# 661. Before You Give Up on Your Health: The Missing Link to Joy, Healing & Health

An episode of [The Thyroid (and Hormone) Fixer Podcast: Thyropause, Menopause, Metabolism and How to Fix It](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1529800263), 1 Sep 2026, 1 h 13 min.

Audio: https://episode.flightcast.com/01M0WNT25X3YM09E2G00SV832Q.mp3

I’m joined by my dear friend Kristin Weitzel for a conversation about psychedelic-assisted therapy, trauma, nervous system regulation, and what it can look like to create meaningful change from the inside out. Kristin brings more than 15 years of experience in breathwork, nervous system regulation, health optimization, and integration work, and she shares what led her from supporting plant medicine ceremonies to becoming a facilitator herself. We talk about the resistance many people have around psychedelics, including the belief that they do not have “big enough” trauma to address, and why the patterns formed through childhood experiences, relationships, environment, and other life experiences can continue to influence how we respond to the world. I also share what came up during my own journey with Kristin, including a traumatic experience involving my father that I had learned to move through rather than fully process. Kristin explains how slowing down, noticing the body's responses, and creating enough nervous system regulation can allow difficult experiences to be approached differently. What you’ll learn: • Why trauma does not have to involve one major event to influence your patterns and behaviors • How experiences from childhood can continue to shape the nervous system long after the original event • What a simple body scan can reveal about your current emotional and nervous system state • What Kristin's own journey taught her about the therapeutic potential of psychedelic work • What to consider when deciding whether a facilitator is someone you can genuinely trust • Why integration may be just as important as the psychedelic experience itself • How breathwork, cold exposure, nervous system regulation, and other tools can fit into the broader process of personal growth Resources: Work with Kristen: https://www.sherpabreathandcold.com/journeys Grab your Thyroid Fixer here: https://betterlifedoctor.com/ New here? Use code LISTEN20 for 20% off your first order Returning customers can use code LISTEN10 for 10% off SHOP DR. AMIE’S FIXXR® SUPPLEMENTS: betterlifedoctor.com LET'S GET YOUR LIFE BACK...Connect with Dr. Amie Hornaman Book a free thyroid and hormone solution call: https://dramiehornaman.com/pages/book-a-call CHECK OUT MY FREEBIES... JUST CLICK BELOW Thyroid Optimization Guide: https://health.dramie.com/thyropause 7 Day Thyroid Healing Kickstarter: https://fixyourthyroid.com/7daykickstarter Thyroid on Trial: https://health.dramie.com/thyroid-on-trial-optin RATE, REVIEW AND FOLLOW ON APPLE PODCASTS Show your love for Dr. Amie and The Thyroid Fixer Podcast! If you’re enjoying our journey together, I’d be thrilled if you could take a moment to rate and review the show on Apple Podcasts. Your support helps me reach and help more people just like you, guiding them towards their optimal selves! Just clickHERE (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-thyroid-fixer/id1529800263), scroll all the way down, give us those 5 stars, and share what you enjoy about my episodes in a review. Haven’t subscribed yet? Make sure to follow The Thyroid Fixer Podcast to catch all the new episodes that come out every week. FollowHERE (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-thyroid-fixer/id1529800263) and never miss out on a moment of the journey! CONNECT WITH ME ON SOCIAL MEDIA: Join my exclusive Facebook Group and get questions answered LIVE weekly, Just Fix Your Thyroid, for a Community of HOPE and SUPPORT in your thyroid journey. https://www.facebook.com/groups/dramie/ (https://www.facebook.com/groups/dramie/) Like me on Facebook:Amie Hornaman Nutrition and Functional Medicine (https://www.facebook.com/amiehornamannutrition/) Subscribe on YouTube:Dr. Amie Hornaman (https://www.youtube.com/c/dramiehornaman) Follow me on Instagram:@dramiehornaman (https://www.instagram.com/dramiehornaman/)

## Transcript

[0:00] The game that we get to play in the work with the psychedelics in a therapeutic sense is to be like, what?
[0:05] Let me bring all of this into the forefront, into the awareness so that I can pick and choose, that I can have autonomy to decide how I show up in the world, right?
[0:14] To stand on my own two feet in a way that is actually me.
[0:18] I just want to say thank you.
[0:21] The fact that you're here means that you have trusted me with something so valuable these days, your time.
[0:28] And I do not take that lightly at all.
[0:30] So if you're listening because you're exhausted, you're gaining weight for no reason, losing your hair, getting really frustrated, or you've been told that everything looks normal, when you know deep down something isn't right, I want you to know that I see you.
[0:46] I've been where you are.
[0:47] And that's exactly why I created this podcast.
[0:50] My mission is super simple, to give you the information, the hope and the tools that I wish someone had given me years ago.
[0:57] So my goal is you get to stop wondering what's wrong with your body and finally start getting your life back.
[1:06] So if these episodes have helped you at all, would you do me one small favor?
[1:10] Take just a few seconds to follow the show, the little button in the upper corner, and then leave a review.
[1:17] Every follow and every review helps this podcast reach another person who's lying there awake at night wondering why they don't even recognize themselves anymore when they look in the mirror.
[1:29] Wondering what's happened to this amazing, energized, full of life person they used to be.
[1:33] You're helping them.
[1:35] And not only that...
[1:36] When you follow the show, you'll be notified about the hottest episodes everyone is listening to and everyone's downloading, along with any bonus episodes I drop throughout the month.
[1:46] Think of it as your insider pass.
[1:48] So thank you for letting me be part of your journey, and thank you for your time.
[1:53] Now, let's get into today's episode.
[1:55] So.
[1:58] So this episode is going to get very, very personal, but I want to give you a kind of an introduction here first.
[2:07] So you may have heard a previous episode I did, episode number 652, where I say I healed more in six hours than in decades.
[2:17] The healing conversation everyone with a pulse needs to hear.
[2:22] Now this kind of expands on that.
[2:24] So that conversation was with...
[2:27] Mike Keller, and he was one of my facilitators during one of my plant medicine journeys.
[2:36] Kristen, who we're going to talk to today, was my other facilitator in my second career.
[2:42] plant medicine journey.
[2:43] So I had two different experiences, male and female, and they each produced different results.
[2:49] I mean, they were totally different experiences.
[2:52] So I wanted to dive into my work with Kristen and what came up during that session, because I truly believe this is something transformational.
[3:01] And I'm naming it, you know, everyone with a pulse needs to hear it, or if you are giving up on your health, this really is the missing link to
[3:10] to healing, to joy, to getting back your power.
[3:14] It really, really is.
[3:16] But it's important that we lay the groundwork first.
[3:19] I don't want you to know who I'm actually talking to.
[3:21] Kristen, just a dear, dear friend, Kristen Weitzel, dear friend of mine, colleague, I was so blessed to be able to work with her
[3:30] So she is a facilitator of psychedelic-assisted therapy.
[3:35] And she uses IFS parts work, somatic integration, trauma-informed regulation, and ceremonial support.
[3:45] Because what you're doing in a plant medicine journey is a ceremony of sorts.
[3:52] You are going deep inside of you.
[3:56] And you're going to hear more on the episode.
[3:58] I certainly can't do it justice in an introduction.
[4:02] But it really is a beautiful experience, an up-leveling experience.
[4:08] It's just incredible.
[4:10] So Kristen is a breathwork expert.
[4:13] She's an integration specialist.
[4:14] She's a great person.
[4:15] She works at that intersection of nervous system science and just transformational deep work for lasting change, lasting change.
[4:27] And her approach really does pair together this physiological grounding with this genuine reverence for your spirit, for the inner terrain workings of your body.
[4:41] And she really dives into helping high performers, athletes, and just seekers of up-level health, up-level life experience experience.
[4:54] deep, lasting change.
[4:56] I mean, that's the only way I can describe this properly.
[5:01] It's like I'm searching for words to describe the most beautiful thing I've ever seen.
[5:06] How can you put it into words?
[5:09] How can you?
[5:10] Just listen to this episode with an open mind.
[5:13] If you've done a psychedelic journey before, a plant medicine journey before, listen to this with an open mind again, because you might want to work with Kristen.
[5:22] I had an incredible experience.
[5:24] And you're going to learn more about my experience and what came up.
[5:27] And if you have not yet gone into the world of plant medicine and
[5:34] If you're curious, if you're resistant, I want you to listen to this episode as well.
[5:40] Because I get into the science with Kristen and we break down, how can it help your health?
[5:45] How can it help your life?
[5:47] How can it help you deal with things that you don't even realize are coming into the picture now?
[5:54] Affecting your progress, affecting your health, affecting your joy, affecting your quality of life.
[6:01] For me, this was transformational.
[6:03] And that's why I want to share it with you.
[6:05] Because if I can help unlock your potential, if I can help you move to the next level, if someone would have sat down with me and told me, listen, you need to do this for yourself.
[6:19] This isn't just...
[6:21] recreational drug use.
[6:23] It's not playing around with mushrooms.
[6:26] It's an experience, a deep, transformative experience.
[6:34] That's all I can say in this beautiful introduction.
[6:36] You just have to listen.
[6:38] Have at it.
[6:39] Let's go.
[6:41] Okay, Kristen, so we're getting real real today, and the audience is going to hear a lot of me.
[6:48] I feel like I'm going to crack my heart and soul open and dump it out on this recording, but I told you right before we started, I wanted to be open and honest because I want my listeners to be able to hear and feel what's going on.
[7:05] the power of what you do for people and literally how you can bring us to a whole different level.
[7:15] I don't even want to say the word consciousness because that's almost a little too woo for people.
[7:19] That you can bring us to a whole new level of understanding who we are in this world, why certain shitty things have happened to us or for us as a reframe,
[7:35] And really how to, and I'm going to just summarize it this way, how to not be controlled by the trauma that you've experienced because we've all experienced it and it's totally possible to move through this world differently.
[7:51] in a joyful state, in a healthy state, have a new perspective on life, and uplevel your health all at the same time.
[8:00] Like it literally is possible.
[8:03] So that's my lead in.
[8:04] You know, that's kind of introducing the audience as to what we're going to talk about to where they're going, okay, I'm going to keep listening.
[8:10] What the hell is Dr. Amy talking about?
[8:13] So Kristen, welcome to the show.
[8:14] And thank you for being here so that we can have this open and honest conversation and be able to help other people that really need this.
[8:20] Yeah, awesome.
[8:21] I'm so glad to be here.
[8:22] And I think more and more as people like you and me speak about this, we gather, we sort of like find the others, right?
[8:30] There's a lot of the conversation around psychedelics in general, plant medicine in general, heart opening medicine, as well as like health optimization tools that are more fringe and
[8:40] that aren't getting discussed often enough.
[8:42] And I know, you know, on my show I started talking and being very open about this and the work I'm doing.
[8:47] Like I said, when I'm gonna start doing this kind of facilitation, my family is all gonna know, I'm gonna have the conversations with them and be really clear, then open about how beautiful it is to help people heal themselves.
[8:58] I love it.
[8:59] I love it.
[9:00] Well, I want to start with how you got into the world of plant medicine because you've been on the show before.
[9:07] People can go back.
[9:08] We'll link to that episode down below so they can hear your first interview.
[9:11] And you and I have been friends forever.
[9:13] We've been in this health space together for a long time.
[9:16] What was it in your life that made that transition for you to say, I need to start using psychedelics or plant medicine?
[9:26] with my clients because I see the potential here.
[9:29] I see the help that it can bring.
[9:31] Yeah, that's a great question.
[9:33] And I would say that I've worked in nervous system regulation with breathwork and cold exposure, and more recently even heat therapy, and a lot of sort of health optimization biohacking tools for 15 plus years, and coaching people around nutrition, all the things.
[9:46] And I really had a beautiful opportunity, probably nine years ago now, to start working in some plat medicine or psychedelic circles where I was bringing breathwork, I was coming and being in service.
[9:57] I was not dosing people, bringing any of the medicines,
[10:00] But as being in service in circles where I could bring breath work, I brought cold exposure, not while people are in medicine, but if it was like a long weekend, that would be like the days in between and help people regulate the nervous systems through it so that they could sort of face what they needed to face about themselves and feel into their feelings in a way that felt safe.
[10:19] And I love doing that work.
[10:20] And sometimes I was like cooking meals or like cleaning puke buckets, like, you know, whatever it might be, right?
[10:25] You're just supporting the whole group that's there.
[10:28] And I really continue to like love that work and grow and see people transform.
[10:33] And I always thought I'm never going to be the person who is the medicine woman.
[10:37] I'm just not with some medicine specifically.
[10:40] They're very reverent.
[10:41] Like we talk about ayahuasca or something.
[10:43] I think it's like.
[10:44] I'd need to go down to the Amazon and study with some shaman for 10 years or just to really get a full understanding of the reverence of that medicine.
[10:52] And so I was cautious and I would say a little bit reserved around it.
[10:56] Also, you know, you're navigating other things in regulation.
[10:59] But a couple of years ago, I had a really the dark night of the soul thing showed up for me.
[11:04] I always used to say, I'm not that girl who's like I went from mess to masterpiece.
[11:08] I don't have something like you have this beautiful story about your rise as a phoenix from the ashes and all the things you learned and the way you became a doctor and all of this.
[11:17] And.
[11:18] how you help so many people came from this lived experience of wow, I had this challenge and then I wanted to help people through it.
[11:24] And I always would say, I don't have that story.
[11:26] I'm just here to help people.
[11:28] I'm like little did I know, of course, be careful what you wish for.
[11:31] Then I had a really big breakdown, I would say.
[11:33] Mental, emotional in the sense that I went from being relatively alpha and organized and not worrying so much about other people or what they thought to like highly anxious, challenged in social situations, really depressed, crying every day,
[11:47] for probably like 12 to 14 months.
[11:49] And it was navigating a lot of grief for my father's passing from a breakup, a whole bunch of things that transformed me.
[11:55] And people recommended to me a few times, you need to go try psychedelic therapy.
[12:01] And after two or three recommendations and knowing that I had every other tool in my toolkit, I had cold, I had breath, I had all these things, I could eat clean, I could, you know, try to transform, I could supplement.
[12:10] I just, I couldn't
[12:12] I couldn't see a light at the end of the tunnel.
[12:14] Right.
[12:15] And it was it was to speak my truth.
[12:17] Like I had a long term ex.
[12:19] His name is Matt.
[12:19] And he set up a phone thread and he asked me first for permission, but said, I just feel like I'm worried about you every day.
[12:25] I'd like to set up a small text group on WhatsApp of all your friends so that we can check in with each other that someone's checked in with you.
[12:31] Right.
[12:31] Because I had a bit of suicidal ideation and.
[12:33] It's a very scary time.
[12:35] And so I finally took the recommendation of some two or three people recommended the same practitioner.
[12:39] And I took the recommendation and went and had an MDMA and psilocybin mixed session with a psychedelic therapist.
[12:47] And it was the first time that I saw a light at the end of the tunnel in a year, year and a half.
[12:52] And it wasn't like the silver bullet that made me think, okay, everything's gonna be fine.
[12:57] But it gave me the ability to be able to get out of bed and to do the work and to feel into that integration period to say, how do I wanna change and what am I doing in my life?
[13:06] And I have some hope that's come back
[13:08] And in that whole course of things, I think the biggest thing was me figuring out how to, in the midst of that journey, I had a moment of clarity.
[13:17] I would almost say sobriety, although you're in an altered state where I said to the person who was my psychedelic therapist, you have to teach me how to do this.
[13:29] I can feel right now the way my nervous system just settled, how it hasn't in many, many months or has rarely done.
[13:37] And I have all these other tools and the underpinning to support people in this way.
[13:40] And I knew I had gone through the Condor approach used to be this course that you could learn how to do facilitation, trauma informed, all these things.
[13:48] And a lot of plant medicine facilitation and facilitators in that group.
[13:52] I had been through that.
[13:53] And I, you know, it's like the universe plays the grand joke on you that you go through these things and then they all kind of transferable skills.
[13:59] So I knew that the headcount of people who needed support versus the therapists that were available, psychedelic facilitators and otherwise, breathwork coaches, et cetera, that it was just way out of whack.
[14:09] And there's just not enough people to serve the population that's challenged with so many mental health conditions and things going on.
[14:16] And it was like in that moment that I thought,
[14:22] And I want to get out in the world.
[14:24] And if someone's going to help someone heal themselves, I want to be able to be a person who's really highly responsible and concerned about safety and can get to people who might have reservations about doing this work so that I can help cultivate their own healing for them.
[14:39] Right.
[14:40] And so that's the shortest story I could tell you about it.
[14:42] But it was a pretty profound experience because I just knew in that moment that automatically I was like, oh, I'm equipped now.
[14:47] I have all the tools.
[14:48] Right.
[14:48] Yes.
[14:49] Yes.
[14:50] Well, and it's the that that last sentence that you just said, the people who have the reservations about doing this work, that's really who I want to speak to today.
[15:01] Because, you know, people who have thought about it, who have kind of toyed around with it, maybe started looking into it, they're going to hear this message anyways, and they're going to hear the benefits.
[15:10] They're going to hear your story.
[15:11] They're going to hear my story.
[15:12] And truthfully, I mean, I'll say it right now.
[15:14] I believe that every single person breathing needs to do this work because there's not a single human on this planet over the age of, I don't know, at least we'll call it over the age of 18 as an adult.
[15:27] who hasn't had something happen to them that they are trying to process.
[15:31] It could have been the death of a parent, abusive childhood, various adverse childhood events.
[15:37] It could be a relationship that you enter into, a bad marriage, whatever it is, these different things.
[15:44] impact us.
[15:45] And like you even said, it can even go back generations.
[15:48] Ancestral trauma, being passed down.
[15:51] Would your mom go through?
[15:52] Would your grandma go through?
[15:53] What is history passed down to you as trauma?
[15:56] So when I say everyone that is breathing right now needs to do this work, I'm not kidding.
[16:02] But I also realize that there's resistance because this is new.
[16:07] This is definitely new
[16:08] in our world of the United States.
[16:10] It just recently became legal in a few states, I believe, although RFK is really working hard at getting psychedelic plant medicine legalized because of the tremendous...
[16:24] help that it gives to so many people.
[16:26] We're seeing it, especially in veterans with PTSD, in addictions.
[16:31] I mean, across the board, we're seeing benefits and fast benefits, not years of talk therapy, fast benefits.
[16:37] But that's who I really want to speak to today are those people in resistance to doing this work.
[16:42] And I'm hoping that they're not going to press stop yet.
[16:45] Keep listening because we're talking to you and we're going to kind of unpack this for you so that you can see all of the benefits involved in this work.
[16:52] So I appreciate you sharing your own resistance because, of course, I have it too, right?
[16:57] I think everybody does.
[16:59] They think a couple of different things.
[17:01] Number one, just like you said, I didn't really have any big T's.
[17:05] I don't really have that much to work through.
[17:07] So is this really going to help me?
[17:10] Is it really going to help me?
[17:11] So let's just kind of start there of what you see with different people that come to you with like, you know, Kristen, I'm kind of interested here, but I don't have any big T to unpack.
[17:20] Yeah.
[17:21] So there's a lot there.
[17:22] So psychedelic is loosely translated as like soul or mind manifesting, which I think it gives just some clue into the way that we shift or the transformation that's possible.
[17:33] And a lot of this is around patterning.
[17:35] When we talk about the things that we have in our developmental years, and this is like not about any shame or blame on anyone, as you know.
[17:41] But it's important to sort of note, I think also, like I have a pretty strong opinion that like we talk about you hear people talk about big T, little T trauma.
[17:50] And I say this thing and again, I want to be like trauma informed when I say it, because we're all going to have an opinion on this.
[17:55] But like if you were three years old in the sandbox and someone hit you in the face of the red shovel.
[18:00] like as you're playing, but hit you hard and it really affected you.
[18:04] And that's the first time something like that's happened.
[18:06] And you formulated this notion in your mind that maybe a red shovel equals pain or equals some kind of, you know, detrimental thing to your body, or you're a guy who was off at the Vietnam War and saw somebody getting blown up.
[18:19] It's hard for us to actually really say like, which one of those is worse.
[18:24] Right.
[18:25] I understand that you and I and people listening are going to probably say, well, somebody goes off to war and there's like there's perhaps.
[18:30] OK, but like that three year old small developmental mind that's still growing, that's still learning, that hasn't had a lot of patterning set into place, who doesn't understand like, you know, pain in that way or like what, you know, is only looking to be safe in their nervous system.
[18:45] That trauma can be just as impactful to them every time they see a red shovel for the rest of their life.
[18:50] They're like, oh.
[18:51] I don't know what's going on, but I have a reaction to it, right?
[18:53] Because the body has created, the mind has created this pattern around this thing.
[18:57] And so the big T, little T trauma to me is not like the important thing.
[19:01] I just don't, I think we all have trauma.
[19:04] When I first went to an EMDR therapist, when I was having all the challenges I was having, the first thing she said was like,
[19:10] First question day one, after she made me make a list of all my traumatic events in my life, she said, I want to ask you the question, do you think that you have trauma?
[19:18] And I was like, well, I don't know.
[19:20] Like, you made me make a list.
[19:22] So I made a list of things.
[19:23] It's not like anyone held me down and burned me with cigarettes.
[19:25] Like, that's just what I said.
[19:26] Right.
[19:26] It was like not to anyone who's navigated that empathy.
[19:31] But I felt like I had a pretty good upbringing and all these things.
[19:33] And also, I have trauma.
[19:36] I had trauma.
[19:36] I continue to work on the trauma and the response that my body had.
[19:39] During developmental years, even some of the smaller things can become larger things to us.
[19:44] And they can pattern us into behaviors that serve us in that moment and don't serve us down the road.
[19:50] So when people are sort of resistant to this or feeling like, well, I don't have trauma or I don't, I'm not here to say wave your trauma flag.
[19:57] But just understanding that there are things that can be activated in your body and even patterns that are out of your awareness because you've just been doing them since you could remember that may not be serving you.
[20:09] They might be shadows in some instances, right?
[20:12] And there'll be things to process for people.
[20:15] So that they can feel like they can continue to live into a thriving life.
[20:20] You know, a lot of these things come up later in life as we start to be.
[20:22] I don't sit in session with people and always say, tell me about something that happened when you were six.
[20:26] But the thing that happened when they were six is what comes up.
[20:29] Right.
[20:29] Yeah.
[20:29] Yeah.
[20:30] Yeah.
[20:31] And it comes up voluntarily.
[20:32] So I think that that's important to bring up here, too, because I know just even from my husband, who definitely needs to do this work, but has massive resistance.
[20:42] One of his things is I don't want to talk about and rehash things.
[20:47] things that have happened to me in the past.
[20:49] And that's essentially what you do when you go see a therapist.
[20:53] You go week after week after week for an hour at a time, and you vomit all of this past stuff that you've gone through.
[21:01] And basically, you're just talking about it and reliving it.
[21:04] You're not actually changing the wiring in your brain that occurred during that time or that occurred at the age of three or five or seven that created those patterns.
[21:14] Right.
[21:14] you're just rehashing it.
[21:16] And that's not it.
[21:17] When you bring up something during a plant medicine journey, it's because you and your body want to bring it up.
[21:24] Am I saying that correctly?
[21:26] Yeah.
[21:26] There's a lot of conversation right now about where we're storing the information.
[21:30] Is it in our cells?
[21:31] Is it in our brain?
[21:32] Is it a lot of it's in our nervous system?
[21:34] I mean, we can say the body keeps score, the body doesn't keep score.
[21:37] We can argue about all the things.
[21:38] The
[21:40] I get a chance to sit with people and we can just see in over the course of different styles of therapy being used on people, we can see that people hold on to things that haven't been fully processed by the brain, fully filed away in a way that feels like they're at a level.
[21:54] If you're looking at a one to 10 that they're like, hey, that's a zero or one for me and how hot or spicy it might feel in my nervous system or from a safety perspective.
[22:03] And we talk a lot about the word safety.
[22:05] And I think, too, this comes up for people.
[22:06] They're like, I'm safe.
[22:07] I don't feel unsafe.
[22:08] It's like not about unsafe.
[22:09] It's about your nervous system being able to be downregulated or regulated enough that you can be the fullest expression of yourself.
[22:16] Because, like, quite frankly, for anyone who's listening, this is what we are all waiting from you to get from you, which is for you to be fully yourself.
[22:23] Yeah.
[22:24] And I recently worked with a woman and quite often these nuggets of beautiful information come out in ceremony or in session.
[22:30] And she was like, if everybody would just be who they are, then everybody would get exactly what they need.
[22:37] But we're busy with all the constructs, society, environment, parental structures, caregivers, all these things has put on us.
[22:44] And so it's like when the resistance comes up, which it definitely comes up for lots of humans, why do I need to go back to 40 years?
[22:50] Why do I need to?
[22:51] It's not affecting me.
[22:52] But it's almost silly to say that these things aren't affecting you because positively or negatively, your caregivers, the way you've been brought up, environment, and all of that is going to affect the person you become, right?
[23:03] It's like nature and nurture.
[23:04] We just know there's so many things that affect us.
[23:07] And so it's like,
[23:08] peeling back the curtain.
[23:10] And there's research that my friend, Dr. Richard did around like conscious connected breathing and talk therapy.
[23:15] And it's never to slight talk therapists, but I went to talk there was for 15 years and I loved her.
[23:20] I got really close with her, learned a lot about myself.
[23:22] And if I had known and trusted these medicines back then, it is just a shorter distance between A and B.
[23:28] It is not...
[23:29] a shortcut, but it is a shorter distance.
[23:31] It's much more efficient and effective.
[23:34] And also for anyone who's listening to just remind everyone, this is not recreational use.
[23:38] This is therapeutic use with a
[23:39] facilitator or clinician, some of those are licensed, some of those are underground.
[23:43] It's people who have been trained and understand how to work with trauma.
[23:47] It's people who have understanding of nervous system regulation.
[23:50] This isn't like you at a festival or birthday party with 40 of your friends just raging.
[23:54] Right.
[23:54] This is about like clear intention and clear integration and doing it in a portal with someone who understands how to hold that container, as we call it a container, but in a portal where you're like actually held.
[24:06] using a medicine like the medicine I lead with is MDMA for people who aren't contraindicated, using a medicine like that, that is actually going to reduce our fear center so we can really talk about those things and process them so we don't have to talk about them for the next 15 years.
[24:22] Yep.
[24:23] Yeah, it's a huge shortcut or shortening of the distance because it literally can be a couple six-hour sessions and you've now dealt with 15 years of talk therapy.
[24:36] I mean, it really is that powerful.
[24:38] Now, before we go into kind of my experience today.
[24:42] I want to, you mentioned nervous system regulation.
[24:45] And for people that might be listening that they don't even know how to tune into their own nervous system to kind of see where they're at, can you go through, I don't even know if there is a checklist or anything, but is there something we can tell people or have them tune in to see if their nervous system is dysregulated?
[25:05] Yeah.
[25:05] Yeah, I mean, I think that people can feel into that in some way to start to get some self-awareness and understanding by doing like a body scan or a daily check-in.
[25:16] And that requires you to be able to find some stillness and stillness I recognize even for me, but it's one of the hardest things for us to create in our day-to-day living.
[25:26] So finding some stillness, really checking in a body scan is exactly what it sounds like.
[25:30] It doesn't have to be more difficult.
[25:32] It's like starting from your toes, going all the way to the top of your head, just taking three to five minutes and slowly scanning your body to see where you are and what is your state.
[25:42] And by state, I mean, do you feel hot or cold?
[25:46] It could be that simple.
[25:47] Do you feel emotions in any way, shape or form coming up?
[25:50] Maybe you're like giddy and nervous and excited.
[25:52] It's the first day of your graduate program.
[25:55] had a really terrible date last night and you feel disappointed because you had hoped it had gone better.
[25:59] Or maybe you're feeling tender because you had a fight with your mother on the phone the day before or the morning of or whatever.
[26:05] Really just noticing and like, and this is a thing, like I have had clients that say, well, I don't feel my feelings.
[26:10] I don't know, feelings or whatever.
[26:12] And it's like, cool, you can bypass and avoid that as long as you want.
[26:15] But if any of us on this planet are here being like, I don't feel my feelings, it's just sort of silly at this point.
[26:21] Like, they're coming out in some way, right?
[26:23] You may be able to hold them back or be avoidant or you may be able to say, look, I need to keep this out of my work container.
[26:29] I'm not going to sit and cry at my desk.
[26:31] But finding some time to be able to process and understand how you feel and what your state is.
[26:36] Your state is like, what are your thoughts every day, right?
[26:38] Dispenza tells us 90% of the same thoughts are the thoughts we're thinking every single day over and over because our brain and our nervous system is just trying to keep things status quo.
[26:47] But we don't want to keep things status quo.
[26:48] We want to like grow and expand and take calculated risks in order to be our best, highest version of ourselves.
[26:55] And so body scanning is really helpful.
[26:58] Orienting yourself, which is a sort of trauma-informed exercise where if you're feeling upregulated or nervous or anxious, I'm sure there's a lot of people that are listening that are navigating some anxiousness in the morning, thinking about the whole day ahead or not a lot of sleep from their kids or what have you.
[27:13] If you're navigating anxiousness, if you're navigating depression, knowing that you can take a moment to just sort of orient yourself to your space,
[27:20] smell what you can smell, look at the objects around the room.
[27:24] Our eyes are the part of the brain that's outside of the head.
[27:28] And the more that we can sort of widen our gaze and get some stillness and take in some colors, sounds, light, noise, anything, smells, tastes even, the more we can bring ourself to the present moment, because that's what this is about, the more we can recognize we're not being chased by a lion.
[27:44] It's not a thousand years ago.
[27:46] We hopefully have a roof
[27:51] And from that place, all you can do is really breathe, right?
[27:54] You're going to naturally be breathing.
[27:56] And so breathing in a way that downregulates you, like nasal breathing in and out through the nose, you can actually shift your state in a few minutes.
[28:03] But scanning your body and checking in where you're at and also being like, cool, I'm really angry today.
[28:09] I'm really sad today.
[28:10] I'm feeling just naming it will take it down a notch.
[28:14] Right.
[28:14] Just so you're like naming it, aware of it, being with it and letting it be a thing that is, OK, this is in me.
[28:20] How do I just make sure that when I respond to anything around me, I'm taking whatever moment of pause I can to not try to color it with that lens.
[28:28] Right.
[28:29] Right.
[28:29] And really recognizing that those feelings, like the buzzing feelings, the heat, the cold, the different sensations that you're having in your body, that is your nervous system.
[28:40] That is your nervous system responding and responding to the thoughts that you have that are almost running underneath the surface that you might not even be aware of.
[28:48] So taking that pause and scanning your body allows you to connect to what's actually going on inside your body instead of staying out here all the time.
[28:57] Yeah.
[28:58] Yeah.
[28:58] Yeah, absolutely.
[29:00] So let's go in.
[29:01] So I'll start sharing.
[29:03] You had mentioned before about trauma and sometimes you go through things.
[29:08] And I'm especially talking to my type A people out there, all the ladies that operate as an apex person.
[29:18] basically operating in your masculine all the time.
[29:21] We can unpack what masculine and feminine means, but you know who you are.
[29:25] You know, you're drivers, you're focused, you have armor on that nothing can touch you because you're just plowing through life.
[29:35] And the reality is that a lot of that drive that you have is fueled by shit that you really got to deal with.
[29:43] And you will be a much better leader, a much better driver, more productive in a calmer sense and more healthy if you do the work.
[29:53] So I did a full journey with Kristen.
[29:55] Just amazing.
[29:56] I mean, just the whole experience and all of you listening can tell how...
[30:01] Just grounded and authentic and real Kristen is.
[30:07] Now, I've known her for a while, but another one of my friends did a full package and has been working with Kristen for a while.
[30:14] And one of the things that she said to me is, Kristen brings the beautiful balance of masculine and feminine.
[30:21] And what she meant by that is that you, Kristen, you bring the love.
[30:26] And I experienced this, so now I know what she's talking about.
[30:28] You bring the love and the care in this motherly, I am going to take care of you.
[30:32] I'm going to be here for you.
[30:33] I'm going to hold you.
[30:35] We're going to do this together.
[30:36] But at the same time, I'm not going to let you bullshit yourself.
[30:41] And you bring in that masculine to go, come on now.
[30:44] No, let's go.
[30:45] Let's get deeper.
[30:45] Or let's talk about that.
[30:47] Nope.
[30:47] Go deep.
[30:47] Go a little bit.
[30:48] Tell me more.
[30:49] And you are literally the perfect guide, the perfect guide.
[30:53] So during our journey,
[30:56] Many different things came up.
[30:57] But one of the things that you were talking about earlier about having even like a visceral response, I remember you telling me when you were talking about this part in your life, your body started shaking.
[31:07] Like you saw me actually start like having a full body response to what I was talking about.
[31:13] And what I was sharing was, and this is very personal, but I've said this before on the show.
[31:18] that I literally watched my dad die in front of me.
[31:21] Now, he's still with us today, but he still died.
[31:24] So the story was when he was going through chemotherapy, he had a heavy dose of chemo that we believe caused this tumor necrosis, this tumor breakdown of the cancer, flooded his body.
[31:39] And while I was there present with him, literally saw him have a heart attack, heard him fall.
[31:46] rushed in the bathroom, calling 911, saw him on the ground, eyes open, mouth open.
[31:51] He was gone.
[31:52] Like he was literally dead for however long.
[31:56] So I start doing CPR compressions.
[31:58] And like talking about you're checking in with your nervous system.
[32:02] If you're really listening to my voice right now, you're hearing it shake because my nervous system is responding to telling the story.
[32:10] So my throat is tight.
[32:11] Yeah.
[32:12] My voice is shaking.
[32:13] Yeah, I'm probably going to tear up a little bit because it's real.
[32:16] Like, I saw this man die in front of me.
[32:19] So I literally did CPR on my father to bring him.
[32:23] Well, I didn't bring him back to life.
[32:24] I kept his heart going.
[32:25] I kept oxygen going to the brain until the paramedics could get there.
[32:28] And then they proceeded to defibrillate him multiple times.
[32:32] Now, the end of the story is he's with us today.
[32:36] No brain damage.
[32:37] He is fine.
[32:38] But that experience imprinted in me, obviously.
[32:41] Like I remember afterwards, I couldn't even watch, you know, ER or the pit or anything hospital wise.
[32:48] If anybody was doing CPR on anybody, I had to turn it off.
[32:51] So obviously there was PTSD.
[32:54] Absolutely there was.
[32:56] Now, I'm going to turn this over to you because I want you to talk freely and openly.
[33:00] You have my permission.
[33:01] You know that of how does that tie in?
[33:04] What does me bringing that up in that session and kind of dealing with it?
[33:10] How does that help?
[33:11] Because I know people listening, although it might not be the same story, they're resonating with a story right now.
[33:17] I know they are.
[33:19] So, yeah.
[33:20] Why?
[33:21] Why even deal with that again?
[33:23] Yeah, that's a great question, right?
[33:24] It's like there's a reprocessing that happens.
[33:26] And what's really beautiful, like Live Time, to watch you speak about that in this situation where you've done so many episodes, so you don't have a lot of nerves around the show or being mic'd, but you're also sharing with your audience something very personal.
[33:38] And I remember when you brought this up, so it's interesting for me as a facilitator because it came a little bit later in the session
[33:45] where I was like, because I will be asking as a facilitator, talking to the subconscious mind, saying, are there challenges or stressors or anything that's come up that you'd like to talk about?
[33:53] So it was a little later in the session, which is not uncommon that some of the bigger things come up later in the session, because the unconscious mind is like just still kind of holding and holding those back.
[34:03] So it was beautiful that it did come up.
[34:04] And also it was very matter of fact, even with the medicine, you were like, oh, yeah, there's this thing where like my father died and I like I brought him back to life.
[34:13] I saved his life kind of.
[34:14] I don't know.
[34:15] And I was like, let's pause here for a second and actually talk about that story because you just laid it out in two sentences and sort of like put a period at the end of it.
[34:22] Like we're not going to talk about that anymore.
[34:23] Like energetically, it felt that way.
[34:25] So I felt like that was a pretty big story in your past.
[34:29] And so I wanted to unpack it a bit more.
[34:31] And when we were having that sort of unpacking of it, and I don't know how much you were realizing it, but what I did get a chance to see as you were like, I slowed down.
[34:41] That's an important thing for a facilitator in a moment with a story like that.
[34:45] That's a very intense story.
[34:46] We can call it a trauma or not, but it's definitely a traumatic experience, a dramatic experience as well.
[34:52] And so it's an important thing as a facilitator to know when something like that comes up, like to slow down.
[34:57] And it's also important for me to slow down and have you slow down.
[35:01] And I don't necessarily mean tell the story slower, but it's just like take more breaths and.
[35:06] let the story unfold to be able to tell it in a space that you're actually hearing yourself, that you're actually downregulated enough to begin to process that.
[35:15] And in that downregulation and that slowing down, there were all these moments of you having microcontractions, which can be a somatic response, some shaking, some things going on, which is a way of your body closing the loop of some of those things that happened.
[35:29] and how lucky that your father was that you were there, right?
[35:33] Perhaps the universe just divinely guided you to be there so that he could still be around today.
[35:38] And going through that processing piece so that you could feel it, so that you weren't completely updated, which when we go through a story at a very quick pace and we're upregulated, we're trying to move through it quickly so we don't have to address it.
[35:50] And addressing it means like breathing it
[35:52] feeling it, feeling the emotions that are connected with it, anchoring it so that we're anchoring it into the system as something that's like, oh, do you see that you have these feelings and that you're processing this?
[36:02] Let me breathe and stay downregulated and anchor the fact that the reframe is like how beautiful it was for you to be there for your father.
[36:09] And also so that your system can recognize anything like that coming up again doesn't need to be dealt with in the exact same emotional state because guaranteed you jumped into...
[36:20] Like fixer mode, which thank goodness, like this is the point for everyone who's listening.
[36:24] We have these parts of us.
[36:25] Let's just say that there's a part of you called the fixer.
[36:28] And like that part of your woman is going to be able to like save your dad's life and help and support all these people that you get to work with.
[36:37] But that other side can potentially have a shadow where the fixer is like, oh, I'm going to fix it.
[36:41] I'm going to fix it.
[36:42] I'm not actually going to look at it deeply.
[36:43] I'm going to fix it.
[36:44] I'm going to fix it.
[36:45] I'm going to fix everybody, which, by the way, many people need to be able to begin to do the work themselves.
[36:50] And you can't always fix everything about everybody.
[36:53] Right.
[36:53] As you know, like there's just people that we can support and help, but the people who don't actually have their awareness that they have a challenge or they don't want to be fixed, we can't do anything about it.
[37:04] Right.
[37:04] So it gives that it slows down the processing speed.
[37:07] It gets you to understand that part of you.
[37:09] It gets you to spend time with that part of you.
[37:11] That's so important to recognize the superpower of what an incredible practitioner it's made you and what an amazing daughter that no CPR that can show up in the face of of traumatic events and still keep her cool and be in it.
[37:26] Right.
[37:26] Right.
[37:27] And your nervous system was probably upregulated and in a bit of like, OK, well, the fight is here, but the freeze and the flight I'm not going to pay attention to.
[37:34] I'm going to be here as present and upregulated as I can because this is my dad.
[37:38] I want to save his life.
[37:39] And then the other thing that I just got to witness, which if anyone's watching the video, they'll see is.
[37:44] When you told the story, you slowed down a bit on your own.
[37:48] You had emotional connection to it because it's your dad and you loved him and you're so grateful and thankful he's still here and that you went through that together.
[37:55] Like, of course, no one wants that to happen.
[37:57] But if you're going to go through it, you want him to survive on the other side.
[38:01] And you had an emotional response that you could speak at that within 90 seconds or so sort of washed through you and then cleared.
[38:08] And this is what we want to start to feel is instead of the holding or the gripping or the let me get through the story or this is too hard to talk about is to actually just be present with it.
[38:17] And like let it land and let it shift in your system.
[38:20] And then it becomes re-pattern in your system, whether we say nervous system, in your brain, and the way that you navigate that.
[38:27] And then it's not the thing on the back burner that's boiling over.
[38:30] It's like you have some clarity and perspective in the medicine, especially because your fear centers are lowered.
[38:36] Your amygdala response is about 30% less.
[38:37] Yeah.
[38:39] That it isn't as scary to you and you can sort of see it as this like third party and how beautiful it is that you got to be there to go through that.
[38:47] And also to give yourself, you know, a little bit of love to be like, wow, it was also very hard.
[38:53] I don't just have to jump to the next thing.
[38:55] Right.
[38:56] And to give some love to the fixer that is in you so that you can actually be like, OK, fine.
[39:01] I want to honor myself and celebrate myself and celebrate my dad and be here now.
[39:05] Right.
[39:05] It's again, how do we be present so we're not in our minds about the things that could go wrong?
[39:10] You know, and it's also a touching story for me because my dad passed away from a heart attack post chemo.
[39:16] Just the chemo was so hard on him.
[39:17] He had a heart attack that got him.
[39:18] And my brother, John.
[39:20] had to give him CPR till the ambulance came and my dad did not survive.
[39:24] And my dad was actually gone when my brother found him.
[39:26] He thinks he was already dead.
[39:28] But I haven't had the beautiful opportunity, even though I keep asking, to help my youngest brother clear that.
[39:36] And I know it needs to be cleared because it's such a big event, right?
[39:39] It's the person who's your caregiver you're trying to resuscitate.
[39:42] And in my brother's case, it didn't.
[39:46] My father had already passed.
[39:48] So it's in there.
[39:49] It's a memory.
[39:50] These memories don't go away.
[39:52] And so what a beautiful opportunity to revisit them in a succinct and efficient way instead of over and over again in a therapy session to really be able to open the lens to say, okay,
[40:04] How am I manifesting my mind?
[40:06] And how am I connected to my soul with this thing that happened?
[40:09] And how can I really look with perspective on all the parts, right?
[40:13] Without so many of those patterns.
[40:15] And so it gave you this beautiful opportunity.
[40:17] It gave me a beautiful opportunity to see in your body, like the shaking is the closing of the loop and the processing.
[40:22] It doesn't always happen, but it was a sure sign to me that was like parts of that, that were still in you, that you were clearing or reconnecting.
[40:30] And again, we're not getting rid of it.
[40:31] We're just integrating it into our,
[40:33] mind into our patterns into our system so it's not so spicy yeah and wow okay i did not know that about your father and then there was like a crossover story like that like that is that is crazy and yes i do hope that for your brother too because that's that's a lot that's a it's a lot to carry it's a lot to care yeah yeah yeah
[40:56] Oh, yeah.
[40:57] So there's so many things there.
[40:59] I'm not even quite sure which direction I want to go to next.
[41:03] But I'm thinking to kind of step out of my experience and bring in some of the thoughts that I can almost hear listeners having right now.
[41:14] So I want to almost like reply to what I know is going on in their mind.
[41:18] Now, I mean, you just beautifully unpacked what I dealt with and explain that.
[41:25] in such a perfect way, because I think people can relate to the whole concept of we're not talking about wiping out your past.
[41:35] We're not talking about forgetting.
[41:37] We're not talking about minimizing.
[41:39] We're not talking about...
[41:41] Pushing it down because essentially that's what we have been doing is pushing those events that have hurt us, that have traumatized us, that have been hard, just hard in life, whatever.
[41:54] We tend to just push it down and push it aside and not deal with it because we don't want to or it's unimportant or we have different coping mechanisms.
[42:04] Can you talk to, based on the clients that you've worked with, can you talk to what you see on a health perspective?
[42:11] Because obviously, I mean, you and I have both been in this health space forever and we know the different biochemical effects that stress, trauma, whatever repressed things can have on a health level, on a body level.
[42:27] Yeah.
[42:28] Now, I know, I mean, just even before I hand it totally over to you, I'll just share this.
[42:32] I referred two women to you in the past like six months, both of them in a, we'll say a negative co-relationship and both of them have health issues.
[42:47] whether it's debilitating, I mean, flattened out on your back pain, or whether it's thyroid and hormone conditions that I'm seeing in the other.
[42:58] How do you see this work overlap with health and longevity?
[43:06] Yeah, I mean, I think what we resist persists, right?
[43:09] We hear this and it's like in every in a greeting card or on a magnet somewhere, a license plate bumper, but it's like what we resist persists and we're holding around actions and things that have happened in our lives.
[43:21] so much so that there is a charge in the nervous system, an upregulation around it, a worry even.
[43:28] And that's like creating more and more stress, right?
[43:30] Even at a low level, it's like an additional micro stressor.
[43:33] It's a worry.
[43:34] It's why I think sometimes when people work in medicine spaces and then the next day they like look a little younger and a little bit like brighter and a little bit more grounded because they're
[43:41] nervous system is actually downregulated in a place where they're like, okay, I can see how I was like wrapped around the axle, like my grandmother used to say, but wrapped around the axle about that thing.
[43:50] And I can just like, I need to not white knuckle it, right?
[43:53] We're like holding on to our hurdy poos, we're holding on to the things that are
[43:57] coming up for us.
[43:58] And then it starts to affect our health because we are like, yeah, we're holding it in our jaw.
[44:02] We're holding it in parts of our body or like sad all the time instead of actually being able to be present and a bit more regulated in general.
[44:10] Right.
[44:11] And that clearly affects our health.
[44:13] We know how much stress affects our health.
[44:16] And so shifting those things in your mind and shifting the way that you're thinking every day can actually shift the state of your being.
[44:23] You know, Louise Hay was one of the earlier people to start correlating things that happen in the body to different, you know, components of mental health or, you know, how we think and feel about ourselves.
[44:34] And whether you believe fully in her work or not, we see this happen quite often where people are beginning to sort of clarify.
[44:40] clear stories.
[44:41] And then those stories are, as they clear the stories, they're clearing the health condition, right?
[44:46] And it's like, this all comes down to the power of belief, right?
[44:49] We are what we believe we are.
[44:51] And the more that I work in these spaces with different people, and the more that I become a little bit of a psychonaut, I'm always working in the therapeutic space if someone works with me.
[44:59] But the more that I work with these different medicines, the more that I can really see that we are what we believe we are.
[45:05] And there's no way to drive that point home to a listener like any more deeply than saying that it's our thoughts become the things.
[45:13] Right.
[45:13] We can course correct our future to the future that we want to the future that our higher self is calling in for us if we think differently.
[45:21] And that is really hard to do.
[45:22] It's simple to say it's really hard to do to think differently about ourselves.
[45:26] I see with women a lot, them talking shit to themselves in the mirror all the time and negative self-talk and changing those thought patterns every single day can be challenging.
[45:34] And also it is possible.
[45:36] I see men come with so many levels of shame and masked feelings.
[45:41] And yeah, like wanting to hold the frame, like a masculine energy and whatever gender, whatever sexual expression you want is great.
[45:47] But holding a masculine frame, if you're doing more of that.
[45:50] The feminine energy tends to be like the picture or the art inside the frame.
[45:54] And I see so many men show up in relationships that are like holding the frame for a family, a job or whatever they might be doing.
[46:02] And they're feeling like I'm not getting any acknowledgement.
[46:04] I have a lot of like.
[46:06] shame around the fact that I need to even have that acknowledgement and just selling themselves down the river because they're like that not good enoughness that spans beyond any gender that we all show up with.
[46:16] Like, I'm not good enough.
[46:17] Why?
[46:18] My self-worth is low.
[46:19] Will anyone notice that I actually don't know what I'm doing?
[46:22] All of this stuff, like I can't express enough.
[46:25] There's no way to say it enough that all of that is bullshit.
[46:29] I'm not saying that it isn't something that we all have to deal with.
[46:33] We do.
[46:34] And also, it's not easy to just stop doing that.
[46:37] But the reality is I get to see people before, during, after, and their transformation.
[46:42] And I've worked enough on myself over time that it's like every single one of us is so special and beautiful and connected and communicates.
[46:51] And we're all doing the best we can at all times, right?
[46:54] It doesn't mean that there haven't been people with challenges who have behaved badly, but we're...
[46:58] There's so much shit that each one of us has.
[47:01] It's like the light inside of us.
[47:03] And without trying to sound woo, but our maximum capacity to bring joy to ourselves and then the world by supporting other people in our communities and all this.
[47:13] And we're so fucking bogged down by the ropes that bind us that are like, I can't, I won't, I'm not good enough.
[47:20] What happens if that person sees me do this thing?
[47:22] And it's like, we got one time around in this specific human.
[47:25] I can't tell you what happens after.
[47:27] But like, what are we doing?
[47:29] Just selling ourselves short over and over and over again.
[47:32] And I think working with these medicines in a respectful and reverent way begins to show you more and more of the universal message, whether it's the mycelium forest of the mushrooms or you're working with something that's more like a non-traditional psychedelic, like an MDMA that's come more from a lab.
[47:47] It can show us actually the essence of who we are and what we want to do and who we want to be and give us permission.
[47:55] Like, that's the big thing.
[47:56] Like, give us permission to be like, okay, hell yeah, this is the thing that I want.
[48:00] Why am I holding myself back?
[48:02] Right?
[48:02] It's like, this is the story of the bear in the cage, right?
[48:04] The bear that was in the cage and they moved the cage away and the bear still circles around the whole square that the bear is in or he was in.
[48:11] It's like the cage isn't even there anymore and we're patterned ourselves to believe it is.
[48:15] So how do we like, we hold the keys to the cage, they say.
[48:18] So how do we just like unlock ourselves from that and say, what's the worst that can happen if I go out and be myself?
[48:25] probably the people that aren't aligned with you are going to fall away.
[48:28] But P.S., you probably don't want those people, you know, and the people that you are meant to love and be in your circle as you grow, like they will all come in.
[48:37] And I think what I've seen, if I'm going to say to a listener, another piece of like why this medicine work can be so important is it's like you accomplish even more by worrying less and being more present, like the more present that we can get.
[48:53] the more I see people step into their own like biggest, brightest selves, even if that's weird to someone else or their family doesn't approve or whatever, the more that they become themselves, they speak to their husband and wife more politely or communicate better.
[49:06] The more they ask for what they want, the more they ask to be seen and loved and acknowledged, the more that the world is like, oh, there's Amy, there's Kristen, there's Jack.
[49:15] They're doing their fullest expression.
[49:16] Let's send amazing things their way.
[49:19] Right.
[49:19] And the jobs come and the loves come.
[49:21] And listen, doesn't mean someone's not coming out of a session with me trying to figure out their relationship and then says, OK, we're going to divorce because I work with couples as well.
[49:28] And it's like perhaps the greatest and highest good at this timeline is for you to separate because it's not working and there's better things coming for you.
[49:37] Right.
[49:37] You said it's like the thing.
[49:38] Why are things happening to me?
[49:39] Well, things are happening for me.
[49:41] We hear that a lot.
[49:42] And I really want to address or say, I think things are coming from us.
[49:47] Right.
[49:47] Not just for us, but from us, because every single day what we're thinking and doing and how we're behaving is dictating what we're calling in.
[49:53] Right.
[49:53] This energetic bubble that's around us, the four feet that we know by science is there, the way that we bump into other people and other people's energies, the way we walk into a room and either light it up or bring it down.
[50:04] Like we can see that in people's energy and people's thoughts and people's and how they just like are in the world.
[50:11] And so I think this gives people the permission slip to be themselves in a much fuller expression than they're doing.
[50:17] And again, it's like, no shame.
[50:18] We're all doing this thing of like, oh, maybe I shouldn't do that.
[50:22] Maybe I should people please a little more.
[50:24] Or I think that that I'll let Johnny go first.
[50:26] Or it's like everyone, if everyone is just being exactly who they are, are they going to get exactly what they need?
[50:36] I love that phrase.
[50:37] That is so beautiful.
[50:38] I remember you said that to me before, and yet it's so true.
[50:41] It's simple, it's beautiful, and it's true.
[50:45] It's just true.
[50:46] And, you know, I also want to say, every single person listening to this, you have...
[50:52] unconscious thoughts, subconscious.
[50:54] You have things running beneath the surface that you don't even know.
[50:59] So you might be listening to this going like, well, no, I don't.
[51:02] No, I don't do that.
[51:03] I don't think that.
[51:04] I don't operate that way.
[51:05] You don't even know.
[51:07] that you are operating based on this wiring that occurred, kind of going back to Kristen's initial example of, you know, the three-year-old that gets hit with a red shovel or whatever, and he creates that with pain, and that created a connection in their brain that now translates into a response to a red shovel that this person doesn't even realize they're responding to, right?
[51:33] Yeah.
[51:34] So I think it's important to note that every single person listening to this, you have subconscious thoughts, programs that were built in that are literally dictating your actions, like dictating your life, dictating your relationships.
[51:51] dictating how much money you make, dictating your health.
[51:54] I mean, that's just reality.
[51:56] I think people live too much in the, I don't know, I don't want to say in the now because we're not living in the now.
[52:02] I mean, what am I looking for?
[52:04] People just don't realize.
[52:05] They don't realize what's going on beneath the surface.
[52:08] Yeah, like we're just we're looking for that.
[52:10] Like, what's the next thing?
[52:11] We're like, I'll be happy when it's like, look, happy now.
[52:15] And again, this this is not an easy game to play.
[52:17] This is like Earth School.
[52:18] We are all learning.
[52:20] You know, we are all we're all learning all the time.
[52:22] And then they're they're more aware and less aware people.
[52:25] Again, it's not a judgment.
[52:26] More aware of like how much they're carrying in their own system or less aware because they're busy.
[52:31] working three jobs and running a family and whatever the things are.
[52:34] But like the game that we get to play and the work with the psychedelics in a therapeutic sense is to be like, what, let me bring all of this into the forefront, into the awareness so that I can pick and choose that I can have autonomy to decide how I show up in the world.
[52:48] Right.
[52:49] So this to stand on my own two feet in a way that is actually me, because what there's nothing more heartbreaking to me than someone who's like 80 years old saying, ah,
[53:00] I really wanted to kiss the girl, do the thing, say the whatever, be an astronaut.
[53:04] And it's not about if you succeed or fail.
[53:06] You can try to be an astronaut and you can fail and not be an astronaut.
[53:09] And that's cool.
[53:09] But like just knowing that you tried and knowing that you like worked to expand yourself in all the ways that you want, you know, like.
[53:18] I spent, this is not my story, I'm just making this up, but it's like, I spent 25 years in a marriage and we hated each other.
[53:24] Like, why wouldn't you give the opportunity for you and your spouse at the time, one of you give the other opportunity and like break up, get a divorce if that's what has to happen so that you can go off and live bigger, different lives in a way that's gonna make you both more fulfilled, right?
[53:39] And like, that can be a painful example, but like we, we,
[53:42] The heartbreak comes in the like not jumping off the ledge, right?
[53:46] It's like leap in the net will appear, if you will.
[53:49] Like, where is the calculated, you know, educated risk that you're taking in your life to be the fullest version of yourself?
[53:58] And, you know, I want to be in a rock band or whatever.
[54:01] I will say to people a lot of times when I meet them, I live in Austin, so a lot of times people are like, what is lighting you up today?
[54:06] But I will say to people like, what's the dream?
[54:09] What's the dream?
[54:10] And if someone's like, well, I'm hoping on Friday I can go get like a steak, whatever.
[54:14] I'm like, that's cool.
[54:15] But actually, like, what's the big dream?
[54:17] What's the bigger dream?
[54:18] We're not dreaming big enough.
[54:20] You think that when you sit around with a group of seven-year-olds and you say, what do you want to do and who do you want to be?
[54:26] If they haven't had so many constructs put on them, they're going to be like, I want to be a guy who rides dinosaurs.
[54:32] We're dreaming massively.
[54:34] I want to wear a tuxedo and go to the moon.
[54:37] They're saying the big dream.
[54:39] And we're sitting around as adults being like, the big dream is I just like to have a steak on Friday.
[54:44] Like, which is cool if you want more peace in your life and that's going to bring you peace and whatever.
[54:48] But what's the big dream?
[54:50] Like, where are you not swinging for the fences in your life that you actually really want to?
[54:55] I mean, that's exhilarating, exciting, scary.
[54:58] And like, how do we reframe that like fear or that like lack of permission that we don't give ourselves?
[55:03] It's like, I can't do it.
[55:04] How do I like give you a permission slip to actually swing for the fences in the area that you want to?
[55:09] Because what if it goes right?
[55:11] What if you set your mind and your thoughts and your attention in that direction?
[55:17] Because you felt like I've worked out enough of my things to see where my patterning is.
[55:22] And now I give myself the permission slip to integrate those things and be like, I love you, scared parts.
[55:27] I love you, hurdy poos.
[55:29] And actually, while I'm loving you, we're going to go jump out of this plane or we're going to go kiss the girl or we're going to go move to a new country or whatever.
[55:38] whatever the thing might be, like this is an opportunity for us to, yeah, like do what the soul wants to do, if you will, again, without trying to sound like too woo about it all, just like at a very deep level, like what do you dream and how can you like shift your mind in that direction?
[55:54] So your patterns give you enough space to do it.
[55:58] Yeah.
[55:59] Well, and you had said it earlier, and I say it over and over again as well.
[56:03] And I think maybe it's hitting me more at the age of 52 than it ever has, that we only have so much time in these bodies on this earth.
[56:13] And why would we not live however many days we have?
[56:18] We don't know.
[56:20] Why would we not live it to the fullest?
[56:22] Why would we not live in joy?
[56:24] Why would we wait for, oh, you know, the next time or down the road, next month, next year, two years?
[56:31] You don't even know if you have two years.
[56:32] Yeah.
[56:33] So why not take the time right now and do everything you possibly can to be that person that you're meant to be, to have the fullest expression of yourself and of joy, which is not only going to light up your life and yes, energetically bring things in.
[56:49] Listen, I don't care whether you believe in manifestation or not.
[56:52] It's freaking real.
[56:53] So you got to come into 2026.
[56:55] because it's real.
[56:56] I can give you 5 to 10 different examples of how I have randomly manifested things in my life.
[57:02] And if you really think about your life, you can too.
[57:04] So why not live your best life every single day if that is possible?
[57:11] Why not do something that is a little bit outside of the box, but that you've heard me talk about now on this show, that can...
[57:20] break through whatever barrier is in you and take you and your body and your health to the next level.
[57:29] Because, you know, just like we've been talking about those things that are running beneath the surface, they're creating barriers to joy.
[57:36] They're creating barriers to what's going to light you up to your fullest expression.
[57:41] What's going to give you peace with, but they're creating barriers in your cells that,
[57:47] from being able to get to that optimized state.
[57:52] You know, I always talk about optimization land.
[57:54] It's a beautiful place to be, but you can't get to optimization land if your body is blocking you.
[58:01] You could take all the thyroid.
[58:03] You could take all the hormones.
[58:03] You could take all the supplements.
[58:04] You could do the best diet in the world.
[58:06] You could, you know, jump into your H-Bot and your sauna and
[58:10] But if you have these things inside of you, I'm not even going to use the T word.
[58:15] If you have these things inside of you that are blockades, and it's like I picture them as like blocks in the body, it's going to prevent your cells from taking that thyroid hormone, from taking that bioidentical hormone, from using the vitamin D to light up your cells.
[58:32] It's going to stop it.
[58:34] So this is your next step to happiness, but it's also your next step to health and longevity.
[58:40] Yeah.
[58:42] I'm like for anyone who's listening and is like, this is a lot.
[58:45] I get to like, I have a beautiful gift.
[58:48] I cannot explain to you like, I cannot stress enough how challenging it was.
[58:52] This is not to say my situation was worse than anyone else, but I didn't think that I would make it.
[58:57] I didn't think that I would get out of bed.
[58:59] I didn't think that anyone would ever want to spend time with me again.
[59:02] I didn't think that people loved me.
[59:04] I was so lost in the sauce that I had other practitioners that I was working with being like, I know you don't believe that you're going to make it through to the other side of this, but I will hold that thought for you.
[59:16] And those practitioners are the people that like...
[59:18] To this day, I'm like, thank you so much.
[59:21] I was just at a wedding in England, I told you, and one of my mentors came, a nutrition and functional medicine mentor came, who I just, I called him twice a month that whole time and just cried.
[59:31] And I got to see him and be like, I have so much gratitude for you because I know how much you love me because you listened every time.
[59:37] And because you just checked in with me and because you were like, I know that you don't know this is going to get better, but it will.
[59:43] And I, you know, I don't want to say I have regrets.
[59:46] It was a beautiful gift, the amount of that.
[59:49] There was a beautiful gift that dark night of the soul and my transformed woman in so many ways because I know myself better and I trust myself and I have my own back.
[59:56] And also, there's just a part of that whole process that I want to share with the audience.
[1:00:03] It's like, if you are stuck in this place, I know it doesn't feel like there's a light at the end of the tunnel, but I'm here to tell you, like, Amy and I will hold that for you.
[1:00:11] Because it can be so challenging.
[1:00:13] And like I said, I don't have regrets.
[1:00:16] But if I could say one thing that I would have added into my toolbox and tried on my own body sooner...
[1:00:21] It would have been putting some psychedelic therapy in a very reverent, safe container into my life because I could have been to the other side of this a bit sooner.
[1:00:30] Again, time takes the time it takes.
[1:00:33] Happens how it happens.
[1:00:34] And I know we can't go back and change things.
[1:00:36] But my resistance was the thing that was like holding me from doing that because I felt like, well, I don't know if this is OK or this or my family or I'm scared I'm going to die or whatever I thought.
[1:00:45] And it's just like with the right practitioner, the right facilitator, the right medicine for you, different medicines for different people.
[1:00:52] It can be so transformative that you come out on the other side and you're just like, thank God.
[1:00:58] Like, thank God that I get to be this person.
[1:01:00] And I understand there'll be people who have like resistance or cultural norms or like restrictions in their communities against these things.
[1:01:08] And there's lots of ways that we can use breathwork and cold exposure.
[1:01:11] And like, I would say edgier, you got to do things that you're afraid of.
[1:01:16] You know, you have to do some things within reason.
[1:01:18] You're not going to jump off a bridge because everyone else is.
[1:01:21] But you have to stretch your envelope.
[1:01:22] This is about building tolerance to stress.
[1:01:24] This is like the window of tolerance window.
[1:01:26] We're stretching it.
[1:01:27] So you can use cold and you can use breath and you can use lots of different therapeutic tools.
[1:01:32] But you have to push your edges in order to see where you can go because you can fly.
[1:01:36] Like we don't even give ourselves credit that we can really expand to a place that's like, wow, look at the human that I'm becoming.
[1:01:43] Yeah.
[1:01:43] And everyone who's listening is no different than you and me, Amy.
[1:01:47] Like they can expand to like the greatest capacity they ever dreamed of.
[1:01:51] It's available.
[1:01:52] And so I just, I say that because I didn't think it was available for me.
[1:01:56] That's why I'm doing this work.
[1:01:58] Yeah.
[1:01:58] Because it's so available.
[1:01:59] Because I can sit in a room with someone that says, I can't ever get there and be like, okay, you can believe that.
[1:02:05] I'm going to disagree and I'm going to hold for you that you can get there.
[1:02:08] And I know it's true.
[1:02:09] Yeah.
[1:02:10] You know?
[1:02:10] And that's your superpower.
[1:02:11] And that's why I'm glad you brought it up because I wanted to bring it up next is I totally realize that there are listeners that, like you said, they're going to have resistance.
[1:02:19] Maybe they need to talk to you and they need to talk through the safety profile of the different medicines.
[1:02:24] And that's totally doable.
[1:02:25] We're going to put all of Kristen's contact information down in the show notes.
[1:02:29] You travel the people.
[1:02:30] They can come to you in Austin.
[1:02:32] You can travel to them.
[1:02:33] But the most important thing is, is that
[1:02:36] You meet people where they are.
[1:02:38] So you had mentioned cold and breath, and that can actually produce very similar, albeit not maybe the level that plant medicine does, but it can produce very similar effects in the body, right?
[1:02:53] Right.
[1:02:53] Yeah, absolutely.
[1:02:54] From like the catecholamine surge, which is just like a bliss chemical surge from a dopaminergic response perspective.
[1:03:00] There's like lots of just like almost like it's like shorter dose than it feels different and you can't quite do the exact kind of coaching you can in a six hour medicine container, but you can absolutely shift people's state and
[1:03:13] I think it's important to also just know if people are out there looking for facilitators to really lean in to not being afraid to like anyone who wants to talk to me, I will always talk to.
[1:03:22] I'm not charging them for that phone call because it's a relationship that you're building with someone who's going to get to know you at a very deep level.
[1:03:29] And I don't shy away from, of course, I mean this appropriately and professionally.
[1:03:33] I love every one of my clients.
[1:03:35] I want to know about their life.
[1:03:36] I want to know every part of it.
[1:03:38] I want to love up on them.
[1:03:39] I'm not judging anything.
[1:03:41] I've seen and heard most things around the clients I've worked with.
[1:03:46] I think it's very important that you find a facilitator who is private and is going to understand, like,
[1:03:51] because I will work with police officers.
[1:03:53] I've worked with, you know, people in corporate jobs that wouldn't want to know about, you know, wouldn't want this to like be a thing that they display on their like corporate LinkedIn profile.
[1:04:02] Someone that can keep and respect your privacy, someone who you're going to build a relationship with like any other relationship, someone you trust.
[1:04:09] And again, for me, it's important.
[1:04:10] Like I don't just work with someone, many facilitators based on time, energy, money, whatever will be like, oh, great.
[1:04:16] One experience.
[1:04:17] I will work with someone in one peak experience, let's say one medicine experience, but all my programs are at least eight weeks long because I take the time.
[1:04:24] I want to intake people.
[1:04:26] I want to get to know what their intentions are.
[1:04:28] I want to learn about them.
[1:04:29] I want them to get comfortable with me, build rapport, have a peak medicine experience.
[1:04:33] And then I always spend like four to six weeks integrating people.
[1:04:37] And you saw it firsthand.
[1:04:38] Like the thing that's really important to me about safety and awareness is when we're in medicine, we forget a lot of the things that come up and we're telling ourselves.
[1:04:46] Our unconscious mind is telling ourselves the most important messages of our life.
[1:04:51] And so with consent, always I ask clients if I can record this session.
[1:04:55] I take copious pages of notes.
[1:04:57] I'm writing and thinking about integration homework and I try to do the thing which thank you so much for saying what you said about the balance of masculine and feminine because I really try to love up on my clients but also be like firm and fair when it comes to integration because integration isn't optional you can stand in the doorway of the psychedelic experience and be like oh my god look at the view and if you don't do the integration you never step in that through that doorway to the other side you might as well close the door and go back.
[1:05:24] So I think yours was probably 11 page summary of the session with all of the notes from things that came up and integration, homework and things that I think that's curated to each person.
[1:05:33] It's very different for every person I work with because everyone has different life experiences.
[1:05:37] And some of it's based on like Jungian psychology or it's based on nervous system regulation or my expertise in breathwork and nutrition even.
[1:05:45] I'm weaving everything I can in and I work with this beautiful supplementation protocol, a vessel love stack.
[1:05:52] which also supports people who are worried about like, oh, the aftermath, the oxidative stress.
[1:05:56] Will I be in a bad mood?
[1:05:58] Will I be okay for the days following or even during the journey?
[1:06:01] And that supplementation protocol, which, you know, full disclosure is something I co-founded with my co-founder, Michael.
[1:06:09] It's just been game changing for when I work with clients who want to work, have a day of integration to start, and then they need to get back to their lives as they continue to integrate in their, what we would call the neuroplastic window for a few weeks.
[1:06:20] So,
[1:06:20] I think it's just important to say that whether people are working with me or working with someone else, that it's like, don't rush into it.
[1:06:27] Meet the person, have a conversation.
[1:06:29] Certainly if you're in dire straits or what we might call like, you know, a situation where you're like, it's the 11th hour, I really need support, which is a bit how I was.
[1:06:37] I was like, what's the first cancellation I can get into?
[1:06:39] But I made sure I checked recommendations, references.
[1:06:42] Like I did all the work to make sure that this was going to be the person that I knew I could work with and that I would be safe with.
[1:06:48] you know, that has some protocol and some integration program and that you can make those good decisions for yourself so that you're held before, during and after.
[1:06:57] And that you can contact that person and be like, you can throw me a text at any time, right?
[1:07:02] I'm not going to be like, that's $250.
[1:07:04] If you want to have a, it's like, I'm here to stay and keep and hold you.
[1:07:08] And we're both adults.
[1:07:09] If things get really deep and we have to work in some other kind of container professionally, we can, but yeah.
[1:07:14] This is a relationship like anything else.
[1:07:16] And just because you're not familiar with the medicine doesn't mean you shouldn't get familiar with your facilitator.
[1:07:21] I love that.
[1:07:22] I love that.
[1:07:23] And everything that Kristen says, I mean, it's from her heart.
[1:07:26] It is real.
[1:07:26] She is there for you.
[1:07:28] She will answer you.
[1:07:29] I mean, it really is a deep relationship.
[1:07:32] And you do have to trust your facilitator.
[1:07:35] You have to feel comfortable.
[1:07:36] And some women are going to feel more comfortable with women.
[1:07:39] They're not going to feel comfortable with men.
[1:07:41] It just is.
[1:07:41] So that's why I so badly wanted to bring you on to share my experience in working with you because I think it's so powerful.
[1:07:48] You know, I came out of the session saying every single person with a pulse needs to experience this.
[1:07:55] And that is my true belief.
[1:07:56] That's my true, true belief.
[1:07:58] I really believe there are very few people walking this planet that I don't know who they are right now to even say, but that I'd be like, oh, no, they don't need this.
[1:08:08] But all the rest of us do.
[1:08:09] So I just thank you.
[1:08:11] I know you had to go through a dark night of the soul in order to find this gift that was inside you that you were expressing in a multitude of other different ways working with your clients through breath, through cold.
[1:08:25] But now this just kind of takes it to a whole nother level.
[1:08:29] And I think it's allowing you, I'm speaking for you right now, but I think it's allowing you to get a little bit deeper with your clients and to get more progress with them as well.
[1:08:39] For sure, because I've had many clients who work with me in the health space cross over and then medicine clients cross over into the health space because this is like we are one incredible being, right?
[1:08:49] And everything is interrelated in the way that we think, in the way that we behave, in the way that we do things with our body.
[1:08:54] Yeah.
[1:08:55] It's such a good fortune to be able to like, yeah, build those deeper relationships.
[1:08:58] And it's helpful, too, because you want if you're navigating someone who's navigating other medications or other challenges or health contraindications like pharmacologically, I work with two or three people that I pay to go to to make sure that if I have a challenging sort of.
[1:09:14] Well, this person's on five different prescriptions to understand what.
[1:09:17] washing out or tapering off looks like and to really work with people so that they feel like we don't have any negative outcomes, right?
[1:09:23] That's the game.
[1:09:24] So that's another piece of the puzzle that I think is just so important is that we can get our whole body, our whole system back online in so many different ways.
[1:09:35] And this way is something that I would never have guessed, you know, if you said to me 15 years ago,
[1:09:41] hey, you're going to be talking about this and how it changed your life on a podcast, I would have said, oh, I don't think that it goes that way.
[1:09:47] But when you talk about transformation, effective and efficient transformation, I've talked a lot about cold and breath and nervous system regulation in my life.
[1:09:55] And this is a tool that just, again, it's not a silver bullet, but it creates the shortest distance between two places of you creating so much self-awareness as a human person.
[1:10:06] that you can be like present and you can love your life yourself.
[1:10:09] And as a result, you start to like, love your communities, be in joy, be in connection.
[1:10:14] We see all this research about the more connection we're in and the more connection to self and others, the more joy we have the happiness quotient, right?
[1:10:21] It's like, it begins to change your life and you find your people.
[1:10:24] And it's like, you're one of my people, Dr. Amy.
[1:10:27] So I'm so glad we could have this chat.
[1:10:29] Oh, that's just amazing.
[1:10:31] It's amazing.
[1:10:31] I love you to death.
[1:10:32] I am encouraging every listener to check the show notes below, click the links, contact Kristen, but you have an amazing podcast so they can bounce over and listen to you and listen to more of your work and your stories as well.
[1:10:46] So tell people verbally, we're going to put in the show notes, but tell people your podcast, where they can find you, how they can work with you.
[1:10:54] Yeah.
[1:10:55] So Well Power is the podcast, W-E-L-L-P-O-W-E-R. Lots of free resources there.
[1:11:00] And you can tell that in January, I was like, okay, I'm going to start talking about psychedelics on the show.
[1:11:04] Finally, I was like, okay, I'm going to start talking and interviewing people.
[1:11:07] So there's probably, I don't know, 12 interviews in the last...
[1:11:12] eight months around psychedelics that are mixed in with all the other health optimization interviews.
[1:11:16] And then I just made my page live.
[1:11:18] It used to be a hidden URL.
[1:11:19] So SherpaBreathAndCold.com forward slash inner quest.
[1:11:23] The inner quest is what I call this journey work.
[1:11:25] This heart medicine work gives you a whole overview of my eight week program.
[1:11:29] And I still answer my own DMs on Instagram.
[1:11:32] Kristen Weitzel official.
[1:11:33] Shout out to the Kristen Weitzel who has Kristen Weitzel because I didn't want to be Kristen Weitzel official.
[1:11:37] But Kristen Weitzel, the pharmacist in Florida, is not me.
[1:11:41] Yeah, Kristen Weissel, official at Instagram.
[1:11:43] Feels so formal.
[1:11:45] It's everything for the most part.
[1:11:46] So just like reach out to me.
[1:11:47] I'm so happy to book a call with anyone.
[1:11:50] Spend a half an hour with you.
[1:11:51] Learn about your story or refer out if I need to.
[1:11:54] Or just like if we bond and things make sense and we can start to work together.
[1:11:58] Amazing.
[1:11:59] Amazing.
[1:11:59] Well, you're doing amazing work in the world.
[1:12:01] I can't wait to continue working with you as I'm going to.
[1:12:05] And just encourage everyone to be open-minded, have the conversation.
[1:12:11] And if you do go through and work with Kristen and have that experience, that beautiful, beautiful experience of a plant medicine journey or many,
[1:12:21] please reach out to me, email me because I want to hear your story and maybe we'll bring you on and we'll powwow back and forth on the show about your story if you want to open up about it like I just did.
[1:12:31] So thank you all for listening.
[1:12:33] Share this episode pretty much with everyone because everybody needs it.
[1:12:37] And Kristen, thank you once again.
[1:12:39] I love you to death.
[1:12:39] Thank you so much for the work you're doing in this world.
[1:12:42] I love you too.
[1:12:43] Thanks for your presence.

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