# There Is No Credential Meeting

An episode of [2Bobs—with David C. Baker and Blair Enns](https://invisiblenetwork.ai/podcast/1219490591), 18 Jun 2025, 31 min.

Audio: https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/2bobs/2Bobs218-There-Is-No-Credentials-Meeting.mp3?dest-id=492492

Instead of beginning the relationship with a prospective client by presenting a deck on why your agency is so amazing and why you should be invited to pitch, Blair encourages us to have the "Probative Conversation" from his Four Conversations sales model. LINKS "There Is No Credentials Meeting" article by Blair Enns for WinWithoutPitching.com "The Four Conversations: A New Model for Selling Expertise" 2Bobs episode The Four Conversations: A New Model for Selling Expertise book by Blair Enns

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