# FKN Classics Double Feature! Dr Gregory Little - Moundbuilders | Nik Hayes - Sky Entities

An episode of [Forbidden Knowledge News](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1470192028), 21 Jun 2026, 2 h 12 min.

Audio: https://dts.podtrac.com/redirect.mp3/api.spreaker.com/download/episode/72619857/classicslithayes_sd_360p_medium_fr30_21062026.mp3

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## Transcript

[0:00] Speaker 1: Enjoy these back to back classic Forbidden Knowledge News episodes. Today,
[0:09] Speaker 1: I want to welcome back to the show, doctor Gregory Little.
[0:12] Speaker 1: He is a researcher and author of over thirty books.
[0:16] Speaker 1: His research has been featured on the National Geographic Channel,
[0:20] Speaker 1: MSNBC Discovery and the History Channel.
[0:24] Speaker 2: Doctor Little, welcome back. How you doing.
[0:27] Speaker 3: Thank you? I'm doing well. Good to be here, Good
[0:30] Speaker 3: to see you. And we'll see where this sky's Yeah,
[0:33] Speaker 3: its something new, yest, the new stuff.
[0:36] Speaker 1: I'm looking forward to this. From what you told me,
[0:38] Speaker 1: I'm very excited today. I want to get your insights
[0:41] Speaker 1: into the mysterious mounds scattered across the United States. Mainstream
[0:45] Speaker 1: academy is oddly silent about the history surrounding these mysterious mounds,
[0:50] Speaker 1: and the more researchers like yourself discover the older and
[0:54] Speaker 1: more advanced seeming the civilizations that may have constructed these
[0:58] Speaker 1: mounds appear to be, as well as the possibility of
[1:01] Speaker 1: some sort of global cover up of giant human remains.
[1:05] Speaker 1: Possibly we'll get into all this before we do, just
[1:08] Speaker 1: remind the audience a little bit about yourself and your work.
[1:13] Speaker 3: Well, I started in this field in nineteen eighty three,
[1:19] Speaker 3: but Basically my profession is I work in the field
[1:23] Speaker 3: of criminal psychology, which I have since the nineteen seventies.
[1:27] Speaker 3: I have a master's degree in psychology and a doctorate
[1:31] Speaker 3: in counseling. I've been a certified psychologist licensed in mental
[1:39] Speaker 3: health counseling, done that for a long time, but starting
[1:42] Speaker 3: in nineteen eighty three, I developed this other hobby which
[1:47] Speaker 3: became a professional hobby and professional interest in the mounds.
[1:50] Speaker 3: So I've been writing books and doing research in the
[1:53] Speaker 3: field of Native American mounds and archaeology since the nineteen eighties.
[2:00] Speaker 3: Have a lot of books out. I'm not really sure
[2:02] Speaker 3: how many are in the field of archaeology. Maybe twelve
[2:06] Speaker 3: or thirteen fourteen cover that, but I have about seventy
[2:09] Speaker 3: books out all together, seventy four I think right now
[2:12] Speaker 3: to be more exact. But I keep writing. I'm trying
[2:17] Speaker 3: not to do as many shows and so on in
[2:20] Speaker 3: archaeology anymore, leave that to others, trying to focus my
[2:23] Speaker 3: attention in the research and just writing it up. So
[2:27] Speaker 3: that's kind of the background of it. But I'm still
[2:30] Speaker 3: very active, still writing loads of books in the field.
[2:33] Speaker 1: Excellent now when it comes to the mounds, what are
[2:36] Speaker 1: some of the most interesting locations in the United States
[2:40] Speaker 1: for you.
[2:42] Speaker 3: Well, there's a lot of them. I did an article
[2:46] Speaker 3: years ago called the top ten mound sites in the
[2:48] Speaker 3: United States. There are several that are I mean, some
[2:52] Speaker 3: of these are incredible. People think of an Indian mound
[2:55] Speaker 3: as basically a small conical hump. It looks kind of
[2:59] Speaker 3: like an ice cream cone. That's what the word conical means.
[3:02] Speaker 3: The top is curved, and they think that they would
[3:06] Speaker 3: lay a body there and just put dirt over it.
[3:08] Speaker 3: That's the idea. But what people don't understand is that
[3:11] Speaker 3: there were probably a million of these in North America
[3:14] Speaker 3: what is today the United States alone, probably a million.
[3:19] Speaker 3: Some of them are very very old, as we'll get
[3:22] Speaker 3: into here in a while. But but a lot of
[3:24] Speaker 3: those conical mounds we're just talking about one kind now
[3:27] Speaker 3: of conical mounds. A lot of those have very large,
[3:31] Speaker 3: extremely well made stone chambers in them. In fact, just
[3:38] Speaker 3: earlier today, I was going through some articles from the
[3:41] Speaker 3: very early eighteen hundreds that had some photographs in them.
[3:45] Speaker 3: Around eighteen thirty or forty, they had some of the
[3:49] Speaker 3: very first photographs, and I saw this site in Ohio
[3:53] Speaker 3: called the Turner site, which I've always been fascinated with it.
[3:56] Speaker 3: It's impossible to describe. You just can't describe some of
[4:00] Speaker 3: these sites. But there was one mound at this massive site, mound,
[4:06] Speaker 3: one large burial mound that when they started excavating it,
[4:09] Speaker 3: they found that the whole mound began with a stone
[4:13] Speaker 3: wall built in a perfect circle. The stone wall was
[4:17] Speaker 3: about seven feet high. It was made of stacked stones,
[4:22] Speaker 3: very well made. Didn't have it didn't have any mortar
[4:26] Speaker 3: in it, but it was stacked masonry. And then they
[4:30] Speaker 3: did burials in it and then covered it over with dirt.
[4:34] Speaker 3: But if you look at it from the outside, you
[4:35] Speaker 3: have no idea that, my God, that thing is made
[4:38] Speaker 3: of stone. So there are lots of these stone mounds
[4:43] Speaker 3: in America. There were some extremely large mounds in Ohio.
[4:47] Speaker 3: One is called the Miamisburg Mound. It is a conical
[4:50] Speaker 3: mound that is seventy feet high, think about as tall
[4:54] Speaker 3: as a seven story building. Its circumference is around four
[4:58] Speaker 3: hundred feet. It is just enormous us about twenty feet
[5:02] Speaker 3: down from the dirt. The outer level of it is
[5:05] Speaker 3: dirt about twenty feet down. It is totally covered with
[5:10] Speaker 3: stone that looks like roof shingles. These are stone slabs
[5:14] Speaker 3: that look like roof shingles. How were they found, Well,
[5:17] Speaker 3: they start after they removed an outer layer of stone
[5:22] Speaker 3: that was on the top of it, and the locals
[5:25] Speaker 3: did that so they could use the stone for construction.
[5:28] Speaker 3: Then they began to excavate from the top and then
[5:30] Speaker 3: they found the next layer twenty some feet down. Now
[5:33] Speaker 3: what that means is is that these mounds were used
[5:36] Speaker 3: over and over for burials. They would bury, then they
[5:39] Speaker 3: would fill it over, then they'd bury again on top
[5:42] Speaker 3: of it, fill it over, and they'd get bigger and bigger.
[5:44] Speaker 3: So there's a lot of these giant mounds in the
[5:47] Speaker 3: United States. But then there are also what are called
[5:51] Speaker 3: platform mounds. Platform mounds are also known as truncated pyramids.
[5:56] Speaker 3: They're usually rectangular or square mounts. Sometimes they have a
[6:02] Speaker 3: base of several hundred feet, like a square base of
[6:05] Speaker 3: two hundred three hundred feet, and they can go up
[6:08] Speaker 3: to sixty to seventy feet high. And then on the
[6:12] Speaker 3: top of those there were temples or other structures built
[6:15] Speaker 3: on them, and those structures were used by the elite
[6:19] Speaker 3: of the tribe. Either they were shaman ki for other
[6:22] Speaker 3: people that were more important and more powerful in the society.
[6:26] Speaker 3: There are loads of those. Mountville, Alabama, for example, which
[6:30] Speaker 3: is one of the most important, one of the top
[6:32] Speaker 3: five sites in the United States. It has twenty of
[6:35] Speaker 3: these platform mounds arranged around this giant plaza and in
[6:40] Speaker 3: the center is a platform mound, and all of those
[6:43] Speaker 3: were used for astronomical alignments. So in that center platform
[6:49] Speaker 3: now it was where the shaman lived. And the shaman
[6:53] Speaker 3: would go out and they could look from the top
[6:55] Speaker 3: of their mound across another mound in the distance, and
[6:59] Speaker 3: they could time. They could see the sunrise and sunset
[7:04] Speaker 3: at the equinox and at the solstice. But they also
[7:09] Speaker 3: watched stars. They would see star alignments, and those star
[7:14] Speaker 3: alignments were used for various rituals. So that's a type.
[7:18] Speaker 3: There are many, many of those platform mounts. And finally,
[7:22] Speaker 3: some of the more incredible things are the geometric earthworks.
[7:27] Speaker 3: The United States of America, in Ohio has the most
[7:32] Speaker 3: extensive and most bizarre geometric earthworks found anywhere in the world. Newark,
[7:41] Speaker 3: Ohio has a golf course called Mountain Builder's Golf Course,
[7:45] Speaker 3: and it was built Mount Builder's Golf Course was built
[7:50] Speaker 3: inside of a giant circle circular earthwork. So what forms
[7:56] Speaker 3: the circle is an outer wall of earth that it
[8:00] Speaker 3: encloses twenty acres. It then has two lines of earth
[8:04] Speaker 3: that go and attached to an octagon that encloses fifty acres.
[8:10] Speaker 3: The walls of earth are about sixteen to twenty feet
[8:14] Speaker 3: high that enclose these. I mean they're just perfectly aligned
[8:18] Speaker 3: in the octagon. Again, it's a fifty acre octagon. It
[8:22] Speaker 3: has truncated mounds or small truncated pyramids at each of
[8:27] Speaker 3: the eight points of the octagon. Right outside of this
[8:32] Speaker 3: there is another circular earthwork, and then there are walkways these.
[8:38] Speaker 3: One of the walkways goes one and a half miles.
[8:42] Speaker 3: Now when I say a walkway, what I'm talking about
[8:45] Speaker 3: is a flat area. On both sides of the walkway,
[8:50] Speaker 3: there are parallel lines of earth piled earth. So there
[8:57] Speaker 3: are these linear mounds that in close the walkway that
[9:02] Speaker 3: runs for one and a half miles, and then it
[9:05] Speaker 3: reaches another circular earthwork that encloses thirty acres that has
[9:11] Speaker 3: a deep ditch on the inside. So you've got an
[9:14] Speaker 3: outer wall of earth that is fourteen feet high, and
[9:18] Speaker 3: then you have a ditch seven to eight feet that's
[9:21] Speaker 3: not even close to the rest of it. There's another walkway.
[9:24] Speaker 3: These walkways are all one hundred and fifty feet wide,
[9:26] Speaker 3: by the way, and then you have the parallel walls
[9:30] Speaker 3: of earth following it for fifty six miles to Chillicothe, Ohio,
[9:37] Speaker 3: where it goes to some identical sets of circles and
[9:42] Speaker 3: octagons formed by walls of earth. It's almost impossible to describe.
[9:47] Speaker 3: I mean, I've tried, but most people that listen to this,
[9:50] Speaker 3: you know, it's just going to be foggy. They cannot
[9:52] Speaker 3: understand it. So that's an example. There are loads of
[9:56] Speaker 3: those around the country, although that is the most extensive one.
[10:00] Speaker 3: So those are the three major types right now.
[10:03] Speaker 1: As far as the purposes, you mentioned that they were
[10:07] Speaker 1: built based on at times stellar alignments. What do you
[10:11] Speaker 1: believe were some of the other purposes is besides rituals
[10:15] Speaker 1: and ceremonial and possibly burial, what else were we looking at?
[10:19] Speaker 3: Well, obviously burial mounds would compa o to the million
[10:22] Speaker 3: that I believe were here. More than half of those
[10:26] Speaker 3: would be burial mounds, although some of those were really extensive.
[10:30] Speaker 3: The geometric earthworks, most of which were built Now, let
[10:34] Speaker 3: me give you a timeframe. The geometric earthworks were built
[10:36] Speaker 3: from roughly five six hundred BC up until around two
[10:43] Speaker 3: to three hundred AD, so there's a timeframe there of
[10:47] Speaker 3: about seven eight hundred years. Those are called Hopewell Era,
[10:51] Speaker 3: and virtually all of those are used for some sort
[10:55] Speaker 3: of rituals, the movements of people. The octagon that I
[11:01] Speaker 3: described that was in newarkal that is in Newark, Ohio,
[11:05] Speaker 3: that was used strangely to predict the movements of the moon.
[11:14] Speaker 3: And the moon makes a cycle over eighteen point six
[11:19] Speaker 3: one years, So this circle and octagon, along with the
[11:24] Speaker 3: eight truncated mounds inside of it, was used to pinpoint
[11:29] Speaker 3: the moon's movements over this eighteen point sixty one year cycle.
[11:33] Speaker 3: So that means that it took that long for them
[11:37] Speaker 3: to build this and align it correctly, and then it
[11:40] Speaker 3: probably took another eighteen point sixty one years for somebody
[11:43] Speaker 3: to sit there and watch the alignments to know that
[11:47] Speaker 3: they were accurate, and by the way, it's still accurate today.
[11:51] Speaker 3: That's how they know. That's what it was used for,
[11:53] Speaker 3: and that was actually discovered in nineteen eighty four, not
[11:56] Speaker 3: by archaeologists, by the way, archaeologists don't like didn't at
[12:00] Speaker 3: that time, like the field that is called archaeo astronomy,
[12:04] Speaker 3: which is the study of astronomical alignments at archaeology sites.
[12:09] Speaker 3: So the platform mounds that I mentioned were also used
[12:13] Speaker 3: for rituals, but they were used for shows of power.
[12:17] Speaker 3: Some of these mounds that are the platform mounds that
[12:20] Speaker 3: were built next to rivers that flooded were probably used
[12:24] Speaker 3: also as refuges for the population during flooding. But other
[12:29] Speaker 3: than that, you've got mounds where people lived. You have
[12:33] Speaker 3: a lot of mounds that were used for burials, and
[12:37] Speaker 3: you have the geometric earthworks that were used to move
[12:40] Speaker 3: processions of people during rituals and to measure the movements
[12:46] Speaker 3: of stars, the moon, and the sun. There were probably
[12:53] Speaker 3: other purposes that we just don't even know of. So
[12:57] Speaker 3: that's kind of a thumbnail of it.
[13:00] Speaker 1: As far as the possible ages and how far back
[13:03] Speaker 1: some of these mounds go. We were discussing before the
[13:07] Speaker 1: show that you've made some pretty amazing discoveries about this.
[13:11] Speaker 2: How far back.
[13:12] Speaker 1: Are we looking when we're looking at some of the
[13:14] Speaker 1: oldest mounds.
[13:16] Speaker 3: All right, Well, first let me say these aren't my discoveries.
[13:19] Speaker 3: I don't do any I have done carbon dating, but
[13:23] Speaker 3: not of mounds. I did carbon dating and a lot
[13:25] Speaker 3: of the work that we did in the Bahamas back
[13:28] Speaker 3: up to twenty twelve, but I've never done any work
[13:31] Speaker 3: on mounds. I've never dug into a mound, never collected
[13:34] Speaker 3: artifacts from them. However, archaeology for a long time believe
[13:40] Speaker 3: that mound building began around three thousand BC. That is
[13:44] Speaker 3: what they said when I started in the field, roughly
[13:47] Speaker 3: in nineteen eighty three. Well it's not wroughly, I started
[13:49] Speaker 3: in eighty three. So they said at the time that
[13:51] Speaker 3: mounds started in the northeast and up along the below
[13:56] Speaker 3: the Great Lakes, in like Michigan and Minnesota, and that
[14:00] Speaker 3: it all started in three thousand BC. That then changed,
[14:04] Speaker 3: and then they said mound building began in Ohio around
[14:07] Speaker 3: the same time, around three thousand BC with the Adena culture,
[14:11] Speaker 3: which really didn't get active till one thousand BC. And
[14:15] Speaker 3: then they started finding mounds in Louisiana, for example Poverty Point,
[14:21] Speaker 3: which I know we'll discuss later because it's so important
[14:24] Speaker 3: that data that one thousand, eight hundred BC. So for
[14:28] Speaker 3: some time Poverty Point seemed to be kind of an
[14:31] Speaker 3: outlier that it began mound building in the United States.
[14:36] Speaker 3: They've long believed that there was some sort of a
[14:38] Speaker 3: Mexican culture influence at Poverty Point, and by the way,
[14:42] Speaker 3: Poverty Points in northeastern Louisiana close to the Mississippi River.
[14:49] Speaker 3: But that's all changed. Not long after Poverty Point was discovered,
[14:53] Speaker 3: they began doing carbon dating with some other sites in
[14:59] Speaker 3: Louisiana and eventually they found a site called Monte Sano,
[15:05] Speaker 3: which is on it's on the capitol grounds in Baton Rouge.
[15:10] Speaker 3: It's been destroyed, but there were several mounds on the
[15:14] Speaker 3: capitol of Baton Rouge and it dated to roughly five
[15:18] Speaker 3: thousand BC or fifty two hundred BC. That's the basic
[15:24] Speaker 3: date of the Monte Sano mounds. So that pretty much
[15:27] Speaker 3: has been North America's earliest mound, along with like seven
[15:34] Speaker 3: others in Louisiana and one in Mississippi that dated between
[15:40] Speaker 3: the year three thousand BC to roughly five thousand BC. However,
[15:47] Speaker 3: in two thousand and twelve a report came out of
[15:52] Speaker 3: South America. The report in South America, which I've long
[15:56] Speaker 3: had an interest in. South America wrote a book about
[16:00] Speaker 3: South American archaeology, and they found that the oldest mound
[16:06] Speaker 3: in South America, which was a burial mound dated to
[16:11] Speaker 3: eight thousand, four hundred BC, ten four hundred years ago,
[16:16] Speaker 3: which is absolutely bizarre. So I'll switch to South America
[16:21] Speaker 3: for a minute before I get back to North America.
[16:24] Speaker 3: So South America has always been kind of a blind
[16:27] Speaker 3: spot in American archaeology. The mounds there have long been
[16:31] Speaker 3: believed to and there are many. There's thousands and thousands
[16:34] Speaker 3: of mounds in South America. They've long been believed to
[16:38] Speaker 3: be made more recently than those in North America. But
[16:42] Speaker 3: that's pretty much not true anymore. The Amazon. Back when
[16:47] Speaker 3: I did this the book on South America, there were
[16:51] Speaker 3: mounds along the Amazon, close to the Atlantic Ocean that
[16:56] Speaker 3: they believed were about five thousand years old, but not
[16:59] Speaker 3: dating back to ten thousand, which is what they found now.
[17:04] Speaker 3: By the way, way that ten thousand, four hundred BC
[17:06] Speaker 3: maun is not BC. The ten thousand, four hundred years
[17:10] Speaker 3: ago is in Bolivia, the Bolivian Amazon, but there are
[17:16] Speaker 3: loads of other mouths. So now we know this comes
[17:21] Speaker 3: straight out of mainstream archaeology, and the National Geographic has
[17:27] Speaker 3: really been the point people on the research in the Amazon.
[17:32] Speaker 3: The Amazon in fourteen ninety two when Columbus reached the Bahamas.
[17:39] Speaker 3: Columbus never set foot in North America, by the way,
[17:43] Speaker 3: but he got into the Bahamas. And in fourteen ninety two,
[17:46] Speaker 3: it is now known the Amazon alone had a population
[17:51] Speaker 3: of ten million people. Ten million in the Amazon. The
[17:58] Speaker 3: Amazon is not a natural rainforest. This is also known,
[18:04] Speaker 3: and this is accepted. I'm not giving in the wild
[18:07] Speaker 3: woo woo stuff. It's now accepted. The Amazon is a garden.
[18:12] Speaker 3: It was made. It was once nothing but a giant
[18:16] Speaker 3: bamboo forest. So whoever came in there, the population that
[18:21] Speaker 3: came in there long ago came in got rid of
[18:25] Speaker 3: most of the bamboo and began planting fruit trees and
[18:29] Speaker 3: other vegetation and turned it into a garden. And there
[18:33] Speaker 3: are now thousands of geometric earthworks, just like in North America, circles, squares, mounds,
[18:44] Speaker 3: and those enclosed towns and cities. There are walkways just
[18:48] Speaker 3: like I described in Newark, Ohio, the one that ran
[18:52] Speaker 3: fifty six miles from Newark, Ohio to Chillicothe, Ohio. There
[18:57] Speaker 3: are walkways like that in the Amazon that are now
[19:00] Speaker 3: being found that have lines of earth, earth and walls
[19:04] Speaker 3: on the side, just like in North America. So we
[19:09] Speaker 3: know now that in fourteen ninety two about the lowest
[19:13] Speaker 3: population in the Americas that archaeology and anthropology excepts now,
[19:20] Speaker 3: is that there were fifty seven million people here when
[19:24] Speaker 3: Columbus got here. It was not the vast uninhabited land
[19:29] Speaker 3: that I learned when I was in school, when I
[19:33] Speaker 3: of course I'm in my seventies, and when I was
[19:36] Speaker 3: in school, I hate to say it, in the nineteen
[19:39] Speaker 3: fifties and the early sixties, the little history we had
[19:44] Speaker 3: about the Americas. Course history began with the discovery of
[19:48] Speaker 3: the Americas. But we were told that about the only
[19:52] Speaker 3: people here were a few Indians that were I hate
[19:56] Speaker 3: the word, but they are called savages, and all the
[19:58] Speaker 3: textbooks that we had that there were very few of them.
[20:02] Speaker 3: They didn't own land. They just went to the west.
[20:05] Speaker 3: A few of them stayed and fought, but that was it.
[20:08] Speaker 3: That's what we learned, and it was a vast uninhabited land.
[20:11] Speaker 3: Totally untrue. There were probably one hundred million people here,
[20:15] Speaker 3: but the lowest estimate now is fifty seven million. So
[20:19] Speaker 3: let's get down then to what has happened recently. So
[20:23] Speaker 3: last year twenty twenty two in June eight geologists and
[20:30] Speaker 3: anthropologists that joined together. There were a couple of archaeologists
[20:34] Speaker 3: in this group of eight did research at what is
[20:37] Speaker 3: called the Louisiana State University Campus Mounds. There are two
[20:43] Speaker 3: burial mounds that are there, and I taught for LSU
[20:48] Speaker 3: at their campus at Shreveport for about five years. The
[20:53] Speaker 3: LSU campus mounds are well known for a number of reasons.
[20:58] Speaker 3: One of them is because some people have died there
[21:01] Speaker 3: because drunken students would drive over them in jeeps and
[21:06] Speaker 3: kill people. But anyway, those mounds were redated and they
[21:13] Speaker 3: published an article in the American Journal of Science in
[21:17] Speaker 3: June of two thousand twenty two, So it was just
[21:22] Speaker 3: it was less than one year ago. And in that
[21:25] Speaker 3: article they have redated the two campus mounds and they
[21:30] Speaker 3: now know that the earliest mound there dates to the
[21:35] Speaker 3: year nine thousand, three hundred BC. It was started in
[21:41] Speaker 3: ninety three hundred BC. Now to some people that may
[21:46] Speaker 3: not sound amazing, but think of this. People think that
[21:50] Speaker 3: pyramids and mound building begin in Egypt. That is totally untrue.
[21:57] Speaker 3: Mound building in e Egypt predated the pyramids and in
[22:02] Speaker 3: all Egyptian textbooks. In Egyptology, it is said that mound
[22:07] Speaker 3: building was the prototype of Egyptian pyramids. The oldest known
[22:15] Speaker 3: mound in Egypt, back when I was some years ago,
[22:19] Speaker 3: was dated to about thirty two hundred BC. Now, the
[22:22] Speaker 3: oldest mound known in all of Egypt dates to about
[22:26] Speaker 3: the year five thousand BC, and that's in Avedos, that's it.
[22:31] Speaker 3: So it is roughly almost five thousand years more recent
[22:38] Speaker 3: than the mounds here. The oldest mounds in Turkey, Turkey,
[22:44] Speaker 3: southeastern Turkey where probably civilization now began, at least the
[22:49] Speaker 3: civilization that we call civilization more modern one. It dates
[22:53] Speaker 3: also to about the year five thousand BC, and that's
[22:58] Speaker 3: actually not too far from the site of goebec le
[23:00] Speaker 3: Tepe in southeastern Turkey, which quebec le Tepe does date
[23:05] Speaker 3: to nine thousand BC. But it's not a mound. Gobecley
[23:09] Speaker 3: Tepe is a stone temple that's actually sunk into the earth. Now,
[23:14] Speaker 3: the word tepe means hill, so it's at the top
[23:16] Speaker 3: of a hill, but it is a sunken stone temple.
[23:20] Speaker 3: So things are getting very very strange now. Now the
[23:24] Speaker 3: fact that the oldest mound is here, that will probably
[23:28] Speaker 3: change I suspect at some point. But I have searched
[23:32] Speaker 3: and searched. I cannot find any mounds in the world
[23:36] Speaker 3: that predate the ones now at Louisiana State University in
[23:41] Speaker 3: Baton Rouge. I know, it's odd. I mean, for example, Ukraine.
[23:45] Speaker 3: Ukraine has fifty thousand known burial mounds. Most of those
[23:51] Speaker 3: go to the Bronze Age. The oldest ones that I
[23:54] Speaker 3: can find in Siberia, which is where they say the
[23:57] Speaker 3: culture came from. All mainstream archaeology says that while all
[24:02] Speaker 3: the people in the Americas came through Siberia, they may
[24:05] Speaker 3: have come from other areas, but they all walked through Siberia,
[24:08] Speaker 3: and they came across from Alaska in the Bering Straits.
[24:12] Speaker 3: They came into the Americas and then populated. The dates
[24:16] Speaker 3: of that have bounced around, and those dates have changed.
[24:19] Speaker 3: But things are actually a lot different from what most
[24:23] Speaker 3: people have learned in school. Things are changing quickly, and
[24:28] Speaker 3: archaeologists don't even agree, and their disagreements are actually kind
[24:32] Speaker 3: of wild when.
[24:36] Speaker 1: Well, when it comes to the possibilities of the oldest
[24:38] Speaker 1: civilizations that may have originated these mounds, that may have been.
[24:42] Speaker 2: The first builders.
[24:44] Speaker 1: We know, like you said, there has been plenty of
[24:47] Speaker 1: civilizations here before Christopher Columbus. Do you think that there
[24:51] Speaker 1: was some possible global maritime culture that had this disadvanced
[24:59] Speaker 1: construction abilities that were able to circumnavigate the globe and
[25:05] Speaker 1: build these advanced structures.
[25:07] Speaker 3: Well, I've said that for decades. When I say decades,
[25:13] Speaker 3: the first book that came out with that in it
[25:16] Speaker 3: was nineteen nineteen ninety seven, I believe, and then again
[25:21] Speaker 3: in nineteen ninety nine and the two thousand and one
[25:25] Speaker 3: of course Atlantis, which is the a word it pops
[25:28] Speaker 3: in there. I do believe, along with Graham Hancock and
[25:32] Speaker 3: Robert Schock and Andrew Collins and others, that there was
[25:36] Speaker 3: a maritime culture, and I think a lot of people
[25:40] Speaker 3: knew about it. I think that's what Plato was describing
[25:43] Speaker 3: when he talked about Atlantis. Edgar Casey described the same thing.
[25:50] Speaker 3: Both Casey and Plato described Atlantis in pretty much the
[25:57] Speaker 3: same way, and their descriptions if you really read it,
[26:01] Speaker 3: it's talking about a massive island empire that was a
[26:07] Speaker 3: maritime culture. Plato said that Atlantis was destroyed and roughly
[26:14] Speaker 3: ninety six hundred BC, which is bizarre because that's dated right,
[26:19] Speaker 3: at when the first mounds were built in the United
[26:23] Speaker 3: States in Louisiana. It dates to that. Now, what I
[26:26] Speaker 3: didn't tell you about the mount in Louisiana. This is
[26:28] Speaker 3: where it gets weird. It was used that ninety six
[26:32] Speaker 3: hundred BC mound in Louisiana or ninety four hundred BC
[26:36] Speaker 3: was used for a couple thousand years as a burial mound,
[26:40] Speaker 3: so they made it bigger and bigger and bigger, putting
[26:42] Speaker 3: more burials. So then they stopped for four thousand years
[26:47] Speaker 3: and just disappeared, and then started using it again around
[26:51] Speaker 3: the year four thousand BC, and then loads of them
[26:54] Speaker 3: appeared down there in four thousand BC. So something happened
[26:59] Speaker 3: around nine four hundred and ninety six hundred BC. Same
[27:04] Speaker 3: thing at gobecley Tepe in Turkey, something happened. There were
[27:09] Speaker 3: burials mounds dated to that. At go bec Le Tepe,
[27:12] Speaker 3: there was this underground temple was buried at the time,
[27:17] Speaker 3: there was a cataclysm of some kind that occurred, and
[27:21] Speaker 3: then they the civilization just kind of disappeared and reappeared
[27:27] Speaker 3: again around the year four thousand BC. So it took
[27:30] Speaker 3: several thousand years for it to build back up. But
[27:33] Speaker 3: the idea that I had pretty much dovetails with Graham Hancock's.
[27:37] Speaker 3: And if you read if you read Graham Hancock's book
[27:41] Speaker 3: America before, and you read it carefully and you get
[27:45] Speaker 3: to the end of the book, Graham Hancock actually references
[27:48] Speaker 3: and discusses the work that Andrew Collins and I did
[27:51] Speaker 3: in several previous books. We believe that what Atlantis was,
[27:57] Speaker 3: and it's just we don't have a better term for it.
[28:01] Speaker 3: Atlantis is the term that Plato used. It is a
[28:05] Speaker 3: dirty word in archaeology, but I don't know what else
[28:08] Speaker 3: to call it. So Atlantis was a maritime culture and
[28:13] Speaker 3: it didn't have spaceships. The word technology. It's said that
[28:18] Speaker 3: that word ever came into it, because when you say
[28:21] Speaker 3: they had advanced technology, what I mean and what Hancock
[28:25] Speaker 3: means when he says advanced technology, he means they weren't
[28:29] Speaker 3: stone age people. And Hancock has said over and over
[28:33] Speaker 3: that they had kind of the same maritime culture as
[28:36] Speaker 3: maybe sixteen hundred and seventeen hundreds maritime culture had. I mean,
[28:43] Speaker 3: the Phoenicians in three thousand BC could sail all over
[28:47] Speaker 3: the Mediterranean, and they went up and down the coast
[28:49] Speaker 3: of Africa. They made it to the Canary Islands in
[28:53] Speaker 3: the Atlantic Ocean, and that is basically what the kind
[28:57] Speaker 3: of culture that I think it was. I believe there
[29:00] Speaker 3: was a maritime culture that existed before the end of
[29:04] Speaker 3: the Last Ice Age. Another piece of this people think that, well,
[29:10] Speaker 3: they couldn't have possibly gone across the oceans, think about
[29:13] Speaker 3: bad weather and all that. During the Last Ice Age,
[29:17] Speaker 3: when the sea levels were much much lower and the
[29:21] Speaker 3: atmosphere in the north was much much colder, the seas
[29:26] Speaker 3: were much calmer, the weather was much calmer, and it
[29:30] Speaker 3: was a lot easier to sail. We know that people
[29:35] Speaker 3: got to I had to move to the Pacific now
[29:38] Speaker 3: and the South Pacific. People got to the Australia, Australia
[29:43] Speaker 3: Islands and New Zealand, Micronesia and Melanesia probably around one
[29:49] Speaker 3: hundred thousand BC. We know now that some of those
[29:55] Speaker 3: people went from there to South America. How do we
[30:01] Speaker 3: know that from genetics in South America? There are tribes
[30:08] Speaker 3: in South America. This is done by mainstream geneticists and anthropologists.
[30:13] Speaker 3: Tribes in South America that are a direct genetic link
[30:19] Speaker 3: to tribes in New Zealand and indigenous cultures in Australia
[30:24] Speaker 3: and a lot of the other islands. There's only one
[30:26] Speaker 3: way they could have gotten here. Now, all you would
[30:29] Speaker 3: have had to do then was get on a raft
[30:32] Speaker 3: and take about a thirty day just sitting a raft
[30:34] Speaker 3: for thirty days, and you would go from Australia and
[30:38] Speaker 3: wind up along the coast of Chile. And these people
[30:42] Speaker 3: had the ability to live off the ocean, collect rainwater
[30:45] Speaker 3: or whatever. So there is other research in South America
[30:50] Speaker 3: that's been around a long time. They know that it
[30:53] Speaker 3: was inhabited at least by fifty thousand BC. There are
[30:58] Speaker 3: several sites in South America, including one in Mexico at
[31:04] Speaker 3: date to two one hundred and fifty thousand years ago.
[31:09] Speaker 3: The one in Mexico, the research was it's very close
[31:12] Speaker 3: to Mexico City. The research was actually done by the
[31:16] Speaker 3: US Geological Survey and they actually published the results. But
[31:21] Speaker 3: mainstream archaeology hates that and of course they don't believe
[31:25] Speaker 3: any of it. They say, oh, this research is flawed.
[31:28] Speaker 3: So a couple of years ago, about three years ago,
[31:30] Speaker 3: research was done in California where before this was done,
[31:36] Speaker 3: Louis B. Leakey had found that in this area in California,
[31:40] Speaker 3: near San Diego. There was evidence that people had inhabited
[31:46] Speaker 3: it two hundred thousand years ago in California. So three
[31:52] Speaker 3: years ago another study came out in a mainstream archaeology
[31:57] Speaker 3: journal saying that it's pretty clear that there were people
[32:00] Speaker 3: in this area not too far from San Diego one
[32:04] Speaker 3: hundred and thirty three thousand years ago. Now they didn't
[32:07] Speaker 3: go any layers deeper. When they found this one hundred
[32:09] Speaker 3: and thirty three thousand year old layer, they pretty much stopped.
[32:13] Speaker 3: So there may be more below it. Of course, it's
[32:15] Speaker 3: all controversial in mainstream archaeology, but the evidence is getting
[32:20] Speaker 3: more and more clear. So Plato said that if you
[32:25] Speaker 3: got out into the true Ocean, the Atlantic Ocean, through
[32:29] Speaker 3: the Straits of Gibraltar, which were called the Pillars of Hercules,
[32:33] Speaker 3: he said, you could hop from island to island until
[32:37] Speaker 3: you reached the opposite continent and somewhere there, somewhere, He
[32:43] Speaker 3: said that Atlantis had had a main island. People all
[32:48] Speaker 3: the time look for this tiny little circular island, you know,
[32:52] Speaker 3: call it Atlantis. Well that what they're looking for is
[32:56] Speaker 3: the center city of Atlantis, which Plato said it was
[33:01] Speaker 3: a It was built on the southern end of an
[33:05] Speaker 3: island that was roughly three hundred and fifty miles long
[33:09] Speaker 3: and two hundred and forty miles wide, which, of course
[33:12] Speaker 3: it couldn't have been the island of Theira or Santorini,
[33:17] Speaker 3: which is in the Mediterranean, which mainstream market Aloe said, oh,
[33:20] Speaker 3: that must be Atlantis, because it's a circle, which is ridiculous,
[33:23] Speaker 3: and it blew up in six hundred or so four
[33:26] Speaker 3: hundred and so BC, and then Plato used that as
[33:29] Speaker 3: his idea for Atlantis. But Plato said that it was
[33:33] Speaker 3: on this giant island and that it was this circular
[33:37] Speaker 3: formation that was on the southern end of the island,
[33:41] Speaker 3: and it was called a circular formation because they made
[33:44] Speaker 3: circuit a set of circular canals, and then there was
[33:48] Speaker 3: a six mile river that went to the ocean on
[33:51] Speaker 3: the southern end of the island. He also said it
[33:53] Speaker 3: had two growing seasons and so on, and the only
[33:57] Speaker 3: area that really fits that at that time frame, the
[33:59] Speaker 3: only area you could zero in and say, well, two
[34:02] Speaker 3: growing seasons in ten thousand BC during the Ice Age,
[34:07] Speaker 3: there's no way it could be in the Mediterranean. They
[34:09] Speaker 3: didn't have two growing seasons. That it was not a
[34:12] Speaker 3: temperate area. It wasn't iced over. People have said, oh,
[34:16] Speaker 3: it might be England or Doggarland. No, that was covered
[34:18] Speaker 3: in ice sheets in ten thousand BC. So it had
[34:22] Speaker 3: to be like in the Caribbean or in the Atlantic Ocean.
[34:27] Speaker 3: There there's no other place. Cuba is where Andrew Collins
[34:31] Speaker 3: has asserted where it probably was. Agar Casey didn't say
[34:36] Speaker 3: where the center city was in his readings, but Egar
[34:40] Speaker 3: Casey said that there were people from Atlantis that lived
[34:44] Speaker 3: up and down the eastern coast of what was then
[34:47] Speaker 3: what now is the United States. But he said that
[34:51] Speaker 3: a lot of it went under because the sea levels
[34:54] Speaker 3: rose three to four hundred feet and it covered miles
[34:58] Speaker 3: and miles and that's why we we can't find many
[35:02] Speaker 3: remnants of it. It's all underwater. Back then, where does
[35:05] Speaker 3: a maritime culture live? Where do they put their seaports?
[35:08] Speaker 3: Right along the ocean? Yeah, that's where it is. They
[35:12] Speaker 3: didn't put it in the middle. You know, archaeologists as well,
[35:15] Speaker 3: we can't find any of this. You know, there's an archaeologist,
[35:18] Speaker 3: a well known skeptic that is in Connecticut who I know,
[35:23] Speaker 3: and we've interacted some. We've had a lot of email
[35:26] Speaker 3: exchanges over the years, and he goes out in Connecticut
[35:31] Speaker 3: and says, I don't see any evidence of Atlanta's here. No,
[35:33] Speaker 3: there's not. Because the evidence of Atlantis if you go
[35:35] Speaker 3: to the coast and you look down three to four
[35:37] Speaker 3: hundred feet and maybe go a little further south away
[35:41] Speaker 3: from where the ice sheets were, because he's up where
[35:44] Speaker 3: the ice sheets were, go down to the Florida coast
[35:46] Speaker 3: or maybe north or South Carolina. I suspect three to
[35:50] Speaker 3: hundred three or four hundred feet on the shelf, the
[35:53] Speaker 3: continental shelf, you will find something. But of course it's
[35:58] Speaker 3: all under ten thousand years of Selton sand and so on.
[36:02] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[36:03] Speaker 1: Now, so you've mentioned Edgar Casey. Speaking of him, he
[36:07] Speaker 1: gave a large amount of readings between nineteen twenty five
[36:11] Speaker 1: and nineteen forty four that actually provided information about the
[36:15] Speaker 1: mound builders. Could you tell us a little bit about
[36:18] Speaker 1: some of the information that he came out with.
[36:20] Speaker 3: Sure, well, Casey said in the nineteen twenties, this is
[36:24] Speaker 3: kind of weird. Even when I did the interview with
[36:27] Speaker 3: his grandson, Edgar Evans Casey, who I asked his grandson
[36:33] Speaker 3: are actually one of his grandson? I asked his son
[36:37] Speaker 3: his grandson was actually the head of the Casey organization
[36:40] Speaker 3: for some years, but his actual old his youngest son.
[36:45] Speaker 3: His name was Edgar Evans Casey. And I interviewed Edgar
[36:49] Speaker 3: Evans in when he was ninety three, and Edgar Evans
[36:55] Speaker 3: said that, yeah, we used to talk about mounds a
[36:57] Speaker 3: lot because they had lived in Selma, Alabama for a while,
[37:02] Speaker 3: where there were a lot of mounds. They lived in
[37:05] Speaker 3: Kentucky where there are a lot of mounds, and they
[37:08] Speaker 3: moved around in the South where loads and loads of
[37:12] Speaker 3: mounds were. He said, yeah, we used to talk about him.
[37:15] Speaker 3: And he said, well, he said, archaeology has always said
[37:18] Speaker 3: that mound building began in the north. Again, that's what
[37:22] Speaker 3: the nineteen eighties, that's what they said. Oh A, mounds
[37:24] Speaker 3: always started up in the northeast, and then they started
[37:28] Speaker 3: they moved down to Ohio, and then eventually it came
[37:32] Speaker 3: down to the south. And I remember Edgar Evans, it
[37:35] Speaker 3: was very very interesting the way he said it. He said, well,
[37:40] Speaker 3: Dad always said that mound building began in the south
[37:44] Speaker 3: and went north. And he said, I know that that's
[37:47] Speaker 3: not what anybody believes. That that's what Dad said, and
[37:50] Speaker 3: that's what's in the Casey Readings. Casey said that mound
[37:55] Speaker 3: building began in the Americas the Atlanteans who were already
[38:03] Speaker 3: here and who migrated here after the destruction of Atlantis,
[38:08] Speaker 3: and they were also people that came from the South Pacific.
[38:12] Speaker 3: Casey talked about migrations from the South Pacific that occurred
[38:19] Speaker 3: starting in fifty thousand BC, which is interesting since that's
[38:24] Speaker 3: what the geneticists now tell us people came, and he
[38:27] Speaker 3: said that around nineteen thirty six or so in his
[38:31] Speaker 3: readings that lots of people came here from the South
[38:35] Speaker 3: Pacific in fifty thousand and he said the Atlanteans were
[38:40] Speaker 3: already here, but in ten thousand BC, before the final
[38:44] Speaker 3: destruction of Atlantis, loads of them went to the northeast
[38:49] Speaker 3: and they became the Iroquois. Casey was very specific, saying
[38:55] Speaker 3: that the Atlanteans were the red races the term he used.
[39:01] Speaker 3: They were the Native Americans, and he said the people
[39:05] Speaker 3: that lived in South America, the cultures there, the indigenous
[39:10] Speaker 3: people and those in the Southwest, came from the indigenous
[39:17] Speaker 3: peoples in the South Pacific, and some came from the
[39:24] Speaker 3: area across Beringia. He actually said that a lot of
[39:27] Speaker 3: them came from Siberia, and he said that the mounds
[39:33] Speaker 3: were replicas of their experiences in Atlantis, and Limeria was
[39:42] Speaker 3: the term or MoU was the term that he applied
[39:46] Speaker 3: to the South Pacific islands, and he said that Limiria
[39:51] Speaker 3: also included a part of the southwestern United States and
[39:56] Speaker 3: bits of California. Now again, all this was before we
[40:00] Speaker 3: knew any of these weird dates that have started coming
[40:03] Speaker 3: out in these areas. He said they were mainly the Limyrians,
[40:07] Speaker 3: and back then, of course, colors and races were often used,
[40:11] Speaker 3: and he said that they were basically the brown race.
[40:16] Speaker 3: They were a brown race, and the Native Americans were
[40:21] Speaker 3: a red race. But the red race were the Atlanteans.
[40:25] Speaker 3: The brown race were the Limyrians, and they mixed together.
[40:30] Speaker 3: They began to intermarry, and they mixed together and eventually
[40:35] Speaker 3: became much more homogeneous. But they began, but the mounds
[40:40] Speaker 3: were began as replicas of their experiences and what they
[40:46] Speaker 3: had built in the parts of Limyria and Atlantis which
[40:50] Speaker 3: were destroyed during the cataclysms that occurred during three time periods.
[40:58] Speaker 3: He gave three very specif dates where destructions occurred. The
[41:03] Speaker 3: earliest of those dates was fifty thousand BC, which now
[41:08] Speaker 3: we know there were some very bad disturbances around the
[41:13] Speaker 3: world around fifty thousand BC. The second destruction, he said,
[41:18] Speaker 3: was around twenty eight thousand BC, but that was more
[41:21] Speaker 3: localized and that actually occurred mainly in the Caribbean. And
[41:26] Speaker 3: the third destruction was pretty much worldwide, and that was
[41:29] Speaker 3: caused by an inundation of water, and that occurred in
[41:35] Speaker 3: ten thousand BC. So that was Casey's timeline for all this.
[41:41] Speaker 1: Now I want to go back to Louisiana for a
[41:42] Speaker 1: bit and talk about Poverty Point. I went visit Poverty Point,
[41:47] Speaker 1: and I went visit the mounds at LSU and Poverty
[41:49] Speaker 1: Point is one of the most impressive locations as far
[41:53] Speaker 1: as the construction.
[41:56] Speaker 2: Tell us a little bit about what you.
[41:57] Speaker 1: Learned about this to age and some of the more
[41:59] Speaker 1: inch interesting aspects about this location.
[42:03] Speaker 3: Well, Poverty Point, according to mainstream archaeology, began around the
[42:08] Speaker 3: year eighteen hundred to seventeen hundred BC, so that would
[42:15] Speaker 3: be thirty eight to thirty seven hundred years ago. That's
[42:20] Speaker 3: mainstream arching. That's what you'll see if you go to
[42:22] Speaker 3: Wikipedia or if you go to other mainstream articles. That's
[42:25] Speaker 3: what you'll see. There are some archaeologists, including one who
[42:30] Speaker 3: I talked with at length, who gave me an unpublished paper.
[42:34] Speaker 3: They could not get it published. Wherein they had dated
[42:39] Speaker 3: the large bird effigy there, which I haven't described yet
[42:42] Speaker 3: at Poverty Point to thirty eight hundred BC, and he
[42:47] Speaker 3: said that date was so far out they would not
[42:50] Speaker 3: publish those results. So okay. So Poverty Point, according to
[42:56] Speaker 3: the mainstream, began around the year eighteen hundred seventeen hundred BC.
[43:02] Speaker 3: Where it came from, they don't know, although there is
[43:07] Speaker 3: a very strong suspect that it came from the ole
[43:12] Speaker 3: Mech culture in the Yucatan Peninsula part of Mexico. The
[43:17] Speaker 3: ol met culture built structures very similar to the way
[43:21] Speaker 3: Poverty Point was made. There's also other mound sites in
[43:26] Speaker 3: North America that are believed to have a Mexican influence.
[43:30] Speaker 3: Most of them are in Georgia and in Florida. For example,
[43:35] Speaker 3: the Crystal River site in Florida is believed to have
[43:39] Speaker 3: what they would call a Mexican cultural influence. They don't
[43:42] Speaker 3: like to narrow it down.
[43:43] Speaker 1: So let me ask you, based on some of the
[43:45] Speaker 1: historical information that's presented about Poverty point. It says that
[43:50] Speaker 1: the Edena was the primary tribe there. Is that not
[43:53] Speaker 1: something you subscribe to.
[43:55] Speaker 3: No, I hadn't. No, No, it dates to the Adena era.
[44:00] Speaker 2: Mm hmm uh.
[44:00] Speaker 3: But the Adena era, the let me think about the
[44:05] Speaker 3: the most the southernmost Adena mound that I'm aware of
[44:10] Speaker 3: would probably be in Uh. I don't know of any
[44:14] Speaker 3: Adena era mounds in Louisiana, although they're the mounds in
[44:21] Speaker 3: Louisiana are older than any Adena mounds. But the oldest,
[44:25] Speaker 3: the southernmost Adena mound as far as I know of,
[44:28] Speaker 3: would be in maybe parts of northern Alabama. But I'm
[44:34] Speaker 3: not really I'm not really certain about that. There are
[44:37] Speaker 3: some in Tennessee. Uh, but that's about as far south
[44:41] Speaker 3: as the Adena. God. The Adena were really centered in
[44:43] Speaker 3: Ohio and Kentucky. Uh. There were Adena mounds in Pennsylvania,
[44:48] Speaker 3: for example.
[44:49] Speaker 4: Uh.
[44:50] Speaker 3: The largest Adena mound was on the Ohio River near Pittsburgh.
[44:55] Speaker 3: But anyway, No, I wouldn't say the Adena were Poverty Point.
[45:00] Speaker 3: Poverty Point is kind of an outlier. It seems to
[45:04] Speaker 3: have come from nowhere, and initially they believe it just
[45:08] Speaker 3: kind of sprung up from nowhere, and it is bizarre
[45:11] Speaker 3: it's very difficult to describe what the Poverty Point Mound
[45:16] Speaker 3: is like. It's almost as hard as trying to describe
[45:20] Speaker 3: what the site in Newark, Ohio was like, because Poverty
[45:24] Speaker 3: Point has geometric earthworks, and the geometric earthworks are comprised
[45:33] Speaker 3: of six concentric sea shaped terraces, elevated terraces. And when
[45:41] Speaker 3: I say they're sea shaped, they literally are like half
[45:44] Speaker 3: an oval, and there's six of them. They're all about
[45:51] Speaker 3: eighty feet wide there. Now they believe they were about
[45:56] Speaker 3: eight feet tall originally, so they would be an eight
[45:59] Speaker 3: foot terraces eighty feet wide. Then you would have one
[46:04] Speaker 3: hundred and fifty feet of a depressed area, and then
[46:08] Speaker 3: you would have another terrace again about eight feet tall
[46:14] Speaker 3: and eighty feet wide, then another one hundred and fifty
[46:17] Speaker 3: feet of a depressed area, and the same thing. So
[46:20] Speaker 3: you had sticks of these terraces. Now, if you combined
[46:26] Speaker 3: the length of all six of these sea shaped terraces,
[46:31] Speaker 3: they would run for eight miles. Eight miles. I mean,
[46:36] Speaker 3: it's incredible. It's been calculated. It was twenty million baskets
[46:43] Speaker 3: of dirt it took to build those on top of
[46:47] Speaker 3: those terraces. Again, they're about eighty feet wide. On top
[46:52] Speaker 3: of the terraces. There were circular buildings built where people
[46:58] Speaker 3: lived apparently, and they found those circular buildings through postholes.
[47:04] Speaker 3: And there was a thirty five acre plaza area, so
[47:09] Speaker 3: the sea kind of wrapped partly around this thirty acre
[47:13] Speaker 3: thirty five acre plaza area. Within the plaza area, there
[47:19] Speaker 3: are walkways that cut through these sea shaped embankments, and
[47:25] Speaker 3: there were giant posts that were stuck in the ground
[47:30] Speaker 3: that were used for alignments. Now the only mainstream accepted alignments.
[47:37] Speaker 3: Their astronomical alignments are to the equinoxes, the rising and
[47:42] Speaker 3: setting of the sun at the equinoxes, and I would
[47:45] Speaker 3: suspect they would also accept that there are alignments to
[47:51] Speaker 3: the solstices too, but chances are there are probably alignments
[47:55] Speaker 3: to various stars. But that's not the most impress part
[48:00] Speaker 3: of poverty point. The sea shaped embankments are also linked
[48:06] Speaker 3: to what are five large mounds, the largest of which
[48:12] Speaker 3: is an enormous effigy of a bird. It is an
[48:17] Speaker 3: eagle effigy mound. It is believed to represent an eagle
[48:22] Speaker 3: with its wings outspread or spread out, laying on its back.
[48:29] Speaker 3: That's what it's believed to represent from the tip of
[48:33] Speaker 3: the tail to the top of the head. This mound
[48:38] Speaker 3: is seven hundred and twenty feet long from the wing
[48:44] Speaker 3: tip to wing tip. It is six hundred and forty
[48:48] Speaker 3: feet wide, and at the tallest point it's almost seventy
[48:54] Speaker 3: two feet tall, the height of a seven story building.
[48:59] Speaker 3: So it is and enormous mound. They don't know if
[49:04] Speaker 3: anything was ever built on it. Back in the eighties.
[49:07] Speaker 3: When I first went to it, it was covered with
[49:10] Speaker 3: trees and vegetation, very difficult to see, and I believe
[49:14] Speaker 3: it was two thousand and twelve or so they wound
[49:18] Speaker 3: up cutting off all the trees and now sow it's
[49:20] Speaker 3: totally exposed, and actually did that to stop erosion. And
[49:25] Speaker 3: it was during that process when they were cutting down
[49:30] Speaker 3: the trees that they took some more samples core samples
[49:33] Speaker 3: from the mound, and that's when they carbon dated some
[49:37] Speaker 3: of the samples and they got the date from the mound,
[49:41] Speaker 3: the thirty eight hundred BC date, which matches another site
[49:45] Speaker 3: that is about two miles south of Poverty Point. Because
[49:49] Speaker 3: this guy's very confusing, there's a site two miles south
[49:53] Speaker 3: that was on what is called the Jackson Farm and
[49:56] Speaker 3: it's called the Lower Jackson Mound. And the only reason
[49:59] Speaker 3: the the Lower Jackson Mound still exists is because the
[50:02] Speaker 3: Jackson family put a historic cemetery on the top of it.
[50:06] Speaker 3: That's where their family cemetery is, so it wasn't destroyed
[50:10] Speaker 3: and it dates to thirty eight hundred PC. And so
[50:13] Speaker 3: it's interesting that the cores that were taken from this
[50:16] Speaker 3: giant mound at Poverty Point went to thirty eight hundred BC.
[50:20] Speaker 3: But archaeologists have always said, no, no, this can't date to that.
[50:24] Speaker 3: The rest of this site we know dates to about
[50:26] Speaker 3: eighteen hundred BC. So they never published the article, though
[50:29] Speaker 3: I have a pre print copy of it that says
[50:32] Speaker 3: thirty eight hundred BC. There's also another site that was
[50:35] Speaker 3: right in the middle of the Jackson farm, which is
[50:40] Speaker 3: called the it's called the Jackson site. So you have
[50:46] Speaker 3: the Lower Jackson site and you have the Jackson site,
[50:49] Speaker 3: and it had a C shaped earthwork and it was
[50:52] Speaker 3: simply obliterated. I was obliterated by Clarence Bloomfield Moore, who
[50:56] Speaker 3: also excavated the Poverty Point mata. Most people don't know this.
[51:01] Speaker 3: In the very early nineteen hundreds, Clarence bloom Fort Bloomfield
[51:06] Speaker 3: More excavated down about fifteen to twenty feet into the
[51:11] Speaker 3: giant bird effigy mound at Poverty Point gave up there
[51:15] Speaker 3: was just too big, but he accumulated tens of thousands
[51:20] Speaker 3: of the artifacts there from just laying all around, and
[51:25] Speaker 3: if you go into the museum there you see all
[51:27] Speaker 3: these bizarre artifacts recovered there. Most people don't know over
[51:32] Speaker 3: two million artifacts were picked up around the Poverty Point site.
[51:39] Speaker 3: Two million and they haven't even really dug down much
[51:42] Speaker 3: there and hasn't really been excavated that much. It was
[51:46] Speaker 3: farmed for over one hundred and fifty years, so a
[51:49] Speaker 3: lot of these terraces that were plowed over and over,
[51:53] Speaker 3: they've reduced from what they were, the eight feet in
[51:56] Speaker 3: height down quite a bit. So Poverty Point was for
[51:59] Speaker 3: a long time considered the first mound site in America.
[52:04] Speaker 3: It just seemed to come from nowhere. But it's still
[52:07] Speaker 3: an anomaly. This is all very, very strange, and it's
[52:12] Speaker 3: just been made more strange because all these old mounds
[52:17] Speaker 3: are in Louisiana, and that doesn't make a lot of
[52:21] Speaker 3: sense archaeologically. Although probably a lot of these very early
[52:26] Speaker 3: cultures came up from South and Central America. That's the
[52:30] Speaker 3: only thing that makes sense here.
[52:32] Speaker 1: Could it be possible that these ancient cultures might have
[52:37] Speaker 1: been of taller stature than your average human now seven
[52:42] Speaker 1: to eight maybe taller they were considered giants possibly.
[52:47] Speaker 3: Well, as you well know, I've done a lot of
[52:50] Speaker 3: the background research in that. Andrew and Collins and I
[52:53] Speaker 3: published a couple of books. One was called Path of Souls.
[52:57] Speaker 3: Also the book Denisovan Origins and Origins of the Gods.
[53:01] Speaker 3: We discussed this. One of the things that we did
[53:04] Speaker 3: was read the two Smithsonian reports, one of which was
[53:08] Speaker 3: in eighteen ninety four, and I believe the other one
[53:10] Speaker 3: was eighteen eighteen eighty seven, where the Smithsonian did their
[53:16] Speaker 3: mound survey project. The Smithsonian dug into over two thousand mounds,
[53:21] Speaker 3: it's believed to be three thousand mounds, trying to find
[53:25] Speaker 3: out the origin of the mound builders. That's why they
[53:28] Speaker 3: did this project. And in their studies and in their reports,
[53:34] Speaker 3: the Smithsonian reported finding seventeen large skeletons between seven feet
[53:43] Speaker 3: to the tallest one was seven feet eight inches in height.
[53:47] Speaker 3: All of that is reported in the mainstream archaeological publications
[53:53] Speaker 3: by the Smithsonian's Bureau of Ethnology. Since that time, the
[54:00] Speaker 3: Smithsonian and other archaeologists publishing for the hay Foundation, for
[54:06] Speaker 3: the Carnegie Institute for Harvard University, and many other mainstream publications.
[54:15] Speaker 3: There have been about twenty to thirty archaeological publications in
[54:19] Speaker 3: those various journals other than the Smithsonians, where they've found
[54:24] Speaker 3: another fifteen to twenty very large skeletons anywhere from six
[54:31] Speaker 3: feet seven inches in height to seven seven and a
[54:36] Speaker 3: half feet tall. These are all mainstream reports, but that's
[54:40] Speaker 3: as big as it gets in mainstream archaeology. There are
[54:43] Speaker 3: hundreds to a couple thousand newspaper articles that, of course
[54:49] Speaker 3: claim that skeletons that were ten feet in length, twelve
[54:54] Speaker 3: feet even a few that are larger than that. There
[54:57] Speaker 3: are a number of like I said, a number of
[54:59] Speaker 3: newspaper are articles that say that. Andrew Collins and I
[55:02] Speaker 3: tried to run down a lot of those reports, since
[55:05] Speaker 3: a lot of those talked about the mainstream archaeological publications.
[55:11] Speaker 3: What we really found for most of those that we
[55:14] Speaker 3: were able to run to the final source was this
[55:18] Speaker 3: that the newspaper reporters who wrote those articles never talked
[55:23] Speaker 3: to the actual excavators or the archaeologists. What they did
[55:28] Speaker 3: were talked to locals who had witnessed some of the excavations,
[55:33] Speaker 3: or they talked to a few of the locals who
[55:36] Speaker 3: had actually helped dig out the remains. Because when the
[55:39] Speaker 3: archaeologists came in, there was a guy named Clarence Bloomfield
[55:44] Speaker 3: Moore who dug into over three thousand mounds himself, more
[55:51] Speaker 3: than the Smithsonian did during its entire mound building project.
[55:58] Speaker 3: This one guy did. His goal was to dig into
[56:01] Speaker 3: every single mound along the rivers in the entire southeast
[56:07] Speaker 3: and he spent thirty years doing it, and he also
[56:11] Speaker 3: looked for giant skeletons. But anyway, we believe that what
[56:16] Speaker 3: happened was that at the sites where they found the
[56:20] Speaker 3: seven footers, a lot of the people who they hired
[56:24] Speaker 3: for a dollar a day. In most cases, that was
[56:28] Speaker 3: the feat. It was a dollar a day for somebody
[56:31] Speaker 3: that would dig. They simply exaggerated. That's what we believe this. Oh,
[56:36] Speaker 3: they were ten feet, but when you read the actual
[56:38] Speaker 3: archaeological reports reports, it might say seven feet two inches,
[56:44] Speaker 3: seven feet eight inches. There's a lot of newspaper articles,
[56:49] Speaker 3: for example, one in Pennsylvania. We actually went to the
[56:51] Speaker 3: place where this one was in Athens, Pennsylvania, where supposedly
[56:56] Speaker 3: a ten foot skeleton was found, and it's said that
[56:59] Speaker 3: some men this was the actual report, some men digging
[57:05] Speaker 3: a seller in Athens dug a ten foot skeleton out.
[57:10] Speaker 3: That's the report. So some men digging a seller somewhere
[57:17] Speaker 3: in Athens, and it's just not possible to run it down.
[57:20] Speaker 3: We could find nothing, but there's there's a couple thousand
[57:24] Speaker 3: of those newspaper reports. So what actually came of our
[57:29] Speaker 3: research is this A mainstream archaeologist whom I respect quite
[57:34] Speaker 3: a bit, who's a skeptic, had read our books and
[57:38] Speaker 3: he actually read our statistical evaluation of these very big skeletons,
[57:45] Speaker 3: virtually all of which were removed from a Dina mounds,
[57:49] Speaker 3: these conical burial mounds that go back to about five
[57:55] Speaker 3: hundred to a thousand BC, so they're pretty old. All
[58:00] Speaker 3: of these giant skeletons, with almost no exceptions that were
[58:05] Speaker 3: reported by mainstream archeologists, came from the Edena era mounds,
[58:11] Speaker 3: and I want to describe the tombs in a minute,
[58:14] Speaker 3: but we did a statistical analysis that showed that there
[58:17] Speaker 3: were way, way, way too many of these giant skeletons
[58:23] Speaker 3: out of these adena mounds to account for the population.
[58:28] Speaker 3: It's just there were too many of them. And so
[58:31] Speaker 3: he dubbed that the Edena elite hypothesis, with the idea
[58:37] Speaker 3: being that the Edena population were primarily comprised of exceedingly
[58:46] Speaker 3: tall people. Their rulers were these tall people, which then
[58:50] Speaker 3: Andrew Collins and I took that, and that's where our
[58:54] Speaker 3: book Denisovan Origins came from. That We believe that a
[58:59] Speaker 3: population called the Denisovans came here around eleven to fifteen
[59:07] Speaker 3: thousand BC, and that population were originally called the Solutreans
[59:14] Speaker 3: and they were in France and Portugal and Spain around
[59:19] Speaker 3: twenty thousand BC. And they made implements very much like
[59:25] Speaker 3: America's Clovis culture did. It gets very complicated, and even
[59:30] Speaker 3: if the tie in the time we have left, there's
[59:32] Speaker 3: no way to go through all that. But there's no
[59:36] Speaker 3: doubt there were a lot of seven footers here. But
[59:39] Speaker 3: in these Okay, so in these tombs, people think that, oh,
[59:43] Speaker 3: you know, they just stuck the body in and maybe
[59:46] Speaker 3: they covered it with something and then they put a
[59:48] Speaker 3: lot of dirt on it. No, they built these very
[59:52] Speaker 3: elaborate tombs. First, the tombs were either made from logs,
[59:58] Speaker 3: giant logs, and then they were roofed over, or they
[1:00:03] Speaker 3: were made from stone, and they would stack the stone beautifully.
[1:00:08] Speaker 3: It looked like good masonry work, dry masonry work. And
[1:00:13] Speaker 3: they would then cover these tombs with giant slabs of
[1:00:17] Speaker 3: stone and it kept them quite dry. And then they
[1:00:20] Speaker 3: would build enormous mounds, earthen mounds on top of these,
[1:00:26] Speaker 3: so you would never know that there's a tomb in
[1:00:29] Speaker 3: there at the base of it. And in some of
[1:00:32] Speaker 3: these it took a great deal of work. For example,
[1:00:35] Speaker 3: some of these were like fifty sixty feet they had
[1:00:38] Speaker 3: to dig down, dig a tunnel from the top fifty
[1:00:40] Speaker 3: to sixty feet down before they would hit these stone tombs. So,
[1:00:46] Speaker 3: I mean, it's an amazing culture, unappreciated by most Americans.
[1:00:51] Speaker 3: Unknown lots of reasons for that, one of which I
[1:00:55] Speaker 3: think we have sort of a cultural shame for destroy
[1:01:00] Speaker 3: this culture. There is no doubt that when America was discovered,
[1:01:06] Speaker 3: which is kind of funny to put it that way,
[1:01:09] Speaker 3: but that actually is what was in our textbooks when
[1:01:12] Speaker 3: I went to school. America was discovered in fourteen ninety two,
[1:01:15] Speaker 3: when Columbus sailed the ocean blue, which is kind of funny,
[1:01:19] Speaker 3: But at that time there were lots and lots of
[1:01:22] Speaker 3: people here with a very sophisticated culture.
[1:01:26] Speaker 1: Now, where do you think future discovery should go with this?
[1:01:29] Speaker 1: Do you think they should be excavated or do you
[1:01:31] Speaker 1: think they should be left and protected? Where do you
[1:01:35] Speaker 1: think we should go with future exploration of these mounds?
[1:01:40] Speaker 3: Well, for a lot of these sites, we have destroyed
[1:01:42] Speaker 3: so much. I would like I would love to see
[1:01:45] Speaker 3: America's mounds, particularly the geometric earthworks. I'd love to see
[1:01:50] Speaker 3: them all turned into parks that are beautifully maintained. There
[1:01:55] Speaker 3: are some that are that way, but they're still unknown
[1:01:59] Speaker 3: by the population. People go to Egypt, I mean, Egypt
[1:02:02] Speaker 3: has roughly one hundred and eight pyramids. That's it. It's true.
[1:02:06] Speaker 3: The Great Pyramid is amazing. It's true. The Temple of
[1:02:09] Speaker 3: Abidotes is amazing. All this the you know, it's amazing stuff.
[1:02:13] Speaker 3: I've been there. But if Kahokia, Illinois, where Monks Mound is,
[1:02:21] Speaker 3: Monk's Mound is one hundred feet tall, ten story building tall.
[1:02:25] Speaker 3: Its base of Monks Mound covers fourteen acres. Its base
[1:02:31] Speaker 3: is one acre larger than the Great Pyramid at Giza.
[1:02:35] Speaker 3: It's bigger, and Kahokia had one hundred and twenty mounds
[1:02:41] Speaker 3: one hundred and twenty. All of Egypt had one hundred
[1:02:44] Speaker 3: and roughly one hundred and eight pyramids. There's more mounds
[1:02:48] Speaker 3: of Kahokia than there Moundville, Alabama is just incredible. So
[1:02:53] Speaker 3: I would love to see all these sites turned into
[1:02:56] Speaker 3: parks and preserved, but it just won't happen. There's just
[1:02:59] Speaker 3: not much for it. We do not have much of
[1:03:03] Speaker 3: an appreciation for it. As far as more excavations go,
[1:03:09] Speaker 3: it doesn't matter what I think, because the laws are
[1:03:11] Speaker 3: pretty strict in this. We're gonna We're not gonna dig
[1:03:14] Speaker 3: into any more burial mounds. It's just not going to
[1:03:16] Speaker 3: be done. The only archaeological work that's done is when
[1:03:20] Speaker 3: we're building the road and they find they have to
[1:03:22] Speaker 3: look in the area first. It's called public archaeology. You
[1:03:25] Speaker 3: go win cultural. You have to do a cultural evaluation
[1:03:28] Speaker 3: to make sure this road isn't going to destroy anything,
[1:03:32] Speaker 3: So they look at they do a surface evaluation. It's
[1:03:35] Speaker 3: sometimes a surface excavation down to make sure when new
[1:03:38] Speaker 3: buildings are built, but mounds are being destroyed all the time,
[1:03:41] Speaker 3: even today, So I don't see a great deal of
[1:03:45] Speaker 3: future in North America. I think most of what's going
[1:03:49] Speaker 3: to occur here is genetic research, and the genetic research
[1:03:53] Speaker 3: is going to get more and more sophisticated. Right now
[1:03:57] Speaker 3: is so complicated that very very few people can truly
[1:04:00] Speaker 3: understand what the genetics are pointing to. Now, what the
[1:04:03] Speaker 3: genetics is telling us is that there were multiple groups
[1:04:07] Speaker 3: of people that came into the Americas, and the genetics
[1:04:11] Speaker 3: are very clear. The first ones were probably around fifty
[1:04:14] Speaker 3: thousand BC. Even mainstream archaeology today agrees that there were
[1:04:19] Speaker 3: people here, probably far before that, but the remnants of
[1:04:22] Speaker 3: them are gone, so there's no genetic trace of them anymore.
[1:04:26] Speaker 3: There is no genetic trace. I mean, even the oldest
[1:04:29] Speaker 3: burial known in the world, do you have any idea
[1:04:33] Speaker 3: how far it goes back? The oldest burial known in
[1:04:36] Speaker 3: the world.
[1:04:37] Speaker 2: How far is that?
[1:04:39] Speaker 3: It's only forty seven thousand BC. That's it, because when
[1:04:45] Speaker 3: you bury remains, they don't generally, if you're not very
[1:04:49] Speaker 3: very careful, they degrade. And that's in Africa, by the way,
[1:04:54] Speaker 3: that's the oldest one that is known. I better double
[1:04:57] Speaker 3: check I'm sorry, seventy eight thousand. So let me say
[1:05:01] Speaker 3: that again. The oldest burial known in the world goes
[1:05:06] Speaker 3: back to seventy eight thousand years ago and it's in Africa,
[1:05:10] Speaker 3: and that it's an intentional burial where a human being
[1:05:14] Speaker 3: in this case it was a child, was put into
[1:05:17] Speaker 3: a grave and covered and then carefully, you know, they
[1:05:20] Speaker 3: carefully marked it and so on. But that's it, and
[1:05:23] Speaker 3: it's because human remains just don't last very long. In
[1:05:27] Speaker 3: the Americas. The oldest we know again now or around
[1:05:30] Speaker 3: ten thousand BC, but it's very very rare. Most most
[1:05:35] Speaker 3: human the oldest remains that I know of that they
[1:05:38] Speaker 3: found actually are in the Yucatan and that goes back
[1:05:42] Speaker 3: to eleven thousand years ago. Those were found in the
[1:05:45] Speaker 3: Yucatan about eleven thousand years ago. So what do we do.
[1:05:48] Speaker 3: We do more genetics. Unfortunately, the Amazon is being uncovered.
[1:05:56] Speaker 3: I say unfortunate because it's not good for climate to
[1:06:00] Speaker 3: get rid of the rainforest. But the rainforest was not
[1:06:04] Speaker 3: natural to begin with. And again, very very few people
[1:06:09] Speaker 3: realized that it was a human made garden. Don't know
[1:06:15] Speaker 3: exactly when it was made. Most of these billage areas
[1:06:18] Speaker 3: that were there date back to about one thousand BC.
[1:06:23] Speaker 3: But the problem is they haven't actually dug lower yet.
[1:06:27] Speaker 3: And how many of those are there. There's like a
[1:06:29] Speaker 3: thousand villages they've found so far, and as they keep
[1:06:34] Speaker 3: getting rid of the forest there, they're finding more and
[1:06:38] Speaker 3: more of them. So how many are there, I don't know,
[1:06:42] Speaker 3: but ten you think about ten million people in the
[1:06:44] Speaker 3: Amazon at that time, that is more. There were more
[1:06:49] Speaker 3: people in the Americas when Columbus got here than there
[1:06:54] Speaker 3: were in all of Europe. And Kohokia, Illinois had a
[1:06:58] Speaker 3: greater popular at that time than did London, England. The
[1:07:04] Speaker 3: hook I had a population of fifty thousand people. Wow.
[1:07:09] Speaker 3: When when when the Spanish went into Mexico City which
[1:07:13] Speaker 3: then was called Teno Chito Lan, there were all there
[1:07:16] Speaker 3: were one hundred thousand soldiers there that the that the
[1:07:21] Speaker 3: Aztecs had there were two hundred and fifty thousand people
[1:07:24] Speaker 3: that lived there, and the Aztec army had one million
[1:07:30] Speaker 3: standing members.
[1:07:34] Speaker 2: It's incredible, it is incredible.
[1:07:36] Speaker 3: Yeah, we just ignore it.
[1:07:38] Speaker 1: Yeah, doctor Little, this was fantastic information.
[1:07:42] Speaker 2: I love having you on.
[1:07:44] Speaker 1: Before you head out, let the audience know where they
[1:07:46] Speaker 1: can find out more about you. To pick up your books.
[1:07:49] Speaker 1: If you have any social media, all the good stuff.
[1:07:52] Speaker 3: The best thing to do is to search for my
[1:07:55] Speaker 3: full name. Put in my middle initial. It is Gregory L.
[1:07:59] Speaker 3: Put the letter L in there in my middle initial,
[1:08:02] Speaker 3: little L. I ttl E. Do that. I'll pop up
[1:08:05] Speaker 3: on Google or whatever search engine you use. Twitter's the
[1:08:09] Speaker 3: best place to find me. I post tons of stuff
[1:08:12] Speaker 3: on mounds and archaeology on Twitter. That's the only thing
[1:08:16] Speaker 3: I post on Twitter. And all my books can be
[1:08:19] Speaker 3: found there in my profile. I don't want to go
[1:08:22] Speaker 3: through them. The archaeology books are easy to find, but
[1:08:25] Speaker 3: that's it. Go to Twitter, do my whole name and
[1:08:28] Speaker 3: you'll find me. It's always a pleasure, man.
[1:08:30] Speaker 1: Yes, always a pleasure. Thank you so much, Doctor Little.
[1:08:32] Speaker 1: Will do it again and until next time. Everyone, have
[1:08:35] Speaker 1: a wonderful evening. We'll talk again tomorrow. We'll see y'all
[1:08:39] Speaker 1: then today and welcome back to the show. Nick hayes
[1:08:46] Speaker 1: He is a UK based author and photographer who has
[1:08:49] Speaker 1: spent the last twelve years photographing and filming in the
[1:08:53] Speaker 1: infrared and ultraviolet parts of the electromagnetic spectrum, documenting the
[1:08:59] Speaker 1: stream invisible life forms, craft like objects and other phenomena.
[1:09:05] Speaker 1: That appear to exist beyond the range of human sight. Nick,
[1:09:09] Speaker 1: welcome back. How you doing very well?
[1:09:13] Speaker 4: Thank you, Chris Jah, thanks for having me back on
[1:09:14] Speaker 4: the show. It's great to be back on.
[1:09:16] Speaker 1: Yes, it's great to have you back. I'm very excited
[1:09:18] Speaker 1: to dive back into your work, which is surrounding the
[1:09:22] Speaker 1: invisible life forms in the sky that surround us at
[1:09:26] Speaker 1: all times. And you've discovered how to capture some of
[1:09:29] Speaker 1: these beings and entities with different photographic techniques and lenses.
[1:09:34] Speaker 1: And last time you were on, you shared some incredible images.
[1:09:37] Speaker 1: I'll be showing those overlaid over our conversation today, So
[1:09:41] Speaker 1: I can't wait to see and listen to what you
[1:09:44] Speaker 1: have today. Now for the audience that is listening, if
[1:09:47] Speaker 1: you would like to see the visuals, go check us
[1:09:50] Speaker 1: out on Rock Fin and Rumble and our website. You'll
[1:09:54] Speaker 1: be able to see it there as well. So, before
[1:09:56] Speaker 1: we get into this, it's been a while since you've
[1:09:59] Speaker 1: been on, find the audience just a little bit about
[1:10:02] Speaker 1: yourself and what brought you to this work and research.
[1:10:07] Speaker 4: Well you well, basically I might began this in two
[1:10:09] Speaker 4: thousand Christmas Christmas Day evening two thousand and eight, I
[1:10:14] Speaker 4: was walking my dogs and I saw a UFO had
[1:10:16] Speaker 4: an encounter with the UFO. It's a very misty night,
[1:10:19] Speaker 4: and I could hardly see the UFO it was. It
[1:10:22] Speaker 4: was a very misty night, and basically what I kept
[1:10:24] Speaker 4: seeing was like a glow, a warm glow, about two
[1:10:26] Speaker 4: hundred foot up in the air, and it was moving
[1:10:28] Speaker 4: about walking pace, and it just kept disappearing, and it
[1:10:33] Speaker 4: kept appearing again, and there seemed to be a band
[1:10:35] Speaker 4: of thicker sort of mist or fog, and all of
[1:10:38] Speaker 4: a sudden got could see it in all of its glory.
[1:10:42] Speaker 4: I saw like about four or five seconds of it,
[1:10:44] Speaker 4: and then it disappeared again. But it looked like at
[1:10:46] Speaker 4: first I thought it was a craft, but it actually
[1:10:49] Speaker 4: it looked like it was breathing. It looked like it
[1:10:51] Speaker 4: was alive. So I managed to capture a couple of
[1:10:54] Speaker 4: frames of it on the camera which I had. I
[1:10:56] Speaker 4: went back down and followed it. I got my camera
[1:10:58] Speaker 4: and went back home, managed to capture a few frames
[1:11:01] Speaker 4: of it, and I just didn't know what I'd seen,
[1:11:04] Speaker 4: because I thought you in UFOs were craft and nothing
[1:11:07] Speaker 4: else than craft. So I I just couldn't sleep for
[1:11:12] Speaker 4: six months. So I couldn't eat. I couldn't. It just
[1:11:14] Speaker 4: blew me away. It's like having a religious experience, and
[1:11:17] Speaker 4: I just wanted to know what it was. I just
[1:11:19] Speaker 4: couldn't get over the concept that it looked alive. It
[1:11:23] Speaker 4: was then that I discovered Trevor James Constable. He captured
[1:11:26] Speaker 4: similar living life forms in the in the infrared in
[1:11:29] Speaker 4: the desert of Mahve Desert of southern California back in
[1:11:33] Speaker 4: the nineteen fifties using infrared film. So I discovered his book,
[1:11:38] Speaker 4: The Cost Repulse of Life, and which came out in
[1:11:41] Speaker 4: nineteen seventy six. I got the two thousand and eight reissue,
[1:11:43] Speaker 4: and I later bought They Live in the Sky, which
[1:11:45] Speaker 4: was his earlier nineteen fifty eight book. So I sort
[1:11:49] Speaker 4: of took it from there. Early I realized that these
[1:11:51] Speaker 4: things were out there, and I've been lucky to see
[1:11:54] Speaker 4: one in you know, in the normal visual light. So
[1:11:58] Speaker 4: I said about trying to capture some more using some
[1:12:00] Speaker 4: of the techniques that he had in his book.
[1:12:05] Speaker 1: Right, Well, let's talk about some of the equipment and
[1:12:09] Speaker 1: techniques that you're actually using to capture these images.
[1:12:14] Speaker 4: Well, basically, yeah, yeah, I use this standard camera which
[1:12:17] Speaker 4: I sent away to be converted to infrared. They remove
[1:12:20] Speaker 4: the blocking filters out which block invisible light, and they
[1:12:24] Speaker 4: replace them either with clear quartz, which gives you full spectrum.
[1:12:28] Speaker 1: Now, can anyone have this done to their photographic equipment.
[1:12:31] Speaker 4: Yes, yes, there's several firms in the US. I mean
[1:12:34] Speaker 4: I send my to the US a couple of times camcorders. Yes.
[1:12:38] Speaker 4: So it becomes a full spectrum. So it now sees infrared, ultraviolet,
[1:12:41] Speaker 4: and visible LIGHTE spectrum. You can use filters to see
[1:12:46] Speaker 4: whichever part you want. So, for instance, you can use
[1:12:48] Speaker 4: an infrared pass filter which gets rid of the visible
[1:12:51] Speaker 4: light and ultra violet at least you were just infrared,
[1:12:54] Speaker 4: or you can have infrared and ultraviolet, or you can
[1:12:57] Speaker 4: have just ultra violet. But with the camera, I had
[1:13:00] Speaker 4: an infrared past filter put into the camera, so the
[1:13:02] Speaker 4: camera just sees infrared, a seven hundred and twenty animeter
[1:13:06] Speaker 4: one which sees just a bit of the barely visible
[1:13:09] Speaker 4: light that occurs just before the infrared. And that's good
[1:13:12] Speaker 4: for nighttime situations because you can see things like the lights,
[1:13:15] Speaker 4: you know, the light coming from street lands, and it
[1:13:17] Speaker 4: helps put pictures into more perspective. So I began just
[1:13:22] Speaker 4: using an infrared camera and began using a cloudbuster, which
[1:13:26] Speaker 4: was a device invented by doctor Wilhelm Reich, and that's
[1:13:29] Speaker 4: what Trevor Jones Constable used for attracting UFOs. I later
[1:13:33] Speaker 4: started using a Geiger counter because I found that a
[1:13:36] Speaker 4: Geiger counter could detect these things and also film in
[1:13:40] Speaker 4: the ultraviolet using camcorders, a full spectrum camcorder with an
[1:13:43] Speaker 4: ultraviolet filter on it which blocks the visible light spectrum
[1:13:46] Speaker 4: and the infrared, and it's almost a pure ultraviolet picture.
[1:13:52] Speaker 4: And I found by using the son obliteration technique using
[1:13:55] Speaker 4: the position of myself and the camcorder so that the
[1:13:58] Speaker 4: sun was trapped beyond the room. It makes what I
[1:14:01] Speaker 4: refer to as the elimination zone, and I zoom slightly
[1:14:05] Speaker 4: into the top of the roof, and it means that
[1:14:06] Speaker 4: you're already in focus and these things come by. When
[1:14:09] Speaker 4: they come by, you can capture them. There's a certain angle,
[1:14:12] Speaker 4: it's like a forty five degree angle, and as the
[1:14:15] Speaker 4: sun slowly rises, you've got to you've got to keep
[1:14:17] Speaker 4: adjusting it to keep the sun right behind the roof
[1:14:19] Speaker 4: so that it doesn't peek over completely.
[1:14:23] Speaker 1: Now you said you use a Geiger counter, and this
[1:14:25] Speaker 1: can detect when these things are in proximity.
[1:14:30] Speaker 4: Yeah, very much so. Yeah, they can detect sort of
[1:14:32] Speaker 4: entity type things at ground level. I mean, how I
[1:14:35] Speaker 4: explain it. Yeah, they What happens is when these things
[1:14:38] Speaker 4: come through the sky, even if they're at like a
[1:14:39] Speaker 4: thousand foot in the year, it seems to detect it.
[1:14:41] Speaker 4: You get a sudden burst. I mean I set it
[1:14:44] Speaker 4: for there's about normal background radiation which you get which
[1:14:48] Speaker 4: is about zero point nine micro servers per hour, but
[1:14:51] Speaker 4: a set point for NERO point two zero and higher,
[1:14:55] Speaker 4: and these things they give a brief, really quick hit
[1:14:58] Speaker 4: on the guide counter. Yeah, and you can catch things
[1:15:01] Speaker 4: at ground level. I've caught enteries and things that have
[1:15:04] Speaker 4: been I think when they manifest into this reality, albeit
[1:15:07] Speaker 4: still invisible, you can actually get a you know, some
[1:15:11] Speaker 4: kind of energies forms which seems to set the guide
[1:15:14] Speaker 4: counter off.
[1:15:15] Speaker 1: So you not only have have caught these entities in
[1:15:18] Speaker 1: the sky, you you can catch them on the surface
[1:15:20] Speaker 1: level as well.
[1:15:22] Speaker 4: That's right. Yeah, Yeah, I've captured them in the forested
[1:15:24] Speaker 4: wooded area at the bottom of my garden. I've got
[1:15:28] Speaker 4: research area which is about an acre of land which
[1:15:30] Speaker 4: is my garden. And it backs onto another area and
[1:15:33] Speaker 4: I film there. Well, I use the side of the
[1:15:36] Speaker 4: house to record in the ultra violet and then I
[1:15:40] Speaker 4: just with with the infrared camera. I just walk around
[1:15:43] Speaker 4: with a guide counter just take random photographs when I
[1:15:45] Speaker 4: get a hit.
[1:15:47] Speaker 2: Now, what about film?
[1:15:48] Speaker 1: Can is there any way to film these like a
[1:15:52] Speaker 1: movie camera?
[1:15:53] Speaker 2: Can? Can you catch these on on live action?
[1:15:58] Speaker 4: Yeah? I have done.
[1:15:59] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[1:15:59] Speaker 4: Basically of the things I caught, the fish like forms
[1:16:02] Speaker 4: and some of the other strange things which are in
[1:16:04] Speaker 4: my book ques Invisibles, they're actually taken from moving footage.
[1:16:08] Speaker 4: But very often these things will only appear. Even if
[1:16:10] Speaker 4: you're filming at one frame per so fifty frames per second,
[1:16:14] Speaker 4: these things will often only appear in one frame, maybe two,
[1:16:17] Speaker 4: maybe three. They seem to be traveling really really fast
[1:16:20] Speaker 4: on some kind of etheric flow which seems to go
[1:16:22] Speaker 4: from west to east, which I discovered, well, I mean
[1:16:25] Speaker 4: I didn't. We discovered it during my work by Dr
[1:16:28] Speaker 4: Reich also speculated about this flow. He found there's a
[1:16:32] Speaker 4: west to east flow in this part of the world,
[1:16:35] Speaker 4: and they seem to be riding on it or caught
[1:16:37] Speaker 4: up on it. These are the things that I've captured
[1:16:40] Speaker 4: the fish like forms in the ultra violets.
[1:16:42] Speaker 1: Is it that they're they're flowing with some sort of
[1:16:45] Speaker 1: invisible plasma phores.
[1:16:48] Speaker 4: It seems to be. Yeah, it seems to be a
[1:16:50] Speaker 4: really fast moving well, it's like a force basically. Yeah. Yeah,
[1:16:55] Speaker 4: it seems to it almost like an invisible river that
[1:16:57] Speaker 4: they're flowing on and they're only visible just as they
[1:17:01] Speaker 4: hit the sunlight at a certain angle.
[1:17:03] Speaker 1: Besides the Geiger counter, is there any other types of
[1:17:08] Speaker 1: detection techniques that you would use to notify you that
[1:17:12] Speaker 1: these entities are around?
[1:17:14] Speaker 4: You can use things like AMF meters that detect fluctuations
[1:17:19] Speaker 4: in the electromagnetic field. Because and what basically is the
[1:17:23] Speaker 4: group from Italy that I got into that were active
[1:17:25] Speaker 4: during the late seventies early eighties and the GRCU now,
[1:17:28] Speaker 4: they used a whole range of different detection devices. They
[1:17:31] Speaker 4: used light and heat detectors, they used infrared and ultraviolet sectors.
[1:17:35] Speaker 4: They also used they measured AMF detectors using measuring fluctuations
[1:17:41] Speaker 4: in the magnetic field and Geiger counters. And they mainly
[1:17:44] Speaker 4: did their work at night, but they captured some great footage.
[1:17:47] Speaker 4: Some of that is on my website and also in
[1:17:50] Speaker 4: the paper that I did. If people were interested in this,
[1:17:53] Speaker 4: they can look at the I did a two part
[1:17:54] Speaker 4: paper co wrote it and that's got the best evidence
[1:17:57] Speaker 4: from Trevor James Constable, from myself and from the GS you.
[1:18:01] Speaker 4: We did it in defensive Constable's work. So if you
[1:18:04] Speaker 4: can put the link to that on the show, people
[1:18:06] Speaker 4: can see that for themselves and get an idea of
[1:18:08] Speaker 4: the sort of things that you can capture out there.
[1:18:12] Speaker 2: YEA, what go ahead, but.
[1:18:15] Speaker 4: It takes a lot of patience. I mean I sometimes
[1:18:17] Speaker 4: go out there. Well not so much now because I've
[1:18:19] Speaker 4: got a few back problems, but at one point I
[1:18:21] Speaker 4: was out there sort of five six seven days a
[1:18:23] Speaker 4: week for sett anything up to seven hours. And the
[1:18:25] Speaker 4: thing is, when you're filming at fifty fames a second,
[1:18:28] Speaker 4: that's three thousand frames a minute, and some of these
[1:18:31] Speaker 4: things only appear on one or two frames and you
[1:18:34] Speaker 4: get a guide counter here, but by the time you've
[1:18:36] Speaker 4: recognized it, you know hundreds of frames have gone by,
[1:18:38] Speaker 4: so you have to roughly note where that was. Then
[1:18:41] Speaker 4: you've got to go back through and through the footage
[1:18:43] Speaker 4: and find it. So you know, with the infrared it's
[1:18:49] Speaker 4: normally more instantaneous. When you're taking a photograph, you get
[1:18:52] Speaker 4: the hit and you take photos in the direction that
[1:18:54] Speaker 4: the Geiga country is aiming and just hope you capture something,
[1:18:58] Speaker 4: whether that be really high in the sky or ground level.
[1:19:02] Speaker 4: Did a feel for it? After a while, you also
[1:19:04] Speaker 4: get like a feeling. I mean, some of the entities
[1:19:06] Speaker 4: I've photographed, I could sense they were there, and I've
[1:19:09] Speaker 4: got a real sudden feeling of dread and in the
[1:19:11] Speaker 4: exact time the character has gone off.
[1:19:13] Speaker 1: Have some of these entities, did you get a sense
[1:19:16] Speaker 1: of intelligence or even have any of them seemed to
[1:19:20] Speaker 1: interact in any way or that when they are aware
[1:19:24] Speaker 1: of you? Have any of them been aware of you
[1:19:27] Speaker 1: in any way?
[1:19:29] Speaker 3: Oh?
[1:19:29] Speaker 4: Definitely, yeah, yeah, because I took photos in the But
[1:19:33] Speaker 4: what I did was walk around. What happened was basically,
[1:19:35] Speaker 4: my cat, Roy died and I buried my cat, and
[1:19:38] Speaker 4: I went out every night and started taking photographs long
[1:19:40] Speaker 4: infrared exposures of fifteen seconds or more in total darkness
[1:19:44] Speaker 4: at his grave site. I was asking if you could
[1:19:47] Speaker 4: give me a sign he was still around, And that's
[1:19:49] Speaker 4: how I caught that snakelike entity that oh yes, yes,
[1:19:52] Speaker 4: whole grave. And then after that I noticed that every
[1:19:55] Speaker 4: time I walked past the greenhouse, I suddenly get a
[1:19:58] Speaker 4: hit on the guigecounter. So I just I did as
[1:20:00] Speaker 4: it was so dark to use an infrared camera with
[1:20:03] Speaker 4: a standard flash on it. So what I did the
[1:20:05] Speaker 4: moment I walked past the greenhouse, I've got the hits
[1:20:08] Speaker 4: on the guide counter, and I instantaneously took photographs straight
[1:20:11] Speaker 4: into the greenhouse, and I was using the I found
[1:20:14] Speaker 4: that the normal standard flash is enough to light up
[1:20:17] Speaker 4: the greenhouse and light up the area around these entities
[1:20:19] Speaker 4: and show them make them appear in the infrared. So
[1:20:22] Speaker 4: they were definitely appearing for me because it was every
[1:20:24] Speaker 4: time I walked past, I'd suddenly get the hits on
[1:20:26] Speaker 4: the guide counter and I just instantaneously take photographs and
[1:20:30] Speaker 4: I captured four of them. One looked like an et,
[1:20:34] Speaker 4: one was a ghostly kind of figure, and one looked
[1:20:37] Speaker 4: like it was like almost like a cat, like being
[1:20:40] Speaker 4: really dark. They didn't reflect light. It's a really dark
[1:20:43] Speaker 4: look like he had horns, and it adds some kind
[1:20:45] Speaker 4: of sitting on its knee. And then the other photograph
[1:20:48] Speaker 4: of caused it's really weird looking head with a really
[1:20:50] Speaker 4: big mouth and big teeth and really freaky looking things.
[1:20:56] Speaker 4: And that's where it all started going a bit weird.
[1:20:57] Speaker 4: I started getting hearing footsteps in my room then and
[1:21:00] Speaker 4: hearing the voice called, and my sister would hear her voice,
[1:21:03] Speaker 4: her name called. When the doorbell started ringing at three
[1:21:07] Speaker 4: o'clock in the morning, and we're not out on the
[1:21:09] Speaker 4: main road, you know, We've got like a gated area
[1:21:11] Speaker 4: to come in, so there's nobody going to be walking
[1:21:13] Speaker 4: around our premises at three in the morning. Plus the
[1:21:16] Speaker 4: lights didn't trigger I'm around the house, so they were
[1:21:21] Speaker 4: definitely interacting, you know, showed me they were there. I
[1:21:23] Speaker 4: could feel they with that.
[1:21:25] Speaker 1: So it's possible that what you're interacting with is not
[1:21:28] Speaker 1: only would people may consider extraterrestrials, but possibly spirit realm
[1:21:34] Speaker 1: entities or interdimensional beings or something that we would consider
[1:21:39] Speaker 1: more of a metaphysical type entity, right.
[1:21:44] Speaker 4: Yeah, basically yeah, yeah. They were very ghostly, sort of
[1:21:46] Speaker 4: paranormal type entities, some of them. I mean. The strange
[1:21:50] Speaker 4: thing is that the first photograph I captured in the greenhouse,
[1:21:53] Speaker 4: it was like a ghost like identity which seemed to
[1:21:55] Speaker 4: be holding like a lantern. And when I went to
[1:22:00] Speaker 4: the second time, and I suddenly it was about a
[1:22:01] Speaker 4: week later I suddenly got the hit on the guide
[1:22:03] Speaker 4: counter just as I approached the greenhouse. In my mind,
[1:22:06] Speaker 4: I said to myself, you know, you know, I don't
[1:22:09] Speaker 4: mind capturing ET's and craft and stuff like that, but
[1:22:11] Speaker 4: I'm not ready into ghost hunting. And then lo and
[1:22:14] Speaker 4: behold the next photograph I took. It's actually like a
[1:22:17] Speaker 4: little et about four foot high with a proper et head.
[1:22:21] Speaker 4: It's almost like I said, so, I just think there's
[1:22:25] Speaker 4: some kind of enterges that could perhaps shape shift rather
[1:22:27] Speaker 4: than being solidly in that state of being.
[1:22:31] Speaker 1: Now you've also captured things that seem to be solid
[1:22:36] Speaker 1: nuts and bolts type of craft and physical technology, even.
[1:22:42] Speaker 4: Some of the things. Yeah, there's a picture on the
[1:22:44] Speaker 4: front of my website which is a whole load of
[1:22:47] Speaker 4: lights and it seems to be part of some kind
[1:22:49] Speaker 4: of a power systems, so must like the bars on
[1:22:52] Speaker 4: electric fire. And they're all different intensity and they're all
[1:22:56] Speaker 4: different sort of shapes. But that was right above a
[1:22:58] Speaker 4: hundred foot tree. Two photographs when the guycounter went off,
[1:23:02] Speaker 4: and basically nothing appeared in the second or third photo.
[1:23:04] Speaker 4: I think it took three, but this appeared in the
[1:23:06] Speaker 4: first photo, and it was pitch taking a pitch dark.
[1:23:09] Speaker 4: I don't use a flash when I take photos in
[1:23:11] Speaker 4: the dark. Now, this looked like it was part of
[1:23:13] Speaker 4: a craft and another object just above it. And you
[1:23:17] Speaker 4: always sing as the intensity of the energy which is
[1:23:20] Speaker 4: being picked up in the infra red, which is obviously heat.
[1:23:23] Speaker 4: But I saw nothing at all, and this thing was
[1:23:25] Speaker 4: massive and of court other things that look sort of
[1:23:28] Speaker 4: nuts and boltsy, But it's strange. I'm convinced that a
[1:23:32] Speaker 4: lot of these things are interdimensional. There's an interdimensional slant
[1:23:37] Speaker 4: to these things, to be quite honest with you.
[1:23:40] Speaker 1: Do you find that certain areas have more density of
[1:23:45] Speaker 1: these entities than others?
[1:23:49] Speaker 4: Yeah? Yeah, Well the thing is when you when you
[1:23:51] Speaker 4: use a cloudbuster or something and you're filming up into
[1:23:53] Speaker 4: the sky, you tend to attract more kind of craft
[1:23:56] Speaker 4: like objects, and things look like craft. But obviously, I
[1:24:00] Speaker 4: mean I've captured things a little like a craft. I've
[1:24:02] Speaker 4: captured this egg like well, I think it's an endry.
[1:24:05] Speaker 4: It's like an egg shape with radar dishes on it.
[1:24:07] Speaker 4: They are like a craft. But it seemed to know
[1:24:10] Speaker 4: that I was filming it through a camcorder and it
[1:24:12] Speaker 4: turned round towards me, and there's a video of that
[1:24:14] Speaker 4: on my Question in Visible's YouTube channel. It's called I
[1:24:17] Speaker 4: think it's called a range craft. So I'm not sure.
[1:24:21] Speaker 4: I think a lot of these things can change their form,
[1:24:24] Speaker 4: and they can look like craft, and they can take
[1:24:26] Speaker 4: any form they want, So I'm not convinced they are
[1:24:29] Speaker 4: all crafts. I'd say the ninety nine percent of what
[1:24:31] Speaker 4: people see in the sky, these lights, they are actual
[1:24:33] Speaker 4: entities in their own right, plasma like entities that can
[1:24:37] Speaker 4: take any form. They're like a liquid plasma and life
[1:24:40] Speaker 4: energy within that plasma. You know, they've basically got their
[1:24:43] Speaker 4: existence within a you know, heat based I think, you know,
[1:24:48] Speaker 4: I kind of say, so it's plasmoidal. Really, you know,
[1:24:52] Speaker 4: he'd been four matter.
[1:24:54] Speaker 1: So now I've seen that you've captured lifeforms that look biological,
[1:25:00] Speaker 1: and we were just talking about some sort of technological
[1:25:03] Speaker 1: looking entities as well as well. You have actually mixes
[1:25:08] Speaker 1: of both. You have some that look like fish, some
[1:25:11] Speaker 1: that look like a meeba's Could you tell us about
[1:25:14] Speaker 1: some of the most profound entities and beings that you've photographed,
[1:25:20] Speaker 1: besides the ones that you've just already told us about.
[1:25:25] Speaker 4: Yeah, I think there's a strange one that I talked,
[1:25:26] Speaker 4: which I like, it looked like it was like rods
[1:25:30] Speaker 4: coming out of it. I think it's im actually in
[1:25:33] Speaker 4: my books, it's like a weird always reminds me of
[1:25:36] Speaker 4: like a light bulb with rods coming out of it.
[1:25:38] Speaker 4: It's like a plasmoidal glow and it's got these rods
[1:25:40] Speaker 4: coming out of what looks like a tin canna something
[1:25:43] Speaker 4: that's catching the sun that's really shiny, and it's very
[1:25:46] Speaker 4: hard to tell what that is. And I think some
[1:25:48] Speaker 4: of the fish like forms I've captured as well, they
[1:25:50] Speaker 4: they're pretty phenomenal because they've got actual fins. Yes, you
[1:25:54] Speaker 4: know people about skyfish and they actually like rods. But
[1:25:57] Speaker 4: you know a lot of those things are actual insects.
[1:25:59] Speaker 4: If you get peaks of wings, multiple repeats and a
[1:26:01] Speaker 4: long rod, light body, the nine nine percent is going
[1:26:03] Speaker 4: to be an insect. But these things are fine. Haven't
[1:26:06] Speaker 4: got that because through the way you record, you see
[1:26:09] Speaker 4: you get intola's video recording that doesn't repeat, so you'll
[1:26:12] Speaker 4: get like there's a bit on my website where I've
[1:26:15] Speaker 4: purposely filmed mosquitoes and various things to show what these
[1:26:19] Speaker 4: things look like. And you get like a long rods
[1:26:21] Speaker 4: with loads of appendages on the side. And then you know,
[1:26:25] Speaker 4: and then I spent hours film in mosquitoes and various
[1:26:27] Speaker 4: different things, moths and everything. You either get like a
[1:26:30] Speaker 4: white bat on or you get like a white batter
[1:26:32] Speaker 4: like shape with multiple repeats. But the things I've captured
[1:26:35] Speaker 4: in the ultra violet, they've got actual fins and mouths
[1:26:38] Speaker 4: a lot, and they definitely look like living forms that
[1:26:42] Speaker 4: are swimming through the sky.
[1:26:45] Speaker 1: Now, for the skeptics that are looking at this and
[1:26:48] Speaker 1: don't know much about photography and probably think that maybe
[1:26:53] Speaker 1: artifacts or some kind of glitches in your camera, what
[1:26:57] Speaker 1: would you tell them.
[1:27:00] Speaker 4: Well, there are a lot of things that glitches can do,
[1:27:01] Speaker 4: but these, you know, I'm filming straight into sunlight. I'm
[1:27:04] Speaker 4: filming a fifty frames a second. I've also used to
[1:27:07] Speaker 4: film a lot of time with a standard camera filming
[1:27:09] Speaker 4: the same scene, and these things don't show on the
[1:27:11] Speaker 4: standard camera. They honestly don't, you know. And also, you know,
[1:27:18] Speaker 4: you don't get guide counter hits from insects. These are
[1:27:21] Speaker 4: really high guide counter things, you know. Sometimes they're like
[1:27:23] Speaker 4: three or four times the standard background radiation levels, and
[1:27:27] Speaker 4: it's just for an instant as they go by. These
[1:27:31] Speaker 4: things can be hundreds of feet, it's not thousands of
[1:27:33] Speaker 4: feet in the sky. You can still get a hit
[1:27:35] Speaker 4: on the guy counter, right, Yeah, So something's going on.
[1:27:41] Speaker 4: There's some energy that they're made of, whether it's all
[1:27:43] Speaker 4: one energy, the life force they're made of, is being
[1:27:46] Speaker 4: excited through them being well, they're not actually in this
[1:27:49] Speaker 4: reality unles. They're in this reality but invisible. But something's happening,
[1:27:53] Speaker 4: especially with entities, whether they seem to manifest, you'll get
[1:27:55] Speaker 4: a big hit on the guide counter, and you take
[1:27:57] Speaker 4: multiple photographs. But sometimes you can use a flash and
[1:28:00] Speaker 4: that might light up the outside of these entities and
[1:28:03] Speaker 4: you'll capture capture them that way. But a lot of
[1:28:05] Speaker 4: them don't reflect light because they seem quite dark both
[1:28:09] Speaker 4: ways really, you know. So, but I use the sunlight
[1:28:13] Speaker 4: a lot to light up the things in the ultra
[1:28:15] Speaker 4: violet because they don't appear very strongly unless they're lit
[1:28:19] Speaker 4: up for that split second as they passed above the
[1:28:21] Speaker 4: rooftops or beyond the rooftops. So it's very very tricky.
[1:28:26] Speaker 4: I mean I filmed for two or three years, you know,
[1:28:29] Speaker 4: and I captured you know, sometimes didn't capture anything. For
[1:28:33] Speaker 4: three or four months, and I'll be out there all
[1:28:34] Speaker 4: day long. I was just totally obsessed with it, And.
[1:28:38] Speaker 2: Now I haven't.
[1:28:39] Speaker 1: Have you traveled to any specific locations that may have
[1:28:44] Speaker 1: been considered hot spots to see if you could capture anything.
[1:28:47] Speaker 1: I'm curious if you ever, if you would ever go
[1:28:50] Speaker 1: to place somewhere like skin Walker Ranch and attempt to
[1:28:54] Speaker 1: see if there's entities there you could capture.
[1:28:57] Speaker 4: Oh. Yeah, I've been watching The Skinwalker right. Serious. Actually,
[1:29:01] Speaker 4: it's great. I'd love to have been part of that,
[1:29:03] Speaker 4: But I don't know, because I've had a lot of
[1:29:05] Speaker 4: problems over the last year, a lot of strange things
[1:29:08] Speaker 4: happening to me, and this spooks to me a little bit,
[1:29:10] Speaker 4: to be quite honest with you.
[1:29:13] Speaker 1: Is related to to paranormal activity?
[1:29:17] Speaker 4: Yeah, and just constantly, Yeah, definitely, yeah.
[1:29:19] Speaker 3: Yeah.
[1:29:20] Speaker 4: It seems you know, the minute I switch on to
[1:29:22] Speaker 4: the question in visible's mode and go out with the camera,
[1:29:24] Speaker 4: I'm getting really quick guide counter hits even before I'm
[1:29:27] Speaker 4: out of my room. And something happened to me about
[1:29:30] Speaker 4: three months ago where I was coming down the stairs
[1:29:32] Speaker 4: with a camera in one hand, guy coountering the other.
[1:29:34] Speaker 4: It's quite expensive equipment and all of a sudden, I
[1:29:37] Speaker 4: heard this down then it went right in my ears.
[1:29:40] Speaker 4: It almost deafened me, and my whole body. BOOK called him.
[1:29:42] Speaker 4: I then he fell down the stairs, and I didn't
[1:29:44] Speaker 4: feel right for any three months. I couldn't control my thoughts.
[1:29:48] Speaker 4: I didn't feel like me. I was getting suicidal feelings.
[1:29:50] Speaker 4: I I just I started getting really angry all the time.
[1:29:53] Speaker 4: I just I went through this really really weird. It's
[1:29:57] Speaker 4: almost like a depression of darkness thing that came over me, you.
[1:30:00] Speaker 2: Know, Nick.
[1:30:00] Speaker 1: What's so interesting is I have a researcher friend who
[1:30:04] Speaker 1: is around the Uinta Basin, around the Skinwalker Ranch area.
[1:30:08] Speaker 1: He's a he does paranormal research, and he was investigating
[1:30:12] Speaker 1: a cattle mutilation and there were these spikes of radiation
[1:30:16] Speaker 1: around that area too, and he had the exact same
[1:30:20] Speaker 1: symptoms that you're that you were talking about for a
[1:30:24] Speaker 1: very long time. I don't know if it was like
[1:30:25] Speaker 1: four to six months. He was having neurological symptoms, all
[1:30:30] Speaker 1: kinds of problems that just started after he investigated this
[1:30:34] Speaker 1: cattle mutilation. So that is very interesting that you're having
[1:30:38] Speaker 1: these these these effects because of the radiation or whatever
[1:30:44] Speaker 1: type of frequencies are occurring there.
[1:30:48] Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, it's just you know, a couple of times,
[1:30:50] Speaker 4: we're actually thrown up of sense that these things in aime.
[1:30:53] Speaker 4: And I've taken photographs and We've not managed to capture anything.
[1:30:57] Speaker 4: But I've just found that, you know, the god counter
[1:30:59] Speaker 4: when one we went up six times higher than normal
[1:31:02] Speaker 4: radiation levels, and I don't know what radiations I'm dealing with,
[1:31:06] Speaker 4: but I felt physically sick and actually have been sick
[1:31:08] Speaker 4: one time. It gets dangerous when you start getting things
[1:31:11] Speaker 4: like that. And I started having dreams. I mean, one
[1:31:13] Speaker 4: night I had this kind of weird dream that I
[1:31:15] Speaker 4: was laying on the bed in the daytime and these
[1:31:17] Speaker 4: three entities they were just pitch black and they had
[1:31:19] Speaker 4: like frog like hands and feet and head. In my dream,
[1:31:24] Speaker 4: I dreamt that they were strangling me and actually woke up,
[1:31:27] Speaker 4: which was in the pitch dark in my room, and
[1:31:29] Speaker 4: I saw them. They were there, and the second I
[1:31:31] Speaker 4: looked at them, they all sprung back into all like
[1:31:34] Speaker 4: a portal in the corner of the room. They all
[1:31:36] Speaker 4: sprang back in unison, and I kept the light on
[1:31:39] Speaker 4: it one eye. It really freaked me out at the time.
[1:31:41] Speaker 4: I mean, it's not so bad now because it's a
[1:31:42] Speaker 4: while ago, but I started getting, you know, hearing footsteps,
[1:31:46] Speaker 4: hearing voices, and I didn't feel right and I had
[1:31:49] Speaker 4: nobody to turn to. So I found the more and
[1:31:52] Speaker 4: more I was trying to get into this thing, the
[1:31:54] Speaker 4: more and more things were having.
[1:31:56] Speaker 1: That seems to occur with many people who go chasing
[1:31:59] Speaker 1: after this phenomena and have a aggressive approach at times.
[1:32:06] Speaker 1: It seems to have a trickster type of aspect to it,
[1:32:11] Speaker 1: where it seems to not want you to try and
[1:32:15] Speaker 1: attempt to figure out what's going on, and it always
[1:32:18] Speaker 1: seems to be many steps ahead of what you're trying
[1:32:21] Speaker 1: to attempt to do, and there seems to also be
[1:32:23] Speaker 1: attempts to dissuade you from going any further at times.
[1:32:28] Speaker 4: Right, I definitely agree, Yeah, yeah, I mean I've watched
[1:32:31] Speaker 4: the skin Walker ranch serious and I've seen a lot
[1:32:33] Speaker 4: of the problems they've had. But it's almost like in
[1:32:36] Speaker 4: my garden. It's almost like there's a general phenomenon which
[1:32:40] Speaker 4: can express itself in different ways. And I've got very
[1:32:43] Speaker 4: into this dog man thing. I've been looking in stuff
[1:32:45] Speaker 4: quite a while and I thought, you know, I took
[1:32:47] Speaker 4: a strange photo once which almost had like a wolf
[1:32:50] Speaker 4: like face, and well, I've taken I was k looking
[1:32:53] Speaker 4: around taking a picture straight into the door. It was
[1:32:56] Speaker 4: into a window actually, and it was dark outside and
[1:32:58] Speaker 4: it should have been my reflection, but it this weird
[1:33:00] Speaker 4: looking face, and that kind of really unnerved me. And
[1:33:06] Speaker 4: I get a bit obsessed with things. I either do
[1:33:08] Speaker 4: something or I don't. And I think you get so
[1:33:11] Speaker 4: obsessed with this thing. I think it can that becomes
[1:33:13] Speaker 4: your reality basically, and most of the people, you know,
[1:33:16] Speaker 4: they don't even think about this type of thing. I
[1:33:18] Speaker 4: don't even believe that it's real. But I've heard a
[1:33:21] Speaker 4: lot of about researchers that end up being troubled by things,
[1:33:26] Speaker 4: especially to skin Walk garage and this whole skin walker thing,
[1:33:28] Speaker 4: because I believe there's a lot of really dark enterties
[1:33:32] Speaker 4: out there, and I think you know when you're inviting
[1:33:34] Speaker 4: them in, because when you go out with your camera
[1:33:36] Speaker 4: and in the pitch dark into a forest or whatever,
[1:33:39] Speaker 4: you basically were willing them to come. Really you're saying, oh,
[1:33:42] Speaker 4: you're going out there with the intent to capture something.
[1:33:45] Speaker 4: I always have respect, you know, I don't try and
[1:33:47] Speaker 4: force me do anything. I don't antagonize or wind up.
[1:33:50] Speaker 4: I have a lot of respect, you know, when I
[1:33:52] Speaker 4: do this kind of work, but it's they all seem
[1:33:54] Speaker 4: to sort of know, like they switched. I've had things
[1:33:57] Speaker 4: where my chemical has been switched off. I set up
[1:33:59] Speaker 4: camical just filming me, the cam cord has been switched off,
[1:34:03] Speaker 4: and one of them got knocked over and one of
[1:34:06] Speaker 4: the disappeared. For a while, I couldn't find it, and
[1:34:08] Speaker 4: then it appeared. We've had food go missing in my
[1:34:11] Speaker 4: sister's house and it never never appeared. We've had things
[1:34:13] Speaker 4: appear that we don't know where they came from. And
[1:34:17] Speaker 4: constant light flashing. This is a problem I've had recently.
[1:34:19] Speaker 4: The light. Every time I come into my sister's house,
[1:34:21] Speaker 4: the light starts flashing, and I go into her room
[1:34:23] Speaker 4: and the light flashes. I'm in the shower and the
[1:34:26] Speaker 4: light flashes, and it flashes in response to certain things
[1:34:29] Speaker 4: that I think, And it's just crazy. I mean, even
[1:34:32] Speaker 4: though I went out one night with my camera and
[1:34:34] Speaker 4: the gate lights started flashing, the main lights we have
[1:34:37] Speaker 4: on our gate, and they just were completely mad and
[1:34:39] Speaker 4: do like about a thousand flashes a minute. I thought
[1:34:41] Speaker 4: there was going to blow the whole electric system up
[1:34:44] Speaker 4: in the house and then it just stopped, you know,
[1:34:47] Speaker 4: and I couldn't catchure anything. I was getting massive hits
[1:34:50] Speaker 4: on the guide counch. I was taking hundreds and hundreds
[1:34:52] Speaker 4: of long exposures, I was taking shorter exposures. I was
[1:34:55] Speaker 4: trying everything. Couldn't capture anything at all.
[1:35:00] Speaker 1: It's so interesting. It's either a phenomena that can mimic
[1:35:05] Speaker 1: paranormal or haunted activity, or it is connected to what
[1:35:10] Speaker 1: we understand is the afterlife or this spiritual activity.
[1:35:15] Speaker 2: What do you think?
[1:35:17] Speaker 4: Definitely, yeah, I think that, I mean come to conclusion
[1:35:20] Speaker 4: that you know, as well as us living on Earth,
[1:35:22] Speaker 4: I think it may be many different levels existing, you know, explain.
[1:35:27] Speaker 4: I think there's multiple dimensions and there's multiple realities going
[1:35:30] Speaker 4: on at the same time, and I think some things
[1:35:33] Speaker 4: can step through from that reality into this reality. Especially
[1:35:36] Speaker 4: when you hear about the amount of people that go
[1:35:37] Speaker 4: missing and things like that, and you know Alaska, in
[1:35:40] Speaker 4: places like the parks in America, people have just disappeared completely.
[1:35:46] Speaker 4: I'm sure that there's different realities that can phase in
[1:35:48] Speaker 4: and out sometimes, and I think that's what's happening on
[1:35:50] Speaker 4: skin Walk Garage. It may be to do with the
[1:35:53] Speaker 4: amount of quartz, because that just retained memory, and a
[1:35:57] Speaker 4: lot of these people go missing in areas of high quarts,
[1:36:00] Speaker 4: and it could be that, you know, perhaps the memory
[1:36:02] Speaker 4: of that time period or something is replayed, or perhaps
[1:36:06] Speaker 4: it's somehow allows them to exist at the same time
[1:36:09] Speaker 4: or phase phase in and out of our reality. M hm.
[1:36:13] Speaker 1: Have you caught any have you caught any?
[1:36:18] Speaker 2: I'm sorry, go ahead.
[1:36:19] Speaker 4: So I'm convinced that you know, everything exists or can
[1:36:22] Speaker 4: exist everything.
[1:36:23] Speaker 1: Yeah, it seems there's a whole spectrum of life just
[1:36:27] Speaker 1: beyond what we can perceive. Have you caught any evidence
[1:36:31] Speaker 1: of what you would understand as a portal activity or
[1:36:35] Speaker 1: objects coming in and out of the reality?
[1:36:40] Speaker 4: Not as such. And I didn't catch what looked like
[1:36:42] Speaker 4: a little tear in the sky and a bright light
[1:36:44] Speaker 4: coming out of the sky like a rip, and he had
[1:36:46] Speaker 4: something coming through there. But I've never captured any sort
[1:36:50] Speaker 4: of evidence clear evidence of a portal opening. Not really.
[1:36:54] Speaker 4: I've captured things in the sky where the sky seemed
[1:36:57] Speaker 4: to change color. I took about three or four photographs
[1:37:00] Speaker 4: in the infrared, and all these way colors came out.
[1:37:02] Speaker 4: They shouldn't have come out. Because the infrared the filter
[1:37:06] Speaker 4: should have blocked those colors unless they're made between the
[1:37:10] Speaker 4: filter and the camera. I'm not sure how it works,
[1:37:12] Speaker 4: but by some strange things that have paid in the sky,
[1:37:17] Speaker 4: and they could well have been portals because I was
[1:37:19] Speaker 4: filming things in the sky around that point, and perhaps
[1:37:22] Speaker 4: the cloudbuster use, you know, created a portal. I don't know.
[1:37:25] Speaker 4: I don't use cloudbusters now, but I used to use,
[1:37:28] Speaker 4: you know, use them a lot, and you know they're
[1:37:31] Speaker 4: well known for attracting things.
[1:37:35] Speaker 1: Have you considered the possibility that our cosmology that we're
[1:37:39] Speaker 1: told about from our mainstream academia, NASA, and our government
[1:37:45] Speaker 1: could be different than what we're being presented, and that
[1:37:51] Speaker 1: the concept of outer space could be more of an
[1:37:54] Speaker 1: inner dimensional phenomena than than we realize.
[1:37:58] Speaker 4: Definitely, I think that. Yeah, I think that's true. I mean,
[1:38:01] Speaker 4: I believe that the history as we know it is different.
[1:38:03] Speaker 4: I mean, you know, when you look back at the God,
[1:38:06] Speaker 4: been spent a lot of time looking back, you know,
[1:38:08] Speaker 4: like the Old Testament and some of the Hindu books
[1:38:10] Speaker 4: that you know, the God's coming down. I think these
[1:38:12] Speaker 4: gods are very real. I think these things happened, and
[1:38:15] Speaker 4: I believe you know, they may be even coming down
[1:38:17] Speaker 4: now and putting them entities, you know, because onto this earth,
[1:38:20] Speaker 4: because people have seen portals opening and things walking through them.
[1:38:24] Speaker 4: But I believe that perhaps they're being put some things
[1:38:26] Speaker 4: being put down here.
[1:38:28] Speaker 1: We just had a story break yesterday in Las Vegas.
[1:38:31] Speaker 1: It's gonna be a pretty big story here in the
[1:38:33] Speaker 1: United States. A craft supposedly crashed in a family's backyard.
[1:38:38] Speaker 1: They called nine one one and said that there were
[1:38:42] Speaker 1: eight to ten foot tall beings with huge black eyes
[1:38:46] Speaker 1: walking around the craft in their backyard. And there's some
[1:38:50] Speaker 1: speculation that it's there's a cover up involved because we
[1:38:53] Speaker 1: can't find any of the video evidence and they were
[1:38:56] Speaker 1: blocking out some of the evidence of the video footage
[1:38:59] Speaker 1: and the new and it's very interesting. The witnesses sound
[1:39:03] Speaker 1: very critical. So I'm interested to see where this story
[1:39:06] Speaker 1: is gonna go. And that's I think this just occurred yesterday.
[1:39:09] Speaker 1: So we're having a lot more, a lot more of
[1:39:11] Speaker 1: this stuff come out in the mainstream here in the
[1:39:14] Speaker 1: United States. Is it that way over in the UK?
[1:39:18] Speaker 1: Are you guys looking into the UFO phenomena of your government?
[1:39:23] Speaker 4: This is what the government over here released all the
[1:39:25] Speaker 4: UFO files a few years ago.
[1:39:27] Speaker 2: Mm hmmm.
[1:39:29] Speaker 4: I don't really trust the governments.
[1:39:30] Speaker 2: We can't, of course not.
[1:39:31] Speaker 1: No, I think there's this huge psychological operation behind all this,
[1:39:34] Speaker 1: and they're trying to skew our perception of what's going on.
[1:39:38] Speaker 1: But it is very interesting that it's even being mentioned now.
[1:39:44] Speaker 4: Yeah, well this is it. We never know whether it's
[1:39:45] Speaker 4: some kind of thing they're trying to force, you know
[1:39:47] Speaker 4: what I mean talk about, you know, the false alien
[1:39:50] Speaker 4: invasion type thing scenario. But I mean it strikes me
[1:39:54] Speaker 4: as being very funny that a lot of these people
[1:39:56] Speaker 4: that are now so called heads of the UFO sort
[1:39:59] Speaker 4: of thing are all excellent people. They spend their lives
[1:40:01] Speaker 4: trying to hoist it up and keep it from us. Yes, yeah,
[1:40:03] Speaker 4: they seem to be in Oh you've got Nick Pope
[1:40:05] Speaker 4: and all these other people. I mean, you know, I've
[1:40:08] Speaker 4: already got an opinion on him. But I just very
[1:40:12] Speaker 4: I don't trust a lot of these people. You know,
[1:40:14] Speaker 4: if they spent twenty years keeping this thing secret and
[1:40:16] Speaker 4: all of a sudden they're up there, you know, turning
[1:40:18] Speaker 4: some of all these things, I just don't sit right
[1:40:20] Speaker 4: with me really, to be quite honest with you.
[1:40:22] Speaker 1: Well, they are also painting it as a threat. There's
[1:40:26] Speaker 1: a lot of convoluted information, especially when it comes to
[1:40:29] Speaker 1: the events lately.
[1:40:30] Speaker 2: Where is it a balloon? Is it a UFO?
[1:40:33] Speaker 1: Why are we shooting UFOs down if we aren't sure
[1:40:36] Speaker 1: the capabilities? What is really happening with some of these events?
[1:40:41] Speaker 1: And it seems to be that we will have a
[1:40:44] Speaker 1: cluster of events happen, things will get quiet for a while,
[1:40:47] Speaker 1: and then they'll have another somewhat cluster of events happen
[1:40:52] Speaker 1: that seem to be oddly placed, and the reason behind
[1:40:56] Speaker 1: it is still unknown because we still haven't even retrieved
[1:40:59] Speaker 1: any the supposed the crash retrieval from the balloon or
[1:41:05] Speaker 1: that we supposedly shot down. So it's very interesting what's
[1:41:07] Speaker 1: happening right now?
[1:41:09] Speaker 4: Yeah, that was in the news a lot, that balloon thing,
[1:41:12] Speaker 4: But then you've never heard any any more about it.
[1:41:14] Speaker 4: I mean, you've got and then again you've got whistleblows.
[1:41:16] Speaker 4: You know, people that have come out. I mean, like
[1:41:19] Speaker 4: the guy from Area fifty one, what's his name? Brobblers
[1:41:24] Speaker 4: are bubblers? I mean I totally believe bob Bubblers are
[1:41:29] Speaker 4: I really do. I don't I get a good feeling
[1:41:31] Speaker 4: about bubblers are. I've known quite a scientists in my life,
[1:41:35] Speaker 4: and he's very sort of typical of scientists, and you
[1:41:38] Speaker 4: know when you listen to what he has to say,
[1:41:40] Speaker 4: and you know, he's very angry that this type of
[1:41:42] Speaker 4: science isn't being used. It's what's being suppressed.
[1:41:46] Speaker 3: You know.
[1:41:46] Speaker 4: And any good science wants to go as far into
[1:41:48] Speaker 4: things as he can and work out how things work.
[1:41:51] Speaker 4: And it must be very frustrating if you're working on
[1:41:54] Speaker 4: some you know, like using element one, more five and
[1:41:57] Speaker 4: power in these crafts, and yet you can't, you know,
[1:41:59] Speaker 4: put it in an application for the world to help
[1:42:02] Speaker 4: save the world in some way, or to give us
[1:42:03] Speaker 4: free energy or something like that.
[1:42:05] Speaker 1: Well that's the thing that some speculate that there are
[1:42:07] Speaker 1: so many in the private sector that are actually coming
[1:42:11] Speaker 1: to crack free energy and understand some of this technology
[1:42:15] Speaker 1: themselves and develop technologies for free energy themselves, and have
[1:42:19] Speaker 1: an understanding of what's behind it, that our governments and
[1:42:23] Speaker 1: military industrial complex may be trying to get ahead of
[1:42:27] Speaker 1: all that by coming out with some of this information
[1:42:31] Speaker 1: or staging some events, or even just leaking a little
[1:42:35] Speaker 1: bit of what the real possibility of UFOs is because
[1:42:39] Speaker 1: they don't want us to have access to free energy
[1:42:43] Speaker 1: uncontrolled or especially when it's not in their control, right exactly.
[1:42:49] Speaker 4: This is the thing, you know, if I invented a
[1:42:50] Speaker 4: device which could you know, draw ende if the zero
[1:42:53] Speaker 4: point failed, you know, and I put it in to
[1:42:56] Speaker 4: get a patent, they'd be taken off me under you know,
[1:43:01] Speaker 4: and that's wrong, that's just totally totally wrong.
[1:43:05] Speaker 3: You know.
[1:43:05] Speaker 4: Then they use it for military applications, and I can
[1:43:07] Speaker 4: see why. I mean, you know, if they suddenly discovered
[1:43:10] Speaker 4: the drives, the drives to these craft and the UFO technology,
[1:43:13] Speaker 4: they wouldn't want to release it out to the public
[1:43:15] Speaker 4: in any manner at all, because you know, the other side,
[1:43:17] Speaker 4: whoever they considered to be the enemy at the time,
[1:43:19] Speaker 4: maybe Russia or China in their eyes, could use that
[1:43:22] Speaker 4: against them. So I suppose for military purposes to have
[1:43:24] Speaker 4: a you know, to be ahead of the other side,
[1:43:26] Speaker 4: they're going to keep this stuff secret and they're not
[1:43:29] Speaker 4: going to be putting it out stop by the disclosure
[1:43:32] Speaker 4: protect all these people say they worked on UFOs and
[1:43:35] Speaker 4: everything else. I mean, they were military people, and a
[1:43:38] Speaker 4: lot of them didn't release this information until they were dead.
[1:43:41] Speaker 4: You know. They recorded videos and things.
[1:43:44] Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's also possible that these beings, if
[1:43:48] Speaker 1: they are entities and not just some non corporeal intelligence
[1:43:52] Speaker 1: or trickster intelligence. If we are dealing with entities, they
[1:43:56] Speaker 1: could just possibly be from here in just in a
[1:44:00] Speaker 1: different spectrum of vision. They could have resided on this planet,
[1:44:05] Speaker 1: on Earth forever and we just can't see them, and
[1:44:08] Speaker 1: they know how to manipulate either density or a new
[1:44:13] Speaker 1: state of matter to where they can come in and
[1:44:16] Speaker 1: out of our reality, or even alter our perception to
[1:44:19] Speaker 1: where we can only perceive certain things. I don't know,
[1:44:23] Speaker 1: but it seems that it's possible that these beings were
[1:44:26] Speaker 1: always here.
[1:44:27] Speaker 4: Yeah, I believe that as well. Yeah, I mean, you
[1:44:29] Speaker 4: know the Earth. I mean, who knows how old the
[1:44:32] Speaker 4: Earth is. But it's quite possible because a lot of
[1:44:34] Speaker 4: cultures talk about the invisible reality, to the reality of
[1:44:37] Speaker 4: invisible beings a lot, you know a lot of them,
[1:44:40] Speaker 4: and you know, especially at night as well, a lot
[1:44:43] Speaker 4: of these things are seen at night, these pale humanoid forms.
[1:44:46] Speaker 4: There's one captured crossing the road over a motorway in
[1:44:48] Speaker 4: England and it was like a human like form and
[1:44:51] Speaker 4: it was actually running, well like crawling a fast crawl.
[1:44:55] Speaker 4: It jumped over the motorway and run in front of
[1:44:57] Speaker 4: the car, and it looked like a really tall human
[1:44:59] Speaker 4: about seven. It's already emaciated and gray, but it kind
[1:45:02] Speaker 4: of it moves, not not bipedally, but actually on four
[1:45:06] Speaker 4: you know, on his hands and knees. And a lot
[1:45:09] Speaker 4: more people are capturing things and saying things in the dark,
[1:45:12] Speaker 4: so I think a lot of these are coming through
[1:45:13] Speaker 4: from sort of darker realms as well.
[1:45:16] Speaker 1: Yeah, and you said you you had captured something of
[1:45:20] Speaker 1: a dog man. I've heard very interesting accounts of dog
[1:45:25] Speaker 1: man and dog like creatures, cryptid creatures in different rural areas.
[1:45:30] Speaker 1: I'm doing a documentary right now. In the first area
[1:45:33] Speaker 1: that I'm documenting is South Louisiana and some of the swamps,
[1:45:37] Speaker 1: And apparently there are an entire range of creatures that
[1:45:42] Speaker 1: are so either elusive or know how to come in
[1:45:46] Speaker 1: and out of our reality, like these other beings that
[1:45:50] Speaker 1: we're just speaking of. Possibly that what we can understand
[1:45:54] Speaker 1: is Bigfoot and these dog men creatures that have these
[1:45:57] Speaker 1: abilities to traverse throughout our reality as well.
[1:46:03] Speaker 4: It could well be it could well be, or they
[1:46:04] Speaker 4: could be remnants of some ancient race I mean, you know,
[1:46:08] Speaker 4: America very old place, and you think, you know, I mean,
[1:46:10] Speaker 4: the evidence for giants is massive. That the fact that
[1:46:12] Speaker 4: you know, right down to the Native Americans having problems
[1:46:15] Speaker 4: with them, you know, with them being cannibalistic and they well,
[1:46:18] Speaker 4: you know, there's legends of them having wars with these giants,
[1:46:20] Speaker 4: and it goes all the way through the UK, around
[1:46:22] Speaker 4: the world. And I believe in those times when the
[1:46:24] Speaker 4: gods were down all sorts of strange creatures, they're probably
[1:46:29] Speaker 4: doing you know, DNA splicing and mixing certain creatures with
[1:46:33] Speaker 4: other creatures. So they could be remnants from a time
[1:46:36] Speaker 4: like that in ancient time, or they could be things
[1:46:38] Speaker 4: that are being put down. Because it's just weird with
[1:46:42] Speaker 4: the dog man thing, the fact they can run on
[1:46:43] Speaker 4: four legs, but they can also seem to have to
[1:46:45] Speaker 4: click their legs out and stand up and be by
[1:46:47] Speaker 4: bipedal And yeah, I mean, I haven't seen an actual
[1:46:51] Speaker 4: dogman thing. I just caught a reflection of something that
[1:46:53] Speaker 4: looked weird in my window. But the whole dog man
[1:46:56] Speaker 4: thing is pretty crazy. And they've been citing in England
[1:46:59] Speaker 4: as Wow, there's been a few sightings of them in England.
[1:47:02] Speaker 4: I think Australia as well. But I'm very very interested
[1:47:05] Speaker 4: in that thing by the base of bray roads and
[1:47:07] Speaker 4: all that kind of stuff. But the very frightened imagine.
[1:47:12] Speaker 1: It's interesting the ability they have to either cloak into
[1:47:17] Speaker 1: their environment. Every picture we seem to get of one
[1:47:20] Speaker 1: of these beings, they look blurry or fuzzy or like
[1:47:24] Speaker 1: a part of the environment. And I've had researchers clean
[1:47:28] Speaker 1: that they've actually seen them morph into a tree or
[1:47:32] Speaker 1: a rock.
[1:47:34] Speaker 4: Yeah, it doesn't surprise me. Yeah, I watched the serius
[1:47:36] Speaker 4: that was on. I think it was somewhere in Alaska
[1:47:39] Speaker 4: where they went out trying to track down this on
[1:47:41] Speaker 4: this side. I think that it was an abandoned fishing place,
[1:47:43] Speaker 4: salmon cannery. They found that when they were trying to film,
[1:47:47] Speaker 4: they are again a lot of a lot of things, a rapping.
[1:47:50] Speaker 4: The equipment was switching off and they're getting things work
[1:47:55] Speaker 4: turning out on the camera. The camera just get switching
[1:47:57] Speaker 4: off and they could get a lot of I can't
[1:48:02] Speaker 4: I don't know that things were just going all over
[1:48:03] Speaker 4: the place. They try to take a photo and it
[1:48:05] Speaker 4: come out all fuzzy, and things like being disturbed all
[1:48:08] Speaker 4: the time, and they seem to be able to affect
[1:48:10] Speaker 4: do something with the frequency and lettromagnetic frequency, they seem
[1:48:14] Speaker 4: to be able to affect that. So perhaps they've got
[1:48:17] Speaker 4: a way of making sure they're not captured on camera
[1:48:20] Speaker 4: or something.
[1:48:21] Speaker 1: Now, I want to get into your the paper that
[1:48:24] Speaker 1: you're working on, Positive Findings on Constables. Yeah, tell us
[1:48:29] Speaker 1: a little bit about what's what's details in this paper?
[1:48:33] Speaker 4: Yeah? Yeah, Well, basically what happened was as a guy
[1:48:36] Speaker 4: called Leon Southgate is an academic organ researcher, became he
[1:48:39] Speaker 4: rang me up one day, Well he actually emailed me
[1:48:41] Speaker 4: and after you heard me on the show, and we
[1:48:43] Speaker 4: became really good friends. And he's really really into Uguran
[1:48:46] Speaker 4: energy and the work of doctor Wilhem Reich. And he
[1:48:48] Speaker 4: told me about a paper that had been written by
[1:48:50] Speaker 4: a guy called James Demo, who's another orgonomist, and it
[1:48:53] Speaker 4: was called negative Finding on Constables Bioforms And in this
[1:48:57] Speaker 4: two page article he dismissed constables bioforms invisible UFOs as
[1:49:03] Speaker 4: nothing more than marks on the emulsion. And for his
[1:49:05] Speaker 4: main proof he used some photographs which came from a
[1:49:08] Speaker 4: book called Like Quest by Commember. The guys Andrew Collins
[1:49:13] Speaker 4: wrote a book called like Quest, and in that book
[1:49:16] Speaker 4: there's a load of photographs. He had taken a stereoscopic
[1:49:19] Speaker 4: camera and set up cloud busters, apparently trying to recreate
[1:49:23] Speaker 4: Constable's methods. And he'd taken some photographs and because he
[1:49:26] Speaker 4: used the stereoscopic camera, on both sides should be the same.
[1:49:29] Speaker 4: And what he found, what he presented in this book
[1:49:31] Speaker 4: was a whole load of what looked like, you know,
[1:49:33] Speaker 4: UFOs in the sky and biology UFOs, and then on
[1:49:36] Speaker 4: the other picture there's one or none on some of them.
[1:49:39] Speaker 4: So he said, because both frames are different, that they
[1:49:41] Speaker 4: must be marks on the emulsion. But I actually looked
[1:49:43] Speaker 4: at the actual photographs and I found they weren't taken
[1:49:47] Speaker 4: from a stereoscopic camera. One of them, out of thirty degrees,
[1:49:51] Speaker 4: slants on it, which was different to the other one,
[1:49:53] Speaker 4: and I basically managed to put really put one on
[1:49:57] Speaker 4: top of another. Actually traced them, and I found they
[1:49:59] Speaker 4: were all out no way they were taken with a
[1:50:00] Speaker 4: stereoscopic camera. And it really annoyed me the people trying
[1:50:05] Speaker 4: to discredit Constable's work. So I said to Leon, let's
[1:50:07] Speaker 4: write a paper positive findings on Constables orgodotic biforms and
[1:50:12] Speaker 4: present the best bioform evidence from write from nineteen fifty seven,
[1:50:16] Speaker 4: when Trevor James Constable started right through the GRCU in
[1:50:19] Speaker 4: the late nineteen seventies early eighties, and then the things
[1:50:21] Speaker 4: I've captured from twenty ten to was in about twenty nineteen.
[1:50:26] Speaker 4: So we decided to write this paper and put all
[1:50:29] Speaker 4: the evidence, all the photographic evidence, and there's pictures from
[1:50:32] Speaker 4: taken from live footage. Just wanted to present it all
[1:50:36] Speaker 4: just to show because the GRCU they wrote a book
[1:50:39] Speaker 4: in the nineteen eighties, a really rare book called Lorialta Nascosta.
[1:50:42] Speaker 4: It's an A four book with about two hundred pages.
[1:50:45] Speaker 4: It's very rare. I mean I paid a lot of
[1:50:47] Speaker 4: money for it. I've got it on the internet. I
[1:50:49] Speaker 4: think I paid three hundred and fifty pounds free. I
[1:50:51] Speaker 4: was so desperate because I'd read about it and nobody
[1:50:54] Speaker 4: has really got access to this because the book was
[1:50:56] Speaker 4: only one thousand printed and there's nothing about it on
[1:50:59] Speaker 4: the internet. So I set about trying to get this
[1:51:01] Speaker 4: information out there, and I got permission to actually use
[1:51:04] Speaker 4: some of those photographs, and so I'm just trying to
[1:51:07] Speaker 4: present the best evidence and evidence that is a little known,
[1:51:10] Speaker 4: really by people. I mean, I don't reely know Travior
[1:51:13] Speaker 4: James Constable. I was into eupology for a long time.
[1:51:15] Speaker 4: I never heard of Travi James Constable until I went
[1:51:17] Speaker 4: seeking and really looking, you know, into like living UFOs basically,
[1:51:24] Speaker 4: so a lot of it's been dismissed and just swept
[1:51:27] Speaker 4: under the carpet. Really. Constable himself was banned from lecture
[1:51:31] Speaker 4: and at one point a various UFO dues that were
[1:51:35] Speaker 4: going on you know, conferences because they didn't like what
[1:51:38] Speaker 4: he was saying, because they just they were going from
[1:51:40] Speaker 4: the from the point that they were all UFOs had
[1:51:43] Speaker 4: to be interplaneatory craft and nothing else.
[1:51:47] Speaker 1: Yeah, you mentioned earlier that a lot of the craft
[1:51:51] Speaker 1: you have photographed, and even the ones you saw with
[1:51:53] Speaker 1: your your own eyes seemed to have biological aspects. To
[1:51:58] Speaker 1: him is very interesting.
[1:51:59] Speaker 2: I've had it.
[1:52:00] Speaker 1: Experiencers that claim that, some that claim they've been taken
[1:52:03] Speaker 1: on hips that are biological in some ways and actually
[1:52:08] Speaker 1: conscious and living.
[1:52:11] Speaker 4: That doesn't surprise me, I mean, to be honest with you,
[1:52:13] Speaker 4: nothing surprises me anymore. It really doesn't, you know, it
[1:52:16] Speaker 4: really doesn't. I mean, it's start things twisted my head
[1:52:19] Speaker 4: to be quite honest with you. I mean, people say, well,
[1:52:21] Speaker 4: it's a nice photograph. They look at the photographs of
[1:52:23] Speaker 4: the stuff, you know, in the snakelike object that came out,
[1:52:26] Speaker 4: for instance, from my cat's grave site. But you know,
[1:52:29] Speaker 4: the object came out as a reaction to me, you know,
[1:52:31] Speaker 4: asking if my cat coul give me a sign that
[1:52:33] Speaker 4: he was still there, and other things happened. So you know,
[1:52:38] Speaker 4: to people, they just say just a photograph, but to me,
[1:52:40] Speaker 4: it was actual happening and a response that happened. And
[1:52:43] Speaker 4: I can weigh quite heavily on your mind sometimes when
[1:52:46] Speaker 4: you're out they're doing it all the time, and you're
[1:52:48] Speaker 4: getting these responses and capturing things because that is your reality,
[1:52:52] Speaker 4: and this is very hard to you know, get back
[1:52:56] Speaker 4: into the normal reality sometimes because your mind's just out
[1:52:58] Speaker 4: there in this alternative reality of invisible things.
[1:53:01] Speaker 1: You know, do you think that we are military industrial
[1:53:05] Speaker 1: complex has the capability to mimic some of these more
[1:53:10] Speaker 1: advanced craft or even some of the biological craft. Do
[1:53:14] Speaker 1: you think we have this technology or you think it's
[1:53:17] Speaker 1: something beyond anything we're capable of.
[1:53:20] Speaker 4: I think it's beyond what we're capable of, yeah, or
[1:53:22] Speaker 4: even in need of doing. To be quite honest with you,
[1:53:25] Speaker 4: I think it's very much sort of nuts and bolts
[1:53:27] Speaker 4: thing that they're looking at, you know. I mean, I
[1:53:29] Speaker 4: do believe that they've captured various crafts and things. I
[1:53:31] Speaker 4: do believe that's quite possible, especially with what Bubblazar says.
[1:53:35] Speaker 4: I don't see any reason why bubblers Are would make
[1:53:37] Speaker 4: such a thing up and put his life in jeopardy
[1:53:40] Speaker 4: and cause himself the problems he has. I mean, he
[1:53:42] Speaker 4: distances himself from it now, but I find it very
[1:53:45] Speaker 4: very credible. And other whistleblowers have also talked about underground
[1:53:48] Speaker 4: bases and things and these Reptinian beings, because if you
[1:53:53] Speaker 4: look back in the Bible, you'll see that the serpent,
[1:53:55] Speaker 4: you know, it seems to be about the serpent of
[1:53:58] Speaker 4: the Reptinian beings, like even in the Garden of You,
[1:54:01] Speaker 4: and it's a repent said it's a snake, but you know,
[1:54:04] Speaker 4: I believe it's repted in being. But it said it
[1:54:06] Speaker 4: was banished to crawl as a snape, so obviously it
[1:54:09] Speaker 4: wasn't a snake to start with. So I just think
[1:54:11] Speaker 4: it's a mix up with words, you know. But I
[1:54:15] Speaker 4: believe that these sentences have been helping the human race.
[1:54:17] Speaker 4: Maybe some of them are not helping them, suppose with
[1:54:20] Speaker 4: our best interests at heart, but that's given them this
[1:54:24] Speaker 4: start and everything else. And it's quite possible that the
[1:54:27] Speaker 4: elements of the government working or ministry or ministry industrial
[1:54:31] Speaker 4: complex working with some of these things. M Is that true.
[1:54:37] Speaker 1: The aspect that's really interesting to me is when you
[1:54:41] Speaker 1: look at things like skin Walker Ranch and the experiments
[1:54:44] Speaker 1: they're doing there. It's very scientific and the whatever the
[1:54:48] Speaker 1: phenomena is at times seems to have aggressive reactions. I've
[1:54:54] Speaker 1: seen people be harmed. And on the other hand, another
[1:54:58] Speaker 1: group of researchers that takes a more spiritual approach, a
[1:55:03] Speaker 1: more type of magical approach to interacting with this around
[1:55:07] Speaker 1: the same area in the Unsaw Basin, and they get
[1:55:09] Speaker 1: much different reaction. It's much more of it's not as
[1:55:15] Speaker 1: frightening and as it doesn't seem to be threatening in
[1:55:18] Speaker 1: any other in any way. It seems more of a
[1:55:21] Speaker 1: curious and playful interaction when they approach it in a
[1:55:25] Speaker 1: spiritual manner, and I find that very interesting. It seems
[1:55:28] Speaker 1: like the phenomena doesn't really want us to find out
[1:55:32] Speaker 1: scientifically what's going on, but maybe just interact with it
[1:55:35] Speaker 1: in different ways.
[1:55:36] Speaker 2: What do you think about that?
[1:55:38] Speaker 4: I believe that, Yeah, I totally believe that as well.
[1:55:41] Speaker 4: You know, I'm having followed the Skidmore Ranch stuff that's
[1:55:44] Speaker 4: been going on there. It's definitely seems to be That's
[1:55:48] Speaker 4: what I said, definitely happens to me as well. I
[1:55:51] Speaker 4: you know, I've had clear gychicund indications and I've heard footsteps,
[1:55:54] Speaker 4: and I've seen the lights triggered on the side of
[1:55:56] Speaker 4: my house and I've heard footsteps and I can't see anything.
[1:55:59] Speaker 4: And these things are that can't capture them on camera,
[1:56:02] Speaker 4: you know. Then I find the cameras which I've set
[1:56:04] Speaker 4: up at the other end of the garden. They've been
[1:56:05] Speaker 4: switched off and one of them's knocked over. So it's
[1:56:08] Speaker 4: almost like they don't want you to totally understand what's
[1:56:12] Speaker 4: going on. I believe that's what it is. Any sabotage
[1:56:15] Speaker 4: it it's hard to know really, but I've never been
[1:56:20] Speaker 4: physically calmed apart. I mean, the nearest iff come is
[1:56:22] Speaker 4: when I nearly felt on the stairs this massive bush
[1:56:26] Speaker 4: sound go sort of right into my ears and I've
[1:56:28] Speaker 4: got like a buzz through my body. I've actually been
[1:56:31] Speaker 4: punched or scratched, because you know, some researchers have got
[1:56:34] Speaker 4: scratched and had other things going on. Well, I've never
[1:56:38] Speaker 4: had that.
[1:56:39] Speaker 2: Have you ever had any missing time?
[1:56:42] Speaker 4: Not that I can speak of really, No. No, oppressed
[1:56:46] Speaker 4: when I was younger, but no, nothing that I've experienced.
[1:56:51] Speaker 3: No.
[1:56:51] Speaker 4: I mean, I pretty much do all my research and
[1:56:53] Speaker 4: things from my house. I very very rarely even leave
[1:56:56] Speaker 4: my house where I live. Be quite honestly, I don't
[1:56:58] Speaker 4: really interact with the world. But I haven't noticed anything
[1:57:01] Speaker 4: sort of you know, since I've been living here, I've
[1:57:05] Speaker 4: not woken up and you know, wondered where time had
[1:57:08] Speaker 4: gone or anything like that, thankfully. Yeah, I don't know.
[1:57:11] Speaker 4: You know, you don't know what's going on when you're asleep.
[1:57:14] Speaker 4: I mean I saw a video the other day of
[1:57:15] Speaker 4: a woman that thought she kept getting abducted, and her
[1:57:17] Speaker 4: husband filmed and he saw her body disappear from the bed,
[1:57:22] Speaker 4: just disappear.
[1:57:23] Speaker 2: Huh.
[1:57:24] Speaker 4: Yeah. He saw the bed covers go down as if
[1:57:26] Speaker 4: she was transported out of this reality. And then you know,
[1:57:28] Speaker 4: he was fifteen minutes later she came back in.
[1:57:31] Speaker 2: He said, you said he was able to film this.
[1:57:34] Speaker 4: It was on something I saw on one of these
[1:57:36] Speaker 4: programs the other day. It was a paranormal program in
[1:57:39] Speaker 4: the UK. Yeah, he felt on a night vision camera
[1:57:43] Speaker 4: sort of thing.
[1:57:44] Speaker 2: Oh wow.
[1:57:44] Speaker 4: She kept saying certain she was being adupted, so he
[1:57:47] Speaker 4: set up cameras to see what was going on because
[1:57:49] Speaker 4: he didn't believe it at all. He thought that she
[1:57:50] Speaker 4: was making it up. And you just saw it kind
[1:57:53] Speaker 4: of like melt away under the covers and there's just
[1:57:55] Speaker 4: him laying there and she'd gone, and all of a sudden,
[1:57:57] Speaker 4: you see the covers blow up again and she seemed
[1:57:59] Speaker 4: to appear, and it seems to be pretty pretty real. Well,
[1:58:04] Speaker 4: you don't know with all this animation and stuff, but
[1:58:06] Speaker 4: you know, you try and take it at face value.
[1:58:08] Speaker 1: When Yeah, they do have a small amount of people
[1:58:11] Speaker 1: that have very negative and terrifying which you would consider
[1:58:15] Speaker 1: abduction experiences. But it's interesting a lot of those people
[1:58:20] Speaker 1: who are having these negative experiences also report seeing military
[1:58:26] Speaker 1: personnel and people in military uniforms that are in the
[1:58:32] Speaker 1: approximate area where this is occurring, or even working with
[1:58:37] Speaker 1: extraterrestrial beings. The most negative aspects of this could be
[1:58:43] Speaker 1: our own military industrial complex.
[1:58:46] Speaker 4: Yeah, and that's quite frightening, really yeah, because you know,
[1:58:49] Speaker 4: if you think, I mean, you know, if they have
[1:58:51] Speaker 4: got the technologies with these distant things, they could already
[1:58:54] Speaker 4: be on Mars. They could be with other beings, you know,
[1:58:57] Speaker 4: something like a star Trek type fag going on you
[1:59:00] Speaker 4: know where, or got Stargate even you know, and we
[1:59:05] Speaker 4: don't know. I mean, they could be letting them, you know,
[1:59:09] Speaker 4: we're getting technology off them and letting them abduct us.
[1:59:12] Speaker 4: Like some people have said, you know, some kind of
[1:59:15] Speaker 4: a deal going on between certain entities. I mean, I
[1:59:17] Speaker 4: wouldn't put that past the government now, you know, the
[1:59:22] Speaker 4: deep dark government, you know.
[1:59:24] Speaker 1: Right, Do you have plans on in the future picking
[1:59:29] Speaker 1: up the camera again and attempting to get more footage
[1:59:32] Speaker 1: or is this something that you're going to stay away
[1:59:34] Speaker 1: from for a while.
[1:59:35] Speaker 4: I'm going back. I'm basically just going to go back
[1:59:37] Speaker 4: to filming in the sky. Now we've got the summer here,
[1:59:40] Speaker 4: so I find June, July, August, September over here in
[1:59:43] Speaker 4: the UK that's the point where there's more UV in
[1:59:45] Speaker 4: the sun and that's the best time for capturing things
[1:59:48] Speaker 4: in the UV. So I'm basically just going to go
[1:59:50] Speaker 4: back to what I was doing and filming in the sky.
[1:59:52] Speaker 4: I'm not going to do anything at ground level now
[1:59:55] Speaker 4: because it just starts getting too weird. And when I
[1:59:58] Speaker 4: start feeling sick and filling ill and it I don't
[2:00:00] Speaker 4: feel right. I don't want to keep going through that
[2:00:02] Speaker 4: because you know, it's where does it end?
[2:00:05] Speaker 3: Yeah?
[2:00:05] Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it is interesting.
[2:00:08] Speaker 1: Have you considered trying any CE five type of interaction
[2:00:16] Speaker 1: or meditation to attract some of these entities.
[2:00:21] Speaker 4: I've done it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've done it. Yeah.
[2:00:23] Speaker 4: I've done the calling, the UFO calling. The first time
[2:00:26] Speaker 4: I tried it, I got results with in about ten minutes.
[2:00:29] Speaker 4: A bright colored red we look like a red balloon
[2:00:31] Speaker 4: appeared really high in the sky and it came right
[2:00:33] Speaker 4: above my house, and you know, I said thank you,
[2:00:36] Speaker 4: and it just melted away into the sky. And then
[2:00:38] Speaker 4: another one came and it was like a blue on
[2:00:40] Speaker 4: top of another one. They all looked slightly weird. They
[2:00:42] Speaker 4: may mimic. They mimic things like flying dolphins and balloons
[2:00:46] Speaker 4: and things people. They look slightly metallic, and they basically
[2:00:50] Speaker 4: but they always look a bit odd, and they always
[2:00:53] Speaker 4: keep themselves a few thousand footup in the air, so
[2:00:54] Speaker 4: you can just see them and make out what they are,
[2:00:57] Speaker 4: but you can't, you know, without the aid of a
[2:00:59] Speaker 4: camcorder anything to zoom in. You can't see them too
[2:01:02] Speaker 4: you too near. But I've got a pretty good camcord
[2:01:05] Speaker 4: that can zoom in up to two thousands. So but
[2:01:08] Speaker 4: the problem is because it was a full spectrum camcorder.
[2:01:10] Speaker 4: These things are bright red, but of course it sees
[2:01:12] Speaker 4: red as white, and of course the sky looked white,
[2:01:16] Speaker 4: so it wouldn't come out very well on the camcorder.
[2:01:19] Speaker 4: I could see these bright red balloon like objects coming
[2:01:21] Speaker 4: over and disappearing, but when I look back at the
[2:01:23] Speaker 4: footage I could I couldn't see it on the footage
[2:01:26] Speaker 4: very well, because obviously I should have done it with
[2:01:29] Speaker 4: a standard camcorder, but I haven't actually got any all
[2:01:32] Speaker 4: my infred converted and full spectrum. Never been interested in
[2:01:37] Speaker 4: a normal camcorder filming in the normal light spectrum.
[2:01:40] Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's interesting.
[2:01:43] Speaker 1: You were saying that these things shape shift and try
[2:01:47] Speaker 1: to mimic different objects, And I've heard this so many
[2:01:50] Speaker 1: times from different witnesses. They'll see something like an orb
[2:01:55] Speaker 1: turning to a plane and then shape shift into some
[2:01:58] Speaker 1: other type of bird or object. And this is across
[2:02:03] Speaker 1: the board that a lot of these objects seem to
[2:02:06] Speaker 1: be shape shifters, and they can, they can morph into
[2:02:11] Speaker 1: different type of objects or even biological entities during any
[2:02:17] Speaker 1: type of experience you have.
[2:02:19] Speaker 4: It seems to be living plasma a lot of them.
[2:02:21] Speaker 4: They often look metallic. Some of them are pairs like
[2:02:24] Speaker 4: silver like balls, but they can actually grow. And I
[2:02:27] Speaker 4: mean I was seeing. I mean I recorded that thing
[2:02:29] Speaker 4: that looked like an egg and it had radar dishes
[2:02:31] Speaker 4: on the side, and when it turned around it looked
[2:02:34] Speaker 4: totally different, looked teardrop drops shaped. And I tried to
[2:02:36] Speaker 4: make a model of it. I went out and bought
[2:02:38] Speaker 4: a load of modeling, like plast scene, and I tried.
[2:02:41] Speaker 4: I've got all the stills from the photographs from the
[2:02:43] Speaker 4: footage I had taken, and I tried to make a
[2:02:45] Speaker 4: model of it, and I couldn't because it looked like
[2:02:48] Speaker 4: an egg from one view with these two radar dishes
[2:02:50] Speaker 4: on the side, but yet when it turned around it
[2:02:51] Speaker 4: look like a tear drop. No matter what I did,
[2:02:55] Speaker 4: I couldn't make a model of it. It just didn't
[2:02:58] Speaker 4: make it seem to change as it and I'm very strangely,
[2:03:03] Speaker 4: it paired right up in the sky about a thousand
[2:03:05] Speaker 4: feet up in the sky. I've seen it going round
[2:03:07] Speaker 4: all day. It was almost like it was looking at
[2:03:09] Speaker 4: you know. They noticed that I was using a cloudbuster
[2:03:11] Speaker 4: or something and I decided to I saw it just
[2:03:14] Speaker 4: as I was packing up, and I decided to sort
[2:03:16] Speaker 4: of try and zoom in. And as I zoomed in,
[2:03:18] Speaker 4: it almost like knew I was looking at it, and
[2:03:19] Speaker 4: it turned round and it shot me that much. I
[2:03:22] Speaker 4: fell over, but I managed to capture quite a few
[2:03:25] Speaker 4: seconds of pretty good footage, which is on my YouTube channel.
[2:03:29] Speaker 4: It's called Strange Visible Craft. I think it's that's the video.
[2:03:33] Speaker 4: You can see a very strange looking thing.
[2:03:35] Speaker 2: Actually it looks like some.
[2:03:37] Speaker 4: Bolts thing at first, but then the more you look
[2:03:39] Speaker 4: at it, it doesn't. It looks more like it's a
[2:03:41] Speaker 4: living thing or even a probe or something something weird.
[2:03:45] Speaker 4: But it's definitely changes its shape.
[2:03:47] Speaker 2: Right.
[2:03:48] Speaker 1: Do you think that in within our lifetime that we
[2:03:51] Speaker 1: will have an understanding that these life forms exist and
[2:03:57] Speaker 1: that it will just be common knowledge that we have
[2:04:01] Speaker 1: a whole spectrum of entities that are just beyond our vision.
[2:04:07] Speaker 4: I hope so, because as you know, people like trevi
[2:04:08] Speaker 4: Jan's Constable devoted a lot of their life to revealing
[2:04:11] Speaker 4: this type of thing, as did the GRCU group, but
[2:04:14] Speaker 4: it never really got into the mainstream. I mean, I've
[2:04:16] Speaker 4: probably got my work a lot further than those guys,
[2:04:18] Speaker 4: because obviously with you know, I've done a few talks,
[2:04:22] Speaker 4: we've done quite a few shows, a few talks, but
[2:04:24] Speaker 4: that wasn't available back in the you know, fifties, when
[2:04:27] Speaker 4: Trevis Janes Console did his work, he did a few conferences,
[2:04:31] Speaker 4: but obviously we didn't have the internet, and we didn't
[2:04:33] Speaker 4: have these shows like yours, you know, discussing such things.
[2:04:36] Speaker 4: So I think it's going to become more and more
[2:04:38] Speaker 4: acceptable because I've noticed that a lot of these paranormal
[2:04:41] Speaker 4: quote on camera programs I've watched over the last ten years,
[2:04:44] Speaker 4: more and more people seem to be catching biological things
[2:04:46] Speaker 4: a lot, like worms or you know, in the sky,
[2:04:49] Speaker 4: or snakes, and it seems to be a lot more
[2:04:51] Speaker 4: accepted that these things may be biological, a lot of them.
[2:04:55] Speaker 4: And it wasn't like that when I first started my
[2:04:56] Speaker 4: work in twenty ten, you know, it wasn't didn't seem
[2:05:01] Speaker 4: to be that much. I mean, I know there's quite
[2:05:03] Speaker 4: a few people who caught worm like forms in Mexico
[2:05:05] Speaker 4: and in the skies in Scotland. I believe huge plasmatic
[2:05:09] Speaker 4: white looking worms are actually wriggling in the sky. Those
[2:05:13] Speaker 4: I can't Barney. I think they called him know something,
[2:05:16] Speaker 4: yeah so yeah, But I think they go into space
[2:05:20] Speaker 4: as well. I think these things are just part of
[2:05:22] Speaker 4: the atmosphere and perhaps out into space, because I know
[2:05:25] Speaker 4: Nasra caught a few things that looked a bit a
[2:05:27] Speaker 4: bit like that, a bit weir.
[2:05:28] Speaker 1: Yeah, the tether experiment had those ameble looking entities attracted
[2:05:33] Speaker 1: to that to the to the tether.
[2:05:35] Speaker 4: Yes, yes, thing, yeah, yeah, well they look very much
[2:05:38] Speaker 4: like the objects that Trevor Jones constably captured ameboid forms,
[2:05:41] Speaker 4: and they were pulsating. He captured the things in the
[2:05:45] Speaker 4: Mahave Desert in nineteen fifty seven. I mean his first
[2:05:48] Speaker 4: capture was I think it was August ninety fifty seven.
[2:05:51] Speaker 4: He captured six says his frames of a huge amble
[2:05:55] Speaker 4: like biform as it moves off above his head and
[2:05:58] Speaker 4: then off across the desert. He managed to frame certain
[2:06:01] Speaker 4: parts of the desert terrain in the photograph, and in
[2:06:04] Speaker 4: the very last photograph there's another strange creature that almso
[2:06:07] Speaker 4: like I had a beak on it that was up
[2:06:09] Speaker 4: in the sky alongside the Amiba type. You can see
[2:06:13] Speaker 4: all those on my paper. The two part paper is
[2:06:16] Speaker 4: it features all these photographs, the best of all this
[2:06:19] Speaker 4: photograph and footage from nineteen fifty seven right through to
[2:06:23] Speaker 4: about twenty nineteen. It's Trevor James Constable's footage, plus doctor
[2:06:28] Speaker 4: James wood See was his companion and friend. He captured
[2:06:30] Speaker 4: some good things. And there's my footage and then the
[2:06:32] Speaker 4: GRCU group led Byliciana Poconi in the late nineteen seventies
[2:06:37] Speaker 4: in Italy. So the paper presents all this what I
[2:06:42] Speaker 4: consider to be the best footage of these things, just
[2:06:45] Speaker 4: so people can see and understand that, you know, people
[2:06:49] Speaker 4: have been capturing this stuff for quite a while.
[2:06:52] Speaker 1: Yeah, logic, really, it's incredible. Those links are right in
[2:06:57] Speaker 1: the description. Everyone if you want to just click on
[2:07:00] Speaker 1: those go check out the pictures while you watch this.
[2:07:03] Speaker 1: It's all right there, Nick, this was amazing. Thank you
[2:07:06] Speaker 1: once again before you head out, let everyone know once again,
[2:07:10] Speaker 1: even though the links are in the description where they
[2:07:12] Speaker 1: can find your work, what's the best way to do so.
[2:07:17] Speaker 4: Yeah, basically I've set up a website question Invisibles dot
[2:07:20] Speaker 4: co dot uk, and I've put all the best photographs
[2:07:23] Speaker 4: and footage video skills that I've captured over the years,
[2:07:27] Speaker 4: and I've written full descriptions of the equipment that I
[2:07:30] Speaker 4: used and sort of how I captured them. The website
[2:07:33] Speaker 4: is completely full of everything you need to know about
[2:07:35] Speaker 4: capturing various things from entities to two sky creatures. And
[2:07:40] Speaker 4: also I've got Yeah, I think the two part paper
[2:07:44] Speaker 4: is very important because that's goes through the history of
[2:07:48] Speaker 4: some of these creatures, and since Constable captured them, it's
[2:07:52] Speaker 4: a good source for people to kind of learn about
[2:07:55] Speaker 4: these things. So that's too many things I think well
[2:07:57] Speaker 4: best in my book obviously my book Questioned the Invisibles,
[2:07:59] Speaker 4: which is available worldwide, and then the two part paper,
[2:08:03] Speaker 4: and then the website. I also got a YouTube site
[2:08:05] Speaker 4: on which I haven't kept up today with for a while,
[2:08:07] Speaker 4: but some of my earlier in for red footage showing
[2:08:11] Speaker 4: strange creatures that spin through the sky while I call
[2:08:14] Speaker 4: the spinning Jeneis and some other strange things, and a
[2:08:16] Speaker 4: few videos I've made up of compilations of some of
[2:08:19] Speaker 4: these fish like forms.
[2:08:23] Speaker 2: Excellent. Yeah yeah, yeah, go check that out.
[2:08:27] Speaker 1: All those links are in the description. Nick, thank you
[2:08:29] Speaker 1: so much. This was fantastic and we'll definitely have to
[2:08:32] Speaker 1: do this again in the future.
[2:08:34] Speaker 4: Yeah, love too, Chris. Great to talk to you.
[2:08:36] Speaker 1: Yeah, and until next time, everyone, have an excellent evening.
[2:08:40] Speaker 2: We'll talk again tomorrow. We'll see all there.
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