# The Art of Attraction: Marketing Strategies for Small Businesses

An episode of [The Detail Solutions Podcast](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1528818623), 30 Mar 2025, 1 h 05 min.

Audio: https://podcasts.captivate.fm/media/c85b5e74-daf9-4e3e-ab53-af679be5b4b2/FilmForth-john-dwyer-Mp3.mp3

The primary focus of this podcast episode revolves around the challenges faced by automotive detailing professionals in effectively marketing their services. We delve into the prevalent issue of misaligned marketing strategies within the detailing industry, particularly in the United States, where many operators struggle to replicate successful advertising efforts observed in others. Our guest, John Dwyer, an expert in direct response marketing, provides invaluable insights on innovative marketing tactics, specifically the concept of using incentives, such as vacation giveaways, to attract potential customers and enhance engagement. This episode serves as a crucial resource for detailers seeking to elevate their marketing approaches, moving away from price discounting to more effective, value-driven strategies. Ultimately, we aim to equip our listeners with actionable ideas that can significantly impact their business growth. If you'd like to contact John Dwyer for any further info he can be reached at john@theinstituteofwow.com If you're interested in attending The Detailing Authority Academy training you can click the link: https://www.square.link/u/pnqgYWNQ Don't forget to subscribe to our YouTube channel for more content: http://www.youtube.com/@TheDetailSolutionsPodcast1 https://www.mte.live/paint-correction-competition leave a suggestion for next years competition Use code dsp10 at www.biobombs.com to save 10% on your order. Links referenced in this episode: • vacationsincentive.com • fbcontestformula.com • instituteofwow.com

## Transcript

[0:00] So basically before we get started, because this is going to
[0:03] be a little bit different for me because I typically kind of do
[0:10] this like Joe Rogan where usually when I have guests on, in
[0:14] the automotive detailing industry, even though, you know,
[0:20] sometimes we do top talk topics, is I just kind of let it
[0:24] be very free flowing, conversational.
[0:27] Yeah.
[0:28] The reason, the reason why, when Jen had reached out to me and
[0:32] I thought like okay, cool, let's, let's, you know, maybe try
[0:35] and get something with you coming on is because I think it's
[0:39] something that not only myself, but a lot of people that
[0:41] I'm talking to right now in the detailing industry, especially
[0:46] here in the States, but I do hear a little bit of it from some
[0:49] of my counterparts and, and in the uk, not so much the guys that
[0:55] I know in Australia because I do Australia is like surprisingly
[1:01] like I rank third and well, not I ranked third, but Australia
[1:05] is like the, the third most country of, of listens for my podcast.
[1:10] So I do have a pretty, pretty decent followership down in Australia.
[1:15] But what, what, what I'm kind of noticing again for myself and
[1:20] then people I'm talking to here in the States is, is we just
[1:24] don't know how to market correctly.
[1:26] Some guys are hitting it out of the park, you know, AdWords, Facebook,
[1:31] Instagram, whatever, and, and other guys are trying to replicate
[1:38] it and it just doesn't hit, you know, like I, I've done the same,
[1:42] I've talked, I did, I've done AdWords for kind of a long time.
[1:46] And, and part of it might be like I probably don't throw enough
[1:50] money at it because it's Google and they want all your money
[1:53] and everything.
[1:55] And, and I'm a small business, so, so for me this is kind of a lifestyle
[1:59] business.
[2:00] So I don't, I'm not trying to scale, I'm not trying to grow.
[2:03] I'm just trying to do enough.
[2:04] Right.
[2:05] Whereas some of my, my buddies are trying to grow exponentially
[2:11] and, and increase and things like that.
[2:13] And, and so they'll do AdWords and they'll throw a lot of money
[2:15] at it and, and it doesn't hit, you know, and then, you know, this
[2:18] guy over here is doing Facebook ads in it and it's working
[2:21] and it's, everybody's like, you know, scampers over to Facebook
[2:24] and, and then we try doing Facebook and it doesn't work.
[2:27] And then this guy's like, hey, I'm doing Instagram and it works.
[2:30] And then we're all like, okay over here to Instagram So, so when
[2:34] she reached out to me, I was like, you know what?
[2:35] Like, maybe this will be a good thing.
[2:37] Maybe, maybe you'll have some clues or some tips or some things
[2:40] or whatever.
[2:41] And, and honestly, listening to that, that episode earlier, you
[2:47] know, the giveaway thing was kind of ingenious, you know, Like,
[2:51] I don't necessarily know that detailers would give away a free
[2:56] vacation for a, for a detail, but I liked what you had mentioned
[3:04] with the dealership.
[3:08] I think it was a dealership, and it was a way to kind of capture
[3:14] kind of emails and it's like, hey, come do a test drive and, and
[3:19] win, or whatever.
[3:20] Right?
[3:21] And, and you even had mentioned that maybe some smaller
[3:24] businesses could give away a service.
[3:26] So that made me think, like, maybe I do something where, you know,
[3:30] I do a Facebook ad, you know, hey, win a free detail.
[3:35] Yep.
[3:37] And then everybody who signs up, like you said, right?
[3:39] Like, I pick one, I give it away, I do justice, right?
[3:43] But then everybody else who signed up, hey, you didn't, you didn't
[3:46] win.
[3:47] But tell you what, here's a hundred dollar off service or something
[3:52] like that.
[3:52] So I, I did, I did like that when I heard that.
[3:58] Do you have a car detailing service yourself?
[4:00] Do you?
[4:01] Yes, sir.
[4:01] Yes, sir.
[4:02] Yeah, so, yeah, so that's, that's my, my primary business, like
[4:06] I said, it's a lifestyle business for me, but it is.
[4:08] My primary businesses is car detailing.
[4:10] And so the podcast is, you know, a, a primarily a car detailing
[4:17] podcast.
[4:19] We have had some other other topics or, or things that popped
[4:23] up and, and we've talked to some people, but primarily we try
[4:25] to keep it to, to this.
[4:27] So again, that's why I thought maybe you would be a great guest
[4:31] to come on and maybe shed a little light in, in, in to some of
[4:37] us that are having a tough time figuring out this marketing
[4:42] thing.
[4:43] Maybe the AdWords isn't working for us, maybe the Facebook
[4:45] isn't working for us, maybe whatever.
[4:47] So, you know, to hear kind of your expertise.
[4:52] So the first thing to do would be to introduce you, obviously to
[5:34] my guest.
[5:37] So for everybody who's listening, this is John Dwyer.
[5:40] And John, you have the.
[5:44] Is it.
[5:44] It's the wow Institute, is that correct?
[5:47] Yeah, it's called the Institute of Wow.
[5:49] The Institute of Wow.
[5:50] My bad.
[5:50] I.
[5:51] Dyslexia.
[5:52] Got it all backed up there.
[5:54] I wanted to get the WOW Institute 20 years ago, but it was
[5:56] already gone.
[5:59] So just for my listeners that are, that are listening, who probably
[6:04] don't know who you are, give us a Little bit of background or,
[6:08] you know, what's your business and what services do you provide
[6:11] and things like that.
[6:12] Yeah, look, it's a direct response marketing business.
[6:15] And the.
[6:16] I always highlight to people that direct response marketing is
[6:20] very different from marketing.
[6:22] And the reason I do that is because it's not about brand building
[6:26] and it's great if you build your brand, but direct response marketing
[6:29] is putting an ad on Facebook or Instagram today and getting result
[6:33] this afternoon.
[6:33] So that's what direct response is, as the name infers.
[6:37] And yeah, look, I've been doing this, you know, for a thousand
[6:39] years.
[6:39] And what I found is that most, I mean, in America and Australia
[6:43] and England, 94% of businesses are doing less than a million turnover.
[6:48] And so therefore those businesses more than likely are mom
[6:52] and pop businesses.
[6:53] Or maybe they might have five or six or seven employees, but they
[6:56] don't have a marketing manager.
[6:59] They just don't.
[7:00] And so therefore they're always looking for ideas to, you
[7:03] know, turn ideas into cash pretty quickly.
[7:05] And that's where we come into play.
[7:07] So the stuff that you would have heard on other podcast is pretty
[7:10] much a rinse and repeat of what I do when I'm doing one of these
[7:13] interviews.
[7:13] It's just essentially teaching business owners to stop price discounting
[7:18] and to think about a new way of attracting customers.
[7:21] And normally that's through what we call an incentive, but I
[7:23] call it a Happy Meal toy, so.
[7:25] Right.
[7:26] And I, and I like that you said that about stop discounting
[7:30] because again, in the, I feel like since the COVID years, this
[7:39] industry, along with others has, has just gotten flooded with,
[7:43] with new people coming in because, you know, either they lost
[7:48] their jobs to Covid and, and hey, what's a, what's a easy entry
[7:52] level to get, you know, job to get into?
[7:54] You know, landscaping, car detailing, you know, house cleaning,
[8:00] you know, things of that nature you can do pretty, you know,
[8:03] there's a low bar of entry for it.
[8:05] And so what's, what I found is, and what I'm hearing when I talk
[8:09] to some people is it's like, oh man, you know, the guy up the
[8:12] street just popped up and he's doing, you know, whatever for 200
[8:18] cheaper than I am.
[8:19] So now I've gotta discount my prices to try, you know, and, and
[8:23] instead of, instead of everybody doing what the rest of
[8:27] the world does or detailing doing what the rest of the world
[8:30] does of increasing prices as we go on, everybody is racing to
[8:35] the bottom.
[8:36] It almost seems like.
[8:37] And it's, and, and to me And, And a lot of, you know, professionals
[8:42] that I talk to is when you do that, you're devaluing your service.
[8:48] So my whole thing is.
[8:50] And.
[8:50] And kind of like what you said with the Happy Meal Toy is I'm always
[8:54] trying to find that way to maybe give a little without discounting,
[9:00] you know, so I, I like that premise.
[9:05] So for everybody who's listening, how.
[9:08] How would a detailer, and I know you kind of talk to multiple
[9:12] businesses from, you know, super mega, you know, million banks
[9:17] to.
[9:18] To mom and pops.
[9:19] Like, what would be your advice to, you know, do a.
[9:25] A Happy Meal Toy, as you say, versus discounting or racing to the
[9:29] bottom?
[9:31] Yeah, look, the Happy Meal Toy needs to be something that suits
[9:34] the target audience.
[9:35] And so I'm a baby boomer, so you can imagine if I went into a
[9:39] menswear shop and they said, look, buy a suit or buy a sports
[9:42] jacket or buy a shirt, and we'll give you a.
[9:45] A skateboard, then they're barking up the wrong tree.
[9:49] And so therefore, it's called message to market match.
[9:52] You want to have the right message to course.
[9:55] And, you know, over the years, we've tested every incentive, every
[9:59] Happy Meal Toy that you could possibly think of.
[10:01] And there is.
[10:01] I.
[10:01] I say Happy Meal Toy.
[10:03] You know, I'm the father of six millennial children.
[10:05] They've all left home these days, but we had six children under
[10:08] 12 at one stage.
[10:09] And I think I gave McDonald's, my wife myself, gave McDonald's about
[10:12] seven gazillion dollars just to keep the little.
[10:16] To keep them quiet in the back of the car, you know.
[10:18] Exactly.
[10:19] Yeah.
[10:20] So I don't think the kids ever ate the hamburger.
[10:22] It was all about the free toy.
[10:23] And so if you get it right, it's something which you can repeat
[10:27] for the rest of your business life because McDonald's have been
[10:30] doing the Happy Meal toy giveaway for 45 years.
[10:33] Kellogg's have been doing the same thing in the bottom of their
[10:36] cereal packs for 50 years.
[10:38] Dunkin Donuts are doing it right now, where when you spend money
[10:41] with them, you get points, and then you can redeem those points.
[10:44] Amazon do it through their prime membership club.
[10:46] If you wanted to join their prime membership club, then you get
[10:50] special features such as free music and free movies and so on and
[10:53] so forth.
[10:54] So even your local coffee shop down the road does it where, you
[10:57] know, you get nine stamps on your little reward card and you get
[11:00] the 10th copy for free.
[11:02] The crazy thing about it, though, is that 97 of businesses
[11:06] worldwide have Never, ever, ever offered an incentive because
[11:09] it's too easy just to drop their pants and price discount.
[11:12] Which is nuts.
[11:13] Absolutely crazy, right?
[11:16] Yeah, and that's, that's the thing.
[11:17] I mean, you're right.
[11:18] I mean, I think about it all the time.
[11:20] I mean, you know, I go to Chick Fil A, I use my points because
[11:23] I know like every so many visits I'm gonna get, you know, a
[11:27] free whatever.
[11:30] The girl who, who cuts my hair, she has a, you know, little
[11:33] hand punch thing and every tenth one I get, or actually I think
[11:37] it's every five, I get a half off and then the tenth one I get
[11:40] a free one.
[11:43] So.
[11:43] Yeah, you're absolutely right.
[11:44] I mean, it's, it's.
[11:46] And I like what you said, you know, it's, it's easier to do that
[11:49] than to drop your pants and, and do a price discount, you know,
[11:53] kind of screwing yourself.
[11:54] Because that's the one thing I is like, it's, sure, it's easy to
[12:00] just discount and, and to get the client in, but then you'll never
[12:05] be able to get that client to, to pay more than when you finally
[12:09] get to a point or whatever.
[12:11] They're not going to pay more than that because they've, they've
[12:14] always only paid whatever.
[12:18] So with the direct response marketing kind of thing, I mean,
[12:23] is it, is it really, you know, any business could do it.
[12:26] So like the small detail guy, you know, can do it versus like a
[12:31] big Amazon or McDonald's.
[12:33] Yeah, look, I was speaking at a conference in Santa Monica.
[12:36] I've been to America a gazillion times and, and it was a
[12:39] conference in Santa Monica on the west coast.
[12:41] And the guy in the room put his hand up and said to me, I own
[12:46] a funeral parlor business.
[12:47] Would it work for me?
[12:49] I said, look, I reckon it works for just about every business,
[12:52] but I don't think it would be tasteful if you said, look, give
[12:55] me your relatives to bur.
[12:57] And once I've, you know, burnt five of your relatives, you get a
[12:59] free headstone.
[13:00] I don't think that would be.
[13:01] Yeah, so aside from a funeral parlor, pretty much any business,
[13:05] I mean, A to Z, we've been providing this stuff for businesses
[13:09] for a long time.
[13:10] And yeah, I mean, any business.
[13:12] The thing is, is that if you do price discount, there's nothing
[13:15] wrong with doing that maybe once or twice a year you've got to,
[13:18] you've got to move the warehouse of stock or in your instance,
[13:21] their car detailers.
[13:21] And so therefore they have a cash flow problem.
[13:23] They want to get more cash in quickly.
[13:25] Right.
[13:26] Nothing wrong with doing that a couple of times a year.
[13:27] It's just that if you do it all the time and you become, you
[13:31] know, the, the, the Costco of your industry, you're not going to
[13:36] be able to ever lift your prices because you've conditioned
[13:39] everybody to your car dealership, you know, detailing price.
[13:42] And, you know, if you said to me, look, what was the most successful
[13:46] incentive of all time?
[13:47] No question, vacation.
[13:50] And the reason I say that is that we had a bank down under called
[13:55] the Greater Building Society.
[13:56] So they're enough a bank, it's a building society.
[13:58] And I was contracted by them to come up with, you know, a direct
[14:02] response campaign.
[14:03] And the one that we came up with because I was doing some TV
[14:06] commercials at the time for a travel wholesaler.
[14:09] I introduced a travel wholesaler to the bank and we put
[14:12] a campaign together which said, get a home loan or swap your
[14:15] home loan from Wells Fargo across to this bank.
[14:17] We don't have Wells Fargo down under, but the equivalent of swap
[14:20] your home loan across and we'll give you a free vacation.
[14:23] And they took an extra $15 billion worth of home loans within
[14:28] the first three years.
[14:29] And this idiot who you're talking to didn't charge a percentage
[14:33] of the increase in loans.
[14:36] I'm a complete fool.
[14:37] I charge a consultancy fee.
[14:40] So, yeah, so if I charged a percentage of the increase in home
[14:43] loans, I wouldn't have gone to Hawaii, I would have bought Hawaii.
[14:47] Anyway, it went really well.
[14:48] And about three or four years into that, I convinced Jerry Seinfeld
[14:51] to become their spokesman.
[14:54] I'm name dropping, I know, but the fact is we got Seinfeld to be
[14:57] the spokesman and I would fly backwards and force to New York and
[15:01] Jerry would do all the ads for us.
[15:02] So when Jerry Seinfeld comes on TV down under, on social media
[15:05] and says, get a home loan from this bank and you get a free vacation,
[15:08] you can imagine what happened.
[15:10] And as a result of that, a company contacted me after that campaign
[15:14] because it's pretty hard to keep it secret.
[15:16] When you got Seinfeld and they said, listen, you seem to have half
[15:19] a clue when it comes to marketing.
[15:20] We've got access to unsold hotel rooms around the world.
[15:23] And these hotels outside of school vacation period are happy
[15:27] to give up their rooms for free in the hope that whoever stays
[15:30] there as a freebie guest will, might, might spend money on food
[15:33] and beverage.
[15:33] There's no time share presentations or any of that rubbish.
[15:36] Basically, the hotels outside of School vacations are happy to
[15:39] give up the rooms because they hope whoever stays there is going
[15:42] to spend money on food and beverage.
[15:44] And I said, yeah, go on.
[15:45] And they said, well, do you know what to do with that for businesses?
[15:47] I said, absolutely.
[15:48] I'll turn it into the Happy Meal toy from heaven.
[15:50] And this was six months before COVID And so we launched it and we
[15:54] just said, the businesses, car detailers and butchers, bakers, candlestick
[15:57] makers.
[15:58] How would you like to get 50 vacation vouchers for $97 each?
[16:03] And you give them away when someone uses your lawn mowing service
[16:07] or someone buys your refrigerator or someone uses your
[16:09] car dealership car detailing.
[16:10] Sorry.
[16:11] And it went nuts, absolute nuts.
[16:14] My head became huge because this was a money tree.
[16:17] I'd put ads on Facebook and we would just get absolutely smashed
[16:20] with businesses saying, look, I want this as a Happy Meal toy.
[16:24] And I think my sarcasm hit a peak when my wife said, you've been
[16:28] working hard, let's go to Fiji.
[16:30] I said, don't go there by the island.
[16:32] You know, God was watching and saw that my head was too big and
[16:36] thrust covert upon the world.
[16:40] That's my fault for showing off, thinking I had retirement package.
[16:43] So we had this incredible travel product that was going nuts
[16:47] and of course for the first time in 100 years, you couldn't travel.
[16:49] So I learned my lesson.
[16:51] So we sat on our hands for a couple of years.
[16:52] But I have to say to you, if any car deal detailer is looking
[16:56] for a Happy Meal toy, then yeah, a vacation is the hottest on
[17:01] the planet and purely and simply because everyone wants one.
[17:05] Yeah.
[17:05] So let me ask you about those, you know, because you know, when
[17:09] I see those kind of things, I, I always think like, ah, it's too
[17:12] good to be true.
[17:13] Like there's gonna be blackout or.
[17:16] Yeah, yeah, you know, or you know, you can only go on the second
[17:19] Tuesday of every week, you know, kind of thing, you know, so,
[17:23] so as a detailer, because I mean, here's the thing, I mean you're
[17:27] saying, you know, you could buy them at 97 a piece, basically,
[17:33] you know, for me, I can offer that to one of my ceramic coating
[17:38] clients that's going to pay dollars.
[17:41] So to take a hundred dollars out of that $2,000 to, to basically
[17:47] maybe guarantee me a sale, you know, hey, buy a two thousand dollar
[17:52] ceramic coating and get a free vacation, you know, or a staycation
[17:57] here in Orlando.
[17:59] And all I'm, all I'm Putting out is 97.
[18:01] Doesn't sound like a bad deal.
[18:03] But like, how does that actually work, you know, when you're
[18:08] giving it to a client or, you know, even I can't speak offering
[18:15] it to a client.
[18:16] Well, it gets better because when I'm doing podcasts, if this
[18:20] subject comes up, I always say to people, I'll give you my email
[18:24] at the end of this.
[18:24] And if they are interested, they get it for 32, not 97.
[18:29] So it becomes a little more crazy.
[18:31] And the reason that we, that we do that is that our inventory
[18:37] is free.
[18:38] Okay?
[18:38] So if you're bringing in a television from China and it costs
[18:41] you 200 and you mark it up to 4 or $500, if you give, you know,
[18:46] in a way for anything less than $200, you lost money.
[18:51] The thing with this product, it's, it's built for price variability
[18:55] because the, the cost of goods is free.
[18:58] We get the hotel rooms for free.
[19:00] So all I've got to do is I've got to cover my overheads, which
[19:03] generally speaking, is Facebook advertising or LinkedIn
[19:05] advertising, and my operational expenses.
[19:08] If I'm on a show like yours, I don't have any Facebook advertising
[19:12] costs.
[19:12] I don't have really any costs at all.
[19:15] And so what I do to basically incentivize people to consider doing
[19:19] it is that I actually provide them with a deal whereby it's three
[19:22] for one.
[19:23] We just say to them, listen, if you buy 30 of these things at
[19:25] 97, which is, what's that, $2,900, we'll give you a three for
[19:31] one deal.
[19:32] We'll give you 90 of them.
[19:33] And that means if you're getting 90 vouchers for the cost
[19:36] of 30, you're not paying $97, you're paying $32.
[19:40] And that normally lights up the switchboard, so to speak, because
[19:42] people go, my God, I can.
[19:44] $32.
[19:45] And by the way, it's a three to seven night vacation.
[19:49] You've got destinations like Vegas and Orlando and New York and
[19:52] San Diego, Grand Canyon, I mean, all the hot spots.
[19:55] Cancun in Mexico is five nights, right throughout Europe,
[19:58] if they want to go to Italy or Germany or Spain or anything like
[20:00] that.
[20:01] So it's pretty sexy.
[20:02] And when they rang me just six months before COVID I said exactly
[20:07] what you did.
[20:08] I said, look, I'm in the advertising game.
[20:09] I've seen every travel scam there is, and this sounds ridiculously
[20:14] too good to be true, and they said, no, all it is is what the airlines
[20:18] used to do before the cheap airlines came along.
[20:21] Remember, people would sit in a Waiting lounge.
[20:23] And then it was basically the hostess would come out and when there
[20:27] was 10 seats vacant in the plane, she'd say, okay, all of you
[20:30] people in the waiting lounge in your pajamas, without teeth, we
[20:33] have 10 seats.
[20:33] All right, come on in.
[20:35] Yeah, those days are gone.
[20:37] When the cheap airlines came along, they scooped up all those
[20:40] people and yeah, there was no catches to that.
[20:42] They were filling the seats that other people had paid good money
[20:44] for.
[20:45] This is the same thing when they are outside of school vacation
[20:48] periods.
[20:49] Most hotels are running at about 30% vacancy.
[20:52] Sorry.
[20:52] Yeah, 30% vacancy.
[20:54] So the hotel believes that if they've got 30% of their rooms vacant,
[20:58] they might as well give that room away for free in the hope that
[21:00] whoever stays there will stay spend money on food and beverage.
[21:03] The good thing for the hotels is that this is under the radar.
[21:06] So when you hand a voucher to your, you know, car detailing customer,
[21:10] that customer goes online to a, you know, booking platform.
[21:14] They book their vacation.
[21:15] When they arrive at the resort in Orlando or Las Vegas, wherever
[21:19] it might be, no one recognizes them as being any different from
[21:22] any other full paying guest.
[21:23] Right.
[21:24] Beautiful for the resort.
[21:25] The resort's not dropping its pants and wrecking its brand.
[21:28] It actually is filling rooms under the radar.
[21:31] And that's what the hotels want.
[21:32] They don't want to destroy their brand by dropping their prices.
[21:35] They would like to just fill the rooms through promotions like
[21:38] this and then of course, make money out of food and beverage.
[21:41] Oh, I gotcha.
[21:42] I gotcha.
[21:43] So, yeah, so it's making it out like they're not treated any
[21:46] different because they got a free room or anything like that.
[21:49] It's just, you know, status quo, business as usual or whatever.
[21:53] Yeah, no, that's, that's interesting.
[21:56] I.
[21:58] Oh, by the way, you asked.
[21:59] The question, there are no timeshare presentations.
[22:01] I mean, I would have run the other way.
[22:02] I said, yeah, look, it sounds pretty sexy, but if there's a timeshare,
[22:05] there's a time out of here.
[22:06] They said none of that.
[22:08] Look, there's, there's conditions, of course.
[22:10] I mean, they won't be able to go in school vacation period.
[22:12] So.
[22:13] Right.
[22:14] It's available on an availability basis.
[22:17] So if you go into the booking platform and you wanted to go to
[22:19] Vegas on, you know, let's just say the 4th of August and 4th of
[22:23] August happens to be conference week in Vegas.
[22:25] Every hotel's booked a out for conferences and of course.
[22:28] But that's the same as if you were going to book and pay full tariff
[22:31] if you're going to pay 300 or 400 for the room.
[22:34] It's available on and as available basis.
[22:37] So therefore you just make sure that you don't go when the,
[22:40] I don't know when the, when the, with the racing car track is
[22:42] full.
[22:43] Right, right.
[22:44] See, and that's the, that's the interesting thing for me for
[22:47] being here in Orlando.
[22:49] Like it would be a perfect staycation for me to kind of offer
[22:53] because I could literally offer somebody of a free, okay, a
[22:59] free hotel stay and it doesn't really cost them anything else.
[23:03] They're not paying for the airfare.
[23:05] They're not paying, you know, any other travel stuff.
[23:07] Because if they're here and it, it could be a staycation weekend.
[23:11] Like, hey, get, drop the keys.
[23:13] No, you can't.
[23:14] You've got to be 100 miles away from the hotel.
[23:17] Okay, okay, okay.
[23:18] Now the reason for that is that if you are in Orlando and you
[23:20] stay in Orlando, you won't eat at the, at the hotel.
[23:24] You'll go to your favorite restaurant down the road.
[23:26] Gotcha, gotcha, gotcha.
[23:27] Okay, so they've worked out that, you know, they want tourists.
[23:30] And look, the 100 mile condition is, nobody's ever complained
[23:34] about that because if I, you know, if I live in Sydney, Australia,
[23:37] I don't want to go for a vacation in Sydney.
[23:40] So, yeah, that's one of the conditions is that you need to be
[23:43] 100 miles away from where you're going, and that's as the crow
[23:46] flies.
[23:47] So when you actually go into the booking platform to book your
[23:49] three or four or five nights, whatever it might be, it will immediately
[23:53] tell you straight away if you're within 100 miles from that
[23:56] hotel.
[23:56] Because they want tourists, they don't want locals who will spend
[23:59] money at the restaurant.
[24:00] Okay, yeah, no, no, that makes sense.
[24:02] That makes sense then.
[24:03] Yeah, yeah, look, when I turned it upside down because I thought
[24:06] it was ridiculously good to be true, too good to be true, I was
[24:09] very pleasantly surprised.
[24:10] I've seen every incentive program and we've given away microwave
[24:15] oven, skateboards, dining vouchers, fuel discount vouchers,
[24:19] movie ticket vouchers.
[24:20] I've tried everything.
[24:22] And not just because the Seinfeld campaign proved it to me
[24:25] with the bank, but just in general, I have used, I've never
[24:28] seen anything like it.
[24:29] It can double or triple people's sales straight away.
[24:32] Because you'll get the reason McDonald's Happy Meal toy works is
[24:35] because that Toy, I know McDonald's gets for 20 to 25 cents
[24:39] in China, but to A mum and dad who are buying a Happy Meal for their
[24:42] child, they see that toy as being worth four or five dollars
[24:45] in Kmart.
[24:46] So the important factor is that's a very low unit cost for the,
[24:50] you know, for the business, but a high perceived value.
[24:53] In this instance, this is worth up to a thousand dollars.
[24:56] Three, I mean, three nights in Orlando, you can imagine, you know,
[24:58] it'd be certainly worth up to a thousand dollars, but it's costing
[25:01] them, you know, 97 normally, but $32.
[25:04] Anybody wants to have a look at it, go and have a look@vacations
[25:07] incentive.com.
[25:08] just plural.
[25:09] Vacations with an S.
[25:11] Vacations incentive dot com.
[25:13] Yeah, no, and it's, and it's interesting because, you know, growing
[25:18] up I remember, you know, it felt like that was a big marketing
[25:22] thing with a lot of car dealers.
[25:26] I mean, I mean almost, you name it, you know, was come down
[25:30] and do a test drive or come down and do whatever, or come to,
[25:33] you know, whatever, insert the whatever thing.
[25:37] And, and you got a vacation.
[25:38] And it seems like, it seems like it's not, is, is as used as
[25:47] much as it used to be in the form of not even a vacation, but
[25:51] even just a thing.
[25:52] Right.
[25:53] Like now it's just, you know, whatever.
[25:56] Here's our deal, you know, come on down, you know, kind of thing.
[25:59] And, and there, there kind of, isn't that that incentive or that,
[26:04] or that toy?
[26:05] I mean, you, I mean, McDonald's still does it in the Happy
[26:08] Meals.
[26:09] I know, I know that because my kid is about to be 16 and you know,
[26:14] up until probably a lot within the last year or so, she would still,
[26:19] you know, want to go to McDonald's and do happy Meals because
[26:22] she liked the smaller, the smaller meals.
[26:25] She wouldn't eat a bigger meal.
[26:26] She liked the smaller meals.
[26:27] So not that she wanted the toy, but we would still get the toy.
[26:30] But you know, I don't, I don't necessarily know that Kellogg's even
[26:35] does the, the toys and the cereals anymore.
[26:37] You know, the occasional times that we get cereals, it doesn't really
[26:41] seem like there's anything in them anymore or anything like that.
[26:46] So it is.
[26:48] Do you think like we made a shift from doing that or is it just
[26:52] a different type of marketing these days?
[26:55] No, I mean, what happens is that sometimes a left brained person
[27:00] will take over the marketing role.
[27:02] Now by left brain, I meant someone who's analytical and operationally
[27:05] minded.
[27:06] Most accountants are left.
[27:07] Left brain.
[27:07] Yeah, rather than right brain, which is, you know, the creative
[27:11] person.
[27:12] And that would be me.
[27:13] I hate looking at spreadsheets despite the fact I've got to.
[27:16] And so therefore, if a left brain person takes over the marketing
[27:19] role, then they will say, oh, this is an expense.
[27:22] And so therefore, let's get rid of it instead of looking at it
[27:25] as an investment and keeping it right.
[27:28] You know, in the advertising game, if you went to a, an advertising
[27:32] agency which was run by, you know, bearded hipsters and ponytail
[27:36] creatives, they will tell you that you've got to build your brand
[27:40] so that people, you know, will fall in love with your product.
[27:44] Okay, right, well, build your brand so that they'll taste your
[27:47] product.
[27:47] We flip that, we say get them to taste your product so that they'll
[27:51] fall in love with your brand.
[27:52] And the best way to get them to taste your product would be, for
[27:55] example, outside a seafood shop.
[27:58] I would have hostesses there handing out calamari samples at lunchtime
[28:02] and dinner time so that whoever walked past would get a calamari
[28:05] sample and taste it and go, that's beautiful.
[28:07] They'd go inside the seafood shop and spend money on, you know,
[28:10] more expensive fish, like barramundi.
[28:12] Right?
[28:13] Yeah.
[28:14] If I had a coffee shop, I'd be giving out shot glasses and little
[28:17] paper cup shot glasses of my coffee at lunchtime and dinner time
[28:20] as well.
[28:21] The whole idea of this is to actually not only get the attention
[28:26] of people who may have been getting their car detailed anyway,
[28:29] but also get the attention of people who weren't thinking about
[28:33] getting their car detailed.
[28:34] You can imagine if they're strolling through their Facebook
[28:38] feed and they're scrolling, scrolling, scrolling, and all of
[28:40] a sudden your card detailing business says, listen, stop.
[28:43] If you get your card detailed from me, we've got a special April,
[28:47] May, June, whatever it is, offer for X dollars.
[28:49] And what comes with that is a free vacation to Vegas or New York,
[28:53] wherever you want to go.
[28:54] I think that might stop the scroll.
[28:56] Yeah, yeah, for sure, for sure.
[28:58] You know, but I like the, the, the almost kind of like the, the
[29:02] taste test sampling that you're talking about, you know, with
[29:04] the, you know, you walk by and you get a, you know, have somebody
[29:07] standing out there with a little sample.
[29:09] I remember, you know, growing up and you'd walk through the mall,
[29:12] the food court in the mall, you know, and all the little, all
[29:16] the little, you know, quote unquote restaurants, you know, because
[29:21] the fast food places, whatever, they would do that, you
[29:25] know, especially like the, the Chinese food place would always have
[29:28] like, you know, toothpicks with their bour Chicken or whatever.
[29:32] You know, you walk by and you know, the, the sub place has got,
[29:36] you know, little cheese steaks, you know, on toothpicks or
[29:39] whatever, without doing something as large of a getaway,
[29:44] you know, as a, as a getaway kind of vacation.
[29:47] Because to me, I would, I would say if I was going to, if I
[29:51] was going to use that as a marketing tool again, I would do
[29:55] it more with, in line with like my ceramic coatings, my, my
[29:59] fifteen hundred dollar and up kind of packages.
[30:02] But if I wanted to get people kind of in the door, like you say
[30:05] in your thing, right.
[30:07] Like, like, you know, get them in the door now, make, make money
[30:10] tomorrow kind of thing versus the, the plant, the seeds, and we'll
[30:15] wait and see kind of advertising, like as a detailer,
[30:19] like what kind of sample things would you maybe say?
[30:24] Like, you know, hey, you offer with, with the whatever.
[30:29] I'll give you an idea.
[30:30] I can't guarantee much in life because obviously.
[30:33] Right, yeah, there's only the big guy upstairs can do that.
[30:36] But this is almost a guarantee that if you are a car detailer and
[30:41] you do what I'm just about to tell you, there's a good chance you'll
[30:44] double your business within 30 days.
[30:46] Do you reckon that would have got the attention of someone who's
[30:48] watching or listening?
[30:49] Okay, I'm already paying attention.
[30:51] So.
[30:53] And this is something we only launched actually probably, I don't
[30:56] know, six months ago.
[30:58] I'd been doing this forever but didn't realize what I was sitting
[31:01] on.
[31:01] And we call it the Facebook contest formula.
[31:04] And basically it's giving away your product or service on Facebook.
[31:10] So therefore it's a paid advertising, but the advertisement
[31:13] actually gives away a car detailing package worth whatever.
[31:17] Okay.
[31:18] And what that attracts is people who want their car detailed.
[31:22] You don't enter a contest to win a car detailing package if you
[31:25] don't want your car detailed.
[31:27] All right?
[31:27] Right.
[31:28] First of all, you're attracting a warm audience, if not
[31:30] a red hot audience.
[31:32] You say, listen, we're going to draw this in a week's time or
[31:35] two weeks time.
[31:36] So basically click the ad, they go through to a landing page,
[31:38] and on that landing page you collect all of the data that you
[31:41] normally would want to collect.
[31:42] Their name and their contact details and so forth.
[31:45] And of course, even, you know, they make and model the car, whatever
[31:48] it might be, you give one away.
[31:50] But then you've got 100, 200, 300,000 people who put their hand
[31:55] up, glowed in the dark and said, I want my car detailed.
[31:59] So you don't get a hotter audience than that.
[32:01] And then what we do is that we suggest that you would contact all
[32:05] of those people, and if you can't do it, we have a robot that'll
[32:08] do it for you within an hour.
[32:10] And they basically say to the people who entered the contest, look,
[32:14] you didn't win, but I got some good news for you.
[32:17] That particular package that you're talking about that you entered
[32:20] the contest to win, we've got a special deal on that this week
[32:23] that it's normally this, but now this.
[32:25] But if you get in by Friday, we will give you a free vacation.
[32:29] So not only has it created through the funnel a red hot lead
[32:35] because they ended, we do it just one, two weeks ago for a dentist.
[32:40] I said to him, who do you want?
[32:41] He said, obviously, you know, people with crooked teeth.
[32:44] I said, good, okay, well, how about we give away one of your Invisalign
[32:47] products?
[32:48] And that's the invisible braces without the metal teeth anymore.
[32:52] And they're worth about $5,000, but to him it's only two.
[32:56] So we ran a contest for parents in basically the geodemographic
[33:02] area around where his dentist practice was.
[33:04] And we said, how would you like to win, you know, braces for
[33:07] your children's teeth?
[33:08] Now, anyone who entered that was a parent with a child with crooked
[33:11] teeth, you don't want to win braces if you've got perfect smile,
[33:13] right?
[33:14] Yeah.
[33:14] He got just under a thousand entries in the first week.
[33:17] We're talking a thousand.
[33:18] Okay.
[33:19] He only spent $30 a day.
[33:20] $30 a day on Facebook.
[33:22] So seven times 30 over a week is $210.
[33:25] He got just under a thousand leads.
[33:27] And then his staff would ring the people after they give them one
[33:30] away and say, look, you didn't win, but we have a special deal for
[33:33] you.
[33:33] Those invisible braces were normally this, but this week is this.
[33:37] And if you get in by Friday, we'll give you a free vacation.
[33:39] Shut the gate.
[33:40] It's all over.
[33:42] Wow.
[33:42] Wow.
[33:43] And just out of curiosity, like, how do you or what do you recommend
[33:48] as a way of like actually picking one?
[33:52] Right.
[33:52] I mean, like my thought would be I would just put them all in probably
[33:55] like a Google random generator and pick a number that way kind of
[33:59] thing.
[33:59] Or I mean, I have seen, you know, kind of thinking back on it,
[34:04] when I first got into detailing, when I left the car wash
[34:09] and got and opened my own detail shop, there was a guy in town
[34:13] who, who he did do a very similar thing.
[34:16] He offered A.
[34:19] A free service and had everybody like, send them, you know,
[34:23] what type of car they had.
[34:25] And honestly, I think he kind of picked based off of like, coolness
[34:29] factor of the car.
[34:30] You know, I think he picked somebody with a, you know, a very
[34:34] expensive car that could probably easily afford the, the service
[34:38] that he was giving away, you know, just because it.
[34:41] Then it looks good in pictures and stuff like that.
[34:43] I mean, I, to me, I would, I would think a Google random generator,
[34:47] but, you know, what is your take?
[34:49] I would not spend any more than 10 seconds thinking about it
[34:52] because no one gives a.
[34:53] Yeah.
[34:54] How you draw the.
[34:55] I mean, I would just use a random generator, pull someone out.
[35:00] I mean, the cheeky people out there might like to choose someone.
[35:04] I mean, if it's a.
[35:05] If it's a contest, which is a game of chance, it should really
[35:08] be a random.
[35:08] Yeah.
[35:10] If it's a game of skill where they've got a right layer, 60 words
[35:13] or less of why they would like to win the car detail.
[35:15] You don't want to go there.
[35:16] That's good.
[35:20] They would have lost me right there.
[35:21] I'd have been like, I'm out.
[35:23] Yeah.
[35:23] Well, I'll give you an example.
[35:25] I mean, there was a.
[35:26] A turf farm that we had some years ago.
[35:28] This is not just a recent time, some years ago.
[35:31] So he had a turf, as in grass.
[35:32] He would grow grass for landscapers.
[35:34] Right.
[35:35] And the landscapers would then sell that to consumers, of course,
[35:38] for their front yard or backyard.
[35:40] I just said to him at the time, what do you think would be
[35:42] a good Happy Meal toy for landscapers now?
[35:44] 99.9% men, he said, you tell me.
[35:46] I said, beer.
[35:47] And so what we did, we picked a prestige beer down under.
[35:50] It won't mean anything to you guys, but it's called Crown Lager,
[35:53] so it's a very prestige beer.
[35:55] And we just said, look, for every home's worth of grass that
[35:58] you get from my turf farm, instead of going down the road to
[36:00] another turf farm, we will give you a carton of beer.
[36:04] And he rang me about six days after we launched this, and obviously,
[36:08] you know, sent out to an email list of landscapers, and he said,
[36:11] I've got to put problem.
[36:11] I said, oh, God, haven't we all?
[36:13] What's your problem?
[36:13] He said, I've got no more grass.
[36:14] He said, we've been through like three miles worth of grass in
[36:17] one week.
[36:19] Yeah.
[36:19] And he said, he said, your incentive works so crazily well.
[36:22] And talk about perfect message to market match.
[36:24] I mean, you Know alcohol for a landscaper, by the way, because you're
[36:29] injured cars.
[36:30] I would not recommend this as a happy Meal toy for you guys.
[36:32] But.
[36:32] Yeah, no, yeah, but he just said, look, we just wiped out three
[36:36] miles worth of grass.
[36:36] And because he's farm, his turf farm went on for miles and miles
[36:40] and miles.
[36:40] He said, we just moved three miles with the turf in one week.
[36:44] He said, this is the.
[36:45] I've never seen anything like it.
[36:46] I said.
[36:46] He said one guy who was a pain in the ass client, he said he used
[36:49] to always ring me up and say, oh, you're $6 per square meter, I
[36:53] can get it for $5.50 down the road.
[36:55] And he said I'd have to drop my price.
[36:56] That same guy rang up and said, I want 18 homes worth of grass.
[37:00] I don't care when the grass gets here, but I need the beer by
[37:02] Friday.
[37:02] I've got a party.
[37:05] Nice.
[37:07] And.
[37:07] And.
[37:08] Okay.
[37:09] So I don't know if I know my Australian perfectly, but I'm surprised
[37:13] you guys didn't use a Dixon cider.
[37:19] That's an Australian bread.
[37:21] Correct.
[37:21] All right, yeah.
[37:23] Yes.
[37:24] I should have done that.
[37:25] Yeah, yeah.
[37:27] But yeah, look, the thing is, is that, can you imagine if you have
[37:31] a.
[37:31] If you give away a card detailer package and let's just say
[37:36] it's a value of a thousand dollars.
[37:38] Okay.
[37:38] Yeah.
[37:39] Then the point is, is that if you give one of them away each week
[37:43] and you need to give them away quickly because you've got to have
[37:46] the facility to be able to contact these people very soon after
[37:49] they've entered the contest.
[37:50] So don't run a contest that goes on forever.
[37:53] Right.
[37:53] And if you want to have a look at this, by the way, we've put it
[37:55] into a little package.
[37:56] It's FB for Facebook.
[37:58] FB, FBContestFormula.com.
[38:00] so if you go to FBContestFormula.com that'll show
[38:04] you how to do it.
[38:05] It's just steal the idea.
[38:06] You don't need me involved.
[38:07] You can do it yourself if you wanted to.
[38:09] But the thing is, is that, yeah, it attracts warm, if not red
[38:13] hot prospects.
[38:14] Because, you know, as I said, I mean, the classic one was it was
[38:18] a walking frame business.
[38:19] Recently he sells walking frames to people maybe in the 70s
[38:22] and 80s.
[38:23] He insulted me by asking if I'd like to do a contra.
[38:25] So I told him I hope he died in his sleep.
[38:28] But anyways, what we did is we said, win a wheelie walker.
[38:32] Why they put wheels on these things for People who can't walk
[38:35] straight, I don't know.
[38:36] But anyway, win a wheelie walker worth 500.
[38:39] He had 820 leads in one week.
[38:41] Again, all he spent was $30 a day in Facebook ads.
[38:46] He had 820 leads.
[38:47] He gave one away and he had 819 people who just glowed in the
[38:51] dark, put their hand up and said, I want to walk.
[38:52] Walking frame.
[38:54] Wow.
[38:55] So is it better to do it as a, as like, you know, maybe started
[38:58] on a Monday, ended on a Friday kind of thing?
[39:01] Just do it, do it for a week and then turn around, bam, pick your
[39:05] winner, announce it and then, and then start contacting those other
[39:09] leads.
[39:10] Now let me ask you this.
[39:11] Like with those people that had success with the, the, the turf
[39:15] farm guy, the, the walker guy, what was their conversion as far
[39:22] as do, I mean, do you know what their conversion was with the
[39:25] other people that entered so the 800 and however many people that
[39:29] entered for the, for the, for the wheelie walker, what was his
[39:33] conversion on that?
[39:33] If you have any idea, you know.
[39:36] Some people tell us, others don't.
[39:37] They think that we're going to pass it on to all their competitors,
[39:40] which is not the case.
[39:41] But anyway, we, we get the statistic if they happen to be a
[39:44] consultant, consultant consulting client of ours.
[39:46] So they're hanging around with us all the time.
[39:48] They're more open to providing us with details.
[39:50] Of course if they're not, then they don't know us from, from Adam.
[39:53] So therefore they like to keep that to themselves.
[39:55] But the one with the walking frame, for example, he had his girl
[40:00] who was the, basically the secretary of the PA.
[40:03] She rang 100 of the 820 and she had a conversion rate of 9%.
[40:08] So therefore she closed 9% of those and she couldn't go any further.
[40:12] She took her three days to get through 100 of them because you ring
[40:15] people and they had a voicemail.
[40:16] You had to ring back and ring.
[40:17] So we just put our AI robot onto it and we rang the other 800
[40:21] in the space of two hours and the robot got a 14% conversion rate.
[40:28] So we have an arm that we've just launched recently called AIG
[40:33] now dot com.
[40:34] So basically what it is is a telephone receptionist service whereby
[40:40] we can answer the phone, our robots can answer the phone for any
[40:42] business.
[40:43] If you can't, I'm perfect for car detailers because obviously,
[40:45] obviously they can't get to the phone a lot of the times.
[40:47] And that call that you missed could have been a two thousand dollar
[40:51] job.
[40:51] So what happens is for, I think it's 297amonth we charge, so
[40:55] it's not very expensive.
[40:56] But basically the robot answers the phone, has a human like,
[41:00] conversation with the people.
[41:01] So therefore 78% of people don't know it's a robot.
[41:04] I say robot, it's an AI agent, but most of us.
[41:09] So therefore, if someone can't ring up all of the people who had
[41:12] the contest and we just get the outbound version of the robot
[41:15] to ring them and see if he or she can close more than the human.
[41:19] Wow.
[41:21] Wow, that's interesting.
[41:22] Yeah, I mean that's, that's a, that's always a pain in the ass in
[41:25] my day.
[41:26] And I think a lot of my fellow detailers listening to this will
[41:30] probably agree is, you know.
[41:33] Right, right.
[41:33] As soon as you put the polisher onto the paint and start
[41:39] spreading it in, the phone rings and you're like, you know,
[41:41] like, do I stop?
[41:42] Do I keep going?
[41:43] Do I miss the phone call?
[41:44] Do I?
[41:45] So yeah, I could definitely see where, where something like that
[41:50] would definitely be.
[41:51] Be very beneficial.
[41:54] Yeah.
[41:55] Nobody leaves a voicemail.
[41:56] I mean, I'm exaggerating, but not a lot of people leave voicemail
[41:59] anymore because they're on Google.
[42:01] They'll just go to the next town.
[42:02] Detailer, right?
[42:03] Yeah.
[42:04] Yeah.
[42:06] Crazy part about it is that we, we're part.
[42:10] We've partnered with an American company to put this together,
[42:13] so we're way down under, but we're partnered with a company on
[42:15] the west coast.
[42:16] And basically what happens is that, you know, we still make margin
[42:20] in the 297Amonth.
[42:21] So it's a 297Amonth subscription plan.
[42:24] Right.
[42:24] And your phone will be answered 24 7.
[42:27] And 78% of people have no clue that it's a robot.
[42:30] They think that it's a human.
[42:31] You can pick either a male or female.
[42:33] You can, can inject a personality into it.
[42:35] So you can say, look, I want it to be like Conan O'Brien.
[42:38] Or if you happen to be an accountancy practice, then you say,
[42:41] okay, well, I'd like it to be very, you know, strict and very regular
[42:44] and very disciplined.
[42:46] So the good part is you've got the, the cleverest staff member in
[42:49] the world answering your phone for 24 hours a day, which of course
[42:53] you can't do.
[42:53] I mean, someone rings about car detailing.
[42:56] Yeah.
[42:56] For less than a dollar a day.
[42:59] Yeah, for less than $10 a day.
[43:00] So it's 290, $297 a month.
[43:02] So that, that's Month.
[43:04] Come on.
[43:04] My bad.
[43:04] Yeah.
[43:06] I mean, you try getting a human for 24 hours for 10 bucks.
[43:09] Yeah, yeah, exactly.
[43:10] Let me, let me ask you this, though.
[43:14] Can I get it to answer all my wife's phone calls?
[43:17] I don't have to talk to her.
[43:20] Get it, deal with my wife when she calls me.
[43:23] Just I think, I think if I could program it to do that, then
[43:27] I think I'd probably be using it myself too.
[43:29] Yeah, exactly, exactly.
[43:32] So listen, I want to ask you, because you did mention it earlier,
[43:36] you did name drop, and I want to give you a little bit of time.
[43:39] So, like, how do you get Jerry Seinfeld, like, how do you know Jerry
[43:43] Seinfeld?
[43:44] Where do you meet Jerry Seinfeld to be like, hey, you want
[43:46] to do a commercial down under for me?
[43:48] Or was it like, hey, Jerry Seinfeld, do a commercial for me,
[43:51] I'll give you a free vacation?
[43:54] Yeah, no, no, I don't think he needs a free vacation.
[43:56] Yeah, look, what happened is that, you know, we did a survey,
[44:02] but with bank customers and non bank customers, and said, look,
[44:05] who would be a spokesperson who you think would fit this brand?
[44:08] Again, it needs to be message to market match.
[44:10] Okay?
[44:11] Right.
[44:11] So therefore we would not be looking for P.
[44:13] Diddy, for example.
[44:14] Okay.
[44:15] We're looking for someone this particular.
[44:17] Anybody's looking for P.
[44:19] Diddy to do any kind of marketing, right?
[44:21] I don't think so.
[44:21] Not at the moment.
[44:22] Yeah, so we're looking for someone who is probably going to
[44:25] be funny and a bit cheeky because the brand that we had created
[44:28] was a cheeky brand.
[44:29] So our TV commercials and online presence would say.
[44:32] I say our.
[44:33] I mean, I was a consultant to them as if I was working for them.
[44:37] The, the brand was, oh, look, why would you give all your, you
[44:40] know, your details to someone like the Wells Fargo bank when in
[44:44] fact they don't treat you like a person, they treat you like a number.
[44:46] They charge all of these fees and they don't really care who you
[44:49] are.
[44:49] Right.
[44:49] Swap across to the Greater Building Society, where we will treat
[44:53] you like a person.
[44:54] We don't have any of those ridiculous banking fees and guess
[44:56] what?
[44:57] We give you a free vacation.
[44:58] So it's a very good Coke Pepsi comparison.
[45:01] Right.
[45:01] And what had happened had been doing very well for a few years.
[45:04] And the guys who ran the bank said to me, my name's John Dwyer,
[45:08] but I get jd.
[45:08] They said, okay, JD Smart alec, you've got a few runs on the
[45:12] board.
[45:12] We've scooped up all the low lying Fruit, which is basically working
[45:15] class people, because that's what a building society attracts.
[45:18] How do we take the brand up a little bit?
[45:20] How do we take it up a little bit to white collar?
[45:22] And I said, I will leave it with me.
[45:24] So anyway, a good buddy of mine had been doing a similar thing,
[45:27] lifting the brand Persona from working class to middle white collar.
[45:31] And I said, how did you do it?
[45:32] He said, we did it overnight by using Billy Connolly, the English
[45:36] comedian.
[45:38] And he said, wherever he is in the world, we just give him, you
[45:40] know, one and a half million dollars.
[45:42] We fly in, do the ads, wherever he might be in the world,
[45:44] and then we fly out again and.
[45:45] And that's it.
[45:46] He got an easy one and a half million.
[45:48] We basically got a year's worth of ads.
[45:50] I said, okay.
[45:51] So therefore we did a research survey and just asked, you know,
[45:54] who did they think would be a good spokesperson for the building
[45:56] society?
[45:56] I was hoping that it might be an Australian TV star, because that
[45:59] would be easy to get.
[46:00] Yeah, I would think.
[46:01] I would think Crocodile Dundee, you know.
[46:04] Yeah, yeah, well, you know, I thought.
[46:09] Brothers or whatever.
[46:10] Exactly.
[46:10] Well, you know, Paul Hogan, the Crocodile Dundee guy.
[46:12] I mean, he's, he's funny.
[46:14] So I thought he'd be on.
[46:15] On the list and he would have been a lot easier.
[46:16] And as it turned out, Robin Williams, Jim Carrey and Jerry Seinfeld
[46:19] came out on the top.
[46:20] And I thought, what have I done?
[46:21] I've just dug a hole for myself as if you're going to get
[46:23] those guys to.
[46:24] Anyways, it turned out I flew over to New York and, and, well,
[46:28] sorry, Los Angeles, and met with George Shapiro, which he's been
[46:32] Jerry's manager for a thousand years.
[46:34] And I just said to him, look, we just want, you know, Jerry to
[46:37] take the piss out of other banks, basically.
[46:39] You know, take the mickey out of them and.
[46:41] And be him.
[46:42] And that's what got it across the line.
[46:44] It was not the money.
[46:45] I mean, as it turned out, he's got more money than God, so he didn't
[46:48] do it for the money.
[46:49] And I asked him, actually, when he did say yes, and it took
[46:52] six months, by the way, it wasn't.
[46:53] I'd make it sound simple.
[46:54] It was six months worth of me being a nuisance.
[46:56] And when I met him in New York for the first time to go through
[46:59] all the scripts and what we were going to do, I said, mate, you've
[47:01] got more money than God.
[47:03] Why would you say yes to this thing?
[47:05] You know?
[47:05] And he said, well, two reasons.
[47:07] I Like the Australian sense of humor.
[47:08] You're pretty sarcastic and, you know, quirky and, you know, basically
[47:11] I enjoy that sort of humor.
[47:13] And he said, the second reason I said yes is because I thought if
[47:16] I don't say yes, you'd never go away.
[47:21] So persistent speech, intelligence, sometimes that's what
[47:25] it takes.
[47:25] You know, Like, I, I always, I, I'm always afraid to annoy people
[47:30] or, or, or pastor them or whatever.
[47:33] But I, what I've learned with, dealing with some people, especially
[47:37] in, in the, in the detailing industry, like some of the brands
[47:43] or the people that run the brands or whatever, when I'm trying
[47:46] to either get them to come on the show or, you know, maybe do something
[47:50] for the show in the form of, you know, we want to do a giveaway
[47:54] or, or we want to do something, you know, could we get
[47:56] some stuff?
[47:57] And, and that's the one thing that they've all, all told me is
[48:00] like, look, like I'm, I'm super busy.
[48:02] I get a million emails and text messages a day from everybody
[48:05] and anybody.
[48:06] And whatever I'm dealing with, with, you know, getting towels from,
[48:10] you know, China and Asia or whatever, I'm dealing with this,
[48:13] I'm dealing with that.
[48:15] You just have to, you just have to, you know, if I don't reply
[48:18] to you within a couple hours, hit text me again, email me again,
[48:23] and just keep going and keep going and keep going.
[48:25] So, so yeah, sometimes you have to do that to, to kind of show
[48:29] up on the list of priority, because otherwise you do it once
[48:33] they get 100 emails in a day and now your email's gone, they'll
[48:36] never get to you.
[48:38] And sometimes it just takes that, like, okay, you know, throw
[48:42] it in the towel, you know, I'm gonna let you do it.
[48:47] Well, you know, I mean, look, I, and I'm sure you're the same,
[48:50] too.
[48:50] We're both, you know, probably typical entrepreneurs, and most of
[48:53] your listeners or viewers would be the same thing.
[48:55] You have a roller coaster ride when you open up your own business.
[48:57] It's not a matter of if you want to get on the merry ground,
[48:59] go and get a job.
[49:00] But if you've, if you own your own business, then it's hills and
[49:03] valleys.
[49:04] And throughout all of that time, you develop, I guess, a never
[49:07] give up attitude.
[49:08] And so, you know, I have to say, my six millennials, I don't
[49:12] think they've listened to me yet.
[49:14] I think three of them have got a mortgage and the other three are
[49:16] still, you know, just having a girlfriend.
[49:19] We've Got five boys and one girl.
[49:20] So three of them are married with a mortgage and the others aren't
[49:23] the ones with the mortgage.
[49:24] Mortgage.
[49:24] All of a sudden start to listen to me because they go, dad,
[49:27] those ideas that you've got to increase sales, could you give me
[49:30] one or two of them?
[49:31] I know I haven't listened to you for, for 20 years, but the ones
[49:35] who don't have a mortgage, they, they don't give a.
[49:37] What I do for a living.
[49:38] I don't think so.
[49:40] And so, you know, pretty much my attitude has been just keep persisting
[49:46] until they say absolutely no.
[49:48] And that normally will open doors.
[49:50] Just never, ever, ever, ever give up.
[49:52] Yeah, no, that's, that's awesome.
[49:53] That's a great thing.
[49:54] Well, listen, John, I don't want to keep you too much longer.
[50:00] I'm not sure what time it is there in Australia.
[50:02] Wait, let me guess.
[50:03] It's five.
[50:04] It's 5:00pm here, I must say.
[50:07] It's like 7:00 there.
[50:09] Close only an hour 10 to 8.
[50:11] So, so as I'm going to be having caffeine, you'll be probably
[50:14] heading to the refrigerator for that beer.
[50:17] Yeah, yeah, I'm gonna, actually, I think the wife is cooking
[50:20] dinner, so we're gonna go grab some dinner.
[50:22] But listen, I, I, listen, I, I appreciate you for doing this.
[50:26] You know, thanks to, to Jen for setting this up.
[50:31] You know, I wasn't sure when she first reached out and then, and
[50:35] then like I said in the beginning, you know, I mean, it's
[50:36] just right now is kind of a time where not only myself, but some
[50:41] people that I'm talking to are just struggling with how to market
[50:45] their business and how to get it in.
[50:46] And I thought like, hey, this, this might be a cool thing to do
[50:50] and maybe somebody will get some ideas.
[50:52] Maybe, maybe they'll use the ideas of, of, you know, do a giveaway
[50:57] kind of, you know, deal.
[51:00] Maybe somebody's gonna be like, hey, you know what?
[51:03] The, the vacation thing seems like that's a great deal.
[51:07] So hopefully they'll reach out to you for that.
[51:10] But if anybody wants to follow up more with you, if anybody wants
[51:14] to learn a little bit more about you, where's the best place
[51:18] for them to go?
[51:19] I mean, Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, whatever you have.
[51:24] And then I will, in the show notes, I will put the, the vacation
[51:30] website, I will put your, the institute.
[51:36] I'm saying it wrong again, right?
[51:38] It's the wow.
[51:40] The Institute of wow dot com.
[51:41] The Institute of Wow.
[51:42] Okay, I'll put that in there and everything like that.
[51:45] But, but you know, for people that are listening right now, if
[51:47] they want to pause for a second and pull out their phone and
[51:50] look you up, you know, how do they find you?
[51:52] Where do they go?
[51:53] Yep, sure.
[51:54] Well, look, in terms of the vacation promotion, which out of
[51:58] all of the things that I have mentioned in this interview, if they
[52:03] really want to turn the dial quickly, then that would be in my
[52:08] view.
[52:08] I know it sounds self serving because I make money out of the vouchers,
[52:11] but you know, I could easily point you in another direction where
[52:14] I make money as well.
[52:15] There's no doubt it is the.
[52:17] Yeah, it is the Michael Jordan of all of our package promotions.
[52:22] What I decided to do some years ago because I came from the
[52:25] corporate world where I was doing this stuff for McDonald's and
[52:28] KFC and you know, 711 and places like that, they would pay
[52:33] me money.
[52:34] And the greater building society, for example, they would,
[52:37] would pay me money for advice because they had an advertising team
[52:41] to actually implement my advice.
[52:43] What I found with smaller businesses, they don't have a team
[52:46] to implement.
[52:47] And so giving them advice was silly because they'd say, oh, J.D.
[52:50] that's a great piece of advice and we'll get to that.
[52:52] But of course, guess what?
[52:53] They got caught in their business.
[52:54] They never got to it.
[52:56] So what we did years ago is we swapped everything to packaged promotions.
[53:00] So for example, if you wanted to attract people with a million
[53:02] dollar prize, we can get a million dollars out of the insurance
[53:05] company for $23,000.
[53:08] Okay?
[53:08] And so therefore all of those TV shows you see, you know, who Wants
[53:11] to Be a Millionaire or Deal or no Deal, the TV network doesn't give
[53:15] that money away.
[53:16] That's what we call an insured prize.
[53:17] And that prize is given away by an insurance company and you pay
[53:21] the insurance company a premium based on the difficulty of
[53:24] the questions.
[53:25] Okay, so what we did is we just packaged all those things together
[53:29] and what we do is provide to businesses now are done for you package.
[53:32] And the vacation one is probably the absolute number one
[53:36] in terms of, you know, working.
[53:38] And if anyone's interested in that, just give me an email.
[53:40] Just flick me an email.
[53:41] John at the institute of wow.com and yeah, so if you shoot
[53:46] an email to me at John at the institute of whale.com, i'll make
[53:49] sure that you're not paying $97 a voucher.
[53:51] You pay $32 a voucher.
[53:54] And just to, to put that in perspective, you're mentioning a
[53:58] little while ago, would you use that just for the $2,000, you
[54:03] know, car detailing.
[54:04] Yeah.
[54:04] What I would suggest you do is that just like McDonald's, if you
[54:08] buy one Happy Meal, you get one toy.
[54:10] You buy four Happy Meals, you get four toys.
[54:12] And there's a logic to that.
[54:13] Okay, so what I, the supermarket chains down here, down
[54:17] under have copied McDonald's.
[54:19] They've said here in Australia, for every $30 you spend,
[54:21] you get a list Lego toy or whatever it may be.
[54:24] So that means if you spend $60, you get two Lego toys.
[54:27] What I would strongly suggest to any car detailer, whether it's
[54:30] the vacations or any other giveaway, and that is you link it
[54:33] to a spend requirement.
[54:35] So you would say, listen, for every thousand dollars you spend
[54:38] with me on car detailing, I will give you a free vacation to
[54:41] Vegas, New York, San Diego, wherever it might be.
[54:44] So that means if they were going to spend $1,800, guess what?
[54:47] They'll now spend $2,000 because they'll get a second voucher.
[54:50] Right, gotcha.
[54:52] So don't, don't tie it to just a high end two or three thousand
[54:56] dollar car detailing because all the people underneath that, you've
[55:00] essentially ignored them and yeah, they're going to put their
[55:04] hand up and you know, basically say what about me?
[55:06] What about me?
[55:07] So what I would suggest you do is that you would actually say, look,
[55:10] for every X dollars you spend, I will give you the Happy Meal toy.
[55:13] Which means if you spend twice those X dollars, you get 2 ounces.
[55:17] Yeah, no, that's not bad.
[55:19] I hope none of my clients listen to this because some of them
[55:23] do two cars at a time or three cars at a time.
[55:28] Yeah, no, no, no, that's, that's a good idea though to, to
[55:32] kind of do it as a, you're almost on a point.
[55:36] You know, you get so many points you get a voucher, you know,
[55:39] or spend so many.
[55:40] So spend so many dollars you to voucher verses buy this product
[55:44] and get.
[55:45] Because then that, yeah, that might, you know, they might come
[55:49] in for an 800 service and if you got it at a thousand, you might
[55:52] be able to add on an extra 200 bucks just to get them there, to
[55:55] get them, you know, they'll pay the extra hundred.
[55:59] I mean a lot of people, the way I look at it is this is that
[56:03] if I said to you give me $32 and I'll give you more clients than
[56:07] you could ever purchase poker stick out, then you would gladly.
[56:10] You could be 32.
[56:11] 32, 32, 32.
[56:12] That this is this is a slot machine.
[56:14] Yeah.
[56:15] For $32 you've got the hottest Happy Meal toy in the country.
[56:19] And so therefore, don't be greedy if you're getting it for 30.
[56:22] I mean, what I normally say if I'm speaking at a conference on stage,
[56:25] I say who in the.
[56:26] It doesn't matter what the conference is, whether it's restaurants
[56:28] or car dealer detailers.
[56:29] I'll just say to them, who thinks a 10 discount is going to
[56:33] move the dial up?
[56:34] Okay.
[56:35] And nobody puts their hand up because, no, everyone knows that
[56:37] with Groupon being 50 off, nobody's ever going to really react
[56:41] to 10.
[56:41] I said, how about if I give you something that's worth just 10%,
[56:45] but it's worth a thousand dollars?
[56:47] So it's, it'll cost you just 10% of your sale price, but it's
[56:50] worth a thousand dollars.
[56:51] Who thinks that might work?
[56:52] And of course, everyone puts their hand up.
[56:53] So say, for example, if you get the voucher for $32 and you're
[56:57] selling something for $320, all you're doing is a 10 discount,
[57:01] but you're turning a 10 discount into Rocket Fleet because
[57:04] no one's going to come and buy your product.
[57:06] 32 or 320.
[57:08] But they will come and buy your product.
[57:09] Most likely if you're giving them something when they spend $320,
[57:13] that's worth a thousand dollars.
[57:15] Gotcha.
[57:16] Yeah, no, no, for sure, for sure.
[57:19] Listen, that's.
[57:20] It's a lot, it's a lot to digest.
[57:24] I mean, I'm, I'm, I've kind of got some ideas on how I want to maybe
[57:30] implement this.
[57:30] I, I do want to talk to you a little bit more about the, the vacation
[57:36] thing because I think that that might be something that, that
[57:39] maybe we, we can do or offer.
[57:42] So.
[57:42] Yeah, man, I mean, you listen, you're giving me a lot of different,
[57:46] other than AdWords, Facebook, Instagram, ideas to kind of think
[57:50] and to think about.
[57:52] And realistically I feel like they're tried and true.
[57:56] I mean, they're the things that go back to, you know, the beginning
[58:00] of advertising or the beginning, it goes back.
[58:03] To the green stamps.
[58:04] I mean, you know, probably as a child, you might remember your
[58:06] mum and dad.
[58:09] Oh yeah, yeah.
[58:10] It's just basically a digital version of what used to work on paper.
[58:14] I mean, used to go into a supermarket and for every $10 you
[58:17] got a stamp and you lick the stamp and put it onto a saver sheet.
[58:20] Well, that's are gone.
[58:21] But yeah.
[58:25] I remember one thing that.
[58:27] Might be interesting before we do close up, and that is that we
[58:30] have a client here in Australia who's a hardware business
[58:33] and he's got a reasonable hardware shop.
[58:35] It's probably, I guess, you know, a quarter of a football field
[58:39] in terms of the size of it.
[58:40] So it's not just a little corner hardware store, but it is
[58:42] small compared to the Costco style, you know, hardware officer.
[58:47] And he's across the road from one called Bunnings.
[58:50] Now that won't mean anything to anyone in America, but Bunnings
[58:52] in Australia is the hardware Costco.
[58:54] Okay, so it's like Costco, it's the size of a suburb, right?
[58:58] He's got this thing sitting opposite him and he's got his smaller
[59:00] hardware store literally across the road.
[59:03] And he didn't plan it that way.
[59:04] He actually set up his hardware store and then three or
[59:07] four years later, this gigantic 40 ton gorilla set up across
[59:10] the road from him, right?
[59:11] So guess what?
[59:12] He's using the free vacation as a tool to stay alive.
[59:15] And he's one of our number one customers because he, there's a method
[59:19] to the madness of the $32.
[59:21] I know that if I provide it to someone for $32, if it happens to
[59:26] be on a podcast or webinar, then if they follow our instructions
[59:30] and do it properly, there's a good chance they'll be back in six
[59:32] months time for more.
[59:33] So the whole idea is to, you know, and they'll get the same deal.
[59:36] It doesn't go back up to 97, they get the same deal.
[59:38] He's one of those.
[59:39] And so therefore he said to me, he said, I've never seen anything
[59:42] like it.
[59:43] He said, they give it away, you get a free vacation for every
[59:46] thousand dollars you spend in his hardware store.
[59:48] He said he knows the manager of the hardware of the Costco store
[59:52] across the road.
[59:52] And the manager said to him, we would have six months worth of
[59:55] committee meetings trying to work out how to beat you.
[59:58] Had you gone down the price discounting path, we would beat you
[1:00:01] in five minutes.
[1:00:02] So it's a chance to beat the 40 ton gorillas because they just
[1:00:06] cannot possibly make a decision within six months.
[1:00:09] You'll be up and running within 24 hours.
[1:00:13] Gotcha.
[1:00:14] Yeah, no, no, that's, that's, that's right.
[1:00:16] Yeah.
[1:00:16] And, and again, I mean the, in the, in the, the cost cutting or
[1:00:21] the price cutting, you know, they would win because they're buying
[1:00:24] in so much bulk that they're getting in such a crazy good deal
[1:00:28] anyways.
[1:00:29] That, that, yeah, they could definitely undercut.
[1:00:31] Yeah.
[1:00:32] This guy told me he was up 450 within two months.
[1:00:35] I said, you've got, I thought he was BSing.
[1:00:37] I said, no, no, no, look, you know, I think I'm okay at this stuff,
[1:00:40] but I'm not David Copperfield.
[1:00:41] You cannot possibly up 450.
[1:00:44] And he's a, he's a bit of a larrikin.
[1:00:46] And so therefore I thought he was stretching it.
[1:00:49] But no, he, he absolutely gave me a wonderful video testimonial
[1:00:52] because I said to him, well, if that's the truth, I want to get
[1:00:55] you on zoom straight away whilst he was still high.
[1:00:58] And he said, yeah, 450 within two months.
[1:01:01] He said, basically what was happening is that people were coming
[1:01:03] into the hardware store and spending 710 or 720, and then when
[1:01:07] they saw the signage and the offer, spend $1,000, you get a vacation.
[1:01:11] Straight away, they look for something else that was $250.
[1:01:17] Wow, that's, that's awesome.
[1:01:18] Yeah, no, listen, like I, like I said, I, I am, I am so glad to
[1:01:22] have you on.
[1:01:23] It's, it's given me some different thought processes to try
[1:01:28] and figure out my marketing woes.
[1:01:31] I think it definitely proves that, you know, sometimes maybe going
[1:01:37] back to tried and true, you know, it, it worked for so many years
[1:01:41] and, and a lot of the digital is probably, you know, using that
[1:01:47] guideline, but we've just become so digital, you know, and,
[1:01:51] and in our social media, advertising and marketing and stuff
[1:01:55] like that that we kind of forget, you know, what works.
[1:01:57] And a lot of times the thing.
[1:02:00] Is, is that, you know, everyone now realizes that probably
[1:02:03] 80, if not more of their budget is going to spend, going to
[1:02:06] be spent on digital marketing.
[1:02:08] The platform doesn't really matter.
[1:02:10] I mean, it does a bit silly to say that.
[1:02:13] Can't blanch.
[1:02:13] I mean, obviously it matters because if you're after middle management,
[1:02:16] then LinkedIn is probably going to be for you.
[1:02:18] You know, if you're after small to medium sized businesses,
[1:02:22] maybe Facebook might be fit.
[1:02:23] If you're after consumers and obviously Instagram and Facebook
[1:02:26] and that's who your account detailers are after, of course.
[1:02:30] So it's really, really simple to say, okay, Facebook, you pour
[1:02:33] the lookalike audience in, it'll spit out the audience for you.
[1:02:36] But the thing is, the platform's one thing really.
[1:02:40] If you don't have the idea in the first place, if you don't have
[1:02:42] the offer in the first place, it doesn't matter how many times
[1:02:45] you put that on TV or Facebook, it's not going to work.
[1:02:48] And so I keep on saying to people, look, just, just don't spend
[1:02:51] so much time on choosing the platform.
[1:02:53] That's easy.
[1:02:54] That's a five minute job.
[1:02:55] Choose your time on coming up with the creative, the actual offer.
[1:02:58] Because whether you put it on TV or letterbox, browser or it's
[1:03:01] on Facebook, it's the offer that makes the difference.
[1:03:06] Right, right, exactly.
[1:03:08] Yeah.
[1:03:09] No, listen, John, appreciate it, man.
[1:03:11] I.
[1:03:11] I've had a blast.
[1:03:14] I look forward to maybe talking to you again.
[1:03:19] Maybe I try to implement a few of these and maybe we can do a where,
[1:03:25] where am I now?
[1:03:26] You know, kind of deal with you and down the lines and everything.
[1:03:30] So, yeah, I.
[1:03:31] Listen, you've really given me a lot to think about, so I really
[1:03:35] appreciate this.
[1:03:36] Thank you for your time and enjoy your.
[1:03:41] It's Wednesday there.
[1:03:42] Enjoy your Wednesday.
[1:03:43] Yes or no?
[1:03:44] Tuesday.
[1:03:44] Yes, Tuesday.
[1:03:45] I'm sorry, I'm thinking.
[1:03:46] I'm.
[1:03:47] I'm already thinking.
[1:03:48] Which means if you're betting on the horses, just let me know,
[1:03:51] I'll tell you which horse won.
[1:03:53] Yeah, yeah, exactly.
[1:03:56] I mean, listen, that's what I always ask my Australian detailer
[1:03:59] friends, you know, like, hey, what are the lottery numbers?
[1:04:01] And they never tell me.
[1:04:02] I mean, they're.
[1:04:03] What can I say?
[1:04:04] Or cons, as you guys love to say.
[1:04:06] And I love saying that word because I can when I'm talking.
[1:04:12] Oh, yes.
[1:04:17] Can't really say that a lot here, but with my Australian friends,
[1:04:22] I don't.
[1:04:23] Think it's everyday vernacular, but when they're excited.
[1:04:25] Yeah, yeah.
[1:04:27] Oh, no, not absolutely.
[1:04:28] Yeah, yeah.
[1:04:29] But it's fun.
[1:04:30] It's fun every now and then, so.
[1:04:33] All right, John, you have a great day.
[1:04:35] It was great talking to you again.
[1:04:37] Appreciate it.
[1:04:37] It.
[1:04:38] Thanks, buddy.
[1:04:40] Hey.

Shows are listed from Apple Podcasts' charts and directory, and Podcast Index where it is used. Every show and episode belongs to its publisher and plays from the publisher's own feed; this site hosts none of them.