# Cowboy Jim Morrison

An episode of [Rose City Politics](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1247337855), 16 Mar 2024, 1 h 01 min.

Audio: https://dts.podtrac.com/redirect.mp3/api.spreaker.com/download/episode/59071059/cowboy_jim_morrison.mp3

This week Kristen, Frazier, Jon and Doug talk about the surprising quote in The Narwhal from ERCA CAO Tim Byrne. Later, we cover the expansion of the Banwell road intersection with EC Row. Rose City Politics is brought to you with the kind support of LiUNA Local 625: Building Better Communities. Support the show at Patreon.com/RoseCityPolitics. Read our stuff in Biz X Magazine or online at BizXMagazine.com and RoseCityPolitics.ca

## Transcript

[0:24] Hey everyone, Welcome to Rose City Politics March sixteenth, twenty twenty four.
[0:29] Regular panel includes Doug Sartry, Fraser Fathers, Kristen Ciappas, and myself,
[0:33] John Lidkey. Do yourself a favor, head over to patreon dot com slash
[0:37] Roast City Politics. ROAs City Politics guarantees you it's the most fun you'll have
[0:41] all day long signing up on Patreon and giving us your cash. We guarantee
[0:45] that. Guarantee it one hundred percent. Hello day. If you aren't one
[0:50] hundred percent satisfied with it, you can take it up with our chart Applan.
[0:53] Well, that's the punch Don in the face guarantee, right, And
[0:58] Don's not here to defend himself right now, so not that you could get
[1:00] a good punch on him. He's literally not here, but he can't defend
[1:03] himself, I guess physically or you know, verbally, emotionally, natively.
[1:11] And while you're at it, pickup a biz X magazine. We've got a
[1:15] new piece that's in there. It's online on our website as well. And
[1:19] ros City Politics able to broadcast live on tape thanks to the kind and ongoing
[1:23] support of Luna six two five Building better communities. We have a big show
[1:27] today. We're going to dive into some controversial comments from the CEO of URCA
[1:34] who was addressing Ontario's Minister of Natural Resources. Spoiler alert it includes the F
[1:40] word, which is, you know, quite frankly, pretty great when it's
[1:44] coming from someone who is in a leadership role. Big fan. And then
[1:48] if we have time after that, we're going to dive into the fifty million
[1:49] dollar announcement from Premier Forward for the Banwell Road E c Row Interchange, and
[1:55] then who knows, maybe we'll be able to talk about Ontario jails as well
[1:59] specific Lee Windsor. But before we get to those topics, let's dive into
[2:02] our main one of the show, the Essex Region Conservation Authority. No wait,
[2:07] first, you had a good lunch for dinner? Oh thank you.
[2:12] Yes. We are recording in the palatial Rose City Politics Studios directly across the
[2:17] street from o Let Avenue restaurant Hot Taco. I had a chance to check
[2:23] out Hot Taco this week, Folks. Get down there. It is really
[2:28] really good stuff. They don't have their liquor license yet, so you know,
[2:31] take that into account. Maybe get some takeout because those bad boys would
[2:36] go terrific with some cold beer. But yeah, yeah, the tacos were
[2:38] awesome. This is the same place as Leamington, right, I don't know
[2:43] hot Taco. I think they've got their their first location is out there and
[2:46] yeah, sure, all right, Well Leamington tacos are extremely legit, so
[2:49] it makes sense. I'm literally headed there next. That's where my plans for
[2:53] the day. Podcasting followed by tacos. It's a solid day. If you
[2:57] want to really cap it off, make sure that you had to patreon dot
[2:59] com afterwards, because that's how you guarantee a great afternoon. No full of
[3:06] taco signing up on the Patriarch, you could have that day, two folks.
[3:10] But let's dive into the You can hit pause right now. You can
[3:14] do all that and then come back and right back in. We're gonna take
[3:16] a quick break and we're back. We hope you got that cold six pack
[3:22] of beer, you got those hot tacos, and you signed up at patroon
[3:23] dot com. Slash Rosity politics the Essex Region Conservation Authority. That was so
[3:29] dumb. I was just letting it go by, but everyone else is completely
[3:34] in stitches. Very good, very good, yeah, the Essex Region Conservation
[3:38] Authority Board will discuss potential disciplinary action against c aoh Tim burning who said a
[3:45] controversial phrase to Ontario's Minister of Natural Resources over new regulations affecting watershed protections.
[3:51] We're gonna hold off on a second of what he said, will just go
[3:53] with a quick background and then we'll we'll use that as the jumping off point
[3:58] for our discussion. The URCA chair Jim Morrison said that the board's gonna be
[4:01] discussing in camera what was said by the CEO, but said if any action
[4:05] is taken, it's probably not gonna be a dismissal Bernie did not respond to
[4:09] The Windsor Star request for comment about the issue. This all stemmed from a
[4:12] story in The Narwhal proving yet again, when the narwal comes at you,
[4:18] they don't miss. So I don't know who the third person is going to
[4:23] be in Windsor who gets hit by the narwal. We saw Drew Dilkins get
[4:27] the first one. Now it's Tim Burney at ERCA if the narwhal calls don't
[4:31] pick up. And on the other hand, Narwhal, if you need help
[4:34] selecting targets, you could do worse than touch and base with us. The
[4:39] windsor Essex is a target rich environment, so to reach out. So the
[4:43] narwhal had a story about these new provincial regulations related to conservation authorities. These
[4:47] new REGs, well, they take away some authorities from the conservation authorities.
[4:51] They brought in other powers. The Minister of Natural Resources now has the ability
[4:55] to issue development permits without approval from conservation authorities. The Minister can also alter
[5:00] conditions agencies want to impose on developments. And here's the fun so CEO of
[5:06] URCA Tim Burney said to the Minister of Natural Resources regarding these new regulations,
[5:14] quote the minister better staff up if he wants to tell us what to do.
[5:18] And as for overruling us or appealing our decisions, well fuck you,
[5:23] minister. Based on what end to quote. Just to be clear, I
[5:29] did not add anything to that. That is the quote of a lifetime incredible
[5:32] Well fuck you, minister. I mean, if you're looking to be walking
[5:36] out of an organization, perfect thing to drop. If you're looking to have
[5:42] a long lasting role with an organization, how do you give that quote to
[5:46] a media outlet. That's the part of the conversation is like, what was
[5:53] the circumstance of this narwal quote? Did you think you were off the record,
[5:58] because again, there's no legal definition of off the record. You can't
[6:03] take someone to court over not being on record or off record. Well fuck
[6:10] you, minister. Incredible. So after the story was published, it was
[6:14] updated with a statement from Bernie to sincerely apologize for the comments. He also
[6:21] sent a letter directly to the minister apologizing and we had some fallout over this
[6:27] Award for Counselor. Mark McKenzie, who is an ERKA board member, has
[6:30] called for Bernie's resignation over these inappropriate statements, which is ironic considering a litany
[6:39] of inappropriate statements from the Word for Counselor before he got elected. Tried to
[6:44] scrub most of them off of the web, but memories are long, and
[6:47] so are internet archives. Jim Morrison, who also sits on the ERKA board,
[6:53] said he had a total surprise coming from Mark McKenzie's call for resignation.
[6:57] Quote. I wasn't sure that mister mackenzie should have making the statements that he
[7:00] did with very limited knowledge. Little bit of side glare there from Jim Morrison
[7:06] that we don't often see. He went on to say McKenzie made statements about
[7:11] irreparable damage that's being done. I felt like there was certainly not a lot
[7:14] of information for him to be making those statements. Again, if the board
[7:19] does take any action, this will be occurring after the in camera discussion.
[7:25] But we're expecting that if anything does happen, it will not be a dismissal.
[7:30] I love this story, yeah, can I can? I just I
[7:32] want to just react to Jim Morrison's conduct here because you know, Jim Morrison,
[7:40] I think is a sensible person and that perhaps is his reputation around the
[7:46] council table that he's sensible. You know, he's not a rabble rouser,
[7:51] but he's willing to step out a line occasionally when perhaps the you know,
[7:56] he feels that it's called for. But but the purity here in the way
[8:01] that he handled this, the the uh, Definitely, it's a SmackDown to
[8:09] Mark McKenzie. It's a decently respectful SmackDown, and I think it's appropriate and
[8:15] what a chair needs to be doing. So anyway, I know it's going
[8:18] to get lost in all the fun, so I just wanted to call out
[8:22] that that Jim Morrison did what Jim Morrison should have done here. I like
[8:26] Jim Morrison. I mean, like obviously bank manager background. He reminds me
[8:30] of like an old timey bank manager, like in the olden days. Are
[8:33] we talking like black and white days, Like we're talking like like like the
[8:39] vault exactly, tumble Weed's going by and people come and by bandits with like
[8:45] you know, a yeah, yeah, that's the image that I have.
[8:48] Jim Morrison is a figure in the old last So anyways, exactly the boy
[8:54] Jim Morrison. He's sitting there and like he's just every now and then looking
[8:58] up from his abacus and like you know, counting numbers as one does in
[9:01] the old banks. And he's just you know, keeping an eye on things.
[9:03] But then every now and then, like you know, someone walks in
[9:05] and he's trying to rob the place, and that's when he reaches under the
[9:07] desk and he grabs like a shotgun. And that's what this was. It
[9:13] was the yeah he didn't shoot, don't make me Yeah, just like Dad's
[9:18] here, kids. No, that's the Jim Moore. So Jim, I'm
[9:24] just saying, get an old timey coup at show up at council I think
[9:28] I have a Christmas present for fantastic. This was great for so many reasons.
[9:35] We don't get elected officials often an elected officials, you know, community
[9:41] leadership dropping f bombs at other community leaders. So I'm loving this for that
[9:46] reason. But I guess we could. You know, I don't know where
[9:52] are you even start with us. I think I really like to deal with
[9:56] the F bomb itself. I think that you have to be push so far
[10:01] to get to that point, Like even if you're a crazy hot head and
[10:03] I don't really know enough to say that he is, but even if you
[10:09] in your everyday life or drop a F bombs left and right, you really
[10:13] have to feel so frustrated when you look at the circumstances that ERKA is being
[10:16] put in and that conservation authorities across the province are being put in right now,
[10:20] it really speaks to the pressure that they're under, the way that power
[10:28] is being taken away from them, that the meaninglessness of environmental concerns, Like
[10:31] you must just feel so frustrated to get to that point. And I think
[10:37] the loss of power has to be such a thing for ERCA, which operated
[10:41] in its own fiefdom with unprecedented abilities to stop development and its tracks on whims
[10:46] if they decided to. When I worked in the cannabis industry on a couple
[10:52] of developments, ERCA had shown up after construction I had already started and things
[10:56] had approved and said, oh, watershed conditions have changed. You need to
[11:00] put in a new drainage ditch to accommodate for all of the water flow that
[11:05] comes off. And with one project I was working on, that turned into
[11:07] an eight hundred thousand dollars additional fee, which was a significant increase to the
[11:13] total project. So the point being is ERCA has been able to operate in
[11:18] their own kingdom, issuing their own proclamations that all of us lowly surfs had
[11:24] to follow. And now you end up here with Premier Ford completely and you
[11:28] know, for better or worse, I'm not commenting on you know what the
[11:31] role of her is. Do you make it sound like a bit a bit
[11:33] I don't know, like too broadly authoritative. Well, it's a racket.
[11:39] We're talking about the environment. Like I think it's reasonable that that somebody's got
[11:43] to have the bottom line on it, you know, sure, But the
[11:46] point is is they were even able to go and change things mid stream after
[11:50] approvals had already been granted. It's the point being is they operated without any
[11:54] consideration for anything else other than their own values beloe and what their interpretation of
[12:01] the legislation was. This completely upends that and I can appreciate a group going
[12:05] whoa, we went from having complete power to no power going well fuck you
[12:11] minister, Okay, yeah, yeah, that's the vibe. Right. I
[12:13] want to I just want to and I'm trying to do this without being an
[12:18] asshole. We go for so this is my mission here. But like your
[12:22] perspective on ERCA is that is that is the developer perspective for sure? On
[12:28] yeah, this is anybody who who has like is used to doing projects and
[12:35] using the tools that they have available to them to manipulate and influence the levers
[12:41] of power. I think finds like conservation authorities to be intensely frustrating because they
[12:48] are motivated by completely different Who cares about a triple spec new right right,
[12:54] I'm kidding. My point is that I think that that's a that is a
[13:00] a specific perspective on ERCA. I've heard it before and I'm not totally disagreeing
[13:03] with you. I just I just thought it was really interesting that you know,
[13:07] you went there, and because probably because how you engage with them has
[13:11] been on the developer side, like you've been part of a development that got
[13:16] that got adjusted by Erka. I was told that we should have bought a
[13:20] more expensive case of wine. Boy here we go. Oh, we didn't
[13:26] actually buy the one, so we did talk about it. But and I
[13:28] take that like, see, I see what you Kristen and you John are
[13:33] saying. And I think that that's an interpretation that has a lot of potential
[13:37] merit that there is frustration here about the thing itself. I also think that
[13:43] well, fuck you, minister is something that you might say as a part
[13:46] of a spirited conversation in which you feel very relaxed and comfortable. You mean,
[13:52] like a podcast on a Saturday afternoon, and not a provincial but for
[13:56] environment. I'm going somewhere with this. I don't know Tim Burney's background.
[14:01] He's been with the Conservation Authority for a long time, a person with lots
[14:05] of experience, lots of heft, respected that this is not this is not
[14:09] some kid making a mistake when the microphone gets put in their face, right,
[14:13] But I don't know how deep media training penetrates into official circles. And
[14:20] I think that we look at people interacting with the media, especially officials,
[14:26] through the lens of like this official should have had media training and should know
[14:31] how to avoid all the snares of the news media. Actually, I don't
[14:35] think that's a reasonable expectation and I don't think that we need to have that
[14:39] expectation of people. Well, I think that's that's exactly it. Like Erka
[14:41] is seen as this institution in the community, and you then compare it to
[14:46] every other institution in the community. Right, so you know, the university
[14:50] pretty much has half of windsor Star's former staff in the hospital all working for
[14:54] them. Now, right, they don't say anything without it going through ten
[14:58] different groups of you know, you know, ten different approvals and tended and
[15:01] like. So, like the president of the university is never going to be
[15:05] in a position where something like that gets set. So I think, well,
[15:09] and and crucially, all the media people know there are no jobs to
[15:13] be had thereafter, yeah, exactly, And so I think that there's and
[15:16] this is where you know, obviously the Narwal and again you go read the
[15:20] story they talked to they reached out to all thirty eight conservation authorities in the
[15:22] province. Eleven of them talked to them, you know, so they it
[15:26] wasn't just they called up URCA and got this sweet quote and ran that for
[15:30] the story, right Like, so there was, you know, a broad
[15:33] conversation. But I think what makes this story so juicy is that the bureaucrat
[15:37] said everything that he says, you know, with his team behind closed doors.
[15:41] Yeah, and their quiet part was set out loud. And this is
[15:45] what happens in Pick your organ you know, nonprofit organization when they don't get
[15:48] their grant from the province. Pick your university when not you know, when
[15:52] certain thing doesn't get funded or there wasn't money for you know, whatever,
[15:56] you can't raise tuition. You pick the hospital when you know, you know,
[15:58] the hospital timelines being delayed because a bureaucratic thing out of Toronto with the
[16:03] Ministry of Health. This is what gets said. Obviously, he said the
[16:07] quiet part out loud, and that's why this is such a juicy story.
[16:11] And I think the other piece is that it's to flip it sort of on
[16:15] its head. You're kind of seeing the passion of the organizational head, which
[16:18] is very different than also what you don't normally see from any institution, not
[16:22] just in this town but across the province. Everything is so sanitized and cleaned
[16:27] up. And you know, it's a two hundred word statement, you know,
[16:32] put onto a press release, and that's what you get from your leadership
[16:34] in a community these days. Well, this is a leader who obviously is
[16:37] passionate about the work that he does, and you know, yeah, he
[16:41] shouldn't have said it, probably, but you know he did. Yeah.
[16:45] I think I think that's a really good point. And also like the tone
[16:49] of this story, with the stories about the statement, not the Narwale story,
[16:59] how like, how much do we love authority in this province? How
[17:03] like deferential are we in this province? And how like like the the gut
[17:07] reaction of so many people to this story was like tut tut, how dare
[17:12] he say something about like, you know, somebody who's superior to him on
[17:15] the organizational chart and you know, as somebody who's not particularly interested in that
[17:21] line of thinking. I just find it fascinating and I think I think that
[17:25] the thing that it reveals about about Ontarians in general is that we eat that
[17:30] kind of shit up like, there's this is this is something that the people,
[17:34] the folks at home, the guy on Askin Avenue is nodding along.
[17:37] Yeah, fuck you, minister, But you shouldn't have said that. That's
[17:40] a terrible thing to do. It's this is so inherently colonial feeling quite frankly,
[17:45] and even in the follow up with the apology, I just I want
[17:48] to he said, having devoted thirty eight years to ensuring the people in property
[17:52] are protected from flooding and erosion, blah blah blah blah blah. Notwithstanding I
[17:56] regret my use of inappropriate language and any embarrassing it has caused the Minister,
[18:02] my board of director's, fellow conservation authorities and staff. The fuck are you
[18:07] apologizing for embarrassing the minister? Why do you think the minister was embarrassed?
[18:11] But on the other hand, the ministry has funded his entire life. Sure,
[18:15] no, I get that, but I think, like, but even
[18:17] just the use of the language of I regret for the embarrassment caused the message.
[18:22] Do you really think that the minister or the Minister's office was embarrassed by
[18:23] this? No, I think that they were probably furious, maybe a little
[18:26] amused by it. Quite frankly, embarrassed doesn't come into it. But that's
[18:30] that colonial mindset heurope here. Oh I need to so prostrate myself and just
[18:34] get it ahead of this. I'm so sorry. Okay, wait, though
[18:38] it's not like it's not like I'm deeply sorry that I used such an offensive
[18:45] word to express my very passionate feelings on this subject, Like yeah, that's
[18:49] in there, but it's like, yeah, I'm sorry you got upset,
[18:56] you know. It's like it's like it's good, which is probably what to
[19:02] do. I'm sorry you took it that way. I don't know, like
[19:07] I'm sorry that you were embarrassed when I told everybody how stupid I thought this
[19:11] idea was, Like, I don't know, I get it. We've all
[19:17] been there, Like we've all been in a situation on the wrong end of
[19:21] a government or a boss that has, you know, done something so inherently
[19:26] stupid. But you're involved on the ground level, going the fuck are you
[19:29] doing here? Buddy? You think that was gonna help, But the problem
[19:33] is is you're dealing in this case with a government that just took away the
[19:36] vast majority of your powers. Is an antagonistic government quite frankly towards everything that
[19:41] you purport to value and believe in, because they are on the other side
[19:45] of it right now while purporting to believe in value in it themselves. And
[19:51] this is I mean, I suppose, maybe, on the one hand,
[19:53] if you're trying to get respective doug Ford showing that you're willing to take a
[19:57] punch or punch or rather get you on his radar, but you're not gonna
[20:03] walk away winning from this at all. And I don't think the apology was
[20:06] a win either. The whole thing was just you know, a black eye.
[20:08] Yeah. Can we talk about Mark McKenzie in this a little bit?
[20:12] I feel like I feel like mackenzie revealed something here too. He was so
[20:18] quick to jump on this with both feet, like he really and and like
[20:25] I think you can see from morrison SmackDown, how an appropriate SmackDown, how
[20:32] far McKenzie over extended himself getting excited to like crush this guy. I like,
[20:38] I'm uncomfortable with that. Actually, So do we think that this was
[20:41] like motivated by anything or is it just simply let me ask you this,
[20:45] does do you think that anybody in Windsor believes that Mark McKenzie was genuinely offended,
[20:51] right, Like, he wasn't offended by this, and you alluded to
[20:53] his podcast and whatever horseshit before, but like, like, come on,
[20:57] he wasn't offended. He wasn't. So for the minister, he wasn't anything
[21:02] except that he saw an opportunity to settle a score with a political foe and
[21:06] he was so eager to do that that he landed a bit on his own
[21:11] face. But I don't think that I don't think that we should just disregard
[21:15] this evidence. Like when over the course of a politician's term in office,
[21:18] you get opportunities to see who they are, and you should pay attention to
[21:22] that. And I think that the you know, the press doesn't like to
[21:25] talk about that. They don't like to make those analyzes. And now we
[21:27] don't have any editorial writers, so it's down to you, the dear listener,
[21:32] member of the public, to draw your own conclusions. But when we
[21:34] get this kind of evidence, he should be paying attention, you know.
[21:37] I was also the Line podcast earlier today and a similar situation came up.
[21:42] Just this idea of how quick we all are to you know, jump on
[21:45] things, and how media amplifies it and the short of it, as they
[21:49] were saying, like, you know some aldermen in small shit town and Alabama
[21:56] that no one knows about who says something stupid to a public Officialbably shouldn't become
[22:00] known by international media by the end of the day. But we live in
[22:03] a world where if it gets to social and it trends, and then the
[22:06] daily mail picks it up and now everyone's mad at Steve because Steve went and
[22:08] said the wrong thing to someone in that small town of four hundred people or
[22:12] something. This feels like one hundred percent the exact same thing there. Mark
[22:18] wanted to get a point, he saw an opportunity. You said, settle
[22:22] scores. I'll take a little bit of pushback on that. Rather, it's
[22:23] like, I don't know if there was a score to settle there, Like
[22:26] I don't know if there's a relationship at all between the two other than you
[22:30] know, they're on the board together, or rather Ceo answers to the board
[22:34] so they have interaction. I don't even know if Bernie is on the board
[22:37] itself. If this is you know, as you said, if this is
[22:42] how Mark is revealing himself right now to be I'd be really concerned if I
[22:48] were someone who interacts with him and decides to, you know, share things
[22:51] with him or have conversations with him friendly, because I wouldn't want to be
[22:55] on the other side. And you know, there's the phrase like if if
[22:56] you're taking flak, you're probably doing something right. I guess Bernie is doing
[23:02] something right here because McKenzie decided that this was a broadside that he felt he
[23:06] had to take, or maybe he just felt he could. And if he's
[23:10] just picking on someone as a bully, then that's you know, how it's
[23:11] coming across. At least. I have a slightly different perspective of mcmark McKenzie's
[23:15] position, and it's that he's being closely aligned with the Conservative government in this
[23:19] and so he's maybe trying to score points at that provincial level there you go,
[23:25] you know, in that like there's something happening maybe there. Yeah,
[23:29] you know, it's like you you know, it's like that's I think that's
[23:33] the pathway for him. And he has a base that aligns probably pretty closely
[23:37] with the Doug Ford sort of base in Windsor, and so I think it's
[23:41] more I think it was an opportunity for him to, you know, and
[23:47] he did overstep in that, Like as a single board member, you should
[23:51] not be stepping out and calling for your leaders. Like good board governments would
[23:55] have him now step down really from RCA, right, Like, if you're
[23:57] a good board of directors, you just called it the leader. If the
[24:00] board isn't going to now dismiss that leader, then that board member usually has
[24:03] to leave, right because how does that board member gonna have a functional relationship
[24:07] with the leader of that organization. It's like an in or out situation that's
[24:11] not going to happen in all likelihood, So I don't know if it even
[24:14] can. Well, Mark could resign from the board of ERCA like that and
[24:18] someone else would have to pick up his and then someone will have to take
[24:21] that seat. But I think, you know again, like this is just
[24:25] like he has there was an opportunity for him to get a headline, and
[24:27] he grabbed at that headline without you know, reading the room, I think,
[24:30] And it was like and obviously he has a relationship with the provincial government,
[24:34] and so maybe it's a way to win a couple of points with some
[24:37] people up in Toronto. I'm not sure. Yeah, I see that analysis,
[24:41] And I think the common thread here is that none of the like I
[24:45] just can't find a positive reason and like because I just don't. I just
[24:51] completely disbelieve the face value story that this was this was bothersome or offensive intrinsically
[24:56] in some way. To McKenzie, I think you're you're you're reading you did
[25:00] say it was like irreparable damage to the relationship between the Conservation Authority and the
[25:04] Ministry of Natural Resources right well being being a PC or like being sympathetic to
[25:10] PCs. You can see how that would be your perspective. And and I
[25:14] you know, I don't think that I don't think that that counselors should just
[25:18] throw away their partisan colors when they walk in the room or conduct themselves like
[25:22] I don't think that's realistic or even desirable. But I think that if you're
[25:26] going to intervene in favor of the government that or the poll book party that
[25:33] you like and that you support and that you want to work with in the
[25:36] future, maybe you just you still want to do it with some strategy and
[25:40] judgment. We haven't talked about Frank Graves. Now, yeah, I'm a
[25:48] big fan of Frank Graves. Can we before we do any of this.
[25:51] Oh no, the tweet's gone on. Ah you say the tweet? Wait
[25:56] you know what, I bet we can still see it because of the the
[26:00] uh not you were getting away, Graves, the permanence of Twitter. I
[26:03] bet there, it's still there. Fuck you, I can know it.
[26:06] We would and we would not do this segment except except Frank has said no
[26:10] to being on this show more than once. So truly, yeah, sorry,
[26:14] Frank, Okay, let me just uh because he's an avid listener,
[26:19] to be fair, the last time he asked, he said he was having
[26:25] surgery that day, so who's to say, well he did? Okay,
[26:32] So Frank Graves tweeted out last night at around twelve thirty five pm after midnight.
[26:37] Am, Am, excuse me, I'm so excited by this, I
[26:41] have lost tracking of the day and night cycle time. He was responding to
[26:48] a post that Pierre Poliev, the leader of the opposition Conservative Party of Canada,
[26:52] had put up. I don't know what it was because we are looking
[26:56] backwards in Twitter right now at screenshots that don't have permanence. Responding to Pierre
[27:02] Pully, fill in whatever the hell it is that you care about that,
[27:04] Pierre said, Frank said, you are not worth the mendacity, the bullying,
[27:10] the assault on reason and evidence. You could not manage a two whole
[27:15] ship house. We are onto you. What is a two hole ship?
[27:22] I don't know. Tolet I like it a lot, but but I can't
[27:26] see how the management of that might be might be tricky though they got two
[27:32] year one? Is that did he do the thing where there's a space before
[27:37] the period and after the period? Yes, so there is a space before
[27:41] after, before the comma throughout and periods. I'm just I am only going
[27:45] to say that I have noted that happens sometimes when people are having, for
[27:52] whatever reason, difficulty with their manual dexterity and typing on a phone. I
[27:56] don't know how that might connect the twelve forty five am. I'm just saying,
[28:00] so, Frank, is you know he he's another one of these unelected
[28:04] leaders in communities. I guess you could say the community here being you know,
[28:10] national, and he often will put his commentary out in addition to what
[28:21] it is that he pulls. Last night was no exception to the rule.
[28:26] In fact, we've been speaking about this dug for a number of years now
[28:30] throughout the pandemic, especially, we saw Frank tweeting often after midnight and you
[28:36] know, listen for listen, I'll just put on the table. We're having
[28:38] a conversation where we're sipping around the fact that maybe or maybe not he was
[28:44] inebriated when he put this tweet out. We don't know. We can't guarantee
[28:48] either way. I have deleted my share of post midnight tweets. Yes,
[28:55] I stand by all of mine. As a general, don't drink and tweet.
[29:00] There is a lot to be said about keeping things in your drafts and
[29:07] waking up and deciding if you want to deend on it. I don't think
[29:11] he said anything wrong here. Quite Frankly, he's coming from a place where,
[29:18] let me explain when I say something wrong here. He's obviously very angry
[29:22] at Pierre Polief. But I think what he's doing is expressing. And we've
[29:26] seen in fact Sean o'she from Global TV, tweeted out and he quote tweeted
[29:32] that saying these are the kind of quotes nearly impossible to get from a Canadian
[29:34] during a television in Urney, especially the last part vivid imagery to whole shit
[29:40] house. I think that's really interesting is that, like he did say something
[29:45] that I think a lot of people aren't able to eloquently express as well.
[29:52] I think the big problem for Frank here is that it's hard to take the
[29:56] polling seriously when you go and decide to impart so much personal emotion into it,
[30:03] because people can question your animus, where you come from, your motivations.
[30:08] But again, it speaks to this idea of is this what we're doing
[30:12] right now? Like is this it? Are we at a politics of just
[30:15] like public mud slinging. Well, it was in response to mud slinging,
[30:19] right, So the original tweet was from Pierre probably ever was wonder why you're
[30:25] broke? Take a listen to the guy who's been running things for eight years.
[30:27] And then there's a clip together montage of Trudeau. So so it is
[30:33] like it's it's not like it came out of nowhere. It is it's in
[30:34] line with like, look a look at how bad this guy is managing things.
[30:38] And the response is like, well, you could manage things any better.
[30:41] You can manage your way out of an outhouse or whatever. And let's
[30:44] be clear, Frank Braves has been a polster for the Liberal Party multiple times.
[30:48] Like he's a partisan bolster. Yes, yeah, and so like this
[30:51] is just the this is just the next let this is like, Okay,
[30:55] the US was doing this two and a half years ago a sure partisan political
[30:57] level. It's made its way to Canada, right, And and let's be
[31:02] clear about the business of polling. The public polls, Like they don't make
[31:04] money off the public polls. The public polls are unless somebody, somebody decides
[31:10] to put their own name on it as well, like those public polls are
[31:12] done as a lost leader to draw attention to the polls. The polling firm
[31:17] is marketing and whatnot. And Graves has a market that he knows well and
[31:22] he knows the shithole stuff is not going to about Pierre Polyev is not going
[31:27] to damage him in his market. So like, I think that it's important
[31:33] to distinguish between Graves and Bernie because what Frank Graves did, you're to your
[31:37] point. Frazer is like, Look, he's a private business person. And
[31:42] I think that as a private citizen engaging in whatever you want in the community,
[31:48] you you absolutely can say whatever you want, and people do say whatever
[31:53] they want and often very weird things. It's one of the things that I
[31:57] really value about Twitter. And when Twitter inevitably like finishes what it's doing and
[32:04] goes away, it's going to be sad because I think this has been the
[32:07] platform that, more than any other communications platform that I have known, has
[32:13] given us a look at the unvarnished personalities behind the names. And I really
[32:19] value it for that, and I really appreciate that Frank Graves is also perfectly
[32:23] like within his rights to wake up in the morning and go oh fuck and
[32:27] delete the tweet. I've been there, but unfortunately Twitter is such as shitty
[32:35] service. Now we can still see it if you pushed back button. So
[32:37] so I guess like the question is do we like people being real or not?
[32:42] And I like people being real. I think that the challenge though,
[32:46] is that like when you're when you're a public person like Frank Graves, And
[32:52] Frank Graves has a reputation because of his work, because of his work which
[32:57] is rigorous, which I believe is done in unbiased way because it wouldn't be
[33:00] any service to the partisan clients that he serves if it was biased polling.
[33:06] So the man is a professional who knows how to do this, and when
[33:09] he communicates on polling and on the data and what the data means. He
[33:13] is authoritative. Now, how do we have a society where people can use
[33:17] the same platform, the same communications channel to announce their professional results and to
[33:27] say, you know, you couldn't manage a garbage pile like these are.
[33:31] I think this is the interesting thing and this is the challenge. I don't
[33:35] think there's anything wrong with what Graves is doing. Do we have a like,
[33:39] do we live in a society where we can support this and this is
[33:44] going to work? Well? This is the structural problem, right, and
[33:46] again, like, and part of this is like yet, part of this
[33:51] is because this is online. You know, like Frank isn't doing this right
[33:55] in front of Pierre Paulia up to his face, right, you know,
[33:59] Bernie wasn't doing it right telling the minister to fuck you right to the minister's
[34:02] face. It was like, you know, nameless, faceless sort of there's
[34:06] that abstract distance and I think there is you know, and this is an
[34:10] aside, but you know, when we talk about like decorum around politics and
[34:15] people getting into politics on harassment of public officials like Pierre paul I may not
[34:21] agree with him, but do I need to like call him names on the
[34:24] internet to get like my point across I don't know, right, Like,
[34:29] but like we hear a lot about washing your hands about like, well,
[34:31] why don't women run for office? Well, it's because of a behavior like
[34:35] Frank Graves. But it's some guy, crazy guy on the right attacking a
[34:37] woman. Yeap that Like it's unacceptable then, but now that it's like Frank
[34:42] Graves attacking Pierre pauliap like, oh he's he's giving an insightful view of his
[34:47] own personality. And like the reporter who followed him is like, we can't
[34:51] get a quote like that normally. Ain't that great? You know? It's
[34:54] like so I actually don't think it's a good thing, Like and this is
[34:59] where you know the death the media has media used to be the intermediary,
[35:01] right And like I even think like the narwhal story and again like going back
[35:07] to John's earlier point about how they have two kills in Windsor almost like if
[35:12] a media organization's coming in looking for a kill in a community like the narwhale
[35:16] has an agenda like and like, yes, they're coming into Windsor to look
[35:22] for because they know that we're this Bumpkin town who has either conservation authority people
[35:27] who are really radical maybe, and we have a mayor who's you know,
[35:30] pretty anti environment or conservative maybe, and so they know they can get something
[35:34] that's going to drive their subscriptions. Right, This is the future of media.
[35:37] Is that you're gonna have a whole bunch of organizations like the narwhale just
[35:42] looking for kills. And like that's a bad thing because you don't have a
[35:45] mainstream media who's like actually going and getting a quote and contextualizing that quote and
[35:50] putting that quote in front of people to then potentially make their own decision about
[35:53] on the six o'clock news or in the newspaper anymore. And so where you
[35:57] end up with is people drunk on Twitter potentially allegedly who knows, but like
[36:00] attacking politicians and that's now a normal status quo and that's not a healthy thing
[36:05] for our community or society. Fraser loves media. There's also to be said
[36:13] for taste, Like I wonder if, like the media outlets of whatever nineteen
[36:21] seventy one, like, is anybody going to write FU in a news article
[36:24] or would they just regardless of those words being said? No CP style doesn't
[36:30] allow would it just you know what I mean, Like, is there not
[36:32] a moment where you're going, well, I can't print that. Well,
[36:35] we have different standards for taste now though, That's what I mean. Like
[36:37] fifty years ago, it was completely okay for the Windsor Star to put out
[36:43] an editorial about the about the serial killer who preyed on homosexuals, saying like,
[36:49] you know, if they weren't gay, we wouldn't have this problem,
[36:51] right, And so I like my point being that we have different standards today.
[36:58] Standards of decorum are lower, and to your point, into Fraser's point,
[37:01] perhaps we should regret that. But on the other hand, certain other
[37:05] ethical standards or our standards for people's conduct around inclusiveness is certainly much higher.
[37:12] And I think it's a good thing. No, not that we should regret
[37:15] it, but what are the repercussions of it, Like it does that does
[37:19] that in effact like to Fraser's point, like does that scare people off from
[37:22] running for office? Because you know that the terrible things that people say under
[37:25] their breath are now going to get amplified. And this links back to and
[37:30] you know one of your you know, one of our hobby horses dog transparency
[37:34] from government administrations and businesses. And what we talked about was Transform last week.
[37:38] Right. Transform won't give you a statement because they can't. You know,
[37:42] they don't want to because those decorums have gotten so loan and they know
[37:46] that, like there's no media who's going to force them and do the digging
[37:50] and the hard work, so they just can off uscate. This is why
[37:52] it takes you know, two years to get a basic freedom of information request
[37:55] out of any level of government these days, because you know, this is
[38:00] where that those standards have gotten and because normally the URCA CEO is sort of
[38:08] unvarnished opinion, because everything is so controlled, because everything is so message managed,
[38:13] because everything is so varnished from institutions, they fear that unvarnishedness coming out
[38:20] in any way, shape or form. And so, oh, your data
[38:22] requests, Well, it's the data. And we've talked about this a lot,
[38:24] like what happens when there's a bad news data story in this town?
[38:29] Right, Well, you're just a naysayer, you know, why can't you
[38:30] get on board with the good news stories all of those things when there's a
[38:35] legitimate conversation to have right, because that's like an embarrassment to this community.
[38:39] But like again, because it's something they can't control, they don't want to
[38:43] talk about it. Okay, So like I want to draw a distinction here
[38:45] because like there's so much good stuff being said, but I I there's a
[38:49] distinction. So when when Graves did his thing, he was representing Frank Graves,
[38:54] Oh, I agree, and his his Twitter account. To be fair,
[38:58] he shares his work, but that his personal Twitter account, that is
[39:01] that is Frank Grave's public personal channel. Tim Burney was only being spoken to
[39:08] by the Narwhale because of his position at ERCA, and he is representing the
[39:14] organization. And when you are a senior leader at an organization, the expectation
[39:17] that the the people like just to to elaborate on the Mark McKenzie perspective,
[39:24] the people around the board table, the people who control that organization, and
[39:28] the people that organization serves, frankly have a have a every right to expect
[39:35] that you are not going to undermine the interests of the organization by pursuing your
[39:38] you know, by communicating your personal thoughts. Like ERKA doesn't have this opinion,
[39:46] Like ERCA as an institution doesn't hold the opinion fuck you, minister,
[39:51] and so to the extent that tim Berney was speaking for ERCA, he made
[39:53] a mistake and spoke out a turn. I don't think that it's a crime,
[39:59] Like I don't think and I like, I like getting more clarity and
[40:04] more truth, but it should be the organization's truth, you know, if
[40:08] you're speaking for the organization. So so like I feel like like in both
[40:14] cases, I think both of these, both the tweet and the quote,
[40:16] they're both like I would characterize these as bar talk. This is the kind
[40:21] of stuff that like you say when you're you're sitting with your buddies and you're
[40:23] complaining about the people who frustrate you in your daily life. And that's an
[40:27] important part of like everyone's like you know, psychological needs. Doing it in
[40:34] public as maybe a little less savvy, but I think, like I think
[40:38] that where what we have to figure out is and I agree with you Frasier
[40:44] that I would like to see more open and honest communication like TRANSFORM should be
[40:49] talking. But Transform can't communicate like an individual, right and and at no
[40:57] point should the institution say, well, fuck you phrase your father is because
[41:01] because you you know you you had this opinion or whatever, like that's not
[41:07] that's not reasonable and that's not appropriate. Yeah, I agree with that distinction,
[41:13] but I do think that, you know, because the level of under
[41:15] expectation for institutions is to be so constrained. The only reason why we're interested
[41:21] in this story is that you know, Tim was caught you know, doing
[41:25] that bar talk when in theory and we don't know the contact full context like
[41:30] of the interview with the narwhale either, right, like because he's had a
[41:34] thirty seven year history or you know, working in conservation, so he's probably
[41:37] one of the leading experts in the province. So like, yes, he's
[41:40] the head of that, but they could have been talking about non orca things
[41:44] at some point in that interview. I've had a number of interviews where you
[41:45] start on one subject, you got four others, and then you come back
[41:49] to the end of like where you started again, right, And so you
[41:52] know, I do think that, like again, this is all sort of
[41:55] tied together. I think around you know, if institutions were more forthright and
[42:00] more honest and like this is where we love you know, when Wendy's makes
[42:04] fun of McDonald's on Twitter, right, and like oh, like that marketing
[42:07] thing goes viral because of the chicken the chicken nuggets, you know or whatever.
[42:13] Right, like but like when like they are shut yeah exactly, but
[42:17] like those are the things that are like you know, like but that those
[42:20] are the things that seem to go viral too, right when like Evil Corporation
[42:23] number one made fun of Evil Corporation number two, and you know, suddenly
[42:29] it's like lots of likes and retweets on whatever social media platform. Right,
[42:32] So there's a craving for authenticity from our institutions, I would say, and
[42:37] I think we both agree on that. I think what happened here was not
[42:40] the proper way for that to happen. But you know, institutions who are
[42:45] probably more authentic are probably more likely to build trust. And given that we're
[42:49] in a trust deprived to society right now, Like that's actually a thing where
[42:52] if an institution can have an honest conversation about, you know, minister,
[42:57] we don't like and here's why, you know, you know, in a
[43:00] respectful way, so that you're not getting the tut tut from from your constituents.
[43:05] Like I don't think that's a bad thing. You go read every other
[43:07] comment from every other conservation authority in that narwhale story, and that's what they
[43:13] did, right. So isn't that the issue though, that that the comments
[43:15] become the story and and the comments are so much fun and everybody enjoys like
[43:22] a good little you know, insult war or whatever so much that that obscures
[43:27] the actual point that mister Bernie was trying to make. Well, look at
[43:30] us, Yeah, we haven't talked about the issue at all. We also
[43:34] never fucking talk about a watershed conservation issue on Rose City politics. We have
[43:38] we have talked dirka plenty. Okay, it's not a regulatory we are nerdy.
[43:45] We have talked Dirk. But I take your point. But yeah,
[43:49] and it's just we're talking about it because of the flashpoint issue. And that's
[43:53] you know, it goes to the quip that Rich Garden gave me at the
[43:59] Trudeau event. Yet esterday we went Rose City politics, you're more like roast
[44:02] city politics if anything, which was Rich cranky because we haven't invited him in
[44:07] a while. He was in good spirits. It was a good joke.
[44:13] We were in a r CMP lock up with national media and local media and
[44:16] it was like dead silent and then he drops that after I give roast city
[44:21] politics to the RCMP officer, it was just ten out of ten. Very
[44:23] nice. Good for Rich on that. But yeah, no, I mean,
[44:27] we typically wouldn't be covering this unless we had a broader vision for a
[44:31] conversation of an episode we're going to dive into environmental issues and talk about it
[44:36] wouldn't be one that we would just pick up on a weekly basis. So
[44:38] I guess if you're toiling away in some obscure corner of the bureaucracy and you
[44:43] think that people should be paying more attention to what you do, a good
[44:46] fucking minister in the press seems to do the trick. Yeah, hey,
[44:50] you can even say fucking roasty politics. You can get our attention guaranteed.
[44:55] Yeah, you work at the city archives. Come on, the municipal archivist
[45:00] says, fuck you, RCP. He'd be great. We'd be down there
[45:02] in a second. We'll get you miked up. We would dive into it.
[45:07] Should we drive ourselves out to Banwell and Ezero, let's drive on out
[45:10] there. Yeah sure, okay, Well, Premier Ford was in town announced
[45:15] fifty million dollars for a new eighty five million dollar interchange to help traffic flow
[45:19] around Banwell and ec Row. They're expecting that to be overwhelmed, of course,
[45:22] from the next our energyed battery plant. The premier also announced that they've
[45:28] started work on expanding Highway three. People who drive by will notice tree clearing
[45:32] occurring right now. Mayor Dilkins said he's ecstatic about this funding for the interchange
[45:37] and said that quite frankly, this project couldn't happen at all without the province's
[45:42] contribution. The Premier was also asked about the province taking over the ec Row,
[45:46] which costs US ten million dollars annually, and he said he'd talk with
[45:51] Doug with Mayor Dilkins about it. Premier Ford also said that he felt like
[45:55] Santa Claus to Mayor Dilkins quote, I've given him more presents than anyone in
[46:01] Ontario and MPP Andrew Dowie Windsor to Comsy, said that he was proud to
[46:09] be a part of the government that was delivering this interchange Banwell and Ecow.
[46:19] I think it would be remiss to not mention that former Rose City Politics host
[46:24] Mark Bosquariel had been waiting for this one for like twenty years he opened up
[46:30] that restaurant to come see road house. I believe it was on forty two
[46:36] at Banwell there, and I'm pretty sure the only reason that he opened that
[46:40] was in the hopes to get expropriated at some point when they did finally do.
[46:44] This. Whole thing was a long grand vision that unfortunately it burned down
[46:49] before that came to be and Mark passed away. But I felt it was
[46:52] important to get that part out there because this was We've been expecting this to
[46:55] happen, this interchange for quite some time. It seems like an inevitability.
[47:01] It eventually will get there. Eventually we would fill the area enough that it
[47:07] necessitate a new road to be built. The one road town goes to two.
[47:13] Hey good, I guess we need a road. We got a road.
[47:15] Did we ever expect that like this wasn't going to get built? I
[47:19] love Mayor Dilkins platitudes. Without this money from the province, this would never
[47:23] have happened, jeopardizing the entire ev plant and all of the investments that have
[47:28] happened down here. We would have said nope. I think the more interesting
[47:32] comments came from Engineering Mark Waddington about the need now to fast track this project.
[47:38] From an engineering design perspective, you know, they have fifty million dollars
[47:43] from the province, the city set aside ten million dollars, so there's about
[47:46] twenty or so still missing, which is probably gonna have to get rejigged out
[47:50] of the capitol budget for next year. So there's probably gonna be some shuffling
[47:54] around road projects in the city over the next year or two now and major
[48:00] infrastructure projects because they're going to have to probably move some money around and even
[48:04] just staff time. Right, Like, if it takes x hours to design
[48:07] this, that's x hours that some engineer isn't going to be able to do
[48:10] some other project. You know, Benwell is going to be one of the
[48:15] densest corridors in the city, right, Like the amount of development that's slated
[48:19] for Banwell Road is you know, huge, and you have hundreds, if
[48:24] not thousands of units going up there and then south in the next Star Battery
[48:28] plant near Tucumpsy Vista in the town of Decompsy, they've slated i think almost
[48:34] several hundred single family homes and new subdivisions in the town. On the town
[48:37] and too Compsy side of Banwell so yes, this has to be done.
[48:40] You know, I guess you know, we could talk about you know,
[48:45] what does this do from an urban footprint perspective? Is this sprawl all that
[48:47] sort of stuff, Like if you want to be anti sprawl, well,
[48:51] let bandwell be a disaster of an intersection. And it's going to make it
[48:54] harder for people to drive to Lake Shore and to Compsy. And so maybe
[48:58] people will live in Windsor who knows, but like that's been cast to move
[49:01] on. So what was the street that? What was the street in Windsor
[49:08] that like hasn't been repaved since John Prince hung those Americans? Like what was
[49:13] that? Oh yeah, it's in seven so it's it's in the same world.
[49:19] Okay, So I got those guys. Those guys forget it. Guys,
[49:23] wasn't that Jarvis Street? Sorry guys, you could totally forget it.
[49:29] It's another hundred years. We're busy. Yeah, sorry. I mean,
[49:34] I don't know why we're talking about this story. We're so big voted for
[49:39] it. Why did we put this on? I voted for it, But
[49:43] I don't know why we're talking about this story except to say that this is
[49:46] like, well because the engineer said, fuck you, doesn't let me.
[49:51] Let me get my point out, except to say that this is like the
[49:57] platonic ideal of a political announce right. There's you know, you've got the
[50:04] the mayor and the and his political ally the premiere falling all over each other.
[50:09] You've got the MPP who's just happy to be here. You've got right,
[50:15] it's like and it and it's an it's a needed project and people are
[50:19] going to be happy about it, excited about it, and like, I
[50:22] don't know, I guess the question that I come to because we see these
[50:24] like there's there's one hundred and fifty of these in every for every government,
[50:29] right, there's one hundred and fifty announcements like this that you'll see in the
[50:31] local papers, in the local press. Do you guys think that this actually
[50:36] helps get reelect anybody get re elected? Do you think that like announcing a
[50:43] to to the point that's been made a couple of times on this on the
[50:45] show, like a project that we knew had to happen, Like yeah,
[50:50] we got to do that, We got to do that, we sure are
[50:51] got to do that. Like this to me is different from Highway three,
[50:54] where there was a Boogeyman created or the hospital where there was a boogeyman man
[50:59] you thatchured Like, this to me is different. This is something where there's
[51:04] consensus. There's nobody besides like like the real hardcore urbanist weirdos. Nobody is
[51:08] mad about this, Like right you point to get what you say that it
[51:15] wasn't even you second insulted can make eye contact? Is it does? It
[51:24] does just feel like housekeeping though this is like like this upgrade is not it's
[51:30] not saving, like it is saving that. I don't know, it's it's
[51:32] probably it's like we need housing, we need industry, we need infrastructure,
[51:37] like that's literally that's the quote. And then they're like, let's get these
[51:42] trees out of here. First of all, we'll put this Like I want
[51:44] to just kind of put a hold on this project because of like some like
[51:47] wildlife they find in the foot print of this overpast it's so cheesy, like
[51:51] it's just you're right, like it is. It is the picture perfect announcement,
[51:55] like it ties into all of these plans we have and we've got the
[51:59] money for it. So I think this is actually a type of project that
[52:01] does move votes right right because because like again, look at the timing as
[52:07] a two year project. It's going to start this year. It's going to
[52:08] be done before the next provincial and municipal elections, more or less right when
[52:13] the time with the battery plant. The Banwell Road corridor is a pain.
[52:16] I don't know Doug doesn't go past Walker Road, but I've been out there
[52:19] a couple of times. And like, turning left off of ec Row onto
[52:22] Banwell is like a bit of a thing because you're backed up into traffic on
[52:27] ec Row and so cleaning up that interchange and making lives easier. And again
[52:32] you got to remember Andrew Dowy covers Windsor and Decumpci. So for all of
[52:37] those commuters who come down lest Brunt's or Manning Road and then get onto Banwell,
[52:39] now there's one less light. Their commute just got thirty six seconds shorter.
[52:45] And so and like that's the thing that you can slap on a piece
[52:47] of lit and like and it'll be a big thing that's in everyone's face every
[52:52] day on their way to work to and from same with counselor Marigiani. You
[52:57] know they have to roundabout right on right on two on Banwell Road. That
[53:00] just got finished, and it's going to go right into a nice smooth on
[53:04] ramp that'll be freshly paved just in time for the next election, and then
[53:07] right on the ec row and you can get to whatever job you do inside
[53:10] the city. So it measurably makes your life better. Yeah, it does,
[53:15] And so I get that. Do we think that people vote for elected
[53:20] officials to thank them for public works? Like, I just want to explore
[53:24] it, So I'm not denying it. I want to explore it. I
[53:27] don't know about tanks, but as the rewards, maybe I think they re
[53:30] elect people. Yeah, absolutely, I think it because especially when you're looking
[53:35] at something like this that impacts your day to day comfort level. Every day
[53:37] you're grateful that your commute to work is easier, that you're you know,
[53:42] you're whatever the project is, your neighborhood is more beautiful, or like whatever
[53:45] it is. If there's something that that impacts you on a daily basis like
[53:49] this, for sure, it just subconsciously gives you the good feelings for that
[53:52] person, and therefore that's a good person. Why wouldn't I want them to
[53:55] be re elected? Right? And I think it adds up, right,
[53:59] So it's not just this project, but it's every other project you know that
[54:02] has been done because again you're the expert on like all of this is going
[54:06] on a lit You're gonna show up and it's gonna be in your and it's
[54:08] like Banwell Roade Interchange Bandwell Road. But bub buah uh duh da da da
[54:13] da da right down the list, and like you know, when you get
[54:15] there and there's like six or seven you know, hey, that guy did
[54:20] six or seven things I liked. If that's your in total engagement with your
[54:24] elected official before before you know, going into the polling booth, you have
[54:29] new person I don't know who wants to do other things or guy did six
[54:32] or seven things I liked. You know, you're probably more likely to check
[54:37] a box next to guy who does six or seven things that I like.
[54:39] I think provincially it gets a little messier because you got parties there and then
[54:43] there's like, okay, well do you like Doug Ford or Bonnie Crombie or
[54:46] Merritt styles more than your local MP or not? And all that sort of
[54:50] stuff gets tied into it, but trigularly at a municipal level, like I
[54:53] think I think this gets this could re elect Angela Marianni. See I'm between
[54:58] the two of you. Dug In free on it. I don't know it.
[55:01] To me, this feels a lot like the city shows up and says,
[55:06] hey, you're scheduled for sewer replacement on your street, and you go,
[55:08] okay, it was gonna happen. It happened, sort of what you
[55:12] were saying, Kristin. We knew this was going to care if this was
[55:15] what twenty eighteen when we had the massive floods and the city shows up and
[55:21] says, we're replacing all your sewers to make sure that the flood never happens
[55:24] again. Now you've got my vote. Like it's it's the issue of is
[55:29] it just general maintenance and upkeep of a city. I can't get turned on
[55:32] by that. If it's something that's new and exciting, yeah, I mean
[55:36] I could. I could see that swaying a vote. I think that this
[55:38] is one of those things where it's kind of in between the two. I
[55:40] don't think that, you know, Mayor Dilkin's gonna be picking up votes from
[55:44] West Windsor because of an interchange out there, no matter how good it is
[55:46] for the battery plant and for Chrysler and all that stuff. But I can
[55:50] appreciate Frasier's point that, yeah, this could be a boost for Angelo or
[55:53] for Andrew Dowie specifically. It's interesting, I think it in part, and
[55:58] like, I think there's more than one There's more than one type of elector,
[56:01] right, and I think that they're like to me. I think that
[56:07] there is there's an element of the electorate that wants to vote for a vision,
[56:15] that they want to vote for something that is going to change their lives,
[56:21] something that is going to be different. But there's also I think there
[56:25] there is a segment of the electorate that is looking for good management, that
[56:29] they are looking for managerial competence. And uh and and you know, we
[56:36] like Andrew Dowie on this show. Sure we like Andrew. I think Andrew
[56:39] Dowie's value proposition as a politician is one thousand percent managerial competence. So maybe
[56:50] this, like Banuel Road, matters a whole lot more to a guy like
[56:54] to a guy like Andrew, then it to a politician who's who's public persona
[57:05] and approach and the reason that they are you know, what they are selling
[57:08] to you is something different. So if if you're a visionary politician who is
[57:13] selling transformation. I don't know that you get points for Bandwell that's fair,
[57:16] but I think given what's out there and who's up there and the politicals are
[57:21] there, Yeah, but this moves votes, I would say, what what
[57:24] problems exist? And to come see like what is the you know, getting
[57:28] to work in Windsor. Yeah, there you go. Windsor's roads are so
[57:31] bad that like you're hit a pobble and damage your car. Maintaining the extractive
[57:37] relationship between the suburbs and the city because your agenda, can I go somewhere
[57:44] with us off track where we want not towards Bandwell, I'll tell you that
[57:46] much. You know how we talk about how Mary Dilkins is like best suited
[57:57] for being a radio host. Yes, doug Ford is best suited for being
[58:01] a game show host like screw Santa Claus. Doug Ford would be the excellent,
[58:07] like the best game show host where like he's there the barker, which
[58:13] which briefcase do you think all the money said? Do you think it's number
[58:15] one or number twenty seven? Like doug Ford would be so good at that.
[58:20] And then when he gets to give away the money. He'd just be
[58:22] there smiling and beaming out. The only thing that I will say counter to
[58:27] that, because I see the vision. I see it's a vision. I've
[58:31] got a whole thing planned, the doug Ford pyramid or whatever he's got it.
[58:36] He's got a hair trigger temper. So I think that'd make for great
[58:39] television. Quick. Frankly, I just think of you, idiot, its
[58:44] seventeen. I just think of game show hosts as more of buncular well than
[58:49] that. Well, you know, just as our unelected leadership is evolving in
[58:53] their discourse, maybe to our game shows can as well. What are we
[58:57] at right now? We're at time to say goodbye? Okay, well bye,
[59:00] folks. We do encourage you all to go read about jails in Ontario.
[59:05] Windsor has the third most crowded in the province, with inmate numbers spiking.
[59:10] Not great, folks, overall, right now, eighty one percent of
[59:15] people in jails are awaiting to drought. Is that why they don't address arrest
[59:17] people for drinking beer on the street or smoking crack in front of storefronts anymore?
[59:22] We're selling drugs potentially too. Yeah, well, hey, and not
[59:25] that there are friends over at the line. But you know, we respect
[59:29] what they do and you should go read their most recent dispatch and listen to
[59:32] their most recent podcast about why are we giving them pre advertising because they can't
[59:37] buy it and maybe they'll kick it back. I don't know, maybe they
[59:40] listen right, sure, yeah, sure, yeah, we're coming for you
[59:44] the line. Thanks dear listeners. Well screw you, Frazier. Good evening,
[59:52] everyone that was roasty Politics Mark sixteenth irregular panel included Dugs are Story,
[59:57] Don Merryfield, no not Don, maryfild how's your father's Christen Siapas and myself
[1:00:00] John Lydkey head to patroon dot com slash rose to eat politics and it'll help
[1:00:05] make the show become more concise and stay on track longer. Pick up a
[1:00:09] sex magazine? Sure maybe, and Rosie Politics is able to broadcast live on
[1:00:15] tape thanks to the kind support of Lena six two five building Better Communities.
[1:00:19] We'll be back next week.

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