# Second Chance: He focuses on empowering returning citizens and at-risk youth to reintegrate successfully into society.

An episode of [Money Making Conversations Master Class](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1264705641), 30 Dec 2025, 34 min.

Audio: https://podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/b1db7263-d1a3-4d00-8976-af62012aab44/f68587fb-ef65-4d9f-88de-b3a8001f85a0/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=35a10561-3e1b-4d05-a529-af62012aab6a

Listen and subscribe to Money Making Conversations on iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, www.moneymakingconversations.com/subscribe/ or wherever you listen to podcasts. New Money Making Conversations episodes drop daily. I want to alert you, so you don’t miss out on expert analysis and insider perspectives from my guests who provide tips that can help you uplift the community, improve your financial planning, motivation, or advice on how to be a successful entrepreneur. Keep winning! Two-time Emmy and Three-time NAACP Image Award-winning, television Executive Producer Rushion McDonald interviewed Blayther Sabbat. Purpose of the Interview The interview aims to: • Showcase Blayther Sabbat’s mission through his nonprofit Pillars of Success, which empowers returning citizens and at-risk youth. • Discuss strategies for reducing recidivism and creating pathways to success via mentorship, financial literacy, and career development. • Inspire individuals and communities to take action toward social impact and economic empowerment. Key Takeaways • Background and Motivation • First-generation Haitian-American from Washington, D.C. • Athletic background (DeMatha Catholic High School football) instilled discipline and leadership. • Personal experiences with family and community challenges inspired his commitment to mentorship and reentry programs. • Pillars of Success • A 501(c)(3) nonprofit providing wraparound services: • Mentorship • Financial literacy • Life and work skills • Career development and housing support • Focus on empowering returning citizens and at-risk youth to reintegrate successfully into society. • Challenges and Misconceptions • Common stigma: People assume returning citizens are “bad individuals.” • Reality: Many are in survival mode and lack resources, not character. • Success requires personal accountability and willingness to change. • Impact and Measurement • Success is defined as progress, even small steps like consistent routines or positive mindset. • Emphasis on action: “The difference between success and failure is taking action.” • Affordable Housing Advocacy • Sabbat worked at D.C. Housing Authority for 8 years, rising from clerical assistant to certified housing inspector. • Purchased property at age 26, faced conflict-of-interest issues, and resigned to pursue real estate and community impact full-time. • Career Development and Partnerships • Promotes trades (plumbing, HVAC, carpentry, IT) as sustainable career paths. • Partnerships with Google for digital literacy tools and scholarships. • Collaborates with local universities and organizations for training and job placement. • Financial Literacy • Learned through personal experience buying property on a $35K salary. • Advocates understanding credit, banking, and responsible money management. • Call to Action • Support through donations, mentorship, volunteering, and spreading awareness. • Website: www.pillarsofsuccess202.com Notable Quotes • On stigma: “People judge returning citizens as bad individuals without knowing their story. Many are just in survival mode.” • On success: “Progress—any form of it—is success. The difference between success and failure is taking action.” • On leadership: “We don’t succeed unless they succeed.” • On financial literacy: “It’s not about how much you make—it’s about what you do with it.” • On courage: “I walk by faith. Fearless. Failure and fear are the same—you learn from mistakes.” #SHMS #STRAW #BEST Money Making Conversations Master Class with Rushion McDonald is America's premier entrepreneurship, business leadership, financial literacy, and wealth-building podcast featuring successful entrepreneurs, executives, founders, celebrities, and industry experts sharing actionable insights for professional and financial success. Business Podcast Entrepreneurship Small Business Business Growth Financial Literacy Wealth Building Black Entrepreneurs Minority Business…

## Transcript

[0:00] Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Rashan McDonald host this weekly Money Making Conversation
[0:03] Speaker 1: Masterclass show. The interviews and information that this show provides
[0:06] Speaker 1: off for everyone. It's time to stop reading other people's
[0:09] Speaker 1: success stories and start living your own. If you want
[0:12] Speaker 1: to be a guest on my show, Money Making Conversations Masterclass,
[0:16] Speaker 1: please visit our website, Moneymaking Conversations dot com and click
[0:20] Speaker 1: to be a guest button. If you're a small business owner, entrepreneur,
[0:23] Speaker 1: motivational speaker, influencer, a nonprofit, now let's get started. My
[0:28] Speaker 1: guest is a Haitian American entrepreneur from Washington, DC. His
[0:33] Speaker 1: Pillars of a Success is a nonprofit organization that is
[0:36] Speaker 1: dedicated to empower returning citizens and at risk youth by
[0:41] Speaker 1: providing comprehensive wrap around services such as mentorship, financial literacy,
[0:47] Speaker 1: life and work skills to assist them what it's successful
[0:50] Speaker 1: re entry back to our society. Please welcome to Money
[0:54] Speaker 1: Making Conversation Blather. It's about how you doing, sir.
[0:57] Speaker 2: I'm doing great, are you Blather?
[1:00] Speaker 3: That's a beautiful name. Give us some background on that
[1:02] Speaker 3: and Sabbat.
[1:03] Speaker 4: Yes, so Sabbat is a Hastian last name. I believe
[1:07] Speaker 4: it originated has some origin back in Iran as well.
[1:12] Speaker 4: Blake that I asked my father where he got the
[1:14] Speaker 4: name from. He mentioned he's seen an I d at
[1:17] Speaker 4: the airport and he found some id and he liked
[1:20] Speaker 4: the He liked the name, so he thought to go
[1:21] Speaker 4: with it.
[1:22] Speaker 1: Well, you know, my name is Rashan, and I know
[1:24] Speaker 1: that names can create unique reactions and unique behavior and
[1:30] Speaker 1: also put you down the path of uniqueness, you know.
[1:33] Speaker 1: And I'm not saying people with names like Ricky and
[1:35] Speaker 1: Bill and Betty can't do unique things. But do you
[1:40] Speaker 1: feel your name has had an impact made you, giving
[1:44] Speaker 1: you a different perspective on your directions that you take
[1:46] Speaker 1: in your life.
[1:47] Speaker 2: Absolutely? Absolutely my name.
[1:50] Speaker 4: I know for sure, I'm the only Blake in the world,
[1:52] Speaker 4: unless you know I have I don't have any sons yet,
[1:55] Speaker 4: but you know, hopefully one day I will, but I
[1:57] Speaker 4: will pass the name now. But it's definitely impact or
[2:00] Speaker 4: you know, it's Rungs and bell, so I feel like
[2:02] Speaker 4: it's you know, I definitely put some up behind that
[2:04] Speaker 4: well place.
[2:05] Speaker 1: Whenever I break people on this show. I wanted a
[2:07] Speaker 1: little background a bottom. This is money Making Conversation master class.
[2:10] Speaker 1: I've read your intro and it's about you're an uplift person.
[2:14] Speaker 1: Your person's by extending the hand. You know, about mentorship,
[2:18] Speaker 1: Where is that coming from?
[2:20] Speaker 4: So just growing up, I didn't come from a you know,
[2:23] Speaker 4: a wealthy family. I didn't come from a middle class family.
[2:26] Speaker 4: It was more like I'm first generation in DC. My
[2:29] Speaker 4: parents were straight from Haiti. The life that they wanted
[2:33] Speaker 4: for me or expected from me, it wasn't the life
[2:35] Speaker 4: that I wanted for myself. I was always somebody that
[2:38] Speaker 4: you know, I was always a leader. I was never
[2:40] Speaker 4: a follower. There was I always wanted to lead the pack.
[2:43] Speaker 4: I always wanted and I was the oldest of my siblings.
[2:46] Speaker 4: I was you know, I had to be a father
[2:48] Speaker 4: before I had to be a father. You know, my
[2:50] Speaker 4: mother was, you know, always working. There were times where
[2:52] Speaker 4: I come home from school and you know, my siblings
[2:55] Speaker 4: were the ones leaning on me. So they depending on me.
[2:58] Speaker 4: So that was one of the reasons. They were like
[3:00] Speaker 4: a motivation for me where I had to you know,
[3:02] Speaker 4: I had to be the leader. I had to play
[3:04] Speaker 4: the father figure.
[3:05] Speaker 1: With that being said, how did that impact you academically?
[3:08] Speaker 1: Did you graduate from high school? Did you move forward
[3:11] Speaker 1: to four year institutions talk to us.
[3:13] Speaker 4: Yes, I did graduate from the matha Catholic high school that's.
[3:16] Speaker 3: A famous athletic school. Correct in the DC area.
[3:19] Speaker 1: Give us a little history of that before we just
[3:21] Speaker 1: dropped that, Like, it's not that they man if the Math.
[3:25] Speaker 1: If you follow any high school sports, that school produces football,
[3:30] Speaker 1: basketball players that are legendary and currently scholarship D one students.
[3:35] Speaker 2: Correct. Yes, everybody, every sport. We're good at. Every sport
[3:39] Speaker 2: got out.
[3:40] Speaker 4: Yeah, shout out to them because the championship game is
[3:44] Speaker 4: this Sunday, so I'm sure they're gonna win it. But
[3:46] Speaker 4: definitely the Math. While I was there, we were number
[3:48] Speaker 4: seven in the nation. We went twelve and o my
[3:51] Speaker 4: senior year. I have two rings with them. I was
[3:54] Speaker 4: on varsity junior and seen football. Yes, yes, played defensive back.
[4:00] Speaker 4: I was also good at receiving, but defenses back was
[4:02] Speaker 4: my primary position.
[4:05] Speaker 1: Now, there's always talk about sports. That's why I brought it.
[4:08] Speaker 1: Wanted to connect the dot because there's a certain discipline
[4:10] Speaker 1: that comes with a person who plays sports, and it
[4:14] Speaker 1: also allows you to take those saved skill sets. So
[4:18] Speaker 1: because you've been coached and then you show that means
[4:21] Speaker 1: that you're willing to follow instructions.
[4:24] Speaker 3: Is that a good thing for you now?
[4:26] Speaker 2: Absolutely?
[4:28] Speaker 4: Playing football, playing sports in general just helped me transition
[4:32] Speaker 4: better in life from what I know, just based off
[4:35] Speaker 4: my experience, just being able to compete, the competitiveness. You know,
[4:40] Speaker 4: a lot of times in life we're really competing with ourselves.
[4:44] Speaker 4: So we you know, training, we have to hold ourselves up,
[4:46] Speaker 4: you know, we have to be accountable. That's part of
[4:49] Speaker 4: being an adult. You have to hold yourself accountable and
[4:51] Speaker 4: being responsible. And I feel like sports was something that
[4:55] Speaker 4: pretty much led me to you know, thinking that, or
[4:57] Speaker 4: it just demonstrated, you know, the poor so leadership, the
[5:00] Speaker 4: importance of discipline.
[5:02] Speaker 3: So college, where did college take you?
[5:05] Speaker 2: So?
[5:06] Speaker 4: I didn't do the best of high school my last year,
[5:08] Speaker 4: but I ended up going to JUCO Few Juco's Eury,
[5:13] Speaker 4: then at Huston Valley. Then I ended up at Akron University,
[5:16] Speaker 4: and then things got a little rough, So I ended
[5:18] Speaker 4: up going to Lincoln, PA to get close to the.
[5:20] Speaker 3: Home, which is an hbcub.
[5:23] Speaker 4: In Pennsylvania Philadelphia area, right, not very far from Okay,
[5:27] Speaker 4: I'm good you saying this, And I wanted to get
[5:28] Speaker 4: everybody your background base based, So before we get into
[5:31] Speaker 4: the actual pillars of success because I always feel that
[5:35] Speaker 4: people need to know what's driving him.
[5:37] Speaker 1: Because you've said at a little rough here, then you
[5:40] Speaker 1: have good grades in high school, but that doesn't prevent
[5:43] Speaker 1: you from Sydney at to tell your very, very successful
[5:46] Speaker 1: story because you know that every picture, just because it
[5:52] Speaker 1: hasn't painted a certain way, everybody looks at it different
[5:56] Speaker 1: and your success has been because people have looked at
[5:59] Speaker 1: you differently, and you've chosen that if they chosen the
[6:03] Speaker 1: image that isn't positive, you've chosen to show an image
[6:06] Speaker 1: that it is positive so they can accept you for
[6:09] Speaker 1: who you are and the things that you're trying to change.
[6:13] Speaker 3: What is Pillars of Success?
[6:15] Speaker 4: So Pillars of Success is a five on C three
[6:18] Speaker 4: nonprofit that's dedicated to empowered return of citizens and at
[6:21] Speaker 4: risk youth, at risk youth, at risk youth in a
[6:24] Speaker 4: way that we provide comprehensive wrap around services such as
[6:28] Speaker 4: financial literacy, life work and personal development skills to help
[6:31] Speaker 4: what is successful re entry back to society Now.
[6:35] Speaker 1: I remember in high school, good friend of mine would
[6:38] Speaker 1: invite me down to talk to young students. They call
[6:41] Speaker 1: them a last chance to you know, if they didn't.
[6:44] Speaker 1: It was like a middle program. It was a program
[6:46] Speaker 1: before they either shipped them off to jail, but they
[6:49] Speaker 1: couldn't go back to high school because they gotten kicked
[6:51] Speaker 1: out of high school. So I used to come in
[6:53] Speaker 1: there and talk to them and try to get them
[6:55] Speaker 1: to see And also the thing about it is that
[6:58] Speaker 1: they were so used to people just dropping in and
[7:01] Speaker 1: dropping out of their lives. With that being said, what
[7:03] Speaker 1: is some of the common misconceptions or that returning citizens
[7:08] Speaker 1: at risk youth have.
[7:11] Speaker 4: So a lot of times people, you know, judge them
[7:14] Speaker 4: on their way in life. A lot of times, you know,
[7:17] Speaker 4: individuals can't think or you know, can't execute if a
[7:22] Speaker 4: lot of times they're in survival mode. Not a lot
[7:24] Speaker 4: of people, you know, not a lot of people have
[7:27] Speaker 4: been in situations where they've been put in survival mode.
[7:31] Speaker 4: What I come across a lot of jewers saying, well
[7:33] Speaker 4: this this person is a bad person. But you never
[7:36] Speaker 4: really get to know them, you know, because a lot
[7:39] Speaker 4: of the times you never know. Sometimes you may have
[7:41] Speaker 4: to walk to the store to go grasp something for
[7:43] Speaker 4: your mother, and then you know, you may be you
[7:46] Speaker 4: may come across somebody who may be trying to take
[7:48] Speaker 4: your life or trying to rob you or whatever the case,
[7:50] Speaker 4: trying to survive on their own. So you have to
[7:52] Speaker 4: defend yourself. And you know sometimes that could result in
[7:55] Speaker 4: a you know, a negative outcome. But it wasn't the
[7:59] Speaker 4: person being negative. He was just trying to defend himself.
[8:01] Speaker 4: He or she were trying to defend himselves. So, you know,
[8:04] Speaker 4: the just the stigma was saying, you know, return the
[8:07] Speaker 4: citizen or people you know that's been locked up or
[8:10] Speaker 4: you know, at risk youth have been you know, just
[8:13] Speaker 4: bad individuals or not productive or not you know, just
[8:17] Speaker 4: just the stigma of them just being negative individuals. And
[8:20] Speaker 4: a lot of the times in our community we have
[8:22] Speaker 4: to uplift each other. A lot of times these individuals
[8:25] Speaker 4: come from lack of support.
[8:27] Speaker 3: I'm talking to Blatheram.
[8:28] Speaker 1: He founded an organization called Pillars of Success in the
[8:32] Speaker 1: DC area. Yes, the old say it is blather You
[8:36] Speaker 1: can't save everybody.
[8:38] Speaker 2: You're right, So what has led to you?
[8:41] Speaker 1: So tell us some frustrating moments, but you just could
[8:44] Speaker 1: not understand why they didn't get it.
[8:46] Speaker 3: That person did get it.
[8:49] Speaker 4: Well, first of all, a lot of times, you're right,
[8:51] Speaker 4: a lot of you know, we can't say everybody, but
[8:53] Speaker 4: a lot of times that individual has to understand they
[8:57] Speaker 4: have to want it right.
[8:59] Speaker 2: You have to no matter where you at in life.
[9:01] Speaker 4: I don't care if you've been locked up or whatever
[9:03] Speaker 4: background you you have to want it. And then it's
[9:06] Speaker 4: it's you know, it's the part of the subconscious thinking.
[9:10] Speaker 4: A lot of us make decisions based off, you know, emotions,
[9:13] Speaker 4: where we should really think consciously, you know what I mean.
[9:16] Speaker 4: So you know, I've done a lot of research on that,
[9:19] Speaker 4: and you know a lot of times, you know, food
[9:22] Speaker 4: for thought is just a lot of where we feed
[9:25] Speaker 4: ourselves mentally what we see. We have to understand that,
[9:28] Speaker 4: you know, our emotions sometimes we have like we have
[9:31] Speaker 4: to slow things down. We have to process things. And
[9:34] Speaker 4: that's what makes us adults by thinking wisely and thinking
[9:36] Speaker 4: with our brains not with our heart.
[9:38] Speaker 1: Well, you know, like you said, you have to go
[9:40] Speaker 1: to JUCO so and you so your academics when you're
[9:44] Speaker 1: number one charge football, that was you kick on the
[9:48] Speaker 1: field kind of like alright in the classroom, and that's
[9:52] Speaker 1: a reality check because when you graduate, you realize that
[9:55] Speaker 1: you should have put some more effort into that, and
[9:57] Speaker 1: it could have taken you down a different path, not
[9:59] Speaker 1: saying path that you have a journeying on. This journey
[10:03] Speaker 1: is not a bad path. But how did you kill
[10:07] Speaker 1: a success? What exactly did that come from? At what
[10:10] Speaker 1: point in your life eighteen nineteen twenty that you said,
[10:14] Speaker 1: you know, so I want to build a five oh
[10:17] Speaker 1: one that changes people's life.
[10:20] Speaker 4: Just after witnessing and growing up and seeing the challenges
[10:24] Speaker 4: that return to citizens and that risks you face. You know,
[10:27] Speaker 4: just people in my you know, where were you witnessing
[10:30] Speaker 4: this act? Just people around me, the people, the people
[10:33] Speaker 4: that were just closest to me. You know, I come
[10:36] Speaker 4: from that. I have a lot of individuals that you know,
[10:39] Speaker 4: they were my support, but they didn't have the support,
[10:42] Speaker 4: you know what I mean. They were you know, they
[10:43] Speaker 4: told me, yeah, stay out the streets, stick to football,
[10:47] Speaker 4: you know, get us out of here. And they were
[10:49] Speaker 4: the ones that were sitting there. You know, they had
[10:51] Speaker 4: to survive, you know what I mean. They had goals,
[10:53] Speaker 4: they had dreams as well, but they had to survive.
[10:57] Speaker 4: And that's where that came from. I just witnessed so
[10:59] Speaker 4: many individual was closet, you know, close to me that
[11:02] Speaker 4: just you know, they got the negative outcome of it
[11:05] Speaker 4: and it impacted their lives where you know, it's built trauma,
[11:08] Speaker 4: you know, and sometimes they already had trauma prior to
[11:11] Speaker 4: even getting locked up, you know what I mean, or
[11:13] Speaker 4: getting you know, you know, any type of disciplinary action
[11:17] Speaker 4: or whatever the case may be.
[11:18] Speaker 1: So this is a building thing, you know, it starts
[11:21] Speaker 1: here and it just keeps building and building. And like
[11:24] Speaker 1: you said, sometimes you just at a point where frustration
[11:28] Speaker 1: and sometimes denial that this is all I'm going to
[11:32] Speaker 1: be or this is all I can do is rob,
[11:35] Speaker 1: steal or sell drugs, you know, all hustle. And that's
[11:40] Speaker 1: a term in life that you're trying to change you
[11:43] Speaker 1: and that changing process is creating options.
[11:46] Speaker 3: And how do you create the options with pillars of success.
[11:49] Speaker 4: So pretty much just helping individuals build self intrinsic value,
[11:54] Speaker 4: you know, helping them build like you know, the self esteem,
[11:57] Speaker 4: that's one of the biggest things, and helping them build trust.
[12:00] Speaker 4: A lot of individuals, you know, and you know, statistically
[12:03] Speaker 4: a lot of people who have been incarcerated that come
[12:06] Speaker 4: back to society A lot of the times they you know,
[12:09] Speaker 4: recidivizing about you know, within three years, you know what
[12:13] Speaker 4: I mean. So just pretty much just helping them, you know,
[12:15] Speaker 4: gain that trust. And another thing is individuals that you
[12:21] Speaker 4: know a lot of people they're still stuck in the past.
[12:23] Speaker 4: Some people can't get past it, you know what I mean.
[12:26] Speaker 4: I know the same where you know, you know a
[12:28] Speaker 4: lot of people they're still looking in the rear view.
[12:30] Speaker 4: But in order for you to get to where you
[12:32] Speaker 4: need to get to, you need to look in that
[12:33] Speaker 4: front windshield to get to your destination.
[12:35] Speaker 3: But yeah, a lot of people do hold on anger.
[12:38] Speaker 1: It's that's leads to a lot of people not wanting
[12:41] Speaker 1: to go back into community, right, you know, out of
[12:44] Speaker 1: fear a lot of times because like Tupac always said,
[12:47] Speaker 1: don't buy house sometimes the neighborhood that you grew up
[12:49] Speaker 1: in because they guess what they're gonna rob you.
[12:52] Speaker 3: You know. But in your case, you have no fear.
[12:56] Speaker 4: No wow, I only feel one man. That's man upstairs,
[13:01] Speaker 4: you know what I mean. And you know you walk
[13:03] Speaker 4: out here and fear, then I mean, I mean, how
[13:05] Speaker 4: can how could you be a leader?
[13:08] Speaker 2: You know what I mean?
[13:10] Speaker 3: Fear?
[13:10] Speaker 4: You know some people fear, I mean failure all that
[13:12] Speaker 4: I mean that kind of relates to the same way.
[13:14] Speaker 4: But it's just all about you know, you learn from
[13:16] Speaker 4: your mistakes. I wouldn't stay feared. So I'm definitely saying
[13:20] Speaker 4: fearless and it's in my blood. I mean, you know,
[13:23] Speaker 4: just being fearless about everything.
[13:24] Speaker 2: Yep, you know.
[13:25] Speaker 3: There's always a measure of success and impact.
[13:28] Speaker 2: You know.
[13:29] Speaker 1: First of all, let's talk about measuring success, but we
[13:31] Speaker 1: talk about your impact because this interview is about you really,
[13:34] Speaker 1: because you're trying to.
[13:36] Speaker 3: Create change two types of people.
[13:41] Speaker 1: Sometimes they don't want to change, and then sometimes society
[13:45] Speaker 1: won't let them change. Okay, So let's talk about success.
[13:49] Speaker 1: What do you define success when you're dealing with re
[13:53] Speaker 1: entry student of re entry, people who these people who
[13:57] Speaker 1: have been incarcerated and then also at risks.
[14:01] Speaker 4: You progress, any form of progress, you know what I mean,
[14:07] Speaker 4: whether it's ten steps or just any form of progress.
[14:11] Speaker 4: What I mean, uh, progress like being open, being willing
[14:15] Speaker 4: to you know, like, for instance, we have people that
[14:19] Speaker 4: you know, the first thing they say, oh, well, I
[14:21] Speaker 4: want to make money. Okay, Well, then you know, at
[14:24] Speaker 4: the end of the day, each and everybody, you know,
[14:26] Speaker 4: every every individual in the world, you have to have
[14:28] Speaker 4: a plan, you have to have a goal.
[14:29] Speaker 2: So a lot of these.
[14:30] Speaker 4: Individuals think, okay, well I come home. I'm just gonna
[14:33] Speaker 4: settle for this. And you know, at pillars of the
[14:35] Speaker 4: steps we let them know, no, you're not gonna you
[14:37] Speaker 4: You're not just going to settle.
[14:39] Speaker 2: What do you want to do? What do you want
[14:42] Speaker 2: to do? And what are you willing to do?
[14:44] Speaker 4: And at the end of the day, why would somebody
[14:46] Speaker 4: else want to choose you outside of somebody else another
[14:49] Speaker 4: candidate if it comes to work, if it comes to anything.
[14:53] Speaker 4: So that's what you know, that's what I mean when
[14:55] Speaker 4: it comes to that. So success is just having some
[14:58] Speaker 4: type of progress.
[15:00] Speaker 2: Don't go anywhere.
[15:01] Speaker 5: We'll be right back with more money Making Conversations Masterclass.
[15:10] Speaker 5: Welcome back to Money Making Conversations master Class hosted by
[15:13] Speaker 5: me Rashaan McDonald. Money Making Conversation master Class continues online
[15:18] Speaker 5: at Moneymaking Conversations dot com and follow money Making Conversation
[15:22] Speaker 5: master Class on Facebook, X and Instagram. And sometimes progress
[15:26] Speaker 5: can be just getting up same time every day, you know,
[15:31] Speaker 5: you know, just at you know, just having a positive personality,
[15:35] Speaker 5: losing the negative spirit, as I always say, that's.
[15:38] Speaker 2: Progress, absolutely.
[15:40] Speaker 4: And another thing I tell a lot of our members,
[15:42] Speaker 4: I let them know, like look, sometimes the first the
[15:44] Speaker 4: number one thing, the difference between you being successful and
[15:47] Speaker 4: you not.
[15:48] Speaker 2: You taking action. You have to take action.
[15:51] Speaker 4: If you want your life to change, you have to
[15:53] Speaker 4: take that action, and that's your best foot forward towards
[15:57] Speaker 4: that productivity.
[15:58] Speaker 2: You know what I mean.
[15:59] Speaker 4: And a lot of times, if you are in a
[16:01] Speaker 4: circle and you are the smartest individual in your circle,
[16:05] Speaker 4: that's not the right circle for you. You have to
[16:07] Speaker 4: challenge yourself, and first and foremost, you have to hold
[16:10] Speaker 4: yourself accountable if you expect to grow or if you
[16:13] Speaker 4: expect to survive in this world.
[16:15] Speaker 3: This is just one part of your life.
[16:17] Speaker 1: Later, okay, affordable housing is that you're another strong advocate.
[16:23] Speaker 1: Let's talk about how that got started. I'm gonna pause
[16:26] Speaker 1: this conversation because I think I'll be remiss not talking
[16:30] Speaker 1: about you in the three sixty fashion. I'm talking about
[16:33] Speaker 1: a gentleman here, a young guy who's chosen in your perspective,
[16:38] Speaker 1: in your situation to change the world. And I always
[16:42] Speaker 1: say that that's a bold move for a young person.
[16:45] Speaker 1: I always go back to when did this pop in
[16:48] Speaker 1: your head? I always respect people who get it at
[16:51] Speaker 1: such a young age. We talk about re entry for
[16:55] Speaker 1: incarcerated people and at risk. You affordable house. Where did
[17:01] Speaker 1: that come from?
[17:02] Speaker 4: So back in twenty fourteen, I got the opportunity to
[17:06] Speaker 4: work at the DC Housing Authority. It was a chance
[17:10] Speaker 4: I took. I was actually I got hurt and I
[17:15] Speaker 4: was just like, dang, I'm out here in this workforce.
[17:17] Speaker 4: Football is all I had. And I just took a
[17:20] Speaker 4: job at the casino. It was a full time job.
[17:22] Speaker 4: And I got a call at while I was in training,
[17:25] Speaker 4: and it was it just they just kept calling me
[17:27] Speaker 4: and I answered and they said, hey, we would like
[17:29] Speaker 4: to offer you a seasonal position.
[17:32] Speaker 2: I said, well, man, is this seasonal to you know?
[17:35] Speaker 2: Is it attempt to hire? You know what I mean?
[17:37] Speaker 2: Like yeah, right?
[17:39] Speaker 4: And they say third seasonal? You know, are you gonna
[17:42] Speaker 4: take it? And now I said, you know what, I'm
[17:44] Speaker 4: a bet on myself, and I'm just because the experience.
[17:47] Speaker 4: It's the government, you know, it's the government position and
[17:50] Speaker 4: I can grow from there.
[17:51] Speaker 2: It's something to add.
[17:52] Speaker 4: And I got into d C Housing Authority and it
[17:56] Speaker 4: was just like I acted like I was on the field.
[17:58] Speaker 2: I grew.
[17:59] Speaker 4: I started off as a clerical assistant and then I
[18:03] Speaker 4: went up to a housing assistant. Then I ended up
[18:05] Speaker 4: going to a housing especialist where I was a case
[18:08] Speaker 4: manager for over like ten thousand people. Then I got
[18:12] Speaker 4: up there when I was at GS eleven two and
[18:15] Speaker 4: I got my housing inspection certification, so I was a
[18:19] Speaker 4: certified housing inspector for DC Housing Authority, where I conducted
[18:22] Speaker 4: over twenty thousand inspections.
[18:25] Speaker 3: A seasonal.
[18:27] Speaker 4: Call led to eight years of me working at DC
[18:32] Speaker 4: Housing Authority, and I ended up resigning there because I
[18:36] Speaker 4: wanted to continue to grow. And you know that wasn't
[18:38] Speaker 4: my goal just sit there and the next step just
[18:41] Speaker 4: to be a manager housing.
[18:43] Speaker 1: When you make that stake, my listeners are money making conversation.
[18:48] Speaker 1: Later tell them how important it is to bet on
[18:51] Speaker 1: yourself and trust yourself, and also why you was trusted yourself?
[18:56] Speaker 1: Why did you make that decision to bet on yourself.
[19:00] Speaker 4: Well, so at the time I was putt I had
[19:02] Speaker 4: I was put in a predicament. So the process of
[19:06] Speaker 4: me working with DC Housing, I said, hey, look, I
[19:10] Speaker 4: have goals and I intend to, you know, affect the
[19:14] Speaker 4: community in a productive way, and my way is through housing.
[19:19] Speaker 4: And I'm single, i have no kids, so I'm gonna
[19:22] Speaker 4: go get me an apartment building in d C. And
[19:25] Speaker 4: I would like in nine times out of ten with
[19:28] Speaker 4: apartment building or in d C. You know, it's Section eight.
[19:31] Speaker 4: So I want to clarify with you or I want
[19:33] Speaker 4: to be proactive and you know, let you all know, Hey,
[19:37] Speaker 4: in the event that I do purchase a property, I
[19:39] Speaker 4: would like that is not if it's a conflicent interest,
[19:41] Speaker 4: or would you guys be able to you know, create
[19:44] Speaker 4: some type of waiver for me to continue to move
[19:46] Speaker 4: forward with that. And you know, it was an attorney
[19:49] Speaker 4: that I was working with and for months and months,
[19:51] Speaker 4: you know, going through the home buying process. Then once
[19:54] Speaker 4: I got qualified, I told them about it, and you know,
[19:57] Speaker 4: the property ended up having two Section eight ten in there.
[20:00] Speaker 4: And I actually met, you know, met with them, said hey,
[20:04] Speaker 4: I just closed on the property and this is where.
[20:06] Speaker 2: I'm at with it.
[20:07] Speaker 4: And they pretty much looked at me and told me,
[20:10] Speaker 4: we're not paying you twice. They looked at me and said,
[20:14] Speaker 4: we're not paying you twice where you worked where I worked.
[20:18] Speaker 3: When what did they mean when they said that?
[20:20] Speaker 4: They basically said, you need to figure out and get
[20:22] Speaker 4: those tennis out on your own and we won't be
[20:24] Speaker 4: paying you, not because you got sextion eight tennis and
[20:27] Speaker 4: we're not going to pay you for them.
[20:28] Speaker 1: So because you were employed in housing and you bought
[20:33] Speaker 1: a building that had affordable housing tenants, they viewed that
[20:40] Speaker 1: as paying you twice.
[20:42] Speaker 4: Yes, I don't kind and it was it was kind
[20:45] Speaker 4: of scouraged, but I knew I felt the power. It
[20:48] Speaker 4: was powerful because I was twenty six, you know at
[20:52] Speaker 4: the time, you know, purchasing apartment bent over this that's
[20:54] Speaker 4: half a million, and you know, I said, okay, I
[21:00] Speaker 4: see what power, you know, a little bit of power
[21:01] Speaker 4: does to some people. And you know, instead of you
[21:04] Speaker 4: know us, you know, you know, uh, you know, them celebrating,
[21:08] Speaker 4: uplifting whatever, you know what I mean, it was just like, no,
[21:13] Speaker 4: we're not happy for you know what you got.
[21:15] Speaker 3: At that point in life.
[21:16] Speaker 1: You made a decision, and the decision was to resign
[21:20] Speaker 1: and then move on into who you are today.
[21:23] Speaker 2: Yep.
[21:24] Speaker 4: So I had to get an extra uh, I had
[21:25] Speaker 4: to you know, create my exit strategy. And two years later,
[21:29] Speaker 4: you know, two years later, I was able to say, hey,
[21:32] Speaker 4: you know, I'm impacting people, and I get this is
[21:36] Speaker 4: a way, you know, this is you know, a nine
[21:39] Speaker 4: to five, whatever the case is, but this is what
[21:41] Speaker 4: I want to do. This is my retirement, getting into
[21:43] Speaker 4: real estate. This is what I need to do and
[21:46] Speaker 4: uplifting people, helping, you know, impacting people and watching people,
[21:50] Speaker 4: you know, say hey missus sabbat man, thank you for
[21:53] Speaker 4: being a great landlord, and just you know, educating people.
[21:56] Speaker 4: I'd rather sit there and you know, build on that
[21:59] Speaker 4: instead of sitting there and just being comfortable and with
[22:02] Speaker 4: a nine to five and paycheck to paycheck type of thing.
[22:05] Speaker 1: Blate, that's abot, that's my man right here, Pillars of Success.
[22:08] Speaker 1: You're on a mission. How can we support your mission?
[22:11] Speaker 1: Where can we go to find out more about you?
[22:13] Speaker 1: The interviews isn't over, but at this point I think
[22:16] Speaker 1: people need to do their research on you and figure
[22:20] Speaker 1: out how they can support you in the DC area
[22:23] Speaker 1: but also within this country.
[22:25] Speaker 4: Okay, so we're on social media. We have a website
[22:28] Speaker 4: as well, www. Dot Pillars of Success two o two
[22:33] Speaker 4: dot com. You can also email us at Pillars of
[22:36] Speaker 4: Success two o two at gmail and also you know,
[22:42] Speaker 4: I mean, we're all over as far as you know, uh,
[22:45] Speaker 4: the world. You know, we're based out of DC, but
[22:48] Speaker 4: we're looking to grow everywhere. Yeah, We're supporting all return
[22:52] Speaker 4: to citizens from every walk of life. I don't care
[22:55] Speaker 4: where you're from, you know, because we have some connections.
[22:57] Speaker 4: And you know, and that's another thing. My staff, from
[23:00] Speaker 4: the people I deal with, they all can relate because
[23:02] Speaker 4: some of them have been for me. You know, return
[23:05] Speaker 4: you know, and return to citizens that success be reintegrated
[23:08] Speaker 4: back to them and you know, shout out to my
[23:10] Speaker 4: you know, director of programs which the ship.
[23:12] Speaker 1: Well you're not doing this by yourself, you know, that's
[23:14] Speaker 1: one of you know. As an individual, you know, I
[23:18] Speaker 1: am a I like to believe I'm a community leader,
[23:21] Speaker 1: you know, HBCU advocate, and I have a plan. I've
[23:26] Speaker 1: always had a plan of how I can impact people's lives.
[23:30] Speaker 1: You are developing plan or have a plan your affordable house,
[23:35] Speaker 1: re entry people, and I said every entry because you.
[23:40] Speaker 3: Know, my younger brother, he spent time in jail. You know,
[23:44] Speaker 3: we had a hard head.
[23:45] Speaker 1: Now went to jail a couple of times before we
[23:47] Speaker 1: got it right, okay, because always was smart, but just
[23:51] Speaker 1: wanted to take the short cut or the cut. Well,
[23:54] Speaker 1: he felt he was smarter than the main Sometimes the
[23:57] Speaker 1: man when he starts winning, all you have to do.
[23:59] Speaker 1: All they can do is just mess up your record.
[24:01] Speaker 1: And so now he's gotten his life together.
[24:03] Speaker 2: And so.
[24:05] Speaker 3: How do you as an individual?
[24:08] Speaker 1: Can you give people advice on how they can impact
[24:12] Speaker 1: the community doing what you're doing, or like you said,
[24:15] Speaker 1: they can contact you, but they also can make a
[24:18] Speaker 1: difference by changing people's lives within that community.
[24:21] Speaker 4: Absolutely, So what I would say is, and you know,
[24:25] Speaker 4: pretty much just reinvented with basically connect the individuals instead
[24:29] Speaker 4: of with job opportunities, with career development. You know a
[24:32] Speaker 4: lot of these trades as you see statistic states, you know,
[24:36] Speaker 4: the tradesmen are going to be the you know, the future,
[24:39] Speaker 4: you know, big things as far as plumbing, carpentry, electrician,
[24:43] Speaker 4: hvac it, you know what I mean, mechanical skills. So
[24:48] Speaker 4: definitely emphasizing career development definitely. And also like we have
[24:54] Speaker 4: a digital literacy tool, you we yeah, we actually partner
[24:58] Speaker 4: with Google and this is a digital literacy tool that
[25:02] Speaker 4: actually has professional development still because.
[25:05] Speaker 3: Those are those scholarships, those Google scholarships, So.
[25:07] Speaker 4: It could be Google scholarships or it could be sponsors.
[25:10] Speaker 4: So that's another way. And the village can help either
[25:12] Speaker 4: you know with volunteering, you know, serving as a mentor
[25:15] Speaker 4: you can donate or you know, spreading the work, you
[25:18] Speaker 4: know what I mean, as far as you know, spreading
[25:20] Speaker 4: awareness of what's going on.
[25:22] Speaker 1: You know, it's really amazing when I look at an
[25:24] Speaker 1: individual like you, you know, because again, look you atlantic
[25:28] Speaker 1: you still look like you tackled somebody.
[25:32] Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying.
[25:34] Speaker 1: But you've chosen this path, man, and I and I'm
[25:39] Speaker 1: gonna tell people it's not an easy path because you're
[25:41] Speaker 1: dealing with people who can frustrate you, make you mad,
[25:45] Speaker 1: and make you get up one day I quit, yep.
[25:47] Speaker 4: But you're not quitting though later Why Because we don't
[25:52] Speaker 4: succeed unless they succeed. That pillar says, we don't succeed
[25:55] Speaker 4: unless they succeed. And the thing is, I see so
[25:59] Speaker 4: much potential a lot of individuals. And sometimes I've learned
[26:03] Speaker 4: just to be a better person because I've been able
[26:05] Speaker 4: to sit there and listen to someone. Because the main thing,
[26:09] Speaker 4: and as you know what your they gotta trust you.
[26:11] Speaker 4: Some people just they dealt with so many people, you know,
[26:14] Speaker 4: they've been lowed to the wrong individuals, you know what
[26:17] Speaker 4: I mean, and people just lying to them then, you know,
[26:20] Speaker 4: and then again just the lack of support, lack of resources.
[26:23] Speaker 4: So that's another thing that makes pillars of success very
[26:26] Speaker 4: important because we're like peer navigation. We will connect any
[26:30] Speaker 4: individual with these resources and support and assist with them
[26:34] Speaker 4: on how to utilize these resources.
[26:35] Speaker 1: So let's break down some of the wrap around services
[26:39] Speaker 1: such as mentorship.
[26:41] Speaker 3: Tell us about that.
[26:42] Speaker 2: So mentorship pretty much.
[26:44] Speaker 4: So now, like for example, every once a month, we
[26:47] Speaker 4: actually meet with the Supervision Office which means the POS
[26:53] Speaker 4: and stuff like that CSOs, and we we mentor the
[26:57] Speaker 4: individual and let them know, okay, the importance of their
[27:01] Speaker 4: job because a lot of the times they looking at
[27:03] Speaker 4: oh man, I'm not trying to I'm not coming back
[27:04] Speaker 4: to do this, take urine or do any of this
[27:07] Speaker 4: just so you guys can call me in the lock
[27:09] Speaker 4: me back up. But we let them know, Hey, the CSOs,
[27:12] Speaker 4: a lot of the times they are here to prevent
[27:14] Speaker 4: you from reid from recidivism the first step.
[27:18] Speaker 2: And if not, then that's not the line of work
[27:20] Speaker 2: they're supposed to be doing. And you know, and that's the.
[27:23] Speaker 3: Coaching side of you do. Yeah, that's what I'm saying,
[27:25] Speaker 3: Athlete pair road. You're constantly coaching, right.
[27:28] Speaker 4: And then the second thing is we actually you know,
[27:31] Speaker 4: helped you know, speak to the individual and the biggest
[27:34] Speaker 4: thing helping them understand or identifying where they're at currently
[27:38] Speaker 4: and where they're trying to get to. So again it's
[27:41] Speaker 4: just like you know me and we have like tailored support.
[27:44] Speaker 4: So we had so we have like three different tiers.
[27:47] Speaker 4: We have a basic support here, we have an enhanced
[27:50] Speaker 4: support tier, and we also have a maximum support here.
[27:54] Speaker 4: Not only the difference between all three of them is
[27:57] Speaker 4: that the base support obviously, you know those are people
[27:59] Speaker 4: who actually you know, they still you know, they're where
[28:03] Speaker 4: they can communicate, well, they just need assistance on you know,
[28:06] Speaker 4: just here and there on you know, on certain things now,
[28:09] Speaker 4: where you know, enhanced support is more like somebody that
[28:11] Speaker 4: we need to check up on, you know more you know,
[28:13] Speaker 4: weekly calls, things of that nature, checking in, creating assessments
[28:18] Speaker 4: or assignments. And then it's the maximum support where we
[28:21] Speaker 4: actually sit and we have a tailor and we create
[28:24] Speaker 4: a tailored plan not on our own with that end
[28:27] Speaker 4: of it, with our member and we go and we
[28:30] Speaker 4: come up and we just dota, eze and cross our
[28:33] Speaker 4: t's and we pretty much go through everything to see
[28:36] Speaker 4: what exactly what they're what they're trying to do, and
[28:39] Speaker 4: how we get there and we take a step by step.
[28:41] Speaker 4: So that's where the volunteering, that's what that's where the donations,
[28:44] Speaker 4: that's where you know, the support would come from with
[28:47] Speaker 4: you know, if we were to get some donations, whatever
[28:49] Speaker 4: the case is, is to these tiers, these packages where
[28:52] Speaker 4: we can provide and not only just providing you know,
[28:55] Speaker 4: constant communication, but we're also connecting them with the direct
[28:59] Speaker 4: contacts to these career development, these trades or you know,
[29:04] Speaker 4: if you want to become a phlebotomist or and we
[29:06] Speaker 4: also you know, we connect with you know, University of
[29:10] Speaker 4: District of Columbia, so you know, we partner with them
[29:13] Speaker 4: as well. We partner with so many different locals, so
[29:16] Speaker 4: local you and that's another thing with the tradesmen. A
[29:18] Speaker 4: lot of the times these are guaranteed four to five
[29:20] Speaker 4: year commitments, so the mentoring is more so that's where
[29:24] Speaker 4: the mentorship comes in. We pretty much just guide them,
[29:27] Speaker 4: help them with assistance on you know, the routes or
[29:30] Speaker 4: how things look or how to get there, you know
[29:32] Speaker 4: what I mean. And then if you know, it's houses
[29:34] Speaker 4: support as well. We have some individuals that could not
[29:37] Speaker 4: have been home right now if they didn't reach out
[29:40] Speaker 4: the pillars and had a place to stay. So we
[29:42] Speaker 4: had to go find you know how we got support,
[29:45] Speaker 4: and you know, there's individ and we have testimonies. I
[29:49] Speaker 4: have quite a few testimonies. So I mean that's you know,
[29:52] Speaker 4: the proof of constant is there. So that's where the
[29:54] Speaker 4: mentorship comes from.
[29:55] Speaker 1: Let's talk about because you know, once you start generating
[29:59] Speaker 1: a degree of SI says, financial literacy, education has to
[30:03] Speaker 1: kind of play.
[30:03] Speaker 2: That's a plan.
[30:04] Speaker 1: That's a plan there, because you can't keep your money
[30:06] Speaker 1: unneath your magic. You're right, talk about financial literacy.
[30:11] Speaker 4: I was forced to learn about financial literacy back in
[30:14] Speaker 4: twenty seventeen, well even prior to that, I would say
[30:16] Speaker 4: twenty fifteen, were in pursuit of getting my first property.
[30:21] Speaker 4: It's all about you know, it's not about how much
[30:23] Speaker 4: you make, it's all about what you do with it.
[30:25] Speaker 4: At the time, I was making about sixteen dollars an hour.
[30:29] Speaker 4: My salary was only thirty thirty five thousand, and I was,
[30:34] Speaker 4: you know, I was able to purchase a property for
[30:37] Speaker 4: half a million. So I was forced to understand what
[30:41] Speaker 4: financial literacy was. And you know, I'm a frugal individual.
[30:44] Speaker 4: I'm not into vehicles, buying you know, because I understand
[30:48] Speaker 4: the liabilities, but I do understand you know how you know,
[30:51] Speaker 4: you know how people purchase you know, vehicles through business
[30:55] Speaker 4: you know ei ns and stuff like that or just
[30:58] Speaker 4: business credit.
[30:59] Speaker 2: So I had to learn credit. Yeah, because I had
[31:02] Speaker 2: to learn credit.
[31:03] Speaker 4: And of course when you're going through the home buying
[31:05] Speaker 4: you know program, you know, you have to understand that.
[31:08] Speaker 4: You know, your bank accounts, you know, your counselors are
[31:10] Speaker 4: always looking at it, the lenders, you know, under assistant
[31:14] Speaker 4: consistent yep ninety.
[31:15] Speaker 2: You know, so the statements, it has to make sense.
[31:17] Speaker 4: And you know, if you make if you know, you
[31:20] Speaker 4: the positive certain amount, you know, if it's cash, they
[31:23] Speaker 4: want to they want to proof, you know, a letter
[31:25] Speaker 4: of explanation.
[31:25] Speaker 2: What is this right? Where does the two thousand come from?
[31:28] Speaker 2: You know?
[31:29] Speaker 4: And if it's not justifying, hey, that doesn't count. You know,
[31:32] Speaker 4: so it's your you know, your buying power.
[31:34] Speaker 1: Right because they want to make sure that's not money
[31:36] Speaker 1: just been dropped in that account and suddenly so it
[31:39] Speaker 1: can inflate your revenue in their account and make you
[31:43] Speaker 1: feel like.
[31:43] Speaker 3: You have more more value to pace by property than
[31:47] Speaker 3: you really don't.
[31:49] Speaker 1: Because an end a bank or any lensing institution don't
[31:52] Speaker 1: want the property that they're financing. They want you to
[31:56] Speaker 1: buy the property that's the bottom lot. A lot of
[31:58] Speaker 1: people need to understand that not in the in the
[32:01] Speaker 1: car buying business, the loan owned, the house loaning owning business,
[32:06] Speaker 1: or the land owning business. And so these stipulations in
[32:09] Speaker 1: the financial literacy process that you learn and you have
[32:12] Speaker 1: to educate your own. Educate yourself is important. Again before
[32:16] Speaker 1: as we wrap up this one more time, how do
[32:18] Speaker 1: we get in touch with you later?
[32:20] Speaker 4: So you guys can get in touch with me at
[32:24] Speaker 4: ag Pillars of Success to O two. You also can
[32:28] Speaker 4: find us on you know, our website www. Dot Pillars
[32:32] Speaker 4: of Success two two dot com uh and we have
[32:36] Speaker 4: all our information there.
[32:37] Speaker 2: You'll see the proof of concept.
[32:39] Speaker 4: You'll see who we're connected to, what we do and
[32:44] Speaker 4: you know and how our mission may align with whomever
[32:46] Speaker 4: you know, the community activists or whatever the case may be.
[32:49] Speaker 1: My brother, I want to thank you for taking the
[32:51] Speaker 1: time to you know, our meet individuals like you, your
[32:56] Speaker 1: version of me and your better version of me, because
[32:59] Speaker 1: you're out there in this and that's a very courageous
[33:02] Speaker 1: version because what you do does have a degree of
[33:06] Speaker 1: danger in it. It does, and a lot of people
[33:09] Speaker 1: don't understand that. And because when you deal with people
[33:12] Speaker 1: who can easily be frustrated and see you doing a
[33:16] Speaker 1: little bit better, that can lead to jealous absolutely, and
[33:20] Speaker 1: that can also lead.
[33:20] Speaker 3: To frustration on that part.
[33:22] Speaker 1: And so with that being said, there's a high degree
[33:25] Speaker 1: of courage and a lot of respect, but pillows of success,
[33:28] Speaker 1: as you say, two O two in their case, that's Washington, DC.
[33:34] Speaker 1: Keep winning, man, and keep doing what you're doing, Blake,
[33:36] Speaker 1: and thank you for coming on Money Making Conversations. This
[33:39] Speaker 1: has been Money Making Conversations Masterclass with me Rashaun McDonald.
[33:44] Speaker 1: Thanks to our guess and our audience. Visit Moneymaking Conversations
[33:48] Speaker 1: dot com to listen or register to be a guest
[33:51] Speaker 1: on my show.
[33:52] Speaker 3: Keep leading with your gifts, keep winning,

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