at the road.
[1:15:17] Speaker 1: Famously, Lisa saved my life keeping an eye on a
[1:15:19] Speaker 1: falling asleep Uber driver who I thought was just trying
[1:15:22] Speaker 1: to weave in between cones for fun. Okay, I was
[1:15:26] Speaker 1: like not paying attention at all.
[1:15:28] Speaker 2: And I'll still never forgive you for giving him five stars.
[1:15:33] Speaker 2: I know he shouldn't be on the road. I was
[1:15:36] Speaker 2: trying to get out of the app. I'm sorry.
[1:15:38] Speaker 1: I shouldn't have done that. I think I wrote I
[1:15:40] Speaker 1: think kipp him though no, and I did, And I
[1:15:43] Speaker 1: think I wrote a report. I just gave five stars
[1:15:46] Speaker 1: to get to the screen to like give feedback, and
[1:15:48] Speaker 1: I gave a report that said he was driving dangerously
[1:15:51] Speaker 1: he fell asleep. But yeah, but I was like, you
[1:15:54] Speaker 1: were like how many stars? I was like, oh, I
[1:15:56] Speaker 1: don't know, five, just so I could get to the report. Sorry,
[1:15:59] Speaker 1: I'll never live it down. I'll never live it down.
[1:16:01] Speaker 1: Just like saying I thought that you drank ful fat
[1:16:03] Speaker 1: coke once. Okay, so you didn't say it. You brought
[1:16:07] Speaker 1: me a full fac I brought you. I brought you
[1:16:09] Speaker 1: a full fat coke. Stupid, very stupid. I brought you
[1:16:12] Speaker 1: what I would drink. I was only thinking of myself.
[1:16:15] Speaker 1: So she says to them that now she's been up
[1:16:19] Speaker 1: for three fucking days and it's not working this time.
[1:16:22] Speaker 1: It's not she's not having her beautiful mind moment anymore,
[1:16:25] Speaker 1: where everything falls into place and she can write a
[1:16:27] Speaker 1: play in a day. Okay. She's like, my mind is
[1:16:29] Speaker 1: a jigsaw puzzle. It's a mess. I can't put anything together.
[1:16:32] Speaker 1: Please please bring me some provigil, and Olivia says, tell
[1:16:35] Speaker 1: me where it is. So now we've got Olivia going
[1:16:38] Speaker 1: to her dorm room while Jennifer's voice narrates what's happening. Okay,
[1:16:42] Speaker 1: she goes, it's in my room. I have it hidden
[1:16:45] Speaker 1: so that no one can take away my secret, like
[1:16:47] Speaker 1: even though all the kids at school are using it.
[1:16:49] Speaker 1: And she has hidden it in the spine of a
[1:16:51] Speaker 1: book that Olivia has to slice open with a knife,
[1:16:53] Speaker 1: So I don't know how she's getting in and out
[1:16:55] Speaker 1: to get it, but Live's got the tools. Jennifer's talking
[1:16:58] Speaker 1: about how she takes one pill and she's Einstein. She
[1:17:01] Speaker 1: wrote a play in one night. Her brain was finally working,
[1:17:04] Speaker 1: like probably the way she imagines that Elsa's brain works
[1:17:07] Speaker 1: with nothing at all. Meanwhile, Live opens a journal and
[1:17:10] Speaker 1: the first few pages look normal, like immaculate handwriting, and
[1:17:13] Speaker 1: then a couple of pages in crazy serial killer spirals
[1:17:18] Speaker 1: where the words are written all over each other, swirling
[1:17:20] Speaker 1: all over the place. And she said, I realized I
[1:17:23] Speaker 1: could talk to Elsa and make her like me again.
[1:17:25] Speaker 1: So now we're with Melinda and she's looking at this
[1:17:28] Speaker 1: fucking serial killer notebook shit, and she goes. This kind
[1:17:31] Speaker 1: of hypergraphia is common with provigial abuse. It was developed
[1:17:35] Speaker 1: provigil to treat narcolepsy and other sleep disorders, but then
[1:17:38] Speaker 1: the military found out that it can keep you awake
[1:17:40] Speaker 1: and they gave it to soldiers in the field, and
[1:17:42] Speaker 1: it is a good treatment for add if you use
[1:17:44] Speaker 1: it right. And Olivia's not buying it though, She's like,
[1:17:48] Speaker 1: you think all those Morewood kids have add Sorry nowadays
[1:17:52] Speaker 1: everyone says ADHD. But Melinda says she'll tip off a
[1:17:56] Speaker 1: friend in the health department to see if we can
[1:17:57] Speaker 1: stop the pill pushing. Jennifer was up for six days straight,
[1:18:02] Speaker 1: and Melinda goes, well, the record is eleven. The Guinness
[1:18:04] Speaker 1: Book had to stop recognizing it because of deadly health
[1:18:08] Speaker 1: risks because people were like trying to beat the record.
[1:18:11] Speaker 1: And that's why Dan Pathon's real? Or was that just
[1:18:14] Speaker 1: like in sitcoms for the Guinness Book. I don't know, no,
[1:18:18] Speaker 1: just in general, like fundraising, dance a thons, you know, yeah,
[1:18:22] Speaker 1: I think those are real. I think those are real.
[1:18:23] Speaker 1: We got to bring back Dan Pathons, Dan Pathons, Yeah,
[1:18:27] Speaker 1: I didn't do a dance Pathon. You heard it here first.
[1:18:31] Speaker 1: It's like not the same thing, but like hands on
[1:18:33] Speaker 1: a hard body. Also, isn't that such a weird thing
[1:18:37] Speaker 1: that it's how long can you touch a car? Yeah?
[1:18:41] Speaker 1: So weird? Else, Oh yeah, but now we've got Melinda,
[1:18:48] Speaker 1: what what you also earlier said solitary Jack. That made
[1:18:57] Speaker 1: me laugh too, and you didn't get shit. Okay, So
[1:19:04] Speaker 1: Melinda's giving us like the four one one on sleep,
[1:19:07] Speaker 1: like what you just said about food. She's like, that's
[1:19:09] Speaker 1: why sleep deprivation is a torture technique. Like one study
[1:19:12] Speaker 1: found that seventeen hours without sleep is like having a
[1:19:15] Speaker 1: point zero five blood alcohol. So I guess me personally,
[1:19:18] Speaker 1: I'm always a little bit drunk because I really only
[1:19:20] Speaker 1: get five or six hours of sleep per night. And
[1:19:24] Speaker 1: I don't know you do. Maybe are we always like
[1:19:27] Speaker 1: a little bit low key drunk or are getting enough?
[1:19:28] Speaker 1: I'm not getting enough sleep, I don't think.
[1:19:30] Speaker 2: I mean for me, it's just not consistent. But no,
[1:19:33] Speaker 2: I wake up throughout the night. I'll wake up in
[1:19:36] Speaker 2: the morning, I go to bed it and I mean, yeah,
[1:19:38] Speaker 2: I have blacked out last night, no idea when I
[1:19:40] Speaker 2: got home and I was up at six thirty in
[1:19:42] Speaker 2: the mornings to work on our podcast, and then I
[1:19:46] Speaker 2: had my nine were eleven Russian lesson and then I
[1:19:49] Speaker 2: went back to our.
[1:19:50] Speaker 1: Pod Russian lessons. U Can she only do it days
[1:19:55] Speaker 1: of pod recordings? No?
[1:19:57] Speaker 2: But like I didn't think I'd get drunk all night,
[1:20:00] Speaker 2: you know what I mean, Like I couldn't have planned.
[1:20:04] Speaker 2: I was gonna do all my work last night. I
[1:20:06] Speaker 2: just had at six o'clock dinner.
[1:20:07] Speaker 1: No spots.
[1:20:08] Speaker 2: I usually when we do big recordings, I don't do
[1:20:10] Speaker 2: spots the night before, so I could just like kind
[1:20:12] Speaker 2: of focus and chill out because I also like to
[1:20:15] Speaker 2: go to Soul.
[1:20:16] Speaker 1: Cycle in the mornings on these days. On a Tuesday,
[1:20:20] Speaker 1: it's that espresso. It's that you espresso that just can't.
[1:20:25] Speaker 2: I think I had two Margarita's, three espresso martinis, and
[1:20:28] Speaker 2: probably a few shots at tequila.
[1:20:30] Speaker 1: But I also hadn't eaten all day, so it was
[1:20:32] Speaker 1: a lot at once. That'll do it. That's the rest.
[1:20:35] Speaker 1: That'll do pigs, that'll do it. Yeah. You know. I
[1:20:38] Speaker 1: was in Charlotte's Web in high school.
[1:20:40] Speaker 3: Do you were?
[1:20:42] Speaker 1: Who were? I was Lurvy the farm hand.
[1:20:45] Speaker 2: Ah yeah, and we are set was like a story book,
[1:20:49] Speaker 2: and we traveled to different schools and performed it for
[1:20:55] Speaker 2: little kids.
[1:20:56] Speaker 1: But it's so cute.
[1:20:57] Speaker 2: And then I was like in a movie because during
[1:20:59] Speaker 2: the sh Charlotte's Web tour, I had my sectionals, like
[1:21:04] Speaker 2: our conference meets for swimming, and so my swim coaches
[1:21:08] Speaker 2: were pissed. I wasn't resting, and I was like, I
[1:21:10] Speaker 2: don't know, Like I'm going to be an actor. I'm
[1:21:12] Speaker 2: not going to be a fucking swimmer back the fun.
[1:21:14] Speaker 1: I'm on tour. I'm on tour with Charlotte's Web. I'm
[1:21:20] Speaker 1: touring the elementary school circuit. Like I'll do my backstroke
[1:21:23] Speaker 1: another time. Oh my god, you know I did butterfly.
[1:21:27] Speaker 1: I know your butterfly. As soon as it came out
[1:21:29] Speaker 1: of my mouth, I was like, that's not her stroke.
[1:21:31] Speaker 1: But yeah, oh my god. I was also in a
[1:21:36] Speaker 1: kabuki play. I don't know if you know that.
[1:21:38] Speaker 2: I was in The Monstrous Spider and we had a
[1:21:42] Speaker 2: Japanese man come to direct it. He guest directed it.
[1:21:46] Speaker 2: He was like a Northwestern person, And I.
[1:21:50] Speaker 1: Mean, I knew you guys had a good theater program,
[1:21:52] Speaker 1: but I don't think I've heard of these two specific play.
[1:21:55] Speaker 2: Yeah, the Kabuki was a big one for me for sure,
[1:21:59] Speaker 2: because the other ones are part of the classes.
[1:22:01] Speaker 1: Like I feel like the Kabuki was the only one
[1:22:02] Speaker 1: I actually like booked on my own, like without you, Yes,
[1:22:07] Speaker 1: I booked. I was.
[1:22:12] Speaker 2: I was in the scene that was like the comedic relief.
[1:22:14] Speaker 2: But we had to like wipe the stage and do
[1:22:16] Speaker 2: all these things. And then I had a talking to
[1:22:18] Speaker 2: and my teacher was like, the director doesn't think you're
[1:22:21] Speaker 2: grateful enough to be here, and you're not You're not
[1:22:24] Speaker 2: enthusiastic enough. And I go, all right, I'll pump it up,
[1:22:26] Speaker 2: like I've always had the same personality, you know what
[1:22:28] Speaker 2: I mean?
[1:22:29] Speaker 1: My god, you know I've gotten the you're not pumped,
[1:22:31] Speaker 1: you're not enthusiastic enough speech before as well. Wow, I
[1:22:35] Speaker 1: got that at the Page program. I when I started.
[1:22:38] Speaker 1: When I was doing orientation for the Page program, I
[1:22:41] Speaker 1: was just kind of like listening to all of the
[1:22:43] Speaker 1: things we needed to learn and I was supposed to,
[1:22:45] Speaker 1: I guess be more like awesome. Sounds great, and I
[1:22:48] Speaker 1: like I wasn't doing that, and they were like we
[1:22:50] Speaker 1: need to. You know, you beat out a lot of
[1:22:52] Speaker 1: people for this job. Like we're just like a little
[1:22:54] Speaker 1: bit more enthusiasm or like I was doodling on a
[1:22:57] Speaker 1: piece of paper, which I just do out of habit.
[1:22:59] Speaker 1: I'm completely listening I draw cubes Like I'm not a
[1:23:01] Speaker 1: good artist. I'm drawing like a cube and they were like,
[1:23:04] Speaker 1: you just felt like you were doodling and not listening,
[1:23:06] Speaker 1: and I was like, what, like, I'm so excited to
[1:23:09] Speaker 1: be here. In fact, I'm like nervous. Like it was
[1:23:11] Speaker 1: just like stupid stuff like that, but I've gotten it
[1:23:13] Speaker 1: before as well, and you got to pump it up.
[1:23:15] Speaker 1: I had to pump it up.
[1:23:16] Speaker 2: And then we had to do our own makeup, you know,
[1:23:19] Speaker 2: And then we learned how to do kabuki makeup. And
[1:23:22] Speaker 2: then once we got our silk outfits on, we couldn't
[1:23:24] Speaker 2: sit down. We weren't allowed to sit.
[1:23:26] Speaker 1: And you can't ruin that you can't wrinkle that silk. Yeah,
[1:23:29] Speaker 1: we weren't allowed to sit. It was crazy.
[1:23:31] Speaker 2: And then they made me dye my hair black and
[1:23:33] Speaker 2: then I wore a hat, so I was like, well,
[1:23:34] Speaker 2: you ruin my senior photos, you pieces of shit.
[1:23:37] Speaker 1: And you know how you had to dye your hair
[1:23:39] Speaker 1: in a high school production, sign a contract before you
[1:23:41] Speaker 1: start that you do whatever the play needs you to do. Wow.
[1:23:46] Speaker 2: Yeah, we had an because we also for like one
[1:23:49] Speaker 2: of our classes, we had to do twenty five hours
[1:23:50] Speaker 2: of stage craft and like behind the scenes, so you
[1:23:53] Speaker 2: had to put you had to clock in hours in
[1:23:55] Speaker 2: the set design or in the costume shop.
[1:23:57] Speaker 1: Or like lighting. I did the curtains for the King,
[1:23:59] Speaker 1: and I like, you had to do damn, you had
[1:24:03] Speaker 1: to do backstage work, yeah, to be and shit, and
[1:24:08] Speaker 1: I did a shake.
[1:24:09] Speaker 2: We also had a Shakespeare Week in the summer every
[1:24:11] Speaker 2: other year and I got to do it. And it's
[1:24:12] Speaker 2: like a week long, eight hour a day or two
[1:24:15] Speaker 2: weeks of like intense Shakespeare with swords and we'd learn
[1:24:19] Speaker 2: monologues and then fight.
[1:24:20] Speaker 1: With the swords. Oh my god. Yeah, it was like incredible.
[1:24:26] Speaker 2: I wonder what the new teachers are, Like, I mean,
[1:24:28] Speaker 2: mister Ortman was the best. Mister shout out mister yeah,
[1:24:33] Speaker 2: I mean, and our plays sorry this long monologue, but
[1:24:36] Speaker 2: now I'm like, I like, am reminiscing so fucking hard,
[1:24:40] Speaker 2: but like, yeah, love him, love him. And we had
[1:24:46] Speaker 2: plays like gay Kissing. So early on we did an
[1:24:50] Speaker 2: Iago's plot always happened to oh yeah, no, he rode
[1:24:54] Speaker 2: a horse. But then we had another gay kissing one,
[1:24:56] Speaker 2: like we were just doing cool ass ship and it
[1:24:59] Speaker 2: was there was always a Tkespere one and a contemporary one.
[1:25:03] Speaker 1: I don't know the guy is that's really the guy
[1:25:06] Speaker 1: had it. And we did sketch stuff and I got
[1:25:10] Speaker 1: to be in Godspell, Like I fucking love mister Ortman.
[1:25:13] Speaker 1: Shout out. He'll never give me the props. I was
[1:25:15] Speaker 1: so desperately grave from him. It's like, you know, mister Ortman,
[1:25:19] Speaker 1: tell him, I'm desperate, desperate for a compliment. This podcast
[1:25:23] Speaker 1: got me in touch with my old elementary school principle.
[1:25:26] Speaker 1: I'm sure it can get you in touch with your
[1:25:28] Speaker 1: high school theater teacher. Okay, and he was gay.
[1:25:32] Speaker 2: I mean he had like a way younger boyfriend I remember,
[1:25:35] Speaker 2: and like it was kind of pretty radical. I feel
[1:25:38] Speaker 2: for him to like his boyfriend came to all the productions.
[1:25:41] Speaker 1: I love that. Yeah, I love that. Very progressive, fucking cool.
[1:25:46] Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm trying to think if I'm the most me
[1:25:49] Speaker 2: and esther have to be the most successful people from
[1:25:51] Speaker 2: that high school theater program.
[1:25:54] Speaker 1: Yeah, you would know if there was somebody bigger.
[1:25:57] Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe someone's like really good, like good at something
[1:26:00] Speaker 2: on Broadway that I don't know about.
[1:26:02] Speaker 1: Yeah, you're right, I would fucking know. I think it's
[1:26:03] Speaker 1: a manster. Yeah I got kicked by a horse and nope,
[1:26:07] Speaker 1: like it's me, Yeah, it's me. Yeah, mister Ortman, write
[1:26:14] Speaker 1: me a letter, DM me slide into my DM's mister Ortman, Okay,
[1:26:21] Speaker 1: back on track here, No, so she's missing. So Melinda's
[1:26:26] Speaker 1: basically talking about how even seventeen hours of sleep, you're
[1:26:29] Speaker 1: basically a little bit wasted, like you're a little bit
[1:26:31] Speaker 1: buzzed because you like, you know that. It's just like
[1:26:33] Speaker 1: that's how much your body needs sleep, and the irritability
[1:26:36] Speaker 1: can lead to delusions to psychosis. She was mannic in
[1:26:40] Speaker 1: interrogation and then out of her mind in the courtroom,
[1:26:43] Speaker 1: and Melinda says, well, she would have been way worse
[1:26:45] Speaker 1: the night of the murder because she was on even
[1:26:46] Speaker 1: less sleep. So now Benson and Sabler are like begging
[1:26:50] Speaker 1: Kendra Gill for an insanity defense now finally, and the
[1:26:54] Speaker 1: New Jersey Eightya is like, are you guys serious? That's
[1:26:56] Speaker 1: so hack, Like that's the last stop for lazy lawyers,
[1:26:59] Speaker 1: and he goes not if the fact support it, and
[1:27:01] Speaker 1: the Ada goes, yeah, your girl missed a nap, and
[1:27:04] Speaker 1: Live is like sleep deprivation psychosis is a clinical condition.
[1:27:07] Speaker 1: She was temporarily out of her mind, and Gil's like, well,
[1:27:10] Speaker 1: I've done a couple of days without sleep and the
[1:27:11] Speaker 1: only thing I murdered was my pillow.
[1:27:13] Speaker 2: Like I sort of like that is there no curiosity,
[1:27:15] Speaker 2: no openness now, like let me see it.
[1:27:17] Speaker 1: No, you just want to put this person away. It's
[1:27:19] Speaker 1: like psycho. It's weird. It's also because it's like it's
[1:27:21] Speaker 1: not like it's a defense attorney coming to you. It's
[1:27:24] Speaker 1: not like it's like these are cops that like honestly
[1:27:26] Speaker 1: have nothing, no skin in the game. Really, they just
[1:27:29] Speaker 1: care about humanity, you know, like they just want this
[1:27:31] Speaker 1: girl to get a fair shake. So you could listen
[1:27:33] Speaker 1: to them for three seconds. But I do like the
[1:27:37] Speaker 1: concept of talking about sleeping really hard as murdering your pillow,
[1:27:41] Speaker 1: Like I like that. I'm like, I'm gonna go murder
[1:27:42] Speaker 1: my pillow. I think that's a fun, little, fun little
[1:27:45] Speaker 1: way to talk about it. So Liv gets into personal storytime.
[1:27:48] Speaker 1: She goes, well, I knew a guy who wants who
[1:27:49] Speaker 1: worked forty one hours straight, went home, went to sleep,
[1:27:52] Speaker 1: and had an asthma attack, and when he reached for
[1:27:54] Speaker 1: his inhaler, he accidentally grabbed his gun, put it in
[1:27:57] Speaker 1: his mouth and blew his brains out. And the Ada
[1:27:59] Speaker 1: is like, okay, so what do you want from me?
[1:28:02] Speaker 1: And She's like, I want you to read Jennifer's journal
[1:28:05] Speaker 1: and then she goes sleep on it, which good one.
[1:28:07] Speaker 1: You know, we all need sleep. So in the next scene,
[1:28:10] Speaker 1: we are the judge talking about a plea agreement that
[1:28:12] Speaker 1: the defendant is remanded to the Department of Juvenile Justice
[1:28:15] Speaker 1: for a period not to exceed seven years, and the
[1:28:17] Speaker 1: camera is zooming in on Jennifer and a single tear
[1:28:19] Speaker 1: rolls down her cheek and the judge is like, change
[1:28:22] Speaker 1: of heart, miss Gill, and she says new evidence showed
[1:28:24] Speaker 1: the defendant's mental status at the time. Warrens leniency and
[1:28:27] Speaker 1: the judge is like, yeah, well so Jennifer. He's like, bitch,
[1:28:30] Speaker 1: you just want the lotto, so don't fuck it up.
[1:28:32] Speaker 1: And then there's another teer from Jennifer. Jennifer hugs her mom.
[1:28:35] Speaker 1: Stabler goes, you'll be out by twenty one. She thanks
[1:28:37] Speaker 1: Benson and Sabler and Live goes at least she still
[1:28:40] Speaker 1: has a chance, and Gil goes, well, here's my next case.
[1:28:45] Speaker 1: A fifteen year old boy is being led into the courtroom.
[1:28:47] Speaker 1: She goes, he raped and murdered his six year old stepsister,
[1:28:50] Speaker 1: no remorse, said he'd do it again. You want him
[1:28:52] Speaker 1: out at twenty one two, And it's like Yeah, I
[1:28:55] Speaker 1: just feel like it's a little bit different. Like a
[1:28:57] Speaker 1: fifteen year old kid that like rapes and murders his
[1:29:00] Speaker 1: six year old stepsister and says, I do it again.
[1:29:01] Speaker 1: Then a girl who's hyped up on fucking drugs and
[1:29:05] Speaker 1: blacked out and kills a classmate in a rage. I
[1:29:09] Speaker 1: don't know, I feel, but I don't where everyone is
[1:29:12] Speaker 1: coming from. Yeah, it feels like if this family is
[1:29:16] Speaker 1: so rich, she would have had like top notch, Like
[1:29:20] Speaker 1: I didn't even know who her defense attorney was, Like
[1:29:22] Speaker 1: she would have had Buchanan, she would have had uh,
[1:29:27] Speaker 1: Elizabeth Marvel, Rita Calhoun, she would have had somebody super
[1:29:31] Speaker 1: super high end to make it look like it was
[1:29:34] Speaker 1: self defense or something. I don't know, Like they just
[1:29:36] Speaker 1: felt like they were kind of they didn't. They went
[1:29:39] Speaker 1: into the first hearing not even knowing about the provigil,
[1:29:41] Speaker 1: Like I don't, I don't if I don't get it,
[1:29:44] Speaker 1: like that's you would do an exam on her, Like
[1:29:46] Speaker 1: I don't know. It just feels like there was a
[1:29:48] Speaker 1: couple holes. But Sarah Hyland that monologue going crazy anyway.
[1:29:53] Speaker 1: The episode ends when the kid gives The fifteen year
[1:29:55] Speaker 1: old kid gives a creepy ass smile to the detectives
[1:29:58] Speaker 1: and that stick wolf baby.
[1:29:59] Speaker 2: So crime unfortunately sad obviously. So this is an Arenda, California,
[1:30:13] Speaker 2: and it's an affluent community near San Francisco, and this
[1:30:17] Speaker 2: happened in nineteen eighty four. So the average household income
[1:30:20] Speaker 2: in the eighties in this affluent neighborhood was sixty K,
[1:30:25] Speaker 2: which is lol to kind of think about. Yeah, if
[1:30:27] Speaker 2: you're I wonder what what Arenda is now, I'm going
[1:30:30] Speaker 2: to look that up Ornda?
[1:30:32] Speaker 1: What do I write? Median income? Okay, yeah, two hundred
[1:30:36] Speaker 1: and fifty plus most average is three seventy whoa why
[1:30:42] Speaker 1: is literally when you look it up. One of the
[1:30:44] Speaker 1: questions people also ask is why is Arenda so expensive? Yeah,
[1:30:48] Speaker 1: because it kind of sucks probably or something or what.
[1:30:51] Speaker 1: I don't know. It's there are cost of living is
[1:30:53] Speaker 1: significantly higher than national and stay averages. Arenda baby. So uh.
[1:30:59] Speaker 2: Bernadette Proty she stabbed her classmate Kirsten costUS to death
[1:31:06] Speaker 2: June twenty third, nineteen eighty four. Chris Kirsten was fifteen
[1:31:10] Speaker 2: years old and Prati was sixteen years old. They were
[1:31:13] Speaker 2: both on the swim team and they worked in the
[1:31:15] Speaker 2: school office and were members of a prestigious volunteer group.
[1:31:20] Speaker 1: I think times were different in.
[1:31:22] Speaker 2: The eighties, but Kirsten was far more popular and she
[1:31:26] Speaker 2: was on the cheer team and basically so what like,
[1:31:33] Speaker 2: there's a few things. So she was scared that the
[1:31:36] Speaker 2: victim was going to tell people that she was weird.
[1:31:39] Speaker 2: That was like a big fear of hers. And there
[1:31:41] Speaker 2: was this suggestion that Protty was jealous of Kirsten, who
[1:31:45] Speaker 2: was more popular and successful to her. And then when
[1:31:47] Speaker 2: she eventually confessed, she was like, yeah, I was fucking.
[1:31:49] Speaker 1: Jealous of her.
[1:31:50] Speaker 2: But Protty's friends and neighbors described her as polite, average
[1:31:54] Speaker 2: teen and the youngest of five from a devout Catholic family.
[1:31:57] Speaker 2: And then this is so bizarre, but this woman soon
[1:32:00] Speaker 2: zan Bar is quoted like this must be a terrible
[1:32:03] Speaker 2: mistake in the New York Times. And she relied on
[1:32:07] Speaker 2: Proty as a babysitter. And then this mom is quoted writing,
[1:32:11] Speaker 2: I don't know who else would I would trust my
[1:32:13] Speaker 2: children to. She's full of grace, sympathy and love. And
[1:32:18] Speaker 2: it's like, I think you could find another person that's
[1:32:21] Speaker 2: not fifteen to leave your kids with. Who stabbed her
[1:32:24] Speaker 2: friend to death, Like, what are you talking about? What
[1:32:28] Speaker 2: are you talking about? I don't know who I could trust.
[1:32:31] Speaker 2: I don't know a grown woman, how about that? How
[1:32:34] Speaker 2: about a child from down the block?
[1:32:37] Speaker 1: Times are tough in Rinda. You gotta take the babysitters,
[1:32:41] Speaker 1: you get Yeah, times are different, So.
[1:32:45] Speaker 2: Okay, But Prouty lured cost Us to her death with
[1:32:48] Speaker 2: a phony invitation to an initiation dinner for the bob Olinks,
[1:32:54] Speaker 2: which was the Junior League style volunteer group at Maramonte
[1:32:58] Speaker 2: High School. Both girls were invited to join this group,
[1:33:02] Speaker 2: and so she drove them to Maraga, California, into a
[1:33:07] Speaker 2: church parking lot, and Costas didn't like what was happening,
[1:33:10] Speaker 2: and so she sought help at a home nearby and
[1:33:13] Speaker 2: like ran off and then told the resident of this
[1:33:15] Speaker 2: home like proty went weird. That's the quote went weird.
[1:33:20] Speaker 2: And the resident drove Costas to a neighbor's house in
[1:33:23] Speaker 2: Rinda because her parents were out for the evening. Prody
[1:33:26] Speaker 2: followed her, jumped out of a car and stabbed Costas
[1:33:30] Speaker 2: five times on the front porch of the neighbor's home.
[1:33:32] Speaker 1: Oh my god. And this is according to testimony from
[1:33:36] Speaker 1: the UPI.
[1:33:39] Speaker 2: Wildly. It took six months to solve this. Well, they
[1:33:41] Speaker 2: didn't even solve it. Cops don't do anything, So there
[1:33:44] Speaker 2: was only one witness, and the witness said that she
[1:33:46] Speaker 2: saw Kirsten get attacked by a blonde teenager who was
[1:33:49] Speaker 2: driving a gold Pinto. There was seven hundred and fifty
[1:33:53] Speaker 2: pintos that they had to like check and go through,
[1:33:56] Speaker 2: and they did interview Bernadette and she calmly denied any
[1:33:59] Speaker 2: invo and then later when she was arrested, there was
[1:34:04] Speaker 2: a like the psychological profile that was provided by the
[1:34:07] Speaker 2: FBI suggested the murder would be convinced the slang was
[1:34:11] Speaker 2: justified and would show little reaction under questioning.
[1:34:15] Speaker 1: So the FBI ended up being right. But her parents
[1:34:17] Speaker 1: are who turned her in.
[1:34:19] Speaker 2: Five months after the funeral, she wrote a letter confessing
[1:34:22] Speaker 2: to the crimes, and they picked their daughter up from
[1:34:25] Speaker 2: school after reading the letter and took her to the authorities.
[1:34:28] Speaker 2: And there there's a tape confession where she talks about
[1:34:31] Speaker 2: feelings of jealousy inadequacy that drove her to kill.
[1:34:35] Speaker 1: These are from the confession tapes.
[1:34:37] Speaker 2: I didn't know what I was doing, and then afterwards
[1:34:39] Speaker 2: I was so horrified. I didn't think about if she
[1:34:41] Speaker 2: was going to die. And this is all in the
[1:34:44] Speaker 2: archives of the UPI I lost for cheerleading, like she
[1:34:48] Speaker 2: basically she like lost. She didn't get into the cheerleading team,
[1:34:52] Speaker 2: she didn't get into the clubs she wanted, and then
[1:34:54] Speaker 2: she didn't get on yearbook staff and so she was
[1:34:57] Speaker 2: like piss and then that got me. That got her
[1:35:00] Speaker 2: mad and hurt and that like she was pissed. She
[1:35:03] Speaker 2: couldn't change her looks or money or popularity and stuff
[1:35:06] Speaker 2: like that. And her dad did confirm all this, Raymond.
[1:35:09] Speaker 2: He told an FBI agent, well sorry, so an FBI
[1:35:14] Speaker 2: agent on the stand testified. So his name was Gerald Diedrich,
[1:35:18] Speaker 2: and he said the father Raymond told him that she
[1:35:21] Speaker 2: was quite upset she didn't make the cheerleading team and
[1:35:23] Speaker 2: she was very jealous that the other Rinda girls had
[1:35:27] Speaker 2: so much wealth. March nineteen eighty five, she was convicted
[1:35:31] Speaker 2: of second degree murder for the stabbing and yeah, because
[1:35:35] Speaker 2: she didn't want people to think she was weird, like what.
[1:35:38] Speaker 1: A fucking psycho.
[1:35:40] Speaker 2: Bernadette was charged with first degree murder, but there was
[1:35:43] Speaker 2: just not enough evidence to convict on that. She was
[1:35:46] Speaker 2: also charged as a juvenile, so the maximum sentence is
[1:35:49] Speaker 2: only a placement in a youth prison till twenty five.
[1:35:52] Speaker 2: So then in nineteen and then there was a nineteen
[1:35:55] Speaker 2: ninety four Lifetime movie Death of a Cheerleader that was
[1:35:57] Speaker 2: inspired by these events with Torri Spelling, and I remember
[1:36:01] Speaker 2: watching it, and.
[1:36:03] Speaker 1: I believe Kelly Martin friend of the pod, Yes, yes,
[1:36:06] Speaker 1: oh my god, and Kelly Martin, and she apparently changed,
[1:36:13] Speaker 1: like she's out.
[1:36:13] Speaker 2: She got paroled and was released at age twenty three,
[1:36:17] Speaker 2: and an uncredible source said that she changed her name
[1:36:20] Speaker 2: and no one really knows where she is.
[1:36:22] Speaker 1: I don't want to, like, you know, sentenced teenagers to
[1:36:25] Speaker 1: death or anything, but like, it seems pretty first degree
[1:36:28] Speaker 1: murder to bring someone to a secluded location and then
[1:36:31] Speaker 1: when they run away, you chase them and kill them
[1:36:33] Speaker 1: at another location. Like that seems pretty first degree, like
[1:36:37] Speaker 1: that that's what you were intending to do, you know,
[1:36:40] Speaker 1: But damn, that's fucked. Yeah, Like I can't believe they
[1:36:45] Speaker 1: had to go through so many pintos and they didn't
[1:36:47] Speaker 1: just start with the pintos of the kids at school,
[1:36:50] Speaker 1: like start with the pintos that are closest to you.
[1:36:54] Speaker 1: So crazy, fucking nuts all right, well, thank you for
[1:36:58] Speaker 1: telling us about this state of affairs with Kirsten Costas,
[1:37:02] Speaker 1: but we do have a great guest, so don't go anywhere, okay.
[1:37:13] Speaker 1: Our guest today is an actor who has starred on
[1:37:16] Speaker 1: shows like You're the Worst and The Boys, and most
[1:37:20] Speaker 1: recently in Welcome to Flatch and the Franchise. You can
[1:37:24] Speaker 1: currently see her in her Broadway debut alongside John Lithgow
[1:37:28] Speaker 1: in the show Giant, but you know her best today
[1:37:31] Speaker 1: as the moderately genius waitress with Rice Knee Scars Katrina Lytchkoff.
[1:37:36] Speaker 1: Please enjoy our chat with the amazing Aya Cash. Well.
[1:37:41] Speaker 1: So you're like a young actor and then you book
[1:37:44] Speaker 1: three dick wolfs like in a row.
[1:37:47] Speaker 5: Oh my god, I thought you were calling me a
[1:37:48] Speaker 5: young actor. Now I was like, thank you so much.
[1:37:53] Speaker 1: Still are you are? But did that make you feel
[1:37:57] Speaker 1: so good? Like? What was that like? Oh?
[1:37:59] Speaker 5: Yeah, my first ever on camera job was Law and
[1:38:04] Speaker 5: Order the Mothership.
[1:38:06] Speaker 1: Yeah, and then according to IMDb, your second one is
[1:38:09] Speaker 1: Criminal and Debt, like you just did two in a row. Yeah.
[1:38:12] Speaker 5: I can't remember how far away those were, but that
[1:38:16] Speaker 5: first one I just remember going to Chelsea Piers for years.
[1:38:22] Speaker 1: I mean, like at least I was.
[1:38:24] Speaker 5: I was auditioning for Law and Order for at least
[1:38:27] Speaker 5: a year before I got my first like one scene role,
[1:38:30] Speaker 5: and you'd sit in those waiting rooms with like fifty people, just.
[1:38:35] Speaker 1: Going how how how is it? How can it be
[1:38:38] Speaker 1: me this time? Yeah?
[1:38:40] Speaker 2: And then SVU, your bangs were incredible, your outfit you
[1:38:45] Speaker 2: were and you had to do like cuts and the
[1:38:48] Speaker 2: rice knees. Do you remember your hair and makeup wardrobe
[1:38:51] Speaker 2: time at SVU?
[1:38:54] Speaker 5: Well, I remember being sad that I was wearing a
[1:38:56] Speaker 5: waitressing uniform because I remember you got paid like, I
[1:38:59] Speaker 5: don't know, thirty dollars extra if you wore your own
[1:39:03] Speaker 5: clothes kind of thing.
[1:39:04] Speaker 1: There's some sag pool and I was real broke, so.
[1:39:10] Speaker 5: I always was looking for that extra cash. My hair
[1:39:14] Speaker 5: that was essentially my bad highlights and my attempt at
[1:39:19] Speaker 5: a curtain bang.
[1:39:20] Speaker 2: No, I loved your bangs. I wrote, your bangs are
[1:39:22] Speaker 2: incredible and cute waitress outfit.
[1:39:25] Speaker 5: Yeah, And then I remember I don't remember getting like
[1:39:29] Speaker 5: the scars and stuff on, but I do remember I
[1:39:34] Speaker 5: was recently on a show with with young folk, with
[1:39:37] Speaker 5: actual young actors, and they said they wanted to see
[1:39:41] Speaker 5: my law and Order, and so I showed them this
[1:39:44] Speaker 5: and we laughed about it, and.
[1:39:46] Speaker 1: Then they called me Rice nees some you said. I
[1:39:50] Speaker 1: was like, yes, I've been called that before. Oh my god,
[1:39:56] Speaker 1: that's cool. Yeah, that was like a gnarly injury. They've
[1:40:00] Speaker 1: we've never seen a Rice kind of thing like that before.
[1:40:03] Speaker 1: I never knew Rice could be violent. Yeah, well I
[1:40:07] Speaker 1: was violent crazed. Yeah, it was an upsetting episode, but
[1:40:13] Speaker 1: you did have a perfectly like wet eye. We like
[1:40:17] Speaker 1: to say it's like the tears were starting, but not really.
[1:40:20] Speaker 1: How was it sitting across Marishka and Christopher Malaney legends?
[1:40:27] Speaker 1: Of course, it was very intimidating. If I'm going to
[1:40:31] Speaker 1: be totally honest, I was so nervous.
[1:40:36] Speaker 5: I hadn't done that much at that point, and I
[1:40:39] Speaker 5: think I was still every time I was on camera,
[1:40:42] Speaker 5: I was convinced I was doing it wrong. I mean,
[1:40:45] Speaker 5: I started in theaters, so I remember even auditioning, they'd.
[1:40:49] Speaker 1: Be telling me to stop yelling. You know. I was
[1:40:53] Speaker 1: very much projecting, so that was always a note.
[1:40:57] Speaker 5: And then I remember doing a job to step over
[1:41:01] Speaker 5: something and I'm kind of going out of frame, just
[1:41:04] Speaker 5: you know, don't let.
[1:41:05] Speaker 1: Us know you're stepping over track.
[1:41:07] Speaker 5: You know, I just didn't quite know the ins and
[1:41:09] Speaker 5: outs of television for a while because you get on
[1:41:12] Speaker 5: these sets and you do one or two days at
[1:41:15] Speaker 5: this point is what I'm doing, and you never got
[1:41:18] Speaker 5: into a groove.
[1:41:19] Speaker 1: You never knew who you're allowed to talk to.
[1:41:22] Speaker 5: So to work with people that you know have been
[1:41:25] Speaker 5: doing this forever and show up into their show that
[1:41:29] Speaker 5: they're in season ten of I don't am I.
[1:41:31] Speaker 1: Allowed to talk to?
[1:41:32] Speaker 3: You?
[1:41:33] Speaker 1: Do you want to be bothered? There's just a lot
[1:41:36] Speaker 1: of that going on.
[1:41:37] Speaker 5: There's a running inner monologue of chaos and insecurity.
[1:41:43] Speaker 1: Well, because you had just graduated from like you you
[1:41:45] Speaker 1: graduated from like a theater program, and then you just
[1:41:47] Speaker 1: what moved to New York and started trying.
[1:41:49] Speaker 5: Yeah, so I moved here and I was just waitressing
[1:41:52] Speaker 5: and trying to get I was doing regional theater. So
[1:41:56] Speaker 5: I would pop out of town and do a play
[1:41:58] Speaker 5: in you know, one Ona, Minnesota or Roanoke, Virginia, and
[1:42:06] Speaker 5: then I would come back and hopefully you'd get a
[1:42:09] Speaker 5: law and order or something that would pay your bills
[1:42:11] Speaker 5: and also residuals.
[1:42:13] Speaker 1: Okay, I have a question for you.
[1:42:15] Speaker 2: I'll tell you my bank in an episode of Family Guy,
[1:42:19] Speaker 2: which is a rewatchable show that people watch a lot,
[1:42:21] Speaker 2: and you're in an SVU, which residuals are more I.
[1:42:26] Speaker 1: Think s for you. Nice. Nice.
[1:42:28] Speaker 5: I don't know if I've made such a distinction between
[1:42:32] Speaker 5: SVU and the other ones in terms of residuals, so
[1:42:34] Speaker 5: maybe I'm thinking of them.
[1:42:35] Speaker 1: All as a whole.
[1:42:36] Speaker 5: But I can't remember a Family Guy residual coming in
[1:42:40] Speaker 5: to be on.
[1:42:41] Speaker 1: Maybe I better get on that. I was gonna say.
[1:42:46] Speaker 1: Animation can be a little bit sketchy, but Family Guy's pretty,
[1:42:49] Speaker 1: you know, tip top of the food chain there.
[1:42:52] Speaker 5: Yeah, I don't remember. And now they go directly to
[1:42:54] Speaker 5: your bank account. It used to be you'd go to
[1:42:56] Speaker 5: the you know, your mailbox, and there'd be a surprised
[1:43:00] Speaker 5: waiting for you that said you can pay your rent
[1:43:02] Speaker 5: this month, and now it's direct deposit. So I think
[1:43:06] Speaker 5: I pay attention less. And also, let's be honest, I'm
[1:43:09] Speaker 5: doing better. Yeah, those fifteen dollars checks are less of
[1:43:15] Speaker 5: thank god, fifteen dollars.
[1:43:16] Speaker 1: I get residuals sometimes for like seventy eight cents. Oh yeah,
[1:43:20] Speaker 1: I was really really depressing. I'm like you guys didn't
[1:43:22] Speaker 1: even need to spend the money on the stamp for this,
[1:43:24] Speaker 1: you know.
[1:43:25] Speaker 5: Yeah, well that's why it's good there's direct deposit, because
[1:43:27] Speaker 5: you'd get point oh.
[1:43:28] Speaker 1: One, why why no? You? Why you are doing incredible?
[1:43:34] Speaker 2: You have like five things in your upcoming as IMDb area,
[1:43:39] Speaker 2: I'm hitting, finally hitting.
[1:43:43] Speaker 1: I was gonna say, though, you like besides, like you
[1:43:46] Speaker 1: have been after you're the worst you've got. You've done
[1:43:49] Speaker 1: a lot of like multiple episode arcs of things where
[1:43:53] Speaker 1: you're I don't know if you're like a regular per se,
[1:43:56] Speaker 1: but you're in a lot of episodes. Yeah.
[1:43:58] Speaker 5: So I've been I've been working, which feels like a
[1:44:03] Speaker 5: goddamn miracle in.
[1:44:05] Speaker 1: This day and age. It is now brutal out there
[1:44:08] Speaker 1: and in a hit show, I mean people love the boys. Yeah,
[1:44:11] Speaker 1: well and that was that was cool outfit. A little
[1:44:14] Speaker 1: gift dropped in my lap.
[1:44:16] Speaker 5: I mean, I let's be clear, I auditioned for it
[1:44:19] Speaker 5: and fought for it, but dropped my lap after fighting
[1:44:23] Speaker 5: for it. And then yeah, there's a spin off coming
[1:44:25] Speaker 5: which I did not audition for it because it's about
[1:44:28] Speaker 5: my character.
[1:44:29] Speaker 1: Oh my god. Cooh shit. Yeah. So this is my
[1:44:33] Speaker 1: bragging section of the podcast. Oh that's so hard for
[1:44:38] Speaker 1: so many people right now. But I'm doing great about rising.
[1:44:46] Speaker 1: Vought Rising, Yeah, Vought Rising. Sorry, I'm saying it incorrectly.
[1:44:50] Speaker 1: I haven't seen the Boys, but I've only heard great
[1:44:52] Speaker 1: things about it that it's so good, cool, full superhero.
[1:44:57] Speaker 1: How does that feel?
[1:45:00] Speaker 5: It feels age inappropriate in the best way. I feel
[1:45:03] Speaker 5: like a young actress again. Speaking of which, by the way,
[1:45:05] Speaker 5: the SVU episode, I remember asking them, do you want
[1:45:09] Speaker 5: to change the line, because I say, he kicked me
[1:45:12] Speaker 5: out last year on my sixteenth birthday. So I think
[1:45:15] Speaker 5: I'm playing seventeen in that episode, and I believe I'm
[1:45:20] Speaker 5: well past mid twenties at that point.
[1:45:23] Speaker 1: And I sort of said, do you want to turnvel?
[1:45:26] Speaker 5: And they're like, nobody cares, you're not the focus.
[1:45:30] Speaker 1: I buy it. I buy you as seventeen because you're
[1:45:35] Speaker 1: on your own, you know what I mean? Yeah, hard living,
[1:45:38] Speaker 1: hard living seventeen year olds. Listen, a seventeen year old
[1:45:41] Speaker 1: has been kneeling on rice for a few years. They
[1:45:43] Speaker 1: look older than a regular seventeen year old. Yeah, oh,
[1:45:45] Speaker 1: I like this. I wish I'd thought of these things.
[1:45:48] Speaker 5: I just thought they're going to fire me I do
[1:45:50] Speaker 5: remember going to set for when I go meet them
[1:45:54] Speaker 5: for the first time, because I also because iced Tea
[1:45:56] Speaker 5: is in that scene, and I had just seen iced
[1:46:00] Speaker 5: Tea guest at the Apollo at the Snoop Dogg concert
[1:46:04] Speaker 5: and I told him that and he sort of looked
[1:46:07] Speaker 5: me up and down and went, huh. I think he
[1:46:12] Speaker 5: was like, maybe my career is over if this is
[1:46:14] Speaker 5: the girl going to the Snoop Dogg concert at this time.
[1:46:19] Speaker 1: Yeah, that's so good. Are you? Are you still doing theater,
[1:46:23] Speaker 1: like in between gigs of your multiple over hair series
[1:46:29] Speaker 1: arcs episode arcs that you're doing. Yeah.
[1:46:30] Speaker 5: I think by the time this comes out, I will
[1:46:32] Speaker 5: be on the Broadway myself. I'm doing a show called Giant,
[1:46:37] Speaker 5: which is I did it in London on the West
[1:46:40] Speaker 5: End with John Lithgow and Elliott Levy and Rachel Sterling
[1:46:45] Speaker 5: and they lift out plays a roll doll and so
[1:46:51] Speaker 5: it's a it's actually it's an incredible play.
[1:46:56] Speaker 1: Maybe not as maybe check your idea is about rule
[1:47:00] Speaker 1: doll at the door? But is he bad? Because I
[1:47:06] Speaker 1: used to love Scandal, I'm on it right now. I
[1:47:08] Speaker 1: think we can still love his books. We were children,
[1:47:12] Speaker 1: and I love Nazi vibes or something. Yeah, there's some.
[1:47:17] Speaker 5: I mean apparently it's my year of Nazi because I
[1:47:20] Speaker 5: play a Nazi on The Boys' spin off and uh
[1:47:23] Speaker 5: and uh something else in this but we Yeah, it's he.
[1:47:29] Speaker 5: It's not really up for debate if he's an anti
[1:47:31] Speaker 5: semi or not. But the play is much more nuanced
[1:47:35] Speaker 5: and interesting than that.
[1:47:37] Speaker 1: Who do you play?
[1:47:38] Speaker 5: I play one of his publishers who has flown to
[1:47:43] Speaker 5: England to discuss some some of his outspokenness.
[1:47:50] Speaker 1: And what's it like working with him? Were you like
[1:47:52] Speaker 1: a Dexter head? Oh?
[1:47:54] Speaker 5: I mean well also third Rock from the Sun I
[1:47:57] Speaker 5: grew Yeah, yes, but also dex I mean. That's the
[1:48:01] Speaker 5: amazing thing about John Lithgow is you could you could
[1:48:05] Speaker 5: drop his name anywhere and people would be like, I
[1:48:07] Speaker 5: love him from and name ten different things and be
[1:48:10] Speaker 5: equally obsessed with those things.
[1:48:12] Speaker 1: And he really does live up to it all.
[1:48:15] Speaker 5: I keep waiting to see a crack or a you
[1:48:18] Speaker 5: know that darkness has to come from somewhere.
[1:48:20] Speaker 1: But he's really really great. Yeah. I was on the
[1:48:25] Speaker 1: subway when I lived in New York and he got
[1:48:27] Speaker 1: on the subway and I was so entrenched in the
[1:48:32] Speaker 1: trinity Killer from Dexter that my body, like my blood
[1:48:35] Speaker 1: went cold, like I froze and was like he's gonna
[1:48:38] Speaker 1: kill me. Like he's such a good actor. But it's
[1:48:40] Speaker 1: like if I I've also seen him in Third Rock
[1:48:43] Speaker 1: for the Sun, I've also seen him in like a
[1:48:44] Speaker 1: ton of things where he's like a jovial man, but
[1:48:47] Speaker 1: he was so good and scary in that that I
[1:48:50] Speaker 1: totally I just looked at him paralysis. It's at the
[1:48:55] Speaker 1: music I was just at the Music Box theater. It's
[1:48:57] Speaker 1: like an incredible theater. Wow, do you see are huge?
[1:49:01] Speaker 1: I did see art, I haven't seen it yet.
[1:49:03] Speaker 5: I'm still working in Toronto, so i have very limited
[1:49:07] Speaker 5: time in New York right now. I'm just here for
[1:49:09] Speaker 5: a few days. But I'm seeing Liberation tonight, I'm seeing
[1:49:13] Speaker 5: I'm seeing Cecily Strong in a comedy thing oh tomorrow,
[1:49:17] Speaker 5: and then I'm running back.
[1:49:19] Speaker 2: I'm so excited for this Broadway show. Is this your
[1:49:21] Speaker 2: Broadway debut or have you been on before?
[1:49:23] Speaker 1: No? No, no, I've never never My first time, Wow,
[1:49:27] Speaker 1: first time on Broadway? And how long is that engagement?
[1:49:31] Speaker 1: Sixteen weeks? Yeah, I'm on the site right now. Thank you,
[1:49:35] Speaker 1: thank you. My publicist sixteen weeks. That's fun though. Six
[1:49:40] Speaker 1: I mean that's I mean, it's like a grueling schedule, right,
[1:49:42] Speaker 1: but you're in your own town, and yeah, you can
[1:49:44] Speaker 1: go home. I mean you're gonna be able to go
[1:49:48] Speaker 1: to war.
[1:49:48] Speaker 2: I mean I get excited just taking the train and
[1:49:50] Speaker 2: walking to go see a Broadway show. So like, I
[1:49:53] Speaker 2: can't imagine the feeling of walking to a Broadway theater
[1:49:57] Speaker 2: for a show.
[1:49:57] Speaker 1: Oh, I feel that. I'm so excited.
[1:50:00] Speaker 5: One to just work in New York at all, because
[1:50:02] Speaker 5: I never get to work in New York and this
[1:50:03] Speaker 5: is where I live. And two to be able to
[1:50:06] Speaker 5: go to I mean, I've been dreaming about it since
[1:50:10] Speaker 5: I was a little little girl.
[1:50:12] Speaker 1: I'm really excited. Oh you need to get on Elsbeth.
[1:50:16] Speaker 1: That's what I would love. Oh, so I love her.
[1:50:20] Speaker 1: She did.
[1:50:22] Speaker 5: She did Virginia Wolf at the Guthrie when I was
[1:50:25] Speaker 5: in college, and so I cannot tell you how many
[1:50:29] Speaker 5: times I have gone up to her and been like, Hi,
[1:50:32] Speaker 5: you don't know me, but I saw you at Virginia
[1:50:34] Speaker 5: Wolf and I think you're amazing, until she finally had
[1:50:37] Speaker 5: to be like, stop at Iya, We've met so many times, brilliant.
[1:50:42] Speaker 1: Yeah, we love her. She's in SVU Aluma also, as
[1:50:47] Speaker 1: is her husband. Yeah, Preston, you can get back on
[1:50:50] Speaker 1: SVU too. I would love it. I mean, whenever you
[1:50:54] Speaker 1: can do back, it's been long enough. You'd be a
[1:50:56] Speaker 1: good lawyer. You would actually be a really good fucking
[1:51:00] Speaker 1: DA or defense attorney. Yeah. Well you were in Wolf
[1:51:04] Speaker 1: of Wolf of Wall Street. So you know, how was that, Scorsese, Leo,
[1:51:10] Speaker 1: how were the vibes great? I was there for.
[1:51:15] Speaker 5: Three months or something like that, and yeah, I have
[1:51:19] Speaker 5: five lines.
[1:51:21] Speaker 1: I uh, oh my god.
[1:51:22] Speaker 5: I remember there were full weeks when I'd be behind
[1:51:25] Speaker 5: the sound guy and they'd say, we might catch you,
[1:51:27] Speaker 5: and I'd be like, you got to reshoot if you
[1:51:29] Speaker 5: catch me, because there's a boom operator.
[1:51:32] Speaker 1: But I read seven books. I got to listen to you.
[1:51:35] Speaker 5: Know, everybody that I've ever dreamed of meeting tell amazing
[1:51:41] Speaker 5: stories about their life and career.
[1:51:43] Speaker 1: And yeah, I had a really good time.
[1:51:46] Speaker 5: It was really fun to sort of just be around
[1:51:49] Speaker 5: watching all that happen, and it was all improv It
[1:51:52] Speaker 5: ended up being basically I uh, misters Scorsese seemed to
[1:51:57] Speaker 5: really love to let people play and anything that came
[1:52:00] Speaker 5: out of my mouth that was really dirty ended.
[1:52:02] Speaker 1: Up making it in the film. Fuck yeah.
[1:52:06] Speaker 5: Speaking of residuals, that that's the one, that is the one.
[1:52:11] Speaker 1: Wow. Cool.
[1:52:13] Speaker 5: Yeah, I think I made more in my first residual
[1:52:15] Speaker 5: than I made for the entirety of shooting.
[1:52:20] Speaker 1: Fuck yeah. I mean what a huge movie for sure,
[1:52:22] Speaker 1: But that's cool to know.
[1:52:24] Speaker 5: Yeah, so do small parts, but for long times, that's
[1:52:27] Speaker 5: what happens. I guess there's something in our sad contracts.
[1:52:30] Speaker 5: It's about days on set versus part in the movie
[1:52:34] Speaker 5: that does your residual.
[1:52:36] Speaker 1: Yeah, so the fact that I was there for so
[1:52:38] Speaker 1: long meant I got a really.
[1:52:39] Speaker 5: Good residual, even though I'm not hugely in the movie.
[1:52:43] Speaker 2: Yeah, and in my in my insta algorithm, I'll get
[1:52:48] Speaker 2: scenes from that movie with the script underneath moving so
[1:52:51] Speaker 2: you could see what's like been improvised, and I like
[1:52:54] Speaker 2: watching those.
[1:52:55] Speaker 1: Yeah, that's fun. It just seems like a I don't know,
[1:53:01] Speaker 1: or relax. I like the idea of that.
[1:53:03] Speaker 5: Yeah, it was really fun. I'm not usually I did
[1:53:06] Speaker 5: not come up. I'm not a stand up. I didn't
[1:53:08] Speaker 5: come up through UCB or groundlings or anything. So it's
[1:53:11] Speaker 5: not my natural habitat. But it's really fun when there's
[1:53:16] Speaker 5: real good parameters. I love to just rif, but I
[1:53:20] Speaker 5: can't do I can't do the like UCB. I'm in
[1:53:24] Speaker 5: a kumaquat thing and make it funny. I just don't
[1:53:27] Speaker 5: understand drop in the middle of nowhere and create comedy
[1:53:30] Speaker 5: out of nothing.
[1:53:31] Speaker 1: I saw Hot Sauce perform ones.
[1:53:35] Speaker 5: I don't know if you know them, their UCB group
[1:53:38] Speaker 5: Gillow's aerie Callie Benchwartz, and I just thought, Oh my god,
[1:53:43] Speaker 5: that's the most incredible thing I've ever seen.
[1:53:46] Speaker 1: I want to do that. So I signed up for UCB.
[1:53:47] Speaker 5: One on one and then was like, oh, they're really
[1:53:50] Speaker 5: good at it, like I'm not. They made it look
[1:53:53] Speaker 5: so easy and fun, and this is really horrible.
[1:53:56] Speaker 1: If you're not good, it is. Yeah, yeah, and I
[1:54:00] Speaker 1: ride all the levels. Gil used to coach one of
[1:54:03] Speaker 1: my groups, and I then I moved to stand up,
[1:54:06] Speaker 1: which was better for me, but improv is it's one
[1:54:10] Speaker 1: of those things where when it's good, it's so great,
[1:54:12] Speaker 1: but what it's bad, it's so awful. There's kind of
[1:54:14] Speaker 1: not the way that there could be, Like mediocre stand
[1:54:16] Speaker 1: up You're like it's okay, Like stand up is just
[1:54:19] Speaker 1: either great improv. I feels like it's great or it's awful,
[1:54:22] Speaker 1: like it's silence and nothing's working and and terrible. Yeah,
[1:54:27] Speaker 1: and the one on ones are awful too, because it's
[1:54:29] Speaker 1: a lot of like accountants that just want to get
[1:54:31] Speaker 1: better at public speaking and stuff. It's not all like
[1:54:34] Speaker 1: people that are trying to necessarily incorporate it into performing.
[1:54:37] Speaker 1: Not that there's anything wrong with like being an accountant,
[1:54:39] Speaker 1: but just a lot of it's a lot of people
[1:54:42] Speaker 1: with zero performing experience. I could see if you had,
[1:54:44] Speaker 1: like already been to school for theater, how that would
[1:54:47] Speaker 1: be a little annoying. Not annoying, just shame shame inducing.
[1:54:51] Speaker 5: It was also I was twenty nine and they were like,
[1:54:54] Speaker 5: you look great for twenty nine. I was like, excuse me,
[1:54:56] Speaker 5: Like I didn't. I was old again, a bunch of
[1:54:59] Speaker 5: nineteen years. World's in my class, being like, you have
[1:55:01] Speaker 5: an IMDb page?
[1:55:02] Speaker 1: Why are you crying? You know what I have to
[1:55:07] Speaker 1: ask you about. I cannot believe what I was looking
[1:55:10] Speaker 1: at your IMDb that you're Olivia Walker on Will and Grace. Oh,
[1:55:13] Speaker 1: because Olivia is like such a referenced character that they
[1:55:17] Speaker 1: that you only see in one episode and it's you crazy,
[1:55:21] Speaker 1: who's Olivia Walker. They're like Karen step kids, Oh wow,
[1:55:25] Speaker 1: it's Olivia. And then I forgot what the boy's name is.
[1:55:28] Speaker 1: But she'll, you know, she'll always just be like Olivia
[1:55:31] Speaker 1: wants me to do this or whatever, and then she
[1:55:33] Speaker 1: grows up and she and she and Ayah place her
[1:55:36] Speaker 1: in one episode. Yeah.
[1:55:39] Speaker 5: So those creators gave me my first pilot, like my
[1:55:44] Speaker 5: first job, my first real series regular job. I mean
[1:55:51] Speaker 5: it didn't go so it was just one episode, but
[1:55:54] Speaker 5: was a pilot of theirs. So then I kept in
[1:55:57] Speaker 5: touch with Max over the years and he just called
[1:55:59] Speaker 5: me and said, do you want to do this?
[1:56:00] Speaker 1: And I said sure.
[1:56:01] Speaker 5: I've never done a multicam and there they always say
[1:56:05] Speaker 5: it's like theater. And I did the multicam and I thought, oh,
[1:56:08] Speaker 5: this is like theater with no rehearsal.
[1:56:10] Speaker 1: This is just a living nightmare. This is just this.
[1:56:14] Speaker 5: It felt like i'd been hit by a truck. Afterwards,
[1:56:16] Speaker 5: I had no understanding of how to do that form.
[1:56:21] Speaker 5: They would you do a scene and then they'd come
[1:56:25] Speaker 5: up to you and be like, Okay, here's that scene
[1:56:28] Speaker 5: but totally rewritten. Now do it again live without having
[1:56:31] Speaker 5: time to remember. Yeah, and so I remember going to
[1:56:36] Speaker 5: look at the sheet to try to look at my lines,
[1:56:38] Speaker 5: and Max said, don't look, don't look at the sheet,
[1:56:40] Speaker 5: look at me.
[1:56:40] Speaker 1: And he said my lines to me.
[1:56:42] Speaker 5: I repeated him back, and then we did the scene
[1:56:44] Speaker 5: and I out of body experience.
[1:56:47] Speaker 1: I don't think it's the philm for me, I like,
[1:56:50] Speaker 1: not for you.
[1:56:51] Speaker 5: No, I like rehearsal, but it felt I mean, talk
[1:56:54] Speaker 5: about intimidating. I obviously had done a lot more film
[1:56:58] Speaker 5: and TV at that point, but the those actors are
[1:57:02] Speaker 5: the top of their that kind of comedy and knowing
[1:57:07] Speaker 5: how to do that form of TV. They were so
[1:57:11] Speaker 5: so funny. It was incredible to watch.
[1:57:15] Speaker 1: Yeah, we've had we had we had Eric McCormick on
[1:57:18] Speaker 1: the podcast and then uh Sean Hayes is the king
[1:57:22] Speaker 1: of podcasting now, So you know, have you seen this
[1:57:26] Speaker 1: episode like the rest of it? Yeah, but I mean
[1:57:30] Speaker 1: not in years. I remember what I remember. Sarah Hyland
[1:57:34] Speaker 1: has this like sort of epic monologue that I see
[1:57:38] Speaker 1: being passed around Instagram and TikTok and stuff a lot
[1:57:41] Speaker 1: now where it's just like sort of a breakdown of
[1:57:45] Speaker 1: a of a riddle and addicted overachiever, you know, and
[1:57:50] Speaker 1: I was just wondering if you'd seen it. I do.
[1:57:52] Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean she was so good, right, I remember
[1:57:55] Speaker 5: she was such a theater star too. Before that I
[1:58:00] Speaker 5: had heard of her, and then when she got Modern Family,
[1:58:03] Speaker 5: I just remember telling everyone, Oh, yeah, I was in
[1:58:05] Speaker 5: the episode where the little girl from Modern Family killed
[1:58:07] Speaker 5: my sister.
[1:58:08] Speaker 1: That was essentially how I remember.
[1:58:11] Speaker 2: And she has like a bucket list sv you think,
[1:58:13] Speaker 2: because she gets to get carried out of court, and
[1:58:16] Speaker 2: I feel like that's kind of the dream, is to
[1:58:19] Speaker 2: get carried out of court.
[1:58:21] Speaker 1: Yeah, that's my that's my Yeah. Well I got to cry,
[1:58:24] Speaker 1: and that's a big deal too. You got to cry,
[1:58:26] Speaker 1: and you got ricenes. I mean, who else has rices?
[1:58:30] Speaker 1: Is not anything to sneeze up.
[1:58:32] Speaker 2: And it was just nice to have you, like your
[1:58:35] Speaker 2: character get the satisfaction of her father being arrested. Yeah,
[1:58:39] Speaker 2: you know, I enjoyed that kind of I mean, it
[1:58:43] Speaker 2: sucked that your sister had to die, but I'm glad
[1:58:45] Speaker 2: he got arrested.
[1:58:46] Speaker 1: What a weird man, what a weird genius, underachieving genius
[1:58:51] Speaker 1: with a psych superiority complex. I maybe should have been
[1:58:56] Speaker 1: arrested for my accent in that, but no way, no,
[1:59:04] Speaker 1: you were so good.
[1:59:07] Speaker 2: I wanted to ask you. I know Holmes and Taylor
[1:59:10] Speaker 2: from Holmes and Taylor.
[1:59:11] Speaker 1: Who named me Risneys? So that's why we know. I
[1:59:18] Speaker 1: know homes names Taylor or take a Taylor. Oh yeah,
[1:59:22] Speaker 1: and I'm seeing Holmes tonight. Actually we're going to a
[1:59:24] Speaker 1: liberation together. Oh my god. Okay, cool.
[1:59:28] Speaker 2: Well anyways, listen, you're on Broadway. You're a law and
[1:59:32] Speaker 2: order triple trifecta.
[1:59:34] Speaker 1: Yeah, you got the law order in the first three
[1:59:37] Speaker 1: years of your career. That's pretty crazy.
[1:59:40] Speaker 5: But I don't have the like Annie Parisi thing where
[1:59:43] Speaker 5: she played a stripper and then was a district attorney
[1:59:46] Speaker 5: or something, right, like, didn't she?
[1:59:48] Speaker 1: But they can. That's what I'm saying. That life is long,
[1:59:51] Speaker 1: there's more time.
[1:59:52] Speaker 5: I just know she was not going within twelve months
[1:59:55] Speaker 5: to go from like dancer to lawyer.
[1:59:59] Speaker 1: Like that's real. Well, that's they usually have a house.
[2:00:02] Speaker 1: They usually space it out a little bit. But like
[2:00:04] Speaker 1: Peter Scanavino was an unhoused suspect and then became a
[2:00:09] Speaker 1: detective and then a district attorney. Well, no, he was abused.
[2:00:13] Speaker 1: I think he did.
[2:00:14] Speaker 2: He did assault a man, but it's because he thought
[2:00:16] Speaker 2: he was being a molester. Yeah, yeah, he witnessed something,
[2:00:21] Speaker 2: but it came from his own abuse. Have they not
[2:00:24] Speaker 2: had you guys on? Is there anyway? I bombed one
[2:00:29] Speaker 2: audition in like twenty fifteen, and then I had one
[2:00:33] Speaker 2: audition last year which was for an anti immigrant protester,
[2:00:37] Speaker 2: which I'm okay, not kidding.
[2:00:39] Speaker 1: I feel like I can.
[2:00:39] Speaker 2: I can hopefully, so hopefully I nail an audition one time.
[2:00:43] Speaker 5: But I mean they would be lucky to what what
[2:00:47] Speaker 5: crossover press?
[2:00:48] Speaker 1: I mean, they don't care enough about us.
[2:00:50] Speaker 2: We're desperate, but we have them all on the inside
[2:00:52] Speaker 2: and they have sent us pr packages before.
[2:00:55] Speaker 1: But you know, we just love it so much.
[2:00:58] Speaker 5: They should be There's to be some like pod we
[2:01:02] Speaker 5: would like to find a body? Yeah, but no, But
[2:01:05] Speaker 5: what I'm thinking more like what podcast gossip is worthy
[2:01:10] Speaker 5: of s?
[2:01:11] Speaker 1: View?
[2:01:11] Speaker 5: Like what crazy pod? There must be something at this
[2:01:15] Speaker 5: point there's so many podcasts.
[2:01:16] Speaker 2: Oh, you're right, like a crazy like someone going and
[2:01:19] Speaker 2: searching for a thing. I mean, I'm really what, I'm
[2:01:23] Speaker 2: really thirsty, like a true crime in a podcast realm
[2:01:26] Speaker 2: that could be used to inspire few and then.
[2:01:28] Speaker 5: You guys could play the podcasters who find the thing
[2:01:31] Speaker 5: and uncover this crazy crime.
[2:01:34] Speaker 2: Yes, I did love the ricenes moment, like I can't
[2:01:41] Speaker 2: get enough of it because of course those two people
[2:01:45] Speaker 2: came up with that.
[2:01:47] Speaker 1: Yeah, of course she was a delight.
[2:01:52] Speaker 2: Oh yes, all connected.
[2:01:55] Speaker 1: But she was great. I mean I've been watching her
[2:01:57] Speaker 1: for such a long time. Uh, and it was great
[2:02:01] Speaker 1: to get Katrina Lichikov. Uh this episode. Fuck.
[2:02:05] Speaker 2: I mean I'm gonna see her on Broadway, I think, yeah, yeah,
[2:02:09] Speaker 2: I want to see. Yeah, I'm gonna go. I'm gonna
[2:02:11] Speaker 2: try to go, so I hope I see you guys there.
[2:02:14] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[2:02:14] Speaker 2: Oh, also, since i've you know, I performed in Chicago
[2:02:18] Speaker 2: this past weekend.
[2:02:18] Speaker 1: It was fun and everyone's like so exciting. I love
[2:02:22] Speaker 1: the people. That nice show. And someone made me a bracelet,
[2:02:27] Speaker 1: A lot of bracelets, A lot of bracelets.
[2:02:28] Speaker 2: I have a bracelet that a lot of jewels. I
[2:02:33] Speaker 2: just wanted to give a shout out to them.
[2:02:35] Speaker 1: But yeah, this episode is.
[2:02:38] Speaker 2: I have children because there are people like you can't
[2:02:41] Speaker 2: for it's all wrong, it's all wrong. You shouldn't have
[2:02:44] Speaker 2: been a parent. Yeah, you shouldn't have been a parent.
[2:02:47] Speaker 2: You can't force you to do math and make money
[2:02:50] Speaker 2: for you and be your little weirdo and Rice abuse
[2:02:54] Speaker 2: in a cell.
[2:02:54] Speaker 1: What the fuck are you talking about? Yeah? Yeah, And
[2:02:59] Speaker 1: it's like kids, I don't know. I have like friends
[2:03:01] Speaker 1: whose kids have like tested really gifted, and they're like, yeah,
[2:03:04] Speaker 1: but I don't want them to like not have any
[2:03:07] Speaker 1: social skills, so I'm leaving them in the regular school
[2:03:10] Speaker 1: that they're in so that they can keep their friends
[2:03:12] Speaker 1: and they can go to like MIT later, you know,
[2:03:14] Speaker 1: like or whatever. It's just sometimes I don't know about
[2:03:19] Speaker 1: these like incubators of genius talent or whatever. But also
[2:03:25] Speaker 1: it's interesting because now it feels like so many kids
[2:03:29] Speaker 1: are medicated. I mean this episode came out at a
[2:03:31] Speaker 1: time where it was like I think Riddle and adderall Concerta,
[2:03:35] Speaker 1: it was all like in the in the zeitgeist, and
[2:03:38] Speaker 1: now I feel like it's sort of just like more commonplace.
[2:03:41] Speaker 1: Everybody's a lot of people take that stuff. I mean,
[2:03:44] Speaker 1: I'm on one of those. So you know, it's interesting
[2:03:50] Speaker 1: some of these things, Like I'm like, I don't know,
[2:03:51] Speaker 1: is it still a thing where people are like I
[2:03:53] Speaker 1: gotta be the best? Like obviously yes, but like I
[2:03:57] Speaker 1: don't know, I'm around like young people sometimes that feel
[2:04:01] Speaker 1: like they're like not as obsessed with like the college
[2:04:03] Speaker 1: rat race getting into Harvard and all that stuff. You know,
[2:04:07] Speaker 1: I don't know, I'm not as connected, but I think, Yeah,
[2:04:11] Speaker 1: these psychopaths exist everywhere, and I will not for a
[2:04:14] Speaker 1: moment think it's there's not a hot house happening near
[2:04:17] Speaker 1: me at any moment. There's a hot house within one
[2:04:20] Speaker 1: hundred people at all times.
[2:04:21] Speaker 2: I just don't trust these people having kids with no thought,
[2:04:24] Speaker 2: Like if you're going to force your kid to do
[2:04:26] Speaker 2: an activity that you think you can do, but you're
[2:04:29] Speaker 2: actually a flop at don't.
[2:04:31] Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, because your kids are like your extension of
[2:04:34] Speaker 1: you and you need you need like a little bit
[2:04:38] Speaker 1: of like stolen valor from your children kind of. Yeah,
[2:04:41] Speaker 1: it's like it's dark. It's dark. And then the other
[2:04:44] Speaker 1: she's dead to it.
[2:04:45] Speaker 2: You're cutting your kids out because they're not good enough
[2:04:47] Speaker 2: at math, Like it's sick.
[2:04:49] Speaker 1: Yeah, but I guess.
[2:04:50] Speaker 2: If your kid isn't take all of us like, that's
[2:04:53] Speaker 2: isn't that what they say? It's like because they don't
[2:04:56] Speaker 2: because kids are not loved. That's the issue with everything.
[2:05:00] Speaker 1: Yeah, truly, that's the cycle that starts everything. I mean, sure,
[2:05:04] Speaker 1: you can give a kid love and they could be
[2:05:06] Speaker 1: like born a psychopath, as we've seen born psychopath. But like,
[2:05:10] Speaker 1: that's very rare compared to most of the problems of
[2:05:13] Speaker 1: the world are from people that yes, we're abused, unloved, neglected.
[2:05:20] Speaker 1: But I was gonna say, if you are going to
[2:05:25] Speaker 1: have a genius child and their journaling, just keep an
[2:05:28] Speaker 1: eye out for fully spiraling literally spirograph like words. Just
[2:05:35] Speaker 1: make sure that they're waiting in a straight line and
[2:05:37] Speaker 1: that the word.
[2:05:38] Speaker 2: The whole time I've been so focused on the Russian
[2:05:40] Speaker 2: house thing, I forgot about Sarah Hyland fully throughout this
[2:05:44] Speaker 2: whole recap, I mean this whole post mortem.
[2:05:48] Speaker 1: Yeah, if you want to cover your tracks, a mesh
[2:05:50] Speaker 1: song is a great way to convince everyone that your
[2:05:52] Speaker 1: roommate's a slut. A mesh thong. Okay, well, best set Chess.
[2:05:58] Speaker 1: I do love that episode. It's good, but it's just
[2:06:00] Speaker 1: it is. It was hard to try to do it
[2:06:02] Speaker 1: at a live show. It just was it's not quite
[2:06:04] Speaker 1: as funny as we need it to be. No, because
[2:06:06] Speaker 1: she's such.
[2:06:06] Speaker 2: A young child, and we just want everyone to have
[2:06:09] Speaker 2: a joyous, good life. Yeah, because if you get a
[2:06:12] Speaker 2: joy out of the math, Yeah, be a genius. Go
[2:06:15] Speaker 2: do your homework. My niece loves to study. We're not
[2:06:19] Speaker 2: forcing her. Wait, my niece found so my mom found
[2:06:28] Speaker 2: letters from the war from nineteen forty four from my
[2:06:31] Speaker 2: father's cousins that were right and died and no one
[2:06:35] Speaker 2: knew where or when they died. Nothing, And like, you know,
[2:06:38] Speaker 2: my father's father was in the war as well. And
[2:06:42] Speaker 2: my niece took this and then found archives from in
[2:06:45] Speaker 2: Russia today, found where they served, where they battled, where
[2:06:49] Speaker 2: they died, and found like all of these Russian documents
[2:06:53] Speaker 2: about my father's family from World War two.
[2:06:56] Speaker 1: Oh wow, my brother has been doing that for our family. Yeah,
[2:06:59] Speaker 1: So I'm going.
[2:07:00] Speaker 2: I talked to Lauren, our art friend, and so I
[2:07:03] Speaker 2: I'm going to find a place the right sleeves to
[2:07:06] Speaker 2: hold this and like how to store this all. Yeah,
[2:07:09] Speaker 2: we're trying to get it all translated, well, because I
[2:07:12] Speaker 2: don't want to use aotic. I want to Yeah, so
[2:07:14] Speaker 2: I'm trying to figure out because it's cursive. But and
[2:07:16] Speaker 2: then so I looked at all these photos and it's
[2:07:18] Speaker 2: so sad these two young men, these.
[2:07:21] Speaker 1: Boys that died. Yeah, and yeah tragic. Wow, Yeah, that's
[2:07:29] Speaker 1: more war and the things and like young men just
[2:07:32] Speaker 1: die for bullshit, for these fucking bullshit. It's like really upsetting.
[2:07:37] Speaker 2: But yeah, yeah, so this is a new journey my
[2:07:40] Speaker 2: niece has brought us into because she's so studious.
[2:07:43] Speaker 1: Yeah, my brother randomly started doing that too, because my
[2:07:45] Speaker 1: dad turned eighty and so they were like making him
[2:07:47] Speaker 1: a book and like he found all this information about
[2:07:51] Speaker 1: our family back in like Hungary that I didn't know
[2:07:54] Speaker 1: from World War Two. It's so funny.
[2:07:55] Speaker 2: I guess guys are like I have to procreate because
[2:07:57] Speaker 2: of my legacy.
[2:07:58] Speaker 1: It's what's your great grandmother his name? Yeah? And that
[2:08:02] Speaker 1: that was just like a meme video that came up
[2:08:04] Speaker 1: in my feet. You know, I love the meme video
[2:08:06] Speaker 1: that I know you've seen too, where this guy goes,
[2:08:08] Speaker 1: my mom's the best. This girl's dating a guy who's like,
[2:08:12] Speaker 1: my mom's the best. She did everything for us growing up.
[2:08:14] Speaker 1: And what's her what's your favorite color? What does she
[2:08:16] Speaker 1: do for fun? What do you mean like the guy
[2:08:18] Speaker 1: knows nothing about his mom, Like he doesn't know a word,
[2:08:22] Speaker 1: like a single thing about her personally. Oh god, devastated.
[2:08:26] Speaker 1: Got that hit. It's really like that SNL with the bathrobe.
[2:08:29] Speaker 1: You know, it's like, get your bathrobe what the fuck.
[2:08:33] Speaker 1: She doesn't need it and I got this robe all right? Oh,
[2:08:39] Speaker 1: I also for a postmortem. It's not not relevant in
[2:08:44] Speaker 1: any way. I saw Hoppers speaking of the mom. The
[2:08:47] Speaker 1: way I got to that was, I don't know what
[2:08:49] Speaker 1: you talking to me, like I should know what this is.
[2:08:51] Speaker 1: It's a Pixar, it's a new Pixar. Cute. Yeah. A
[2:08:56] Speaker 1: Parna's a voice in it, a Parna on Cherla's a
[2:08:58] Speaker 1: voice in it, Vanessa Bay. My friend John Ham's in it,
[2:09:01] Speaker 1: John Ham, John Ham's a major character. It was good.
[2:09:04] Speaker 1: I mean, I feel like Pixars had a bunch of flops,
[2:09:06] Speaker 1: and I thought Hoppers was good. There was a part
[2:09:08] Speaker 1: Wheresie got a little bit scared of, but the rest
[2:09:11] Speaker 1: of it, like, it was really good. They look really cute,
[2:09:14] Speaker 1: these little beavers. I want to squeeze. Yeah, cut, it
[2:09:18] Speaker 1: was cute. It was cute. And Bobby moynihan, it's like
[2:09:20] Speaker 1: a lot of SNL people. That's what reminded me of
[2:09:22] Speaker 1: it when you said that. Okay, let's get into what
[2:09:25] Speaker 1: would Sister Peg do. This is our weekly segment where
[2:09:28] Speaker 1: we direct you to an organization, an article, a movie,
[2:09:32] Speaker 1: a doc something to give you more information about what
[2:09:34] Speaker 1: we talked about today. And obviously with all this talk
[2:09:38] Speaker 1: of you know, abusing ADHD medication, I wanted to point
[2:09:42] Speaker 1: you guys to sam says National Helpline. That's Substance Abuse
[2:09:48] Speaker 1: and Mental Health Services Administration. It's a free, confidential, twenty
[2:09:52] Speaker 1: four to seven, three hundred and sixty five day year
[2:09:53] Speaker 1: treatment referral and information service. It's in English and in
[2:09:57] Speaker 1: Espanol for individuals and family facing mental and or substance
[2:10:01] Speaker 1: use disorders. So if you you know, bookmark that if
[2:10:06] Speaker 1: in case you know anybody that could use that for
[2:10:08] Speaker 1: more information. The helpline number is one eight hundred and
[2:10:11] Speaker 1: sixty sixty two Help HLP. And the website is SAMHSA
[2:10:16] Speaker 1: dot gov, so that's SAMHSA dot gov. That will be
[2:10:21] Speaker 1: linked in our show notes and then it will be
[2:10:23] Speaker 1: in a story the day that this episode comes out
[2:10:29] Speaker 1: on our Instagram, which is that's Messed Up pod, so
[2:10:32] Speaker 1: that's how you can find it, and then we save
[2:10:33] Speaker 1: those forever in our WWSPD highlights on our Instagram.
[2:10:36] Speaker 2: Thank you so much, And next week we'll be doing
[2:10:38] Speaker 2: Reasonable Doubt from season fifteen, episode twenty two.
[2:10:42] Speaker 1: As always, we're here weekly.
[2:10:44] Speaker 2: We've never taken a day off, and I hope you
[2:10:47] Speaker 2: see that that one week off, we've taken days off.
[2:10:51] Speaker 1: I misspoke, but I'm just saying. Always an episode. We
[2:10:54] Speaker 1: never we never missed an episode. We love you guys. Bye.
[2:11:07] Speaker 2: That's Messed Up as an exactly right production.
[2:11:09] Speaker 1: If you have compliments you'd like to give us or
[2:11:11] Speaker 1: episodes you'd like us to cover, shoot us an email
[2:11:14] Speaker 1: it That's Messed uppod at gmail dot com. Listen to
[2:11:17] Speaker 1: That's Messed Up on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or
[2:11:20] Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts.
[2:11:22] Speaker 2: Follow the podcast on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod,
[2:11:25] Speaker 2: and follow us personally at Kara Klank and at Glitter Cheese.
[2:11:29] Speaker 1: As always, please see our show notes for sources and
[2:11:32] Speaker 1: more information.
[2:11:33] Speaker 2: Thank you so much to our senior producer Casey O'Brien
[2:11:36] Speaker 2: and our associate producer Christina Chamberlain.
[2:11:39] Speaker 1: And to our mixer John Bradley and our guest booker
[2:11:42] Speaker 1: Patrick Cottner, and to Henry Kaperski for our theme song
[2:11:45] Speaker 1: and Carly Geen Andrews for our artwork. Thank you to
[2:11:48] Speaker 1: our executive producers Georgia hard Start, Karen Kilgareff, Daniel Kramer
[2:11:52] Speaker 1: and everybody at exactly right. Media dut dun

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