# "Mingus Ah Um" — Charles Mingus

An episode of [You'll Hear It: Full Album Deep Dives with Jazz Musicians](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1342674932), 10 Nov 2025, 1 h 13 min.

Audio: https://pscrb.fm/rss/p/media.transistor.fm/95629b26/c6741dea.mp3

1959 gave us Kind of Blue, Time Out ... and Mingus Ah Um. Adam and Peter dig into Charles Mingus’s most adventurous, soulful record: gospel, bebop, and pure Mingus genius. You’ve never heard it quite like this. Charles Mingus was one of jazz's greatest bass players AND composers. Listen with us as we break down the genius in every track of his best-selling record, and share stories of the brilliant, chaotic, occasionally volatile man behind Mingus Ah Um. Start your free Open Studio trial for ALLLLL your jazz lesson needs: https://osjazz.link/yhi 00:00 — Opening Jam: "Better Git It In Your Soul" 01:40 — What's happening at Open Studio 3:15 — 1959: What a Great Year! 5:40 — Early Mingus 10:40 — "All the Things You Can C#" from Mingus at the Bohemia 11:40 — "A Foggy Day" from Pithecanthropus Erectus 16:15 — "Better Get Hit In Your Soul" 23:35 — This One is For the Nerds 27:50 — "Goodbye Pork Pie Hat" 34:36 — "Boogie Stop Shuffle" 38:30 — "Self-Portrait in Three Colors" 40:30 — The Duke Ellington Influence 45:10 — "Open Letter to Duke" 48:05 — "Bird Calls" 49:00 — "Fables of Faubus" 56:40 - "Pussy Cat Dues" 58:15 — "Jelly Roll" 1:00:15 — Categories 1:10:50 — GALA

## Transcript

[0:00] Or is it Peta?
[0:01] No. Is it Petum? Nope. It's not Petoa.
[0:05] It is not. Well, is it Adum? No.
[0:10] Adomia. I Don't think so.
[0:11] E pluribus Adameas. I
[0:13] Don't believe it is. Is
[0:14] it Mingah? Mm-hmm. Is it Mingum? No. It's Mingus.
[0:18] Boom.
[1:36] I am Adam Maness. And I'm Peter Martin.
[1:37] And you're listening to the You'll Hear podcast
[1:39] Music, Explored. Explored
[1:41] brought to today by Open Studio.
[1:42] Go to open studiojazz.com for all
[1:45] your jazz lesson needs. Yeah. Yeah.
[1:48] What's happening over at Open Studio? There's
[1:50] A lot happening. So, first of all,
[1:51] we have a new course from
[1:53] probably my favorite pianist making music right now,
[1:56] which is Sullivan Fortner,
[1:58] a new course from Sullivan, dropping within weeks.
[2:00] Peter, we are weeks away.
[2:01] I've been, I've been taking some peeks at it.
[2:03] It's awesome. It's amazing. Yeah. Sullivan's great.
[2:05] We also have some wonderful courses from yours. Yours truly
[2:09] Mine. Truly
[2:10] yours
[2:10] Truly. Yeah. We got the Harmony Games.
[2:11] Harmony Games. Unlimited.
[2:12] Unlimited. Right. Meaning there's a new
[2:14] lesson every single week.
[2:15] And we've got the Jazz Piano Method from you. Yeah.
[2:17] New lesson every week. We also,
[2:19] if you've never played jazz piano,
[2:21] we have a brand new course dropping called
[2:22] Jazz Piano Primer.
[2:24] Yes. Which is designed to teach you how
[2:26] to play jazz piano if you've never played jazz piano.
[2:27] That's taught by wonderful New York City bass pianist named
[2:29] Caili O'Doherty one
[2:31] of our Open Studio pro instructors. So
[2:32] We've also got Jazz Piano
[2:33] Jumpstart that we collaborated on.
[2:35] If you like us collaborating like this.
[2:37] And you're jazz piano curious or just piano curious.
[2:39] Come on over. 'cause we have a 14 day free trial,
[2:42] so it's like, you know, you can
[2:43] try us out if you don't like us.
[2:44] Come back to the pod. Where do they or take
[2:46] Both? Where do they go
[2:47] again?
[2:47] openstudiojazz.com. Thank you,
[2:50] Peter. Yeah.
[2:51] Exciting. That was an ad read. I know. High
[2:53] Five. I know. We never
[2:54] do these.
[2:54] Did we get in some comments about, we got some comments,
[2:56] guys, for guys like sponsor your own show.
[2:58] This podcast is honestly just an extension of Open Studio.
[3:01] Yeah. All we do here is like, talk about music we love
[3:03] and talk about how to play it.
[3:04] Yeah. But this show is all about listening
[3:07] to the music we love, including today's album, which is,
[3:09] Charles Mingus is 1959 Mingus. Ah. Um,
[3:14] And it's not called Mingus mga
[3:16] mgu, but we're gonna get into that.
[3:18] Could have been called, that could have been,
[3:19] Could have been called. Uh,
[3:20] first of all, what a great title. That's great. Come on.
[3:22] Yeah. I have to, I'm gonna up my accoutrement score just based
[3:24] upon that, but we'll get to that later as well.
[3:26] Yeah. Oh, such, such, such a great album. Okay.
[3:30] Let's talk about a certain year,
[3:31] 1959. 1959.
[3:32] Have we ever mentioned that we might have's
[3:34] A great year? It's a giant
[3:35] steps here,
[3:37] Kind of, kind of 1959, probably not just
[3:41] for Columbia records of which this album is on,
[3:45] but just talking about Columbia Records.
[3:46] We got day Brubeck timeout. Yep. Yep. 1959.
[3:49] Little thing called kind of blue,
[3:51] maybe you've heard us call it KOB
[3:52] by Miles Davis. Miles Davis kind
[3:54] Of blue on Columbia Records. That's
[3:55] right. Uh, Mingus Ah Um. All these records were recorded
[3:58] with a lot of overlap, if not total overlap, actually,
[4:01] of the studio, the producer, the record label for sure.
[4:04] A couple of 'em with the same, um, graphic designer or, and
[4:07] or photographer on the cover.
[4:09] Like, this was really a huge year for Columbia Jazz
[4:11] and really for kind of, dare I say, if I'm allowed
[4:14] to say commercialized jazz.
[4:16] Yeah. Not smooth jazz. Well, no,
[4:18] I mean, there are all kinds of jazz. Yeah.
[4:19] I mean, you also have Ornette
[4:20] Coleman's the Shape of Jazz to Come. Yep. Which is the
[4:23] Most commercial free jazz record I ever made in my
[4:25] Book. Yeah. Well, and that's coming
[4:26] to this show very, very soon.
[4:27] Ooh. Uh, but you have even like, some, some lesser known,
[4:30] but equally like important ones.
[4:32] Thelonious Monk, Thelonious. Oh.
[4:34] Alone in San Francisco, one of our favorite albums. I
[4:37] Think that's his finest, uh, solo
[4:38] Piano record. It's incredible.
[4:39] You've got, uh,
[4:40] you've got things from Horace Silver Blowing the Blues Away
[4:43] and Finger Popping two albums that year, I believe.
[4:47] Portraits and Jazz, uh, portraits of Jazz, bill Evans
[4:50] Portrait and Jazz from Bill Evans, uh, is this year,
[4:52] it was 59 as year as well as Kelly Blue, one
[4:53] of my favorite Wynton Kelly albums.
[4:55] So great. So an incredible year. Yeah. For the music.
[4:58] And this album sits on top of that heap.
[5:01] I mean, this is one of the Mount,
[5:02] when you talk about the most important albums of that year.
[5:06] Yeah. This is in that top four
[5:07] that usually people talk about, kind of blue timeout,
[5:11] Mingus a, um, and probably Portrait in Jazz
[5:13] or Shape of Jazz to Come, depending on
[5:14] how you wanna frame it.
[5:16] But man, what an album.
[5:17] Yeah. And actually I'm thinking like Mingus,
[5:19] a show has showed up for years, uh,
[5:22] which I think is super interesting, uh, on these lists
[5:25] of like the 10 greatest jazz albums of all time.
[5:28] And sometimes even just like the a hundred
[5:29] greatest albums ever made.
[5:31] I mean, this is really a beloved iconic album,
[5:34] and it's been so much fun for me to kind of go back
[5:36] and listening to this over the last couple days
[5:38] and be reminded why.
[5:39] But this is a very adventurous album.
[5:41] Super. I forgot how like, this is a deep record.
[5:44] Well, and it, it's so different from
[5:45] everything else on the list.
[5:47] I mean, it's closest might be Time Out just as far
[5:49] as like its conception Yeah.
[5:50] Of the music as it's almost like a soundtrack
[5:53] to a movie that doesn't exist.
[5:55] You know what I mean? Yeah. It's like, it's very, very,
[5:57] uh, visual almost.
[5:58] Yeah. You can hear things happening, which is by the way,
[6:01] a consistent theme in a lot of Mingus music.
[6:03] He's so good at sort of like using arranging
[6:06] as a soundscape, which I want to get into here.
[6:08] Yeah. But Mingus himself, man, if we can just build up
[6:11] to this album, like where he was.
[6:12] Yeah. The first gig he ever got
[6:15] as a professional musician was in Lionel Hampton's band,
[6:18] where he immediately was a standout.
[6:19] And he started writing music,
[6:21] including this tune called Mingus Fingers, which was sort
[6:24] of his feature in Lionel Hampton's band.
[6:26] Check it out.
[6:35] You could already hear, right? Yes. Swing it in. Weird.
[6:41] Ah, that sound already.
[6:51] How great is that? Ah,
[6:52] and that's, so this is pre like
[6:54] Duke Ellington pre late forties.
[6:55] Exactly. So he goes from Bird, right? Yeah.
[6:58] Next up we got is Bird actually. Okay.
[7:00] So he starts playing with, uh, bud Powell. Yeah.
[7:03] Charlie Parker, max Roach, dizzy Gillespie, sort
[7:06] of those fathers of of Bebop.
[7:07] Yeah. They make this live album, uh, under,
[7:10] I think it's under Bud Powell's name, live at Massey Hall.
[7:12] It was actually under, it was just called The Quintet.
[7:15] It was the Quintet. Yeah. That's right. Yep.
[7:17] And so what's interesting about this recording, Peter, uh,
[7:19] we're gonna listen to Perdido from that, is
[7:21] that this MCUs started a record label Perdido,
[7:25] Did you say Perdido Perdido Perdido
[7:30] Perdido Per diem per, um,
[7:33] I call it Perdido Mingus Ming Ming.
[7:35] Exactly. Per per diem. Per per diem.
[7:38] Uh, no, but this is with Charlie Parker.
[7:39] Disney Gilles Bud po.
[7:40] What's interesting is, like, so Mingus put this on a
[7:42] label as a young man.
[7:43] He created this own record label. Yeah.
[7:45] Put this album on a label, this a version
[7:47] of this album on a label.
[7:48] And he rerecorded his bass.
[7:51] 'cause it's from a live recording, right? That's right.
[7:53] He rerecorded retraced his bass part, which was not like now
[7:57] with Pro Tools where you just punch it in.
[7:58] No, it would've been an incredible undertaking to do.
[8:00] And he did it. And he, I'm thinking it probably would've
[8:03] included physically playing the record while he recorded.
[8:06] I think so. 'cause there was no like,
[8:08] multi-track punch in situation.
[8:09] But this version became the version,
[8:11] the popular version of the album
[8:16] Max, That bass.
[8:17] Yeah.
[8:19] Hey, when you own the Label, that's what you do.
[8:21] This is what bass players love to do.
[8:29] Anyway, I love highlighting that
[8:30] because I just, it just goes to show like Charles Mingus.
[8:34] I think when I think about him as a musician,
[8:35] I think about someone who was constantly
[8:37] thinking outside of the box.
[8:39] Yes. Was constantly sort of swimming upstream,
[8:41] going against the grain, whatever you wanna call it.
[8:43] Mm-hmm. If, if a bunch of people were into it, he was like,
[8:46] nah, I'm gonna do my own thing.
[8:47] I I wanna make the music I wanna make.
[8:49] He was a very intense individual. Yeah.
[8:52] And could be, I think a handful
[8:54] for like a band leader especially.
[8:55] Yeah. When you hear about like,
[8:57] his interactions with Duke Ellington.
[8:58] Yeah. Um, and some other
[8:59] folks that we'll talk about, I'm sure.
[9:01] But what, uh, an incredibly huge personality.
[9:04] A an incredibly, uh, a genius musician
[9:08] and a very thoughtful forward-thinking musician on one
[9:11] of his very first, uh, albums.
[9:13] Is that, I'm sorry. I just wanted, just as a side note on
[9:15] that live at Massey Hall, uh, that record.
[9:19] Like, I think Mingus became sort of like,
[9:22] there was this lore about him
[9:23] as being like the bebop bass
[9:26] player just because of that record.
[9:27] That was an important record. It was the last time Dizzy
[9:29] and Byrd played together.
[9:30] Yeah. Um, or at least record.
[9:32] I believe it was the last time they played together too.
[9:34] But Mingus was not like the bebop bass player. Actually.
[9:37] He was, I mean, he came in at the tail end of that.
[9:39] He was super young. Um, like
[9:41] that was never his main kind of a thing.
[9:44] He could do it. He could do it. Yeah. Yeah.
[9:45] But I mean, he was, and I remember when I was coming up
[9:47] and I, that was the first record I heard
[9:49] of Charlie Mingus, that record.
[9:51] And I was like, oh my God. In fact, I heard this story.
[9:53] This is back when lore and myths and, and
[9:56] and stuff were flying around.
[9:57] I heard that the bass was so loud. This was pre-internet.
[10:00] I don't know if you knew this, Adam.
[10:01] I grew up before the internet.
[10:02] Really? Unlike some people.
[10:04] No, but I was told the story by some St. Louis musicians.
[10:07] They're like, oh, he had a portable tape recorder.
[10:09] And the bass was so loud. 'cause he had it set up
[10:11] by the base, which is of course we find out later.
[10:13] It's not true. He overdubbed it
[10:15] and it was recorded by the Canadian Jazz
[10:17] Society or something like that. Amazing. It's a great
[10:20] Record though. Amazing. It's
[10:21] a great record. Also
[10:21] Fun fact about the record, it was supposed
[10:22] to be Lenny Tristano on piano, and,
[10:25] but Lenny told them when he heard the lineup
[10:28] and what they were gonna do, he's like,
[10:29] I think Bud Powell would be better if you can get him.
[10:31] I think Lenny was right. Yeah.
[10:32] Um, next up, this is one of, from one, from one
[10:35] of his very first albums as a leader.
[10:37] And this again shows you sort
[10:39] of the creativity that we're working with here.
[10:41] Someone who's not afraid to mix things up. Show me what
[10:42] You working with.
[10:44] It's called All the Things You Can See Sharp.
[10:47] Oh yeah. This is like music to a silent movie.
[10:52] Very theatrical. Very cinematic.
[10:55] Oh,
[11:00] A little rock mounted off.
[11:01] Yeah. And a little Jerome Kern. Yeah.
[11:04] Mixed together A little Charlie Parker, dizzy Gillespie.
[11:07] And what year was this Ish?
[11:08] This would've been in the early fifties. Okay.
[11:10] This is it from an album called, uh, Mingus The Bohemia.
[11:13] Oh, yeah. Yeah. I think 1953, I believe. 54. Nice.
[11:16] Yeah. Isn't that cool though? Yeah.
[11:19] So cool. So he's like 20 years old, or 21
[11:21] Or so. 21. Yeah.
[11:22] Wow. Incredible.
[11:24] Well, apparently when he was a teenager,
[11:25] he was already writing a lot of what later would be coined
[11:29] as third stream music.
[11:30] Um, you know, ALA Miles birthday, cool.
[11:34] Gunther Schuller, all that kind of stuff.
[11:35] Like Mingles was doing that in the forties as a teenager.
[11:38] His big breakout though, was on this album,
[11:44] Pithecanthropus Erectus.
[11:45] I'm glad you said it. Never that. Correct.
[11:59] Traffic Traffic Jam. New York City
[12:02] Or London, England.
[12:05] I see a mate. No, Australia. Sorry.
[12:15] Yeah. The Woo. Birds are out.
[12:24] You know what's interesting,
[12:30] man, that dancing baseline.
[12:32] Oh,
[12:38] Just the traffic continues.
[12:40] Yeah.
[12:44] Like, I think we're gonna see this like
[12:46] as we get into Mingus a like the big mystery for me
[12:50] has always been like how some of his records
[12:53] and his, not so much his music.
[12:55] 'cause he's got some incredibly accessible, beautiful, some
[12:58] of the most beautiful jazz standards,
[12:59] of which a couple at least we're gonna be listening
[13:01] to today, were written by Charlie Mingus, Charles Mingus.
[13:05] Um, but a lot of his performances, um, were very out there.
[13:10] Right. And especially at a time when like jazz was, I mean,
[13:13] this is still kind of the big band era.
[13:15] You know, we're gonna get into the Duke Ellington
[13:16] connection and this kind of a thing.
[13:18] But like, he was very aggressive in terms of like,
[13:20] expectations of the audience almost in a way
[13:22] that like modern classical music
[13:24] might have been at that time.
[13:26] Um, but I think the fact that he was able to, like,
[13:30] he's obviously firmly, you know, steeply, um,
[13:34] firmly steeped in the bebop tradition in terms
[13:36] of like his line and how he approaches things.
[13:38] That's why he fits in so good with Max Roach. Sure.
[13:40] But like Max Roach always looking around the corner too.
[13:43] Right? That's right. And we're gonna get into, into that.
[13:47] Um, like Max Roach, you know, the main influence for
[13:51] that part of their, their artistic minds was Duke Ellington.
[13:54] Yes. Who Mingus played very
[13:56] briefly in Duke Ellington's band.
[13:57] We're gonna talk about that a little bit later
[13:59] 'cause it's a great story we're gonna get to here in a bit.
[14:02] But, uh, that last foggy day, that's from 1956,
[14:07] um, the Pithecanthropus Erectus is from 1956.
[14:11] Yep. And just three years later in, there's,
[14:14] there's the clown that happens in between, there's a couple
[14:16] of other things that happen, which are really, really great.
[14:18] But this album, uh, Mingus, um, is the one that sort
[14:22] of like cements his legacy as a forward thinking.
[14:26] Really. I mean, New York City legend too.
[14:29] Can we be honest here? Like, this is just like a,
[14:31] this everything he does.
[14:32] You said New York as soon as you heard the Foggy Day. Yeah.
[14:34] It all feels very downtown Manhattan, doesn't it? Right.
[14:37] I mean, there's, and also like, the fact that he was like
[14:40] friends with Fran Lebowitz. Oh yeah.
[14:42] Who still, who still talks about it. I know. Yeah.
[14:44] To this day, like in Martin Scorsese documentaries, like,
[14:48] uh, it just, he just feels like a very east coast
[14:50] personality to me as a Midwest boy.
[14:52] I'm like, man, that's like how people in New York are,
[14:54] are like intense and gruff and like committed to their art
[14:57] and like doing things outside
[14:58] of the box. You know what I mean? Yeah.
[15:00] And it's, I mean, he came across in his personality
[15:02] and most importantly in the personality of his instrument,
[15:05] his, you know, his riding for sure.
[15:07] But even you just hear him walk in the baselines.
[15:09] It's different, you know, for sure.
[15:11] But it's fun fact, he grew up in LA That's
[15:13] the amazing thing about it too.
[15:14] He, he is, he's such a New York presence,
[15:17] but he grew up in Los Angeles.
[15:18] And Watts, I believe was born in, um, Arizona
[15:21] and just had a very, very interesting lineage.
[15:24] A lot of different ethnicities, um, of more
[15:27] of which than we can list here
[15:29] and understand what, when it's his kind of personal lineage
[15:31] of his family, uh, ties and stuff.
[15:34] So that's, that's his pedigree right there.
[15:35] I mean, he, he really, he played with all the greats.
[15:37] He played with Lionel Hampton, Charlie Parker,
[15:40] bud Powell, duke Ellington.
[15:41] He co-founded debut records with Max Roach in 52
[15:44] and was already a, a business person, already an an artist
[15:48] and executive in this industry
[15:50] by the time he made this album.
[15:52] Uh, this album comes out
[15:53] and it begins with, um, something
[15:56] that we've heard a lot here on this podcast from a lot
[15:59] of different kinds of music.
[16:00] And that is church. Yes. It starts with church.
[16:03] You know, whether that's, we've heard it from all corners
[16:07] of the music that we've listened to that Yeah.
[16:09] That church music just, uh, well,
[16:12] it gets in your soul. Yeah. Doesn't it?
[16:14] You better. Well, Good one.
[16:22] Horace Parlan piano. Amazing. Horace Parlan.
[17:34] Oh,
[17:43] The backgrounds on this song.
[17:45] All the backgrounds on this album.
[17:46] All the solo so intricate.
[17:48] Yeah, you're right. The whole album Yeah.
[17:51] Is full of like, very precisely arranged Yes.
[17:55] Backgrounds and timed. Yeah.
[18:04] And going into the walking here, the walking baseline,
[18:07] we're still in three or in six.
[18:09] Yeah. 2, 4, 5, 6, 1 2. Yeah.
[18:13] But that's that underlying bead. Now we're back to it.
[18:17] Horace Parlan.
[18:21] Woo. I want
[18:23] to put a pin in this 'cause I want to talk about Yes.
[18:25] Real quick. I wanna put a pin in this
[18:29] and apply it to all my playing.
[18:30] For sure.
[18:32] Woo.
[18:39] Is that Mingus yelling out as he's playing?
[18:42] I always thought it was. I thought it was too.
[18:43] I don't know who's yelling at though. Yeah. I just assume
[19:28] this is very different from a lot of those other 1959
[19:33] jazz records in that there's so much just like vamp.
[19:38] Like this is not really, I mean this is kind of solo,
[19:41] but it's more like shout stuff.
[19:43] Collective improv. That's what I'm saying.
[19:45] It's not about going from solo to solo to solo.
[19:47] That's what makes it so appealing for Right.
[19:49] It's not all of blue, which is great too.
[19:51] I love this breakdown.
[20:00] Hm.
[20:14] Bebo.
[20:21] Woo.
[20:27] That's the correct way.
[20:34] This Is the blues, of course, in six
[20:36] with the gospel groove.
[20:39] But you got all that bebop in there because of the tempo
[20:44] and because Mingus goes into the walking.
[20:47] Um,
[20:55] Oh, Dannie Richmond.
[21:02] But the form on this is, is like the,
[21:04] the almost every track on here,
[21:05] there's a couple more conventional ones,
[21:08] but, um, this drone on that edge,
[21:11] The drone is so sick, man. The drone is so
[21:14] Sick. Oh, the dynamics
[21:15] they're playing there.
[21:17] Oh man, it's got that ding tank sting.
[21:22] He's playing around with that two against
[21:23] three or four and six
[21:28] Correspondents.
[21:31] 2, 3, 4, 3, 3, 4, 5, 6.
[21:39] So Imagin, it's so simple. It's so imaginative.
[21:44] And then this is like a Max Roach bebop
[21:45] soul kind of. Totally.
[21:47] Yeah. Totally. Great. Call Lakey
[21:50] Man.
[21:54] Ugh. This is nasty.
[21:56] Then back to, and then like a variation on the drone
[22:10] and then the chanting.
[22:11] I mean,
[22:16] And You could tell this was
[22:17] a straight through recorded track.
[22:19] Like I, I will, I'll put that flag pole in the sand.
[22:29] I mean, they did have editing at that time,
[22:30] but you can just feel it.
[22:31] Right. There's some other stuff
[22:32] on the album that's edited.
[22:33] Yeah. But not this. No, probably. But I mean,
[22:37] Because of how like complex the form is
[22:40] with the different sections.
[22:41] I don't know if he was queuing that as he went.
[22:43] I don't think they have that written out where
[22:45] It's like, they sound so tight with this.
[22:46] Too tight. It sounds so natural and smooth.
[22:50] It's almost like going through a church service
[22:51] where like everybody knows.
[22:53] Yeah. You don't know what's gonna happen,
[22:54] but you know what's gonna cue the next part.
[22:57] This is the Blues Bridge.
[23:00] 4 1 2 5.
[23:05] Simple.
[23:17] Oh, Woo.
[23:18] Come on. Now. They're just letting it
[23:20] Break down. Seven and a half
[23:21] minutes. Genius. The bottom there. So
[23:23] Good on that. Bottom F. Yeah.
[23:25] How long Is it? Seven
[23:26] and a half minutes. Yeah,
[23:27] but it flies by, there's so much little amen at the end.
[23:31] So good. It's so good. One thing I just wanna point out
[23:33] for all the nerds out there is Nerd Nook is like, you know,
[23:38] it's a blues form Yeah.
[23:39] When they get into it, right.
[23:41] And you can hear Horace Parlan doing this kind of thing.
[23:45] Yeah. Or this going up sort
[23:48] of f major try and the B flat thing. Right.
[23:50] Like a little inlaid one to four. Right.
[23:53] Ah, amen. Reverse. Ah, amen.
[23:55] But I want everyone
[23:56] to notice if you're a beginner piano player out,
[23:57] when when they go to the four court, he doesn't go
[24:00] No, no. He
[24:01] Goes to, That would be corny.
[24:03] F minor, essentially.
[24:05] Yep. Right.
[24:06] Same, same little melodic riff, but major to minor. It's
[24:10] Something you hear again and again
[24:11] with great blues musicians.
[24:12] I mean, they're treating that four chord
[24:14] as almost like it's one minor.
[24:15] Yeah. In the language that they're playing
[24:17] and the voicings that they're playing around it.
[24:19] Just something that you should note.
[24:20] It doesn't have to be as cookie cutter
[24:22] as like F seven B flat seven.
[24:24] It's really about this push and pull. Always
[24:27] We, using my voice. You
[24:28] imitating my voice a little bit. Talk like
[24:29] That a little bit. A little bit. But,
[24:30] but the push
[24:31] and pull between that major and minor all the time.
[24:32] Yeah. And the four chord in, uh, can be used as just like
[24:36] that one minor in a lot of situations.
[24:38] And and also the five chord. Yeah.
[24:40] Playing like F minor over that cc Oh, absolutely.
[24:43] In the bass all the time. It sounds incredible. Yeah.
[24:45] Great stuff. I mean, I think you're already hearing it on,
[24:47] on this track, probably the most
[24:50] consistently of any track on here.
[24:52] But, but it, but it permeates the entire album.
[24:54] I think Mingus ability to set the table, I mean,
[24:57] in the side side man on this are incredible.
[25:00] Obviously we're gonna talk about them,
[25:01] but I mean, Mingus in terms of the composition,
[25:03] he wrote everything on this record,
[25:05] but he had that ability to combine blues, gospel jazz,
[25:10] but specifically in terms of jazz, like bebop in a way
[25:13] that's actually very tricky on something like this.
[25:15] Like he's pushing the tempo a little bit on this.
[25:17] It's, it's not like typically like kind of a,
[25:20] I mean this could be at as a church group, it could be a lot
[25:22] of different tempos, but typically this be like,
[25:27] like that kind of a thing, you know? Oh, that
[25:30] Little, all the all blues kind of situation.
[25:32] Another another instance of, by the way,
[25:34] the one minor on the for chord, kinda
[25:36] Exactly. Exactly.
[25:37] With, with a three
[25:37] or a six as opposed to a two or four.
[25:39] But I mean, he's pushing it.
[25:41] So, and then he's pushing into
[25:43] that walking baseline pretty quickly,
[25:45] Which is great. And then
[25:46] He brings it back as like this part of the story.
[25:48] Yeah. And then everybody's picking up in terms
[25:50] of like bebop language and stuff.
[25:52] And so it's very, actually very hard
[25:55] to seamlessly combine all those different styles without it
[25:58] sounding like, like a corny kind of thing of like,
[26:01] now I'm doing jazzy, now I'm doing bluesy,
[26:03] now I'm doing r and b or whatever.
[26:05] Like, it's just kind of his thing.
[26:07] I mean, there's a lot you could say about
[26:08] Gospel's, kind of the overlay. Maybe there's
[26:10] A lot you could say about Charles Mingus,
[26:11] but Corny is not one of Thoses.
[26:13] No. Kind of the opposite of corny.
[26:15] He's sort of the ultimate, like, he
[26:16] Might pull a shotgun out on you, cool
[26:18] Guy, guy. Calm, corny. You
[26:19] know what I'm saying? Um,
[26:20] alright, next up is,
[26:21] But there was such like the beauty, like his intonation,
[26:25] the playing, the dynamics.
[26:26] He was, he was a tough guy. We have all the legendary
[26:28] stories, which might have been overblown a little
[26:30] bit, but I mean Yeah.
[26:32] But he had this like, beautiful, nuanced approach to music.
[26:36] We're gonna hear that for sure on the next track.
[26:38] That really was obviously a huge part
[26:40] of his musical personality as well.
[26:43] So the next track is called Goodbye Pork Pie Hat.
[26:46] This is a tribute to Lester Young, who had passed away
[26:50] just a couple of months before they recorded this album.
[26:53] Yeah. Uh, Lester Young,
[26:54] if you haven't heard much Lester Young,
[26:55] go listen to Net Lester Young.
[26:57] I recommend the Lester Young Trio.
[26:58] I'm with Nat King Cole and Buddy Rich,
[26:59] which is like, unbelievable. Unbelievable. That'd
[27:03] Be a fun one. Um, we
[27:04] should do that actually at some point. Um, but, uh,
[27:08] Les Young was so great that other saxophonists nominated
[27:11] him and called him President.
[27:12] That's right. Was that was his
[27:14] nickname. Was president. Was President. That's
[27:15] Right. Um, I love
[27:16] this song so much, man. And yeah.
[27:18] Let's have a listen by the way.
[27:20] I just wanna, but I wanna point out too, this is the first
[27:22] of, I think 80% of this album, the titles, the,
[27:26] the songs themselves are written about someone.
[27:29] Yeah. So there, there's tribute to Lester Young.
[27:31] There's an open letter to Duke.
[27:32] There's bird calls about bird calls. Charlie Parker.
[27:34] Charlie Parker. There's even like some, you know, the fables
[27:36] of Faubus, which is not Oh, yeah.
[27:37] A flattering picture
[27:39] Of this. But it's about somebody specific.
[27:40] There's a call song called Jelly Roll. Right.
[27:42] There's Jelly. There's even self-portrait in Three Colors
[27:44] about Mingus himself, a song
[27:46] called Pussycat Dos, which we don't know.
[27:47] We know who that's for. Know who
[27:48] that's for. We're not gonna one.
[27:49] So was speculate on that last Young had he just died when
[27:52] they made the record, or when he wrote this or something?
[27:54] I mean, I know it's it's a good buy,
[27:56] so I'm assuming it was Yeah.
[27:58] No, he died. He had just died
[27:59] before the recording of this album.
[28:00] Okay. He died in March of 1959. Oh, wow. He was Goodbye. My,
[28:38] And Then they're gonna split.
[28:52] Hmm.
[28:59] Now they're in octaves. Oh, such great. Arranging simple.
[29:03] You know, what I love about this one too, is like,
[29:05] I consider these two contemporary composers to be some
[29:09] of the most Im important composers of this era of music.
[29:12] Charles Mingus and Felonious Monk. Yeah.
[29:15] And like this,
[29:16] the Monk has written ballads in this sort of style Yeah.
[29:19] And this sort of feel, and they're completely different.
[29:21] They're like, yeah. Completely opposite harmonically,
[29:24] melodically what they choose to do.
[29:26] But somehow, like they, there's a authenticity to both
[29:30] of them as artists that is really so appealing.
[29:32] Like, you can hear the Mingus one
[29:34] and just know like, that's the Mingus thing.
[29:35] Yes. It's like he does all those like dominant
[29:37] sevens down a minor third.
[29:38] You know what I mean? Yeah. And the melodies are
[29:41] always very singable, always very memorable.
[29:44] Not that monks aren't, but Monk,
[29:45] you can hear just like rhythmically,
[29:46] he's got harmonic concepts that just bring 'em out.
[29:49] I consider those two to just be like, uh,
[29:51] they're working on a same similar plane in their own
[29:54] sandboxes kind of.
[29:55] Yes. I mean, really. Really. I don't even know.
[29:57] Did they ever play together? I don't
[29:58] Think. I'm sure
[29:59] they did. I I can't think.
[30:01] I'm, I'm sure they would've crossed paths, but no, I we're
[30:03] Definitely swinging and missing on that.
[30:05] Put in the comments if there's been a Monk
[30:07] Mingus, I know it's probably gonna be like
[30:08] Yeah. It'll be, oh, you remember the,
[30:09] the Great Monk Mingus duo
[30:10] at, at Mossy Hall in Montreal.
[30:13] Totally. Totally. Yeah.
[30:14] And I mean, like, you, you touched on it a little bit,
[30:15] but like, there's a lot
[30:18] of this Sharp nine, which is really, yeah.
[30:20] Yeah. And blues, there's a lot of blues inflection in terms
[30:23] of how Mingus you can hear it when he's improvising his
[30:27] baselines on all of his stuff.
[30:28] Yeah. Like, that was a deep part of his thing.
[30:30] But what you alluded to in terms of like the dominant
[30:33] chord movement was very unique.
[30:35] Like with this, that's like e-flat, uh,
[30:38] seven to go up to the four.
[30:39] Like he did, that's a very gospel kind of blues thing.
[30:42] But then he goes down Yeah.
[30:44] To that DFL seven, which is like, that's kind
[30:46] of like later on was like a Stevie Wonder.
[30:48] Like Stevie Wonder loves to do. Yeah. At this time.
[30:50] That was a little bit, um, I mean, it just,
[30:52] it really gives the personality of like how he heard music,
[30:55] how he'd float those melodies on top.
[30:57] And then also, man, the details
[30:59] with having the two saxophones in unison for
[31:02] that whole melody and then split and then splitting 'em.
[31:03] And they have one note.
[31:05] And I'm thinking that it was just one
[31:07] of 'em made a little mistake.
[31:08] But I love it so much in that first melody
[31:09] where they're not in unison,
[31:11] but I'm also like, maybe Mingus
[31:12] wrote it like that. I don't know.
[31:13] We don't know. It works. I love that
[31:15] that stayed on the record.
[31:17] Yeah. And is like part of it, you know, I mean, like,
[31:19] when you play it, do you have to do that?
[31:20] No. No. But I mean, like, that's part of the moment.
[31:23] And I mean, the level and,
[31:24] and shout out,
[31:26] we didn't shout out enough on, I think on one of the others.
[31:27] First of all, Teo Ero Yeah.
[31:29] Producer on this, who also at least
[31:31] co-produced both those other records.
[31:33] We talk about Columbia in 1959,
[31:35] timeout and kind of blue and kind of blue.
[31:36] And also Fred Lau who engineered all of 'em.
[31:39] The sound is just stellar.
[31:40] Shout out Fred and shout out 30th Street, Columbia Studio.
[31:43] The church where they, where, I mean,
[31:45] you can hear how beautifully it's captured. Yeah. And
[31:47] The band on this too is pretty ridiculous.
[31:48] We got Dannie Richmond on the drums. We've Dannie
[31:50] Richmond. Bad Bad dude.
[31:51] Bad dude. We've already talked about Horace Parlan,
[31:53] which I wanna talk about more on the next song.
[31:55] Yeah. Uh, John Handy, the third on the Ounce
[31:57] of Saxophone, who is still with us?
[31:59] Yes. I believe he's, is he the only one on here?
[32:01] Probably still with us. I think so.
[32:03] I apologize if I'm, if
[32:04] somebody on this record, but I think so.
[32:05] He's 92 years old. Shout out to the Great John Handy.
[32:09] Um, yeah. Ho Parley, you know where Horace Parlan is from?
[32:12] Pittsburgh? Pa Pittsburgh pa,
[32:15] which we know is a great music town.
[32:16] Incredible. But Piano
[32:18] Town In Incre.
[32:19] I mean, yeah. I'm always thinking about all the great
[32:21] musicians, but just the pianist.
[32:22] I compiled a little list. Okay.
[32:24] Am I, am I, am I, am I even getting into some people
[32:27] that just traveled through Pittsburgh airport?
[32:29] I don't think so. No. Sonny Clark ever heard of
[32:31] Him? One of my face. Oh,
[32:32] You want go to a, a real big dog? How about Errol
[32:35] Garner? That's
[32:35] A big dog. That's a big dog. Yeah.
[32:36] Johnny Costa,
[32:38] Uh, Mr. Right.
[32:39] Drew fans. It doesn't get any more
[32:40] Pittsburgh than that big dog.
[32:41] Ahad Jamal. Um, often associated with Chicago,
[32:44] But one of the greatest
[32:45] artists who ever lives. Yeah. Yeah.
[32:46] Oh. Oh, well, you know what?
[32:47] Let's go, let's go even more og.
[32:49] Let's, let's go up even higher.
[32:51] I like where you're going. Earl
[32:53] Hines father, the father
[32:54] considered the father of jazz piano.
[32:55] Of course. Earl Hyz from Pittsburgh. Oh, I'm sorry.
[32:58] Let's go to even more legendary. Mary Lou Williams. What?
[33:03] Pittsburgh? Yeah. That one I'm almost sure is correct.
[33:06] I'm on right side on that one. No, I think it is. We'll
[33:08] Get letters. Oh. Send
[33:09] 'em to johnny costa.com.
[33:10] Let's just talk about just great composers in general. Oh.
[33:13] And they're also great jazz panels from Pittsburgh.
[33:15] Sure, sure, sure. But legends. Yeah. Like
[33:17] Who?
[33:20] William Strayhorn.
[33:21] William Strayhorn. Billy Strayhorn. Billy Stray.
[33:23] Jerry Allen. This is the one I'm not sure about.
[33:25] I love Jerry. We love Jerry Allen. J Jerry Allen.
[33:27] One of the greatest jazz pianists of the class.
[33:28] Could be from Pittsburgh, Either.
[33:30] Well, she definitely taught there and hung out.
[33:32] I believe she's from Pittsburgh.
[33:33] I just love saying her name. Anyway. And,
[33:35] And yeah, shout out
[33:36] Jerry Allen. Man, the little list. Sammy,
[33:37] Sammy Nest. Okay.
[33:38] Sorry. Now I'm just naming names. But yeah, this all
[33:41] Pittsburgh. Keep going.
[33:42] Uh, and Horace Parlan is one of them. Yeah.
[33:45] And you know, Horace Parlan born in Pittsburgh, uh, in his
[33:49] first year on this earth was stricken with polio.
[33:51] Yeah. That was the polio Time.
[33:53] And that resulted in a partial crippling of his right hand.
[33:56] Which if you play piano, you know, kind
[33:58] of an important hand.
[33:59] Yeah. I mean, they're both pretty important. Yeah.
[34:02] The right hand though, especially.
[34:03] Um, but partial only had partial use of his right hand.
[34:06] Yeah. Which he made into his sound, which like,
[34:10] it just goes to show you stop using excuses.
[34:14] Right. I know. Like Horace Parlan sounds amazing. Yeah.
[34:17] And he was crippled on his right hand
[34:19] with polio when he was a child.
[34:20] Yeah. And developed his own sound.
[34:21] Became this whole, this whole artist unto himself had an
[34:25] amazing life, amazing career.
[34:27] Um, and this is Bookie
[34:28] Stop Shuffle, which we're gonna hear a little
[34:29] Horse. David Sandborn too.
[34:31] That's right. David Sandborn also
[34:33] from Polio. Correct. Yeah.
[34:34] Yeah. Ey Stop Shelf.
[34:43] Ah,
[34:50] Oh. As Duke
[34:51] Ellington right there. Influence.
[34:54] Woo.
[35:00] Dannie Richmond So much Duke Ellington in Mingus.
[35:03] I mean, Mingus talks about this too.
[35:05] His primary compositional influence.
[35:10] Keeping that line going underneath. Ooh. Counter point.
[35:16] Ah, Oh, can Minga swing
[35:20] When he walked?
[35:21] Yes. What a sound too big bass sign.
[35:41] I mean, the comping is just continuing the lines.
[35:44] So genius Bass and piano.
[35:50] Oh, More background sipping. Right. Go to swing.
[35:53] But with the background,
[36:01] we start rushing there.
[36:02] And I, I'm here for it.
[36:05] Mia, Mia threw, had a rush. Not a problem.
[36:08] Some of our favorite bass players. That's right.
[36:10] Our Famous rushers.
[36:11] Oh, Again, more of that blues thing.
[36:15] Oh, Horace Parlan.
[36:17] Oh, the background.
[36:22] Ah,
[36:28] oh, play. So tasteful
[36:30] Piano, Not pianist mode. Not piano.
[36:33] Ah, Swing
[36:38] activated
[36:44] blues has been activated. Been done activated.
[36:47] Oh, That reminder.
[36:51] Oh yeah. Hell, that's a pro Move. That's right.
[36:54] You gotta be advanced to pull that off. You
[36:55] Gotta be ready to be like, Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[36:58] So just for our listener here about what just happened. So
[37:01] That's what we were saying he didn't do
[37:03] before. Yeah, yeah. No, but he
[37:04] Waited on it. But what we, yeah. What
[37:05] we said before.
[37:05] But he, he just picked a right moment, didn't he?
[37:08] So, uh, uh, a b flat minor Blues. Right. Yeah. Right.
[37:12] So all minor. Yeah. Minor Blues minor.
[37:14] So, uh, and on that one time,
[37:18] on the four court, he goes up to
[37:19] The blue scale of the four. He goes,
[37:21] Amazing, amazing stuff. So good.
[37:23] Um, yeah. And this one's so cool too
[37:25] 'cause it's obviously, uh, it's called Boogie Stop Shuffle.
[37:28] So it's, it's got like bebop undertones.
[37:32] It's bluesy, obviously it's even got some churchy stuff.
[37:35] It's not really a shuffle,
[37:36] but like Dannie Richmond is so like, flexible with, with it.
[37:41] It's got the undertones of that
[37:42] and then it's got this Boogie Woogie line.
[37:43] But it's not like your typical like, oh, you know,
[37:47] um, down there.
[37:50] Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's, it's up here. Right.
[37:55] You know, it, it's, man, it's just like all woven together
[37:58] and it's very, man, this could be like,
[38:00] this could be like a Chase scene in,
[38:02] in like the French Riviera in North
[38:04] by Northwest Alfred Hitchcock or something.
[38:06] You know, where they got like the slick car.
[38:08] I'm glad you mentioned that because the next track on the
[38:10] album Self portrait in, why are We taking
[38:11] A trip To France together? We
[38:12] Could. Glad you mentioned that. Take
[38:13] it.
[38:13] Open Studio France.
[38:15] Uh, the next track is self portrait in Three Colors,
[38:18] which is originally written for the film shadows,
[38:19] but wasn't included due to budgetary concerns.
[38:23] Come on. And we are all the Hollywood, we're all the benefit
[38:26] because I'm sure you watch Shadows a couple times a year.
[38:28] Like we all do. Wow. Never heard of it, of it either,
[38:30] But we No, but John Caves isn't this John
[38:33] Caves actually movie, I think. Yeah. But
[38:35] Self-Portrait in Three Colors.
[38:37] We listen to all the time. Gorgeous song.
[38:39] This would've been good. I haven't seen a movie.
[38:41] Hold on, check my imdb real quick.
[38:43] Is that the John? I think so.
[38:47] Unison Melody again. Of course.
[38:52] Marlin.
[38:58] Yeah. John Ca Shadow. You're totally right.
[39:01] Yeah. Actually this movie looks dope.
[39:03] He was an actor too. He was in a bunch of,
[39:06] did he direct this or was he starring in it?
[39:08] I don't know. He
[39:10] Directed It. Yeah. But he was an
[39:11] actor too.
[39:11] I, I can't remember what It's big stuff. Big stuff.
[39:18] Yeah. This was around that period where there was like jazz
[39:21] and this kind of thing.
[39:23] I could see like, 'cause you got Anatomy
[39:24] of a Murder I believe was right around this maybe the year
[39:26] before Duke Ellington.
[39:28] I mean, shout out Auto Preminger, shadow Out
[39:30] Shadows. I'm gonna go look
[39:31] it up on Tuby tonight and tell you what
[39:33] Tuby Sponsor maybe
[39:35] Never heard of it. So
[39:36] is that Netflix?
[39:40] It's so, man, you, you really nailed it. The beginning.
[39:43] Jimmy Neper, you nailed it
[39:47] with is Mingles.
[39:49] Like, is he on the m Mount Rushmore of the little big band
[39:52] of like, small, small,
[39:54] what would you call it? Small big band arrange
[39:56] Would have to be, yeah. But
[39:57] yeah, for, for such a small quote unquote
[39:59] band of just Yeah.
[40:01] Three or four horns and a rhythm section.
[40:03] I mean, the colors that he's able to get. Yeah.
[40:06] I mean in this tune specifically three. But in general.
[40:10] In general, so many different colors to all of this.
[40:13] And he learned it, Peter from his mentor,
[40:16] the great two Ellington,
[40:17] Edward Kennedy Ellington, Edward Kennedy Ellington.
[40:20] And the next track is a tribute to that open letter to Duke.
[40:22] Well, we don't know if it's a tribute, it's an open letter
[40:24] because they had
[40:26] Checkered Pad quite a relationship.
[40:28] So, uh, Mingus joined Duke's band and,
[40:32] and was fired from Duke's band all in 1953. All in
[40:35] Like a couple weeks I think for
[40:36] Allegedly swinging an ax at Trombonist, Juan Teel, who,
[40:41] uh, in MGA's defense might have called Mingus a racial
[40:45] slur and pulled out a knife.
[40:46] We don't know, because there's several different accounts
[40:49] of the interaction.
[40:50] There's one from Mingus. Yeah. There's one from Juan Teel.
[40:53] Yeah. There's one from Duke Ellington.
[40:55] And there's even one from the trumpet player,
[40:56] one of the trumpet players in the band.
[40:58] St. Louis, his own Clark Terry. I'm gonna
[40:59] Trust Clark Terry. I
[41:00] Actually would trust Clark as well, because he's
[41:02] kind of a, he's
[41:03] The only one of those that I knew a little bit in
[41:04] Real life. He's an angel cartoon.
[41:05] Yes. Yeah. So it,
[41:08] But the only thing in common with all those stories,
[41:10] I think, was that Char Charles Mingus swung a large iron
[41:14] or steel object at Juan Tessel.
[41:17] Like that's not in dispute. Everybody,
[41:19] Including Mingus, that he grabs something.
[41:21] Right. And Acts, some say it was a piece of iron, something
[41:24] Like from the state on the side of the stage.
[41:25] On the side of the stage. Yeah. But, uh,
[41:27] there was apparently an altercation about, uh,
[41:30] Juan Teel playing something of Duke's or writing.
[41:34] He had written something. Yeah. And he didn't, like,
[41:36] he said something to Mingus about, you're not reading it.
[41:38] Right. But apparently it went back deeper than that.
[41:40] Like when Mingus was coming up, he really wanted
[41:42] to play cello and some other instruments too.
[41:44] Yeah. And like, because of, you know, the times
[41:47] and everything, he wasn't afforded, um, in,
[41:50] in equal musical education, even though he really wanted it.
[41:53] So he didn't learn to read real Well. He did later on.
[41:56] But he could play, he could write, he could arrange,
[41:59] but he had some of these barriers put up.
[42:01] And um, so he might have had a little chip on his shoulder
[42:04] as you would for people saying,
[42:05] oh, you can't read that correctly. What you mean
[42:07] Music Sheet music read. Yeah.
[42:08] Right. Notation. He's like, oh really?
[42:10] Lemme go get this, um, steel pipe
[42:12] and see if you can read that buddy.
[42:14] Um, but We are not jazz,
[42:16] we are not journalists, by the way.
[42:17] So No, but, but let's put that out there.
[42:19] But, uh, duke, apparently, the way I love this part
[42:22] of the story too, the way that Duke fired him.
[42:24] Mingus said, you feel like he just like shook your hand
[42:26] and said some nice things about you
[42:27] and you felt great about it. Which like, and
[42:29] He resigned. Yeah. And then,
[42:30] yeah, and then he resigned.
[42:31] But that's so tracks for
[42:32] what everybody would say about Duke Ellington was he was,
[42:35] he was just the UAEs man.
[42:36] The most like, incredible gentleman in the world.
[42:39] Uh, Mingus loved Duke so much.
[42:41] Uh, the aforementioned Fran Leitz, who
[42:44] is New York City icon author Fran.
[42:46] It says that Mingus used to say to that, uh,
[42:49] Ellington could get away with things
[42:51] that no one ever could like calling him Charlie.
[42:53] Apparently he Mingus hated when people call him Charlie.
[42:55] Yeah, I know. I said it earlier. I was like, yeah,
[42:56] he's gonna, he might, he might take that out. Andy,
[42:58] Chuck Don't, don't use Chuck for
[42:59] Sure. And he'd let, he'd
[43:00] let, he'd even let Duke Ellington steal
[43:01] bites out of his dinner, which he would else.
[43:04] I'm not sure the validity of that,
[43:06] of Fran's recollection, but, but a
[43:08] Couple years after this was, um, the money jungle.
[43:12] Well, which is such an interesting, we don't have to Well,
[43:14] I mean, we can divert if you'd like
[43:16] One of the tracks. So Money
[43:17] Jungle is Duke Ellington Max Roach. Yeah.
[43:19] So the guy that Mingus started the label
[43:20] with incredible bebop drummer, uh, and Mingus recorded
[43:24] One of the greatest trio on Low Key, one
[43:26] of the greatest Trio piano Trio records ever made.
[43:28] I think it's such a great record. It's such
[43:30] a weird, weird record.
[43:31] It's a record. It's awesome. Should do that.
[43:32] And what I love about it, are we
[43:34] Gonna become a jazz podcast again?
[43:35] We are. We, there's
[43:36] a little bit of a battle in the
[43:37] comments. Go on. So let us know.
[43:39] It's always guys with bebop in their
[43:40] names though, that are And
[43:41] With Fedor. No,
[43:42] not a Fedor Beret.
[43:43] Yeah, no. But, um, what's interesting about Money Jungle,
[43:46] one of the tracks that they put on this album,
[43:49] Juan Teal's Caravan.
[43:50] Oh, that's right. What best track. I know
[43:53] They put Caravan on
[43:54] It. What is that all about?
[43:55] Maybe Megan said had he buried the
[43:57] hatchet, buried the steel pipe. Right.
[43:58] Can't say that. You can't say that here. We can't.
[44:00] Sorry. This is Money Jungle from 1963.
[44:06] Man, dude, duke, Dude. Killing.
[44:07] I know we should do Money Jungle. Honestly,
[44:10] One of the most aggressive, beautiful,
[44:12] weirdest jazz trio records ever.
[44:14] But great, but great
[44:15] Incredible Actually approach.
[44:19] This is what you have to love about Duke Care.
[44:20] Like that record shouldn't have worked as good as it did.
[44:22] I love records like that. Can we just say
[44:23] That almost the entire last 15 years
[44:26] of Duke Ellington's recording career shouldn't have worked.
[44:28] I know. And some of his best stuff. Yeah.
[44:30] I mean, talk about a visionary and you can see Orleans
[44:32] Suite. That's a weird,
[44:33] that's a weird piece. That
[44:35] Duo album with Ray Brown is so odd.
[44:37] That's in the seventies. I
[44:38] Think Incre in the seventies, right before he passed away.
[44:40] Passed away. But this is
[44:41] where I think you can tell Mingus is inspired
[44:44] by his hero is from this kind of stuff.
[44:46] Like making these really interesting things
[44:47] that are not straight down the middle,
[44:49] that are curve balls. And both even
[44:51] Duke Ellington and John Coltrane
[44:52] shouldn't have worked as good as it did. It worked so well.
[44:56] I feel a Duke Ellington streak coming
[44:57] on for next season, Peter.
[44:59] So, um, anyway, this is, uh, uh, MGA's open letter to Duke.
[45:05] This Swinging is hail by
[45:07] The, okay.
[45:10] Pause. Sorry, I haven't done that in a while.
[45:12] We're gonna go back and listen to the beginning again,
[45:14] because a bunch of, first of all,
[45:15] the way this whole record starts
[45:17] with better get in your soul, like, kind of,
[45:19] it's very like, what's going on?
[45:21] Almost like voodoo where it's just kind of like congeals
[45:24] and what's gonna happen now.
[45:26] Just like, what's Going on? Yeah. What's going on?
[45:28] I mean, for like one of the most popular jazz records
[45:30] of all time, it's crazy, but this track,
[45:32] like MGA's decision now, did he make it at that moment?
[45:35] Was it calculated? Who cares?
[45:36] But his decision to wait to come in
[45:38] and start walking kill to me just like draws you in.
[45:41] And it's like, oh yes, I'm here for it. I
[45:43] Mean, this is the run of the album of this album that I,
[45:46] I think makes it so immortal.
[45:48] Yeah. Is the open letter to Duke Bird calls and,
[45:49] and fables of Fabi, I think takes, it's the meat of it.
[45:52] It breaks open the album. Yeah.
[45:54] I mean, the first four tracks are
[45:55] amazing. They're also, they're all great.
[45:56] The first three, I would say, well,
[45:58] really the first two are like the most I can
[45:59] understand why they put those first.
[46:01] All nine of these tracks Peter are incredible, honestly.
[46:03] Yeah. But I'm saying the first two are the most like
[46:06] potentially crossing over to anybody that for sure.
[46:08] I don't know if I like jazz. Okay. I like
[46:09] That. This is good jazz.
[46:11] Yeah, yeah, yeah. The s nter starts very high or very
[46:13] Low. We're not stretching. It starts very
[46:14] low,
[46:15] but now it starts to get high. 'cause this s**t is,
[46:16] But the way he comes, just check out
[46:17] you guys when Mingus comes in.
[46:22] Oh, Little countdown.
[46:24] Foreshadowing. Yeah. Little countdown.
[46:27] Fores. Same here. Well,
[46:28] Next year,
[46:33] M lets Dannie Richmond coming.
[46:34] Oh,
[46:37] Ah. Dannie
[46:42] Richmond still. Horse Parley here too.
[46:43] Yeah.
[46:45] Are Horse Parley and Dannie Richmond the most underrated
[46:48] rhythm section players probably.
[46:50] Yeah.
[47:04] Don't sleep on open letter to Duke.
[47:05] That is just Yeah. And it goes so many different places.
[47:08] This is almost like a mini suite, the whole
[47:09] Track. And it's something that
[47:10] we kind of haven't had yet. Right?
[47:12] We've had all this like, intricate backgrounds
[47:13] and these back and forths between the rhythm section
[47:15] and the horns and dropping out and clapping.
[47:17] Yeah. And now we just get like, no, we're just gonna burn.
[47:19] We can also tip. Right.
[47:20] You know, but the way they come in, man, I, I can't, like,
[47:23] I'm always, whenever I hear something else,
[47:25] I remember I was like, oh, little silly things
[47:28] are actually actually super important.
[47:29] Like, when do you come in?
[47:30] When does like, 'cause we,
[47:32] I mean, how would we have done this?
[47:33] We probably be like one, two altogether. Bam, you know?
[47:36] Yeah, yeah. Which is fine. But,
[47:38] So next up is bird calls.
[47:39] Now Peter, we mentioned that this is a tribute
[47:42] to Charlie Parker, however not true. Did you know that?
[47:45] I didn't, I never totally assumed.
[47:46] I mean, I, I always assumed it was,
[47:48] but I've never had any definitive Oh,
[47:50] so we are jazz journalists. Is that what you're saying?
[47:51] This is not a tribute to Charlie Parker. Lemme see
[47:53] Your card. Lemme see
[47:54] your jazz police card.
[47:55] Hold on. I got it right here. Hold on. I got my badge.
[47:57] A badge. It's a badge. Uh, this is, uh, bird call. Yeah.
[48:03] Can it have a dual meaning? I always
[48:06] just assumed it was about Bird.
[48:07] Yeah.
[48:09] Oh, Definitely about
[48:13] bird. Both birds.
[48:15] I think so. Yeah.
[48:19] Why do you say it's not about Charlie Parker?
[48:22] Because That's what my, that's what our producer
[48:25] Thoughts here. Am I
[48:26] supposed to be reading this?
[48:29] No. Shout out Liz, our producer for the, the research
[48:31] that us knuckleheads don't
[48:33] Do. She is a jazz journal.
[48:34] I don't know about
[48:35] that. You know, maybe it is.
[48:37] It's gotta be in there somewhere. I mean,
[48:38] Mingus probably said, nah, that's not for Charlie Parker.
[48:41] Yeah, but come on, you.
[48:44] Next up. So this is, I think probably when people think
[48:47] of this album, they probably think of this song as one
[48:49] of the quintessential songs of the album.
[48:51] Fables of Fbu, which was a protest against Arkansas Governor
[48:56] Orville Fbu.
[48:58] He sounds shady.
[48:59] I don't know a lot about Orville Fbu just, I mean,
[49:02] I like Orville Redden Barker.
[49:03] So he makes some fine popcorn.
[49:04] It sounds like the Orville
[49:05] Falba sounds like he was up to some bad
[49:07] Things. He sounds like the bad
[49:08] guy In a John Grisham novel, uh,
[49:10] he sent the National Guard to prevent black students.
[49:12] The Little Rock nine. Yeah.
[49:14] From attending Little Rock Central High School in
[49:16] 1957. Fun fact.
[49:17] The Little Rock nine, one of the the children
[49:21] was a young girl, um, whose name, I apologize,
[49:24] I'm forgetting, but she used to, I saw her for years.
[49:26] She was PBS NewsHour. One of the original anchors. Yeah.
[49:29] Um, she's retired now. Was wonderful.
[49:32] She was actually one of the little
[49:33] Orville, you're f*****g up man.
[49:35] Come on. Son of a b***h.
[49:37] Oh. So the original had lyrics,
[49:38] but Columbia wouldn't allow Mingus
[49:40] to publish the song with lyrics.
[49:41] So they released it as an instrumental. Come on, Columbia.
[49:43] Yeah. Come on. Stand up Columbia. See,
[49:45] We're always like 1959.
[49:46] What a glorious year. We
[49:47] Forget. Yeah. Not quite. No.
[49:48] But Mingus did release a version of it
[49:50] with the lyrics the following year as
[49:52] original Faubus fables.
[49:54] He started off the song saying it's dedicated to the first
[49:57] or second or third, all American heel.
[49:59] Heel. HEEL. This is by the, I'm now I'm gonna stop,
[50:05] Stop it.
[50:06] This is one of the greatest compositions of the fifties.
[50:09] This is an incredible piece of music. Yeah. I'll say that.
[50:31] Orchestration we
[50:32] Have.
[50:34] It's tell the story too, right?
[50:40] Orchestration. Damn.
[50:41] But there's like a, there's a little bit of a
[50:45] military action element to this.
[50:48] Ah,
[50:55] sharp knives.
[51:07] Ah,
[51:08] Unbelievable. MEUs Master
[51:09] the segue. Unbelievable. I mean,
[51:11] And that's a, it's not a
[51:12] complicated thing you just did there.
[51:14] No, it's very sophisticated though. Very effective.
[51:20] The way the trombone comes in on the second note there.
[51:23] Ah, Jimmy kn
[51:41] mine with a major seven.
[51:44] Oh, Unbelievable.
[51:48] Mm-hmm.
[51:56] I mean, you think this has influenced the
[51:57] musicians over the I meanly how many,
[51:59] And I mean, oh yeah.
[52:00] This is, and I mean,
[52:05] to make such a overt political statement
[52:10] of such beauty, but there's also like, um,
[52:14] there's a certain, is it mockery?
[52:18] There's a disdain that's built into this even as beautiful.
[52:21] It is. Yeah. You know, and he named it.
[52:23] So this is not supposed to be like obscured or anything.
[52:26] And jazz, the stands as, as a piece of beautiful art.
[52:28] 100%. Which is something that's always been in jazz.
[52:32] Right? It's always been a part of the music.
[52:33] Is it still, is it
[52:34] Falling off? There's,
[52:35] I mean, there's corners. We need more of this.
[52:37] There's corners for Sure. Me
[52:38] and Charlie Mingus out here.
[52:40] Oh, it's a masterpiece.
[52:43] It's a masterpiece. Yeah.
[52:47] I love this horse, Parlan.
[52:51] Oh yeah.
[52:59] And when they come out of it, ah,
[53:05] ah,
[53:11] it's supposed to be
[53:12] uncomfortable too, when they're like, it's
[53:13] Not supposed to feel Smooth now.
[53:18] Oh man. Thank you. Charles Mingus.
[53:33] So right there, that effect
[53:34] that he's getting is on the base.
[53:35] He's slapping the base itself.
[53:37] Yeah. Which has a whole history guard back
[53:39] Jimmy Blanton pre that.
[53:41] Um, ah, yeah.
[53:45] I mean, Mingus had such a dramatic flare, like for
[53:50] infusing the music with this like, drama,
[53:54] but then also just very like, beautiful swinging stuff.
[53:57] Bluesy, like, there's some, there's like comfort food,
[54:00] but then it's like some really
[54:01] challenging stuff put in there.
[54:06] I mean, it, it helps this cause
[54:08] that this band is so swinging.
[54:11] It, it makes it, oh, you think? Yeah. No, I mean, oh, great.
[54:14] Great. Players contribute to the, to the
[54:15] expedition. You're
[54:17] Mocking me now.
[54:19] Like I am Orval. Th
[54:23] Orval. Or come
[54:24] on Orville.
[54:25] Um, I do want to, I actually do wanna try to bring up the,
[54:27] uh, version with lyrics because I think it's, oh yeah.
[54:30] But how great it, so the orchestration of the beginning of
[54:33] that with the, the Baba
[54:36] and that trombone is not playing on the first note
[54:38] of the phrase, but on the second notes of the phrase.
[54:40] And you know, with orchestration, your goal is
[54:43] to make new instruments by combining instruments.
[54:45] Mm. And that's what Mingus is doing there.
[54:48] Like any great orchestrator, whether it's
[54:50] for an orchestra in classical music or for a film score,
[54:53] or for a rock band or for this kind of music,
[54:56] Mingus is top tier at getting new instruments.
[54:59] Yeah. There's even a new, there's an instrument that happens
[55:02] with those, uh, the comping that happens behind
[55:04] that saxophone solo of, of Horace Parlan
[55:06] and dun dun with the slap on the base
[55:09] with the slap. Right. That's a new rhythm
[55:10] Instrument That he's making by combining those things.
[55:13] Absolutely.
[55:14] Oh man, this is great. And I love,
[55:16] like his first big label, big budget.
[55:18] I know Columbia. He's like, we're going,
[55:20] we we're going with, uh, FBU. Fables.
[55:22] No Fear. Fables of Fbu.
[55:25] All right. Here we go. Thank you ladies and gentlemen.
[55:28] Remember no applause. And keep it down your drinks.
[55:30] Don't rally your ice and your glasses.
[55:32] And don't ring the cash. Richard, you got it covered.
[55:35] All right. I'd like to, um, continue, continue,
[55:39] continue this set with a competition dedicated to the first
[55:43] or second or third, all American Hill fathers
[55:45] and it's title, the Fables of Fathers. Oh
[55:48] Lord. Don't
[55:49] let us, oh Lord.
[55:53] Don't let
[56:01] no more
[56:03] Mm. No more
[56:04] squashes Doesn't seem like that big
[56:08] of an ask. No,
[56:09] I know. And I love
[56:10] this, this kind of like militaristic undertone,
[56:13] police state kind of a thing, even though it sounds great,
[56:17] you know, gonna swing like that dichotomy.
[56:21] Right? I mean, Mingus man a giant, not, not the voice
[56:26] of an angel, we wouldn't say, but like he's he's singing it.
[56:29] He's singing it while he's playing. Uh,
[56:31] Next up Pussycat dos.
[56:35] Oh Yeah.
[56:40] He's a great track.
[57:01] The sound of this album to and shout out to
[57:06] And, uh, Fred Plow. Yeah.
[57:09] Shut out Freddy. Hard pan on those horns. I love it.
[57:15] Ah,
[57:25] ah, that's,
[57:27] that's a Mingus progression right there. Ah,
[57:31] Incredible. Next
[57:32] up is a tribute. Another tribute. This is the
[57:34] Last track. This is the last
[57:35] track track. We're
[57:36] Moving through this album. Last
[57:37] track on the album is a tribute
[57:38] to Jelly Roll Morton called Jelly Roll.
[57:39] I love playing this song.
[57:41] I've got to do this album a little
[57:42] bit with our own Bob Debu.
[57:44] Uh, Bob hosted a 1959 day at our very own Jazz St.
[57:47] Louis years. Did you play Giant Steps? We did not play Giant
[57:50] Steps Now 'cause it was released 1960.
[57:53] Um, question for you on this.
[57:54] Are we gonna listen to,
[57:56] 'cause we can start to get into categories
[57:57] or we can listen to this and then,
[57:58] but I just want a question.
[57:59] Are we gonna listen to the original version of this,
[58:02] the four minute-ish version?
[58:04] I, I don't,
[58:06] Because this is like a Spotify thing where they kind of,
[58:09] I think this is six minutes here. Yeah.
[58:10] So this is not the original version. Yeah.
[58:12] This is really good.
[58:15] I get more slapping here on the base. This
[58:17] Is so great.
[58:18] Yeah. There was, in the original version, there was a,
[58:20] a splice where like two minutes and 40 seconds was taken
[58:22] Out. Yeah. It's like one of
[58:23] the worst.
[58:24] Well, I shouldn't say it's one of the worst for 1959.
[58:26] It's not bad. It's my only equivalent
[58:27] With They fixed it though. Yeah.
[58:28] Well they,
[58:31] but it's such a part of the record.
[58:35] New Orleans
[58:37] Very fancy. Yeah.
[58:38] I'm gonna give Room Killed
[58:39] At Age. I'm
[58:40] already, we on one of those PBS parties
[58:42] for those corny shows that comes on to
[58:44] Quote Bobby Hill.
[58:45] I'm gonna give Room service the jangle
[58:47] and order up some A two Fey. That's
[58:49] Okay.
[58:50] We might have to call our friends to make sure we can
[58:53] De Bossier and de Quis b******t.
[58:57] I don't know if our new fans know about De Bossier.
[59:01] Oh. But man Mangoes could like bring this like,
[59:06] old timey new, but, but it's not corny.
[59:10] It's not at all corny. If I try to write
[59:12] Some in lesser hands in Cornier
[59:14] Hands Oh my God.
[59:16] Because he's always got a little mingus twist to it.
[59:18] Man, guy as cool as hell. There's no doubt about it. It
[59:21] Man, his baseline, like under not, I mean, oh,
[59:23] Charlie Mingus is a great bass player that, okay.
[59:25] I'm no genius to say that,
[59:27] but it's always, look, it's, it's baseline.
[59:29] And so like Mingus,
[59:31] I do feel like sometimes we don't quite put him in the,
[59:34] like, Paul Chambers, Ray Brown, Jimmy Blanton category,
[59:38] but I think he maybe should be it.
[59:40] It's because he is probably the greatest
[59:43] bass jazz bass playing composer.
[59:45] Mm-hmm. Of all time. Yeah.
[59:46] You know, you could say put, make a easy case for that.
[59:49] But we forget like he's in kind of the Mount Rushmore.
[59:52] Of course he is. You know, top five, top 10,
[59:54] just bass players buddy abilities
[59:56] and swing intonation. Bo you know,
[59:58] It's Charles mga. It's
[59:59] Charles mga. Sorry. Come on man.
[1:00:00] Okay, let's get to some categories.
[1:00:01] Peter, what's your desert Island
[1:00:02] track? From this album Goodbye
[1:00:03] Pork by Hat Man, I think that's one of the most beautiful,
[1:00:06] gorgeous, to me it's kind of like, it's gorgeous, you know,
[1:00:08] a horse silver piece.
[1:00:09] It's kind of like, um, Wallford Debbie.
[1:00:12] It's just a beautiful, and it's truly a jazz ballad, right?
[1:00:16] Yeah. It's not a, it's not a, it's not even like,
[1:00:19] like sometimes there's beautiful jazz ballads
[1:00:21] that are written in the style of, um,
[1:00:24] great American songbook, and this is not that.
[1:00:26] You know what I mean? Yeah. It's got that kind
[1:00:28] of like ballad beauty and stuff.
[1:00:30] But it's very much an instrumental jazz ballad.
[1:00:34] Standard. Standard. What
[1:00:35] You got from me? I got, uh,
[1:00:36] fables of faus.
[1:00:37] I just think it's an incredible work of art.
[1:00:39] I think it's a, it is beautiful protest song. Apex
[1:00:42] Moment. Are you gonna, but you're gonna
[1:00:43] be p****d off on
[1:00:44] that desert island every time you hear that.
[1:00:46] Every day. You gotta remember about
[1:00:47] listening to that. Is that how you wanna go out? No.
[1:00:48] I'm gonna remember that human beings, uh,
[1:00:49] there are human beings out in the world
[1:00:50] that make incredible art to stand up, uh,
[1:00:53] to actually abuse of power.
[1:00:56] And I think that's important. It gives me hope.
[1:00:58] And maybe like, oh, maybe there's someone out there standing
[1:01:00] up for me on this desert island
[1:01:01] trying to get me off this thing. You know?
[1:01:03] See, that's, that's deep man. Can be inspiring me.
[1:01:04] See how I'm on, I'm on my desert island.
[1:01:06] Just want to hear some, most, most beautiful ballet.
[1:01:07] What does that say about me versus
[1:01:09] you? You're still standing up.
[1:01:10] Okay. Apex moment. What do you got?
[1:01:12] Okay, so we listened to it already,
[1:01:14] but if you want to go back to it on Boogie Stop Shuffle.
[1:01:17] I love the beginning of Horace Parlan solo.
[1:01:21] Like with the backgrounds. Like this is, yeah.
[1:01:25] Coming out of the, coming
[1:01:26] Out of The sax solo
[1:01:33] and those really quiet lines underneath.
[1:01:38] And He, it's so killing man.
[1:01:40] And he keeps going. He goes up there
[1:01:45] And Doing the same
[1:01:46] line and then here.
[1:01:52] Oh, I mean,
[1:01:59] great, great moments in swing.
[1:02:00] Remember that CBS great moments in history.
[1:02:03] I also, I have Horace Harlin's solo on
[1:02:05] Better Get It in Your Soul.
[1:02:07] Yeah. So like two Harlan
[1:02:09] HHorace Parlan steal this record.
[1:02:11] Horace Parlan. We used to have a category.
[1:02:12] Did who stole the record? Yeah.
[1:02:13] Horace Parlan might have stolen this.
[1:02:15] I know. But Mingus Mingus is so killing,
[1:02:17] so it's back up here bit.
[1:02:20] All this stuff, the same kind of thing
[1:02:21] that he's doing on the, on
[1:02:22] The, it's so cocky to play a solo
[1:02:24] where you're not really soloing, you know?
[1:02:27] So great. Super, super inspiring. Well, okay.
[1:02:29] Bespoke playlist title. What do you got, Peter? Well, I'm
[1:02:31] Really gonna go out a limb on this one.
[1:02:33] I'm gonna surprise you. I'm gonna go off cuff
[1:02:36] and call it 1959.
[1:02:38] Exclamation point. Exclamation
[1:02:39] Point. You're so creative, which
[1:02:40] is what I love about you.
[1:02:42] I'm gonna call it the Golden Year,
[1:02:43] which is pretty much the same thing.
[1:02:45] A little bit, a little bit shinier. Yeah.
[1:02:46] Uh, quibble bits. What do you got? Well,
[1:02:48] On that original version, the edit coming out of the, uh,
[1:02:51] the sax solo going into the Mingus is one
[1:02:54] of the most abrupt, weird edits on a record
[1:02:57] that feels like it was just,
[1:02:59] they came in and just did all first takes.
[1:03:00] I don't know that they did. Yeah, they probably didn't.
[1:03:02] But it's got that feel that it's so abrupt
[1:03:04] and weird, I would say.
[1:03:05] But it's such a part of it.
[1:03:06] So when I listen to the Spotify version
[1:03:08] now, I was like, wait, where was that?
[1:03:09] Or earlier today. And I was like,
[1:03:11] oh yeah, of course they would've fixed that.
[1:03:12] So that's one of the advantages.
[1:03:13] But I'm also like, man, that's some of the magic.
[1:03:15] It's like the last track. It's a weird edit.
[1:03:18] I'm sure it was because I mean,
[1:03:20] I think this record's like 46 minutes or 45 minutes.
[1:03:22] Yeah. Which is getting on the long side for an lp.
[1:03:24] Yeah. It needs to be like 43. Yeah.
[1:03:26] Yeah. For, I mean, not, I don't think it's getting
[1:03:27] musically, it's just the qua, you know, how they used,
[1:03:29] especially in the late fifties.
[1:03:30] Yeah, yeah. With LPs the Qua, the longer it was, the more,
[1:03:33] um, qualitative decisions they had to make
[1:03:36] to degrade it a little bit.
[1:03:37] So that, that's probably why they lopped it off.
[1:03:39] 'cause the plane's great on it, but that's a little
[1:03:40] Equipment. I mean, my only equipment
[1:03:41] is with Columbia Records
[1:03:43] for not allowing the lyrics to fables
[1:03:44] of Alvis on there. Oh, why?
[1:03:46] That's what are You're not a company, man. Come on.
[1:03:49] Uh, speedometer.
[1:03:50] So here, Peter, interesting thing about the s Nobo in this
[1:03:52] case, I wrote down five oh number,
[1:03:54] and then, then next to that you wrote down,
[1:03:57] ha haha. And I'm just
[1:03:58] No, no, no, just two ha's. Ha ha. Oh,
[1:04:00] Sorry. Haha. Haha.
[1:04:01] Why Wait, you say five? I say five because, haha.
[1:04:05] I was say five. I Never say five.
[1:04:06] I know You always say five.
[1:04:08] And I, I put nothing.
[1:04:09] 'cause I wanted to like, go through this experience.
[1:04:11] I think this is a five.
[1:04:14] I would've to agree, because this is your classic.
[1:04:16] Like how could it, I mean,
[1:04:18] there's certainly like a snobby level to be like, I like,
[1:04:21] so if you're with like, general company
[1:04:23] and you're like, what's your favorite record?
[1:04:24] Someone's like, uh, Phil Col, uh, Genesis, uh,
[1:04:28] three Sides Live,
[1:04:29] and someone else is like Michael Jackson off the Wall.
[1:04:32] Then you say Mingus.
[1:04:34] Ah, you're, you're off the speedometer, right?
[1:04:36] You're off the charts. You're 10. Yeah. Right.
[1:04:38] I guess so. But For jazz records,
[1:04:40] this is a one actually,
[1:04:42] because it's, it's very, it's on Rolling Stones,
[1:04:45] 500 greatest albums of all time,
[1:04:47] Which is kind of incredible. This
[1:04:48] is 100%. It's pretty far up. And you know
[1:04:50] What's, it's not four, nine.
[1:04:51] You know what's so crazy is depending on the personality
[1:04:53] type of the person that you're trying to, to introduce jazz
[1:04:56] to any of those sort of big five albums from 1959, kind
[1:05:00] of blue, blue timeout, mga, aam, timeout, shape of jazz com,
[1:05:03] and portrait and Jazz.
[1:05:04] I think you could find one of those
[1:05:06] as the entree into the music from that, that year.
[1:05:10] Yeah. Because they're all so accessible.
[1:05:12] I would put this as the snobby of those five.
[1:05:13] You even shape of jazz to come, I
[1:05:15] Would put Shape of Jazz to come as
[1:05:16] a little bit more snobby than this.
[1:05:16] But, but this is, but that's such
[1:05:17] An obvious, like real snobs would be like, oh,
[1:05:20] that's not even top five for Ornette Records.
[1:05:22] I don't know about that. Um, better than KOB kind of blue.
[1:05:25] No, no, I
[1:05:28] Different.
[1:05:29] He can't commit. I'm gonna say no.
[1:05:31] Why though? Why, like, hearing this again,
[1:05:34] experiencing this with you and our dear listeners, like,
[1:05:37] I'm more excited about this record now, which is crazy.
[1:05:40] 'cause what do we talk about going into this?
[1:05:42] I was like, I don't know if I love this album.
[1:05:44] I like this album. Yeah.
[1:05:45] To quote a very good friend of mine
[1:05:47] who shall remain nameless.
[1:05:48] I like this album. I don't love,
[1:05:49] but I mean, I, I almost feel like I,
[1:05:52] it's like deeper than love or like for me with this record.
[1:05:55] Mm. Like, there's, there's an authenticity,
[1:05:57] there's a vibrancy.
[1:05:58] Like this is the least dated piece of art from any year
[1:06:02] Of I You're right about that 20th century
[1:06:04] I've ever heard. I think you're right about that.
[1:06:05] It's crazy. Like how much this stands up.
[1:06:08] It's almost like, it's exactly like it came out then.
[1:06:10] Now could you, is kind of blew a more beautiful record. Yes.
[1:06:12] Is it a more romantic record? Yes.
[1:06:15] Is it a better record though? Yes. Oh, okay.
[1:06:18] I'm gonna say maybe. Okay.
[1:06:20] I want, if there are any static statisticians listening,
[1:06:22] please compile how many maybes
[1:06:24] or evens Peter's done with kind of blue
[1:06:26] and how many fives Peter's put on the speedometer.
[1:06:29] Because I think it's pretty much every episode, if
[1:06:30] You look at my resume, you might think I was a part-time
[1:06:32] smooth jazz musician.
[1:06:33] 'cause some of the artists I've worked with,
[1:06:35] but I am not a smooth jazz guy.
[1:06:37] Sorry. That you're a smooth jazz guy and you love KLB.
[1:06:39] Oh, okay. Because I always say that. Like,
[1:06:40] that's the first smooth jazz record acc
[1:06:41] Months, Man.
[1:06:42] I'm gonna go 10 on this one.
[1:06:45] I'm going 10 as well. No, You have eight. I'm you
[1:06:47] Have nine. You have nine. But
[1:06:48] I, I'm excited about this.
[1:06:50] I opted, I'm now excited. And I think the cover, I mean
[1:06:52] The, the, the re the cover's Perfect. Cover's perfect.
[1:06:54] I, I, you know, um, I, I mean nine 10, so shout out s Neil
[1:06:59] Fujita, who was the, an incredible graphic designer.
[1:07:03] He did, um, timeout from this
[1:07:06] and a bunch of other Columbia records.
[1:07:07] He did this one. He was a very interesting man.
[1:07:10] He was born in Hawaii American,
[1:07:13] but of Japanese descent, both of his parents.
[1:07:15] And like during, he was in art school in California.
[1:07:18] He was during World War ii. He was interned.
[1:07:21] I mean, you talk about injustices that are all over this,
[1:07:23] you're being addressed in this record.
[1:07:24] He was sent to an internment camp for several years, um,
[1:07:29] and then volunteered for the US Army, the very country,
[1:07:33] his country that put him in an internment camp.
[1:07:36] Um, and went and fought in in Europe for the US
[1:07:40] and then went to the Pacific Theater
[1:07:41] and was an interpreter, was integral with the war there.
[1:07:44] And then when he came out,
[1:07:45] finished design school was incredible.
[1:07:47] I mean, he's actually designed the cover for the paperback,
[1:07:50] or I, I guess the hard cover too for The Godfather,
[1:07:52] the First Godfather, which is one
[1:07:53] of the most iconic novels ever.
[1:07:56] Um, artwork.
[1:07:57] He did Cold Blood, the book by Truman Capote In Cold
[1:08:00] Blood. Uh, in
[1:08:01] cold Blood. Exactly.
[1:08:02] And, uh, did a bunch
[1:08:04] of amazing things at Columbia Records. So it's
[1:08:06] Wanted, it's an incredible cover.
[1:08:07] Beautiful cover. Yeah.
[1:08:09] Because we look, we talk about the musicians, the art.
[1:08:11] That is the crux of it.
[1:08:12] But when we talk about the engineers, the producers,
[1:08:15] the cover up, we don't give that enough.
[1:08:16] Do sometimes. And that's, that's, that's our bad. But,
[1:08:20] Um, Peter, what do you got up next?
[1:08:22] Man, I got just
[1:08:23] 'cause of the Duke Ellington, like hovering above,
[1:08:26] like this, you talked about the orchestration,
[1:08:28] the composition, the influence.
[1:08:29] I got Duke Ellington piano in the background,
[1:08:31] which came out I believe in Right.
[1:08:33] The next year. Either 60
[1:08:34] or 61, same year as as, um, anyway, that's one
[1:08:39] of Duke Ellington's weirder records,
[1:08:41] but I love that record. Can
[1:08:43] We, we gotta do An episode on, I think that is the,
[1:08:44] like if I was gonna recommend a Duke Ellington record Yeah.
[1:08:47] To anyone. One record, if you
[1:08:48] haven't checked that on piano in the
[1:08:49] background. Incredible record. We
[1:08:50] Gotta do all the weird Duke Ellington albums from
[1:08:52] the era on an episode. I actually
[1:08:54] Got weird too on this one. Well,
[1:08:55] I'm gonna, I I kind of, I'm calling an audible here,
[1:08:57] so I'm gonna put, I have a couple of suggestions.
[1:09:00] I would put Money Jungle Up next. Oh.
[1:09:02] I think after hearing that. Yep. Caravan.
[1:09:04] I think that would be a great call.
[1:09:05] I'm also gonna make a, a bold prediction here.
[1:09:08] So Cecile McClure, Salvan friend of the show. Yes.
[1:09:10] Hopefully friend of the pod. Yeah. Incredible vocalist.
[1:09:13] Yeah. Um, released an album this year called O Snapp. Yeah.
[1:09:17] And she is just as, I think Mingus is so theatrical
[1:09:21] and so incredible with his themes on his, on his albums.
[1:09:25] Like that O Snapp album is one
[1:09:27] of the best albums I've heard in years and years and years.
[1:09:31] And like her, she paints such vivid pictures
[1:09:35] with everything she does.
[1:09:37] But the album before this too, the French album. Yeah.
[1:09:39] That was incredible. Misal or something like that. Yeah.
[1:09:41] All in French. Also just like captivating. Yeah.
[1:09:43] And I just wanna shout out Cecile, I've never met Cecile.
[1:09:46] I'm such a huge fan.
[1:09:47] I hope eventually that she comes
[1:09:49] and does something here with us at Open Studio.
[1:09:50] 'cause she's so amazing. And, uh,
[1:09:53] I just think she has this thing too, of like, not just like,
[1:09:56] we're gonna now,
[1:09:57] now we're gonna just burn on some tunes,
[1:09:59] which she can do. Yeah. But I'm
[1:10:00] Gonna, yeah. She has an amazing voice
[1:10:01] where she
[1:10:02] could just, she could do whatever
[1:10:03] She wants that. Yeah. But she
[1:10:04] really is an incredible
[1:10:05] storyteller and incredible artist.
[1:10:06] And I think you could tell she cares passionately about
[1:10:09] actually saying something going against the stream Yeah.
[1:10:12] Of what a lot of her contemporaries would not be doing.
[1:10:15] Agreed. Which would be just like,
[1:10:16] I'm just gonna do straight down the middle every time.
[1:10:17] Yeah. She is almost
[1:10:19] never straight down the middle. She's always, Hey
[1:10:20] Lou, we will, man.
[1:10:21] She's always thinking outside the, outside the box.
[1:10:24] And so I just wanna shout out Cecile on that one. Great.
[1:10:26] That's a fantastic call. Yeah. Oh, Snap's great.
[1:10:28] I'm voting for that. I'm sure it'll be on the ground.
[1:10:30] I'm gonna be voting for that. It's incredible.
[1:10:32] I'm sorry, I'm not supposed to say what I'm voting for.
[1:10:33] It's unbelievable. Yeah. Anyway.
[1:10:35] Um, how about some, uh, how about a little,
[1:10:38] how about a little, uh, little gala?
[1:10:40] Love gala. So we've,
[1:10:41] we've been getting some great podcast reviews.
[1:10:43] Thanks everybody who's left a rating and review.
[1:10:45] We do have an agreement here.
[1:10:46] We give you this podcast for free.
[1:10:48] Except it's, it's not free. It's not free at all.
[1:10:50] It's not free, sir. It's expensive. It's
[1:10:51] Af it costs you your time and effort
[1:10:53] because wherever you, Hey,
[1:10:55] Look, our listeners hey, are so great.
[1:10:57] Their time and effort. They, they Bill listen,
[1:10:58] Like our Friends at De bo de bo,
[1:11:00] they billing 500 an hour wait, that's probably low nowadays.
[1:11:03] No, we have, we have Rich folks as listeners.
[1:11:05] Rich in both, I'm sure monetarily and
[1:11:09] Spirit Easily.
[1:11:11] Um, but please take your valuable time and leave us a rating
[1:11:15] and review wherever you get your podcast from.
[1:11:17] Whether that's YouTube, apple Podcasts, Spotify,
[1:11:19] here's one from Stitcher.
[1:11:21] Nope. Here's one from Strange Brain Pure Music.
[1:11:24] Nerdism at its finest. Oh, your Nerdism needs.
[1:11:28] That was just for you. Strange Brain. Yeah.
[1:11:30] And here's one from hell. Yo.
[1:11:33] Super hell you Oh, but an Umla on the o
[1:11:36] Hell.
[1:11:37] Super. Various topics. Incredibly well researched.
[1:11:40] Shout out Liz. And always enriched by personal views.
[1:11:42] Amazing. Uh,
[1:11:44] I like that. That's, that's,
[1:11:45] is that
[1:11:45] a compliment sandwich there? A little
[1:11:46] Bit. It might be, it
[1:11:47] might be
[1:11:48] Enriched by personal views.
[1:11:49] They're not journalists.
[1:11:50] Here's one, uh, here's a review.
[1:11:52] Uh, five stars from Sings
[1:11:54] and drinks in the UK as a lifelong museo muso
[1:11:58] and sometime part-time jazz singer.
[1:12:00] This podcast gets perfectly for me.
[1:12:01] I love the raw enthusiasm these guys have for the music.
[1:12:04] Then there are probably two levels of music geek up from me
[1:12:06] so I can enjoy their harmonic analysis
[1:12:08] and historical nuggets.
[1:12:10] I spent a long train journey doing a deep dive on Stevie
[1:12:12] Wonder with their album reviews, which got me hooked.
[1:12:14] That makes me feel great.
[1:12:16] Combo of jazz, popular jazz, jazz influence. Pop.
[1:12:18] It's perfect. I think Youo just like, or sings
[1:12:21] and drinks UK Just nailed it there. Yeah. So thanks.
[1:12:23] Can I do this last one? Yeah, please. That was great.
[1:12:25] Uh, thank you. From Bimo Bimo Bimo, uh,
[1:12:29] you both have enriched my musical life so much
[1:12:32] by turning me on to things I may have overlooked over the
[1:12:35] years and reminding me of the amazing records I
[1:12:37] wore out years ago.
[1:12:38] I'm sorry. Are you texting somebody?
[1:12:40] You, have you got another podcast to go to?
[1:12:42] Sorry, I wasn't paying attention. What'd you say?
[1:12:45] I love experiencing for the first time
[1:12:47] and re-experiencing music with you both.
[1:12:50] I can't thank you enough. Well, you know what, your review
[1:12:52] and your adherence to gala, the gentleman
[1:12:55] and ladies agreement is much appreciated.
[1:12:58] Mo Yeah, Peter, I'm sorry, I am on my phone,
[1:12:59] but I was just looking up something here.
[1:13:00] Hold and it says right here, it says, um, until next time
[1:13:05] You'll hear It.
[1:13:06] Yeah, that's what it says. Oh,
[1:13:08] Okay.

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